Is there Time in the spiritual world?

[Guruvani]

Is there Time in the spiritual world or only here in the material world?

[Kulapavana]

 

Is there Time in the spiritual world or only here in the material world?

 

first we need to understand WHAT is time

[Guruvani]

 

first we need to understand WHAT is time

 

hmmmmm.......

 

I would say off the top of my head is that time is the passing of one moment to the next.

[theist]

 

first we need to understand WHAT is time

 

Time belongs to the material nature.

 

 

[...]Where nirguna Brahman is found, simple unalloyed goodness prevails. Saguna Brahman is described by the Säìkhya system of philosophy as consisting of twenty-five elements, including the time factor (past, present and future).[...]

SB 3.26.15

[Murali_Mohan_das]

Another off-the-top-of-the-head definition:

 

Time is the perception that events are happening sequentially and not simultaneously and eternally.

 

 

hmmmmm.......

 

I would say off the top of my head is that time is the passing of one moment to the next.

[Guruvani]

 

Another off-the-top-of-the-head definition:

 

Time is the perception that events are happening sequentially and not simultaneously and eternally.

 

But, even if we say that Krishna's lilas are all happening simultaneously and eternally, within each pastime there is a sequence of one moment passing to the next right?

 

Doesn't Krishna bring the cows in at a certain point in the lila?

[Murali_Mohan_das]

Good question! I'm tempted to wave my hand and say "inconceivable"...

 

I recall Param-Gurudev mentioning something about this topic in my summer reading. Perhaps I'll do some digging.

 

 

But, even if we say that Krishna's lilas are all happening simultaneously and eternally, within each pastime there is a sequence of one moment passing to the next right?

 

Doesn't Krishna bring the cows in at a certain point in the lila?

[Kulapavana]

 

hmmmmm.......

 

I would say off the top of my head is that time is the passing of one moment to the next.

 

time is actually a force. a force which makes things progress from one stage or point to another. a relentless force which makes this material world work.

 

if we look at a computer program, it has a built in system of commands which say: "when you complete task A go to task B, when you complete task B go to task C" and so on. This is the force of time in the computer language but the universe is programmed as well, and the role of time is identical.

[Guruvani]

Here is an interesting verse from SB that describes that there are apparently even seasons in Vaikuntha.

 

 

Śrīmad Bhāgavatam 3.15.16

 

yatra naiḥśreyasaḿ nāma

vanaḿ kāma-dughair drumaiḥ

sarvartu-śrībhir vibhrājat

kaivalyam iva mūrtimat

 

SYNONYMS

yatra — in the Vaikuṇṭha planets; naiḥśreyasam — auspicious; nāma — named; vanam — forests; kāma-dughaiḥ — yielding desire; drumaiḥ — with trees; sarva — all; ṛtu — seasons; śrībhiḥ — with flowers and fruits; vibhrājat — splendid; kaivalyam — spiritual; iva — as; mūrtimat — personal.

 

 

TRANSLATION

In those Vaikuṇṭha planets there are many forests which are very auspicious. In those forests the trees are desire trees, and in all seasons they are filled with flowers and fruits because everything in the Vaikuṇṭha planets is spiritual and personal.

 

[Kulapavana]

 

Good question! I'm tempted to wave my hand and say "inconceivable"...

 

 

Krsna brings in the cows home not when the darkness falls but when he desires to enter another leela. Darkness falls because he wants to perform rasa leela, not because the sun goes down.

 

There is no FORCE of time in the spiritual sky, only the whimsical progression of the leela based on Krsna's will and pleasure.

 

One cowherd to another: "My oh my, this is surely a very long night!"

Other gopa sighs: "I have a feeling that the gopis are very naughty tonight"

[Guruvani]

 

 

There is no FORCE of time in the spiritual sky,

 

Well, as Krishna says in Bhagavad Gita "kalo smi" (I am Time)

 

So, even if there is force of time, it is Krishna forcing himself and not anything else!

 

Krishna is the controller of time.

So, time serves the will of Krishna and there is no question of time forcing Krishna to do anything.

Time works according to his sweet arrangement.

[Murali_Mohan_das]

Well, even in the material realm, say, when on vacation without any schedule or time-sensitive obligations, it's possible to have a temporary sense of timelessness (by the mercy of the Lord, no doubt).

 

I spent a couple of hours in a park by the East River in New York not too long ago. I was reading and watching the children play. The only indicator of time were the boats passing by in the river and the lengthening of the shadows.

 

 

Well, as Krishna says in Bhagavad Gita "kalo smi" (I am Time)

 

So, even if there is force of time, it is Krishna forcing himself and not anything else!

 

Krishna is the controller of time.

So, time serves the will of Krishna and there is no question of time forcing Krishna to do anything.

Time works according to his sweet arrangement.

[Guruvani]

 

Well, even in the material realm, say, when on vacation without any schedule or time-sensitive obligations, it's possible to have a temporary sense of timelessness (by the mercy of the Lord, no doubt). I spent a couple of hours in a park by the East River in New York not too long ago. I was reading and watching the children play. The only indicator of time were the boats passing by in the river and the lengthening of the shadows.

 

They must have some good weed in New York?

(just joking)

[Murali_Mohan_das]

Not as good as the Kali weed. I actually fasted when I was back East. Go figure!!

 

They must have some good weed in New York?

(just joking)

[Guruvani]

 

Not as good as the Kali weed. I actually fasted when I was back East. Go figure!!

 

Musta been flashbacks from THC withdrawal?

[Murali_Mohan_das]

 

Musta been flashbacks from THC withdrawal?

Funny how that works, isn't it? If one smokes all the time, then one feels some anxiety without it and, after smoking it, simply feels "normal"--addiction (adiksha?) is not so much fun!

 

Stopping, even temporarily, can lead to some pretty profound experiences.

 

I still hope to give that addiction up for good (the sooner the better).

 

Here's a song I wrote on that topic (more or less):

 

If It's Not Too Late

by MM

copyright 1998

 

Lord free me from this ugly conceit

That clouds my head

And nails my feet to the floor

Oh Oh Oh Oh

Verse2:

I thought that I saw Your face

But turned away

Shamed and disgraced

Once more

Oh Oh Oh Oh

 

Chorus:

Lord if it’s not too late

I’d like to change my fate

Lord if it’s not too late

I’d like to put down this weight

Lord if it’s not too late

I’d like to celebrate You

Verse3:

Though I suffer from

A weakness of spirit

I know that when I pray

You oh Lord can hear it

Bridge:

And as I flex my will

In the direction of light

This false ego

Will put up a fight

 

Chorus

 

 

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[Guruvani]

Murali,

I found some good vitamins on a regular basis helps to curb the addiction.

After you take good vitamins the poison just makes you feel bad not good or high.

At least, for me it helped.

Toxins are only pleasurable when our body is toxic.

When your body is flushed of toxins by a powerful vitamin influx the WEED starts feeling like poison instead of nectar.

 

When the stuff starts making you sick instead of HIGH, then you feel like avoiding it.

A good cleansing and a vitamin regimen might help your body detect the WEED as a poison and NOT a sweet herb.

[Murali_Mohan_das]

Maybe my problem is that I still see it as medicine and not poison (though many medicines are also poisons).

 

Of course, the goal with any medicine (well, maybe not the pharmaceuticals--their makers want customers for life) is to transcend the need (or perceived need) for it.

 

As you say, though, the best way to quit is to lose one's taste, and, as Srila Prabhupada said, the best way to do that is to acquire a higher taste (no pun intended).

 

 

Murali,

I found some good vitamins on a regular basis helps to curb the addiction.

After you take good vitamins the poison just makes you feel bad not good or high.

At least, for me it helped.

Toxins are only pleasurable when our body is toxic.

When your body is flushed of toxins by a powerful vitamin influx the WEED starts feeling like poison instead of nectar.

 

When the stuff starts making you sick instead of HIGH, then you feel like avoiding it.

A good cleansing and a vitamin regimen might help your body detect the WEED as a poison and NOT a sweet herb.

[Guruvani]

 

Maybe my problem is that I still see it as medicine and not poison (though many medicines are also poisons).

 

Of course, the goal with any medicine (well, maybe not the pharmaceuticals--their makers want customers for life) is to transcend the need (or perceived need) for it.

 

As you say, though, the best way to quit is to lose one's taste, and, as Srila Prabhupada said, the best way to do that is to acquire a higher taste (no pun intended).

For some reason it just got to the point for me where I didn't enjoy being stoned anymore. I hated it actually, but I kept doing it out of habit.

 

Eventually, I just got tired of being stoned and stopped.

It just got to be so depressing and miserable that I couldn't take it anymore.

I had to quit.

I wasn't pleasurable anymore.

 

I was taking some good vitamins at that time which is what I attribute to the fact that the weed starting seeming like poison instead of sweet herb.

 

Smoking weed is a burden.

I eventually just got very tired and exhuasted with being stoned.

It was miserable and a prison I wanted out of.

[realist]

'TIME I AM DESTROYER OF THE WORLDS' Krishna tells Arjuna

 

Yes, time belongs to the material world (mahat-tattva)

[Beggar]

Does anybody know what time it is? Does anybody care...?

[Guruvani]

 

Does anybody know what time it is? Does anybody care...?

 

Here in Florida is it 9:32 a.m.

Yes, I care.

I have got some things to do on time.

[Murali_Mohan_das]

 

Does anybody know what time it is? Does anybody care...?

 

Yay!! Beggar is still embodied!!!

 

"Time keeps on slippin', slippin', slippin', into the future"

 

I looked through Search for Sri Krishna and Golden Volcano yesterday, but couldn't find the specific references to time of which I was thinking. Perhaps it was in Divine Aspiration.