Meditation SB 11.10.8-9

[theist]

SB 11.10.8: Just as fire, which burns and illuminates, is different from firewood, which is to be burned to give illumination, similarly the seer within the body, the self-enlightened spirit soul, is different from the material body, which is to be illuminated by consciousness. Thus the spirit soul and the body possess different characteristics and are separate entities.

 

 

SB 11.10.9: Just as fire may appear differently as dormant, manifest, weak, brilliant and so on, according to the condition of the fuel, similarly, the spirit soul enters a material body and accepts particular bodily characteristics.

[theist]

Most all the time I approach verses like this in the wrong spirit. I must remember to approach them as objects of meditation and prayerful contemplation. They are afterall given to us by the Lord to liberate us from ignorance.

 

To properly hear these two verses would liberate us from matter.The Bhagavatam is simply overflowing with these portals into the spiritual world but I find myself just reading them and passing by without actually entering into them.

 

Lord please have mercy.

[Guest guest]

It's glorious that you have the motivation to read and meditate on this wonderful scripture. I haven't even started reading it yet.

 

Should one read and understand the Bhagavad Gita before stepping into the world of the Bhagavatam?

 

 

Most all the time I approach verses like this in the wrong spirit. I must remember to approach them as objects of meditation and prayerful contemplation. They are afterall given to us by the Lord to liberate us from ignorance.

 

To properly hear these two verses would liberate us from matter.The Bhagavatam is simply overflowing with these portals into the spiritual world but I find myself just reading them and passing by without actually entering into them.

 

Lord please have mercy.

[Guest guest]

 

Should one read and understand the Bhagavad Gita before stepping into the world of the Bhagavatam?

 

If i were you, i would read Gita first. Because it is the essence of the Vedas. So first understand Krsna's personal message, then study the scripture which speak about Krsna. Although thats my opinion.

 

hari bol

[AncientMariner]

But I gotta admit I like Srimad Bhagavatam much better. The story of Lord Rsabhadeva who was practicing mystic yoga and the general public could not appreciate his behavior and were harrasing him, so to cheat them he behaved like crows, cow and deer to me is just the best. But there are many more great stories similar like that, that you can just read over and over and never get tired of.

[Hari Bhakta dasa]

 

If i were you, i would read Gita first. Because it is the essence of the Vedas. So first understand Krsna's personal message, then study the scripture which speak about Krsna. Although thats my opinion.

 

hari bol

 

It is prescribed by Srila Prabhupada that we read Bhagavad-gita first (not just read but study) before we go on to the Srimad Bhagavatam.

 

Prabhupada then tells us to read the Bhagavatam from the beginning; not to jump here and there. If we do not read from the beginning but jump to other parts of the Srimad Bhagavatam we are in danger of misunderstanding and commiting many offenses by speculating and concocting.

[Guest guest]

Ah, yes. This is so true. That is why SP published the Krsna Book or the forbidden Tenth Canto of SB right away when he came to Western countries. And that is why he had people go out to airports and into the street and give the Tenth Canto of SB to people who had never read or heard of Bhag Gita.

Just gave them SB even while they are eating meat smoking cigs drinking etc so that half of the SBs ended up in airport garbage bin afterwards. And that's why SP said, "If they just look at it or touch it, it will purify them." And that is why when SP asked his disciples to read aloud Krsna Book for him, he told them just open it anywhere and read, "Because anywhere you taste sugar candy it is sweet." So yah this is really true. SP made sure that every single one of then five billion people in the world read BG before he even dreamed of publishing SB. And you had to write in to a monastery the only authorized dealer of SB and prove you were initiated and had read and understood Bhag Gita first plus received dharma transmission and from which lama before anyone would even send a SB to you, like the Tibetan Buddhists do for their more esoteric teachings. So yessiree bob all of these stringent checks and balances were in place to keep the neophyte kanisthas from making offenses.

[theist]

As far as I understand it it is best to study progressively but there are no stringent hard and fast rules. Anyone can read the two verses that started this thread, take the message and become liberated from matter without any preliminary study.

 

It is by Grace we are saved and not by proper scholarship.

 

We sometimes take statements from Srila Prabhupada and try to make an iron tight doctrine out it.

 

When someone moved into a temple he would find Srimad Bhagavatam class in the morning and Bhagavad gita class at night. There was no restriction that only someone who qualified himself as a knower of the Bhagavad gita could attend the Bhagavatam class.

 

Anyone have any thoughts on those particular verses?

[Hari Bhakta dasa]

 

Ah, yes. This is so true. That is why SP published the Krsna Book or the forbidden Tenth Canto of SB right away when he came to Western countries. And that is why he had people go out to airports and into the street and give the Tenth Canto of SB to people who had never read or heard of Bhag Gita.

Just gave them SB even while they are eating meat smoking cigs drinking etc so that half of the SBs ended up in airport garbage bin afterwards. And that's why SP said, "If they just look at it or touch it, it will purify them." And that is why when SP asked his disciples to read aloud Krsna Book for him, he told them just open it anywhere and read, "Because anywhere you taste sugar candy it is sweet." So yah this is really true. SP made sure that every single one of then five billion people in the world read BG before he even dreamed of publishing SB. And you had to write in to a monastery the only authorized dealer of SB and prove you were initiated and had read and understood Bhag Gita first plus received dharma transmission and from which lama before anyone would even send a SB to you, like the Tibetan Buddhists do for their more esoteric teachings. So yessiree bob all of these stringent checks and balances were in place to keep the neophyte kanisthas from making offenses.

 

 

What is your problem? I only repeated what I learned from Srila Prabhupada plus it was in answer to a particular question by some other unnamed guest.

 

Theist, please accept my humble apologies if anything I may have said in your thread has caused any disrupture in the nectar. This was not my intent as I am only repeating what I learned from my spiritual master which is to start at the beginning and follow thru so we have an understanding of who is Lord Krishna. Also, to read Bhagavad-gita first.

[Pankaja_Dasa]

I think I read you have to understand (lol), that krishna is God first then you can apprciciate His Lila (Bhagavatam). But His pastimes are so nice anyway so.

[theist]

 

Theist, please accept my humble apologies if anything I may have said in your thread has caused any disrupture in the nectar. This was not my intent as I am only repeating what I learned from my spiritual master which is to start at the beginning and follow thru so we have an understanding of who is Lord Krishna. Also, to read Bhagavad-gita first.

 

No, no problem. This is a discussion and not "my thread". I start threads and participate in others threads because I need your association and that of the others on this forum. There is no disruption of any nectar because to be honest the majority of us are sitting on the mental plane where there is only the rough reflection of true nectar. We are still the bees outside the honey jar. That was really my point about not really entering the spiritual world through the provided verse portals of the SB.

 

I very much appreciate your point. I was trying to say we shouldn't take such instructions as rigid iron clad rules. After all Srila Prabhupada did want everyone to understand the position of Krnas by reading the SB from Canto 1 onward. He did also say wherever we taste sugar it is sweet, and it is true that he gave everyone Krsna Book first. So how to harmonize these seeming contradictions?

 

My belief is that we should take seriously the warning not to try and proceed far past our pay grade. Those that turn to Tenth Canto almost exclusively often end up as sahajiyas and foolishly pretend they are either Krsna enjoying the gopis or they become cross dressers and female impersonators thinking they are in the mood of separation.

 

To avoid this tradgedy in our own lives I believe it is important to spend time in mediatation on the mood of Prahlada Maharaja, receive his mercy and then move on to madhura-rasa if that is our desire. I take this from the warnings of Srila Prabhupada. So our main focus of study should be assessed through our own introspection and one's siksa guru's instructions on what level we are on. We proceed from there.But through a peek ahead sometimes Krsna gives us a little taste just to keep us enthused.

This is Personalism and not merely a rote formulaic course to transcendence.

 

It is not hard to harmonize these statements from His Divine Grace.

[AncientMariner]

"Anyone have any thoughts on those particular verses?"

 

To be honest those types of verses don't do much for me personally. They are nice and all but I find the real nectar in the wandering foolish madmen incarnations of Krishna.

 

"Jaḍa Bharata behaved before his father like a fool, despite his father's adequately instructing him in Vedic knowledge. He behaved in that way so that his father would know that he was unfit for instruction and would abandon the attempt to instruct him further. He would behave in a completely opposite way. Although instructed to wash his hands after evacuating, he would wash them before. Nonetheless, his father wanted to give him Vedic instructions during the spring and summer. He tried to teach him the Gāyatrī mantra along with oḿkāra and vyāhṛti, but after four months, his father still was not successful in instructing him." SB 5.9.5

 

"The brāhmaṇa father of Jaḍa Bharata considered his son his heart and soul, and therefore he was very much attached to him. He thought it wise to educate his son properly, and being absorbed in this unsuccessful endeavor, he tried to teach his son the rules and regulations of brahmacarya — including the execution of the Vedic vows, cleanliness, study of the Vedas, the regulative methods, service to the spiritual master and the method of offering a fire sacrifice. He tried his best to teach his son in this way, but all his endeavors failed. In his heart he hoped that his son would be a learned scholar, but all his attempts were unsuccessful. Like everyone, this brāhmaṇa was attached to his home, and he had forgotten that someday he would die. Death, however, was not forgetful. At the proper time, death appeared and took him away." SB 5.9.6

 

"Degraded men are actually no better than animals. The only difference is that animals have four legs and such men have only two. These two-legged, animalistic men used to call Jaḍa Bharata mad, dull, deaf and dumb. They mistreated him, and Jaḍa Bharata behaved for them like a madman who was deaf, blind or dull. He did not protest or try to convince them that he was not so. If others wanted him to do something, he acted according to their desires. Whatever food he could acquire by begging or by wages, and whatever came of its own accord — be it a small quantity, palatable, stale or tasteless — he would accept and eat. He never ate anything for sense gratification because he was already liberated from the bodily conception, which induces one to accept palatable or unpalatable food. He was full in the transcendental consciousness of devotional service, and therefore he was unaffected by the dualities arising from the bodily conception. Actually his body was as strong as a bull's, and his limbs were very muscular. He didn't care for winter or summer, wind or rain, and he never covered his body at any time. He lay on the ground, and never smeared oil on his body or took a bath. Because his body was dirty, his spiritual effulgence and knowledge were covered, just as the splendor of a valuable gem is covered by dirt. He only wore a dirty loincloth and his sacred thread, which was blackish. Understanding that he was born in a brāhmaṇa family, people would call him a brahma-bandhu and other names. Being thus insulted and neglected by materialistic people, he wandered here and there." SB 5.9.9-10

 

 

 

 

These kind of stories are just funny as hell in my opinion.