krsna Posted January 22, 2007 Report Share Posted January 22, 2007 "In this age of Kali there is no lila-avatara” (CC Madhya 6.99) BY: LOKAGURU DAS Jan 21, USA (SUN) — Balavidya prabhu, Dandavats. All Glories to Srila AC Bhaktivedanta Svami Prabhupada. In your reply to me you pretended as if Caitanya Caritamrta did not exist. Why? Although this subject matter appears straightforward it is not so easy. It is not really as easy as 1,2,3,4. 1: “In this age of Kali there is no lila-avatara ...” (CC Madhya 6.99); 2: Kalki Avatara is one of 25 lila-avataras. (CC Madhya 6.99p) ; 3:”In this Age of Kali there are no lila-avataras, but there is an incarnation of the Lord manifested in the body of Sri Caitanya.” (CC Madhya 6.99p); and 4: “Therefore Lord Caitanya Mahaprabhu has exhibited to everyone all the pastimes of all the various incarnations.” (CCAntya 5.133). Be honest with us. You accept Srimad Bhagavatam, but do you accept or reject the following words of Krsna das Kaviraja and Srila Prabhupada as they appear in Caitanya Caritamrta and were quoted in Jai Kalki Avatara? Caitanya Caritamrta Madhya 6.99p: “In this Age of Kali there are no lila-avataras, but there is an incarnation of the Lord manifested in the body of Sri Caitanya Mahaprabhu.” (CC) Madhya 6.98-104 : (Madhya 6.98) "In Srimad-Bhagavatam and Mahabharata it is stated that the Lord appears directly, but you say that in this age there is no manifestation or incarnation of Lord Visnu.” (Madhya 6.99) "In this Age of Kali there is no lila-avatara of the Supreme Personality of Godhead; therefore He is known as Triyuga. That is one of His holy names." PURPORT “A lila-avatara is an incarnation of the Lord who performs a variety of activities without making any special endeavor. He always has one pastime after another, all full of transcendental pleasure, and these pastimes are fully controlled by the Supreme Person. The Supreme Person is totally independent of all others in these pastimes. ...... In his book Laghu-bhagavatamrta, Srila Rupa Gosvami has enumerated the following twenty-five lila-avataras: Catuh-sana, Narada, Varaha, Matsya, Yajna, Nara-Narayana, Kapila, Dattatreya, Hayasirsa (Hayagriva), Hamsa, Prsnigarbha, Rsabha, Prthu, Nrsimha, Kurma, Dhanvantari, Mohini, Vamana, Parasurama, Raghavendra, Vyasa, Balarama, Krsna, Buddha and Kalki. Sri Caitanya Mahaprabhu is not mentioned as a lila-avatara because He is an incarnation in disguise (channa-avatara). In this Age of Kali there are no lila-avataras, but there is an incarnation of the Lord manifested in the body of Sri Caitanya Mahaprabhu. This has been explained in Srimad-Bhagavatam.” (SB11.5.31-32) (Madhya 6.100) “Gopinatha Acarya continued, "There is certainly an incarnation in every age, and such an incarnation is called the yuga-avatara. But your heart has become so hardened by logic and argument that you cannot consider all these facts.” (Madhya 6.101) "In the past, your son has had bodies of three different colors, according to the age. These colors were white, red and yellow. In this age [Dvapara-yuga] He has accepted a blackish body.” PURPORT This verse from Srimad-Bhagavatam (10.8.13) was spoken by Garga Muni when he was performing the rituals at Lord Krsna's name-giving ceremony. He states that the incarnations of the Lord in other ages had been white, red and yellow. This yellow color refers to Sri Caitanya Mahaprabhu, whose bodily complexion was yellowish. This confirms that in the past Kali-yugas, the Lord also had incarnated in a body that was yellow in hue. It is understood that the Lord incarnates in different colors for the different yugas (Satya, Treta, Dvapara and Kali). Accepting the color yellow (pita), as well as other characteristics, the Lord incarnated as Sri Caitanya Mahaprabhu. This is the verdict of all Vedic authorities. (Madhya 6.102) "In the Age of Kali, as well as in Dvapara-yuga, the people offer prayers to the Supreme Personality of Godhead by various mantras and observe the regulative principles of the supplementary Vedic literature. Now please hear of this from me.” PURPORT This is a quotation from Srimad-Bhagavatam (11.5.31). (Madhya 6.103) "In this Age of Kali, those who are intelligent perform the congregational chanting of the Hare Krsna maha-mantra, worshiping the Supreme Personality of Godhead, who appears in this age always describing the glories of Krsna. That incarnation is yellowish in hue and is always associated with His plenary expansions [such as Sri Nityananda Prabhu] and personal expansions [such as Gadadhara], as well as His devotees and associates [such as Svarupa Damodara].' PURPORT This verse from Srimad-Bhagavatam (11.5.32) is explained by Sri Jiva Gosvami in his Krama-sandarbha, as quoted by Srila Bhaktivinoda Thakura in regard to the explanation of Adi-lila, Third Chapter, verse 52. (Madhya 6.104) "The Lord [in the incarnation of Gaurasundara] has a golden complexion. Indeed, His entire body, which is very nicely constituted, is like molten gold. Sandalwood pulp is smeared all over His body. He will take the fourth order of spiritual life [sannyasa] and will be very self-controlled. He will be distinguished from Mayavadi sannyasis in that He will be fixed in devotional service and will spread the sankirtana movement." PURPORT Gopinatha Acarya quoted this verse from the Mahabharata's Visnu-sahasra-nama-stotra.” CC Adi 3.20p “Therefore, when the Lord took the place of the incarnation of Kali-yuga to spread the glories of chanting Hare Krsna - the system of worship recommended in this age - He also distributed the process of devotional service performed on the platform of transcendental spontaneous love.” CC Adi 4.10-12 where He writes that (CC Adi 4.10): “When the complete Supreme Personality of Godhead descends, all other incarnations of the Lord meet together within Him.” (Adi 4.11-12) “Lord Narayana, the four primary expansions [Vasudeva, Sankarsana, Pradyumna and Aniruddha], Matsya and the other lila incarnations, the yuga-avataras, the manv-antara incarnations and as many other incarnations as there are-all descend in the body of Lord Krsna. In this way the complete Supreme Godhead, Lord Krsna Himself, appears.” And Srila Prabhupada also writes in (CC Adi 5.131-133): “When the Supreme Personality of Godhead Krsna appears, He is the shelter of all plenary parts. Thus at that time all His plenary portions join in Him.” (Adi 5.133) “Therefore Lord Caitanya Mahaprabhu has exhibited to everyone all the pastimes of all the various incarnations.” Lord Caitanya delivers all the “Jagais and Madhais” of this Kali Yuga though His sankirtan movement (CC Adi 8.20p). Thus, the function of the lila-avatara, Kalki Prabhu, manifests through the pastime of Lord Caitanya delivering all the Jagais and Madhais of Kali Yuga by flooding the world with His Holy Names. Balavidya Prabhu, why did you choose to ignore the parts of sastra (the entire Caitanya Caritamrta) that don't support your beliefs? Srimad Bhagavatam may establish that the lila-avatara Kalki Prabhu appears in every Kali Yuga (SB 1.3.25; SB 4.22.36p; SB 9.15.33p), but Caitanya Caritamrta establishes there is no lila-avatara of Kalki Prabhu in this Kali Yuga and that Lord Caitanya takes His place (CC-above). Shouldn't we accept all the statements of both Srimad Bhagavatam and Caitanya Caritamrta and all other statements by our Srila Prabhupada? And if we have some trouble with statements that appear to be at odds, shouldn't we ask our Guru, how apparently contradictory statements can be reconciled, rather than ignore one side or another? (BG 4.34)”Just try to learn the truth by approaching a spiritual master. Inquire from him submissively and render service unto him. The self-realized soul can impart knowledge unto you because he has seen the truth.” (CC Antya 5.131)"If you want to understand Srimad-Bhagavatam," he said, "you must approach a self-realized Vaisnava and hear from him. You can do this when you have completely taken shelter of the lotus feet of Sri Caitanya Mahaprabhu." If I have made some omission, mistake, or some offence to you, please try to excuse me, Your fallen servant, Lokaguru das Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guruvani Posted January 22, 2007 Report Share Posted January 22, 2007 The Kalki avatar is a shaktyavesha-avatar who appears at the very end of Kali Yuga and the Beginning of Satya Yuga. He appears at the CONJUNCTION of the two yugas, so it is really neither Kali Yuga nor Satya Yuga, but a transitional period where the two Yugas overlap. Because the killing of the asuras heralds the Satya Yuga and the beginning of the Age of Truth and enlightenment, Kalki Avatar could just as well be the first incarnation of the Satya Yuga. He is the first sign that Satya Yuga is beginning. Because Kalki avatar comes at the very end of Kali Yuga he is not known as Kali Yuga avatar, because there is nothing left of Kali Yuga when he gets done. It is a conjunction, a meeting of the two Yugas where the demarcation becomes somewhat blurred. That is why the Kalki Avatar is not actually a Kali Yuga Avatar, because he comes to usher in the new Satya Yuga. Srimad Bhagavatam 1.3.25 athasau yuga-sandhyayam dasyu-prayeshu rajasu janita vishnu-yasaso namna kalkir jagat-patih SYNONYMS atha -- thereafter; asau -- the same Lord; yuga-sandhyayam -- at the conjunction of the yugas; dasyu -- plunderers; prayeshu -- almost all; rajasu -- the governing personalities; janita -- will take His birth; vishnu -- named Vishnu; yasasah -- surnamed Yasa; namna -- in the name of; kalkih -- the incarnation of the Lord; jagat-patih -- the Lord of the creation. TRANSLATION Thereafter, at the conjunction of two yugas, the Lord of the creation will take His birth as the Kalki incarnation and become the son of Vishnu Yasa. At this time the rulers of the earth will have degenerated into plunderers. PURPORT Here is another foretelling of the advent of Lord Kalki, the incarnation of Godhead. He is to appear at the conjunction of the two yugas, namely at the end of Kali-yuga and the beginning of Satya-yuga. The cycle of the four yugas, namely Satya, Treta, Dvapara and Kali, rotates like the calendar months. The present Kali-yuga lasts 432,000 years, out of which we have passed only 5,000 years after the Battle of Kurukshetra and the end of the regime of King Parikshit. So there are 427,000 years balance yet to be finished. Therefore at the end of this period, the incarnation of Kalki will take place, as foretold in the Srimad-Bhagavatam. The name of His father, Vishnu Yasa, a learned brahmana, and the village Sambhala are also mentioned. As above mentioned, all these foretellings will prove to be factual in chronological order. That is the authority of Srimad-Bhagavatam. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted January 22, 2007 Report Share Posted January 22, 2007 ver interesting claim. How has Sri Chaitanya exhibited all the pastimes exhibited by all the previous incarnations?? Please explain. "In this age of Kali there is no lila-avatara” (CC Madhya 6.99) BY: LOKAGURU DAS 4: “Therefore Lord Caitanya Mahaprabhu has exhibited to everyone all the pastimes of all the various incarnations.” (CCAntya 5.133). Caitanya Caritamrta Madhya 6.99p: “In this Age of Kali there are no lila-avataras, but there is an incarnation of the Lord manifested in the body of Sri Caitanya Mahaprabhu.” (CC) Madhya 6.98-104 : (Adi 5.133) “Therefore Lord Caitanya Mahaprabhu has exhibited to everyone all the pastimes of all the various incarnations.” Your fallen servant, Lokaguru das Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Recommended Posts
Join the conversation
You are posting as a guest. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account.
Note: Your post will require moderator approval before it will be visible.