Is diska necessary for the parampara?

[Murali_Mohan_das]

 

Please don't hijack this thread into another friggin' argument about Srila Prabhupada's Godbrothers.

 

I apologize, theist, but I just can't let these half-truths (which can be worse than outright lies) go unchallenged.

 

It appears that these misconceptions persist despite our best efforts.

 

Just the other day, a Godsister of mine who lives near an ISKCON temple and worships there was expressing some doubts that were sowed in her mind by a well-meaning official at that temple.

[Guruvani]

 

Devastated might be a bit exaggerated, pics of the new ISKCON Tirupati Temple, at Life of a Hare Krishna girl,

http://satoxi.com/2007/04/08/iskcon-tirupati-2007/

 

That doesn't mean anything to me.

There are already millions of Vaishnavas in India.

The USA once had a thriving KC movement that has been reduced down to a laughing stock at the hands of the ISKCON leaders.

 

You can build a big fancy temple in India and get thousands of Hindus to come.

That is no major accomplishment.

 

In the USA, ISKCON temples are closing, or dwindling down into pathetic skeletons of their former selves.

 

The test is what kind of success ISKCON can have in the USA.

At this point in time, ISKCON has been reduced to a mess and shows all the weaknesses and faults of the failed ISKCON leadership.

[CCC]

 

ISKCON was devastated by his leading disciples not his Godbrothers, so you can stop with the mis-information campaign already.

 

Once ISKCON gets shattered by the leading devotees the whole argument against the Godbrothers of Srila Prabhupada has no meaning anymore.

 

ISKCON was already destroyed by ISKCON members so there is nothing left for the Godbrothers of Srila Prabhupada to harm.

 

Besides that, in his last days, Srila Prabhupada said the war with his Godbrothers is over.

 

If you want to keep the war alive then that goes against the will of Srila Prabhupada and is a false campaign.

 

Once the members of ISKCON get done feeding on the carcass of a dead ISKCON like a pack of Lions, then what is the harm if some vultures get some leftovers?

 

Yes they did read this. They made the same mistakes in Iskcon and gaudiya math, they voted for new gurus, and Sridhar Maharaj supported the eleven gurus, and said that they were equal to Prabhupada and have to be worshipped like him , that is in the book the confidential science of bhakti yoga. Prabhupada's instructions were opposite to this.

 

http://www.............../gbc/black/sridhara.htm

 

there is a history of Sridhar Maharaj

 

Viraha Astaka

2) Your so-called disciple, the jackal named Ananta Vasudeva,

disobeyed your final instructions to keep the mission united,

and thereby created a scandalous fiasco.

The result of this philosophical deviation is evident to this day

as imitative sahajiyas are being worshiped as gurus in your

temples.

760618rc.tor Conversations

Prabhupada: Daily night. And he was shocked. ONE OF MY GAUDIYA MATHA GODBROTHERS, BIG, HE BECAME THE HEAD OF THIS BHAG BAZAAR GAUDIYA MATHA. So his wife was debauched, and she was bringing new paramour, and the child protested.

Pusta Krsna: New?

Prabhupada: Paramour. And the boy, he was ten years or twelve years old, he could understand: "Who is this man?" So he protested and said, "I shall tell all these things to my father." And he was killed.

Pusta Krsna: The boy was killed?

Prabhupada: By the mother.

Hari-sauri: She murdered him?

Prabhupada: Yes. Killed means given poison. And the father, that is, my Godbrother, seeing this, he also took poison. This is the end of Gaudiya Matha scandal. He was also one of the trustees. This Tirtha Maharaja was a trustee, and another Godbrother and this man. In the beginning, they were made trustees. In the beginning, Prabhupada was to undergo surgical operation. So he was a little nervous, that "I may die." So he made a scrap paper, that "In case I die, these three disciples will be trustees of the Gaudiya Matha Institute." That's all. So this Kunja Babu kept this. There are many long histories. SO ONE OF THE SO-CALLED TRUSTEES WAS THIS VASUDEVA. So he died, his end was like this.

Pusta Krsna: His son was killed, isn't it?

Prabhupada: His wife was a regular prostitute, and she killed her child, and on this shock, he took poison and died.

Pusta Krsna: He killed himself, oh.

Prabhupada: Naturally, he became shocked, that "This is my family life--the wife is prostitute and son is killed. What is the value of my life?" This was his spiritual realization. Just see. (laughs) AND HE WAS MADE THE CHIEF, AND ONE OF THE SUPPORTER WAS SRIDHARA MAHARAJA.

Pusta Krsna: Vasudeva Sridhara?

Prabhupada: No, no. He was made chief. Guru Maharaja did not make him chief. But after his passing away, some of our Godbrothers voted him chief.

Pusta Krsna: Am I mis...? You had told me once, I'm not certain. Maybe I made a mistake. YOU SAID THAT VASUDEVA, IT WAS KNOWN FACT THAT HE WAS HOMOSEX?

Prabhupada: Yes.

Pusta Krsna: Vasudeva.

Prabhupada: HE WAS HOMOSEX AND SEX, EVERYTHING.

 

 

For the Truth:deal:

 

 

Hari Bol

[Murali_Mohan_das]

That's all fine and dandy. When will you follow Srila Prabhupada's instructions to offer his Godbrothers your respect?

 

 

Yes they did read this. They made the same mistakes in Iskcon and gaudiya math, they voted for new gurus, and Sridhar Maharaj supported the eleven gurus, and said that they were equal to Prabhupada and have to be worshipped like him , that is in the book the confidential science of bhakti yoga. Prabhupada's instructions were opposite to this.

 

http://www.............../gbc/black/sridhara.htm

 

there is a history of Sridhar Maharaj

 

Viraha Astaka

2) Your so-called disciple, the jackal named Ananta Vasudeva,

disobeyed your final instructions to keep the mission united,

and thereby created a scandalous fiasco.

The result of this philosophical deviation is evident to this day

as imitative sahajiyas are being worshiped as gurus in your

temples.

760618rc.tor Conversations

Prabhupada: Daily night. And he was shocked. ONE OF MY GAUDIYA MATHA GODBROTHERS, BIG, HE BECAME THE HEAD OF THIS BHAG BAZAAR GAUDIYA MATHA. So his wife was debauched, and she was bringing new paramour, and the child protested.

Pusta Krsna: New?

Prabhupada: Paramour. And the boy, he was ten years or twelve years old, he could understand: "Who is this man?" So he protested and said, "I shall tell all these things to my father." And he was killed.

Pusta Krsna: The boy was killed?

Prabhupada: By the mother.

Hari-sauri: She murdered him?

Prabhupada: Yes. Killed means given poison. And the father, that is, my Godbrother, seeing this, he also took poison. This is the end of Gaudiya Matha scandal. He was also one of the trustees. This Tirtha Maharaja was a trustee, and another Godbrother and this man. In the beginning, they were made trustees. In the beginning, Prabhupada was to undergo surgical operation. So he was a little nervous, that "I may die." So he made a scrap paper, that "In case I die, these three disciples will be trustees of the Gaudiya Matha Institute." That's all. So this Kunja Babu kept this. There are many long histories. SO ONE OF THE SO-CALLED TRUSTEES WAS THIS VASUDEVA. So he died, his end was like this.

Pusta Krsna: His son was killed, isn't it?

Prabhupada: His wife was a regular prostitute, and she killed her child, and on this shock, he took poison and died.

Pusta Krsna: He killed himself, oh.

Prabhupada: Naturally, he became shocked, that "This is my family life--the wife is prostitute and son is killed. What is the value of my life?" This was his spiritual realization. Just see. (laughs) AND HE WAS MADE THE CHIEF, AND ONE OF THE SUPPORTER WAS SRIDHARA MAHARAJA.

Pusta Krsna: Vasudeva Sridhara?

Prabhupada: No, no. He was made chief. Guru Maharaja did not make him chief. But after his passing away, some of our Godbrothers voted him chief.

Pusta Krsna: Am I mis...? You had told me once, I'm not certain. Maybe I made a mistake. YOU SAID THAT VASUDEVA, IT WAS KNOWN FACT THAT HE WAS HOMOSEX?

Prabhupada: Yes.

Pusta Krsna: Vasudeva.

Prabhupada: HE WAS HOMOSEX AND SEX, EVERYTHING.

 

 

For the Truth:deal:

 

 

Hari Bol

[Guruvani]

 

Yes they did read this. They made the same mistakes in Iskcon and gaudiya math, they voted for new gurus,

 

Well, the ISKCON leadership did the same thing after the passing of Srila Prabhupada, so whatever blame you put on the Gaudiya Matha then that same blame goes on the ISKCON gurus and GBC.

 

No ISKCON leader has any right to fault the Gaudiya Matha because they all did the same thing that they are accusing the Gaudiya Matha of.

[CCC]

 

That's all fine and dandy. When will you follow Srila Prabhupada's instructions to offer his Godbrothers your respect?

 

I offer respect to them and no more: I will not worship them, not serve them, not reading their books, just respect as you said.

[CCC]

 

Well, the ISKCON leadership did the same thing after the passing of Srila Prabhupada, so whatever blame you put on the Gaudiya Matha then that same blame goes on the ISKCON gurus and GBC.

 

No ISKCON leader has any right to fault the Gaudiya Matha because they all did the same thing that they are accusing the Gaudiya Matha of.

and the supporter were srila prabhupada godbrothers!, they made the same mistake thanks to Prabhupada's godbrothers advice!

 

...However, when Srila Prabhupada left his body the GBC man where in confusion as to how the future initiations would go on, although it seemed clear that Prabhupada understood the system he established would continue after his disappearance, otherwise why would he go to the trouble of having Tamal Krishna document it and notify all temples? Srila Prabhupada was staying in Vrndavana at that time and he knew quite well he was leaving his body very soon. If he had wanted his disciples to be acaryas in their own right surely he would have said so.

At this time the GBC went to the Gaudia Math and took advice from one of Srila Prabhupada's godbrothers on the future initiations within ISKCON. It is strange that the GBC went to Prabhupada's godbrothers for advice on such an important matter when Srila Prabhupada had warned so often that his godbrothers were envious of his success and couldn't help in the preaching work..."They are simply trying to infiltrate our society to do something harmful..."

 

 

Unfortunately the Gaudiya Math advice was the men named by Srila Prabhupada as ritvics should be treated as non-different from Srila Prabhupada. They were acaryas in their own right, entitled to sit on highly elevated vayassanas (seats), entitled to the title paramahamsa (the topmost devotee) and names like Visnupada and Bhaktipada, almost on the level of Prabhupada. Overnight these devotees became "rubber stamped" as pure unalloyed devotees and were to be worshiped on the same level as Srila Prabhupada.

 

 

This system made ISKCON a laughing stock for the Gaudiya Math and also for many Indians who were well aware of the actual qualifications of a spiritual master. Although the new ISKCON "acaryas" were confident they were pure devotees on the same level as Srila Prabhupada, anyone looking on from outside the movement who knew the qualifications of a pure devotee could see how ridiculous this was. Prabhupada's godbrothers and his so-called "leading disciples" had succeeded in destroying the credibility of ISKCON which Srila Prabhupada had fought so hard to establish. And still no one in ISKCON seemed to know what was happening.

 

 

Many of Srila Prabhupada's disciples had the desire to become gurus, but they were not qualified gurus. Guru is not a cheep thing. Many devotees were attracted by the fame, adoration, profit and distinction which accompanied the position of acarya, rather than the sincere desire to please Krishna and Srila Prabhupada and save the fallen conditioned souls from rotting in this material world by giving them Krishna con- sciousness. Ultimately the devotees named by Srila Prabhupada as authorized to give rtvik initiation on his behalf cheated the general devotee community that Srila Prabhupada had intended them to be his successors.

 

Srila Prabhupada's so called "successors" then carved up the world into a number of zones. In each zone one of the successors was to be the "zonal acarya" and he would be the only "spiritual master" in that zone and all new devotees would have to take initiation from him. Why not? After all he was a paramahamasa, a pure devotee on the topmost platform of devotional service, he was non-different from Krishna, the Supreme Personality of Godhead Himself!

[Guruvani]

 

and the supporter were srila prabhupada godbrothers!, they made the same mistake thanks to Prabhupada's godbrothers advice!

 

 

but we have recorded and documented proof that the 11 ritviks went to Sridhar Maharaja and lied to him and said that Srila Prabhupada appointed them to be diksha gurus.

Srila Prabhupada advised his senior disciples to consult Sridhar Maharaja on philosophical issues after his passing.

 

But, they went to Sridhar Maharaja and lied, so you can't blame Sridhar Maharaja for dealing with matters based upon the false information he was given.

[theist]

In an effort to keep this thread on track.

 

 

Yes diksa is absolutely necessary. There is no spiritual life without it. That is if this definition is used.

 

“Diksha is the process by which one can awaken his transcendental knowledge and vanquish all reactions caused by sinful activity. A person expert in the study of the revealed scriptures knows this process as diksha.”-Jiva Gosvami

[theist]

I give up. Go at it boys.

[Murali_Mohan_das]

 

I offer respect to them and no more: I will not worship them, not serve them, not reading their books, just respect as you said.

 

What sort of respect are we talking about here? Just some abstract respect?

 

You say the words, "I offer respect to them" and you duty is finished?

 

Wouldn't digging out all the quotes from Srila Prabhupada in praise of his Godbrothers be a more practical expression of your respect? Do you claim that no such quotes exist?

[Murali_Mohan_das]

The only "fault" one can find in Srila Sridhar Maharaja is that perhaps he is *too* merciful to the fallen.

 

Dayal Nitai! Dayal Nitai! Dayal Nitai!!

 

 

but we have recorded and documented proof that the 11 ritviks went to Sridhar Maharaja and lied to him and said that Srila Prabhupada appointed them to be diksha gurus.

Srila Prabhupada advised his senior disciples to consult Sridhar Maharaja on philosophical issues after his passing.

 

But, they went to Sridhar Maharaja and lied, so you can't blame Sridhar Maharaja for dealing with matters based upon the false information he was given.

[Guruvani]

<center>

</center> His Divine Grace Srila Bhakti Rakshak Sridhar Dev-Goswami Maharaj and His Divine Grace Srila A.C. Bhaktivedanta Swami Maharaj Prabhupad sharing the same Vyasasana at the opening ceremony of Srila Bhaktivedanta Swami Maharaj's Sri Mayapur Chandrodoy Mandir. At the lower left is His Divine Grace Srila Bhakti Sundar Govinda Dev-Goswami Maharaj, who is now the President Acharya of the Sri Chaitanya Saraswat Math.

[suchandra]

 

That doesn't mean anything to me.

There are already millions of Vaishnavas in India.

The USA once had a thriving KC movement that has been reduced down to a laughing stock at the hands of the ISKCON leaders.

 

You can build a big fancy temple in India and get thousands of Hindus to come.

That is no major accomplishment.

 

In the USA, ISKCON temples are closing, or dwindling down into pathetic skeletons of their former selves.

 

The test is what kind of success ISKCON can have in the USA.

At this point in time, ISKCON has been reduced to a mess and shows all the weaknesses and faults of the failed ISKCON leadership.

 

Well, now just imagine how everything what happened in US always had such a strong influence upon the development of KC in European Nations and how in Europe everything dwindled into nothing. Prabhupada knew all this and when he started in US his idea was that the whole world will follow. Now the whole world still follows and says, ISKCON is dwindling in US, let's make laws so they close here immediately. US Vaishnavas should have known that they not only have the responsibilty for US but for the whole world.

[Kulapavana]

 

What sort of respect are we talking about here? Just some abstract respect?

 

You say the words, "I offer respect to them" and you duty is finished?

 

 

what is being said by these people does not qualify even as a token of respect - quite the oposite.

 

Srila Prabhupada freely criticized his Godbrothers but that was his right, not the right of his disciples. Repeating in public old rumours about alleged homosexuality of Ananta Vasudeva shared in a private conversation between a guru and a disciple is disrespectful to Prabhupada, let alone Ananta Vasudeva, who was very, very dear to Srila Bhaktisiddhanta. if Ananta Vasudeva earned the respect of Bhaktisiddhanta, he was not some petty bhogi-yogi.

[suchandra]

 

what is being said by these people does not qualify even as a token of respect - quite the oposite.

 

Srila Prabhupada freely criticized his Godbrothers but that was his right, not the right of his disciples. Repeating in public old rumours about alleged homosexuality of Ananta Vasudeva shared in a private conversation between a guru and a disciple is disrespectful to Prabhupada, let alone Ananta Vasudeva, who was very, very dear to Srila Bhaktisiddhanta. if Ananta Vasudeva earned the respect of Bhaktisiddhanta, he was not some petty bhogi-yogi.

Just imagine Prabhupada in his room at Radha Damodar Mandir, would he ever have considered to comment on anything what happened in the GM, NO! He commented in context to the development of his preaching work and global movement. Otherwise Prabhupada's attitude was/is to be so much engaged in his spreading Lord Caitanya's movement that there's was not one second time to comment on others. This is Vaishnava spirit.

[Kulapavana]

This is how Prabhupada treated Godbrothers of his guru:

 

2 September, 1971 London - from a letter to Jayapataka Maharaja. Srila Prabhupada writes:

 

"P.S. Whenever our men go to visit Lalita Prasad Thakura they must take some presentation, cash or kind, worth not less than Rs. 50/- at least. Some nice presentation should be always given. Not that you go empty handed.

 

It is customary to make a presentation to the Deity and Spiritual Master. Lalita Prasad Thakura is son of Bhaktivinode Thakura and younger brother of Bhaktisiddhanta Sarasvati so he is considered my spiritual master."

-----------------------------

 

The bashers of Prabhupada's Godbrothers should take a clue from that letter.

 

Lalita Prasada Thakura was a highly controversial person in the Saraswata sampradaya circles, yet Prabhupada accepts him as his guru and demands his disciples show proper respect. That is true respect not some fake lip service and attitude.

[Murali_Mohan_das]

This is *VERY* illustrative, Kulapavana Prabhu.

 

One thing to consider: many people presenting this offensive statements are simply parroting something they heard from an "authority". Like me, they may not have any deep knowledge or understanding regarding the issue, but they cling fervently to these acquired beliefs (out of fear or uncertainty (i.e. the yearning for certainty), perhaps?). Probably, they have not even given the issue much consideration.

 

For instance, growing up, I acquired many knee-jerk "liberal" values (e.g., Big Government is good because government-sponsored social programs are good) that I carried with me until I became a more analytical, critical thinker, at which time I had to abandon *some* of my liberal ideals.

 

 

This is how Prabhupada treated Godbrothers of his guru:

 

2 September, 1971 London - from a letter to Jayapataka Maharaja. Srila Prabhupada writes:

 

"P.S. Whenever our men go to visit Lalita Prasad Thakura they must take some presentation, cash or kind, worth not less than Rs. 50/- at least. Some nice presentation should be always given. Not that you go empty handed.

 

It is customary to make a presentation to the Deity and Spiritual Master. Lalita Prasad Thakura is son of Bhaktivinode Thakura and younger brother of Bhaktisiddhanta Sarasvati so he is considered my spiritual master."

-----------------------------

 

The bashers of Prabhupada's Godbrothers should take a clue from that letter.

 

Lalita Prasada Thakura was a highly controversial person in the Saraswata sampradaya circles, yet Prabhupada accepts him as his guru and demands his disciples show proper respect. That is true respect not some fake lip service and attitude.

[Pita das]

 

And on his deathbed Srila Prabhupada sincerely and tearfully apologized for saying these things and asked for his Godbrother's forgiveness, but somehow people like you chose to ignore that fact because it ruins your fairytale idea of Prabhupada.

 

Well I dont know how many of you were in His Divine Grace room when Srila Prabhupada met with HH Naranya Maharaja and HH Bon Maharaja.

I was ,Srila Prabhupada told them in a very humble way ,not tearfully but his humble way.

"Because I am an Acarya I have had to criticise your mistakes as examples to my disclips so they do not make them.( It was His Divine Grace duty to do so)I am sorry if I have offened you"

That was the compelte statement by Srila Prabhupada made to His God brother HH Bon Maharaja and his god nephew HH Naranya Maharaja.(In English)

At that point at once NM said "You can never offend because you our Guru".

Then Srila Prabhupada began converstion with the two in Hindi I could understand that Srila Prabhupada was speaking the Hindi Lanuage which meant to me that Srila Prabhupada had some desire to speak to privately, so I at once offered my Obeiances to Srila Prabhupada and left the room.

 

Srila Prabhupada continued to meet with these two devottees for 15 to 20 minutes more I estamate as I then remenber HH Tamal Krishna Maharaja outside of Srila Prabhupada's room speaking to HH Bon Maharaja escorting him to the gate of Sri Sri Krishna Balarama Mondir on the side of the temple

by Srila Prabhupadas room.HH Naranya Maharaja may of still have been with Srila Prabhupada.Most likey he was.

 

HH Bon Maharaja told Tamal Krishna Maharaja and myself as I went over to them and listened to what HH Bon Maharaja was telling TK Maharaja.

 

Bon Maharaja told us "dont hate Krishna for takeing srila Prabhupada,Srila Prabhupada was preparing to reenter Radha Krishna Nitya Leela."

 

He also told us that "now at the passing of Srila Prabhupada all of us would now be tested by fire."

 

Bon Maharajas words are very real to me more and more than less .

Every time I visit our Atlanta Temple so many ways the fire is burning me.

[Pita das]

Lalita Prasada Thakura was a highly controversial person in the Saraswata sampradaya circles, yet Prabhupada accepts him as his guru and demands his disciples show proper respect. That is true respect not some fake lip service and attitude.

 

Srila Prabhupadas meeting with Srila Lalita Prasada was because Srila Lalita Prasada had many volumes of unpublished writings of Srila Bhakti Vinoda Thakur and Srila Prabhupada met with him asking him if he would alow ISKCON to preserve them or at least photograph them. I do not think these were allowed to be photographed some maybe>?

 

Guru Kripa who was with Srila Prabhupada when His Divine Grace meet with Srila Lalita Prasada .Srila Prabhupada told Guru Kripa Yasoda Nanada Prabhu that He was a pure devottee Srila Prabhupada never said he aceapted Lalita Prasad as Guru.He Told them Srila Lalita Prasad had diffrences with His Guru Maharaja.

 

When Guru Kripa and Yasodananda continued to visit Srila Lailita Prasada Srila Prabhupada at frist did not object.It was only when Srila Laitla Prasada spoke to them of points not in line with Srila Bhaktisiddanta Prabhupadas teachings that Srila Prabhupada told GuruKripa 'I dont know why Srila Lalita Prasada has told you such and such ,it is best you do not go there."

 

Srila Lailta Prasada when they met him alone at once told Guru Kripa and Yasoda Nanda what thier eternal rasa with Krishna is.

Guru Kripa told me as soon "as Srila Prabhupada told me better not to go back I never did.And the point of telling us what our relationship with Krishna is ,yes he has told us ...but that will not take place for millions of births."

[Guruvani]

The argument and debate about the war with the Godbrothers of Srila Prabhupada is so tired and abused that it simply doesn't deserve any attention of the forums anymore.

 

Many of us have been through this debate and discussion ad nauseum for the last few years and it is just chewing the chewed over and over again.

 

After 35 years and the breakdown of ISKCON the argument just doesn't have any relevance anymore.

 

Maybe Admin can create a section of the forum entitled "Chewing the chewed" for such discussion?

[stonehearted]

I agree here, too, KB. It's as relishable as ABC gum. (That's "already been chewed" for the uninitiated.)

[Pita das]

ISKCON is not disturbed by how many disfunctional persons may be serveing within as mangers...there is an Inner and Outter circle in ISKCON .

 

The outter circle the disclips of Srila Prabhupada formally ...within ISKCON such as Jayaadwaita Swami or outside of it such a Tripurai Swami Jagat Guru Narasimha Swami are still ISKCON .Jahnavi Nita Prabhu's Bhaktivedanta Ashram is ISKCON .

 

The disinfrancized menber whom can not find a place of service within ISKCON are still part of the International society for Krishna but preaches the glories of the holy name is ISKCON,The Ritvik section is still ISKCON the GM which is now filled with Former ISKCON menbers is also ISKCON the Hari Bol International society is still ISKCON From Srila Bhaktisiddanta's branch Gaudiya Math all is ISKCON.

 

All of these devottees will join in kirtian together with Lord Chaitanya leading the kirtian .

ISKCON will remain as long as one person is still reading Srila Prabhupadas books and want to surrender to him.

[Murali_Mohan_das]

Verily!! As Sripad Goswami points out, "International Society for Krishna Consciousness" is almost a direct translation of "Sri Krishna Chaitanya".

 

All aspiring Gaudiya Vaishnavas pray for the service of Sriman Mahaprabhu.

 

Just as Mahaprabhu divided His associates into kirttan parties for the Jagannath Ratha Yatra, so, despite being in different kirttan parties, the Vaishnavas are all one family.

 

 

ISKCON is not disturbed by how many disfunctional persons may be serveing within as mangers...there is an Inner and Outter circle in ISKCON .

 

The outter circle the disclips of Srila Prabhupada formally ...within ISKCON such as Jayaadwaita Swami or outside of it such a Tripurai Swami Jagat Guru Narasimha Swami are still ISKCON .Jahnavi Nita Prabhu's Bhaktivedanta Ashram is ISKCON .

 

The disinfrancized menber whom can not find a place of service within ISKCON are still part of the International society for Krishna but preaches the glories of the holy name is ISKCON,The Ritvik section is still ISKCON the GM which is now filled with Former ISKCON menbers is also ISKCON the Hari Bol International society is still ISKCON From Srila Bhaktisiddanta's branch Gaudiya Math all is ISKCON.

 

All of these devottees will join in kirtian together with Lord Chaitanya leading the kirtian .

ISKCON will remain as long as one person is still reading Srila Prabhupadas books and want to surrender to him.