Official Ramakanta vs. IRM discussion thread

[Guest guest]

Posted by Yaduraja on Dec 04, 2006:

 

Dear Ramakanta Prabhu,

PAMHO. AGTSP!

I had asked:

 

"Do you accept that Srila Prabhupada was not physically present at many

initiation ceremonies; Yes or no will be fine?"

 

To which you reply:

 

> Yes. He was not physically present at many initiation ceremonies. And by

> "physically present" I mean "within a distance of 10 meters or so from the

> sacrificial fire".

 

As we all know there were many occasions, particularly after 1975, when

Srila Prabhupada was in a totally different country to where an initiation

ceremony was being conducted. Such occasions would certainly fit your ’10

metre’ rule.

 

So we now agree that Srila Prabhupada does not need to be physically present

at the initiation ceremony of his disciples.

 

So whatever the reason Srila Prabhupada may have travelled and conducted

most of the early ceremonies himself (for one thing he had to teach his

first disciples everything- including how to conduct ceremonies), we can

know for certain his physical presence is not absolutely required in order

for the diksa ceremony to proceed.

 

Good, now we're getting somewhere.

 

Therefore you cannot use this physical presence issue to challenge point c).

The ritvik system is simply an extension of that which was already up and

running prior to Srila Prabhupada’s physical departure. The physical

presence of the spiritual master is not essential (see many quotes given

previously).

 

you asked for quotes regarding the definition of diksa:

 

"Diksa actually means *initiating* a disciple *with transcendental

knowledge* by which he becomes freed from all material contamination."

(Madhya-lila, 4:112, Purport)

 

"Diksa is the process by which one can awaken his transcendental knowledge

and vanquish all reactions caused by sinful activity. A person expert in the

study of the revealed scriptures knows this process as diksa."

(C.c. Madhya, 15.108, purport)

 

Thus, by the mercy of the spiritual master we receive transcendental

knowledge and have our sinful reactions, or material contamination,

vanquished, as I wrote previously. Neither of which ABSOLUTELY requires the

physical presence of the spiritual master.

 

So welcome to the IRM, where do you want your application forms sent?.

Best wishes

Ys

Yadu