Do You Feel Loved By Krishna?

[gHari]

Rajo guna folks if they thought they could come back and do the religious thing next life, would just party hearty 'til they die.

 

Tamo guna folks if they thought they could come back and do the religious thing next life, would just sleep in their stupor 'til they die.

 

Sattva guna folks know they come back again, know they've been kings and clowns, and worms and dogs, and are just tired of it all.

 

We get what we need to get us from here to there. If they don't believe in reincarnation, then that is what they need right now. Tomorrow may be a different story. A little love of God can change the whole psychological dynamic. A little positive motivation can go a long way until fear will no longer be their prime incentive to give God a thought.

[theist]

I take immortal to be no beginning and no ending vs. merely no ending. I'll have to look up the actual word meaning but doesn't it mean 'not subject to or beyond mortality'?

 

Genesis 1 refers to animals has having the same soul as man but it got changed in the translations.

[suchandra]

 

Do you have some sort of reference for that?

 

There are many Christian denominations with many differing official doctrines. Within any of those denominations, no doubt, one can find theologist-philosophers with varrying views.

 

My understanding is that all Christians believe in an immortal soul (though they differ as to whether non-human animals have souls), but many do not believe in reincarnation.

 

How can one spend an eternity in heaven or hell if one's soul is not immortal?

The problem is revealed scripture, the Bible doesnt define the qualities of soul like Bhagavad-gita does. Simply to argue with logic and reason when it comes to the quality of soul is not acceptable even for Christians, like Vaishnavas they want scriptural backup. Since the Bible doesnt clearly explain the constitution of the soul one first must get a Christian to reject the Bible as authoritative source for understanding the soul's constitution.

 

 

What Happens to Us When We Die?

The Society attempts to answer the second of the above questions in their new booklet, What Happens to Us When We Die (henceforth referred to as What Happens)? The Society explains, "The word 'soul' as used in the Bible refers to a person or an animal or to the life that a person or an animal enjoys."2 Because the soul is simply life of a being, the soul ceases to exist after death.3 The majority of faithful Jehovah's Witnesses, however, will be resurrected after Armageddon; they will then be given a soul, or life, that exactly duplicates their personality in a new body that will live forever on earth.4 Only 144,000 Jehovah's Witnesses will go to heaven.5

 

What Happens attempts to refute the doctrine of the soul using two approaches: historic and hermeneutic.

 

Many people are surprised to find that the term immortal soul appears nowhere in the Bible. However, though the Scriptures do not speak of the soul as being immortal, they have much to say about immortality. For example: "You know that no murderer has eternal life abiding in him" (1 John 3:15).

 

Paul told the members of the congregation in Rome to "seek" immortality (Romans 2:5-7). He taught Christians at Corinth that they must be changed and "put on" immortality (1 Corinthians 15:51-55). Paul proclaimed that only God and His Son possess immortality (1 Timothy 6:12-16) and that eternal life is a "gift" from God (Romans 6:23).

 

The most powerful words come from Jesus Himself: "And this is the will of Him who sent Me, that everyone who sees the Son and believes in Him may have everlasting life; and I will raise him up at the last day" (John 6:40).

True Origin of Immortal-soul Teaching

 

We've seen in this brief look at the supposedly immortal soul that the Bible teaches no such concept. The idea filtered into Western thought through Greek philosophy. Its origins are older than Athens, in fact as old as man.

 

The concept of the immortal soul was introduced into man's thinking at the earliest beginnings of human history. God told the first human beings, Adam and Eve, that if they sinned they would die and return to the dust from which He had created them (Genesis 2:17; 3:19). Satan, the embodiment of evil, the powerful entity who opposes God, assured them they wouldn't die (verses 1-5).

 

Satan slyly injected into Eve's consciousness the notion that God was lying and that she and her husband would not die, thus ingraining the unscriptural teaching of the immortality of the soul into human thought. Satan has since deceived the world on this important understanding as well as many other biblical truths (Revelation 12:9). Much of the world, including millions of people in religions outside of traditional Christianity, are convinced they have—or are—immortal souls and hope they will go to a happy place or state of being immediately after they die.

 

The Biblical Answer to Death

 

Yet the Bible plainly teaches that the dead lie in the grave and know nothing, think no thoughts, have no emotions, possess no consciousness. Does this mean death, the cessation of life, is final, the end of everything?

 

The Bible answers this question too. Although mankind is physical, subject to death, the good news is that God promises a resurrection to eternal life to everyone who repents, worships God and accepts Jesus as the Messiah and His sacrifice. The first resurrection to immortality will take place when Christ returns to establish God's Kingdom on this earth.

 

Later will come another resurrection—to physical life—for people who had never had a relationship with the Father and Jesus Christ. They, too, will gain the opportunity for immortality. The true final answer is not death but resurrection. GN

http://www.gnmagazine.org/issues/gn23/immortalsoul.htm

 

 

[cbrahma]

 

Some early church fathers did. Origen for example. I don't know their history but the belief was squashed. Why did Plato have to be exposed to the Vedas? Paramatma is in his heart also.

Paramatma is in everybody's heart - that doesn't explain the amazing simila rities. Historically Greek culture had many Eastern influences.

[cbrahma]

 

This is rather the actual situation, that present Christians dont believe in an immortal soul.

Which present Christians? If they don't, they're departing radically from mainstream tradition.

[Murali_Mohan_das]

I see you added a quotation from some essay to your previous reply.

 

Very interesting.

 

Of course, semantic issues are always in play--especially where there has been translation. The Bible has been translated so many times (and from one language to another to another--not always from the original Hebrew, Aramaic, or Greek sources), that it's had to swallow a statement like "nowhere in the Bible is there any mention of an 'immortal soul'".

 

Still, very interesting.

 

 

The problem is revealed scripture, the Bible doesnt define the qualities of soul like Bhagavad-gita does. Simply to argue with logic and reason when it comes to the quality of soul is not acceptable even for Christians, like Vaishnavas they want scriptural backup. Since the Bible doesnt clearly explain the constitution of the soul one first must get a Christian to reject the Bible as authoritative source for understanding the soul's constitution.

[theist]

Shows they are all over the map on this one. We tend to think of the Bible as one work but actually it is a collection of individual works and those individuals may have had different thoughts on the matter and so opposing views may be present in the Bible. Add to that the translations comes to us through the minds of people who infused their own understanding (or lack of it) onto what they thought was originally meant. The Bible cannot be relied upon to provide details such as we are discussing.

 

Millions of people become inspired to pray and move towards a God conscious life by reading the Bible, and I have also. But as far as detailed knowledge goes it's just not there.

 

I would like to see the teachings of Lord Jesus Christ extracted from the Bible as a stand alone work. Has this been done? Anyone seen a book of just the four Gospels?

[theist]

 

Paramatma is in everybody's heart - that doesn't explain the amazing simila rities. Historically Greek culture had many Eastern influences.

 

Maybe so. I am not saying there was no infulence. I don't know a thing about history. But the statement was on reincarnation. That need only come from the Lord Himself (the source of the Vedas) and is not dependent on an Indian connection. For all I know Plato heard it from a traveling Indian sage or something I am just saying that is not a necessity.

[theist]

 

Which present Christians? If they don't, they're departing radically from mainstream tradition.

 

Well we need to define what we mean by immortal and see if they mean the same thing when using the word.

[theist]

immortality

 

One entry found for immortality.<form name="entry" method="post" action="/cgi-bin/dictionary"><table valign="top" border="0" cellpadding="0" cellspacing="0"><tbody><tr><td> <input name="hdwd" value="immortality" type="hidden"><input name="listword" value="immortality" type="hidden"><input name="book" value="Dictionary" type="hidden">

</td></tr></tbody></table> </form> Main Entry: im·mor·tal·i·ty

Pronunciation: <tt>"i-"mor-'ta-l&-tE</tt>

Function: noun

: the quality or state of being immortal : a : unending existence b : lasting fame

----------

 

I may be using the word incorrectly. "Unending existence." Doesn't say anything about no beginning also although in reality I don't know how you could separate the two.

[suchandra]

 

Very interesting.

 

 

May be software technology will solve the problem. Present human OS needs a plugin installed in order to understand the impact of immortal soul concept. Because this plugin is not installed the concept of an eternal soul causes a severe software conflict - the whole human society would immediately have their moral concept and ideals dissolved and would be left with nothing. All illusions burst - please insert upgrade disk to avoid data loss....

 

Upgrading your system please wait...

 

 

 

 

Jaya-gopāla: Prabhupada, what is meant by madness?

 

Prabhupāda: Just as don’t you see all these people of the world, they

are mad? What they are doing? They whole day the cars going on

this side, that side. What is the aim of life? They’re mad. Simply

wasting petroleum, that’s all. What they’re doing? Huh? Suppose a

cat and dog goes this side and that side, yow, yow, yow, and he

goes some motorcars. What is the difference? There is no difference

because the aim of the life is the same. Therefore they are mad.

That is explained. Nūnaṁ pramattaḥ kurute vikarma yad indriya-

prītaya āpṛṇoti [bhāg. 5.5.4]. Nūnaṁ pramattaḥ, pramattaḥ means

mad. Prakṛṣṭa rūpeṇa mata, sufficiently mad. And why? Kurute

vikarma. They’re acting which they should not act. They’re acting in

a way in which they should not have done. So what is the aim of

their acting? Indriya-prītaya, simply for sense gratification. That’s

all.

 

So Ṛṣabhadeva says, na sādhu manye, “This is not good.” Na sādhu

manye yato ātmano ’yam asann api kleśada āsa dehaḥ. These

madmen do not know that this is the cause of getting this miserable

material body. The sufferings of humanity is due to this material

body and the cause of vikarma, acting for sense gratification. So this

life is meant for acting for liberation, but they are acting for sense

gratification. Therefore they are mad. They do not know the aim of

life. Life after life, they are working. The cat’s life, the dog’s life, the

horse life, the man’s life or even demigod’s life, simply for sense

gratification. And so long he will continue these activities of sense

gratification, he will have to accept some sort of material body in

the 8,400,000 of species either as demigod or as dog. So this is

going on. So Caitanya Mahāprabhu says, ei rūpe brahmāṇḍa

bhramite kona bhāgyavān jīva [Cc. Madhya 19.151] They are

encircling or circumambulating in this cycle of birth and death. Out

of many, many millions of such persons, if one is fortunate, he

comes in contact with Kṛṣṇa’s representative, and by which he

becomes Kṛṣṇa conscious, and his life becomes sublime. So this is

madness. Simply for sense gratification. They have no other

business. This is madness. What do you think? This is not madness?

 

Devotee: We see it every day.

 

Prabhupāda: Yes. There is no difficulty to find out a madman. Any

man you find out, he’s a madman. And that is medical version also.

That is medical version. In India, there was a case. A man was

murdered, and the criminal lawyer pleaded that he was in madness.

So the expert medical practitioner was invited and he was asked to

examine whether this man is in madness. So he said that “So far my

experience goes, I have studied, every man is a madman, more or

less.” Every man in the material concept of life is a madman because

he does not know his identification. Therefore he’s a madman.

Piśācī pāile yena mati-cchana haya. Just like a ghostly-haunted

man. His father is standing before him and he’s calling the father by

ill names, because he’s ghostly-haunted. Similarly, a living entity

who is entrapped by this material energy, illusion, he’s a madman.

And the whole treatment is to get out of this disease of madness,

misidentification, misconception of life. So it is not difficult to find

out a madman. Any man is a madman. Yes?

 

Madhudviṣa: Prabhupāda? What is the position of Lord Śiva?

 

Prabhupāda: Lord Śiva is a demigod, but he is higher than all other

demigods. He’s higher than Lord Brahmā also. But he’s not the

Supreme Lord. Just like there are different gradations. That is not

difficult to understand. In society also, there are different

gradations. Similarly, the living entities, there are different

gradations. So all the living entities, they are, some of them are

situated in higher planets, some of them are situated in lower

planets, some of them are situated in high-grade life, in low-grade

life. So the demigods are also, they are living entities, but they are

enjoying better standard of life due to their acts of piety. But Lord

Śiva is not amongst the living entities. He’s above the living entities

but he is counted as one of the demigods. But his position is better

than Lord Brahmā even. Brahmā is to be the highest living entity

within the universe, and Lord Śiva’s position is higher than Lord

Brahmā.

 

Madhudviṣa: Does Lord Śiva have a wife, like, a consort?

 

Prabhupāda: Yes. Pārvatī. Satī. Everyone has got wife. Yes. Śakti.

 

Devotee: Is Lord Śiva a devotee of Lord Kṛṣṇa?

 

Prabhupāda: Yes. Everyone is devotee. Only the madmen, they are

not devotees. Any sane man is devotee of… Sanity means become

devotee. That is sanity. And one who is not devotee is insane,

insanity. So how you can expect that Lord Śiva is not devotee? He’s

not insane. We are, the material, the ordinary living entities, in the

lower grades of life, they are all insane. What is that? Yes?

 

Dayānanda: Lord Śiva’s relationship with Durgā—does he have a

relationship with Durgā?

 

Prabhupāda: Yes. Durgā is the material energy. So Lord Śiva is

directly connected with the material energy. Therefore he’s less than

Lord Viṣṇu. Viṣṇu is not directly related with the material energy.

The example is given in the Brahma-saṁhitā. Just like milk, as soon

as in touch with something sour, it becomes yogurt. The yogurt is

nothing but milk, but in connection with some sour material, it is

yogurt. So yogurt is milk, but it is not milk also. Your child requires

milk. You cannot give yogurt. Nobody can argue, “Oh, yogurt is milk

preparation, why not give?” No. It will be not beneficial for him.

Similarly, if you want release from this material world, you have to

take to Viṣṇu, no other demigod. If you want strength, then you have

to drink milk, not yogurt. Yogurt, at times you can eat for some taste

or some particular purpose. The milk is general drinking. Just take

the statistics, how many bottles of milk are sold in the store and

how many bottles of yogurt is sold. The yogurt and milk is the same

thing. Why they’ll demand milk and not the yogurt? Is that right? Yes.

But nobody can put argument, “Oh, why do you take milk? Take the

yogurt.” No. Yes?

 

Revatīnandana: Is it all right that Lord Śiva’s picture is in the new

calendar that’s come out?

 

Prabhupāda: Lord Śiva is devotee, why not? Hare Kṛṣṇa. Chant Hare

Kṛṣṇa. (pause—Prabhupāda chants japa as devotees prepare for

kīrtana) (To devotee:) So your case is dismissed?

 

Jaya-gopāla: Yes.

 

Prabhupāda: Ah, that money is returned?

 

Jaya-gopāla: It will be at the end of the month. (kīrtana) (end)

 

Los Angeles, December 11, 1968

 

 

 

 

[cbrahma]

 

What BR Sridhar Maharaja is saying is that for ourselves personally to see Krsna behind everything is like a beacon light to us.

 

In the case of child abuse the perpetrator would still be punished and Krsna would be behind that as well.

 

I am puzzled by your objection.

 

Because claiming that everything is justified by karma - justifies abominations like child rape - and making God somehow responsible (in the background). It explains nothing because it explains everything and zero inspiration.

[Murali_Mohan_das]

I don't want to offend our friend theist, but I don't drink cow's milk anymore, though I *do* sometimes get cow's milk yogurt instead of soy-based yogurt.

 

I find yogurt easier to digest than raw milk.

 

Hmmmm...could there be some cosmic significance?

 

Overall, it's a nice quote, though

 

Truly, it's hard to look around in any industrialized place and not think, "This is utter madness!!!"

 

 

 

If you want strength, then you have

to drink milk, not yogurt. Yogurt, at times you can eat for some taste

or some particular purpose. The milk is general drinking. Just take

the statistics, how many bottles of milk are sold in the store and

how many bottles of yogurt is sold. The yogurt and milk is the same

thing. Why they’ll demand milk and not the yogurt? Is that right? Yes.

But nobody can put argument, “Oh, why do you take milk? Take the

yogurt.” No. Yes?

 

 

 

[theist]

 

Because claiming that everything is justified by karma - justifies abominations like child rape - and making God somehow responsible (in the background). It explains nothing because it explains everything and zero inspiration.

 

Yeah I figured you were going for the child abuse in Iskcon thing. Not my conversation but in short you have three choices as I see it.

 

1. It was karma being acted out. Krsna is the backdrop of karma as it's His law BTW.

 

2. It was all Krsna's mercy in some way we can't understand.

 

3. It was some combination.

 

In any case Krsna (Vishnu) was involved in some way.

 

Take your pick or if you can suggest something I am missing please post it.

[cbrahma]

 

Yeah I figured you were going for the child abuse in Iskcon thing. Not my conversation but in short you have three choices as I see it.

 

1. It was karma being acted out. Krsna is the backdrop of karma as it's His law BTW.

 

2. It was all Krsna's mercy in some way we can't understand.

 

3. It was some combination.

 

In any case Krsna (Vishnu) was involved in some way.

 

Take your pick or if you can suggest something I am missing please post it.

Please don't speculate about my references. Child rape is an example my ethical philosophy professor usesd to test the boundaries of a theory.

If justice is always served then there's no reason for policemen, courts of law or even prisons. There are no innocent victims. Karma is inscrutable and cannot be invoked for either consolation or regret. Suffice that everything comes out in the wash. Suffice that we have no idea how. But we must hold people accountable for their actions and not be fatalistic. It was just my karma that so-and-so punched me in face for no apparent reason. So I will just be everybody's passive victim. Dangerous conclusion.

[theist]

 

Please don't speculate about my references. Child rape is an example my ethical philosophy professor usesd to test the boundaries of a theory.

If justice is always served then there's no reason for policemen, courts of law or even prisons. There are no innocent victims. Karma is inscrutable and cannot be invoked for either consolation or regret. Suffice that everything comes out in the wash. Suffice that we have no idea how. But we must hold people accountable for their actions and not be fatalistic. It was just my karma that so-and-so punched me in face for no apparent reason. So I will just be everybody's passive victim. Dangerous conclusion.

 

Well that is not my conclusion. It is your speculation otherwise. I believe in a justice system in human society and I accept that karmic law works through that justice system as well as beyond it. It is the kysatriya's duty to administer justice. It would be sinful for the kysatriya to neglect his duty. And behind all such working out of karma is God.

 

I think you need to decide if you accept God as active in the working of things that happen in the material world or if your position is that of a Deist who believes in God as being totally divorced from the actions of this world.

 

I listed three options that I recognize above which you choose not to address. I will ask you about them again.

 

 

in short you have three choices as I see it.

 

1. It was karma being acted out. Krsna is the backdrop of karma as it's His law BTW.

 

2. It was all Krsna's mercy in some way we can't understand.

 

3. It was some combination.

 

In any case Krsna (Vishnu) was involved in some way.

 

<!-- END TEMPLATE: newreply_reviewbit --><!-- BEGIN TEMPLATE: newreply_reviewbit --> Take your pick or if you can suggest something I am missing please post it.

[cbrahma]

 

Well that is not my conclusion. It is your speculation otherwise. I believe in a justice system in human society and I accept that karmic law works through that justice system as well as beyond it. It is the kysatriya's duty to administer justice. It would be sinful for the kysatriya to neglect his duty. And behind all such working out of karma is God.

 

I think you need to decide if you accept God as active in the working of things that happen in the material world or if your position is that of a Deist who believes in God as being totally divorced from the actions of this world.

 

I listed three options that I recognize above which you choose not to address. I will ask you about them again.

Of course I believe God is active in 'things'. I also believe that if his activity covers everything, then the spectre of the problem of evil rears its head. (The favorite argument of atheists.) So individual freedom must be admitted. I will defend my rights. Stand up for myself and the innocent, not brush it off as 'karma', which is so nebulous and complicated a web as to tell us absolutely nothing. I derive no peace or tranquility from it. The world is a dangerous. The idea is to become liberated, to transcend karma, not meditate on how everything that happens is supposed to.

[theist]

 

Of course I believe God is active in 'things'. I also believe that if his activity covers everything, then the spectre of the problem of evil rears its head. (The favorite argument of atheists.) So individual freedom must be admitted. I will defend my rights. Stand up for myself and the innocent, not brush it off as 'karma', which is so nebulous and complicated a web as to tell us absolutely nothing. I derive no peace or tranquility from it. The world is a dangerous. The idea is to become liberated, to transcend karma, not meditate on how everything that happens is supposed to.

It should be obvious that everyone on this forum believes in free will. No need to talk as if it your personal revelation that no one else gets. The fact that one acepts that there is a law governing action is in itself an statement of belief in free will. The needful thing is to see how karma and free will go hand in hand under the supervision of the Supreme.

 

I personally appreciate the statement the above statement of Sridhar Maharaja to a degree and I hope to learn to appreciate it more as I grow. I really have nothing else to say on this one.

 

Haribol

[suchandra]

 

I don't want to offend our friend theist, but I don't drink cow's milk anymore, though I *do* sometimes get cow's milk yogurt instead of soy-based yogurt.

 

I find yogurt easier to digest than raw milk.

 

Hmmmm...could there be some cosmic significance?

 

Overall, it's a nice quote, though

 

Truly, it's hard to look around in any industrialized place and not think, "This is utter madness!!!"

 

 

 

This is real mercy to have such learned Vaishnavas with such huge a store of knowledge at this forum! Go on with the good work!

[sanatan]

 

Of course I believe God is active in 'things'. I also believe that if his activity covers everything, then the spectre of the problem of evil rears its head. (The favorite argument of atheists.) So individual freedom must be admitted. I will defend my rights. Stand up for myself and the innocent, not brush it off as 'karma', which is so nebulous and complicated a web as to tell us absolutely nothing. I derive no peace or tranquility from it. The world is a dangerous. The idea is to become liberated, to transcend karma, not meditate on how everything that happens is supposed to.

 

 

Yes...really, I mean really bad shit happens in this world. And, like it or not, the theistic Vedic model provides the most rational answers for those seeking answers to why it happens.

 

Why would the extant facts of karma and reincarnation prevent anyone from standing up for themselves and/or the innocent? To act or not to act is a personal choice...we all have free will. I could stand by and watch a criminal rape my wife, or I could pull out a pistol and kill him...I've already thought that one through.

 

Sometimes we do have to act aggressively, even violently, to defend what is right and our responsibility to protect.

[realist]

 

 

 

This is real mercy to have such learned Vaishnavas with such huge a store of knowledge at this forum! Go on with the good work!

 

Agree, I have been reading this forum on and off for sometime and the open knowledge discused is brilliant, the present dictatorial leadership in iskcon cleverly closes new devotees off to what is really going on. I have learn't more on these forums in a month than 4 years of living in the Temple. Some of the posts are brilliant and have opened my eyes. Thank you prabhus

[mahak]

Born again? Grow up. Earlier, I admitted that I did not know. But I do. I also know that this is not the point, because guru shastra sadhu confirm that this love he has for me is unconditional and unreserved and unbiased, so he loves hitler and mother theresa the same.

 

Because me and idi amin and pol pot have this commonality, the beloved of Krsna, what is exactly the point. The point is that do I love Him, to I serve him in the nine ways he accepts??? This is what can make the difference.

 

So, any feeling of being unloved by Krsna has nothing to do with Him, it is all in my realm of responsibility. If I care at all, Lord Nityananda makes arrangement with his representative to exhibit his love personally and up close, thru both vapu and vani. Demonstrate. Then, If I still care, I follow. FOLLOW. FOLLOW. Follow. I take the rope dangling from the good ship bhagavatam and hang on, keel hauled for these last few yojanas. And if I still care, I start to develop vaisnava characteristics.

 

These traits experianced not in goloka or the sky of imagined heaven, but here and now. We feel the love of Krsna through all who we meet. If we are truely his in a reciprocal way, everyone knows. Srila Prabhupada never had to hide, he was beloved by even the person with slight traces of sincerity, despite their prejudices and tendencies to hold onto the conventions of time and place. How we really tell if Krsna loves us is how others see us. But we have to have keen perception that only comes thru a purificatory process given by Krsna, the ultimate loving gift, his representative who serves Him in separation for our ultimate benefit. Whatta family.

 

Hare Krsna, ys, mahaksadasa

 

PS Nice topic, a good one to sign off on. My retirement is looming.

[BoneyAss69]

I certainly do. Krishna is the source of divine love:)

[theist]

 

Yes...really, I mean really bad shit happens in this world. And, like it or not, the theistic Vedic model provides the most rational answers for those seeking answers to why it happens.

 

Why would the extant facts of karma and reincarnation prevent anyone from standing up for themselves and/or the innocent? To act or not to act is a personal choice...we all have free will. I could stand by and watch a criminal rape my wife, or I could pull out a pistol and kill him...I've already thought that one through.

 

Sometimes we do have to act aggressively, even violently, to defend what is right and our responsibility to protect.

 

I have thought the gun thing through also. I keep a .357 S&W Magnum seven shot revolver loaded with .38 hollow points in my apt. as well as an 870 Remington 12 gauge shotgun. Anybody try breaking through my door is in for a surprise.

 

The idea of sitting passively by and watching karma play out and not take any action to protect the innocent is farsical for anyone who studies Bhagavad-gita seriously.

 

Christ was tolerant up to being beaten and crucified himself but raise a hand towards his Mother and heads would roll.

[mahak]

theist: "Christ was tolerant up to being beaten and crucified himself but raise a hand towards his Mother and heads would roll."

 

mahaksadasa: Or make offense to his Daddy, hell grab a whip and clear the temple without a second thought.

 

Krsna loves the criminal who severely offends even his great devotees, but he also loves the ones who protect his devotee. The crimes are settled, all must pay, this is the temporary realm where karma is the law. So the guy who rapes will pay, and the guy who blows him away will pay as well. The amount owed is the question, the rapist bill is incalculable, and without receiving forgiveness from the innocent victim, there is no repayment. The one who is acting out of protection owes only the price of the bullet.

 

Haribol, ys, mahaksadasa