Comparison of Jesus-Krishna Preachings

[dattaswami]

Comparison of Jesus-Krishna Preachings

 

The Divine preaching of Holy Jesus is the top most Gospel in the world and touches the climax of the truth. For example Holy Krishna says in Gita that one should withdraw himself from the family bonds slowly like a tortoise withdrawing its limbs (Kurmo ngaaneeva). The tradition of Datta is to cut the family bonds by the Sword of Knowledge as per Gita (Jnanaasi natmanah). But Holy Jesus says that one should hate these family bonds to become His disciple. Cutting the bond is Zero. Existing in the bond is Plus and hating the bond is Minus. Zero is near to Plus and Minus is very far. So if you cut the bond it may form again. But if you hate the bond the bond will never be formed so that the bond with the Lord alone is eternal.

See the preaching of Lord Jesus with impartial attitude and without conservatism. After all a diamond is diamond whether it is foreign diamond or Indian diamond. Thus Holy Jesus is the king of all the divine preachers. He is like the Sun from whom these divine sentences radiate like rays. Holy Bible speaks about the everlasting fire and that the souls have no rebirth. Hindu scriptures say that the soul has rebirth. Both these can be convinced and co-related. The condemned souls enter the everlasting fire, which means that these souls take the births as animals, birds, worms etc, which are like the fire due to the continuous agony. The word “everlasting” means that once the soul enters into the cycle of these births the soul will never come back to the human birth. The rebirth as a human being as told in the Hindu scriptures can be again co-related with the Holy Bible.

Holy Jesus says that the <st1:place w:st="on"><st1>Kingdom</st1> of <st1>God</st1></st1:place>is extended into this world. The meaning of this is that whenever God comes in human form to stay with us (Immanuel), the disciples of the Lord will be staying in this divine Kingdom on the throwns equally with the Lord. This means the servants of the Lord will take rebirth as human beings and will be preaching here and they will be respected like God. For Ex: The Holy Pope is given the status of God. The Holy Pope and other such top most Bishops and pious Fathers who are indulged in the propagation of the knowledge will get the status of God here itself in this world. Thus, the inner sense is the same in all the scriptures, which is spoken in different ways. The ways are different but the real essence is the same.

The aim of human life is to achieve the grace that is the love of God. Even if you earn more money you are not carrying it after death. Very little money is sufficient to eat and drink which the animals and the birds are also doing even without money. If the aim of the money is only eating, drinking and enjoying, you will be born as animal or bird or worm in the next birth. If your file is opened in the upper world you will not get definitely the human birth. When you serve the Lord in this world when He comes in the human form then only you can get human birth without any enquiry in order to serve the Lord when the Lord reincarnates. You must recognize the Lord by His knowledge, because Veda says that knowledge is Brahman.

Only miracles are not the signs since demons also performed miracles. Gita says that the Lord comes down in human form (Maanusheem tanu masritam). Gita also says that it is very difficult to worship formless (Avyaktahi). Gita also says that if one worships the inert statue, he will be born as a stone (Bhutejya yanti Bhutani). So you must serve the Lord by doing practical service which consists of 1) Sacrifice of work 2) Sacrifice of fruit of work (money), which is also a form of work. The Sacrifice must be to the full extent. When a beggar gives one rupee that is greater than one lakh given by a multi lakhier because the beggar has sacrificed whatever he possessed. Holy Jesus appreciated one old lady who donated whatever she possessed, as the highest divine soul.

[gHari]

Quoted from above: "But Holy Jesus says that one should hate these family bonds to become His disciple.'

 

I don't remember this anywhere.

 

We should give up everything and seek the Kingdom of God. That is what he said, over and over, everywhere, in every town and village - what he said he was sent to preach. Please don't pretend such great respect and then just use Jesus for your games.

[Murali_Mohan_das]

 

Quoted from above: "But Holy Jesus says that one should hate these family bonds to become His disciple.'

 

I don't remember this anywhere.

 

We should give up everything and seek the Kingdom of God. That is what he said, over and over, everywhere, in every town and village - what he said he was sent to preach. Please don't pretend such great respect and then just use Jesus for your games.

 

This new friend of ours is the most dangerous type of person--he/she has great learning but not-so-great understanding, it seems. Divine truth is all mixed in with pure speculation in his/her posts.

 

I have plenty of speculations myself, but I try to present my speculations as such and not as Divine Wisdom passed to me through the saints of the ages.

[dattaswami]

 

Quoted from above: "But Holy Jesus says that one should hate these family bonds to become His disciple.'

 

I don't remember this anywhere.

 

We should give up everything and seek the Kingdom of God. That is what he said, over and over, everywhere, in every town and village - what he said he was sent to preach. Please don't pretend such great respect and then just use Jesus for your games.

 

gHari;

 

Thanks for your interst in spiritual knowledge and the true way to GOD. You are bound in this world by family bonds and other worldly bonds like wealth etc. Salvation means having only one bond with Lord. You cannot have bond with invisible God. Invisible God comes in visible form as human incarnation for your service.

 

Now let us examine why Lord jesus told to hate the family bonds;

 

Luke—<st1:time minute="26" hour="14" w:st="on">14:26</st1:time> to 27

“If any one comes to Me and does not hate his father and mother, wife and children, brothers and sisters, yes, and his own life also, he cannot be my disciple’’.

The knowledge is compared to a sword. Bhagavatgita says “Chhitva Jnanasinatmanah”. This means that the ignorance should be cut by the knowledge, which is like a sword. The bonds with wife or husband and children are due to ignorance. Such bonds should break when the Lord in human form competes with them to conduct His test. Lord comes in human form in every human generation to preach and give His direct presence. If the Lord comes in only one human generation, God becomes partial to that human generation because other human generations are not blessed with such opportunity. To see, to touch, to talk and to live with the human incarnation, He comes down as per the prayers of the devotees. The Lord comes to preach and so He will not enter the statues or animals or birds. Veda says “Na tasya pratima <st1:place w:st="on"><st1:City w:st="on">asti</st1:City></st1:place>’’ which means that God will not enter the inert statues.

Gita says “Manusheem tanu masritam” which means that God enters the human body only because the main purpose is to preach the human beings. Gita strongly says that he who worships the inert statues will be born as an inert stone (“Bhootani yanti”). The Christians should be commended on this point who are worshipping the Holy Jesus only, who is the most powerful human incarnation of God. Veda says “Na tat samah” which means that nobody and nothing should be equal to the Lord in human incarnation. One should leave everything and everybody for the sake of the Lord in human form. Only the bond with a new human being can break the bond with the human beings. Such new human being must be very powerful who can be only God in human form.

A new bond existing with formless God or statues cannot break the human bonds. Only the bond with another living being can cut the bond with the living beings. The bond with formless God is impossible. The bond with inert statue has no use. The above statements of Holy Jesus indicate that one should cut the bonds with his family and with the wealth. In Hindu religion also it is said that God (Datta) cuts all the bonds of family and wealth (“Dattam Chinnam”). Even the bond with the body should be cut for the sake of the God. Gita says the same thing as “Mat Gata Pranah”. Holy Jesus says that one has to carry his own cross (death) for the sake of the Lord. This means that one has to invite his own death with his own hands for the sake of God. Holy Jesus did like this as an ideal example for others. This means that you have to cut your bonds not only with your family and wealth but also with your life if necessary.

Hanuman, a top devotee, tore his heart with his own nails for the sake of the Lord and was blessed by the Lord to be immortal. So when the devotee sacrifices his life, his life gets protected forever. The essence of this gospel is that the love is proved only by the practical sacrifice. Veda says “Dhanena Tyage nyke…” which means that sacrifice of money proves the real love.

Money is the fruit of the work. So money is another form of work. If it is inconvenient to sacrifice the money, atleast they should sacrifice the other form of money, which is work for the sake of God. Depending on the money all the family members are attached to you. If money is not there all the family will leave you. You are also giving the money to your family only. Therefore if the bond with money is cut and if the money is sacrificed to God, the family bonds are considered as vanished, even though the family exists externally. The work of God in human form is the propagation of His divine gospel. For doing such divine work the family also stands as an obstacle because most of your energy is diverted for the family only. Therefore you do not have any energy to work for the sake of Lord.

Hence Holy Jesus wants His disciples to leave their families for the sake of God. The propagation work needs both money and work. Generally every body works to maintain his family. In the name of maintenance, several luxuries are introduced, which look like essential needs and thus there is no end for your work to earn the money for the sake of your body and your family. Your blindness increases and you will be putting more and more efforts to work and earn money for the sake of the family bonds. In such a case you can never even see the human form of God. At least you should remove your blindness by the divine knowledge if not the actual bonds. People of very high devotion only can cut the actual bonds. You are giving money to your family but you are giving words to God by prayers and you are giving mind to God through meditation.

You are giving love to your family through your work and money, you are calling the sacrifice of words and sacrifice of mind as love to God and you are fooling the God. Your real love is only with your family and not with the God. Holy Jesus tests your real love to God by these statements. The Christian Pope and fathers and the Hindu Acharya and saints left their families and concentrated completely on the work of God. Such pious souls can only be representatives of God in this world.

[dattaswami]

 

This new friend of ours is the most dangerous type of person--he/she has great learning but not-so-great understanding, it seems. Divine truth is all mixed in with pure speculation in his/her posts.

 

I have plenty of speculations myself, but I try to present my speculations as such and not as Divine Wisdom passed to me through the saints of the ages.

 

Dear Murali_Mohan_das;

 

Ultimate truth is harsh and appears to be madness to human beings how are in the lower level.

 

Datta is called as Unmatta Datta, which means that Datta is mad. The reason for this is that He gives the absolute divine knowledge from His absolute state, which is the absolute reality. In that state, every thing except Him is relatively real including the souls. In this state He is called as Nirguna Datta, which means that He is in the state of absolute reality without any relative reality. The entire creation including the souls is a relative reality only and is just His imagination or quality or feeling (Guna) only. The guna is a property, which is not independent and depends on its substratum (Guni) only. Such substratum is God or Para Brahman who is far from imagination.

The knowledge radiating from that state is absolute truth, which cannot be digested by human beings who are in the lowest layer called as Maya. Therefore, Datta looks like a mad fellow whose statements are beyond the normal digestion. Shri Rama Krishna Parama Hamsa was going to Panchavati for meditation and was in that top state. A newly married person told Him that his wife is hindering him from participating in the spiritual discussion (Satsanga). Immediately Parama Hamsa told him just to divorce his wife. He was shocked. For the plane of normal human beings such knowledge looks like the statements of a mad person. In fact, the souls are mad of the plane of lower relative reality. For mad people, a wise person is mad relatively.

[Murali_Mohan_das]

Ultimate truth is all-sweet, all-loving, all-attractive.

 

I don't buy the harshness claim. The *medicine* may taste bitter due to our diseased state, but the goal is always sweeter than sweet.

 

Ultimate truth is Home Comfort. When we find ultimate truth, it will be like waking up from a dream.

 

Divorcing one's wife in order to spend more time talking philosophy with the blokes sounds like a really raw, nasty thing to do. Maybe, in the grand scheme of things, it's neither here nor there, but it is certainly not going to incurr any good karma.

 

An honorable man would stay with his wife and try to endeavor in partnership to make spiritual advancement, would he not? Of course, there are always exceptions, but this example ought not to be held forth as a rule.

 

Keep on swinging, you might actually hit a fair ball one of these days!!

 

 

Dear Murali_Mohan_das;

 

Ultimate truth is harsh and appears to be madness to human beings how are in the lower level.

 

Datta is called as Unmatta Datta, which means that Datta is mad. The reason for this is that He gives the absolute divine knowledge from His absolute state, which is the absolute reality. In that state, every thing except Him is relatively real including the souls. In this state He is called as Nirguna Datta, which means that He is in the state of absolute reality without any relative reality. The entire creation including the souls is a relative reality only and is just His imagination or quality or feeling (Guna) only. The guna is a property, which is not independent and depends on its substratum (Guni) only. Such substratum is God or Para Brahman who is far from imagination.

The knowledge radiating from that state is absolute truth, which cannot be digested by human beings who are in the lowest layer called as Maya. Therefore, Datta looks like a mad fellow whose statements are beyond the normal digestion. Shri Rama Krishna Parama Hamsa was going to Panchavati for meditation and was in that top state. A newly married person told Him that his wife is hindering him from participating in the spiritual discussion (Satsanga). Immediately Parama Hamsa told him just to divorce his wife. He was shocked. For the plane of normal human beings such knowledge looks like the statements of a mad person. In fact, the souls are mad of the plane of lower relative reality. For mad people, a wise person is mad relatively.

[gHari]

Datta Swami,

 

Yes, I see that was something I missed in the words of Jesus. I take it to mean that one must be detached from family life, from the world.

 

We are taught to water the root of the plant, then all the leaves and flowers will benefit. If we pour water on the leaves and flowers, there is no benefit to any of them or the plant itself.

 

Similarly our relationship with everyone and everything is found through the root, Sri Krsna. We direct our love to Krsna and all other relationships will be perfect.

 

The importance of the Centre, the Cause of all causes, God is highlighted in the following exerpt from "Poetry of a Saint" which features the words of Srila Sridhara Maharaja:

 

 

So, Krsna Consciousness, God Consciousness is like that. It is cinmaya – it is conscious and spiritual. The Lord has manifested Himself in this mundane plane of our sense experience for our benefit. He is not to be neglected. However, this conception, this presence of His grace, is considered to be for the lower section. Yet the Deity should not be considered as an idol. The Deity is also His presence manifested for our gross senses. However, a devotee always sees all things connected to the Lord, the Centre.

 

 

archayam eva haraye pujam yah sraddhayehate

 

na tad-bhaktesu canyesu sa bhaktah prakrtah smrtah

 

(Srimad Bhagatavam 11.2.47)

 

 

“When we do not learn to appreciate the presence of the Lord in the heart of His devotees, but only confine ourselves to such symbols connected with Him, our standard of devotion is meagre.”

 

 

Trace the Causal Existence of Everything

 

We cannot eliminate the plane of affection and love that we find here and there scattered in different ways. We are to trace the causal existence of everything. What is the unity in the background that is really harmonizing all these scattered experiences? One whose consciousness is raised to such a standard can see the background of everything as one, from One Centre. All these creations are handled, controlled and managed from One Centre. “Wherever he goes, he is always with My connection. I am not lost to him. In Srimad Bhagavatam it is said:

 

 

sarva-bhutesu yah pasyed bhagavad-bhavam atmanah

 

bhutani bhagavaty atmany esa bhagavatottamah

 

(Srimad Bhagavatam 11.2.45)

 

 

“One who can see everywhere the connection of the Centre in the background, sees all things correctly. He sees the cause, the connection, the central position, the background, and also his own relationship to the Whole in that position.”

 

 

Three Elements in any Experience

 

In any particular experience, there are three things: The Deepest Root (Sri Krsna), the Seer’s connection (Sri Guru), and that which is having the experience of his connection (jivatma).

 

 

This is in accordance to his position with the Centre and it is also interdependent on his adjustment with that environment. That adjustment is concommitant with his relationship to the Centre.

Everything will be considered in relation to the position and desires of the Centre, and not any independent transaction with part and part. It is from the part to the Whole, and from the Whole to the part.

 

 

‘What will be my position, my relationship to this part?’ It must be calculated through the Centre, and that will be real

. This relationship of “I and he,” is considered a misconception. This misconception will not remain, as it is unreal. But if it comes through the Centre, then it will be real and we will not be frustrated or disappointed. This sort of measurement or estimation would be one of substance. The part-to-part relationship is unstable. It is truly unreliable and will not remain. However, the connection that comes through the Centre is substantial, real and will not frustrate us.

gHari

[gHari]

 

the status of God here itself in this world

Therein lies the source of all the forced false logic and rhetoric. God is not an 'it'. Try again from this perspective. It becomes a lot clearer.

 

I think it is offensive to use the word 'swami' in this way. You may not be capable of seeing how foolish you are, Datta, but please be assured that it is an offence to try to associate such misinformed nonsense with the word 'swami'. Maybe you are trying to make a joke, using high concepts so foolishly - but it is just not funny. It is offensive.

[gHari]

<center></center>

 

Srimad-Bhagavatam 1.3.28:

 

<center>

ete cAMza-kalAH puMsaH

kRSNas tu bhagavAn svayam

indrAri-vyAkulaM lokaM

mRDayanti yuge yuge

</center>

ete--all these; ca--and; aMza--plenary portions; kalAH--portions of the plenary portions; puMsaH--of the Supreme; kRSNaH--Lord KRSNa; tu--but; bhagavAn--the Personality of Godhead; svayam--in person; indra-ari--the enemies of Indra; vyAkulam--disturbed; lokam--all the planets; mRDayanti--gives protection; yuge yuge--in different ages.

All of the above-mentioned incarnations are either plenary portions or portions of the plenary portions of the Lord, but Lord SrI KRSNa is the original Personality of Godhead. All of them appear on planets whenever there is a disturbance created by the atheists. The Lord incarnates to protect the theists.

PURPORT

In this particular stanza Lord SrI KRSNa, the Personality of Godhead, is distinguished from other incarnations. He is counted amongst the avatAras (incarnations) because out of His causeless mercy the Lord descends from His transcendental abode. AvatAra means "one who descends." All the incarnations of the Lord, including the Lord Himself, descend on the different planets of the material world as also in different species of life to fulfill particular missions. Sometimes He comes Himself, and sometimes His different plenary portions or parts of the plenary portions, or His differentiated portions directly or indirectly empowered by Him, descend on this material world to execute certain specific functions. Originally the Lord is full of all opulences, all prowess, all fame, all beauty, all knowledge and all renunciation. When they are partly manifested through the plenary portions or parts of the plenary portions, it should be noted that certain manifestations of His different powers are required for those particular functions. When in the room small electric bulbs are displayed, it does not mean that the electric powerhouse is limited by the small bulbs. The same powerhouse can supply power to operate large-scale industrial dynamos with greater volts. Similarly, the incarnations of the Lord display limited powers because so much power is needed at that particular time.

 

 

For example, Lord ParazurAma and Lord NRsiMha displayed unusual opulence by killing the disobedient kSatriyas twenty-one times and killing the greatly powerful atheist HiraNyakazipu. HiraNyakazipu was so powerful that even the demigods in other planets would tremble simply by the unfavorable raising of his eyebrow. The demigods in the higher level of material existence many, many times excel the most well-to-do human beings, in duration of life, beauty, wealth, paraphernalia, and in all other respects. Still they were afraid of HiraNyakazipu. Thus we can simply imagine how powerful HiraNyakazipu was in this material world. But even HiraNyakazipu was cut into small pieces by the nails of Lord NRsiMha. This means that anyone materially powerful cannot stand the strength of the Lord's nails. Similarly, JAmadagnya displayed the Lord's power to kill all the disobedient kings powerfully situated in their respective states. The Lord's empowered incarnation NArada and plenary incarnation VarAha, as well as indirectly empowered Lord Buddha, created faith in the mass of people. The incarnations of RAma and Dhanvantari displayed His fame, and BalarAma, MohinI and VAmana exhibited His beauty. DattAtreya, Matsya, KumAra and Kapila exhibited His transcendental knowledge. Nara and NArAyaNa RSis exhibited His renunciation. So all the different incarnations of the Lord indirectly or directly manifested different features, but Lord KRSNa, the primeval Lord, exhibited the complete features of Godhead, and thus it is confirmed that He is the source of all other incarnations. And the most extraordinary feature exhibited by Lord SrI KRSNa was His internal energetic manifestation of His pastimes with the cowherd girls. His pastimes with the gopIs are all displays of transcendental existence, bliss and knowledge, although these are manifested apparently as sex love. The specific attraction of His pastimes with the gopIs should never be misunderstood. The BhAgavatam relates these transcendental pastimes in the Tenth Canto. And in order to reach the position to understand the transcendental nature of Lord KRSNa's pastimes with the gopIs, the BhAgavatam promotes the student gradually in nine other cantos.

 

 

According to SrIla JIva GosvAmI's statement, in accordance with authoritative sources, Lord KRSNa is the source of all other incarnations.

It is not that Lord KRSNa has any source of incarnation. All the symptoms of the Supreme Truth in full are present in the person of Lord SrI KRSNa, and in the Bhagavad-gItA the Lord emphatically declares that there is no truth greater than or equal to Himself. In this stanza the word svayam is particularly mentioned to confirm that Lord KRSNa has no other source than Himself

. Although in other places the incarnations are described as bhagavAn because of their specific functions, nowhere are they declared to be the Supreme Personality. In this stanza the word svayam signifies the supremacy as the summum bonum.

 

 

The summum bonum KRSNa is one without a second. He Himself has expanded Himself in various parts, portions and particles as svayaM-rUpa, svayam-prakAza, tad-ekAtmA, prAbhava, vaibhava, vilAsa, avatAra, Aveza, and jIvas, all provided with innumerable energies just suitable to the respective persons and personalities. Learned scholars in transcendental subjects have carefully analyzed the summum bonum KRSNa to have sixty-four principal attributes. All the expansions or categories of the Lord possess only some percentages of these attributes. But SrI KRSNa is the possessor of the attributes cent percent. And His personal expansions such as svayam-prakAza, tad-ekAtmA up to the categories of the avatAras who are all viSNu-tattva, possess up to ninety-three percent of these transcendental attributes. Lord Siva, who is neither avatAra nor Aveza nor in between them, possesses almost eighty-four percent of the attributes. But the jIvas, or the individual living beings in different statuses of life, possess up to the limit of seventy-eight percent of the attributes. In the conditioned state of material existence, the living being possesses these attributes in very minute quantity, varying in terms of the pious life of the living being. The most perfect of living beings is BrahmA, the supreme administrator of one universe. He possesses seventy-eight percent of the attributes in full. All other demigods have the same attributes in less quantity, whereas human beings possess the attributes in very minute quantity. The standard of perfection for a human being is to develop the attributes up to seventy-eight percent in full. The living being can never possess attributes like Siva, ViSNu or Lord KRSNa. A living being can become godly by developing the seventy-eight-percent transcendental attributes in fullness, but he can never become a God like Siva, ViSNu or KRSNa. He can become a BrahmA in due course. The godly living beings who are all residents of the planets in the spiritual sky are eternal associates of God in different spiritual planets called Hari-dhAma and Maheza-dhAma. The abode of Lord KRSNa above all spiritual planets is called KRSNaloka or Goloka VRndAvana, and the perfected living being, by developing seventy-eight percent of the above attributes in fullness, can enter the planet of KRSNaloka after leaving the present material body.

 

KRSNas tu bhagavAn svayam [sB 1.3.28]. The original source of all energies, or the summum bonum, is the Absolute Truth, which is called Parambrahma, etc., and BhagavAn is the last word of the Absolute Truth. But even with the synonyms for BhagavAn, such as NArAyaNa, ViSNu and PuruSa, the last word is KRSNa, as confirmed in the Bhagavad-gItA: ahaM sarvasya prabhavo mattaH samaM pravartate [Bg. 10.8], etc. Besides that, the SrImad-BhAgavatam is the representation of Lord KRSNa as a sound incarnation of the Lord.

kRSNe sva-dhAmopagate

dharma-jJAnAdibhiH saha

kalau naSTa-dRzAm eSaH

purANArko 'dhunoditaH

(SB 1.3.43)

Thus by general conclusion Lord KRSNa is the ultimate source of all energies, and the word KRSNa means that. And to explain KRSNa or the science of KRSNa, the SrImad-BhAgavatam has been prepared.

[dattaswami]

 

Datta Swami,

 

Yes, I see that was something I missed in the words of Jesus. I take it to mean that one must be detached from family life, from the world.

 

We are taught to water the root of the plant, then all the leaves and flowers will benefit. If we pour water on the leaves and flowers, there is no benefit to any of them or the plant itself.

 

Similarly our relationship with everyone and everything is found through the root, Sri Krsna. We direct our love to Krsna and all other relationships will be perfect.

 

The importance of the Centre, the Cause of all causes, God is highlighted in the following exerpt from "Poetry of a Saint" which features the words of Srila Sridhara Maharaja:

 

 

So, Krsna Consciousness, God Consciousness is like that. It is cinmaya – it is conscious and spiritual. The Lord has manifested Himself in this mundane plane of our sense experience for our benefit. He is not to be neglected. However, this conception, this presence of His grace, is considered to be for the lower section. Yet the Deity should not be considered as an idol. The Deity is also His presence manifested for our gross senses. However, a devotee always sees all things connected to the Lord, the Centre.

 

 

archayam eva haraye pujam yah sraddhayehate

 

na tad-bhaktesu canyesu sa bhaktah prakrtah smrtah

 

(Srimad Bhagatavam 11.2.47)

 

 

“When we do not learn to appreciate the presence of the Lord in the heart of His devotees, but only confine ourselves to such symbols connected with Him, our standard of devotion is meagre.”

 

 

Trace the Causal Existence of Everything

 

We cannot eliminate the plane of affection and love that we find here and there scattered in different ways. We are to trace the causal existence of everything. What is the unity in the background that is really harmonizing all these scattered experiences? One whose consciousness is raised to such a standard can see the background of everything as one, from One Centre. All these creations are handled, controlled and managed from One Centre. “Wherever he goes, he is always with My connection. I am not lost to him. In Srimad Bhagavatam it is said:

 

 

sarva-bhutesu yah pasyed bhagavad-bhavam atmanah

 

bhutani bhagavaty atmany esa bhagavatottamah

 

(Srimad Bhagavatam 11.2.45)

 

 

“One who can see everywhere the connection of the Centre in the background, sees all things correctly. He sees the cause, the connection, the central position, the background, and also his own relationship to the Whole in that position.”

 

 

Three Elements in any Experience

 

In any particular experience, there are three things: The Deepest Root (Sri Krsna), the Seer’s connection (Sri Guru), and that which is having the experience of his connection (jivatma).

 

 

This is in accordance to his position with the Centre and it is also interdependent on his adjustment with that environment. That adjustment is concommitant with his relationship to the Centre.

Everything will be considered in relation to the position and desires of the Centre, and not any independent transaction with part and part. It is from the part to the Whole, and from the Whole to the part.

 

 

‘What will be my position, my relationship to this part?’ It must be calculated through the Centre, and that will be real

. This relationship of “I and he,” is considered a misconception. This misconception will not remain, as it is unreal. But if it comes through the Centre, then it will be real and we will not be frustrated or disappointed. This sort of measurement or estimation would be one of substance. The part-to-part relationship is unstable. It is truly unreliable and will not remain. However, the connection that comes through the Centre is substantial, real and will not frustrate us.

gHari

 

Dear gHari;

 

First of all i thank you for the nice reply. I would like to tell you that, salvation and liberation has got an inner meaning. Let us analyse it thoroughly.

 

This physical world, which consists of the inert objects like Sun, Moon, Stars

Air, Earth etc., is not the world, which is binding you and this is not

The world from which you have to attain the liberation or salvation

If you get salvation from this physical world it is called the death

Death is not the salvation since even after death you are bound by the bonds

The bonds are not with the physical world but they are with your family members

It is this family that constitutes your entire world from which you must be salvated

The physical world is real and it is unreal for the creator only and not for you

You are a part and parcel of this world and if you say that this world is unreal

You too become unreal, your unreal world is your own family, which is created

By yourself only and why this is unreal?

If you analyse, these bonds did not exist

Before this birth and do not exist after this birth and hence are not existing

During this birth also, Sankara told that temporary is always unreal

Therefore, Gita emphasizes for the detachment from these worldly bonds

Jesus goes one step further and advises you even to hate these family bonds

This is surprising but if you analyse, I should say, He is absolutely correct

If you analyse deeply, these family members deserve your hatred and not love

The reason is that these family members were very vehement enemies to you

In the previous birth you stole their hard earned property and fought with them

Now they have come to collect their wealth from you along with the

Compound interest, they are in the form of wife and children and you are bound

To pay them according to the force of Karma Chakra i.e., associated with Kala Chakra

Payment of loans is Karma Chakra and payment in this birth is Kala Chakra

The same is said “Runanubandha Rupena Pasu Patni Sutalayaah”

The three strongest bonds are with money, wife and children and these three

Are called as “Eeshanaas”, which are the stainless steel chains, which never

Corrode, the secret in the force of these three bonds is only the force of Karma

The Karma is the payment of the loans with interest and for that you have to earn

Therefore, you are forced by Karma to earn the money and that is the spontaneous

Attraction to the money, the Karma is dragging you to earn the money so that

You can pay to your enemies who are surrounding you for the collection of loans

Thus these three bonds are inter related and amalgamated by the force of Karma

These enemies are in the mask of friendship and love with you and you do not

Remember your previous birth, which is again due to the force of karma only

If you remember the previous birth and that enmity you will not repay the loan

Therefore, by the force of Karma Chakra only you do not remember previous birth

These enemies can collect their money only under the mask of love and friendship

These enemies are collecting their money in the form of work and also money

The mother repays the loan by doing work like bathing and clothing the children

Such sacrifice of work by the mother is coming under Karma Sanyasa

The father repays the money by giving his hard earned property to the children

And this repayment of direct wealth comes under Karma Phala Tyaga.

But these enemies are not satisfied with simple repayment of their loans

If a thief steals your money and if you catch him will you leave him

Just by taking your money? You will torture him and then only leave

Similarly, you have stolen their property and you tortured them

Therefore, they have caught the thief in this birth and collect their money

Apart from that they will torture you by dragging you down from the Lord

 

If you progress in your spiritual path and reach and please the Lord

You are saved permanently and attain eternal happiness here and there

Now these enemies obstruct your spiritual path and drag you back

From that Eternal divine benefit and due to that you will fall in this world-cycle

In this cycle, which is the permanent hell, you are tortured forever

By this, their vengeance is subsided and they stand around you even

In your last minutes so that you will be attracted by them then also

And you will not remember the Lord even in the last minute

This is the reason why all your family members reach you even before your death

They reach you when they hear that you are seriously ill, they are very alert

But you fool! You are not alert about them and remember them only even on the

Death bed! Is your this world not really unreal? You analyse the fact

I say this family world is the most unreal world because these bonds are not only

Unreal according to the analysis of Sankara, but also they are the bonds

Of enmity and so must be hated according to the Holy Jesus

You are thinking the enemy as your friend! How unreal is this bond?

First you come out of this unreal world created by you due to your past deeds

People say often that the world is unreal, yes! It is absolutely unreal

But the world is not this physical world created by the Lord

The unreal world is your family created by yourself due to your past karma

Similarly, your religion is another broader unreal world created by you

Your fellow religious people obstruct you from entering Universal spirituality

Because they are your enemies in the mask of friendship in this birth

 

You harmed them spiritually in the previous birth and therefore they have come

Now here as your friends belonging to the same religion and revenge upon you

When you come out of these two worlds, which are well and river

You will enter the Universal Spirituality, which is the infinite ocean

Some people try to get detachment from the family bonds

Without the attachment to the Lord, they can detach from the family

By attaining self through self-analysis but in this case they can get rid of

The worries and misery by attaining the self, which is pure awareness

Such detachment without attachment to the Lord is not permanent.

The attachment to the self is not as strong as the bond with the Lord

Therefore, such people who get only peace by self achievement cannot

Remain in that state for a long time, bliss is stronger than peace

Because God is stronger than the soul, soul gives peace and God gives bliss

Therefore, detachment from the family by attachment with the Lord alone

Is real and final, the scholars get attached to the self by analysis

And think that the self it self is the Lord and they feel that they are the Lord.

These pseudo Advaita Scholars are dragged again by the families and

They are insulted by the Maya and they are shown the reality.

The service to be done to the Lord should not be decided by yourself

You are pleased by doing the service to the Lord as per your desire

Your desire and your pleasure should not be the final goal of the mission

You must do that service, which is desired by the Lord and which pleases Him

His desire and His pleasure should be the final goal of your service

Mere service is not important but the service required by Him is important

 

Some devotees serve this society to uplift all the human beings

Such social service cannot please the Lord unless He wishes so, without His wish

If you serve the society, that is only to fulfil your desire for the fame

Sankara condemned this concept of social service i.e., Loka Sevaka Matam.

The Lord knows when, whom and where to uplift in this entire world

Whether it is His mission or His personal service, His desire is important

Even in His personal service the angle in which He desires is important

If His hand is paining, what is the use of pressing His legs?

Therefore, at every step the desire, direction and final pleasing of the Lord

Is the only essence and goal of the entire spiritual effort

The Lord alone can protect you and not this world, social service indicates

Your love on your fellow human beings, who constitute a bigger family only.

You have to sacrifice everybody, everything and even every concept for that

 

He tests you by asking that thing only, which you cannot sacrifice

He always attacks your strongest bond and conducts the test

 

One test is sufficient because if you can break your strongest bond for the

Sake of the Lord, all the other bonds, which are weaker need not be tested

The sacrifice of strongest bond with any thing other than the Lord alone

Can prove that you have the strongest bond with the Lord only.

You have to cross the family bonds and even the bond with your life

As told by Jesus, <st1:place w:st="on">Krishna</st1:place> says that you have to cross even Dharma or Justice

For the sake of the Lord because as the protector of justice, He is greater than

The protected justice “Sarva Dharman …” is said in Gita.

Thus Datta conducts only one test and gives you the final report

You will always try to sacrifice all the weak bonds for His sake

 

Then you claim that you can sacrifice everything for His sake

The Lord smiles at your talented dramatic action and keeps silent

 

If you go on still shouting that you are His best devotee, then

He will enter the field and touches your strongest bond or your weakness

You will utterly fail at that point and your mouth is shut forever

[dattaswami]

 

Therein lies the source of all the forced false logic and rhetoric. God is not an 'it'. Try again from this perspective. It becomes a lot clearer.

 

I think it is offensive to use the word 'swami' in this way. You may not be capable of seeing how foolish you are, Datta, but please be assured that it is an offence to try to associate such misinformed nonsense with the word 'swami'. Maybe you are trying to make a joke, using high concepts so foolishly - but it is just not funny. It is offensive.

 

God like His devotees the most, and even He become the servant of His servant. That is the status of His real devotees who love Him alone.

[dattaswami]

 

Ultimate truth is all-sweet, all-loving, all-attractive.

 

I don't buy the harshness claim. The *medicine* may taste bitter due to our diseased state, but the goal is always sweeter than sweet.

 

Ultimate truth is Home Comfort. When we find ultimate truth, it will be like waking up from a dream.

 

Divorcing one's wife in order to spend more time talking philosophy with the blokes sounds like a really raw, nasty thing to do. Maybe, in the grand scheme of things, it's neither here nor there, but it is certainly not going to incurr any good karma.

 

An honorable man would stay with his wife and try to endeavor in partnership to make spiritual advancement, would he not? Of course, there are always exceptions, but this example ought not to be held forth as a rule.

 

Keep on swinging, you might actually hit a fair ball one of these days!!

 

Dear Murali_Mohan_das;

 

You are working day and night for the welfare of your family. Then, is it not your duty to work for their eternal spiritual welfare? By this if your family members become devotees, they will not oppose you, instead, they will support you. Even if you leave the family and go out, you have to live in association of devotees only. Ignorant people leave the house and go to forest where even the normal behavior of human beings is not seen and instead they see the animals and birds, which are always trying and fighting for food.

Shankara left His mother and did not go to forest. He went to Shri Govinda Bhagavat Pada to have spiritual association. Through out His life, He was wandering in the world only with spiritual debates. I do not understand the significance of forests in the spiritual field. If you say that peaceful atmosphere exists in forests, it is zero. Plus which is the association with devotees and Satguru is far better than zero. Zero is only better than minus which is the disturbance in the world.

Therefore, the sages took the advantage of zero and plus by living in forests together. Hence, the association with devotees is main and not mere forest. If you can convert your family members in to devotees, you need not go out. Thus, the obstruction in your spiritual path is removed and simultaneously you have also done the work of God. It is best because it is double edged due to simultaneous work of your self and God. In spite of your best efforts, if the family does not change, then only you have to leave the family for the sake of God (Yadahareva virajet….Veda). But this step should be the last resort and should not be the first step it self. This problem becomes most serious if God is the contemporary human incarnation.

Hanuman did not get such problems because His mother and father were divine with full spiritual knowledge and encouraged Hanuman to leave the house to serve Rama. He was not married and therefore the problem from the side of wife and children did not arise. But in the case of Gopikas, the problem was very serious because their husbands and relatives were ignorant also. It was a fire test for them because that was the last worldly birth for those sages. The detachment from the world should be done carefully without haste. As a last resort only the extreme step of sanyasa should be taken up for the sake of God.

[gHari]

Since you did not address my post, Datta, could you explain who you refer to as 'Lord' in this question: "Can prove that you have the strongest bond with the Lord only". Describe His appearance, His pastimes. Krsnas tu Bhagavan svayam - do you reject the Bhagavatam conclusion? Is that caused by envy of Sri Krsna? Will you be the greatest person in existence, God Himself? Are you this Datta you reference? Is the Father just a force, an impersonal hollow holy spirit?

 

It seems to me that with all your hating of family and the world, you actually hate your Father, Sri Krsna, who lives in their hearts and yours.

 

GOD DON'T MAKE NO JUNK

[ksbh]

Dattaswami seems to just be copy/pasting from somehwere. I can't believe someone can type so many lines, punctuation marks and all, in such a short time!

[dattaswami]

 

Since you did not address my post, Datta, could you explain who you refer to as 'Lord' in this question: "Can prove that you have the strongest bond with the Lord only". Describe His appearance, His pastimes. Krsnas tu Bhagavan svayam - do you reject the Bhagavatam conclusion? Is that caused by envy of Sri Krsna? Will you be the greatest person in existence, God Himself? Are you this Datta you reference? Is the Father just a force, an impersonal hollow holy spirit?

 

It seems to me that with all your hating of family and the world, you actually hate your Father, Sri Krsna, who lives in their hearts and yours.

 

GOD DON'T MAKE NO JUNK

You have not understood the fundamental spiritual concept, even though i explained it in two posts, above!

 

Unless you make one bond with Lord you are not liberated. You cannot have one bond with statue or previous human incarnations. Lord is alive in the present human incarnation. He is the correct place of Lord. Lord comes in every human generation. He compete with your worldly bonds, one has to vote Lord leaving everything behind.

 

I will explain a little bit more provided you analyse my explantion with brain.

 

Gita says ‘Eka Bhakthih Vishishyate’ which means that the person having only one bond with the Lord alone is liberated. The liberation itself means destruction of all the bonds in this world. Without full liberation, one cannot have a strong bond with the Lord. Unless one is completely relieved from the world, one cannot join God. The joining report in the new institution is not possible without complete relief from the previous institution. You cannot partially join the new institution. It cannot be a side employment. Ofcourse such partial bond can be treated as the intermediate stage and is better than no bond. But the aim should not be such partial bond. If you aim at 100 marks, you may get 40 marks and pass. But if you aim at 40 marks only, you will fail. Therefore, let the aim be total liberation from the world and single bond with the God.

The bond consists of three parts. The service in terms of sacrifice of work and fruit of work comprises ninety-nine paise. Love with mind consists of 2/3rd paise. Remembering through words consists of 1/3rd paise. If you take the case of Sankara, he has donated the whole rupee to the Lord. His love for his mother, words to praise mother and service to mother are diverted towards the Lord. He left his mother for the sake of the Lord. He has donated all the one hundred paise to the Lord. He is the top most beloved of the Lord. He should be our aim. In the beginning stage you cannot divert your work, which is called duty and mental attachment, which is called love to the Lord. At least make a humble beginning by donating the words to the Lord. Go on reading spiritual books and go on chanting his songs. By this you have donated 1/3rd paise to the Lord. Remember that you cannot purchase any item from any shop with 1/3rd paise. Therefore, do not aspire any thing in return from the Lord, for this 1/3rd paise. In the next stage you try to divert your mind towards the Lord, which is 2/3rd paise.

Do your duties to your family members, but without mental attachment. Such mental detachment has several added advantages. If one is mentally detached from the family members, he will not be hurt if they insult him in future. He will not be disturbed when their behaviour is not correct. He will not suffer if death attacks them. Such mental detachment brings full peace and balance of mind. Due to this he will be always energetic with good health. Therefore such mental detachment is needed even for an atheist. The detached mind cannot keep silent because it is habituated to the attachment. Therefore, attach the mind to the Lord. Such attachment will always give infinite bliss in the life. When you are successful in attaching the mind to the Lord, you are called as devotee. But a devotee can be disturbed. The devotion becomes firm if his intelligence takes a firm decision through knowledge. Therefore, Knowledge gives firm decision to the intelligence (Buddhi) and this makes the devotion of mind (Manas) to be firm. Therefore, Gita started with Buddhi Yoga or Jnana Yoga in the second chapter.

When the mind is fixed on the Lord with the help of the knowledge of the intelligence, the work will naturally change and will follow the mind. The mind is like the king. The words are like his ministers. The intelligence is like his preacher or Guru. The work is like his army. Therefore, with the help of the words the mind should be diverted to the Lord and it is fixed with the help of the intelligence. The words divert the mind, whereas the intelligence fixes the mind. Therefore, when you have donated words and mind to the Lord and when you are strengthened by the spiritual knowledge your duties and responsibilities, which form the work, will naturally be diverted towards the Lord. The work is always inert item and is controlled by the mind and intelligence.

[dattaswami]

 

Dattaswami seems to just be copy/pasting from somehwere. I can't believe someone can type so many lines, punctuation marks and all, in such a short time!

 

Knowledge about the God is the most imprtant item. Your sole aim in this world is to please Lord. Lord comes in human form in every human generation.

A statue cannot test your real essence in the sacrifice. When you offer food to a statue the sacrifice is only by words and by mind but when you sacrifice the food to the human incarnation the sacrifice is real because the human form of the Lord eats the food. Thus the reality of the worship comes out only when the Lord is in human form. Sakthuprastha was tested by the Lord in human form and not by the statue.

[dattaswami]

 

Dattaswami seems to just be copy/pasting from somehwere. I can't believe someone can type so many lines, punctuation marks and all, in such a short time!

The Lord preached Gita only when Arjuna fell on His feet and craved for the divine knowledge. The Lord said that trying to give the divine knowledge to the people who are not interested due to their ignorance, egoism, jealousy and greed is like throwing a stone on the pond of mud (Krutstnavit Na Vichalayet). But Sankara went to the house of Mandana Misra and begged for a debate. Then Manadana Misra abused Sankara and refused the debate. But Vyasa and Jaimini who were present there objected to such attitude.

Then only Mandana Misra entered into a debate and the debate continued for twenty-one days. At the end Mandana Misra realized the truth and became the disciple of Sankara. Here Mandana Misra was benefitted and not Sankara. Therefore you must try to uplift all the souls in this world. Even if the mud falls on you, you must have patience. Sankara did not return back even if Mandana Misra abused Him in a pungent way. The father tries to correct his son even if his son scolds him. Such kind attitude is the divine nature. <st1:place w:st="on">Krishna</st1:place> tried for kauravas and Hanuman tried for Ravana even if they were insulted. Ofcourse you should leave a rigid person, which should be your last resort because such person is destined to his fate.

 

A true devotee of Lord crave for divine knowledge.

[ksbh]

OK, good luck in your quest to serve the human form of God. He'll be back in the next Yuga. You better practise being patient, boy, coz you got a long wait ahead of you!

 

 

A statue cannot test your real essence in the sacrifice. When you offer food to a statue the sacrifice is only by words and by mind but when you sacrifice the food to the human incarnation the sacrifice is real because the human form of the Lord eats the food.

[ksbh]

I wish I could carve too but I just go to the local art store when I need to buy something like that. I prefer wooden carvings over stone.

 

 

A true devotee of Lord carve for divine knowledge.

[dattaswami]

 

OK, good luck in your quest to serve the human form of God. He'll be back in the next Yuga. You better practise being patient, boy, coz you got a long wait ahead of you!

 

Dear ksbh;

 

The human incarnation comes in every generation but you are not coming in every generation. The rebirth as human being is almost impossible and completely impossible as per Christianity. In such case you are having only one chance to contact the human incarnation present in your generation. If you miss this, never again this luck comes. The next meeting with God is direct where He acts as judge. Therefore, there is no second coming of Jesus (here i have taken jesus as example only) for you and you will meet God finally only.

In this way the second coming of Jesus at the end can be understood. But if you say that you cannot meet the human incarnation in your present generation, you are not having the opportunity even for once. In such case, why a particular generation in which God came in human form as Jesus was only blessed? They had the extra fortune and this means God is partial to that generation. Therefore, every person in every generation will have the equal chance of coming in contact with the human incarnation once in his or her life and the final contact with God in the energetic form as judge.

Therefore, the impartial God comes again and again for every generation (Yada Yada hi…..Gita) but you are not having the chance to meet the human incarnation again since you have no human rebirth. One may get the human rebirth in extreme exceptional situation and you should not depend on that because it involves high risk. The human birth, the urge for salvation and coming in contact with the human incarnation are the three real fortunes and the importance increases from left to right in the order. Therefore, simply having the human birth and having the urge by taking orange robe are not sufficient.

Unless you contact the Lord in human form and get the right knowledge for correct implementation, every thing is waste (Manushyatvam Mumukshatvam, Mahapurasha Samsrayah, Durlabham—Sankara). There is no quarrel if you say that the second coming of Jesus is only at the end because every one is having the equal chance. But if you say that I have to worship the past human incarnation only even in the present generation, then the equal opportunity is not given to Me when I am compared to the human being present in that generation in which Jesus came directly and clarified all the doubts face to face. I must have such equal privilege and here the quarrel comes with you since you deny the equal opportunity.

The second coming is final with respect to every human being but not with respect to God because in such case several human generations miss the chance of direct contact with God in human form except that one particular human generation. Even if you say that Jesus told that His second coming is only final, it is true with respect to every human being and not with respect to Him. You have misinterpreted this statement by extending it with reference to Jesus also because you want to exploit the people in the name of past Jesus and get personal fame and other facilities from the devotees. You are in no way different from the priests present in that time of Jesus.

Both of you do not admit the human form of Lord. Both of you keep the past which is invisible (invisible Jebhova or invisible Jesus) before the devotees and earn money and fame. The only difference between you both is that that priest got Jesus killed through the court and you cannot do that in the present time. The repulsion towards the human form before eyes is common to both the priests and devotees. But in the case priests there is an extra factor that they may lose fame and offerings from the devotees because they get benefited standing at the back ground of the invisible form of God or inert form of God.

In the case of devotees, this extra factor does not exist because they are prepared to sacrifice for God and they are not losing since they do not receive. Any Guru or Priest immediately resists human form of God based on these two factors since he fears that the human form may get the fame or their offerings. Thus, there is political, economical and social issue of psychology in this spiritual line. Attraction to fame and money associated with jealously and egoism is the main back ground and Lord Datta brings out the truth that is buried up to any depth. All the details of truth are known to the omniscient God. Veda says that the knowledge of God is always based on truth (Satyam Jnamam).

[ksbh]

Which Church do you go to?

 

 

Dear ksbh;

 

The human incarnation comes in every generation but you are not coming in every generation. The rebirth as human being is almost impossible and completely impossible as per Christianity. In such case you are having only one chance to contact the human incarnation present in your generation. If you miss this, never again this luck comes. The next meeting with God is direct where He acts as judge. Therefore, there is no second coming of Jesus for you and you will meet God finally only.<?xml:namespace prefix = o />

In this way the second coming of Jesus at the end can be understood. But if you say that you cannot meet the human incarnation in your present generation, you are not having the opportunity even for once. In such case, why a particular generation in which God came in human form as Jesus was only blessed? They had the extra fortune and this means God is partial to that generation. Therefore, every person in every generation will have the equal chance of coming in contact with the human incarnation once in his or her life and the final contact with God in the energetic form as judge.

Therefore, the impartial God comes again and again for every generation (Yada Yada hi…..Gita) but you are not having the chance to meet the human incarnation again since you have no human rebirth. One may get the human rebirth in extreme exceptional situation and you should not depend on that because it involves high risk. The human birth, the urge for salvation and coming in contact with the human incarnation are the three real fortunes and the importance increases from left to right in the order. Therefore, simply having the human birth and having the urge by taking orange robe are not sufficient.

Unless you contact the Lord in human form and get the right knowledge for correct implementation, every thing is waste (Manushyatvam Mumukshatvam, Mahapurasha Samsrayah, Durlabham—Sankara). There is no quarrel if you say that the second coming of Jesus is only at the end because every one is having the equal chance. But if you say that I have to worship the past human incarnation only even in the present generation, then the equal opportunity is not given to Me when I am compared to the human being present in that generation in which Jesus came directly and clarified all the doubts face to face. I must have such equal privilege and here the quarrel comes with you since you deny the equal opportunity.

The second coming is final with respect to every human being but not with respect to God because in such case several human generations miss the chance of direct contact with God in human form except that one particular human generation. Even if you say that Jesus told that His second coming is only final, it is true with respect to every human being and not with respect to Him. You have misinterpreted this statement by extending it with reference to Jesus also because you want to exploit the people in the name of past Jesus and get personal fame and other facilities from the devotees. You are in no way different from the priests present in that time of Jesus.

Both of you do not admit the human form of Lord. Both of you keep the past which is invisible (invisible Jebhova or invisible Jesus) before the devotees and earn money and fame. The only difference between you both is that that priest got Jesus killed through the court and you cannot do that in the present time. The repulsion towards the human form before eyes is common to both the priests and devotees. But in the case priests there is an extra factor that they may lose fame and offerings from the devotees because they get benefited standing at the back ground of the invisible form of God or inert form of God.

In the case of devotees, this extra factor does not exist because they are prepared to sacrifice for God and they are not losing since they do not receive. Any Guru or Priest immediately resists human form of God based on these two factors since he fears that the human form may get the fame or their offerings. Thus, there is political, economical and social issue of psychology in this spiritual line. Attraction to fame and money associated with jealously and egoism is the main back ground and Lord Datta brings out the truth that is buried up to any depth. All the details of truth are known to the omniscient God. Veda says that the knowledge of God is always based on truth (Satyam Jnamam).

[dattaswami]

 

Which Church do you go to?

 

I do not belong to any particular religion. I belong equally to all religions. Infact I am not religious but spiritual.

Religion is like a medium of instruction and spirituality is the curriculum. One can get doctorate degree through any medium and a doctorate will be respected by all over the world equally. Thus we should pursue to reach higher levels in spirituality in our own religion. Nobody need not change his religion. Change of religion is moving horizontally and moving to higher classes in spiritual curriculum is moving vertically, which is only called growth. Spirituality is beyond religion. Infact any true divine preacher never confined to any one particular religion, caste, creed etc, because all require God.

[ksbh]

I have little doubt that you're a Christian.

 

Fanatic or not, that will be revealed in due course.

 

 

I do not belong to any particular religion. I belong equally to all religions. Infact I am not religious but spiritual. <?xml:namespace prefix = o />

Religion is like a medium of instruction and spirituality is the curriculum. One can get doctorate degree through any medium and a doctorate will be respected by all over the world equally. Thus we should pursue to reach higher levels in spirituality in our own religion. Nobody need not change his religion. Change of religion is moving horizontally and moving to higher classes in spiritual curriculum is moving vertically, which is only called growth. Spirituality is beyond religion. Infact any true divine preacher never confined to any one particular religion, caste, creed etc, because all require God.

[theist]

dattaswami,

 

In one thread only yesterday I noticed where the host of this forum admonished you about copy and pasting and told you to stop or they would all be removed.

 

No one here wants to have a conversation with a web site or even your own past articles if that's what they are.

 

Perhaps you didn't know JNdas has the authority to make good on his statement being the host of Indiadivine and this Audarya Fellowship or maybe you missed his post. In either case I just wanted to bring it to your attention.

[dattaswami]

 

dattaswami,

 

In one thread only yesterday I noticed where the host of this forum admonished you about copy and pasting and told you to stop or they would all be removed.

 

No one here wants to have a conversation with a web site or even your own past articles if that's what they are.

 

Perhaps you didn't know JNdas has the authority to make good on his statement being the host of Indiadivine and this Audarya Fellowship or maybe you missed his post. In either case I just wanted to bring it to your attention.

 

My main aim to propagate the divine knowledge

On this earth is Universal Spirituality

For World Peace, because there should not be difference

Based on the religion, two people should not fight

For the sake of Nivrutti, which is reaching the Lord.

Nivrutti is related to Lord and is very sacred.

Should one stab another for the sake of this?

In <st1:place w:st="on"><st1:country-region w:st="on">India</st1:country-region></st1:place> have you not heard of a Muslim stabbing Hindu

And vice-versa just for the sake of religion?

There is meaning if two fight for wealth etc.,

Which is Pravrutti, Pandavas and Kauravas fought

With each other for wealth, it is justified

Both belong to the same Hindu religion

They did not fight for the religion

It is shameful for the Lord to see such fights!

The same Lord is in two different dresses.

And you both are fighting for the difference in the dress!

You are not recognizing that the same teacher came

And taught the same syllabus in two different languages.

To one class He came in red shirt and to another class

He came in white shirt, you are fighting for His shirts!

You are fighting for the two languages, which differ.

The teacher is the same and the syllabus is the same.

You sit and analyze the contents of His teaching.

You treat the teacher as your Master in your section.

Is He not the Master for the other section also?

Both the sections constitute the whole school.

You say that He is the Master of the whole school.

The school consists off two distinct sections vividly.

If you say that He is the Master of the whole school,

The school must contain only your section, then only

Your statement is right, but the school shows two sections.

Your statements are contradicting each other clearly.

Hindus say that Brahman is the creator, Muslims say

That Allah is creator, Christians say that the creator is

Jehovah, all say that the creation is this entire world.

If Hindus say that Brahman created <st1:place w:st="on"><st1:country-region w:st="on">India</st1:country-region></st1:place>, and if

Muslims say that Allah created Arabian countries and

If Christians say that Jehovah created the western countries,

The problem is solved, there can be three Gods together,

Who have created the three parts of the earth separately.

But this is not so, each religion says that their God only

Created the entire world, unfortunately there is one world!

One world only! Come on, all of you sit together here

And give me the final conclusion after debate, otherwise,

The scientists are laughing on all of you! Shame to all!

They criticize that these religions do not have even

The basic logic, which is the fundamental common sense.

Because of you, the greatest God is also mocked by them

They say that the religions are rigid conservatisms!

Even a small boy is putting this question to all of you.

Stop all your discourses and first answer this question.

If you want to say that God created the entire world,

You have to accept that there is one God only always

And that His names are all the above three names.

We see in the world a single person having three names.

If there is one God, He only created this entire world.

All the human beings are invariably His children only.

No Father is partial to a single child and therefore

He must have preached the same knowledge to all

In different languages and in different methodologies

To different levels, this is Universal Spirituality.

I find Christians trying to convert Hindus in <st1:place w:st="on"><st1:country-region w:st="on">India</st1:country-region></st1:place>.

Similarly Hindus are trying to convert Christians in West.

Do you think that Hinduism and Christianity are two

Different political parties to rule the spiritual kingdom?

These conversions then become very much essential,

Because the ruling party must have a clear majority.

Jesus said that majority of people are traveling

On a very wide high way that leads to hell! He also told

That the way to Him is very narrow with few people only!

<st1:place w:st="on">Krishna</st1:place> told that one in millions can only reach Him!

Both Jesus and <st1:place w:st="on">Krishna</st1:place> speak about qualitative minority

And not about useless quantitative majority, realize this.

If you analyze, both philosophies are one and the same.

Buddhism is an offspring of Hinduism, both are same.

Buddha is the incarnation of Vishnu, God of Hinduism.

Islam and Christianity are separated just on one point only.

Islam treats the prophet as messenger of God, Christianity

Treats the prophet as son of God or God Himself also.

Hinduism contains all these three views of the same point.

Whether the prophet is the messenger or the son of God

Or God Himself, think, how does it matter as far as

The message of God is concerned? Since God is same

And His message is also the same. Whether God says

Or His son says or His messenger says, no difference,

In all the three cases it is the message of God only.

Unable to practice the message of God, all of you are

Quarreling seriously on unnecessary immaterial point!

Let all the human beings on this earth recognise one God,

Let them recognise the only one path that is sacrifice,

Let them recognise themselves created by the same God

And therefore they are brothers and sisters in this world.

Let there not be stabbings of brothers for the sake of God.

Let there not be wars based on religious differences.