Vegan vs vegetarian

[Guest guest]

I've heard vegans accuse lacto-vegetarians of supporting the veal industry because the dairy cows are kept pregnant to prolong lactation. Afterwards of course the calves are farmed out for veal.

I wonder how the devotees reason that one out.

[theist]

 

I've heard vegans accuse lacto-vegetarians of supporting the veal industry because the dairy cows are kept pregnant to prolong lactation. Afterwards of course the calves are farmed out for veal.

I wonder how the devotees reason that one out.

Good point. Preaching cow protection as a prime duty for mankind while drinking commercial milk which is directly supportive of the veal industry is very inconsistent.

 

I am a vegan BTW.

 

Krsna loves the calves!

[Vrindavan]

i am not a vegan

as i do not eat onion and garlic etc

[Guest guest]

Why was my previous post deleted?

 

I mean isn't it hypocritical not to eat meat because is some sort of 'sin', but instead eat vegetables?

 

The plants are also alive and some research points out that they might have some sort of feelings as well...

[AncientMariner]

 

Why was my previous post deleted?

 

I mean isn't it hypocritical not to eat meat because is some sort of 'sin', but instead eat vegetables?

 

The plants are also alive and some research points out that they might have some sort of feelings as well...

 

 

Krishna authorizes in the revealed scriptures to eat vegetables. Meat eating is in the mode of ignorance and passion and leads to being eaten in your next life by the animals you ate so it is not conducive to self realization.

[Guest guest]

So with that sense Im going to be eaten by... cows. I respect every belief even if I don't agree with it.

 

But I have some questions. Did Krishna wrote those books? Who did? And why do we have to blindly follow what a book says? Did this practice help you in any way?

[AncientMariner]

 

So with that sense Im going to be eaten by... cows. I respect every belief even if I don't agree with it.

 

But I have some questions. Did Krishna wrote those books? Who did? And why do we have to blindly follow what a book says? Did this practice help you in any way?

 

If I am not mistaken I think the Vedas were written by Srila Vyasadeva who is the literary incarnation of Krishna. As far as I know Krishna and the acaryas do not encourage blind following and the books are a scientic method of self realization so to speak. Yes this practice has helped me personally before I read all this stuff I suffered from terrible anxiety, depression, and confusion and now I feel much saner. If you are interested just take it slow and chant the Hare Krishna mantra and try to give up your bad habits as best as possible.

[Guest guest]

I'm glad that the practice had beneficial results for you. Keep it up then. Not everything is for everyone though.

 

I found myself elsewhere. Eating meat did not cause any problems on my path. The only reason Im saying these things is that many people do things just for the sake of doing them (without any actual results). This attitude, others might take advantage of and it saddens me to see people following them blindly (im not refering to you or anyone else here just to be clear). You know this is the very root of fanaticism (blind following), which is also the root of most of mankinds problems...

 

Ps. Im still waiting an answer from the administrators as to why my previous comment has been deleted/censored.

[mrs.moore]

hare krishnas offer all their food to krishna with prayers and maybe rituals. offering isn't just a prayer of thanks, like saying grace, it means they've cooked for krishna. then they eat the food as if they are eating krishna's left-overs. of course, because he's god, he can eat it and also leave it there for the devotee to eat.

 

so they only offer what he likes.

 

one way of deciding whether to offer and partake of milk products might be to think about krishna's compassion upon the poor little calves and their beautiful mothers, -- he might organise a better future incarnationa for them.

 

the milk from a happy cow in, say, vrindavan, is much nicer than the milk from an industrialised dairy.

 

no harm in killing vegetables, but perhaps the highest diet might be just fruit, nuts, and ahimsa milk. then you don't have to kill anything. very pure.

[AncientMariner]

 

I'm glad that the practice had beneficial results for you. Keep it up then. Not everything is for everyone though.

 

I found myself elsewhere. Eating meat did not cause any problems on my path. The only reason Im saying these things is that many people do things just for the sake of doing them (without any actual results). This attitude, others might take advantage of and it saddens me to see people following them blindly (im not refering to you or anyone else here just to be clear). You know this is the very root of fanaticism (blind following), which is also the root of most of mankinds problems...

 

Ps. Im still waiting an answer from the administrators as to why my previous comment has been deleted/censored.

 

Well I think there probably is plenty of blind following in the Krishna Consciousness Movement but as far as I can tell that is not sanctioned at all by Krishna. The process is actually very scientific but anyone who tries to push their beliefs on you or anything is being disrespectful but Krishna's do feel a duty especially to try and convince people to give up cow slaughter and participating in that industry. For me personally the moderator of this forum has always been real fair and balanced for the most part.

[mrs.moore]

i have my eyes open when choosing what to follow blindly. like vegetarianism.

[theist]

 

i am not a vegan

as i do not eat onion and garlic etc

 

Apparently you do not know what a vegan is.

[mrs.moore]

you can be a vegan and eat onion and garlic! just you don't eat animal products.

 

i don't wear pearls or silk any more. nasty yucky.

[cbrahma]

According to the teaching, there is harm in killing anything, including vegetables which BTW are also jiva souls. The understanding is that offering to Krsna removes all karmic reactions. Now I don't know about the commercial milk though I know for a fact devotees are buying their milk at markets. There is some link between that a cow slaughter.

 

 

hare krishnas offer all their food to krishna with prayers and maybe rituals. offering isn't just a prayer of thanks, like saying grace, it means they've cooked for krishna. then they eat the food as if they are eating krishna's left-overs. of course, because he's god, he can eat it and also leave it there for the devotee to eat.

 

so they only offer what he likes.

 

one way of deciding whether to offer and partake of milk products might be to think about krishna's compassion upon the poor little calves and their beautiful mothers, -- he might organise a better future incarnationa for them.

 

the milk from a happy cow in, say, vrindavan, is much nicer than the milk from an industrialised dairy.

 

no harm in killing vegetables, but perhaps the highest diet might be just fruit, nuts, and ahimsa milk. then you don't have to kill anything. very pure.

[mrs.moore]

 

Now I don't know about the commercial milk though I know for a fact devotees are buying their milk at markets. There is some link between that a cow slaughter.

 

yeah i know. it's yucky to think about the moo-cows suffering and their calves being taken away and slaughtered. i am a mother for god's sake! but i just thought that if that milk is offered to krishna it might help them...

 

have you heard of raw milk? www.rawmilk.org

 

ideally, it would be nice to have your own cow, wouldn't it! there's an old guy who lives in a little stable with his cow in that cobbled arched walkway between radha-damodara down to nityananda vat by the yamuna. that's the life.

[Vrindavan]

>> Apparently you do not know what a vegan is.

 

 

Mrs. Moore had answered it for me, thanks.

[mrs.moore]

 

According to the teaching, there is harm in killing anything, including vegetables which BTW are also jiva souls.

 

yeah. i still think the ultimate diet would be fruit and nuts and milk-from-a-happy-cow. so you don't have to kill anything.

[Guest guest]

 

Eating meat did not cause any problems on my path.

 

It may seem like that now, but once you've taken to this Hare Krishna lifestyle & diet you will notice how wrong and ignorant you had been living, and how much unnecessary hurt and suffering you caused to countless innocent creatures. Only one in ignorance will equating the killing of plantlife with the killing of animals and will fail to see that animals obviously have a much more developed consciousness than plantlife. By meat eating one remains in ignorance and will be unable to realize any spiritual subject matter, that is not only stated in the Vedic scripture but by practical experience one can also establish this for fact by him/herself. A practical example has been given many times, as meat eaters commonly equate the killing of vegetables with the killing of animals.

 

Vegetarian vs. Vegan. This "battle" is a very recent phenomenon. Due to today's greedy exploitational attitude by money hungry people, vegetarianism has come under fire for supporting the meat industry by taking milkproducts. if it weren't for the phenomenon of industry (greed), this problem wouldn't have arisen. See the Vedic literature where countless numbers of cows were donated and herded without problems. Meat eating is a sinful and destructive diet, vegetarianism is the natural diet of man, while the vegan diet means taking things over the top.

Though it's better to take your diet seriously, if you were to keep in mind the processes of any mainstream product today you couldn't even buy a new set of clothes because you basically know it will come from India or anywhere else in Asia 90% of the time, where production methods pollute holy rivers which will kill aquatics and cause serious illness among humans, where workers are sure to be underpayed and laboring in inhumane circumstances, some underraged, while the importing party buys the clothing dirtcheap while selling it at extortional rates.

Also you shouldn't take electricity, just light candles because by taking electricity you attribute to airpollution, cancer inducing electricity poles and other toxic waste (Erin Brockovich).

What it means is that, this is Kali Yuga and there are always going to be processes you use which are going to harm other living beings, either directly or indirectly.

 

The point is to just be conscious of what you buy and consume. Don't buy commercial milk, it's not that hard to find biological milk. Milk and the Vedic culture are inseperable, Krishna accepts milkproducts as an offering, so any karmic reaction will be negated if offered to Him. Who knows, the cow who's milk is offered to Krishna may even receive a blessing.

[cbrahma]

Hitler was a vegetarian. Jesus ate fish.

 

 

It may seem like that now, but once you've taken to this Hare Krishna lifestyle & diet you will notice how wrong and ignorant you had been living, and how much unnecessary hurt and suffering you caused to countless innocent creatures. Only one in ignorance will equating the killing of plantlife with the killing of animals and will fail to see that animals obviously have a much more developed consciousness than plantlife. By meat eating one remains in ignorance and will be unable to realize any spiritual subject matter, that is not only stated in the Vedic scripture but by practical experience one can also establish this for fact by him/herself. A practical example has been given many times, as meat eaters commonly equate the killing of vegetables with the killing of animals.

 

Vegetarian vs. Vegan. This "battle" is a very recent phenomenon. Due to today's greedy exploitational attitude by money hungry people, vegetarianism has come under fire for supporting the meat industry by taking milkproducts. if it weren't for the phenomenon of industry (greed), this problem wouldn't have arisen. See the Vedic literature where countless numbers of cows were donated and herded without problems. Meat eating is a sinful and destructive diet, vegetarianism is the natural diet of man, while the vegan diet means taking things over the top.

Though it's better to take your diet seriously, if you were to keep in mind the processes of any mainstream product today you couldn't even buy a new set of clothes because you basically know it will come from India or anywhere else in Asia 90% of the time, where production methods pollute holy rivers which will kill aquatics and cause serious illness among humans, where workers are sure to be underpayed and laboring in inhumane circumstances, some underraged, while the importing party buys the clothing dirtcheap while selling it at extortional rates.

Also you shouldn't take electricity, just light candles because by taking electricity you attribute to airpollution, cancer inducing electricity poles and other toxic waste (Erin Brockovich).

What it means is that, this is Kali Yuga and there are always going to be processes you use which are going to harm other living beings, either directly or indirectly.

 

The point is to just be conscious of what you buy and consume. Don't buy commercial milk, it's not that hard to find biological milk. Milk and the Vedic culture are inseperable, Krishna accepts milkproducts as an offering, so any karmic reaction will be negated if offered to Him. Who knows, the cow who's milk is offered to Krishna may even receive a blessing.

[Ayodhya]

 

Hitler was a vegetarian. Jesus ate fish.

 

Then obviously, Hitler reaches enlightenment and Jesus gets to be reborn.

[cbrahma]

 

Then obviously, Hitler reaches enlightenment and Jesus gets to be reborn.

Thus speaketh Ayodhya.

[theist]

Hitler was not a vegetarian. That is a myth. His favorite food was some kind of sausage. His doctor advised him to become a vegetarian but he never did it.

[Guest guest]

 

Hitler was a vegetarian. Jesus ate fish.

 

Hitler was not a vegetarian, that is an urban legend, a bogus conception probably propagated by meateaters. Jesus was(is) an eternally liberated soul who descended to earth to bring the ignorant meateaters to a path of God consciousness. Such souls can eat anything and not have their consciousness contaminated by it.

[cbrahma]

It's all a matter of chronology as with most vegetarians.

 

"If I offer a child the choice between a pear and a piece of meat, he'll quickly choose the pear. That's his atavistic instinct speaking."

- Adolf Hitler. December 28, 1941. Section 81, HITLER'S TABLE TALK

"The only thing of which I shall be incapable is to share the sheiks' mutton with them. I'm a vegetarian, and they must spare me from their meat."

- Adolf Hitler. January 12, 1942. Section 105, HITLER'S TABLE TALK

"At the time when I ate meat, I used to sweat a lot. I used to drink four pots of beer and six bottles of water during a meeting. … When I became a vegetarian, a mouthful of water was enough."

- Adolf Hitler. January 22, 1942. Section 117, HITLER'S TABLE TALK

"When you offer a child the choice of a piece of meat, an apple, or a cake, it's never the meat that he chooses. There's an ancestral instinct there."

- Adolf Hitler. January 22, 1942. Section 117, HITLER'S TABLE TALK

 

 

 

Hitler was not a vegetarian, that is an urban legend, a bogus conception probably propagated by meateaters. Jesus was(is) an eternally liberated soul who descended to earth to bring the ignorant meateaters to a path of God consciousness. Such souls can eat anything and not have their consciousness contaminated by it.

[Guest guest]

 

It's all a matter of chronology as with most vegetarians.

 

"If I offer a child the choice between a pear and a piece of meat, he'll quickly choose the pear. That's his atavistic instinct speaking."

- Adolf Hitler. December 28, 1941. Section 81, HITLER'S TABLE TALK

"The only thing of which I shall be incapable is to share the sheiks' mutton with them. I'm a vegetarian, and they must spare me from their meat."

- Adolf Hitler. January 12, 1942. Section 105, HITLER'S TABLE TALK

"At the time when I ate meat, I used to sweat a lot. I used to drink four pots of beer and six bottles of water during a meeting. … When I became a vegetarian, a mouthful of water was enough."

- Adolf Hitler. January 22, 1942. Section 117, HITLER'S TABLE TALK

"When you offer a child the choice of a piece of meat, an apple, or a cake, it's never the meat that he chooses. There's an ancestral instinct there."

- Adolf Hitler. January 22, 1942. Section 117, HITLER'S TABLE TALK

 

 

 

"but we have the testimony to the contrary of the woman chef who was his personal cook in Hamburg during the late 1930s - Dione Lucas. In her "Gourmet Cooking School Cookbook," she records that his favorite dish - the one that he customarily requested - was stuffed squab (pigeon). "I do not mean to spoil your appetite for stuffed squab, but you might be interested to know that it was a great favorite with Mr. Hitler, who dined in the hotel often."

 

 

Robert Payne's authoritative "The Life and Death of Adolph Hitler" (Prager, 1973) states on page 346: "Hitler's asceticism played an important role in the image he projected over Germany. According to the widely believed legend, he neither smoked not drank, nor did he eat meat...Only the first was true. He drank beer and diluted wine frequently, had a special fondness for Bavarian sausages...

 

His asceticism was a fiction, invented by Goebbels to emphasize his total dedication, his self control...He could claim that he was dedicated to the service of his people.

 

In fact, he was remarkably self indulgent... Although Hitler had no fondness for meat except in the form of sausages and never ate fish, he enjoyed caviar..."

 

 

Armaments Minister Albert Speer's autobiography, "Inside the Third Reich," (Macmillan, 1970) indicates that meat was served, in substantial amounts, at Hitler's meals.

 

As the nazis were masters of deception it is not your fault that you bought into their nazi propaganda.