Was Narasimha avatar slain by Virbhadra?

[Vikram Ramsundar]

Guruvani Prabhu,

Now I am the one jabbing at you? One should learn the art of that from you. I am just a simple grhasti working in order to maintain my family and trying to hold on fast to Lord Krsna's lotus feet and doing the best I can to follow Mahaprabhu's teachings. It is true that I do not know you, and I have been all along respectful of you, even whilst denouncing what I thought were undesirable traits that you have been displaying here. You may not consider yourself a representative of Gaudiya Vaisnavism, but your posts reflect a Gaudiya point of view, and they certainly convey the message to outsiders that the rest of us wannabe followers of Gauranga are all ignorant fanatics and fundamentalists. As a fellow who reveres this given spiritual path, I simply cannot tolerate this. Besides, all my messages written in reply to your posts have been thoroughly civil, with your own customary filth like ass, orifice etc being conspicuously absent.

And for the umpteenth time, labelling others as sahajiya or whatever, no matter from whom you may have heard so, is indicative of a complete lack of acquaintance with the fathomless beauty of traditional Gaudiya Vaisnavism as far as I am concerned. I really hope and pray that, someday, you get the divine association of an advanced babaji or sevaite acarya of one of the old mandirs of the Lord's dhama, so that you can get a real taste of what Mahaprabhu came to give to the world.

It was never my intention to try to change you. I know that that is not possible just from reading your posts. I am just a little unhappy to see somebody revel in argumentation and conflict rather than harmony and inclusivism. A Vaisnava, even a lowly kanistha like myself, at least tries to be a friend to all living entities. And it should be borne in mind that someone coming and posting a few sentences that I take exception to does not mean that I lose all sense of composure and jump in headlong with fangs and claws extended. The world in which we live has too many problems already, and the last thing we need is a couple of Krsna fundamentalists around.

In any event, I think I have said enough. If you want to have the final say, please be my guest.

Radhe Radhe

[suchandra]

 

Guruvani Prabhu,

Now I am the one jabbing at you? One should learn the art of that from you. I am just a simple grhasti working in order to maintain my family and trying to hold on fast to Lord Krsna's lotus feet and doing the best I can to follow Mahaprabhu's teachings. It is true that I do not know you, and I have been all along respectful of you, even whilst denouncing what I thought were undesirable traits that you have been displaying here. You may not consider yourself a representative of Gaudiya Vaisnavism, but your posts reflect a Gaudiya point of view, and they certainly convey the message to outsiders that the rest of us wannabe followers of Gauranga are all ignorant fanatics and fundamentalists. As a fellow who reveres this given spiritual path, I simply cannot tolerate this. Besides, all my messages written in reply to your posts have been thoroughly civil, with your own customary filth like ass, orifice etc being conspicuously absent.

And for the umpteenth time, labelling others as sahajiya or whatever, no matter from whom you may have heard so, is indicative of a complete lack of acquaintance with the fathomless beauty of traditional Gaudiya Vaisnavism as far as I am concerned. I really hope and pray that, someday, you get the divine association of an advanced babaji or sevaite acarya of one of the old mandirs of the Lord's dhama, so that you can get a real taste of what Mahaprabhu came to give to the world.

It was never my intention to try to change you. I know that that is not possible just from reading your posts. I am just a little unhappy to see somebody revel in argumentation and conflict rather than harmony and inclusivism. A Vaisnava, even a lowly kanistha like myself, at least tries to be a friend to all living entities. And it should be borne in mind that someone coming and posting a few sentences that I take exception to does not mean that I lose all sense of composure and jump in headlong with fangs and claws extended. The world in which we live has too many problems already, and the last thing we need is a couple of Krsna fundamentalists around.

In any event, I think I have said enough. If you want to have the final say, please be my guest.

Radhe Radhe

 

Well thanks Vikram Ramsundar - me and many people consider like you, but we have to learn the lesson and understand that US Vaishnavas usually consider themselves as being the chosen people - although they want to preach to others they hardly consider others even as human being. Thats also called global US Imperialsimus infiltrated into Vaishnavism and we better learn to obey - just like Lord Vishnu advised the devas:

 

 

 

TRANSLATION

O demigods, fulfilling one's own interests is so important that one may even have to make a truce with one's enemies. For the sake of one's self-interest, one has to act according to the logic of the snake and the mouse.

 

 

 

 

 

PURPORT

A snake and a mouse were once caught in a basket. Now, since the mouse is food for the snake, this was a good opportunity for the snake. However, since both of them were caught in the basket, even if the snake ate the mouse, the snake would not be able to get out. Therefore, the snake thought it wise to make a truce with the mouse and ask the mouse to make a hole in the basket so that both of them could get out. The snake's intention was that after the mouse made the hole, the snake would eat the mouse and escape from the basket through the hole. This is called the logic of the snake and the mouse.

 

[Guest guest]

The story of Lord Narasimha played out many, many times during the life of this Brahma, what to speak of other Brahmas and other universes. Each time the story is a little different, for variety and particular needs of time and audience. Why would it not be possible that at one time Narasimha avatar got defeated by Lord Shiva's manifestation of Virabhadra? Virabhadra is actually a very auspicious name.

 

The sages are telling us innumerable stories for the purpose of making a particular point. It is not so much that the story itself is all-important - it is the purport of the story and the act of rememberance of Lord's pastimes that is all-important.

[Guruvani]

 

Guruvani Prabhu,

Now I am the one jabbing at you? One should learn the art of that from you. I am just a simple grhasti working in order to maintain my family and trying to hold on fast to Lord Krsna's lotus feet and doing the best I can to follow Mahaprabhu's teachings. It is true that I do not know you, and I have been all along respectful of you, even whilst denouncing what I thought were undesirable traits that you have been displaying here. You may not consider yourself a representative of Gaudiya Vaisnavism, but your posts reflect a Gaudiya point of view, and they certainly convey the message to outsiders that the rest of us wannabe followers of Gauranga are all ignorant fanatics and fundamentalists. As a fellow who reveres this given spiritual path, I simply cannot tolerate this. Besides, all my messages written in reply to your posts have been thoroughly civil, with your own customary filth like ass, orifice etc being conspicuously absent.

And for the umpteenth time, labelling others as sahajiya or whatever, no matter from whom you may have heard so, is indicative of a complete lack of acquaintance with the fathomless beauty of traditional Gaudiya Vaisnavism as far as I am concerned. I really hope and pray that, someday, you get the divine association of an advanced babaji or sevaite acarya of one of the old mandirs of the Lord's dhama, so that you can get a real taste of what Mahaprabhu came to give to the world.

It was never my intention to try to change you. I know that that is not possible just from reading your posts. I am just a little unhappy to see somebody revel in argumentation and conflict rather than harmony and inclusivism. A Vaisnava, even a lowly kanistha like myself, at least tries to be a friend to all living entities. And it should be borne in mind that someone coming and posting a few sentences that I take exception to does not mean that I lose all sense of composure and jump in headlong with fangs and claws extended. The world in which we live has too many problems already, and the last thing we need is a couple of Krsna fundamentalists around.

In any event, I think I have said enough. If you want to have the final say, please be my guest.

Radhe Radhe

 

Like I already said, try not to get too personal and get off on any crusade to correct what it is you don't like about my character.

 

I have been on these internet forums for over 5 years and I have never come upon such a whiner and complainer as you.

 

As if you Hindus are all one big happy family?

As far as worship of Lord Shiva or any other demigods is concerned, well maybe you should scold Lord Krishna for being so critical when he says:

 

kāmais tais tair hṛta-jñānāḥ

prapadyante 'nya-devatāḥ

taḿ taḿ niyamam āsthāya

prakṛtyā niyatāḥ svayā

 

 

TRANSLATION

Those whose intelligence has been stolen by material desires surrender unto demigods and follow the particular rules and regulations of worship according to their own natures.

 

 

 

 

As stated in the Bhāgavatam (2.3.10):

 

 

akāmaḥ sarva-kāmo vā

mokṣa-kāma udāra-dhīḥ

tīvreṇa bhakti-yogena

yajeta puruṣaḿ param

 

Less intelligent people who have lost their spiritual sense take shelter of demigods for immediate fulfillment of material desires. Generally, such people do not go to the Supreme Personality of Godhead, because they are in the lower modes of nature (ignorance and passion) and therefore worship various demigods. Following the rules and regulations of worship, they are satisfied. The worshipers of demigods are motivated by small desires and do not know how to reach the supreme goal, but a devotee of the Supreme Lord is not misguided. Because in Vedic literature there are recommendations for worshiping different gods for different purposes (e.g., a diseased man is recommended to worship the sun), those who are not devotees of the Lord think that for certain purposes demigods are better than the Supreme Lord. But a pure devotee knows that the Supreme Lord Kṛṣṇa is the master of all. In the Caitanya-caritāmṛta (Ādi 5.142) it is said, ekale īśvara kṛṣṇa, āra saba bhṛtya: only the Supreme Personality of Godhead, Kṛṣṇa, is master, and all others are servants. Therefore a pure devotee never goes to demigods for satisfaction of his material needs. He depends on the Supreme Lord. And the pure devotee is satisfied with whatever He gives.

 

 

 

 

Just see!

That Lord Krishna is such an extremist fanatic?

 

 

 

Why is he talking so harshly about the demigod worshipers?

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

[Guest guest]

Very easy Guruvani prabhu ... all you got to do is look in the mirror!!!

 

 

I have been on these internet forums for over 5 years and I have never come upon such a whiner and complainer as you.

[Guruvani]

 

Very easy Guruvani prabhu ... all you got to do is look in the mirror!!!

 

I don't whine and complain.

I debate issues and I always present shastric references to support my viewpoints.

 

This topic isn't about me.

 

Can we get out of each others backside and get back to the topic at hand?

[Guest guest]

Actually, Virabhadra is much more than just some powerful demon called up from the netherworld by Lord Shiva. Even Bhagavatam clearly states that:

"Maitreya continued: My dear Vidura, that black person was the personified anger of the Supreme Personality of Godhead, and he was prepared to execute the orders of Lord Siva."

 

This is an interesting topic worth exploring for both Shivaites and Vaishnavas. There is much more to this story than meets the eye. There are even temples devoted to Lord Virabhadra in India. All this animosity between Shiva and Vishnu bhaktas is just misguided partisanship.

[Guruvani]

Well, the Shaivas don't have any monopoly on Siva worship.

The Gaudiya Vaishnavas worship Lord Siva in his form as Sri Advaita Acharya.

 

So, the Gaudiyas worship Lord Siva in his most cherished position as a devotee of Sri Krishna Chaitanya Mahaprabhu.

 

Sri Krishna Chaitanya Prabhu Nityananda Sri Advaita Gadadhar Srivasadi Gaura bhakta vrinda

 

 

It is said that during the advent of Lord Caitanya, Sadāśiva appeared as Advaita Prabhu, and Advaita Prabhu's chief concern was to elevate the fallen conditioned souls to the platform of devotional service to Lord Kṛṣṇa. Since people were engaged in useless occupations which would continue their material existence, Lord Śiva, in the form of Lord Advaita, appealed to the Supreme Lord to appear as Lord Caitanya to deliver these illusioned souls. Actually Lord Caitanya appeared on the request of Lord Advaita. Similarly, Lord Śiva has a sampradāya, the Rudra-sampradāya. He is always thinking about the deliverance of the fallen souls, as exhibited by Lord Advaita Prabhu.

[Guruvani]

Srila Prabhupada:

 

Lord Śiva is called yogīśvara, the master of all yogīs, and Kṛṣṇa is also called yogeśvara. Yogīśvara indicates that no one can surpass the yoga practice of Lord Śiva, and yogeśvara indicates that no one can surpass the yogic perfection of Kṛṣṇa.

[Guruvani]

Srila Prabhupada:

 

Although Lord Brahmā had received very respectful obeisances from Lord Śiva, he knew that Lord Śiva was in a more exalted position than himself. Lord Śiva's position is described in Brahma-saḿhitā: there is no difference between Lord Viṣṇu and Lord Śiva in their original positions, but still Lord Śiva is different from Lord Viṣṇu. The example is given that the milk in yogurt is not different from the original milk from which it was made.

[Guruvani]

Lord Brahma prays to Lord Siva:

 

Śrīmad Bhāgavatam 4.6.46na vai satāḿ tvac-caraṇārpitātmanāḿ

bhūteṣu sarveṣv abhipaśyatāḿ tava

bhūtāni cātmany apṛthag-didṛkṣatāḿ

prāyeṇa roṣo 'bhibhaved yathā paśum

SYNONYMS

na — not; vai — but; satām — of the devotees; tvat-caraṇa-arpita-ātmanām — of those who are completely surrendered at your lotus feet; bhūteṣu — among living entities; sarveṣu — all varieties; abhipaśyatām — perfectly seeing; tava — your; bhūtāni — living entities; ca — and; ātmani — in the Supreme; apṛthak — nondifferent; didṛkṣatām — those who see like that; prāyeṇa — almost always; roṣaḥ — anger; abhibhavet — takes place; yathā — exactly like; paśum — the animals.

TRANSLATION

My dear Lord, devotees who have fully dedicated their lives unto your lotus feet certainly observe your presence as Paramātmā in each and every being, and as such they do not differentiate between one living being and another. Such persons treat all living entities equally. They never become overwhelmed by anger like animals, who can see nothing without differentiation.

 

 

Lord Siva is non-different than the Paramatma in the hearts of all living entities.

[Murali_Mohan_das]

 

Guruvaniji,

 

Do you agree with me that your behaviour falls short of what Mahaprabhu demanded of practitioners in His line? You certainly cannot claim to be evincing tolerance and humility.

Vikram Prabhu. I like what you have to say very much. Also, you are not immune (nor am I) to "superior-itis".

 

Perhaps there is more than one Vikram Ramsundar, but this appears to be you apologizing for picking a fistfight with another visitor to these forums:

 

http://www.indiadivine.org/audarya/spiritual-discussions/443119-lord-shiva-son-brahma-3.html?highlight=ramsundar

 

 

Guest 3, just to get back to one of your many, idiotic remarks full of sarcasm, which do demonstrate how perfected a soul you are for sure - regarding getting pissed off, I reserve that right to myself, and at the tender age of 33, I consider that to be quite normal.

Here you are, apparently, speaking not so kindly (from the same page):

 

 

This is an open forum in which everybody can take part. Who cares to whom you were replying? And trust me, buddy, you don't wanna confront me on a battlefield, because if you were to do so, you wouldn't have your feet on which to stand anymore. By the way, your words sound like those of a eunuch to me. At least I have the guts to write my own name prior to posting, and not hide behind a bland, unimaginative username like Guest 3!

Now, my body is only a year older than yours, but I pray I never use my age as an excuse for acting like a boor (I have plenty of other excuses ).

 

Let us both refrain from deluding ourselves into believing that our (meager) intelligence and knowledge somewhow grant us superiority over those with less of those qualities (or simply a different type of intelligence or knowledge).

 

Keep on speaking truth, Prabhu, in as (genuinely) humble manner as possible.

[radhagovind]

I read some great responses and they do help clear things up a bit. But the puranas may have been altered as someone said. I also read the shiv puran was recited by discipline of sri veda vyas and the discipline was later killed by sri balarama in srimad bhagavatam for bad deeds.

I look at what the lord himself said about himself in the Bhagavad Gita. SHri Krishna says he is the supreme truth with no truth above him. he also describes himself as neverborn, controller of all things, and who expands into everything. So i look at this and see tha he can't be lying to Arjun. In mahabharat, it also says Shri Krishna was speaking to TIME as well as Arjun to address questions of future generations. All the puranas are confusing even though writen by 1 person, that means they have been altered but Krishna (also known as hari, vishnu, rama) is the supreme truth.

[Guest guest]

i really feel sorry when i see vaishnavas fight......especially over scriptures......because if you can go about doing your duties ...stick to satvik food only....chant the mantras given by guru...with pure love and a sense of surrender....without arguing ..without trying to proove anything .....and at the same time not getting disturbed.......by others..then you will know things by experience........and then you will know for sure what is true and what not.....until that time better to do ones daily duties both material and spiritual.....rather doing everything for krishna will make everything spiritual.....

 

since we have come to the topic of shiva....one of his names is 'neelkantha'..

which means one who has a blue throat....his throat turned blue when he swollowed the ocean of poison..what is this poison ?it is the the hatred and insults we face in the world........shiva is lord krishnas expansion ...and the fact is that there indeed is tamas in the material world for materialistic souls to carry out their tamasic activities...so some form of krishna must act as a tamasic diety ...and krishna in his expansion as shiva takes all the blame ....of being a tamasic diety....but remember the messege of neelkanta....he keeps the poison in his throat......he neither takes it in ..or gives it out ........for if we take the poison in (hatred and insults)..we get hurt and depressed and miserable...if we give it out then we end up hurting others.........so whats the solution ......? shiva holds the poison in his throat by the constant chant of ram nama.............i am not sure about this and i dont remember the verse .........but i believe i read some where that the bhagavatam states that one who distinguishes between vishnu and shiva goes to the hell called raurava........but i personally never felt the need to confirm this....it doesnt matter....if your mind finds pleasure at govindas feet ...then why should it loose it while hearing or discussing about shiva.....?and if the pleasure and peace of mind is lost what use is such discussion......life is short ..time flies.....first i want to meet krishna in this life ..then if i have time i'll worry about scripture .......if someone wants to talk about linga purana i just igonre it.......but i dont like to see vaishnavas loose their peace over it......

[Vikram Ramsundar]

Guruvani being a hopeless case who draws practically all he knows about Sanatana Dharma from the half-baked version of Vaisnavism that ISKCON's founder presented to the Western world, I shall not waste one single more word trying to get him to shed some of his extreme bigotry.

 

I am rather more interested in what Murali_Mohan_das Prabhu wrote. Of course, his criticism of me is valid and welcome. Thank you for reminding me of my fallen position, Prabhu. I pray that sincere persons like yourself keep doing that so that I always remain on my guard and never let false pride and its associated negative qualities fill my head. What I wrote to Guest 3 on the other thread was a disgrace, and I am certainly not proud of the words I used then. If you scroll down to the last post of the thread in question, you will see that I repented for being such a boor (to use your own words), and thanked HariShibdas Prabhu profusely for imparting a few very valuable instructions to me. To Guest 3's credit, he did write a brief message also apologising for letting things get out of hand. However, I notice that his message has been deleted for whatever reason. This is plainly disingenuous of the part of the moderators. At the very least, it shows that there are many pseudo-devotees posing as Vaisnavas in contemporary society.

 

Radhe Radhe

[Vikram Ramsundar]

In any event, if my words have offended anybody, I offer my heartfelt apologies. Please forgive my ignorance. I have written quite a bit on humility - now is the time for me to show that this is a virtue that is present to a minor extent in my personality, not just an idea I have read or heard about from somebody whom I consider to be authoritative.

 

My apologies to one and all.

 

From a Kali-yuga patita,

Vikram Ramsundar

[Vikram Ramsundar]

Just to get back to the subject matter under discussion here. For me, the posts of Jahnava Nitai Prabhu best illustrate how to go about comprehending parts of sastra that can be a source of confusion. It is clear that he is an experienced devotee with a lot of service to his credit, as opposed to the many self-appointed scholars who spend most of their time sitting in ivory towers and reading books.

 

I think the example of Ranchor Krsna aptly demonstrates this point. Was Vasudeva scared of Jarasandha when he left Mathura and settled with the Yadavas in Dvaravati? Obviously not. But still the Lord found it appropriate to act in the way he did and thereby earned the appellation Ranchor.

 

We need to view the Narasingha Bhagavan/Virabhadra story in the same light. By the way, I too consider this incident to be fictitious. In the instance that there is some truth to it, there exists certainly an explanation somewhere which does not affect Lord Narasingha's divinity and at the same time preserves the rationale behind this inclusion in scripture.

[Murali_Mohan_das]

Thank you Prabhu, for taking my words as they were intended. I also beg you to do the same for me (to quote a Red Hot Chili Peppers song, "If you see me getting mighty, If you see me getting high, Knock me down, I'm not bigger than life"). No doubt, I am a far greater offender than most.

 

We are both young (in these bodies). I pray our elders forgive our occasional youthful petulance. I also hope they see that, despite our relative lack of experience, we may, at times, have valuable contributions to make to the discussions here (call it wisdom born of naivete, if you will).

 

To quote another song (CSNY):

 

 

And you, of tender years,

Can't know the fears that your elders grew by,

And so please help them with your youth,

They seek the truth before they can die.

 

Teach your parents well,

Their children's hell will slowly go by,

And feed them on your dreams

The one they picked, the one you'll know by.

 

Don't you ever ask them why, if they told you, you would cry,

So just look at them and sigh and know they love you.

Truly, you exhibit great learning and comprehension of what you have learned. I'm happy you have chosen to stick around and join the forum!

 

I wish you all health, happiness, and facility on your spiritual journey!

 

Nitai Gauranga!!

 

 

Guruvani being a hopeless case who draws practically all he knows about Sanatana Dharma from the half-baked version of Vaisnavism that ISKCON's founder presented to the Western world, I shall not waste one single more word trying to get him to shed some of his extreme bigotry.

 

I am rather more interested in what Murali_Mohan_das Prabhu wrote. Of course, his criticism of me is valid and welcome. Thank you for reminding me of my fallen position, Prabhu. I pray that sincere persons like yourself keep doing that so that I always remain on my guard and never let false pride and its associated negative qualities fill my head. What I wrote to Guest 3 on the other thread was a disgrace, and I am certainly not proud of the words I used then. If you scroll down to the last post of the thread in question, you will see that I repented for being such a boor (to use your own words), and thanked HariShibdas Prabhu profusely for imparting a few very valuable instructions to me. To Guest 3's credit, he did write a brief message also apologising for letting things get out of hand. However, I notice that his message has been deleted for whatever reason. This is plainly disingenuous of the part of the moderators. At the very least, it shows that there are many pseudo-devotees posing as Vaisnavas in contemporary society.

 

Radhe Radhe

[Murali_Mohan_das]

Maybe, when he said "half-baked", Vikram Prabhu meant something like Papa Murphy's "take and bake" pizza, where one takes the uncooked pizza home, puts it in their own oven and bakes it to perfection. Wouldn't that be a fair characterization of what Srila Prabhupada did? He gave us the raw materials in hopes that we would bake them to perfection with our sadhana and sadhu-sanga.

 

The terminology used by Vikram-ji may be offensive to some, but, certainly no one would contest if it was phrased like so: Srila Prabhupada presented the sweetest conception of Divinity to his Western disciples in a manner which might be comprehensible to them given their particular conditioning. He gave them everything they needed if not everything that exists.

 

 

So really it's not just me that your venom and hatred is aimed at.

You also have the audacity to presume to know better than the siddha Maha-Bhagavat.

 

Like they say:" A fool goes undetected as long as he doesn't speak, but as soon as he speaks his ignorance is exposed".

 

Vikram babu has shown the darkness that haunts his own soul with his foolish criticism of an empowered acharya who is actually svarup-siddha.

 

A rotten grhamedhi like Vikram certainly has no position to be making such critical assessments of AN ACHARYA.

 

Such filthy talk as that is simply the babbling of an asura.

 

Half-baked version of Sanatan-Dharma?

 

As if India isn't the empire of pseudo-gurus, swamis and yogis?

 

Most Hindus in India are so confused and befuddled with the kaleidoscope of bogus avatars that they don't know Sanatan Dharma from a hole in the ground.

 

In India there is an avatar on every street corner begging for a rupee.

 

Trying to find a Hindu that knows Sanatan Dharma is like trying to find a needle in a haystack.

[Vikram Ramsundar]

 

Maybe, when he said "half-baked", Vikram Prabhu meant something like Papa Murphy's "take and bake" pizza, where one takes the uncooked pizza home, puts it in their own oven and bakes it to perfection. Wouldn't that be a fair characterization of what Srila Prabhupada did? He gave us the raw materials in hopes that we would bake them to perfection with our sadhana and sadhu-sanga.

 

The terminology used by Vikram-ji may be offensive to some, but, certainly no one would contest if it was phrased like so: Srila Prabhupada presented the sweetest conception of Divinity to his Western disciples in a manner which might be comprehensible to them given their particular conditioning. He gave them everything they needed if not everything that exists.

 

 

That is in essence what my drift was, Murali_Mohan_das Prabhu. Let those with the capacity to understand nuance understand. Whose soul is haunted by darkness is clearly visible to any objective reader who goes through the posts on this thread. I wish you all the best in your life and sadhana too. Let us both focus on what really matters instead of frittering valuable time with cry-babies who have to resort to name-calling and mud-slinging at every turn, and make them feel in the least bit important. How useless and meaningless their existences are is out here for all to see.

 

My humble obeisances to you for exemplifying good Vaisnava etiquette so nicely.

 

Radhe Radhe

[Vikram Ramsundar]

 

So really it's not just me that your venom and hatred is aimed at.

You also have the audacity to presume to know better than the siddha Maha-Bhagavat.

 

Like they say:" A fool goes undetected as long as he doesn't speak, but as soon as he speaks his ignorance is exposed".

 

Vikram babu has shown the darkness that haunts his own soul with his foolish criticism of an empowered acharya who is actually svarup-siddha.

 

A rotten grhamedhi like Vikram certainly has no position to be making such critical assessments of AN ACHARYA.

 

 

Guruvani or whatever your real name is, take a good look into the depraved depths of your own hopelessly fallen self before you get on your high horse whenever somebody says something that touches your chord. If an award could be given for committing the most Vaisnava-aparadha on these forums, you would win it hands down. You have yourself said the most nonsensical absurdities about more than one very senior Vaisnava acaryas who are from Gaudiya lines other than the one you profess to follow. These devotees are in fact situated on an infinitely higher platform than your own lowly being and there is way more Krsna consciousness in their toenails than in anything you have ever done in your miserable, pathetic existence. As far as I am concerned, my initial introduction to Radha-Krsna was via the beautiful teachings of Srila A.C. Bhaktivedanta Swami Prabhupada, and I shall remain forever extremely grateful to His Divine Grace for that. I was simply making a specific point by painting a nuanced view of his amazing preaching pastimes, and if you could not read in between my lines properly, blame your own intelligence for it.

 

 

 

Such filthy talk as that is simply the babbling of an asura.

 

Half-baked version of Sanatan-Dharma?

 

As if India isn't the empire of pseudo-gurus, swamis and yogis?

 

Most Hindus in India are so confused and befuddled with the kaleidoscope of bogus avatars that they don't know Sanatan Dharma from a hole in the ground.

 

In India there is an avatar on every street corner begging for a rupee.

 

Trying to find a Hindu that knows Sanatan Dharma is like trying to find a needle in a haystack.

 

Let the decision about who has the more asuric tendencies be made at another level. To quote yourself in a previous message, your own opinion is worth nothing more than the posterior of a rat, so evidently nothing that emanates from your end should be taken seriously, not by me nor by anybody else.

 

Concerning the other part of your post, no, you are right, nobody knows anything about anything. We should all turn to Guruvani for guidance. How about that? Feeling elated now? Regarding filth, it actually appears that YOU are on these forums principally to smirch dirt around. You cannot discuss one issue rationally without at some point emitting obscene vulgarities, slinging personal insults and using garbage language that certainly does not belong here. I think that the readers are intelligent enough to discriminate between gentlemanly conduct and thuggish hectoring. Let them give their verdict.

 

Lastly, I have only myself to blame for allowing this worthless war of words with an ill-mannered fellow like you gather momentum. I have been expending my valuable time uselessly and stupidly, and this is only proving detrimental to my consciousness and progression in Krsna-bhakti. I seriously have to check this harmful proclivity to want to reply to any valueless piece that gets posted. This is deleterious to myself more than to any other person. I have definitely given you much, much more of my time than was warranted.

 

In any event, I have no personal enmity with you, and since you obviously love Lord Krsna and Srila Prabhupada a lot, like I do for that matter, I pray that They shower some of Their blessings on both of us, so that we both become more knowledgeable and advanced souls than we are at present.

 

I wish you the best in your secular life and devotional practice.

 

Radhe Radhe

[Guruvani]

 

 

Lastly, I have only myself to blame for allowing this worthless war of words with an ill-mannered fellow like you gather momentum.

Finally, we agree on something.

I don't know how long you have been around forums like this one, but in the 5 years that I have been posting on forums I have learned that you have to be thick skinned and able to tolerate insult and abuse from others.

 

If you can't take the heat, stay out of the kitchen.

 

We all have our opinions and many times we disagree with others on many different religious beliefs and sentiments.

 

so, you can't get too personal and get off on personal crusades to insult or correct other people.

 

I argue and disgree with people all the time, but I don't waste my time in trying to get too personal and attack them personally and correct them.

 

Let's just stick to the issues and discuss and debate things without taking it to the level of personal insults and accusations.

 

If you want to get all personal and attack and insult everyone who has a different view than yours, then you probably don't belong on forums where argument and disagreement is the principle staple of the diet.

[Guest guest]

Vikram prabhu ... I agree with everything you said about Guruvani.

 

I seriously think Guruvani needs psychiatric help. Too much bitterness and envy to the point that it drives one crazy.

 

 

Guruvani or whatever your real name is, take a good look into the depraved depths of your own hopelessly fallen self before you get on your high horse whenever somebody says something that touches your chord. If an award could be given for committing the most Vaisnava-aparadha on these forums, you would win it hands down. You have yourself said the most nonsensical absurdities about more than one very senior Vaisnava acaryas who are from Gaudiya lines other than the one you profess to follow. These devotees are in fact situated on an infinitely higher platform than your own lowly being and there is way more Krsna consciousness in their toenails than in anything you have ever done in your miserable, pathetic existence. As far as I am concerned, my initial introduction to Radha-Krsna was via the beautiful teachings of Srila A.C. Bhaktivedanta Swami Prabhupada, and I shall remain forever extremely grateful to His Divine Grace for that. I was simply making a specific point by painting a nuanced view of his amazing preaching pastimes, and if you could not read in between my lines properly, blame your own intelligence for it.

 

 

 

 

Let the decision about who has the more asuric tendencies be made at another level. To quote yourself in a previous message, your own opinion is worth nothing more than the posterior of a rat, so evidently nothing that emanates from your end should be taken seriously, not by me nor by anybody else.

 

Concerning the other part of your post, no, you are right, nobody knows anything about anything. We should all turn to Guruvani for guidance. How about that? Feeling elated now? Regarding filth, it actually appears that YOU are on these forums principally to smirch dirt around. You cannot discuss one issue rationally without at some point emitting obscene vulgarities, slinging personal insults and using garbage language that certainly does not belong here. I think that the readers are intelligent enough to discriminate between gentlemanly conduct and thuggish hectoring. Let them give their verdict.

 

Lastly, I have only myself to blame for allowing this worthless war of words with an ill-mannered fellow like you gather momentum. I have been expending my valuable time uselessly and stupidly, and this is only proving detrimental to my consciousness and progression in Krsna-bhakti. I seriously have to check this harmful proclivity to want to reply to any valueless piece that gets posted. This is deleterious to myself more than to any other person. I have definitely given you much, much more of my time than was warranted.

 

In any event, I have no personal enmity with you, and since you obviously love Lord Krsna and Srila Prabhupada a lot, like I do for that matter, I pray that They shower some of Their blessings on both of us, so that we both become more knowledgeable and advanced souls than we are at present.

 

I wish you the best in your secular life and devotional practice.

 

Radhe Radhe

[Guest guest]

Vikram prabhu ... I agree with everything you said about Guruvani.

 

I seriously think Guruvani needs psychiatric help. Too much bitterness and envy to the point that it drives him crazy.

 

 

Guruvani or whatever your real name is, take a good look into the depraved depths of your own hopelessly fallen self before you get on your high horse whenever somebody says something that touches your chord. If an award could be given for committing the most Vaisnava-aparadha on these forums, you would win it hands down. You have yourself said the most nonsensical absurdities about more than one very senior Vaisnava acaryas who are from Gaudiya lines other than the one you profess to follow. These devotees are in fact situated on an infinitely higher platform than your own lowly being and there is way more Krsna consciousness in their toenails than in anything you have ever done in your miserable, pathetic existence. As far as I am concerned, my initial introduction to Radha-Krsna was via the beautiful teachings of Srila A.C. Bhaktivedanta Swami Prabhupada, and I shall remain forever extremely grateful to His Divine Grace for that. I was simply making a specific point by painting a nuanced view of his amazing preaching pastimes, and if you could not read in between my lines properly, blame your own intelligence for it.

 

 

 

 

Let the decision about who has the more asuric tendencies be made at another level. To quote yourself in a previous message, your own opinion is worth nothing more than the posterior of a rat, so evidently nothing that emanates from your end should be taken seriously, not by me nor by anybody else.

 

Concerning the other part of your post, no, you are right, nobody knows anything about anything. We should all turn to Guruvani for guidance. How about that? Feeling elated now? Regarding filth, it actually appears that YOU are on these forums principally to smirch dirt around. You cannot discuss one issue rationally without at some point emitting obscene vulgarities, slinging personal insults and using garbage language that certainly does not belong here. I think that the readers are intelligent enough to discriminate between gentlemanly conduct and thuggish hectoring. Let them give their verdict.

 

Lastly, I have only myself to blame for allowing this worthless war of words with an ill-mannered fellow like you gather momentum. I have been expending my valuable time uselessly and stupidly, and this is only proving detrimental to my consciousness and progression in Krsna-bhakti. I seriously have to check this harmful proclivity to want to reply to any valueless piece that gets posted. This is deleterious to myself more than to any other person. I have definitely given you much, much more of my time than was warranted.

 

In any event, I have no personal enmity with you, and since you obviously love Lord Krsna and Srila Prabhupada a lot, like I do for that matter, I pray that They shower some of Their blessings on both of us, so that we both become more knowledgeable and advanced souls than we are at present.

 

I wish you the best in your secular life and devotional practice.

 

Radhe Radhe

[Vikram Ramsundar]

 

Vikram prabhu ... I agree with everything you said about Guruvani.

 

I seriously think Guruvani needs psychiatric help. Too much bitterness and envy to the point that it drives him crazy.

 

 

 

Haribol Prabhu

 

Let us put an end to all this madness, and prove ourselves worthy of the mercy of Srimati Radharani and Guru-tattva. We cannot eliminate sectarianism by behaving fanatically ourselves. It is for Krsna and Mahaprabhu to decide who is deserving of receiving their attention.

 

Sri Sri Guru Gaurangau Jayatah