Should Christians be friends with Hindus/Hare Krishnas/etc.?

[Guest guest]

Such enlightenment from just four posts. No one can recognize a vaisnava except another vaisnavas, When vaisnavas are accepted, this is by Vaisnavas, when a vaisnava accepts the validity of a teaching, this teaching is vaisnava science.

 

So, since Im chiming in here for the first time, (only by the association of her servant do I bother), the answer depends on the understanding of what is meant by vaisnavism.

 

Christians, if defined as members of a denomination who think they are saved by bathing in the blood of jesus and free to continue sinful activities, they are NOT friends of anyone and just a burden on even kali yuga society. However, a true disciple of Lord Jesus Christ who has a grasp on his actual teachings, who has been taught form one who has also fully understood the science of Lord Jesus Christ, they are friends of even the most horrid personalities. They have no fear of a so-called devil because they see that Jesus has no fear of such a being. They do not teach negation, they do not preach repression. They Give Lord Jesus Christ asa he is to all they meet, and if a vaisnava should come in contact with such a person, there would be no concern of the title of this topic. To even ask such a question tells me all I need to know about the sectarian inquiry. This is not the4 concern of how a religionist relates to the competition. Jesus rejects even such concern as was shown by his own disciples, recognizing the right of His Father to communicate and reciprocate with all his sons and daughters as he well pleases. And dont bother hitting me with that only begotton stuff, not unless you can explain why he teaches us to say "OUR Father"..

 

Again, thanks for showing recognition, herservant. Now and at the hour of my death I pray to be pleasing to Her. Hare Krsna, ys, mahaksadasa

[bija]

 

http://www.ourladyswarriors.org/saints/index.html quote by HerServant

Nice collection of literature. Last night I watched the old Brother Sun Sister Moon movie... on each watching it brings much peace to the heart. Blessed Saint Francis. Peace.

[bija]

The Canticle of Brother Son (Saint Francis)

Most High, Omnipotent, Good Lord,

Thine be the praises, the glory, and the honor and every blessing (cf. Apoc. 4:9.11).

To Thee alone, Most High, do they belong

and no man is worthy to mention Thee.

May Thou be praised, my Lord, with all Thy creatures (cf. Tob. 8:7),

especially mister brother sun,

of whom is the day, and Thou enlightens us through him.

And he is beautiful and radiant with a great splendor,

of Thee, Most High, does he convey the meaning

May Thou be praised, my Lord, for sister moon and the stars (cf. Ps. 148:3),

in heaven Thou has made them clear and precious and beautiful

May Thou be praised, my Lord, for brother wind,

and for the air and the cloudy and the clear weather and every weather (cf. Dan 3:64-65), through which to all Thy creatures Thou gives sustenance (cf. Ps. 103:13-14)

May Thou be praised, my Lord, for sister water,

who is very useful and humble and precious and chaste

May Thou be praised, my lord, for brother fire (cf. Dan 3:66),

through whom Thou illumines the night,

and he is handsome and jocund and robust and strong

May Thou be praised, my Lord, for our sister, mother earth, (cf. Dan 3:74)

who sustains us and governs,

and produces various fruits with colored flowers and green plants (cf. Ps 103:13-14)

May Thou be praised, my Lord, for those who forgive for the sake of Thy love (cf. Mt 6:12),

and endure infirmity and tribulation

Blessed those who endure them in peace (cf. Mt 5:10),

because by Thee, Most High, will they be crowned

May Thou be praised, my Lord, for our sister, bodily death,

whom no man living can escape

Woe to those, who die in mortal sin:

blessed those whom she will find in Thy most holy desires,

because the second death will do them no evil (cf. Apoc 2:11; 20:6)

Praise and bless my Lord (cf. Dan 3:85),

and give Him thanks and serve Him with great humility!

[brajeshwara das]

Saint Francis is my childhood church Also, I bought my current house partly because it is the same color as the Deities in Soquel, but also because there is a St Francis murti near the driveway. I put the garlands from my pictures on him when the time is right, I just started this but it feels good to do so.

[Guest guest]

There is a great wealth of vaisnavic tradition that have western roots and other cultural imprint. Appreciation can only come from a point where one rejects what Srila Bhaktivinode Thakur dubbed PARTY SPIRIT BLINDNESS.

 

In the past, I have had great emotional outburst from saints like Jerome, Ambrose (two Christian Avadhutas), therese Avila, Of course Francis, Queen Mary of Magdalia, Mary of Axum (mother of Lord Jesus Christ), Didyamous Thomas, James. Also, Solomon and David always get to me.

 

I am pleased to say Ive met more than a few folks who try to follow Lord Jesus Christ who never so much as flinched at the idea that Krsna is His Father (who else is the most attractive personality), and I can honestly say that we had very meaningful istagosthi without any trappings of sectarianism. Some of the rastafarian community are also so very open to the idea of yuga dharma, as are a few black muslims I have met over the years (those true to the teachings of Malcolm X, not farrakhans folks or followers of Elijah Muhammed.)

 

This peace and love stuff in the Name of God actually is not sentimental gobbledy-gook. Neither is the part about the sublime life that awaits those who chant the Names of the Supreme Lord. Hare Krsna, ys, mahaksadasa

[Bhakta Devarsi]

 

There is a great wealth of vaisnavic tradition that have western roots and other cultural imprint. Appreciation can only come from a point where one rejects what Srila Bhaktivinode Thakur dubbed PARTY SPIRIT BLINDNESS.

 

In the past, I have had great emotional outburst from saints like Jerome, Ambrose (two Christian Avadhutas), therese Avila, Of course Francis, Queen Mary of Magdalia, Mary of Axum (mother of Lord Jesus Christ), Didyamous Thomas, James. Also, Solomon and David always get to me.

 

I am pleased to say Ive met more than a few folks who try to follow Lord Jesus Christ who never so much as flinched at the idea that Krsna is His Father (who else is the most attractive personality), and I can honestly say that we had very meaningful istagosthi without any trappings of sectarianism. Some of the rastafarian community are also so very open to the idea of yuga dharma, as are a few black muslims I have met over the years (those true to the teachings of Malcolm X, not farrakhans folks or followers of Elijah Muhammed.)

 

This peace and love stuff in the Name of God actually is not sentimental gobbledy-gook. Neither is the part about the sublime life that awaits those who chant the Names of the Supreme Lord. Hare Krsna, ys, mahaksadasa

We worship "Jeheshua" or Jesus, Spiritual Master and Lord of Peace and Tranquil Love each and every morning, that is the conclusion of Srila Prabhupada.

 

 

PURPORT by Srila Prabhupada

Los Angeles, January 2, 1969

• samsara-davanala-lidha-loka-
  tranaya karunya-ghanaghanatvam
  praptasya kalyana-gunarnavasya
  vande guroh sri-caranaravindam

This song is offering obeisances particularly to the spiritual master, and the symptoms of the spiritual master are described in this prayer. The spiritual master has two kind of symptoms in his activities. One kind is called constant, and other kind is called temporary. So the first verse says that the constant symptom of the spiritual master is that he can deliver his disciples from the blazing fire of this material existence. That is the eternal qualification of spiritual master. Tranaya means for deliverance, and karunya means compassionate, very merciful. The spiritual master comes to the deliverance of the fallen souls out of his causeless mercy. Nobody has any business for the sufferings of others. The best example is Lord Jesus Christ, that he suffered for others. And it is the principle in the Bible that he accepted all the sins of others. This is the sign of spiritual master, that he voluntarily accepts the sinful activities of others and delivers them. That is the qualification of spiritual master.

 

[Guest guest]

(removed)

[HerServant]

"So if anyone loves Krsna, he must love Lord Jesus Christ also. And if one perfectly loves Jesus Christ he must love Krsna. If he says, "Why shall I love Krsna? I shall love Jesus Christ," then he has no knowledge. And if one says, "Why shall I love Jesus Christ? I shall love...", then he has also no knowledge. If one understands Krsna, then he will understand Jesus Christ. If one understands Jesus Christ, you'll understand Krsna." -Srila Prabhupada conversation with Alan Ginsberg, May 12, 1969

 

 

Mark 12:1-9

"He began to speak to them in parables. "A man planted a vineyard, put a hedge around it, dug a wine press, and built a tower. Then he leased it to tenant farmers and left on a journey.

At the proper time he sent a servant to the tenants to obtain from them some of the produce of the vineyard.

But they seized him, beat him, and sent him away empty-handed.

Again he sent them another servant. And that one they beat over the head and treated shamefully.

He sent yet another whom they killed. So, too, many others; some they beat, others they killed.

He had one other to send, a beloved son. He sent him to them last of all, thinking, 'They will respect my son.'

But those tenants said to one another, 'This is the heir. Come, let us kill him, and the inheritance will be ours.'

So they seized him and killed him, and threw him out of the vineyard.

What (then) will the owner of the vineyard do? He will come, put the tenants to death, and give the vineyard to others."

 

Dear Scholar,

 

Do you know me? I know you! Are you envious of Jesus Do you despise His Holy Name? Will you continue to try to destroy the Sankirtan movement with religiousity? You will fail because the Sankirtan movement will nectarize the planet with True Love of God! When Jesus reveals Himself what will you do? Will you run to Him or run away?

 

Hari Bol! Om Namo Christaya ki jaya!

[HerServant]

 

And dont bother hitting me with that only begotton stuff, not unless you can explain why he teaches us to say "OUR Father"..

 

 

Dear Mahak maharaja,

 

Kindly accept my humble obeisances. I am no one and nothing. I am a poor seeker just trying to find my way home. I confess I do not know everything but I come here for sincere association. I know you to are sincere by way of your writings and post. So let us first start our association by loving each other. We may even both have the same realization, but our words fail us.

 

Besides, how can words even serve us when speaking of Him?

"O my Lord, when will my eyes be decorated with tears of love flowing constantly when I chant Your holy name? When will my voice choke up, and when will the hairs of my body stand on end at the recitation of Your name?"

 

I try to speak from direct realization as much as possible. My perspective on Jesus as "Only Begotten Son" is that Jesus as Jiva Tattva is in fact shelter of all Jivas. This is proclaimed in John Chapter 15.

 

"I am the true vine, and my Father is the vine grower.

He takes away every branch in me that does not bear fruit, and everyone that does he prunes so that it bears more fruit.

You are already pruned because of the word that I spoke to you.

Remain in me, as I remain in you. Just as a branch cannot bear fruit on its own unless it remains on the vine, so neither can you unless you remain in me. I am the vine, you are the branches. Whoever remains in me and I in him will bear much fruit, because without me you can do nothing." - John 15:1-5

 

Chaitanya-Charitamrita, Adi-Lila, Chapter 5

 

Text 4:

 

"The Supreme Personality of Godhead, Krishna, is the fountainhead of all incarnations. Lord Baladeva is His second body"

 

Purport

"Lord Sri Krishna, the absolute Personality of Godhead, is the primeval Lord, the original form of Godhead, and His first expansion is Sri Balarama."

 

Text 5

 

"They are both one and the same identity. They differ only in form. He is the first bodily expansion of Krishna, and He assists in Lord Krishna’s transcendental pastimes."

 

Purport

 

"Balarama is a svamsa expansion of the Lord, and therefore there is no difference in potency between Krishna and Balarama."

 

Text 10 Purport

"Sri Balarama is the servitor Godhead who serves Lord Krishna in all affairs of existence and knowledge."

 

Text 41 Purport

"Sankarshana, the second expansion, is Vasudeva's personal expansion for pastimes, and since He is the reservoir of all living entities, He is sometimes called jiva."

 

Text 45

"There is one marginal potency, known as the jiva. Maha-Sankarshana is the shelter of all jivas."

 

Hence the purified jiva is one with the Jiva and exhibits all of the qualities of the shelter of all Jivas, just as a branch is part and parcel of the Vine. The Son and sons are one. Just as Guru is One. Only begotten

 

PRABHUPADA'S LECTURES SRIMAD-BHAGAVATAM 1972 720424SB.TOK

 

"...The only worthy son was Jesus Christ. You can interpret it like that, because he was giving service to the Lord, to the father. He brought the message of father. So our interpretation is like that, not that God has got only one son, but he is the only worthy son..."

 

PRABHUPADA'S LECTURES SRIMAD-BHAGAVATAM 1972 721002SB.LA

 

"...Simultaneously one and different. Just like in the Bible also, Jesus Christ is claimed as one with God, but at the same time different. As son, he is different. As representative of God, he is one. That is the philosophy, perfect philosophy..."

 

---

 

Therefore, Shakti avesya avatar, is servitor of Krsna as Vine or branch. These are the same. The Vine and branch, .. there is simultaneous oneness and difference also. The branch is jiva tattva and the Vine is Jiva Tattva, The Shelter of All jivas, the Maha Sankarshana. No way to the Father but by the Son.

 

Your lowly servant.

[brajeshwara das]

 

Dear Mahak maharaja,

 

Kindly accept my humble obeisances. I am no one and nothing. I am a poor seeker just trying to find my way home. I confess I do not know everything but I come here for sincere association. I know you to are sincere by way of your writings and post. So let us first start our association by loving each other. We may even both have the same realization, but our words fail us.

 

Besides, how can words even serve us when speaking of Him?

"O my Lord, when will my eyes be decorated with tears of love flowing constantly when I chant Your holy name? When will my voice choke up, and when will the hairs of my body stand on end at the recitation of Your name?"

 

I try to speak from direct realization as much as possible. My perspective on Jesus as "Only Begotten Son" is that Jesus as Jiva Tattva is in fact shelter of all Jivas. This is proclaimed in John Chapter 15.

 

"I am the true vine, and my Father is the vine grower.

He takes away every branch in me that does not bear fruit, and everyone that does he prunes so that it bears more fruit.

You are already pruned because of the word that I spoke to you.

Remain in me, as I remain in you. Just as a branch cannot bear fruit on its own unless it remains on the vine, so neither can you unless you remain in me. I am the vine, you are the branches. Whoever remains in me and I in him will bear much fruit, because without me you can do nothing." - John 15:1-5

 

Chaitanya-Charitamrita, Adi-Lila, Chapter 5

 

Text 4:

 

"The Supreme Personality of Godhead, Krishna, is the fountainhead of all incarnations. Lord Baladeva is His second body"

 

Purport

"Lord Sri Krishna, the absolute Personality of Godhead, is the primeval Lord, the original form of Godhead, and His first expansion is Sri Balarama."

 

Text 5

 

"They are both one and the same identity. They differ only in form. He is the first bodily expansion of Krishna, and He assists in Lord Krishna’s transcendental pastimes."

 

Purport

 

"Balarama is a svamsa expansion of the Lord, and therefore there is no difference in potency between Krishna and Balarama."

 

Text 10 Purport

"Sri Balarama is the servitor Godhead who serves Lord Krishna in all affairs of existence and knowledge."

 

Text 41 Purport

"Sankarshana, the second expansion, is Vasudeva's personal expansion for pastimes, and since He is the reservoir of all living entities, He is sometimes called jiva."

 

Text 45

"There is one marginal potency, known as the jiva. Maha-Sankarshana is the shelter of all jivas."

 

Hence the purified jiva is one with the Jiva and exhibits all of the qualities of the shelter of all Jivas, just as a branch is part and parcel of the Vine. The Son and sons are one. Just as Guru is One. Only begotten

 

PRABHUPADA'S LECTURES SRIMAD-BHAGAVATAM 1972 720424SB.TOK

 

"...The only worthy son was Jesus Christ. You can interpret it like that, because he was giving service to the Lord, to the father. He brought the message of father. So our interpretation is like that, not that God has got only one son, but he is the only worthy son..."

 

PRABHUPADA'S LECTURES SRIMAD-BHAGAVATAM 1972 721002SB.LA

 

"...Simultaneously one and different. Just like in the Bible also, Jesus Christ is claimed as one with God, but at the same time different. As son, he is different. As representative of God, he is one. That is the philosophy, perfect philosophy..."

 

---

 

Therefore, Shakti avesya avatar, is servitor of Krsna as Vine or branch. These are the same. The Vine and branch, .. there is simultaneous oneness and difference also. The branch is jiva tattva and the Vine is Jiva Tattva, The Shelter of All jivas, the Maha Sankarshana. No way to the Father but by the Son.

 

Your lowly servant.

 

You are my favorite Christian Not that we should play favorites, but I much appreciate your perspective.

[HerServant]

 

(removed)

 

How have our hearts become so hardened?

 

A very advanced Sanyasi told me that Jesus is teaching ecstatic union in separation on the cross in the moment he says "Eloi Eloi", "My God My God, why has Thou forsaken me? "

 

Only John and Mary the Divine Mother, and the other Marys were present at the cross, and therefore, only they saw Jesus as He Is on this cross. They are at the cross because only purest love of God could go there. All of Jesus' other disciples ran away. But those lost in Love of God .. they could not bear to leave Him for one second, ... they can pay any price and endure the greatest sorrows because nothing could be worse than being apart from Jesus.

 

Therefore Mary reveals Him to us. To see Him as She sees Him on the cross, .. :

 

He appeared as youthful innoncent little boy, having a pierced blue body and revealing a deep red wound as if His Heart was torn open.

His head was bowed having countless effulgent rays of compassion radiating from His face. His mood was that of Prahlada .. a little boy in the hands of His torturers that were His very own dearest relations.

 

His sorrow and anguish was that of a child who was being killed by relatives that forgot their relationship to Him. As if a father, brother, mother was killing their child, yet, not knowing that He is their very own. The Child however looks back and sees His dearest relation, .. a father, brother ... and in agony He says: " No .. no .. wait .. please do not do this .. I love you...don't you know me? .. it is Me .. I am your little one .. no"

Then Jesus on the Cross transformed into Ananta Sesha Naga. The crucifix was Ananta Sesha Naga Himself. His eyes were fixed, resolute fiery yet compassionate. The eyes expressed the resoluteness for fulfilling and finishing this sacrifice. Time stops. The entire cosmic manifestation rests on Him.

 

 

Love,

ys

[sanatan]

 

Almost. Calvin rejected a vast body of GSS (Guru Saddhu Sastra) tradition in Jesus' line. Regardless if pre-reformation Catholic/Orthodox churches had their share of politically problems, their remains in these traditions the GSS.

 

Calvin rejects much of this with his own speculations.

 

Yes, the reformation produced a new branch of Christianity that soundly rejected the GSS traditions of the Church.

 

What I was more referring to...even though a GSS tradition existed as the structure of pre-reformation Christianity, this had long been expunged of anything resembling Vedic thought, if it was ever present at all. Certainly the Christianity of those times did produce great saints, but the basics of Christian doctrine were much as they are today...devoid of the truths found in the Vedic line.

 

Calvin and other shapers of Protestant ideology had only this gutted tradition to work with, and therefore were starting from a point of basic ignorance...when ideas such as original sin, innate human depravity, and predestination are considered, it is very obvious that they are speculations born of a "poor fund of knowledge".

[HerServant]

 

Yes, the reformation produced a new branch of Christianity that soundly rejected the GSS traditions of the Church.

 

What I was more referring to...even though a GSS tradition existed as the structure of pre-reformation Christianity, this had long been expunged of anything resembling Vedic thought, if it was ever present at all. Certainly the Christianity of those times did produce great saints, but the basics of Christian doctrine were much as they are today...devoid of the truths found in the Vedic line.

 

Calvin and other shapers of Protestant ideology had only this gutted tradition to work with, and therefore were starting from a point of basic ignorance...when ideas such as original sin, innate human depravity, and predestination are considered, it is very obvious that they are speculations born of a "poor fund of knowledge".

 

"GSS tradition existed as the structure of pre-reformation Christianity, this had long been expunged of anything resembling Vedic thought, if it was ever present at all."

 

Not exactly, but you have a point. For example, starting as far back as the desert fathers, they ran into the desert to escape the religionists in the early church (2nd century). Those zealots are gone but the desert father's writings remain as the church treasure. This trend continues throughout the entire history of the church. St. Francis of Assisi is a good example. He waited on the steps of St. Peters as a beggar asking for an audience with the pope. The pope refused. But St. Francis waited anyway. The Pope then had a dream "the beggar" holding up the structure of the crumbling church. Then he was given an audience, and then the pope confessed his forgetfulness of Christ, repented and approved St. Francis movement.

 

The catholic church has needed constant rescue by the saints throughout its history. This is stated within the church itself in various writings. That the church has many wounds on the body of Christ, but the saints and the sacramnents are the church itself. In fact, that the real catholic church is hidden in Mary the Divine Mother.

 

Now where will the next saint who rescues the church emerge? Maybe a vaisnava will save the real church? I don't know.

 

As far as vedic knowledge .. vedic knowledge is definitely there .. just not recognized.

 

My mother and the nuns taught me from the earliest age, my purpose on earth is: "To know Him, to love Him, and to serve Him"

 

That is a fact. Just last week, as I sit in prayer, I realized this is the 3 principle margas taught in a simple sloka. Jnana(know), Bhakti(love), Karma(serve). More on this in my next post.

 

I do agree though .. there needs to be more explanation and the church has failed on this many regards. Krnsa has a plan to help us and it is still unfolding.

[HerServant]

 

The evidence of the Holy Spirit working in a souls life is the fruit. By their fruit ye shall know them.

The fruit of the Holy Spirit is described in Galatians 5:22; ‘…the fruit of the Spirit is love, joy, peace, patience, kindness, generosity, faithfulness, gentleness, and self-control…’

By correct vision and perception we can see this fruit working in the hearts of all true followers of God. The Spirit is Universal and cannot be boxed in by material/sectarian designation. The Hindu who has drawn close to God feels overwhelming bliss (joy) and peace. Is kind and gentle. Is patient, full of self-control and generous in dealing.

The same fruit can be seen working in the sincere Muslim and Christian also. The same encounter with God’s Spirit occurs in all these faiths. The same awakening, what is called by the Christian, a born again experience, is encountered in all these faiths, by one who has surrendered his will to God. One who has encountered this awakening experience within, knows it well. And for some, it cannot be expressed in words. But the knowing of being awakened is deeply felt.

Christ’s admonishment to not blaspheme the Holy Spirit is to not blaspheme what I have just described. For it is the very working of God, amongst all his children. To not see this in the workings of the faith of others is not the sin. But the sin is to see the workings of the Spirit in others, and call it of Satan.

 

Words of Christ: Luke 12:10; 'And everyone who speaks a word against the Son of Man will be forgiven; but whoever blasphemes against the Holy Spirit will not be forgiven.'

Luke 12:10 commentary from the Oxford Annotated Bible…’Blasphemy against the Holy Spirit is attributing the genuine work of the Holy Spirit to the forces of evil rather than to God.’

By their fruit ye shall know them…false teachers teach sectarianism and hatred. Intolerance of other faith, and class their fellow human beings as followers of Satan. False teachers lead the innocent into their own devices. And the innocent repeat the same mistakes as their teachers. Preaching all that is not of the Spirit.

 

Thank you!

[sanatan]

 

Thank you!

 

Good to have you posting here, HerServant.

 

Many Christians that come on and post are spamming fanatics like Justasking ..IMO, they're just asking to be banned.

[HerServant]

Thank you for welcoming me! Your association is very important and helpful to me.

 

 

Good to have you posting here, HerServant.

Many Christians that come on and post are spamming fanatics like justasking ..IMO, they're just asking to be banned.

 

justasking a "Christian"? .. is that what he is? I think maybe an evangelical or fundamentalist, but not a Christian ..

 

I think Mahaksadas summed it up nicely:

 

" No one can recognize a vaisnava except another vaisnavas, .."

 

Regarding justasking , who knows ?.. if (he) sticks around .. maybe he'll get saved

 

ys.

[theist]

I learn about the nature of Lord Jesus Christ by reading about the nature of pure devotees and avatars in The SB and CC. Prahlada and Haridas Thakur for example. I see Jesus in them and them in Jesus. I see the Christ nature expessed in Srila Prabhupada.

 

The name of thread "should Christians be friends with Hindus and Hare Krsna's". They answer is yes of course. Muslims and Jews also, But to be friends we have to learn to tolerated the difference of opinons that others hold when compared to ours.

 

Going around calling others devils and such is not friendly behavior and is the reason I avoid so-called Christians. The problem is not restricted to Christians bty any means. Religous sectarianism always breeds discord. Real friendship is found in transcendental understanding.

[HerServant]

 

This is what the Bible says.

 

Is Vedic Knowledge present in the Bible?

 

The following quotes are excerpts from "Vedic Metaphysics" by Jagadguru Sankaracarya Sri Sri Bharati Krsna Tirthaji Maharaja published by Motilal Banarsidass press. Vedic Metaphysics is a compilation of lectures given in 1958 in the United States by Jagadguru Sankaracarya Sri Sri Bharati Krsna Tirthaji Maharaja.

 

"In the Vedic Sanantana Dharma, as we call it, the eternal verities are described. We have what we have called the Karma-marga, or Karma Yoga, Bhakti-marga or Bhakti Yoga, Jnana-Marga or Jnana Yoga. Well, the corresponding technical terms may not be in constant use in Christian theology, but the three are represented among the Christian theologians, the Christian evangelisits, etc. from the very beginning. We have the example Christ himself dealing with all three paths. Christ is the Master, the Saviour whom the evangelists learnt from, and whos message they carried into the world. But the evangelists were persons who had their onw predilections, their own individual personal equations, and that added a different shade to their teaching." (chap 6, p80 pp4)

 

"In the Bible too, we have Karma Yoga, Bhakti Yoga, and Jnana Yoga all similarly dealt with. We find St. Peter and St. James emphasizing Karma Yoga, the path of works,.." We have St. John emphasizing love, or what we call Bhakti Yoga, with Sraddha, that is faith, and other ingredients of Bhakti Yoga. An thirdly we have St. Paul laying the utmost stress on Jnana Yoga." (chap 16, p259-260)

 

Now from the Gospel of John:

 

"In the beginning was the Word, and the Word was with God, and the Word was God." John 1:1

 

"And the Word became flesh and made his dwelling among us, and we saw his glory, the glory as of the Father's only Son, full of grace and truth." John 1:14

 

St. John tells us "the formula" of how we can read and understand "The Word". The wisdom of the Vedas is not expressed so much as philosophy but is contained in the Life of Christ (Jesus Lila).

 

In catholic teaching, we are called to "enter into the Divine Mystery" of Christ's life through the sacraments and through prayer. The prayer we have is the Holy Rosary. We are called to meditate on the mystery while reciting the "Hail Marys and Our Father".

 

John Paul II encyclical on the Rosary states:

"It can be said that the Rosary is, in some sense, a prayer-commentary on the final chapter of the Vatican II Constitution Lumen Gentium, a chapter which discusses the wondrous presence of the Mother of God in the mystery of Christ and the Church. Against the background of the words Ave Maria the principal events of the life of Jesus Christ pass before the eyes of the soul. They take shape in the complete series of the joyful, sorrowful and glorious mysteries, and they put us in living communion with Jesus through – we might say – the heart of his Mother. At the same time our heart can embrace in the decades of the Rosary all the events that make up the lives of individuals, families, nations, the Church, and all mankind. Our personal concerns and those of our neighbour, especially those who are closest to us, who are dearest to us. Thus the simple prayer of the Rosary marks the rhythm of human life”.(5)"

 

" But the most important reason for strongly encouraging the practice of the Rosary is that it represents a most effective means of fostering among the faithful that commitment to the contemplation of the Christian mystery which I have proposed in the Apostolic Letter Novo Millennio Ineunte as a genuine “training in holiness”: “What is needed is a Christian life distinguished above all in the art of prayer”.(9) Inasmuch as contemporary culture, even amid so many indications to the contrary, has witnessed the flowering of a new call for spirituality, due also to the influence of other religions, it is more urgent than ever that our Christian communities should become “genuine schools of prayer”.(10)

The Rosary belongs among the finest and most praiseworthy traditions of Christian contemplation. Developed in the West, it is a typically meditative prayer, corresponding in some way to the “prayer of the heart” or “Jesus prayer” which took root in the soil of the Christian East."

 

Now we are equipped to read the Bible in Light of the Vedas, and understand Vedic knowledge/wisdom contained in Jesus Lila. The Vedas are contained in the Life of Christ. The knowledge is revealed through "Mystery" by contacting Jesus through the heart of Mary .. rejoice! .. Jesus teaches us in direct relationship to His Person, .. Himself !!!

[Bhakta Devarsi]

 

Is Vedic Knowledge present in the Bible?

 

 

Now we are equipped to read the Bible in Light of the Vedas, and understand Vedic knowledge/wisdom contained in Jesus Lila. The Vedas are contained in the Life of Christ. The knowledge is revealed through "Mystery" by contacting Jesus through the heart of Mary .. rejoice! .. Jesus teaches us in direct relationship to His Person, .. Himself !!!

Haleluiah!

 

This should give a clue to all men aspiring to discipleship about how to look at all their mothers out there, from their blood Mother to Sisters, cousins, and neighbors.

 

No-one pleases the father except through service to his Son who is the bonafide Spiritual Master, and no man pleases the Spiritual Master unless the women in his own sphere of influence are well sheltered and cared for emotionally and physically, and this alone will inspire them to spontaneously reveal the devotion and love of a divine mother to you as they will see you as a true and worthy servant of the son of Krsna the Father.

 

Hare Krsna

[HerServant]

 

Haleluiah!

 

This should give a clue to all men aspiring to discipleship about how to look at all their mothers out there, from their blood Mother to Sisters, cousins, and neighbors.

 

No-one pleases the father except through service to his Son who is the bonafide Spiritual Master, and no man pleases the Spiritual Master unless the women in his own sphere of influence are well sheltered and cared for emotionally and physically, and this alone will inspire them to spontaneously reveal the devotion and love of a divine mother to you as they will see you as a true and worthy servant of the son of Krsna the Father.

 

Hare Krsna

 

Hari Bol! Ave Marie! Ma Durga Ki Jaya!

 

And only Divine Mother decides which children are invited to Her Divine Child's playgroup!

 

ys.

[HerServant]

 

Let's help each other step up and walk on a higher level.

namaste

 

I am a newcomer and I thank each of you for your welcoming, sincere, pleasant, and Holy Spirit.

 

We are all in this (lifetime) together, and I can use all the help I can get.

 

Our hearts will rejoice in the hearing of Krsna's dealings with our sisters and brothers! Hear everything about Him, every grace given, every mercy bestowed, every mellow experienced, of every tear shed in separation. From every person, from every place, from every town, from every tradition, in every age.

 

"Then they said to each other, "Were not our hearts burning (within us) while he spoke to us on the way and opened the scriptures to us?" Luke 24:32

 

[HerServant]

 

"In the Bible too, we have Karma Yoga, Bhakti Yoga, and Jnana Yoga all similarly dealt with. We find St. Peter and St. James emphasizing Karma Yoga, the path of works,.." We have St. John emphasizing love, or what we call Bhakti Yoga, with Sraddha, that is faith, and other ingredients of Bhakti Yoga. An thirdly we have St. Paul laying the utmost stress on Jnana Yoga." Vedic Metaphysics (chap 16, p259-260) - Jagadguru Sankaracarya Sri Sri Bharati Krsna Tirthaji Maharaja

 

"In the beginning was the Word, and the Word was with God, and the Word was God." John 1:1

 

"And the Word became flesh and made his dwelling among us, and we saw his glory, the glory as of the Father's only Son, full of grace and truth." John 1:14

 

St. John tells us "the formula" of how we can read and understand "The Word". The wisdom of the Vedas is not expressed so much as philosophy but is contained in the Life of Christ (Jesus Lila).

 

The Bhagavad Gita 2:62-63:

 

"While contemplating the objects of the senses, a person develops attachment for them, and from such attachment lust develops, and from lust anger arises. From anger, delusion arises, and from delusion bewilderment of memory. When memory is bewildered, intelligence is lost, and when intelligence is lost, one falls down again into the material pool."

 

"While contemplating the objects of the senses, a person develops attachment for them, and from such attachment lust develops,

 

Matt. 26:14-16

"Then one of the Twelve--the one called Judas Iscariot--went to the chief priests and asked, "What are you willing to give me if I hand him over to you?" So they counted out for him thirty silver coins. From then on Judas watched for an opportunity to hand him over. "

 

Matt. 26:23 Jesus replied, "The one who has dipped his hand into the bowl with me will betray me."

 

Judas, contemplating the objects of the senses, even as the Lord is in his very midst is full of greed. Judas envies the Lord and Judas considers himself equal by dipping his hand in the bowl with Jesus. His desires prompt him to trade Jesus for personal gratification and therefore is lust (greed) personified.

 

We are like Judas when we sin. The sin starts with the desire of personal sense gratification, even at the expense of handing over the Lord to tormentors.

 

and from lust anger arises

 

Matt26: 65-67

"Then the high priest tore his clothes and said, "He has spoken blasphemy! Why do we need any more witnesses? Look, now you have heard the blasphemy. What do you think?"

"He is worthy of death," they answered.

Then they spit in his face and struck him with their fists. Others slapped him"

 

 

From anger, delusion arises and from delusion bewilderment of memory. When memory is bewildered, intelligence is lost, and when intelligence is lost

 

Luke 23:4

Then Pilate announced to the chief priests and the crowd, "I find no basis for a charge against this man."

 

Matt 27:12-26

When he was accused by the chief priests and the elders, he gave no answer. Then Pilate asked him, "Don't you hear the testimony they are bringing against you?" But Jesus made no reply, not even to a single charge--to the great amazement of the governor.

Now it was the governor's custom at the Feast to release a prisoner chosen by the crowd. At that time they had a notorious prisoner, called Barabbas. So when the crowd had gathered, Pilate asked them, "Which one do you want me to release to you: Barabbas, or Jesus who is called Christ?" For he knew it was out of envy that they had handed Jesus over to him.

While Pilate was sitting on the judge's seat, his wife sent him this message: "Don't have anything to do with that innocent man, for I have suffered a great deal today in a dream because of him."

But the chief priests and the elders persuaded the crowd to ask for Barabbas and to have Jesus executed.

"Which of the two do you want me to release to you?" asked the governor.

"Barabbas," they answered.

"What shall I do, then, with Jesus who is called Christ?" Pilate asked.

They all answered, "Crucify him!"

"Why? What crime has he committed?" asked Pilate.

But they shouted all the louder, "Crucify him!"

When Pilate saw that he was getting nowhere, but that instead an uproar was starting, he took water and washed his hands in front of the crowd. "I am innocent of this man's blood," he said. "It is your responsibility!"

All the people answered, "Let his blood be on us and on our children!"

Then he released Barabbas to them. But he had Jesus flogged, and handed him over to be crucified. "

 

Pilate is so bewildered he first acquits Jesus. Then hands him over to Herod, then releases a murderer before giving Jesus over to tormentors and executioners. He does not remember, he cannot discern. The crucifiers and tormentors, the bystanders and onlookers are confused, deluded, bewildered, hard hearted, angered, covered in total darkness. Once one gives up their will for sin, the calamity on the body ensues.

 

The body is scourged with passions, the mind is tortured with thorns, the body becomes a burden, for which we labor to carry to our death, until it becomes dead tree , an instrument of execution, on which we crucify our Lord.

 

one falls down again into the material pool.

"So they took Jesus, and carrying the cross himself he went out to what is called the Place of the Skull, in Hebrew, Golgotha. There they crucified him, and with him two others, one on either side, with Jesus in the middle." - John 19:17-18

 

"Who, though he was in the form of God, did not regard equality with God something to be grasped. Rather, he emptied himself, taking the form of a slave, coming in human likeness; and found human in appearance, he humbled himself, becoming obedient to death, even death on a cross.

Because of this, God greatly exalted him and bestowed on him the name that is above every name, that at the name of Jesus every knee should bend, of those in heaven and on earth and under the earth, and every tongue confess that Jesus Christ is Lord, to the glory of God the Father." - Galatians 2:6-11

 

All glories to Ya'hu shua, the Ananta Sesha Naga, the Maha Sankarshana, shelter and saviour of the entire cosmic manifestation.

 

Hare Krsna Hare Krsna Krsna Krsna Hare Hare

Hare Rama Hare Rama Rama Rama Hare Hare

[Bhakta Devarsi]

Quote:

<table border="0" cellpadding="6" cellspacing="0" width="100%"> <tbody><tr> <td style="border: 1px solid rgb(102, 102, 102); padding-left: 3ex; padding-right: 3ex;" bgcolor="#e0e0e0"> Originally Posted by theist

Let's help each other step up and walk on a higher level.

namaste

</td> </tr> </tbody></table>

<!-- END TEMPLATE: bbcode_quote -->

 

 

I am a newcomer and I thank each of you for your welcoming, sincere, pleasant, and Holy Spirit.

 

We are all in this (lifetime) together, and I can use all the help I can get.

 

Our hearts will rejoice in the hearing of Krsna's dealings with our sisters and brothers! Hear everything about Him, every grace given, every mercy bestowed, every mellow experienced, of every tear shed in separation. From every person, from every place, from every town, from every tradition, in every age.

 

"Then they said to each other, "Were not our hearts burning (within us) while he spoke to us on the way and opened the scriptures to us?" Luke 24:32

 

Dear Theist,

 

If you saw what I did not, and offended me, I forgive you. Please be at peace and let us both aim for that higher level you speak of and try not to sin against one another again.

 

ys

 

B.M.

[theist]

 

Quote:

<table border="0" cellpadding="6" cellspacing="0" width="100%"> <tbody><tr> <td style="border: 1px solid rgb(102, 102, 102); padding-left: 3ex; padding-right: 3ex;" bgcolor="#e0e0e0"> Originally Posted by theist

Let's help each other step up and walk on a higher level.

namaste

</td> </tr> </tbody></table>

<!-- END TEMPLATE: bbcode_quote -->

 

 

Dear Theist,

 

If you saw what I did not, and offended me, I forgive you. Please be at peace and let us both aim for that higher level you speak of and try not to sin against one another again.

 

ys

 

B.M.

Good enough. I'll take a glass half full realizing the half may become full in the near future.

Christ even while hanging on the cross prayed to our Father to please forgive those who out of ignorance placed Him there. That is our example. Any movement we can make in that direction will be pleasing to the Lord.

[Bhakta Devarsi]

 

Good enough. I'll take a glass half full realizing the half may become full in the near future.

Christ even while hanging on the cross prayed to our Father to please forgive those who out of ignorance placed Him there. That is our example. Any movement we can make in that direction will be pleasing to the Lord.

 

Dear Theist.

 

I feel you are not being clear in your communication to me. What is this telling me that my forgiveness extended to is analagous to me giving you a half full glass? In some circles it would be considered that you reject my forgiveness, by calling it inadequate.

 

So let me be crystal clear.

 

Even though you did not indicate what you did that you felt you needed forgiveness for, after some reflection I decided that the fact that you obviously saw something was good enough for me to extend a blanket forgiveness. I truly never felt offended, because I do not take offense, because I deserve whatever treatment I get, due to my Karma. This is a standard Vaisnava concept that I actually realize.

 

I allow my self to be offended when other Vaisnavas are offended by an offender, and I speak to that plenty. You did not ask for forgiveness for all the offenses I felt you made against others. And as you realize, despite the nice sentiment of asking Krsna to forgive others their offenses, we both know that is futile, and as far as offenses to ourselves, that is for the offender to realize and beg forgiveness, because we Vaisnavas personally do not feel offended, as per the last paragraph.

 

In this light, I believe you are mistaken about Jesus's mood of forgiveness. From what we know about a true Vaisnava, He would not see that people placing him there was an act of ignorance, he would have seen it as perfectly in his Father's plan. I highly doubt he felt that ignorant people offended him by crucifying him, but that he forgave them for their offenses against each other and his Father. If he did feel offended then he would not have been the Christ (annointed Vaisnava messiah).

 

Awaiting your reply, with respect and in service to the truth.

 

B.M.