QUANTUM PHYSICS OR THE SCIENCE OF POSSIBILITIES.Could this be similar to how we fall

Vigraha · March 26, 2007

Could this be similar to how we fall from <?xml:namespace prefix = st1 /><st1:place w:st="on">Krishna</st1:place>’s Goloka?

Second Life is a 3-D virtual world entirely built and owned by its residents. Since opening to the public in 2003, it has grown explosively and today is inhabited by a total of 4,980,755 people from around the globe. Everyone escaping to a 2nd reality will experience its illusion more real as technology advances; this idea was laughable 10 years ago.

Could the Internet be not a second life, but actually a third life of transmitted illusion expressed as ‘third expression of our conditioned life without the restrictions of the biological body and the physical laws of our universe’ <?xml:namespace prefix = o />

There is even talk of putting virtual Hare Krishna devotee’s in ‘the second life internet game’ chanting Hare Krishna on the streets of major virtual cities around the world. Even a virtual <st1:city w:st="on"><st1:place w:st="on">Temple</st1:place></st1:city> can be built and visited online by members. Could modern science and technology be imitating what is already going on after we left Goloka? Pradyumna Swami explains; -

‘Unlike the Internet illusions modern science creates, the jiva-bhutah-sub-consciousness is real and temporally exists within the mahat-tattva cloud phenomenon (as a secondary conscious transferred from ones original body in Goloka created when one chooses to forget Krishna.

The extended-conscious jiva-bhutah is unaware of its original perpetual nitya-siddha-atma-vigraha bodily form transmitting the virtual illusionary reality to the material impermanent universe or mahat-tattva and give bodily vessels by Maha-Vishnu.

When the sub-consciousness (jiva-bhutah) begins it transformation from the nitya-baddha condition back to its full consciousness body (nitya-siddha-atma-vigraha), the nescience nitya-baddha-jiva-bhutah consciousness is disseminated by the effulgent personal nitya-siddha-atma-vigraha full bodily consciousness when ones Krishna Consciousness is re-established….

‘The Internet and the so-called second life phenomenon you have described to me is ‘the linking up of ones extended influence (sakti) through the technological materialistic facilities built by scientists to act as an extensive networks with destinations reaching all over the world wide web through a network of cables and satellites without really going anywhere, I compare that as ‘an imitation mahat-tattva’ that is built and controlled by conditioned souls, well ultimately everything in the mahat-tattva is built by Maha-Vishnu and His representatives.

This is very deep subject matter of trying to understand how the rebellious souls of the spiritually primitive 21st century, is trying to imitate Krishna to the point that if they cannot fulfill their desires with their biological body, they attempt to build a virtual universe where they can forget their biological body and live out their fantasies of grandeur, opulence, anything their mind can fantasies in that make believer world. Doesn’t this entire sound familiar? Isn’t this similar to how we originally feel down from Goloka?

In the case of the atma-vigraha devotional Krishna Conscious body in Goloka-Vrndavana, there is always the choice to forget <st1:place w:st="on">Krishna</st1:place> or stay with Him however, if one chooses to leave, they leave their rasa body behind in Goloka while they are consciously project as a secondary self to the mahat-tattva. The non-Krishna Conscious thoughts manifest as the sakti (influence or power) of the jiva. This is called the transmitted jiva bhutah.

In modern scientific terminology, second life becomes the virtual Internet (transmitted influence and power) super-highway (imitating the mahat-tattva creation of the Lord) that creates the many holographic bodies and places for the transmitted extension of consciousness to live out extended non-biological fantasies over the Internet.

The embodied jiva-bhutah’s already restricted to an ethereal vessel further covered by the biological rare human form, have only further chose to totally misuse their rare biological human form, the highest form out of the 8,000,000 biological vessels on offer, by choosing to foolishly enter a ‘fantasy dream-like state within the internet that is a complete illusion and no more real than the dreams their biological body is having.

This technology and science is ultimately the sakti of Maya and has further covered the biological vessel with lifeless psychological restraints where ones inner illusion are expressed as a reality within the confines of the Internet and brought our as an artificial world with simulated life forms. - The ‘thought’ transmitted virtual Internet super highway is actually a perverted reflection of an already perverted reflection (the secular material world their biological vessel is trapped in). In other words, we original left Krishna to ‘do our own thing’ and now we can further ‘switch off from our biological body’ and become totally absorbed in the so-called second life on the Internet.

A crude example of this can be compared to the present hi-tech virtual reality Internet revolution.

The material universe or mahat-tattva, even though real but temporary, can be compared to what the Internet virtual super highway and 3.D. computer games are to the biological human body in the scientific technological age of the 21st century, with one exception, the ethereal bodies in sub-space and the biological bodies in secular space are a real feature of the mahat-tattva but are perishable, where as the internet driven cyber-space is a total illusionary aspect within the mahat-tattva (dead matter can ALSO exist in the mahat-tattva) and just a further distraction for the gift of human life.

Another crude example of how this works: - Today modern scientists are sending probes out into space or in medicine they are sending probes deep into the biological body, these probes become an extension of their senses but have no effect directly on their senses. In this way, they can go deep into space or deep within the biological body without really going there. This is because they have extended their influence (sakti) or conscious awareness with the extensions of their sensual perception.

None of the extensions carrying their consciousness are real. Or another example is telephones and the new 3 dimensional televisions that will be widely available around 2020; one can be transported to a lounge room anywhere in the world, but are they really there? Through the visual senses they will appear real and sitting in your lounge room however, it is only an illusion. They are not real in that transmitted form, they are only real at the source of that transmission. On the other hand, the transmission of the real self’s consciousness (jiva-bhutah or the sakti of the jivatma-vigraha bodily form in Goloka) is real because the mahat-tattva is a real phenomenon or cloud within the Spiritual Sky or Brahmajyoti. There is a real substance to the jiva-bhutah-sub-consciousness state because it is the sakti of the Atma-vigraha body serving <st1:place w:st="on">Krishna</st1:place> in Goloka, they cannot be separated because, they are one (the light is the cause of the darkness when out) that can project that secondary non-Krishna Conscious state we call the jiva-bhutah consciousness.

In the scientific technological atheistic world of the spiritually primitive 21st century, there is no substance to the transmitted 3D television singles broadcasted from the television studio or some computer anywhere on the planet, where as EVERYONES secondary consciousness (lower self) broadcasted from their perpetual bodily form in Goloka-Vrndavana is real but the ethereal and biological vessels the jiva-bhutah consciousness takes shelter of in the mahat-tattva, is subject to impermanence and decay.

Due to the temporary nature of the material universe or mahat-tattva, prompted by forgetfulness, the embodied jiva-bhutah sub-consciousness (contained in a biological body that is already previously contained in the ethereal vessel when first entering the mahat-tattva) sheds a lifeless phenomenon (dead organic matter), these thought-generated-containers provide originally by Maha-Vishnu, without the presents of the jiva-bhutah consciousness, eventually breaks down and expands the lifeless aspect of the material universe with fossilized dust, gases and sand that eventually become rocks, mountains, planets, moons, solar systems and galaxies over trillions of years however, the material universe or mahat-tattva is already build by Maha-Vishnu whom has already antisapated the desires, dreams and thoughts of the jiva-bhutah’s who dare enter His dreams. He sees everything. Past. Present and future, He Knows what the rebellious souls want before they even do, and has already built the mahat-tattva for them.

There are two kinds of sayujya-mukti: merging into the Brahman effulgence and merging into the personal body of the Lord. Merging into the Lord's body is even more abominable than merging into His effulgence. According to the opinion of the Mayavadi Vedantists, the living entity's ultimate success is to merge into the impersonal Brahman after being liberated from ethereal and biological vessels inside the dreams of Maha-Vishnu within the mahat-tattva cloud.

<st1:place w:st="on">Krishna</st1:place> is the source of both the Personal Goloka-Vrndavana realm and the less significant Impersonal mahat-tattva cloud.

The impersonal Brahman, or bodily effulgence of the Maha-Vishnu within the mahat-tattva, is known as Brahmaloka or Siddhaloka. According to the Brahma-samhita (5.40), yasya prabha prabhavato jagad-anda-koti: the material universes are generated from the bodily rays Maha-Vishnu. Some Impersonalist Yogis accept the form of Maha-Vishnu yet want to merge into the transcendental body of the Supreme Lord. That is their desire, however this is only possible within the mahat-tattva. Being the creator and facilitator of the mahat-tattva, Maha-Vishnu can easily allow many millions of living entities to merge their transmitted jiva-nikaya consciousness into His body.

The origin of everything is the Supreme Personality of Godhead, Bhagavan, and Maha-Vishnu is his expansion within the mahat-tattva, His bodily effulgence is known as the brahmajyoti, Brahmaloka or Siddhaloka. Thus Brahmaloka or Siddhaloka is a place where the jiva-nikaya ‘inactive’ consciousness appears as sparklike outside the dreams of Maha-Vishnu yey still within the mahat-tattva cloud. They exist total denial of their original authentic bodily form outside of the mahat-tattva cloud.

This jivatma-vigraha bodily Krishna Conscious form is the authentic constitutional position of all of <st1:place w:st="on">Krishna</st1:place>’s marginal potency or energy.

Vigraha · March 27, 2007

Sub Conscious Ego blocks the Vision.
JNANINAH TATVA DARSINAH-

I hope you understand the implication of mis-conceptions and mix-up terminologies and you have no right to mislead next generations.quote]

Your arrogant self righteous ignorant comment misunderstands that the threat of MISUSING technology and science will only rivet ones jiva-bhutah consciousness deeper into material life and cause many to take birth in the lower species!!

The word Hindu is a Muslim name given by the invading Muslims 1400 years ago and has no place in Vedic Culture, most so-called Hindu's have a complete misunderstanding of the Vedic Sanskrit texts and foolishly worship the Demigods instead of Krishna the Supreme Personality of Godhead (in Goloka) and the source of both Vishnu in the Vaikuntha’s and Maha-Vishnu and Shiva in the mahat-tattva cloud.

The mahat-tattva (material manifestation) is real but temporary.

The ethereal and biological costumes (bodies) always belong to the rental agent, Maha-Vishnu and His wife Maya Devi. Such costumes follow His script or design that simultaneously meets the desires and requirements of each of the jiva-bhutah consciousnesses visiting from their original bodily source and place of servitude in the perpetual Spiritual Sky, which is outside the mahat-tattva or confines of the restricted material universe.

For the inhabitants of the Vaikuntha's planets, the mahat-tattva is an unnatural phenomenon.

For us souls trapped in the mahat-tattva in ethereal or biological bodies, it is hard for us to understand the concept of an imperishable universe where only the present exists beyond time, past and future that is where we originate from. For those inhabitants in the Vaikuntha's, it is therefore possible to see past, present and future within the mahat-tattva all at once, where as from the perspective within the mahat-tattva, unless one is a great devotee who Krishna allows to view the dreams of Maha-Vishnu, from outside His dreams of the material manifestation, (and outside the confines of ethereal and biological vehicals) yet still within the boundaries of the mahat-tattva, then viewing past, present and future within the dreams of Maha-Vishnu is not possible.

The Impersonalists foolishly believe the mahat-tattva is the complete creation and nothing else exists; they can neither view nor experience the existence of the vast Vaikuntha real outside the mahat-tattva that takes up the majority of creation and encircles the insignificant mahat-tattva cloud.

They also think the mahat-tattva is an illusion however, the mahat-tattva is real but unlike the vast majority of the creation in the Spiritual Sky, it is temporary, as already explained, and fades in and out of existence due to the temporary nature of the mahat-tattva governed by the ‘unnatural occurrence’ of time (divided into past present and future), ethereal and biological vessels, impermanence, birth, disease, old age, decay, forgetfulness and death.

Such an impermanent phenomena cannot exist within the other three quarters of the indestructible Spiritual Sky or Brahmajyoti where the vast Vaikuntha planets and atma-jiva-vigraha marginal devotees perpetually thrive on loving devotional service that surround Krishna’s Personal intimate Goloka-Vrndavana abode.

Therefore the following explanation may 'give the impression' that the mahat-tattva is an illusion however, it only appears that way from the level of the Vaikuntha's where time, past, future and impermanence has no meaning in the personal pastimes of Krishna and His Vishnu expansions because everything is always happening now. From this level 'outside' the mahat-tattva, one can see everything (past, present and future) happening in the mahat-tattva or material manifestation. This is important to understand if one is to understand the mahat-tattva creation of Maha-Vishnu.

The Final Proof: The Jiva Did Fall From Goloka

The various Vedic texts tell us that the <st1><st1>Kingdom</st1> of<st1> Krishna</st1></st1> is an eternal active place of boundless pastimes where nothing perishes. Everything in Krishna’s Abode is always eternally there because of the perpetual and imperishable nature of His Goloka-Vrndavana/Vaikuntha Spiritual Sky or Abode, this means ones eternal, perpetual, unchanging, continious, everlasting, ceasless, never ending, long lasting, continual jivatma vigraha is ALWAYS there and can NEVER leave because of the eternal nature of Goloka-Vrndavana/Vaikuntha. Perpetual means nothing there can decay perish or disappear.

<o></o><o>As already mentioned and must be constantly emphasised, this means all of us have an eternal form and relationship that is always with Krishna in His everlasting Abode that is forever there and has always been there, even though from time to time, we are consciously unaware of this unending reality due to our forgetfulness and fantasies that create our mirage like insignificant secondary consciousness (real but temporary) that transmits ‘the thoughts one wants created’ to the material universe in the jiva-bhutah condition consciousness known as the nitya-baddha proviso of existence within the mahat-tattva (material universe).

<o></o><o>In a uncomplicated way of trying to understand this, all of us dream when we sleep, the dreams we have in our biological body or vessel appear real and while immersed in that dream state one forgets their biological body they are dreaming from. In a similar way, the non-Krishna Conscious thoughts, convictions or ‘dreams’ manifest a separate dreaming version of the self (that is real but temporary) and while in that dreaming state or secondary consciousness (jiva-bhutah), we forget our genuine Krishna conscious bodily form.

<o></o>Keep in mind, on the absolute level, unlike the mundane biological level; ones thoughts or dreams are as real as their atma-jiva-vigraha body, with a major difference, they are expressed through counterfeit bodily vessels within the mahat-tattva. All ethereal and biological vessels as well as their material surroundings are provided by Maha-Vishnu for the purpose of allowing one in their secondary conscious state to live out those dreams, thoughts and desires. Such non-Krishna Conscious thoughts and desires cannot exist within the same devotional space that all their perpetual Krishna Conscious bodies exist in (namely Goloka-Vrndavana/Vaikuntha). In this way, it is ones ‘non <st1>Krishna</st1> Conscious desires’ cause one to consciously enter the mahat-tattva cloud.<o></o>

<o>

All self-centered desires, dreams or thoughts expel themselves (as jiva-bhutah consciousness) from Goloka-Vrndavana/Vaikuntha perpetual portion of the Spiritual Sky due to the selfish independent desires (choices) to no longer want to be with <st1>Krishna</st1>.

To remain in the Goloka-Vrndavana/Vaikuntha abode, one has to be Krishna Conscious. In this way ones non-Krishna Conscious thoughts, dreams and desires cannot remain there and are transferred as a secondary conscious state (jiva-bhutah) to a far distant transient place in the Spiritual Sky set aside for such temporary thoughts, dreams or desires. Those desires, thoughts and dreams, represented by the jiva-bhutah consciousness, are provided ethereal and biological containers provided by Maha-Vishnu to chase their dream, in some cases for an almost eternity. This place of ‘the dreaming’ is called the mahat-tattva.

When one is awake in their biological body, or when one is dreaming in that body, it is still the same ‘self’ existing on two completely different levels of consciousness at the same time, one in the biological body, the other as dreamed up fantasies the biological body is dreaming. <o></o>

<o>

Such dreams appear real while ones biological body is sleeping, so real, one completely forgets the biological body one is dreaming from.

<o>

In a comparable way, whens ones dreams or thoughts are not <st1>Krishna </st1>conscious, they create a secondary conscious state called the jiva-bhutah conscious condition. This state of consciousness is then transferred to within the mahat-tattva cloud (material universe), which is real but temporary. In this way, the thoughts of ones lower self, unlike the illusionary unreal dreams one has while their biological body is sleeping, are actually a real reality but subject to decay. Remember, on this level of consciousness, your thoughts are your actions and stays that way while even contained in ethereal vessels within the material heavenly planets. Only in the middle planets of biological vessels are ones thoughts and dreams suppressed. <o>Ones sleeping biological body dreaming, is only an analogy and it does not mean the biological understanding of dreaming is the way we dream ourselves out of the Vaikuntha’s.

<o></o>There is a difference, ones dreams within Goloka-Vrndavana/Vaikuntha are non different from reality or actions. In other words, if one has non-Krishna Conscious thoughts, dreams or desires, they cannot experience those thoughts, desires or dreams in the devotionally uninterrupted <st1>Kingdom </st1><st1>Krishna.</st1>

</o></o>To experience such self-centered dreams and desires, the secondary consciousness (jiva-bhutah) is extended to the mahat-tattva or material universe. In this way, ones secondary consciousness is transferred to within the confines and restrictions (being contained in ethereal and biological vessels) of mahat-tattva when one is unaware of their real original identity and form (The atma-vigraha Krishna Conscious body).

As already explained, this means all of us (all marginal living entities) have an eternal shape, form, body and connection that is forever with Krishna in His everlasting Abode which is infinitely eternal even though from moment to moment, we may choose to consciously deny of this everlasting reality due to our desire to experience existence separate from Krishna. Only then, after that choice is made, does forgetfulness enter the equation where ones fantasies of independent grandeur is created by our dreaming secondary consciousness that transmits one to the material universe (mahat-tattva) or nitya-baddha forgetful condition of existence as the jiva-bhutah conscious condition that originates from our perprtual bodily form in Goloka-Vrndavana. From the teachings of Pradyumna Swami HARE KRISHNA

</o></o></o></o>

Vigraha · March 27, 2007

The last thread was posted before editing and has been misunderstood. This is the correct version

The following is the correct version of the QUANTUM PHYSICS OR THE SCIENCE OF POSSIBILITIES. Could this be similar to how we fall from the <st1:place w:st="on"><st1>Kingdom</st1> of <st1>Krishna</st1></st1:place>?

Could this be similar to how we fall from <st1:place w:st="on">Krishna</st1:place>’s Goloka? -

The following is a crude example of foolishly trying to be lord and master in anyway possible - even if it’s only an illusion offered by mundane material scientists. Read carefully what is being explained here Second Life is a 3-D virtual world missleading millions that is entirely built and owned by those who want to live and enjoy in an imaginary universe. Since opening to the public in 2003, it has grown explosively and today is inhabited by a total of 4,980,755 people from around the globe. Everyone escaping to a 2nd reality will experience its illusion more real as technology advances; this idea was laughable 10 years ago.

A guest asked me at the Sunday feast, could the Internet (making a valid point) be not a second life, but actually a third life of transmitted illusion expressed as ‘third expression of our conditioned life without the restrictions of the biological body and the physical laws of our universe’?

The guest even suggested there was talk by some of putting virtual Hare Krishna devotee’s in ‘the second life internet game’ chanting Hare Krishna on the streets of major virtual cities around the world. Even a virtual <st1:city w:st="on"><st1:place w:st="on">Temple</st1:place></st1:city> can be built and visited online by members. Could modern science and technology be imitating what is already going on after we left Goloka?

Pradyumna Swami explains it’s all a nonsense deviation from real devotional service; -

‘Unlike the mundane Internet illusions modern science creates, the jiva-bhutah consciousness is real exists within the mahat-tattva cloud phenomenon contained in ethereal and biological vessels. The life force or jiva-bhutah consciousness is contained in ethereal and biological vessels as a secondary consciousness transferred from ones original body in Goloka. This happens when one chooses to forget <st1:place w:st="on">Krishna</st1:place>.

This extended jivah-bhutah consciousness extended from the authentic self (jivatma-vigraha) eventually becomes unaware of its original perpetual nitya-siddha-atma-vigraha bodily form that has transmitted ones non-Krishna Conscious 'thoughts' as the virtual illusionary (real but impermanant) reality to the material impermanent universe or mahat-tattva. It is there ones jiva-bhutah consciousness is provided ethereal and biological bodies by Maha-Vishnu and tempted by His wife Maya devi with her influence or sakti

When the embodied jiva-bhutah begins its transformation from the entrapment of the nitya-baddha condition back to its full consciousness body (nitya-siddha-atma-vigraha), the nescience nitya-baddha-jiva-bhutah consciousness is disseminated by the effulgent personal nitya-siddha-atma-vigraha full bodily consciousness only when ones Krishna Consciousness is re-established….

‘The Internet of the 21st century and the so-called second life phenomenon is complete nonsense to a Vaishnava. He or she only wants to help others re-establish their 'old' and original Krishna Consciousness. You have described to me is a further step into ignorance - ‘the linking up of ones misconceptions and thoughts with the technological materialistic facilities, built by mundane scientists 'sense gratifiers', is so they can act out there exploitations and perversions in the illusion of so-called hyper-space.

The internet can appear to transport ones 'conscious awareness of the secular world' over an extensive networks of destinations reaching all over the world wide web through a network of cables and satellites without ones biological body going anywhere or leaving their own house, I compare that as ‘an imitation mahat-tattva where scientists are dangerously playing God and trying to build the Kingdom of God without God’ Do you understand what I'm trying to explain here?

The internet is built by mundane scientists to escape their mundane biological lives. The mahat-tattva is created by Maha-Vishnu for those rebellious souls who do not want to stay with <st1:place w:st="on">Krishna.</st1:place> Ultimately everything in the mahat-tattva cloud, that is 1/4 of the creation, is built by Maha-Vishnu and His representatives. There are many different types of materialist planets where one can go and forget <st1:place w:st="on">Krishna</st1:place> for almost an eternity if they desire.

This is very deep subject matter of trying to understand how the rebellious souls of our spiritually primitive ignorant 21st century, is trying to imitate Krishna to the point they will even try to build an imaginary world that is in effect, a further covering of their biological human body that only leads one further away from Krishna.

Such nonsense technology is for those embodied souls who cannot fulfil their desires with their biological body. They therefore foolishly attempt to build a virtual universe where they can forget their biological body and live out their selfish fantasies of grandeur, opulence, anything their mind can fantasies.

Doesn’t this entire sound familiar? Isn’t this similar to how we originally feel down from Goloka?

In the case of ones authentic real perpetual self or atma-vigraha devotional Krishna Conscious perpetual selfless body in Goloka-Vrndavana, there is always the choice to forget <st1:place w:st="on">Krishna</st1:place> or stay with Him however, if one chooses to leave, they leave their rasa body behind in Goloka while they are consciously project as a secondary self to the mahat-tattva.

The non-Krishna Conscious thoughts manifest as the non-Krishna Conscious sakti (influence or power) of the jivatma-Vigraha that extends to the mahat-tattva as the jiva-bhutah consciousness. This is also called the transmitted jiva bhutah or jiva-sakti.

In modern scientific terminology, the nonsense second life phenomenon on the virtual super-highway, artificially creates the many holographic bodies and places for the artificially transmitted extension of conscious thought lives out extended non-biological fantasies over the Internet.

The embodied jiva-bhutah consciousness, already restricted to an ethereal vessel, and further covered by the biological rare human form, have only further chose to totally misuse their rare biological human form with technology and science. The biological human form of life is the highest and rearrest form out of the 8,000,000 biological vessels on offer and the only one suitable to use as a stepping stone to re-awaken ones old and original Krishna Consciousness. By choosing to foolishly enter a ‘fantasy dream-like state within the internet that is a complete illusion and no more real than the dreams their biological body is having, is wasting the rare gift of human life.

This dangerous technology and science is ultimately the sakti of Maya who has further covered the biological vessel with lifeless psychological restraints where ones inner illusion are expressed as a reality within the confines of the Internet and brought out as an artificial world with simulated life forms. - factually it is like a hellish planet to Vaishnava's

The ‘thought’ transmitted virtual Internet super highway is actually a perverted reflection of an already perverted reflection (the secular material world their biological vessel is trapped in). In other words, we original left Krishna to ‘do our own thing’ and now we can further ‘switch off from our biological body’ and become totally absorbed in the so-called nonsense second life on the Internet and at the same time carves ones pathway to the hellish planets and lower species of biological life.

A crude example of this can be compared to the present hi-tech virtual reality Internet revolution.

The material universe, even though real but temporary, can never be compared to what the artificial Internet virtual super highway and 3.D. computer games are. Ones real while the technological light show on the internet is an illusion!!

The the ethereal bodies in sub-space and the biological bodies in secular space are a real feature of the mahat-tattva but are perishable, where as the unreal internet driven cyber-space is a DANGEROUS illusionary aspect within the mahat-tattva (dead matter can ALSO exist in the mahat-tattva) and just a further distraction for the gift of human life, which is to re-establish one original Krishna Consciousness.

Another crude example of how this works: - Today modern scientists are sending probes out into space or in medicine they are sending probes deep into the biological body, these probes become an extension of their senses but have no effect directly on their senses. In this way, they can go deep into space or deep within the biological body without really going there. This is because they have extended their influence (sakti) or conscious awareness with the extensions of their sensual perception.

None of the extensions carrying their consciousness are real. Or another example is telephones and the new 3 dimensional televisions that will be widely available around 2020; one’s awareness can be artificially transported from a lounge room to anywhere in the world, but are they really there? Through the visual senses they will appear real and sitting in your lounge room however, it is only an illusion. They are not real in that artificial transmitted form, they are only real at the source of that transmission.

On the other hand, the transmission of the real self’s consciousness (jiva-bhutah or the sakti of the jivatma-vigraha bodily form in Goloka) is real because the mahat-tattva is a real phenomenon or cloud within the Spiritual Sky or Brahmajyoti.

There is a real substance to the jiva-bhutah conscious state because it is the sakti of the individual atma-vigraha body eternally serving <st1:place w:st="on">Krishna</st1:place> in Goloka. Ones body and ones extended secondary consciousness cannot be separated because, they are one (the light is the cause of the darkness when out)

In the scientific technological atheistic world of the Spiritual primitive 21st century, there is no substance to the artificial transmitted 3D television singles broadcasted from the television studio or some computer anywhere on the planet, where as EVERYONES secondary consciousness (lower self) broadcasted from their perpetual bodily form in Goloka-Vrndavana is real but the ethereal and biological vessels the jiva-bhutah consciousness takes shelter of in the mahat-tattva, is subject to impermanence and decay.

Due to the temporary nature of the material universe or mahat-tattva, prompted by forgetfulness, the embodied jiva-bhutah sub-consciousness (contained in a biological body that is already previously contained in the ethereal vessel when first entering the mahat-tattva) sheds a lifeless phenomenon (dead organic matter), these thought-generated-containers provide originally by Maha-Vishnu, without the presents of the jiva-bhutah consciousness, eventually breaks down and expands the lifeless aspect of the material universe with fossilized dust, gases and sand that eventually become rocks, mountains, planets, moons, solar systems and galaxies over trillions of years however, the material universe or mahat-tattva is already build by Maha-Vishnu whom has already antisapated the desires, dreams and thoughts of the jiva-bhutah’s who dare enter His dreams. He sees everything. Past. Present and future, He Knows what the rebellious souls want before they even do, and has already built the mahat-tattva for them.

There are two kinds of sayujya-mukti: merging into the Brahman effulgence and merging into the personal body of the Lord. Merging into the Lord's body is even more abominable than merging into His effulgence. According to the opinion of the Mayavadi Vedantists, the living entity's ultimate success is to merge into the impersonal Brahman after being liberated from ethereal and biological vessels inside the dreams of Maha-Vishnu within the mahat-tattva cloud.

<st1:place w:st="on">Krishna</st1:place> is the source of both the Personal Goloka-Vrndavana realm and the less significant Impersonal mahat-tattva cloud.

The impersonal Brahman, or bodily effulgence of the Maha-Vishnu within the mahat-tattva, is known as Brahmaloka or Siddhaloka. According to the Brahma-samhita (5.40), yasya prabha prabhavato jagad-anda-koti: the material universes are generated from the bodily rays Maha-Vishnu. Some Impersonalist Yogis accept the form of Maha-Vishnu yet want to merge into the transcendental body of the Supreme Lord. That is their desire, however this is only possible within the mahat-tattva. Being the creator and facilitator of the mahat-tattva, Maha-Vishnu can easily allow many millions of living entities to merge their transmitted jiva-nikaya consciousness into His body.

The origin of everything is the Supreme Personality of Godhead, Bhagavan, and Maha-Vishnu is his expansion within the mahat-tattva, His bodily effulgence is known as the brahmajyoti, Brahmaloka or Siddhaloka. Thus Brahmaloka or Siddhaloka is a place where the jiva-nikaya ‘inactive’ consciousness appears as sparklike outside the dreams of Maha-Vishnu yet still within the mahat-tattva cloud. They exist total denial of their original authentic bodily form outside of the mahat-tattva cloud.

This jivatma-vigraha bodily Krishna Conscious form is the authentic constitutional position of all of <st1:place w:st="on">Krishna</st1:place>’s marginal potency or energy.

March 28, 2007

The last thread was posted before editing and has been misunderstood. This is the correct version

The following is the correct version of the QUANTUM PHYSICS OR THE SCIENCE OF POSSIBILITIES. Could this be similar to how we fall from the <st1:place w:st="on"><st1>Kingdom</st1> of <st1>Krishna</st1></st1:place>?

Could this be similar to how we fall from <st1:place w:st="on">Krishna</st1:place>’s Goloka? -

The following is a crude example of foolishly trying to be lord and master in anyway possible - even if it’s only an illusion offered by mundane material scientists. Read carefully what is being explained here Second Life is a 3-D virtual world missleading millions that is entirely built and owned by those who want to live and enjoy in an imaginary universe. Since opening to the public in 2003, it has grown explosively and today is inhabited by a total of 4,980,755 people from around the globe. Everyone escaping to a 2nd reality will experience its illusion more real as technology advances; this idea was laughable 10 years ago.

A guest asked me at the Sunday feast, could the Internet (making a valid point) be not a second life, but actually a third life of transmitted illusion expressed as ‘third expression of our conditioned life without the restrictions of the biological body and the physical laws of our universe’?

The guest even suggested there was talk by some of putting virtual Hare Krishna devotee’s in ‘the second life internet game’ chanting Hare Krishna on the streets of major virtual cities around the world. Even a virtual <st1:city w:st="on"><st1:place w:st="on">Temple</st1:place></st1:city> can be built and visited online by members. Could modern science and technology be imitating what is already going on after we left Goloka?

 

Pradyumna Swami explains it’s all a nonsense deviation from real devotional service; -

‘Unlike the mundane Internet illusions modern science creates, the jiva-bhutah consciousness is real exists within the mahat-tattva cloud phenomenon contained in ethereal and biological vessels. The life force or jiva-bhutah consciousness is contained in ethereal and biological vessels as a secondary consciousness transferred from ones original body in Goloka. This happens when one chooses to forget <st1:place w:st="on">Krishna</st1:place>.

This extended jivah-bhutah consciousness extended from the authentic self (jivatma-vigraha) eventually becomes unaware of its original perpetual nitya-siddha-atma-vigraha bodily form that has transmitted ones non-Krishna Conscious 'thoughts' as the virtual illusionary (real but impermanant) reality to the material impermanent universe or mahat-tattva. It is there ones jiva-bhutah consciousness is provided ethereal and biological bodies by Maha-Vishnu and tempted by His wife Maya devi with her influence or sakti

When the embodied jiva-bhutah begins its transformation from the entrapment of the nitya-baddha condition back to its full consciousness body (nitya-siddha-atma-vigraha), the nescience nitya-baddha-jiva-bhutah consciousness is disseminated by the effulgent personal nitya-siddha-atma-vigraha full bodily consciousness only when ones Krishna Consciousness is re-established….

‘The Internet of the 21st century and the so-called second life phenomenon is complete nonsense to a Vaishnava. He or she only wants to help others re-establish their 'old' and original Krishna Consciousness. You have described to me is a further step into ignorance - ‘the linking up of ones misconceptions and thoughts with the technological materialistic facilities, built by mundane scientists 'sense gratifiers', is so they can act out there exploitations and perversions in the illusion of so-called hyper-space.

The internet can appear to transport ones 'conscious awareness of the secular world' over an extensive networks of destinations reaching all over the world wide web through a network of cables and satellites without ones biological body going anywhere or leaving their own house, I compare that as ‘an imitation mahat-tattva where scientists are dangerously playing God and trying to build the Kingdom of God without God’ Do you understand what I'm trying to explain here?

The internet is built by mundane scientists to escape their mundane biological lives. The mahat-tattva is created by Maha-Vishnu for those rebellious souls who do not want to stay with <st1:place w:st="on">Krishna.</st1:place> Ultimately everything in the mahat-tattva cloud, that is 1/4 of the creation, is built by Maha-Vishnu and His representatives. There are many different types of materialist planets where one can go and forget <st1:place w:st="on">Krishna</st1:place> for almost an eternity if they desire.

This is very deep subject matter of trying to understand how the rebellious souls of our spiritually primitive ignorant 21st century, is trying to imitate Krishna to the point they will even try to build an imaginary world that is in effect, a further covering of their biological human body that only leads one further away from Krishna.

Such nonsense technology is for those embodied souls who cannot fulfil their desires with their biological body. They therefore foolishly attempt to build a virtual universe where they can forget their biological body and live out their selfish fantasies of grandeur, opulence, anything their mind can fantasies.

Doesn’t this entire sound familiar? Isn’t this similar to how we originally feel down from Goloka?

In the case of ones authentic real perpetual self or atma-vigraha devotional Krishna Conscious perpetual selfless body in Goloka-Vrndavana, there is always the choice to forget <st1:place w:st="on">Krishna</st1:place> or stay with Him however, if one chooses to leave, they leave their rasa body behind in Goloka while they are consciously project as a secondary self to the mahat-tattva.

The non-Krishna Conscious thoughts manifest as the non-Krishna Conscious sakti (influence or power) of the jivatma-Vigraha that extends to the mahat-tattva as the jiva-bhutah consciousness. This is also called the transmitted jiva bhutah or jiva-sakti.

In modern scientific terminology, the nonsense second life phenomenon on the virtual super-highway, artificially creates the many holographic bodies and places for the artificially transmitted extension of conscious thought lives out extended non-biological fantasies over the Internet.

The embodied jiva-bhutah consciousness, already restricted to an ethereal vessel, and further covered by the biological rare human form, have only further chose to totally misuse their rare biological human form with technology and science. The biological human form of life is the highest and rearrest form out of the 8,000,000 biological vessels on offer and the only one suitable to use as a stepping stone to re-awaken ones old and original Krishna Consciousness. By choosing to foolishly enter a ‘fantasy dream-like state within the internet that is a complete illusion and no more real than the dreams their biological body is having, is wasting the rare gift of human life.

This dangerous technology and science is ultimately the sakti of Maya who has further covered the biological vessel with lifeless psychological restraints where ones inner illusion are expressed as a reality within the confines of the Internet and brought out as an artificial world with simulated life forms. - factually it is like a hellish planet to Vaishnava's

The ‘thought’ transmitted virtual Internet super highway is actually a perverted reflection of an already perverted reflection (the secular material world their biological vessel is trapped in). In other words, we original left Krishna to ‘do our own thing’ and now we can further ‘switch off from our biological body’ and become totally absorbed in the so-called nonsense second life on the Internet and at the same time carves ones pathway to the hellish planets and lower species of biological life.

A crude example of this can be compared to the present hi-tech virtual reality Internet revolution.

The material universe, even though real but temporary, can never be compared to what the artificial Internet virtual super highway and 3.D. computer games are. Ones real while the technological light show on the internet is an illusion!!

The the ethereal bodies in sub-space and the biological bodies in secular space are a real feature of the mahat-tattva but are perishable, where as the unreal internet driven cyber-space is a DANGEROUS illusionary aspect within the mahat-tattva (dead matter can ALSO exist in the mahat-tattva) and just a further distraction for the gift of human life, which is to re-establish one original Krishna Consciousness.

Another crude example of how this works: - Today modern scientists are sending probes out into space or in medicine they are sending probes deep into the biological body, these probes become an extension of their senses but have no effect directly on their senses. In this way, they can go deep into space or deep within the biological body without really going there. This is because they have extended their influence (sakti) or conscious awareness with the extensions of their sensual perception.

None of the extensions carrying their consciousness are real. Or another example is telephones and the new 3 dimensional televisions that will be widely available around 2020; one’s awareness can be artificially transported from a lounge room to anywhere in the world, but are they really there? Through the visual senses they will appear real and sitting in your lounge room however, it is only an illusion. They are not real in that artificial transmitted form, they are only real at the source of that transmission.

On the other hand, the transmission of the real self’s consciousness (jiva-bhutah or the sakti of the jivatma-vigraha bodily form in Goloka) is real because the mahat-tattva is a real phenomenon or cloud within the Spiritual Sky or Brahmajyoti.

There is a real substance to the jiva-bhutah conscious state because it is the sakti of the individual atma-vigraha body eternally serving <st1:place w:st="on">Krishna</st1:place> in Goloka. Ones body and ones extended secondary consciousness cannot be separated because, they are one (the light is the cause of the darkness when out)

In the scientific technological atheistic world of the Spiritual primitive 21st century, there is no substance to the artificial transmitted 3D television singles broadcasted from the television studio or some computer anywhere on the planet, where as EVERYONES secondary consciousness (lower self) broadcasted from their perpetual bodily form in Goloka-Vrndavana is real but the ethereal and biological vessels the jiva-bhutah consciousness takes shelter of in the mahat-tattva, is subject to impermanence and decay.

Due to the temporary nature of the material universe or mahat-tattva, prompted by forgetfulness, the embodied jiva-bhutah sub-consciousness (contained in a biological body that is already previously contained in the ethereal vessel when first entering the mahat-tattva) sheds a lifeless phenomenon (dead organic matter), these thought-generated-containers provide originally by Maha-Vishnu, without the presents of the jiva-bhutah consciousness, eventually breaks down and expands the lifeless aspect of the material universe with fossilized dust, gases and sand that eventually become rocks, mountains, planets, moons, solar systems and galaxies over trillions of years however, the material universe or mahat-tattva is already build by Maha-Vishnu whom has already antisapated the desires, dreams and thoughts of the jiva-bhutah’s who dare enter His dreams. He sees everything. Past. Present and future, He Knows what the rebellious souls want before they even do, and has already built the mahat-tattva for them.

There are two kinds of sayujya-mukti: merging into the Brahman effulgence and merging into the personal body of the Lord. Merging into the Lord's body is even more abominable than merging into His effulgence. According to the opinion of the Mayavadi Vedantists, the living entity's ultimate success is to merge into the impersonal Brahman after being liberated from ethereal and biological vessels inside the dreams of Maha-Vishnu within the mahat-tattva cloud.

<st1:place w:st="on">Krishna</st1:place> is the source of both the Personal Goloka-Vrndavana realm and the less significant Impersonal mahat-tattva cloud.

The impersonal Brahman, or bodily effulgence of the Maha-Vishnu within the mahat-tattva, is known as Brahmaloka or Siddhaloka. According to the Brahma-samhita (5.40), yasya prabha prabhavato jagad-anda-koti: the material universes are generated from the bodily rays Maha-Vishnu. Some Impersonalist Yogis accept the form of Maha-Vishnu yet want to merge into the transcendental body of the Supreme Lord. That is their desire, however this is only possible within the mahat-tattva. Being the creator and facilitator of the mahat-tattva, Maha-Vishnu can easily allow many millions of living entities to merge their transmitted jiva-nikaya consciousness into His body.

The origin of everything is the Supreme Personality of Godhead, Bhagavan, and Maha-Vishnu is his expansion within the mahat-tattva, His bodily effulgence is known as the brahmajyoti, Brahmaloka or Siddhaloka. Thus Brahmaloka or Siddhaloka is a place where the jiva-nikaya ‘inactive’ consciousness appears as sparklike outside the dreams of Maha-Vishnu yet still within the mahat-tattva cloud. They exist total denial of their original authentic bodily form outside of the mahat-tattva cloud.

This jivatma-vigraha bodily Krishna Conscious form is the authentic constitutional position of all of <st1:place w:st="on">Krishna</st1:place>’s marginal potency or energy.

Thank you, you last thread has made your understanding clearer. I have read all your threads and can now comprehend what you are writing. All you are saying is that material science has created an alternative escape than what our physical body offers and all these computer games are only further making our society a Godless one.

I have no problem with what you are saying, which is, through the medium material science and technology, we are trying to create a further illusion than the one our souls are already in. Very interesting, but a very deep subject matter that very few can understand.