Help with overdue pregnancy

[Guest guest]

Dear Lisa ! Thanks very much for some detailed and prompt suggestions !

We'll pass those on. In this case the lady is very much against

intervention and it would be great to find a happy way forward without

her needing to go through that !

We'll post back to the group on outcome

Kind regards

Mike and Stephie

>>>>>>

On Mon, 2007-01-01 at 20:18 -0800, lisa loring wrote:

> Have you inquired with your health care practitioner about Castor? I

> used in when my son was overdue, took it before going to sleep at

> night, woke up at about 4 am in labor, and he was safely delivered at

> home in about 8 hours. (my shortest delivery) I also have several

> friends who have used castor oil under the direction of a midwife.

> There can be side effects, as with anything however this is less

> invasive than most. Please check for safety/efficacy in your case.

> Also, My midwife told me to take Evening Primrose oil (gel-caps) 3X's

> per day and to insert 2 in the vagina at bedtime--you must stay laying

> down or else they fall out. >>>>>

 

>

>

>

[Guest guest]

Though baby is overdue, please ensure that this is the case for

intervention. A philosophy which is gaining ground amongst all

alternative health care professionals associated with childbirth is

that it is not only the the delivery of a baby by mother, it is also

babies experience of start of a new chapter. Boys tend to get

delivered earlier than girls, who like to enjoy mothers company for

longer time! Vegan mothers with strong babies are known to be slow.

 

The description of mothers health, her spirits, her wishes against

intervention and most important of all, winter season, all suggest

that nothing is wrong. 40 weeks, 270 days etc are all statistical

averages, and mathematical bell shaped curve streches to infinity.

baby coming later than mathematical answer expected by people who

are non-participants in babies making, is not necessarily

problematic. 4 weeks overdue examples have been seen.

 

Let baby decide, and interven only if one can prove that overdue is

due to weak apan Vata of the mother. If baby is enjoying inside the

womb, let her be since these last few weeks are most important for

the baby, as can be seen by several studies on pre-term babies.

 

Anyway, let the wisdom of midwife be the ultimate decision maker.

 

Lisa's experience will be very helpful to you. She has given almost

total protocol, including acupuncture. The quantity of Castor oil

should be decided by midwife, but commonly, upto 200 ml dosages have

been used. Women in India most commonly take castor oil and go, even

if they have been suggested possibility of C-section. They know that

they will go for VB this way. The fastest case which author heard was

the second delivery of a woman(32), she consumed castor oil at

bedtime, started getting pains around 7 AM, and by 10:30 the baby was

resting in mothers lap, perfectly normal vagibnal birth. Castor oil

is a best oil for restoring apan vata.

 

According to this author, To make its action gentle, it is better if

it is taken with a little milk, in which small amount (say 1 tbsp)

aswgandha and ginger powder 1/2 tbsp) is boiled adding equal water

and boiling continued till water evaporates. Both these herbs

strengthen and balance apan vata needed to deliver the baby. Lisa

discussed Castor oil and its application other than starting

contractions, it is a very powerful oil, author wishes to write

extensively about it some other day.

 

The subject of helping labor through herbs has been discussed earlier

on this list. E.g in message 4128, "And let us recollect our

ayurvedic epidural and pitocin. The roots of

Arka tree (Calotropis procera), when kept in the hair of laboring

woman assist her for

safe delivery. Can we say they emit certain vibrations to ease the

childbirth. This tree is associated with Lord siva again. The god

associated with birth as well as death." Unfortunately, Arka roots

may not be easily available everywhere in world.

 

Easy labor is possible if proper herbs are used about 5 weeks in

advance. Thus A tincture mix of well-known herbs like Red Raspberry

Leaf, Blue Cohosh Root and False Unicorn, If started 5 Weeks Before

expected date, prepares the woman's body for an easier labor. In

addition, bastis with certain oils will prepare the mother for easier

labor. You may find these oils mentioned in Files section of group

perinatalayurveda.

 

So many herbs become uterine contraction stimulant, that author

thought of posting them here, with a brief comment on each. Author

omitted herbs of Indian origin not available abroad. In the comments,

Euterine Contractions Stimulant is mentioned as ECS.

 

Barberry: ECS

 

Basil oil: ECS,

 

Beth root (Trillium erectum), ECS, also pain relief, to reduce other

complications

 

Black cohosh (Cimicifuga racemosus), Safe during labor. sedative and

reduces hypertension.

 

Blue cohosh (Caulophyllum thalictroides), induces labor, ECS, Safe

during labor, an antispasmodic.

 

Broom (Cytisus scoparius), aids contractions and reduces hemorrage

 

Clove oil, ECS, safe during labor if dosage under guidance

 

Cotton root (Gossypium herbaceum), ECS

 

Devil's claw (Harpagophytum procumbens), ECS, has effects similar to

Oxytocin injection.

 

Feverfew (Tanacetum parthenium), ECS

 

Golden seal (Hydrastis canadensis), ECS, Safe since limited toxicity.

 

Greater celandine (Chelidonium majus), ECS

 

Juniper and juniper oil (Juniperus communis), ECS, safe due to

limited toxicity.

 

Lady's mantle (Alchemilla xanthoclora), ECS, safe due to limited

toxicity.

 

Rue (Ruta graveolens), weak ECS

 

Shepherd's purse (Capsella bursa-pastoris), ECS, safe

 

Spikenard: analgesic, ECS

 

Squaw Vine, ECS

 

Wild yam (Diascorea villosa), safe ECS, small dosage aids fertility

 

Red Raspberry or Rubus strigosus, Raspberry Leaf Tea ( warm) is

valuable during labor as a uterine tonic.

 

Rosemary and rosemary oil, ECS in high dosage.

 

Saffron (Crocus sativa), ECS in high dosage

 

Sage and sage oil, ECS in high dosage

 

Senna (Senna alexandrina), ECS in high dosage

 

Vervain (Verbene officinalis), ECS in high dosage

 

White horehound (Marrubium vulgare), Reputed ECS

 

Wood betony (Stachys officinalis), Reputed ECS, high dose during

labor needed.

 

Yarrow (Achillea millefolium) RCS in high dose, take to start and

maintain labor.

 

Notes:

 

The dosage is obtained by experience and body type of the mother.

THough number of herbs have been mentioned, it is better to use only

few as greater experience can be collected.

 

The principle of the working is toxicity of the herbs, which body

wishes to drive out through bowel motions, as a result of which apan

Vata force needs to be made stronger. consider how Arka roots in the

hair act.

 

Based on the large experience of indian women, castor oil and arka

roots are safe in Indian environment.

 

ayurveda, Mike and Stephie <us

wrote:

>

> Hi People !

> Just wondering of simple and safe ayurvedic methods of hastening a

> pregnancy. Known to us is Black Haritiki in a herbal preparation

but

> perhaps there are others known to the group?

> We have a client who is about 2 weeks overdue.

> Some relevent information:

>

> 1. Around 2 weeks overdue

> 2. Moderate exercise brings on contractions but subsides on

> recovery

> 3. Mother is pitta-vata constitution. Carries little surplus

weight

> 4. Mother's diet is vegan

> 5. Mother enjoys a high level of health and is of good spirits

> 6. The midwife has recommended intervention in 2 days time

> 7. The mother does not entertain the idea of intervention

[Guest guest]

Dear Dr Bhate!

We feel very lucky and privileged by yours and Lisa's detailed

responses.

Our client will be very much pleased tomorrow morning when we take to

her your responses

-- in this country natural birth is not thought of well and so

considered words of wisdom and comfort are rare.

 

Much of our work in Ayurveda is at the level of principles, ethics and

metaphysics and real experience of

Ayurvedic principles in this country is small.

 

We are currently offering support to three mothers in the final stages

of pregnancy, all of whom aspire to an Ayurvedic and

principled lifestyle, so yours and Lisa's comments will be very welcome

over the coming weeks.

 

We've tended to find that the mothers here (New Zealand) are lacking in

fitness for delivery with a common experience being that

the mother loses strength during delivery, requiring more vigorous

interventions than we would really like to see.

Yoga based exercises to moderate exertion has proven very helpful with

mothers finding labour much less daunting.

 

A trip to India some years ago brought the experience that village women

there were very fit and delivery was often quite rapid and relaxed.

 

Anyway there is a small collection of mums here who along with ourselves

are feeling very lucky for yours and Lisa's comments and we'll be

reporting back to the group on outcomes

 

My wife and I are expert in most web technologies -- video, audio and

web pages -- and if you at some stage saw reason to extend your

infomation beyond the current group then we'd feel fortunate to help

with that

Very best wishes

Mike and Stephie

 

<snip>

On Tue, 2007-01-02 at 06:45 +0000, Shirish Bhate wrote:

> Though baby is overdue, please ensure that this is the case for

> intervention. A philosophy which is gaining ground amongst all

> alternative health care professionals associated with childbirth is

> that it is not only the the delivery of a baby by mother, it is also

> babies experience of start of a new chapter. Boys tend to get

> delivered earlier than girls, who like to enjoy mothers company for

> longer time! Vegan mothers with strong babies are known to be slow.

 

 

 

</Snip>

[Guest guest]

also to note, most ob/gyn's. midwives etc have now extended the "normal" duration of pregnancy to be about 42 weeks. This is resulting in more weight gain and larger babies. My mother actually went nearly 6 weeks past her "due date". Unless the mother and child are in jeopardy, intervention should be last resort.

 

 

btw, castor oil tastes horrible.(mix with large quantities of juices)

 

Shirish Bhate <shirishbhate > wrote:

<snip>

The description of mothers health, her spirits, her wishes against

intervention and most important of all, winter season, all suggest

that nothing is wrong. 40 weeks, 270 days etc are all statistical

averages, and mathematical bell shaped curve streches to infinity.

baby coming later than mathematical answer expected by people who

are non-participants in babies making, is not necessarily

problematic. 4 weeks overdue examples have been seen.

<snip>

[Guest guest]

Dear Lisa !

Yes this is something which hasn't been taken into account. This is the

fourth for this mum and it just looks like the baby is not yet ready.

We have already converyed your's and Dr Bate's feedback to the family --

we feel very happy to be able to offer support of this kind to

principled mums who want the best for their little ones. Thankyou

again

We'll post progress to this group.

Kindest regards

Mike and Stephie

 

 

 

 

 

> also to note, most ob/gyn's. midwives etc have now extended the

> "normal" duration of pregnancy to be about 42 weeks. This is resulting

> in more weight gain and larger babies. My mother actually went nearly

> 6 weeks past her "due date". Unless the mother and child are in

> jeopardy, intervention should be last resort.

>

> btw, castor oil tastes horrible.(mix with large quantities of juices)

>

> Shirish Bhate <shirishbhate > wrote:

> <snip>

> The description of mothers health, her spirits, her wishes against

> intervention and most important of all, winter season, all suggest

> that nothing is wrong. 40 weeks, 270 days etc are all statistical

> averages, and mathematical bell shaped curve streches to infinity.

> baby coming later than mathematical answer expected by people who

> are non-participants in babies making, is not necessarily

> problematic. 4 weeks overdue examples have been seen.

> <snip>

[Guest guest]

Mike and Stephie,

 

This may be a bit late for the mother in question but The best thing

a pregnant mother can do is walk 5 miles a day with her spouse.

 

GB

 

> We've tended to find that the mothers here (New Zealand) are

lacking in

> fitness for delivery with a common experience being that

> the mother loses strength during delivery, requiring more vigorous

> interventions than we would really like to see.

> Yoga based exercises to moderate exertion has proven very helpful

with

> mothers finding labour much less daunting.

[Guest guest]

Dear GB

Yes indeed and it's not too late either. Other mums are picking up on

this lead and enquiring about their own fitness, so all this advice is

very well placed and timely.

For all interested or who have responded, the mother originally

mentioned has had some simple, non invasive tests which show that the

baby is responding very well during contractions and so she is very

happy with that news and the comfort received through this group.

 

For the time being her husband and her have decided to not intervene at

this point and to accept the wisdom of experience until (and unless)

there are indications that some prompting along the lines suggested by

Dr Bate and LIsa become appropriate.

 

Again we'll post progress on this

 

Kind regards and thanks for your response

Mike and Stephie

 

 

> This may be a bit late for the mother in question but The best thing

> a pregnant mother can do is walk 5 miles a day with her spouse.

[Guest guest]

I have found that the massage of the uterus point

just above the heal, drinking cumin tae - a litre per

day and a tablespoon of castor oil help to bring on

labor.

[Guest guest]

Hi Mandv !

Thanks for your comments -- we'll add that gratefully to our list of

suggestions.

Just clarification, should that read 'Just above the head?'

Best regards

Mike and Stephie

 

On Thu, 2007-01-04 at 09:26 -0500, mandv m wrote:

> I have found that the massage of the uterus point

> just above the heal, drinking cumin tae - a litre per

> day and a tablespoon of castor oil help to bring on

> labor.

[Guest guest]

--- Mike and Stephie <us (AT) prpremao (DOT) nznzwrote:

 

> Just clarification, should that read 'Just above the

> head?'

>

> On Thu, 2007-01-04 at 09:26 -0500, mamandv wrote:

> > I have found that the massage of the uterus point

> > just above the heal, drinking cumin tatea a litre

> per

> > day and a tablespoon of castoril help to bring

> on

> > labor

>

that was a spelling error - heel. Just at the back

of ankle, above the heel there is a reflex point

for the uterus. When a lady is expecting it will

feel swollen and tender there. Rubbing this

point often helps to relax the mother and baby and can

help with the onset of lalabor I have done this with a

few of my prenatal yoga moms with good results! One

of them in looking so tired and over burdened -

she was a very petite lady. She could not even walk

down my stairs to the study very easily and did not do

much more than lie on her side during the duration of

the class so I massaged this point for her and told

her to do so at home and she went in to labor in

three hours.

 

Cumin tea is made by putting a handful of cumin seed

into a litre of water. This should be consumed

throughout the day.

 

This actually helps to bring on contractions - mild

ones and will help with labor and delivery - it also

helps with post natal water retension

Helps with the onset of milk as well. It should be

taken for two or three days after delivery with ait

of fennel and fenugreek seed to it to promote onset

of milk. It also helps the baby release all

mcmucomiumnd comforts the babies tummy if there is any

gas or poor digestion.

 

I have used all of these techniques first hand and

with many of my yoga students or ayayurveda clients" so

I am pretty confident sharing them with you.

I have also found that talking to the baby is very

helpful. II feel sometimes the child may not be sure

about taking birth and we need to tell them that life

is lovely and that they have people waiting for them

and that they want to hold them and hug them and look at

their precious hands. This helped me prepare for the

arrival of my children and also seemed to ease them

into leaving their comfy - cramped watery abode!

Make sure to massage mom's back with warm sesame oil -

a bit of fennel oil can be added to help relax muscles

massage should be done from the top of the shoulders

to the tail bone. Be gentle. The back is often sore

and pressure can be painful.

 

The goal with the massage is to assist apana vayu

the downward moving air that brings menses and

childbirth flowing in a downward direction. This

feels good, relaxes mom and helps tell the baby and

the body that the time is coming.

 

Massage of the labia is extremely important. This

helps to prevent tearing.

 

Many people feel shy to do this - I was only brave

enough to do so with my third child. The results

though, are so amazing. This can really help prevent

large tears in the perineum It makes the vagina

softer and more supple so that it can open for the

head of the baby. Many women in my prenatal classes

confirmed that it was very helpful.

Start doing things that ease mom as well. A little

massage, plenty of warm tea, brushing mom's hair

gently talking gently about the birth and the baby all

help mom get ready for the transition into bringing

forth a new life.

 

God bless you all in the beautiful journey.

Love

Mandakini

[Guest guest]

Mike and Stephie,

 

I am glad your client had the baby and that doing daily walks will

help future clients. 2 yoga exercises are especially good for

expectant mothers. One is sitting upright; bring soles of feet

together into groin and gently raise the knees up and down. The other

is lie on back and raise heels off the ground and lower back on floor

and not arched. Do long deep breathing.

 

GB

 

__________________

> Dear GB

> Yes indeed and it's not too late either. Other mums are picking up on

> this lead and enquiring about their own fitness, so all this advice is

> very well placed and timely.