Farewell to Shiva

[Guest guest]

I have been listening a little to crimson circle, and one of these channeled messages have a strange message, that we should say farewell to Shiva. So I was wondering if this is a suitable message to give to our spiritual seekers. I have been reading a little about Shiva, and is interested in knowing more.

 

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from

crimsoncircle.no/channels/clarity/02ch.htm

 

"Shiva doesn't like his/her job anymore (some laughter). Shiva got tired of being the destroyer a long time ago, wanted out."

 

"Now, it’s going to piss off a lot of people (more laughter). It’s going to throw their balance off because they have to have that destroyer energy. It has been part of their operating system."

 

"But, we’re going to let Shiva go. Now, we don't have to tell anyone. We’ll just let Shiva go today, and leave the other energies, the creator energy"

 

"Shiva comes in a bit tired, has been busy lately, a bit worn out, a bit bewildered of why it took humanity so long to relieve him of the duties… and her. It is a unisex energy. It works either way, depending on what you are calling. Shiva has always been called on to destroy, to take down structure. And, in a sense, that was appropriate. Structure always wants to be restructured. But, it doesn't have to be destroyed. Humans took Shiva too literally, turned Shiva into the destroyer, the annihilator of energies."

 

"So, let us breathe in this energy of Shiva. She comes in without the sword, without the dark energies… wasn’t at all what she was supposed to be in the first place. She is supposed to be the transmuter. Humans took it into the destroyer."

 

"Let us breathe in the energies of Shiva, the energies of Shiva within each one of us as well, within our consciousness, within the way we operate and believe. “We believe in Shiva. We believe in the destroyer. We believe in the devil and in Lucifer and of the energies that take apart."

 

"Let us take that deep breath of Shiva, and then release. Release the Shiva, the destroyer, within yourself and within human consciousness. Others will still want to play with Shiva in their lives. But, now by releasing this energy today… by letting Shiva go… no longer a god… worshiped as a god… no longer a god energy… just released of all of his responsibilities and job descriptions… letting that go… now the potential exists for other humans who are ready to move beyond destructive energy in their life so that they can also let the Shiva out of them."

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I have some questions about Shiva.

 

What are the good qualities of Shiva?

Where is he now, and what is he doing?

How did he became a god?

Why should I praise Shiva?

[Guest guest]

Lord Shiva's exalted personality and relationship to the Supreme Personality of Godhead, Lord Krsna, is described by Srila Prabhupada in Teachings of Lord Caitanya, Chapter 8, as follows:

 

"...by expanding Himself as Lord Shiva, the Supreme Lord is engaged when there is a need to annihilate the universe. Lord Shiva, in association with maya, has many forms, which are generally numbered at eleven. Lord Shiva is not one of the living entities; he is, more or less, Krsna Himself. The example of milk and yogurt is often given in this regard - yogurt is a preparation of milk, but still yogurt cannot be used as milk. Similarly, Lord Shiva is an expansion of Krsna, but he cannot act as Krsna, nor can we derive the spiritual restoration from Lord Shiva that we derive from Krsna. The essential difference is that Lord Shiva has a connection with material nature, but Vishnu or Lord Krsna has nothing to do with material nature. In Srimad-Bhägavatam (10.88.3) it is stated that Lord Shiva is a combination of three kinds of transformed consciousness known as vaikarika, taijasa and tamasa."

 

In his Purport to Srimad-Bhagavatam 8:12:4, Srila Prabhupada further explains:

 

"The Supreme Personality of Godhead, Visnu, resides within the material world as the sattva-guna-avatara. Lord Siva is the tamo-guna-avatara, and Lord Brahma is the rajo-guna-avatara, but although Lord Visnu is among them, He is not in the same category. Lord Visnu is deva-deva, the chief of all the demigods. Since Lord Siva is in this material world, the energy of the Supreme Lord, Visnu, includes Lord Siva. Lord Visnu is therefore called jagad-vyapi, "the all-pervading Lord." Lord Siva is sometimes called Mahesvara, and so people think that Lord Siva is everything. But here Lord Siva addresses Lord Visnu as Jagad-isa, "the master of the universe." Lord Siva is sometimes called Visvesvara, but here he addresses Lord Visnu as Jagan-maya, indicating that even Visvesvara is under Lord Visnu's control. Lord Visnu is the master of the spiritual world, yet He controls the material world also, as stated in Bhagavad-gita (mayadhyaksena prakrtih suyate sacaracaram). Lord Brahma and Lord Siva are also sometimes called isvara, but the supreme isvara is Lord Visnu, Lord Krsna."

 

Bhaktivedanta Book Trust. HDG A.C. Bhaktivedanta Swami Srila Prabhupada

[Guest guest]

Sri Jagannatha Puri, Purusottama-ksetra: October 10, 2001

Tridandisvami Sri Srimad Bhaktivedanta Narayana Maharaja

 

[setting the scene: After visiting Sri Paramananda Puri's asrama, the devotees walked to Lokanatha Mahadeva's temple, chanting the half hour walk through the villages and open land of beautiful Jagannatha Puri dhama. Arriving at the site they passed through a very large gate and down wide stairs to a courtyard, on the right of which there was a large pond, and on the left of which there were some shops selling sweets and other foodstuffs.

Westerners are not allowed in many of the Indian temples, and this was also the case with Lokanatha Mahadeva. Among the 600 pilgrims accompanying Srila Narayana Maharaja on the parikrama, over 200 were Westerners. Srila Maharaja and the Indian devotees went into the temple while the Western devotees stood in the courtyard, performed acamana at the pond, chanted, and wished they could go inside.

After a few minutes Srila Maharaja came out of the temple alone, without the hundreds of Indian devotees, and sat down on a stone stab platform in front of the shops. All the Western devotees immediately gathered around him, eager to hear.

One of the Lokanatha Mahadeva pujaris approached and talked to Srila Maharaja for a few minutes, saying that he would allow the Western devotees entrance if they would give him money. Srila Maharaja rejected his proposal and began his hari-katha:]

Sankara is a very, very exalted mahabhagavata. He always serves Krsna and all His manifestations, like Rama, Nrsimha, Kalki and Varaha. In this world he has five kinds of manifestations: earth, water, fire, air, and ether. You cannot see other than these five. You can see water, you can see earth, you can see sky and you can see fire. Our body, the world and the universe are made out of these five elements. You cannot see the soul. If you render pure devotional service, then you can also see the soul. You can see Krsna first, and by His light you can see your own soul. So here in this world these are the five prominent elements, and it is Sankara who has taken their form.

We went inside the mandira, but we simply saw a room full of water. You are lucky to be out here, where there is a very big pond of water; so no need of going inside. You can see water here, and this is also a symbol of Sankara. In Bengal and other places there is an Ambulinga (linga means symbol), a linga made of water, to which you can offer your pranama. The pond here at Lokanatha Mandira is called Ganga Parvati Pond.

Those who want to make Krsna, God, their own property, ban others saying, "You cannot come into our temple." Krsna becomes very angry with them, and Sankara is also not pleased with them. Those who think, "Krsna is our property and we can therefore use Him for our maintenance", do not have bhakti. They will ban the whole world from entering, saying, "If you pay something, then you can go in; otherwise not."

Sankara is a manifestation of Krsna, and he is always hungry for love and affection. He is qualified to manifest from all the five elements and to serve his masters, Lord Krsna and Lord Rama. He is very kind. He was first in Kailasa, and then he shifted his place to Kasi Varanasi where he helped the atheist king of Varanasi. He also helped Paundraka Vasudeva, who became four-handed and challenged Lord Krsna. Krsna cut off Paundraka Vasudeva's head and also the head of Kasi-Naresa, the king of Kasi, who considered himself one of the best servants of Sankara. Sankara could not save him when Krsna's Sudarsana cakra burnt down Kasi Varanasi. [see Krsna book ch.66.]

Sankara simply fled. Where his deerskin fell, he did not know. He also left his trident and everything else, including his wife, and very quickly ran from there. He arrived in Ekamrakanana in Bhubaneswar, and took shelter of Lord Jagannatha. Lord Jagannatha told him, "Because you have come to my shelter, I will give you the post of Lokanatha. So don't fear. If anyone comes to Jagannatha Puri and takes my darsana without taking yours, his coming here will not be complete. He must come here to your place after having my darsana. Then he will be very happy."

Sankara is the abode of love, and in that regard Srila Visvanatha Cakravarti Thakura has written:

vrndavanavani-pate! jaya soma soma-maule

sanaka-sanandana-sanatana-naradedya

gopisvara! vraja-vilasi-yuganghri-padme

prema prayaccha nirupadhi namo namaste

"O Lord Sankara, even Sri Narada Muni, Sanaka, and Sanandana are always worshiping you. You can give love and affection like that of the gopis. In your purest form of Gopisvara Mahadeva, you are very powerful. You are Hari-hara-eka-atma. Hari-hara-eka-atma means that Krsna has become your atma and you have become His atma.”

Here atma means dearmost, or very beloved. Sankara can serve as Hanuman, as Bhima, as Madhvacarya, at the time of Mahaprabhu as Advaita Acarya Sadasiva, and in so many other forms.

We have come here to beg the mercy of Lokanatha. But I personally don't see Lokanatha here. I see Gopisvara Mahadeva. Gopisvara Mahadeva ki jaya! You can repeat after me:

[After Srila Maharaja uttered each half line, the devotees repeated:]

vrndavanavani-pate! jaya soma soma-maule

sanaka-sanandana-sanatana-naradedya

gopisvara! vraja-vilasi-yuganghri-padme

prema prayaccha nirupadhi namo namaste

["O gatekeeper of Vrndavana! O Soma, all glories to you! O you whose forehead is decorated with the moon, and who is worshipable for the sages headed by Sanaka, Sanandana, Sanatana and Narada! O Gopisvara! Desiring that you bestow upon me prema for the lotus feet of Sri Sri Radha-Madhava who perform joyous pastimes in Vraja-dhama. I offer pranamas unto you time and again." (Sankalpa Kalpadruma 103, Srila Visvanatha Cakravarti Thakura)]

"O Gopisvara Mahadeva! We have come to you. Here your name is changed and you have become Lokanatha. But we don't know you as Lokanatha; we only know you as Gopisvara Mahadeva. You cannot cheat us. You can cheat Ravana, Kamsa, Jarasandha, and others, but you can never cheat us. This is because we have taken shelter of Yogamaya, Paurnamasi. If you cheat us we will complain to Paurnamasi and she will punish you. Do you remember when all the gopis slapped you and your cheeks became so swollen? Kindly remember this." Sankara will then come in the form of Gopisvara Mahadeva. He will be very helpful, and happy to give mercy.

Lokanatha Mahadeva ki jaya!

Sri Sri Gopisvara Mahadeva ki jaya!

Kamesvara Mahadeva ki jaya!

Nandisvara Mahadeva ki jaya!

Chakalesvara Mahadeva ki jaya!

Parvati-pati ki jaya!

Sri Sri Sankara ki jaya!

Hara Hara Hara Hara Mahadeva ki jaya!

I have given you a special thing, which I did not give to the Indian devotees. I like you most because you are feeling separation from Sankara. Sankara will therefore surely be merciful. He must sprinkle his mercy upon you.

Gaura premanande

[theist]

 

(...)Structure always wants to be restructured. But, it doesn't have to be destroyed. Humans took Shiva too literally, turned Shiva into the destroyer, the annihilator of energies."

 

 

The "destructive" mode(tamas, Shiva) is intimately connected to the creation mode(rajas, Brahma) and maintence mode (sattva, Vishnu),and is everywhere present in all functions and stages of any created object. Take a human body for example. It dies in the woods let's say. Those same cells that were there maintaining (sattva)the structure of the human form,as they break down through the ceasation of metabolism (destruction,tamas) immediately become a breeding ground for flies which then use it for incubating their larvae and creating (rajas) new flies. So depending on where we place our focus we can see all three modes of nature acting in virtually the same place.

 

To extract the destructive (or any mode) mode is not possible. The material world, it's fabric is composed of nothing but these three modes and their transformations.

 

Ken, please excuse my bluntness but better to avoid such infantile talk of Lord Shiva as we hear in that transcript that you provided. Yes we can use our will to remove destructive tendancies from our charater and replace them with creative or sattvic tendancies. That is the wonderful gift that comes with attaining a human form.

 

Lord Shiva should never be portrayed as a worn out character tired of doing his job.

[Guest guest]

I don't agree with what the Crimson Circle have said, I think it is a foolish thing to say to the listeners/readers. I just wanted to show you what they have in their channeling, Crimson circle is supposed to be a big thing, and they are training people with what they call the new energy. I just think they screwed up on that one.

 

So after that message I just thought I should say Farewell to the Crimson Circle.

[theist]

Good choice I believe Ken. Never heard of Crimson Circle. What we need is tolend ear to the one who truly channels God. Not possible to find on our own so we must always ask the Lord to reveal such a person to us.

 

Hare Krsna