Fwd: chAndOgya - VI.iii.5 - b - The order in dEvatA laya

[Guest guest]

Namaste, The following message is from the vadavali group but I

don't wish to discuss this topic here. I am forwarding it to provide

some context for my question. I am confused by these concepts of

Devis/devatas/abhimani devatas etc. How does Advaita look at all

this. Veda itself talks about Rudra, Devi, Agni, Surya etc. My

common sense perspective is that it simply means that any form,

symbol, element of nature, etc can be chosen as a deity and

worshipped as Ishwara. Dvaita claim seems to be that there is a

hierarchy of devis and devatas with Vishnu at the top. I personally

think that "Satyam, Jnanam, Anantam brahma" cannot be given any name

but if you wish to worship that infinite principle of asti-bhati-

preeti, you can chose any God or Goddess. Dvaita also claims based

on some verses in Gita that only Lord Krishna should be worshipped

but then why all the rituals, etc in the Vedas related to

devatas/devis ?

Also can somebody please explain what is the origin and significance

of the term - Isht devata ?

 

regards,

Om Namah Sivaya

 

vAdAvaLi, "Jay Nelamangala" <jayn wrote:

 

|| Om shree gurubhyO namaha harihi Om ||

 

( Continued from previous posting )

 

bhAshya :

 

prAthamyAt ca tEja AdyA lakshmyAdaya iti siddham |

"tEjObhimAninI lakshmIhi prANastu ababhimAnavAn |

annAbhimAnI rudrascha tAha dEvatAha purA || iti ca brahmAnDE ||

 

The fact that among all of creation, tEjO-ab-anna are the first

ones to be

created establishes the fact that when the upanishat talks about

tEjas and so on,

it is talking about their respective abhimAnIs lakshmI and so on.

 

The same truth is taught in brahmANDa purANa by Sri VedavyAsa as,

"LakshmI is the abhimAnI for tEjas. prANa is the abhimAnI for ab.

anna abhimAnI is rudra. These three dEvatAs are the first ones to

be

created".

 

bhAshya :

 

"yatraitat purushaha svapiti nAma satA sOmya tadA sampannO bhavati"

iti

samsAriNO brahma-prAptim uktvA 'sa yathA shakunihi

sootrENa prabaddhaha" iti tasya upapAdanAt

manO nAmA purushaha | prANanAmA bhagavAn |

"sanmoolAha sOmya imAha sarvAha prajAha

sadAyatanAha sat-pratishTAha" ityupasamhArAt |

prajA shabdascha cEtanEshu Eva prasiddhaha |

'prajAnAm sukhaduhkhEna rAjA ApnOti shubhAshubham " ityAdEshca |

 

The upanishat first says, "yatraitat purushaha svapiti nAma satA

sOmya tadA

sampannO bhavati" i.e, "When the jIvAtman is in deep-sleep, by

definition he is with

Parabrahman, the Highest" and thus first teaches brahma-prApti for

a jIvAtman that is in samsAra,

and then the upanishat explains the same concept with the example,

"sa yathA shakunini sootrENa prabaddhaha"

i.e., "just as a bird that has been tied to a pole using a rope"

and then

teaches

"prANa bandhanam hi sOmya manaha" i.e., "manas is under the control

of prANa". i.e,

Thus, in this context, that "mana" is purusha or jIvAtman. and

prANa is

paramAtman, bhagavAn vishNu.

This is also known by the fact that the upanishat concludes it by

stating,

"sanmoolAha sOmya imAha sarvAha prajAha sadAyatanAha sat-

pratishTAha" i.e,

"All jIvAtmans have Parabrahman as their moola and Ashraya".

The word "prajA" is indeed applied only to cEtanas. It can't be

applied to

acEtanas at all.

 

This is also known by expressions such as "King obtains auspecious

and

inauspecious results based on the happiness and unhappiness of his

people ( prajAs )".

 

bhAshya :

 

shareera-dhAtu-krittvEna lakshmyAdyAsca mumukshuNA | dhyEyAha

tadIshritritvEna bhagavAn purushOttamaha |

iti vacanAt anusandhAna kartavyatA jnyApanArtham 'taduktam purastAt'

ityuktam |

 

"One who is desirous of mOksha, should contemplate upon the three

dEvatAs

Shree-prANa-rudra as the creators of the finer elements that are

needed by the body,

and also should contemplate Parabrahman, VishNu, The Highest,

as the Controller of these three dEvatAs" - Because there is

this

teaching of Agama, in order to teach that this teaching of Agama

must always be

borne in mind, the upanishat first states

"imAha tisrO dEvatAha purusham prApya trivrit trivrit EkaikA

bhavati" and then reminds about it again

by stating "taduktam purastAt".

 

muktau umA tu vAgAkhyA rudram yAti manO abhidham | vAyum yAti

shivascApi

vAyuh tEjO abhidAm shriyam |

vAyumAdAya sA dEvee yAti vishNum parAtparam | dvAramAtrA tu sA dEvee

vAyuprApyO janArdhanaha |

mritikAlE ca muktou ca purushA vAcamApnuyuhu | iti sattatvE |

 

At the time of death and also at the time of mukti, the abhimAnI

for vAk,

umA that has the name vAk, has her laya in Rudra

who is the abhimAnI for manas and has the name "manaha", Shiva has

his laya in

vAyu, and vAyu enters into Shree, the abhimAnI for tEjas and has

the name "tEja".

 

Shree takes vAyu with her and enters into Vedic Parabrahman,

VishNu, the Highest.

It only means that Shree is "dvArA" for vAyu to reach Parabrahman.

vAyu has his laya directly

in Parabrahman, with the name janArdhana. Apart from these umA-

rudra etc dEvatAs all

other jeevAtmans, at the time of death and also at the time of

mukti, have their laya in vAg abhimAnI umA.

 

Thus is stated in a work called sattattva.

 

 

NOTES :

 

1) "prajA" of the upanishat is indeed applicable only to sentients.

This point is specially mentioned because of the fact that, it would

be

quite wrong to interpret tEja-ap-anna as Fire-water-food which are

all

jaDa.

 

 

2) "vAk manasi sampadyatE manah prANE...". Some interpret

it as " vAg-indriya ends in manas, manas in vital breath, prANa in

tEjas".

 

Such interpretations purely from the standpoint of jaDa-indriyas

would be quite wrong.

vAk-manah-prANa-tEjas refer to their respective abhimAnIs.

 

3) vAg abhimAnIs are - vAruNee-souparNee, manO-abhimAnIs are

shEsha-garuDa-rudra

and prANa-abhimAnI is caturmukha. So, when upanishat

mentions "manah" we need to

take all the abhimAnIs for manas. Similarly, when it

mentions "vAk", we need to take all abhimAnIs for vAk.

 

4) We may recall geethA in this context, "Abrahma bhuvanAllOkAha

punarAvartinO arjuna"

Having "laya" in any other dEvatA ( including LakshmI ) means one

will have to go through rebirths,

where as, having "laya" in Vedic Parabrahman, VishNu is the

only permanent solution to samsAra.

 

Shree KrishNArpaNamastu,

JayakrishNa Nelamangala

 

--- End forwarded message ---

[Guest guest]

advaitin, "mahadevadvaita"

<mahadevadvaita wrote:

>

> Namaste, The following message is from the vadavali group but I

> don't wish to discuss this topic here. I am forwarding it to

provide

> some context for my question. I am confused by these concepts of

> Devis/devatas/abhimani devatas etc. How does Advaita look at all

> this. Veda itself talks about Rudra, Devi, Agni, Surya etc. My

> common sense perspective is that it simply means that any form,

> symbol, element of nature, etc can be chosen as a deity and

> worshipped as Ishwara. Dvaita claim seems to be that there is a

> hierarchy of devis and devatas with Vishnu at the top. I

personally

> think that "Satyam, Jnanam, Anantam brahma" cannot be given any

name

> but if you wish to worship that infinite principle of asti-bhati-

> preeti, you can chose any God or Goddess. Dvaita also claims based

> on some verses in Gita that only Lord Krishna should be worshipped

> but then why all the rituals, etc in the Vedas related to

> devatas/devis ?

> Also can somebody please explain what is the origin and

significance

> of the term - Isht devata ?

>

> regards,

> Om Namah Sivaya

 

 

Namaste,

 

In the following link one can listen to the latest talk of Swami

Paramarthananda ji on the Bhagavadgita Chapter 9 (verses 20 to 23).

In this one hour talk the Swamiji, towards the end, gives an

excellent exposition of the concept of Supreme Ishwara in the Vedic

tradition. The points he brings out throws a lot of light on the

questions, although in part, of Shri Mahadevadvaita raised above.

 

http://www.vedantavidyarthisangha.org

 

IN this page, scroll down to Bhagavadgita talks and click to hear

the 'latest' talk. You may have to download 'Flashplayer' but that

is easy; the page itself helps you.

 

With warm regards to all,

subbu

Om Tat Sat