Why Does God Exist?

[gHari]

This was a question that came to me as I was chanting in the rain on the way to the Festival of India on Centre Island this year. I rarely come up with questions, so when I had the opportunity to join a group who were posing questions for Jayadvaita Swami Maharaja to answer, I wrote it on a piece of paper. He handled it quite trivially, but later we discussed it in private and realized that there was a lot of appreciation for Krsna's unique position hidden in the actual answer.

 

It leads us to inquire: why is God a cowherd boy? Why does He play the flute? All these things - is it His choice or is that just the way He is? Is He beautiful or is what He is our definition of beauty?

 

Hold on to your head - but it will be a nice confusion. A humbling confusion. Acintya.

[Murali_Mohan_das]

 

It leads us to inquire: why is God a cowherd boy? Why does He play the flute? All these things - is it His choice or is that just the way He is? Is He beautiful or is what He is our definition of beauty?

 

Avoiding the titular topic, who said God is just a cowherd boy?

 

I ended up at the Ashram last night and listened to Parvat Maharaja reading the chapter in Bhagavad Gita regarding the Universal Form of the Lord. The Universal Form contains infinite countenances and infinite limbs.

 

Of course, Vaishnavas think of Sri Govinda as the "primeval" or "original" form of the Lord, but how can we say that God is a cowherd boy when God is also a hurricane?

 

It's safe to say that the Cowherd Boy is the most *attractive* form of the Lord.

[mahak]

The one I heard is why is krsna blue. The answer my esteemed mentor (siksa guru) gave to the fellow was "Oh, you think he should have picked another color?". Another answer than I gave once was "Yamaraja already had green."

 

Why does God exist? The mayavada would answer "because he noticed that He was there anyway." What did he do before he created his very first Lord Brahma.

 

Nice thing about Krsna Consciousness is that these questions are funny. Why? Because He doesnt really care if he exists or not, he just plays. He has other aspects of Himself deasl with religion, heaven and hell for the multitudes, creation and annihilation of the cosmos, such a waste of time. I mean, theres the cows tail, and hes gonna grab it, just because mother yasoda told him not to create such disturbance that way. And this tail grabbin began 1,000,000,000,000,000,000,000,000,000,000,000,000,000 years ago and its still happening, and yasoda is still really mad at him for messin up the butter she worked all mornin on, whippin.

 

Whatta God, eh?

 

mahaksadasa

[Guruvani]

In the books Srila Prabhupada has said that even Mahaprabhu is Vishnu-tattva.

Why are even incarnations of Krishna referred to as "Vishnu-tattva"?

[shiva]

 

Avoiding the titular topic, who said God is just a cowherd boy?

 

I ended up at the Ashram last night and listened to Parvat Maharaja reading the chapter in Bhagavad Gita regarding the Universal Form of the Lord. The Universal Form contains infinite countenances and infinite limbs.

 

Of course, Vaishnavas think of Sri Govinda as the "primeval" or "original" form of the Lord, but how can we say that God is a cowherd boy when God is also a hurricane?

 

It's safe to say that the Cowherd Boy is the most *attractive* form of the Lord.

 

In His Govinda Bhasya; Sri Baladeva Vidyabhusana, the great scholar and acharya has written:

 

Isvara is supremely independent. He is the master of all potencies. He enters the universe and controls it. He awards both material enjoyment and ultimate liberation to the individual spirit souls residing in material bodies. Although He is one, He manifests in many forms. They who understand the transcendental science maintain that He is not different from His own transcendental form and qualities. Although He cannot be perceived by the material senses, He can be perceived by bhakti. He is changeless. He reveals His own spiritual, blissful form to His devotees.

 

"Of all the eternals, one is the supreme eternal. Of all conscious entities, one is the supreme conscious entity."

 

- - Svetasvatara Upanisad 6.13

 

As a vaidurya jewel manifests many different colors, so the Supreme Lord manifests many different forms. Each of these forms is the same perfect, complete, and pure Supreme Lord. In some forms the Lord displays all His qualities, and other forms the Lord does not display all His qualities. Therefore a wise devotee may meditate on all the Lords qualities, as described in the scriptures, as being present in the particular form of the Lord that is chosen for worship.

 

Both Lord Hari and His associates are the same persons in both previous and subsequent actions. Why is that? The sutra explains: "sarvabhedad" because of complete non-difference. This means that because there is no difference in Their personalities, the same Lord Hari and the same associates present in the previous actions are also present in the subsequent actions. That Lord Hari remains one even though He expands into many forms is confirmed in the Gopala-tapane Upanisad in these words:

 

eko pi san bahudha yo vabhati

 

"Although He is one, the Supreme Lord appears in many forms."

 

Also, in the Smriti-sastra it is said:

 

ekaneka-svarupaya

 

"Although He is one, the Supreme Lord appears in many forms."

 

This is also true of the Lord's liberated associates, who remain one even though they appear in many forms. The forms of the Supreme Lord are undivided. They are all full of eternity, knowledge, infinity, and bliss.

 

In this way it is said that although the Lord's forms present a very wonderful variety, still They are all one in essence. Although this truth was also described in sutra 3.2.14, the merciful teacher of Vedanta repeats the same teaching so this very difficult topic may be clearly understood.

 

The Supreme Lord is identical with each of His forms. They are all Him. That a certain form of the Lord is His original form, or an expansion of that form, or an expansion of the expansion is determined only by how much of His powers the Lord chooses to display when He manifests that form. Only in that way are some forms of the Lord considered higher and others less high. The great devotees of the Lord declare:

The Lord's forms are considered greater or lesser on the basis of how much of His transcendental power the Lord chooses to manifest when He reveals them.

 

Because she is not different from the Supreme Lord, Goddess Laksmi is also all pervading. In the Smriti-sastra it is said:

 

Goddess Laksmi is the mother of the worlds. She is the constant companion of Lord Visnu. As Lord Visnu is all pervading, so is she.

 

To think that Goddess Laksmi is different from Lord Visnu, but still all-pervading, is a false, a heretical idea. In this way the idea that Goddess Laksmi is an individual spirit soul, like the many millions of other individual spirit souls is refuted. As Lord Visnu has limitless transcendental qualities, so does Goddess Laksmi. In the scriptures it is said:

 

O Goddess, even if we had tongues like the demigod Brahma, we still could not describe all Your transcendental qualities. O Lotus-eyed Goddess Laksmi, please do not ever abandon your devotees.

 

When Lord Visnu assumes different forms, Goddess Laksmi also assumes different forms and follows Him. In the scriptures it is said:

 

When Lord Visnu assumes the form of a demigod, Goddess Laksmi assumes the form of a demigoddess. When He assumes the form of a human man, she assumes the form of a human woman. In this way she assumes a form to match the form of Lord Visnu.

 

Sri Radha is the origin of all the forms of Goddess Laksmi. Sri Krsna is the origin of all the forms of Lord Visnu. In the Purusa-bodhini Upanisad it is said:

 

In the land of Gokula in Mathura-mandala, Lord Krsna resides. At His two sides are Radha and Candravali.

 

There it is also said:

 

Laksmi, Durga, and the Lord's potencies are expansions of Sri Radha.

[Guruvani]

Why God exists?

Because Srimati Radharani wanted him too!

[mahak]

 

Why God exists?

Because Srimati Radharani wanted him too!

 

God is the last thing on her mind. Once, God (Lord Narayana) got in her way. She was respectful, but wanted him to leave ASAP so she could find the hiding cowherd boy.

 

mahaksadasa

[Murali_Mohan_das]

And neither of you are capitalizing your Divine Pronouns

 

 

God is the last thing on her mind. Once, God (Lord Narayana) got in her way. She was respectful, but wanted him to leave ASAP so she could find the hiding cowherd boy.

 

mahaksadasa

[suchandra]

 

This was a question that came to me as I was chanting in the rain on the way to the Festival of India on Centre Island this year. I rarely come up with questions, so when I had the opportunity to join a group who were posing questions for Jayadvaita Swami Maharaja to answer, I wrote it on a piece of paper. He handled it quite trivially, but later we discussed it in private and realized that there was a lot of appreciation for Krsna's unique position hidden in the actual answer.

 

It leads us to inquire: why is God a cowherd boy? Why does He play the flute? All these things - is it His choice or is that just the way He is? Is He beautiful or is what He is our definition of beauty?

 

Hold on to your head - but it will be a nice confusion. A humbling confusion. Acintya.

The other extreme to this questions somehow seems to have sprung up in the mind of senator Ernie Chambers who did not only ask "Why Does God Exist", but filed a case against God:

 

US Senator sues God

http://www.news.com.au/story/0,23599,22438051-13762,00.html

 

By Nate Jenkins

September 18, 2007 10:01am

<!-- END Story Toolbar --> <!-- Lead Content Panel --> US senator Ernie Chambers is suing God for causing untold death and horror and threatening to cause more.

 

He can be sued in Douglas County, Nebraska, the legislator claims, because He's everywhere.

Angered by another lawsuit he considers frivolous, Chambers says he's trying to make the point that anybody can file a lawsuit against anybody.

 

Chambers says in his lawsuit that God has made terroristic threats against the senator and his constituents, inspired fear and caused "widespread death, destruction and terrorization of millions upon millions of the Earth's inhabitants."

 

The senator, who skips morning prayers during the legislative session and often criticizes Christians, also says God has caused "fearsome floods ... horrendous hurricanes, terrifying tornadoes."

 

He's seeking a permanent injunction against the Almighty.

 

Chambers said the lawsuit was triggered by a federal suit filed against a judge who recently barred words such as "rape" and "victim" from a sexual assault trial.

 

The accuser in the criminal case, Tory Bowen, sued Lancaster District Judge Jeffre Cheuvront, claiming that he violated her free speech rights.

 

Chambers said Bowen's lawsuit is inappropriate because the Nebraska Supreme Court has already considered the case and federal courts follow the decisions of state supreme courts on state matters.

 

"This lawsuit having been filed and being of such questionable merit creates a circumstance where my lawsuit is appropriately filed," Chambers said. "People might call it frivolous but if they read it they'll see there are very serious issues I have raised."

 

US District Judge Richard Kopf, in an order last week, expressed doubts about whether Bowen's lawsuit "has any legal basis whatsoever" and said sanctions may be imposed against Bowen and her attorneys if they fail to show cause for the lawsuit.

 

The Associated Press usually does not identify accusers in sex-assault cases, but Bowen has allowed her name to be used publicly because of the issue over the judge's language restrictions.

Cheuvront declared a mistrial in the sexual assault trial in July, saying pretrial publicity made it impossible to gather enough impartial jurors.

[Guruvani]

 

God is the last thing on her mind. Once, God (Lord Narayana) got in her way. She was respectful, but wanted him to leave ASAP so she could find the hiding cowherd boy.

 

mahaksadasa

That is a weird idea.

Are you trying to say that Radharani is an atheist?

Is she an irreligious person?

 

If she doesn't see Krishna as God then who is God in Vrindavan?

 

The Vrajavasis don't worship God?

[mahak]

 

And neither of you are capitalizing your Divine Pronouns

 

No, lower case is my way of acknowledging the extreme difference between GOD and Sri Sri Radha Krsna. Maybe Ill capitalize Indra's pronoun, because I dont want a thunderbolt to ruin my day, but I dont capitalize the pronoun of the one I want to rassle. Or hassle the cows with, grabbin their tails and lie dat.:eek::eek::eek::eek:

 

Just like my smiley face. It says "EEK", but its my way of smilin. Like my best cat ever, Sivadas, who got old and could barely walk. My daughter would tell him, "run!", and I would tell her, "he is runnin".

 

Sivadas was an awesome cat, used to make the raccoons hide in the trees. Some folks have mousers, I had a raccooner. Sivadas's heir is the black panther named spook, was very little, but now is very big, if he keeps it up, im gonna have to contact the guiness folks to see if a record is approachable. We keep him inside because the big dogs are scared of him. No fat, all black panther.

 

I guess i digress (oops, forgot to capitalize the I, forgot my divinity, I guess.)

 

mahaksadasa

[theist]

 

This was a question that came to me as I was chanting in the rain on the way to the Festival of India on Centre Island this year. I rarely come up with questions, so when I had the opportunity to join a group who were posing questions for Jayadvaita Swami Maharaja to answer, I wrote it on a piece of paper. He handled it quite trivially, but later we discussed it in private and realized that there was a lot of appreciation for Krsna's unique position hidden in the actual answer.

 

It leads us to inquire: why is God a cowherd boy? Why does He play the flute? All these things - is it His choice or is that just the way He is? Is He beautiful or is what He is our definition of beauty?

 

Hold on to your head - but it will be a nice confusion. A humbling confusion. Acintya.

 

"It leads us to inquire: why is God a cowherd boy? Why does He play the flute? All these things - is it His choice or is that just the way He is? Is He beautiful or is what He is our definition of beauty?"

I like these kinds of questions that makes us reexamine what we take as obvious. Very nice contemplations. I find the value in the contemplation more than in a need to come to a final answer.

 

Why is God a cowherd boy?

Brings up more questions to me. Is Krsna a cowherd boy before His appearance in India? Or were the qualities exhibited by His appearance in Vrndavan tailored to the culture that He appeared in to exhibit those qualities? Funny how the highest realization of God mirrors the exact culture of India at that time.

 

If Krsna were to display those same qualities of infant, childhood, youth, lover. friend.rascal. protector and one in need of protection on another planet with a completely different social structure, one so different we could not imagine, say with no cows or even what we call human forms, would it be any less then our concept of Gokula in essence although completly different in form?

 

This is a very tricky area which is where the mayavadi would point to and say see the Vaisnava's are being anthropomorphic in their approach to God.

 

But I want to bring up the idea that the eternal spiritual abode or chamber of God where these pastimes of intimacy with the Lord are displayed may not be limited to just our human, Indian style conceptions at all. There maybe an unlimited type of such places in form and style, and all existing beyond Brahman realization and not to be confused with varying similar astral realms which are alredy know to exist.

 

I know what the stock answer is but I like to reexamine stock answers. Actually not looking for an answer at all, just trying to flow with gHari's excercise in contemplation

[gHari]

 

I like these kinds of questions that makes us reexamine what we take as obvious. Very nice contemplations. I find the value in the contemplation more than in a need to come to a final answer. [...]

 

I find this question promotes a very intimate relationship with Krsna. Perhaps they are even questions He may ask Himself. It seems that intimate.

 

I mean, it's always about us, our liberation, our devotion. But now it's about Him, from His vantage point. Sure, He's laughing at my naivety, but maybe He enjoys my interest just the same.

[theist]

 

Perhaps they are even questions He may ask Himself. It seems that intimate.

I sometimes wonder this. What does Krsna think that is held back from the jivas, you know just for Himself, about it all.

[mahak]

 

That is a weird idea.

Are you trying to say that Radharani is an atheist?

Is she an irreligious person?

 

If she doesn't see Krishna as God then who is God in Vrindavan?

 

The Vrajavasis don't worship God?

 

But is the basis of the whole idea of personal relationship (rasa). How can mother Yasoda tie up god. She cannot, but baby Krsna allows himself to be tied up by the love of Yasoda. Have you never heard of Yogamaya, the transcendental illusion that makes all rasas possible? I am surprised that you would not see the meaning of the post and the well known story that is the sweetness of madurya rasa.

 

Sometimes (like when Sri Krsna speaks the gita on arjunas chariot), the veil of Yogamaya is dropped, but the gita also affirms that arjunas preference is not for the universal form of God, or even the four armed Lord Narayana, but the intimate friendship of Krsna. He also drops the veil of Yogamaya, a necessity of pure bhakti yoga, when Mother Yasoda is admonishing Him for eating dirt. For a brief instance, Baby Krsna shows Her that he is God, within his mouth he reveals the entire cosmic manifestation, but then the veil is back on, and he agrees to her natural maternal disciplines.

 

Srimati Radharani is not an atheist. When her beloved Krsna appears to her in the form of Lord Narayana, she immediately drops to offer her respectful obiesancies. But Lord Narayana is not her priority, and not her object of Love, and is seen by her as an unwelcome interference in her relationship with her beloved Krsna, who sshe does NOT see as god, but as the nectar of her life which she cannot live without. She has religion, but she AUTOMATICALLY abandons such religion in favor of surrendering to a cowherd boy named Krsna.

 

The Vrajavasis do not worship God. God is a position, an impersonal title. The religionists worship this position, and they have no idea who holds such a position. The residents of Vraja worship Krsna, a cowherd boy, in their presence, and in separation when he abandons them when he moves to the big city.

 

The question is why does God exist. You stated because Radharani wanted him to. My response gives indication that she doesnt really care for the position of God, she is 100% devoted to the cowherd boy that she never stops thinking about, even when DISTURBED by the presence of the Four armed Lord Narayana, the supreme holder of the position of GOD.

 

Without Yogamaya, all God invokes is fear and awe, therefore the higher rasas are unknown to such religionists. Krsna removes the awe and reverence to those who have come to surrender to him more and more, thus establishing transcendental and reciprocal relationship unknown to all religionists. I gave up worshipping god when I left the church, my knees were too sore. Stand up, sit down, kneel, genuflect, get bored to tears by preachers of the position of God being one who will eternally damn everyone to fire and brimstone. All the grovelling was against my natural feelings that were brought about by Srila Prabhupadas presentation to the transcendental softness of the Supreme Lord.

 

Hare Krsna, ys, mahaksadasa

[mahak]

On this day of celebration of the appearance of Sri Krsna's internal potency, Srimati Radharani, I refrain from religious worship of god. Instead I immerse myself in the pastimes of storybook children running thru the groves, witnessed by madfolks waving their arms in the air like they just dont care. Gokuladhama, not a throne in heaven. That is Indras world.

 

haribol, ys, mahaksadasa

[krsna]

<CENTER>

</CENTER>JAI SHRI RADHE

 

O supremely beaming young and modest,

O supremely gleaming and knowing Goddess,

O extremely golden glowing Radharani,

extremely bold and extremely charming.

 

You forever renew the meaning of beauty,

You forever revive the meaning of duty,

You forever increase the pleasure of peace,

Your glorious qualities forever increase.

 

Each moment of Your very life is a new sacrifice

on the altar of love in a most invigorating sweet spice,

more sweeter and more tender in Your most intense and careful surrender, forever and ever as you render

Your most sacred service to Govinda.

 

I bow down to Your two Lotus Feet,

supremely soft and supremely sweet,

it is only to Them that all should retreat

to realize the love with which none can compete.

 

O Shrimati Radharani,

Who supremely reigns over God Hari,

the only place we’ll not be sorry

is under the shelter of Radha Hari.

 

She is our real Mother of whom there’s no other

and He is our real Father,

but They can be like Sister and Brother

and Friends like no other.

 

They are the supremely beautiful mystery,

recorded deep in our soul’s displaced history,

just know that all belongs to He and She

to do with us just what They please.

 

Service is the lesson She supremely teaches,

for Her desire to please Krishna goes to the farthest reaches,

and when one is successful, She imbues him with Her love,

so success is every step of that pure Vaishnava,

standing out like the sun, enlightening everyone!!!

 

What is the sweetest overflowing honey,

the most precious living gem?

Srimati Radharani!!!!!

Beauty surrounds our real home that exists

controlled alone by this one Mistress,

who alone can mitigate all our distress,

by asking Her lover Krishna to finally accept us.

 

Her body the sweetest purest spiritual nectar,

is all the Supreme Lord Sri Krishna is after,

for She simply is made of the most perfect love,

that supremely enthralls our Lord Govinda.

 

Both of Them are the supreme destination,

for They are Love’s Supreme Combination,

eternally One yet in separation,

expanding everywhere, within and beyond creation.

 

They are the supreme goal

of you and me and every soul,

but They we never can know,

unless Their mercy They show.

Only attached to Shri Krishna’s Name,

Shrimati Radharani supremely does reign.

if Lord Krishna puts Her in distress,

She feels supremely blessed.

‘O Radhe Radhe’ the greatest souls pray,

‘Under Your sweetest shade we simply pray to stay,

for we know there is no other way,

than to get the mercy of jai Shri Radhe.’

Radha is gold and Krishna is blue,

call out Their Names bold and make your love true,

Rama is most strong and beyond all wrong,

so just chant Their Names and you’ll soon belong.

 

Hare Krishna, Hare Krishna

Krishna Krishna, Hare Hare

Hare Rama Hare Rama,

Rama Rama, Hare Hare

 

Jai Shri Radhe, O She with love’s purest golden body,

Jai Shri Radhe, only sanctuary for the Godly,

Jai Shri Radhe, O Queen of Vrindavana,

for Shri Krishna’s service She always is plotting,

for that One in Her heart is never forgotten.

 

Jai Shrimati Radharani, O Shri Krishna’s sweetest Honey,

for whom His heart is always running,

because Her beauty is supremely stunning,

She is the highest embodiment of love,

for Krishna, the God of all gods above.

 

Jai Shrimati Radharani, without You there’s no winning,

for You have the heart that gives Bhakti its beginning,

in the hearts now lost in this world of the sinning,

because Your love is so overflowing

it is even beyond Lord Shri Krishna’s knowing.

Jaya jaya Shri Radhika, whose mercy the greatest souls are seeking,

anyone who hankers to know the secret of secrets

must pray for the mercy of most glorious Shri Radhika!

Lord Krishna will not come to grab any sikha

without the fervent call of His beloved Shri Radhika.

 

Jai Shrimati Radharani, the owner and master of love’s very garden,

the supreme abode of Krishna, known as Shri Vrindavana,

where for Krishna only all hearts are ecstatically throbbing.

 

Jai Srimati Radharani, please O please now beg my pardon,

for although I am the most offensive,

still I’m praying for Your Presence,

for without You I am nowhere, without any protection,

but I know for everyone you have unlimited affection.

 

O dearest Shrimati Radharani, O source of boundless compassion,

only You can take us to Krishna, that One of all attraction!!!

 

Please hear how I pray, my dearest Shri Radhe,

may I taste the supreme nectar of Your sweetest Holy Name,

the aim and only source of Lord Shri Krishna’s Fame.

 

O Shri Radhe, please allow me to enter Your play,

and on that endless playground always let me stay,

crying out Your Name Jai Shri Radhe! Jai Shri Radhe!

You turned all Vrindavan gold by your love most forceful and bold,

You turned Krishna gold and sent Him down here below,

and here He becomes mad to save all the bad,

but at the very same time Your mercy He must grab,

He must understand your love for Him most grand,

so now He lays on the sand praying for Your Hand.

 

‘I am so much more tiny than a grain of sand on this beach,

I am even lower than the straw on the street,

if I’m to taste life’s most essential treat

I must feel like this, if Krishna I wish to reach.’

 

in this mood of Shrimati Radharani Shri Gourasundara preached.

 

‘Radharani is the tree of service to Shri Hari,

and She is willing to tolerate all for the service of He,

and like the tree I must be’ cried Shri Goura Hari,

‘so I may always chant Krishna’s Names incessantly.’

O Shri Radhe, love is Your play,

and no one can know love without Shri Radhe,

love is at Krishna’s Feet, and Her Name is completely sweet,

so sweet it does defeat He who is perfectly replete.

Jai Shri Radhe, most steady Lady,

eternally ready to answer Krishna’s bidding,

You fulfill all the wishes of Govinda Krishna,

with everything She does and with the most tasty dishes,

He can never repay Shrimati Radhe

nor Her female expansions the Gopis,

who are Krishna’s greatest devotees!

 

This poem I can not stop for I’m drowning in a drop

for you see there’s no end to this love I can’t stop.

 

Shrimati Radharani is God’s equal body

and from Her comes all inspiration,

the supreme celebration that is real life’s highest elevation!

 

Real life is love of God brought by Shrila Prabhupada,

this is all the gift of Radharani, the highest gift from Shri Vrindavana,

Radha is the Supreme Goddess, and Krishna is the Supreme God,

but Neither could be known without Shrila Prabhpada.

Shrila Prabhupada is Radharani’s greatest contribution,

to save us souls on planet earth from illusion.

 

Thank you, Radharani, for Shrila Prabhupada,

for now we know the way to You

if we just stay humbler than the straw

we may always chant Hare Krishna

and always feel the protection of Jai Shri Radha,

with unlimited friends here in Mrytuloka.

 

Anubhavananda Dasa

September 19,1999

Seattle, Washington

[mahak]

 

thanks for di tears, Krsna