TECHNIQUES ALONE? We should've been in Shangrila-Jyotish by now!

[Guest guest]

Dear Rishi,

 

In your message the timeless part encourages us but the mention of

a "bond" brings fear to the human heart!

 

And I AM JUST RESPONDING to your message but not all of what follows

is directed at you personally -- GOD FORBID!

 

I have been on the astrology scene, and this forum for quite sometime

(to the chagrin of many as has been expressed gently, and even

agressively over the last couple of years -- and yes there have been

expressions of love and acceptance too, TRUTH be told! What sustains

me, and my presence, I suppose ...).

 

Particularly since early 90s, the renaissence (sp? BUT as french

members will agree it means rebirth!) of jyotish in North America and

elsewhere -- techniques have become the big thing. Teachings earlier

believed in and not questioned, have been questioned and even

politically accosted through messages, articles and books by the low

and the MIGHTY!)

 

NO RESPONSE or repetitive and empty promotional message expected in

response to this post by anyone. If you are really convinced that the

true answer to the puzzle of human experience lies in a bunch of

techniques and the correct ayanamsha and other coordinates (should we

be considering the geotopological coordinates -- the longitudes and

latitudes as they were at the moment of our birth -- or something

older when our incarnating soul was created? IS A PERSONAL CHOICE I

SUPPOSE?), then please simply post evidence and not make the entire

world of jyotishis work for you. By the way this is a smooth trick

that accomplished scientists play on accolytes (post-docs as they are

known!) but the Post-docs, smart beings in their own right are drawn

to that lure because most come out of that experience with something

positive. Not necessarily documentedly true for those who follow

astrologers!

 

How much can we really claim and demonstrate and explain? When it

comes to divination, astrology and the predictions we make?

 

It is about guarantees really! PARTICULARLY when we make a claim, a

STRONG claim about our predictions, or our ayanamshas or whatever!

 

RR

 

 

 

 

 

 

, rishi shukla

<rishi_2000in wrote:

>

> Some of us are listening or rather reading. The forum

> quiet and transforming as all entities do.

> There are bonds which are timeless and in this

> time-ticking journey of life sometimes allow us the

> privilege to be consciously aware of them.

> And instinct whether realised or not plays a role. Do

> carry on...

> Religions not perfect only the devotees are perfect.

> rishi

>

> --- Rohiniranjan <jyotish_vani wrote:

>

> > continuing ---

> >

> > I hated the choir led by the over-eager to please

> > her white masters

> > and grey mistresses Ms. FORGET HER NAME who insulted

> > us after weeks

> > of practice and called us names and blasted us, "YOU

> > ALL (meaning

> > what?) sound like engine ka seetie (whistles of

> > railway

> > locomotives!)! I wondered if Father Principle was

> > mistaken and gave

> > me a 10/10 and came after me and sent me to the

> > choir? Of course he

> > was German and could not really judge me and gauge

> > me, right? As well

> > as an indian sounding and looking nun/teacher could,

> > right? Even

> > Madam Noronah who came to school on a scooter (so

> > half-indian but she

> > was an angloindian -- the one who let me into the

> > choir!) and was not

> > a nun, I assure you -- was so kinder and forgiving

> > than some of the

> > nuns and fathers!

> >

> > But there was also a non-catholic influence. This

> > was a protestant

> > teacher named Mr. Narendra Singh Chowhan that

> > stepped into my life

> > back then in the sixties as well. He was a very

> > handsome man, one of

> > the tallest Indians I ever remember. We were all in

> > awe of him and

> > scared of him. Until we experienced him in grades

> > seven and further.

> > He was studying M.A. in political science and very

> > polished. He

> > taught us english and social science and he built

> > our characters and

> > our love of language.

> >

> > Whatever I am, I have much to thank him for coming

> > into my life, for

> > illuminating my life, kindly, gently, almost

> > silently ...

> >

> > Never has been a teacher ever like him -- if I am

> > fortunate ever to

> > experience in my life that remain -- he or she has a

> > tough competion

> > to match up to! Chowhan Saheb! I met him for the

> > last time back in

> > early 80s when I was visiting India when my dad had

> > died. I am not

> > sure how he knew but he came to visit me and paid

> > his tributes to my

> > Dad who he respected a lot and also because he loved

> > me. I have not

> > heard from him or had any contact with him since

> > then.

> >

> > Very recently, I lost my mother and eldest brother

> > within five days

> > of each other in August this year. After a very

> > harrowing fortnight,

> > I returned home and still recovering from the

> > tragedies, a phone call

> > came. I picked up and it took me to a few seconds to

> > suddenly realize

> > that Chowhan Sir was calling me!

> >

> > What are the odds of a beloved teacher who is the

> > only reason why I

> > even learned the languages, hindi and english and

> > learned with a

> > certain love and manage to entertain so many on the

> > net with --

> > calling me out of the blue decades since the last

> > significant death

> > and loss in my life, calling at the moment of my

> > deepest tragedy, yet

> > again out of the blue, or instinctively or for

> > whatever reason at the

> > very moment when I was feeling so low!

> >

> > He is still Christian -- though I did not have the

> > need to confirm,

> > and I am still looking for the perfect religion

> > ...!

> >

> > Miracles do not exist, you folks ask?

> >

> > Think again!

> >

> > Thank you SIR!! Pranaaams -- something I never

> > really did to you!!!

> >

> > Ranjan

> >

> >

> >

> > ,

> > "Rohiniranjan"

> > <jyotish_vani@> wrote:

> > >

> > > Anand,

> > >

> > > Your musical answer without elaboration (12

> > swaras? tell us more

> > > since I am non-musical and only know or have heard

> > of 7 notes in

> > > different scales and musical realms!) is

> > confusing.

> > >

> > > Navamshas are only nine, an octave of nine that

> > uses 12 notes!

> > > Dreshkanas are octaves of three using 12 notes

> > > Trishamshas move away from the norm of notes and

> > octaves

> > > as do Horas!

> > >

> > > Maybe I am interpreting and translating astrology

> > into musical

> > > reality wrongly! Good to have a musician like you

> > amongst us to

> > > explain and educate us about the music of the

> > spheres through

> > earthly

> > > music or what we know of it!

> > >

> > > Please explain!

> > >

> > > We are all very confused here on this board, so

> > while invigorated

> > by

> > > yet another analogy (or is it a metaphor), you

> > leave us more

> > > confused, Sir/Madam.

> > >

> > > Please illuminate us and I say this not

> > sarcastically as often

> > > accused of, but humbly!

> > >

> > > Music has been a very moving experience in my life

> > -- I always

> > loved

> > > to sing and hum. When I was in grade six or

> > something, just before

> > > christmas in my catholic school (STOP being nosey,

> > okay?) Father

> > > Lorenzio whatever challenged us to test. The test

> > was simple: I had

> > > to just sing the tones he played on the harmonium!

> > Only in India,

> > > only in the sixties, only in MY school could that

> > happen! I got top

> > > marks but stayed back until he came back few days

> > later and

> > wondered

> > > why the heck I was still in the class and did not

> > choir? <Talk

> > about

> > > communication mishaps -- my nemesis even today,

> > decades hence and

> > > NEVER once because I did not understand! The

> > instructions were

> > never

> > > clearly given!! Someday I will talk to you about

> > my marriage.

> > >

> > > Anyway, the German priest sent me to the choir,

> > the angloindian

> > lady

> > > smiled when I succumbed to her test by copying her

> > pitch (I still

> > had

> > > a high voice then!) and she smiled but let me in

> > to sing

> > the "Silent

> > > Night" choir, that still gives me a lot of PEACE

> > when I hear it.

> > >

> > > I love listening to music, I never could manage to

> > learn music, my

> > > unfulfilled ambition is to one day to be able to

> > play the violin.

> > >

> > > It would sound silly to some, many, hopefully not

> > all!

> > >

> > > If the latter, then I must be on the wrong forum

> > or my friends are

> > on

> > > some kind of holiday today!

> > >

> > > RR

> > >

> > > I hated the school choir, conducted by the

> > >

> > > , Anand

> > <anand.ghurye@>

> === message truncated ===

>

>

>

>

>

>

>

[Guest guest]

Bonds have to coexist with timelessness, that is the duality, I

suppose.

That indeed is a smooth trick, Sir. You know there are no answers in

black and white or even in color.

All human endeavor since recorded history is directed towards

reducing uncertainty in human lives. It is still continuing, there

are claims and may those claims be true for atleast the individuals

staking theclaim that they have the right path and the key to unlock

the certainty lock.

Others claim that once upon a time it was a paradise with no

uncertainities. They are blessed for atleast they have a conviction.

A conviction so strong where there is no grey, only clear white and

black. Maybe such conviction itself brings the answers.

For the remaining vast multitudes, it is a struggle uphill and steep

inclines.

There are those using clear cut techniques and adjust charts to suit

their technique calling it rectification. They are not wrong,

ranjanda, its just their conviction. Its their truth and there are as

many truths as there are Gods and people and then someone says, there

is only one God.

rishi

 

 

 

 

 

, "Rohiniranjan"

<jyotish_vani wrote:

>

> Dear Rishi,

>

> In your message the timeless part encourages us but the mention of

> a "bond" brings fear to the human heart!

>

> And I AM JUST RESPONDING to your message but not all of what

follows

> is directed at you personally -- GOD FORBID!

>

> I have been on the astrology scene, and this forum for quite

sometime

> (to the chagrin of many as has been expressed gently, and even

> agressively over the last couple of years -- and yes there have

been

> expressions of love and acceptance too, TRUTH be told! What

sustains

> me, and my presence, I suppose ...).

>

> Particularly since early 90s, the renaissence (sp? BUT as french

> members will agree it means rebirth!) of jyotish in North America

and

> elsewhere -- techniques have become the big thing. Teachings

earlier

> believed in and not questioned, have been questioned and even

> politically accosted through messages, articles and books by the

low

> and the MIGHTY!)

>

> NO RESPONSE or repetitive and empty promotional message expected in

> response to this post by anyone. If you are really convinced that

the

> true answer to the puzzle of human experience lies in a bunch of

> techniques and the correct ayanamsha and other coordinates (should

we

> be considering the geotopological coordinates -- the longitudes and

> latitudes as they were at the moment of our birth -- or something

> older when our incarnating soul was created? IS A PERSONAL CHOICE I

> SUPPOSE?), then please simply post evidence and not make the entire

> world of jyotishis work for you. By the way this is a smooth trick

> that accomplished scientists play on accolytes (post-docs as they

are

> known!) but the Post-docs, smart beings in their own right are

drawn

> to that lure because most come out of that experience with

something

> positive. Not necessarily documentedly true for those who follow

> astrologers!

>

> How much can we really claim and demonstrate and explain? When it

> comes to divination, astrology and the predictions we make?

>

> It is about guarantees really! PARTICULARLY when we make a claim, a

> STRONG claim about our predictions, or our ayanamshas or whatever!

>

> RR

>

>

>

>

>

>

> , rishi shukla

> <rishi_2000in@> wrote:

> >

> > Some of us are listening or rather reading. The forum

> > quiet and transforming as all entities do.

> > There are bonds which are timeless and in this

> > time-ticking journey of life sometimes allow us the

> > privilege to be consciously aware of them.

> > And instinct whether realised or not plays a role. Do

> > carry on...

> > Religions not perfect only the devotees are perfect.

> > rishi

> >

> > --- Rohiniranjan <jyotish_vani@> wrote:

> >

> > > continuing ---

> > >

> > > I hated the choir led by the over-eager to please

> > > her white masters

> > > and grey mistresses Ms. FORGET HER NAME who insulted

> > > us after weeks

> > > of practice and called us names and blasted us, "YOU

> > > ALL (meaning

> > > what?) sound like engine ka seetie (whistles of

> > > railway

> > > locomotives!)! I wondered if Father Principle was

> > > mistaken and gave

> > > me a 10/10 and came after me and sent me to the

> > > choir? Of course he

> > > was German and could not really judge me and gauge

> > > me, right? As well

> > > as an indian sounding and looking nun/teacher could,

> > > right? Even

> > > Madam Noronah who came to school on a scooter (so

> > > half-indian but she

> > > was an angloindian -- the one who let me into the

> > > choir!) and was not

> > > a nun, I assure you -- was so kinder and forgiving

> > > than some of the

> > > nuns and fathers!

> > >

> > > But there was also a non-catholic influence. This

> > > was a protestant

> > > teacher named Mr. Narendra Singh Chowhan that

> > > stepped into my life

> > > back then in the sixties as well. He was a very

> > > handsome man, one of

> > > the tallest Indians I ever remember. We were all in

> > > awe of him and

> > > scared of him. Until we experienced him in grades

> > > seven and further.

> > > He was studying M.A. in political science and very

> > > polished. He

> > > taught us english and social science and he built

> > > our characters and

> > > our love of language.

> > >

> > > Whatever I am, I have much to thank him for coming

> > > into my life, for

> > > illuminating my life, kindly, gently, almost

> > > silently ...

> > >

> > > Never has been a teacher ever like him -- if I am

> > > fortunate ever to

> > > experience in my life that remain -- he or she has a

> > > tough competion

> > > to match up to! Chowhan Saheb! I met him for the

> > > last time back in

> > > early 80s when I was visiting India when my dad had

> > > died. I am not

> > > sure how he knew but he came to visit me and paid

> > > his tributes to my

> > > Dad who he respected a lot and also because he loved

> > > me. I have not

> > > heard from him or had any contact with him since

> > > then.

> > >

> > > Very recently, I lost my mother and eldest brother

> > > within five days

> > > of each other in August this year. After a very

> > > harrowing fortnight,

> > > I returned home and still recovering from the

> > > tragedies, a phone call

> > > came. I picked up and it took me to a few seconds to

> > > suddenly realize

> > > that Chowhan Sir was calling me!

> > >

> > > What are the odds of a beloved teacher who is the

> > > only reason why I

> > > even learned the languages, hindi and english and

> > > learned with a

> > > certain love and manage to entertain so many on the

> > > net with --

> > > calling me out of the blue decades since the last

> > > significant death

> > > and loss in my life, calling at the moment of my

> > > deepest tragedy, yet

> > > again out of the blue, or instinctively or for

> > > whatever reason at the

> > > very moment when I was feeling so low!

> > >

> > > He is still Christian -- though I did not have the

> > > need to confirm,

> > > and I am still looking for the perfect religion

> > > ...!

> > >

> > > Miracles do not exist, you folks ask?

> > >

> > > Think again!

> > >

> > > Thank you SIR!! Pranaaams -- something I never

> > > really did to you!!!

> > >

> > > Ranjan

> > >

> > >

> > >

> > > ,

> > > "Rohiniranjan"

> > > <jyotish_vani@> wrote:

> > > >

> > > > Anand,

> > > >

> > > > Your musical answer without elaboration (12

> > > swaras? tell us more

> > > > since I am non-musical and only know or have heard

> > > of 7 notes in

> > > > different scales and musical realms!) is

> > > confusing.

> > > >

> > > > Navamshas are only nine, an octave of nine that

> > > uses 12 notes!

> > > > Dreshkanas are octaves of three using 12 notes

> > > > Trishamshas move away from the norm of notes and

> > > octaves

> > > > as do Horas!

> > > >

> > > > Maybe I am interpreting and translating astrology

> > > into musical

> > > > reality wrongly! Good to have a musician like you

> > > amongst us to

> > > > explain and educate us about the music of the

> > > spheres through

> > > earthly

> > > > music or what we know of it!

> > > >

> > > > Please explain!

> > > >

> > > > We are all very confused here on this board, so

> > > while invigorated

> > > by

> > > > yet another analogy (or is it a metaphor), you

> > > leave us more

> > > > confused, Sir/Madam.

> > > >

> > > > Please illuminate us and I say this not

> > > sarcastically as often

> > > > accused of, but humbly!

> > > >

> > > > Music has been a very moving experience in my life

> > > -- I always

> > > loved

> > > > to sing and hum. When I was in grade six or

> > > something, just before

> > > > christmas in my catholic school (STOP being nosey,

> > > okay?) Father

> > > > Lorenzio whatever challenged us to test. The test

> > > was simple: I had

> > > > to just sing the tones he played on the harmonium!

> > > Only in India,

> > > > only in the sixties, only in MY school could that

> > > happen! I got top

> > > > marks but stayed back until he came back few days

> > > later and

> > > wondered

> > > > why the heck I was still in the class and did not

> > > choir? <Talk

> > > about

> > > > communication mishaps -- my nemesis even today,

> > > decades hence and

> > > > NEVER once because I did not understand! The

> > > instructions were

> > > never

> > > > clearly given!! Someday I will talk to you about

> > > my marriage.

> > > >

> > > > Anyway, the German priest sent me to the choir,

> > > the angloindian

> > > lady

> > > > smiled when I succumbed to her test by copying her

> > > pitch (I still

> > > had

> > > > a high voice then!) and she smiled but let me in

> > > to sing

> > > the "Silent

> > > > Night" choir, that still gives me a lot of PEACE

> > > when I hear it.

> > > >

> > > > I love listening to music, I never could manage to

> > > learn music, my

> > > > unfulfilled ambition is to one day to be able to

> > > play the violin.

> > > >

> > > > It would sound silly to some, many, hopefully not

> > > all!

> > > >

> > > > If the latter, then I must be on the wrong forum

> > > or my friends are

> > > on

> > > > some kind of holiday today!

> > > >

> > > > RR

> > > >

> > > > I hated the school choir, conducted by the

> > > >

> > > > , Anand

> > > <anand.ghurye@>

> > === message truncated ===

> >

> >

> >

> >

> >

> >

> >

>

[Guest guest]

Rishi,

 

How can 'it', if indeed a trick, be called smooth if it gets caught

so readily? Surely, it must then be something else ...!

 

When logic makes the dish of human experience too sour(not that is

one black and white taste most would admit)adding a bit of salt can

turn into feeling somewhat sweet (try it if you do not believe me!),

it works best with bitter-sour, like the amla fruit!

 

The bitter-sour logic behind astro-logic must be combined with salt,

which to me is the essence of all good tasting food and thus proposed

by me to represent the essence of reality. That is where the real

charts, the verifiable lives, the internet comes into play. When the

amla of astrological rules meets the salt of human lives, real lives,

and their horoscopes, the astrologer or the astrology student if

paying attention synthetically is experiencing nothing but sweet soul-

astrology, aka, Jyotish!

 

RR

 

, "rishi_2000in"

<rishi_2000in wrote:

>

> Bonds have to coexist with timelessness, that is the duality, I

> suppose.

> That indeed is a smooth trick, Sir. You know there are no answers

in

> black and white or even in color.

> All human endeavor since recorded history is directed towards

> reducing uncertainty in human lives. It is still continuing, there

> are claims and may those claims be true for atleast the individuals

> staking theclaim that they have the right path and the key to

unlock

> the certainty lock.

> Others claim that once upon a time it was a paradise with no

> uncertainities. They are blessed for atleast they have a

conviction.

> A conviction so strong where there is no grey, only clear white and

> black. Maybe such conviction itself brings the answers.

> For the remaining vast multitudes, it is a struggle uphill and

steep

> inclines.

> There are those using clear cut techniques and adjust charts to

suit

> their technique calling it rectification. They are not wrong,

> ranjanda, its just their conviction. Its their truth and there are

as

> many truths as there are Gods and people and then someone says,

there

> is only one God.

> rishi

>

>

>

>

>

> , "Rohiniranjan"

> <jyotish_vani@> wrote:

> >

> > Dear Rishi,

> >

> > In your message the timeless part encourages us but the mention

of

> > a "bond" brings fear to the human heart!

> >

> > And I AM JUST RESPONDING to your message but not all of what

> follows

> > is directed at you personally -- GOD FORBID!

> >

> > I have been on the astrology scene, and this forum for quite

> sometime

> > (to the chagrin of many as has been expressed gently, and even

> > agressively over the last couple of years -- and yes there have

> been

> > expressions of love and acceptance too, TRUTH be told! What

> sustains

> > me, and my presence, I suppose ...).

> >

> > Particularly since early 90s, the renaissence (sp? BUT as french

> > members will agree it means rebirth!) of jyotish in North America

> and

> > elsewhere -- techniques have become the big thing. Teachings

> earlier

> > believed in and not questioned, have been questioned and even

> > politically accosted through messages, articles and books by the

> low

> > and the MIGHTY!)

> >

> > NO RESPONSE or repetitive and empty promotional message expected

in

> > response to this post by anyone. If you are really convinced that

> the

> > true answer to the puzzle of human experience lies in a bunch of

> > techniques and the correct ayanamsha and other coordinates

(should

> we

> > be considering the geotopological coordinates -- the longitudes

and

> > latitudes as they were at the moment of our birth -- or something

> > older when our incarnating soul was created? IS A PERSONAL CHOICE

I

> > SUPPOSE?), then please simply post evidence and not make the

entire

> > world of jyotishis work for you. By the way this is a smooth

trick

> > that accomplished scientists play on accolytes (post-docs as they

> are

> > known!) but the Post-docs, smart beings in their own right are

> drawn

> > to that lure because most come out of that experience with

> something

> > positive. Not necessarily documentedly true for those who follow

> > astrologers!

> >

> > How much can we really claim and demonstrate and explain? When it

> > comes to divination, astrology and the predictions we make?

> >

> > It is about guarantees really! PARTICULARLY when we make a claim,

a

> > STRONG claim about our predictions, or our ayanamshas or whatever!

> >

> > RR

> >

> >

> >

> >

> >

> >

> > , rishi shukla

> > <rishi_2000in@> wrote:

> > >

> > > Some of us are listening or rather reading. The forum

> > > quiet and transforming as all entities do.

> > > There are bonds which are timeless and in this

> > > time-ticking journey of life sometimes allow us the

> > > privilege to be consciously aware of them.

> > > And instinct whether realised or not plays a role. Do

> > > carry on...

> > > Religions not perfect only the devotees are perfect.

> > > rishi

> > >

> > > --- Rohiniranjan <jyotish_vani@> wrote:

> > >

> > > > continuing ---

> > > >

> > > > I hated the choir led by the over-eager to please

> > > > her white masters

> > > > and grey mistresses Ms. FORGET HER NAME who insulted

> > > > us after weeks

> > > > of practice and called us names and blasted us, "YOU

> > > > ALL (meaning

> > > > what?) sound like engine ka seetie (whistles of

> > > > railway

> > > > locomotives!)! I wondered if Father Principle was

> > > > mistaken and gave

> > > > me a 10/10 and came after me and sent me to the

> > > > choir? Of course he

> > > > was German and could not really judge me and gauge

> > > > me, right? As well

> > > > as an indian sounding and looking nun/teacher could,

> > > > right? Even

> > > > Madam Noronah who came to school on a scooter (so

> > > > half-indian but she

> > > > was an angloindian -- the one who let me into the

> > > > choir!) and was not

> > > > a nun, I assure you -- was so kinder and forgiving

> > > > than some of the

> > > > nuns and fathers!

> > > >

> > > > But there was also a non-catholic influence. This

> > > > was a protestant

> > > > teacher named Mr. Narendra Singh Chowhan that

> > > > stepped into my life

> > > > back then in the sixties as well. He was a very

> > > > handsome man, one of

> > > > the tallest Indians I ever remember. We were all in

> > > > awe of him and

> > > > scared of him. Until we experienced him in grades

> > > > seven and further.

> > > > He was studying M.A. in political science and very

> > > > polished. He

> > > > taught us english and social science and he built

> > > > our characters and

> > > > our love of language.

> > > >

> > > > Whatever I am, I have much to thank him for coming

> > > > into my life, for

> > > > illuminating my life, kindly, gently, almost

> > > > silently ...

> > > >

> > > > Never has been a teacher ever like him -- if I am

> > > > fortunate ever to

> > > > experience in my life that remain -- he or she has a

> > > > tough competion

> > > > to match up to! Chowhan Saheb! I met him for the

> > > > last time back in

> > > > early 80s when I was visiting India when my dad had

> > > > died. I am not

> > > > sure how he knew but he came to visit me and paid

> > > > his tributes to my

> > > > Dad who he respected a lot and also because he loved

> > > > me. I have not

> > > > heard from him or had any contact with him since

> > > > then.

> > > >

> > > > Very recently, I lost my mother and eldest brother

> > > > within five days

> > > > of each other in August this year. After a very

> > > > harrowing fortnight,

> > > > I returned home and still recovering from the

> > > > tragedies, a phone call

> > > > came. I picked up and it took me to a few seconds to

> > > > suddenly realize

> > > > that Chowhan Sir was calling me!

> > > >

> > > > What are the odds of a beloved teacher who is the

> > > > only reason why I

> > > > even learned the languages, hindi and english and

> > > > learned with a

> > > > certain love and manage to entertain so many on the

> > > > net with --

> > > > calling me out of the blue decades since the last

> > > > significant death

> > > > and loss in my life, calling at the moment of my

> > > > deepest tragedy, yet

> > > > again out of the blue, or instinctively or for

> > > > whatever reason at the

> > > > very moment when I was feeling so low!

> > > >

> > > > He is still Christian -- though I did not have the

> > > > need to confirm,

> > > > and I am still looking for the perfect religion

> > > > ...!

> > > >

> > > > Miracles do not exist, you folks ask?

> > > >

> > > > Think again!

> > > >

> > > > Thank you SIR!! Pranaaams -- something I never

> > > > really did to you!!!

> > > >

> > > > Ranjan

> > > >

> > > >

> > > >

> > > > ,

> > > > "Rohiniranjan"

> > > > <jyotish_vani@> wrote:

> > > > >

> > > > > Anand,

> > > > >

> > > > > Your musical answer without elaboration (12

> > > > swaras? tell us more

> > > > > since I am non-musical and only know or have heard

> > > > of 7 notes in

> > > > > different scales and musical realms!) is

> > > > confusing.

> > > > >

> > > > > Navamshas are only nine, an octave of nine that

> > > > uses 12 notes!

> > > > > Dreshkanas are octaves of three using 12 notes

> > > > > Trishamshas move away from the norm of notes and

> > > > octaves

> > > > > as do Horas!

> > > > >

> > > > > Maybe I am interpreting and translating astrology

> > > > into musical

> > > > > reality wrongly! Good to have a musician like you

> > > > amongst us to

> > > > > explain and educate us about the music of the

> > > > spheres through

> > > > earthly

> > > > > music or what we know of it!

> > > > >

> > > > > Please explain!

> > > > >

> > > > > We are all very confused here on this board, so

> > > > while invigorated

> > > > by

> > > > > yet another analogy (or is it a metaphor), you

> > > > leave us more

> > > > > confused, Sir/Madam.

> > > > >

> > > > > Please illuminate us and I say this not

> > > > sarcastically as often

> > > > > accused of, but humbly!

> > > > >

> > > > > Music has been a very moving experience in my life

> > > > -- I always

> > > > loved

> > > > > to sing and hum. When I was in grade six or

> > > > something, just before

> > > > > christmas in my catholic school (STOP being nosey,

> > > > okay?) Father

> > > > > Lorenzio whatever challenged us to test. The test

> > > > was simple: I had

> > > > > to just sing the tones he played on the harmonium!

> > > > Only in India,

> > > > > only in the sixties, only in MY school could that

> > > > happen! I got top

> > > > > marks but stayed back until he came back few days

> > > > later and

> > > > wondered

> > > > > why the heck I was still in the class and did not

> > > > choir? <Talk

> > > > about

> > > > > communication mishaps -- my nemesis even today,

> > > > decades hence and

> > > > > NEVER once because I did not understand! The

> > > > instructions were

> > > > never

> > > > > clearly given!! Someday I will talk to you about

> > > > my marriage.

> > > > >

> > > > > Anyway, the German priest sent me to the choir,

> > > > the angloindian

> > > > lady

> > > > > smiled when I succumbed to her test by copying her

> > > > pitch (I still

> > > > had

> > > > > a high voice then!) and she smiled but let me in

> > > > to sing

> > > > the "Silent

> > > > > Night" choir, that still gives me a lot of PEACE

> > > > when I hear it.

> > > > >

> > > > > I love listening to music, I never could manage to

> > > > learn music, my

> > > > > unfulfilled ambition is to one day to be able to

> > > > play the violin.

> > > > >

> > > > > It would sound silly to some, many, hopefully not

> > > > all!

> > > > >

> > > > > If the latter, then I must be on the wrong forum

> > > > or my friends are

> > > > on

> > > > > some kind of holiday today!

> > > > >

> > > > > RR

> > > > >

> > > > > I hated the school choir, conducted by the

> > > > >

> > > > > , Anand

> > > > <anand.ghurye@>

> > > === message truncated ===

> > >

> > >

> > >

> > >

> > >

> > >

> > >

> >

>

[Guest guest]

Yes, Ranjanda,the recipe and the taste vary but Ma cooks them all.-

 

 

 

 

-- In , "Rohiniranjan"

<jyotish_vani wrote:

>

> Rishi,

>

> How can 'it', if indeed a trick, be called smooth if it gets caught

> so readily? Surely, it must then be something else ...!

>

> When logic makes the dish of human experience too sour(not that is

> one black and white taste most would admit)adding a bit of salt can

> turn into feeling somewhat sweet (try it if you do not believe

me!),

> it works best with bitter-sour, like the amla fruit!

>

> The bitter-sour logic behind astro-logic must be combined with

salt,

> which to me is the essence of all good tasting food and thus

proposed

> by me to represent the essence of reality. That is where the real

> charts, the verifiable lives, the internet comes into play. When

the

> amla of astrological rules meets the salt of human lives, real

lives,

> and their horoscopes, the astrologer or the astrology student if

> paying attention synthetically is experiencing nothing but sweet

soul-

> astrology, aka, Jyotish!

>

> RR

>

> , "rishi_2000in"

> <rishi_2000in@> wrote:

> >

> > Bonds have to coexist with timelessness, that is the duality, I

> > suppose.

> > That indeed is a smooth trick, Sir. You know there are no answers

> in

> > black and white or even in color.

> > All human endeavor since recorded history is directed towards

> > reducing uncertainty in human lives. It is still continuing,

there

> > are claims and may those claims be true for atleast the

individuals

> > staking theclaim that they have the right path and the key to

> unlock

> > the certainty lock.

> > Others claim that once upon a time it was a paradise with no

> > uncertainities. They are blessed for atleast they have a

> conviction.

> > A conviction so strong where there is no grey, only clear white

and

> > black. Maybe such conviction itself brings the answers.

> > For the remaining vast multitudes, it is a struggle uphill and

> steep

> > inclines.

> > There are those using clear cut techniques and adjust charts to

> suit

> > their technique calling it rectification. They are not wrong,

> > ranjanda, its just their conviction. Its their truth and there

are

> as

> > many truths as there are Gods and people and then someone says,

> there

> > is only one God.

> > rishi

> >

> >

> >

> >

> >

> > , "Rohiniranjan"

> > <jyotish_vani@> wrote:

> > >

> > > Dear Rishi,

> > >

> > > In your message the timeless part encourages us but the mention

> of

> > > a "bond" brings fear to the human heart!

> > >

> > > And I AM JUST RESPONDING to your message but not all of what

> > follows

> > > is directed at you personally -- GOD FORBID!

> > >

> > > I have been on the astrology scene, and this forum for quite

> > sometime

> > > (to the chagrin of many as has been expressed gently, and even

> > > agressively over the last couple of years -- and yes there have

> > been

> > > expressions of love and acceptance too, TRUTH be told! What

> > sustains

> > > me, and my presence, I suppose ...).

> > >

> > > Particularly since early 90s, the renaissence (sp? BUT as

french

> > > members will agree it means rebirth!) of jyotish in North

America

> > and

> > > elsewhere -- techniques have become the big thing. Teachings

> > earlier

> > > believed in and not questioned, have been questioned and even

> > > politically accosted through messages, articles and books by

the

> > low

> > > and the MIGHTY!)

> > >

> > > NO RESPONSE or repetitive and empty promotional message

expected

> in

> > > response to this post by anyone. If you are really convinced

that

> > the

> > > true answer to the puzzle of human experience lies in a bunch

of

> > > techniques and the correct ayanamsha and other coordinates

> (should

> > we

> > > be considering the geotopological coordinates -- the longitudes

> and

> > > latitudes as they were at the moment of our birth -- or

something

> > > older when our incarnating soul was created? IS A PERSONAL

CHOICE

> I

> > > SUPPOSE?), then please simply post evidence and not make the

> entire

> > > world of jyotishis work for you. By the way this is a smooth

> trick

> > > that accomplished scientists play on accolytes (post-docs as

they

> > are

> > > known!) but the Post-docs, smart beings in their own right are

> > drawn

> > > to that lure because most come out of that experience with

> > something

> > > positive. Not necessarily documentedly true for those who

follow

> > > astrologers!

> > >

> > > How much can we really claim and demonstrate and explain? When

it

> > > comes to divination, astrology and the predictions we make?

> > >

> > > It is about guarantees really! PARTICULARLY when we make a

claim,

> a

> > > STRONG claim about our predictions, or our ayanamshas or

whatever!

> > >

> > > RR

> > >

> > >

> > >

> > >

> > >

> > >

> > > , rishi shukla

> > > <rishi_2000in@> wrote:

> > > >

> > > > Some of us are listening or rather reading. The forum

> > > > quiet and transforming as all entities do.

> > > > There are bonds which are timeless and in this

> > > > time-ticking journey of life sometimes allow us the

> > > > privilege to be consciously aware of them.

> > > > And instinct whether realised or not plays a role. Do

> > > > carry on...

> > > > Religions not perfect only the devotees are perfect.

> > > > rishi

> > > >

> > > > --- Rohiniranjan <jyotish_vani@> wrote:

> > > >

> > > > > continuing ---

> > > > >

> > > > > I hated the choir led by the over-eager to please

> > > > > her white masters

> > > > > and grey mistresses Ms. FORGET HER NAME who insulted

> > > > > us after weeks

> > > > > of practice and called us names and blasted us, "YOU

> > > > > ALL (meaning

> > > > > what?) sound like engine ka seetie (whistles of

> > > > > railway

> > > > > locomotives!)! I wondered if Father Principle was

> > > > > mistaken and gave

> > > > > me a 10/10 and came after me and sent me to the

> > > > > choir? Of course he

> > > > > was German and could not really judge me and gauge

> > > > > me, right? As well

> > > > > as an indian sounding and looking nun/teacher could,

> > > > > right? Even

> > > > > Madam Noronah who came to school on a scooter (so

> > > > > half-indian but she

> > > > > was an angloindian -- the one who let me into the

> > > > > choir!) and was not

> > > > > a nun, I assure you -- was so kinder and forgiving

> > > > > than some of the

> > > > > nuns and fathers!

> > > > >

> > > > > But there was also a non-catholic influence. This

> > > > > was a protestant

> > > > > teacher named Mr. Narendra Singh Chowhan that

> > > > > stepped into my life

> > > > > back then in the sixties as well. He was a very

> > > > > handsome man, one of

> > > > > the tallest Indians I ever remember. We were all in

> > > > > awe of him and

> > > > > scared of him. Until we experienced him in grades

> > > > > seven and further.

> > > > > He was studying M.A. in political science and very

> > > > > polished. He

> > > > > taught us english and social science and he built

> > > > > our characters and

> > > > > our love of language.

> > > > >

> > > > > Whatever I am, I have much to thank him for coming

> > > > > into my life, for

> > > > > illuminating my life, kindly, gently, almost

> > > > > silently ...

> > > > >

> > > > > Never has been a teacher ever like him -- if I am

> > > > > fortunate ever to

> > > > > experience in my life that remain -- he or she has a

> > > > > tough competion

> > > > > to match up to! Chowhan Saheb! I met him for the

> > > > > last time back in

> > > > > early 80s when I was visiting India when my dad had

> > > > > died. I am not

> > > > > sure how he knew but he came to visit me and paid

> > > > > his tributes to my

> > > > > Dad who he respected a lot and also because he loved

> > > > > me. I have not

> > > > > heard from him or had any contact with him since

> > > > > then.

> > > > >

> > > > > Very recently, I lost my mother and eldest brother

> > > > > within five days

> > > > > of each other in August this year. After a very

> > > > > harrowing fortnight,

> > > > > I returned home and still recovering from the

> > > > > tragedies, a phone call

> > > > > came. I picked up and it took me to a few seconds to

> > > > > suddenly realize

> > > > > that Chowhan Sir was calling me!

> > > > >

> > > > > What are the odds of a beloved teacher who is the

> > > > > only reason why I

> > > > > even learned the languages, hindi and english and

> > > > > learned with a

> > > > > certain love and manage to entertain so many on the

> > > > > net with --

> > > > > calling me out of the blue decades since the last

> > > > > significant death

> > > > > and loss in my life, calling at the moment of my

> > > > > deepest tragedy, yet

> > > > > again out of the blue, or instinctively or for

> > > > > whatever reason at the

> > > > > very moment when I was feeling so low!

> > > > >

> > > > > He is still Christian -- though I did not have the

> > > > > need to confirm,

> > > > > and I am still looking for the perfect religion

> > > > > ...!

> > > > >

> > > > > Miracles do not exist, you folks ask?

> > > > >

> > > > > Think again!

> > > > >

> > > > > Thank you SIR!! Pranaaams -- something I never

> > > > > really did to you!!!

> > > > >

> > > > > Ranjan

> > > > >

> > > > >

> > > > >

> > > > > ,

> > > > > "Rohiniranjan"

> > > > > <jyotish_vani@> wrote:

> > > > > >

> > > > > > Anand,

> > > > > >

> > > > > > Your musical answer without elaboration (12

> > > > > swaras? tell us more

> > > > > > since I am non-musical and only know or have heard

> > > > > of 7 notes in

> > > > > > different scales and musical realms!) is

> > > > > confusing.

> > > > > >

> > > > > > Navamshas are only nine, an octave of nine that

> > > > > uses 12 notes!

> > > > > > Dreshkanas are octaves of three using 12 notes

> > > > > > Trishamshas move away from the norm of notes and

> > > > > octaves

> > > > > > as do Horas!

> > > > > >

> > > > > > Maybe I am interpreting and translating astrology

> > > > > into musical

> > > > > > reality wrongly! Good to have a musician like you

> > > > > amongst us to

> > > > > > explain and educate us about the music of the

> > > > > spheres through

> > > > > earthly

> > > > > > music or what we know of it!

> > > > > >

> > > > > > Please explain!

> > > > > >

> > > > > > We are all very confused here on this board, so

> > > > > while invigorated

> > > > > by

> > > > > > yet another analogy (or is it a metaphor), you

> > > > > leave us more

> > > > > > confused, Sir/Madam.

> > > > > >

> > > > > > Please illuminate us and I say this not

> > > > > sarcastically as often

> > > > > > accused of, but humbly!

> > > > > >

> > > > > > Music has been a very moving experience in my life

> > > > > -- I always

> > > > > loved

> > > > > > to sing and hum. When I was in grade six or

> > > > > something, just before

> > > > > > christmas in my catholic school (STOP being nosey,

> > > > > okay?) Father

> > > > > > Lorenzio whatever challenged us to test. The test

> > > > > was simple: I had

> > > > > > to just sing the tones he played on the harmonium!

> > > > > Only in India,

> > > > > > only in the sixties, only in MY school could that

> > > > > happen! I got top

> > > > > > marks but stayed back until he came back few days

> > > > > later and

> > > > > wondered

> > > > > > why the heck I was still in the class and did not

> > > > > choir? <Talk

> > > > > about

> > > > > > communication mishaps -- my nemesis even today,

> > > > > decades hence and

> > > > > > NEVER once because I did not understand! The

> > > > > instructions were

> > > > > never

> > > > > > clearly given!! Someday I will talk to you about

> > > > > my marriage.

> > > > > >

> > > > > > Anyway, the German priest sent me to the choir,

> > > > > the angloindian

> > > > > lady

> > > > > > smiled when I succumbed to her test by copying her

> > > > > pitch (I still

> > > > > had

> > > > > > a high voice then!) and she smiled but let me in

> > > > > to sing

> > > > > the "Silent

> > > > > > Night" choir, that still gives me a lot of PEACE

> > > > > when I hear it.

> > > > > >

> > > > > > I love listening to music, I never could manage to

> > > > > learn music, my

> > > > > > unfulfilled ambition is to one day to be able to

> > > > > play the violin.

> > > > > >

> > > > > > It would sound silly to some, many, hopefully not

> > > > > all!

> > > > > >

> > > > > > If the latter, then I must be on the wrong forum

> > > > > or my friends are

> > > > > on

> > > > > > some kind of holiday today!

> > > > > >

> > > > > > RR

> > > > > >

> > > > > > I hated the school choir, conducted by the

> > > > > >

> > > > > > , Anand

> > > > > <anand.ghurye@>

> > > > === message truncated ===

> > > >

> > > >

> > > >

> > > >

> > > > Tired of spam? Mail has the best spam protection

around

> > > >

> > > >

> > >

> >

>