phk12 Posted September 24, 2007 Report Share Posted September 24, 2007 hi i am a catholic and i have been reading a few of the hare krishna books i was reading about spiritual masters and their purpose i adknowledge jesus as my ''spiritual master'' i havent always been a catholic and i find it a little contradicting sometimes i was just wondering if there was anything in the books hare krishnas read that can be implemented in catholicism i.e. forms of worship(puja, offerings, prayers) that i can offer to jesus as i find some of the catholic methods a little mundane and mechanical (not from the heart) and i was reading about these pujas and food offered to spirirtual masters and thought it would be nice to do that for jesus and if this would be authorized practice look forward to hearing from you all Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
theist Posted September 24, 2007 Report Share Posted September 24, 2007 hi i am a catholic and i have been reading a few of the hare krishna books i was reading about spiritual masters and their purpose i adknowledge jesus as my ''spiritual master'' i havent always been a catholic and i find it a little contradicting sometimes i was just wondering if there was anything in the books hare krishnas read that can be implemented in catholicism i.e. forms of worship(puja, offerings, prayers) that i can offer to jesus as i find some of the catholic methods a little mundane and mechanical (not from the heart) and i was reading about these pujas and food offered to spirirtual masters and thought it would be nice to do that for jesus and if this would be authorized practice look forward to hearing from you all Any offering can be mundane if done as simply a religious duty and not with genuine love. So in the beginning it called sadhana bhakti or bhakti(loving devotion to the Lord) in practice. We only get stuck if we believe there is nothing more than the practice and fail to progress to the heart level. If you are inclined you can offer fruits, flower, water, incense, respectful bows and praise to a picture of Lord Jesus Christ. You can even place a picture of Lord Jesus and Lord Krsna side by side, which is even better because the Son is never separate from the Father nor the Father from the Son yet they are distinct individual beings. We can make progress by worshipping Jesus alone but only to a certain very preliminary point. This is bevause His whole mission was to help the fallen souls (us) become reunited with the Father. By worshipping the Supreme Person Yahweh or Krsna as we like to call Him and especially by chanting His name, Jesus becomes very pleased and to please the spiritual master is the duty of the disciple. You needn't try to duplicate every detail of hindu modes of puja or anything beyond just the basics, a simple offering will suffice. Jaya Yeshua Jaya Krsna Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guruvani Posted September 24, 2007 Report Share Posted September 24, 2007 Theist (the forum member) will be a good resource for you to discuss with. He has as a good way with with Christian oriented people. He has a well-balanced and congenial rapore with devotees coming from a Christian orientation. Take his advices and insights and you will be benefitted nicely. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gHari Posted September 25, 2007 Report Share Posted September 25, 2007 Offer him everything you have: your heart, your mind, your body and senses, your possessions. Thus you can follow his prime instruction: Seek ye first the Kingdom of God. That will make him happiest. And it will make you happiest too, more than you can possibly imagine. Click for: JESUS IN A NUTSHELL Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
suchandra Posted September 25, 2007 Report Share Posted September 25, 2007 .. i find it a little contradicting sometimes i was just wondering if there was anything in the books hare krishnas read that can be implemented in catholicism ... What the founder spiritual master of the Hare Krishnas, A.C. Bhaktivedanta Swami Srila Prabhupada would mention is, 6. Thou shalt not kill. On one side Christians say animals have a soul on the other side they say, "Thou shall not kill" refers to one should not murder. Thats what Vaishnavas find a little contradicting. Next, what is the soul, the Bible somehow sits on the fence and doesnt want to say clearly what is the soul. Just like you have a math book for elementary school, you won't find in that book, explanations about linear algebra. This doesnt mean that this school book is useless, no, but it is not meant for higher studies what is the constitutional position of the soul. This knowledge we find in the Vedas. Again, the Bible is not inferior, but it explains nowhere what is the immortality of soul. Even the very word "soul" is not mentioned not to be found in the biblical vocabulary but rather the term is being used, "living entity". Therefore we find so many different camps among Christians who say, the soul is identical with the material body, the soul dies after this life when one doesnt become a Christian, the soul is made of material elements, in sum the soul is not immortal but what is said is, God created man in His image. His image, God is eternal but his children are not eternal? So this is no critizism but clearly there is knowledge missing what we dont find in the Bible. The Vedas say: For the soul there is never birth nor death. Nor, having once been, does he ever cease to be. He is unborn, undying and eternal. He is not slain when the body dies or is killed. Bhagavad-gita 2.20 For example, the Mundaka Upanishad (3.1.9) explains that the living being is the soul, and that: “The soul is atomic in size and can be perceived by perfect intelligence. This atomic soul is situated within the heart, and spreads its influence all over the body of the embodied living entities. When the soul is purified from the contamination of the five kinds of material air, its spiritual influence is exhibited.” The Chandogya Upanishad (6.11.3) also states that although the body withers and dies when the self or soul leaves it, the living self does not die. Further enlightenment is given in the Srimad-Bhagavatam (7.2.22) wherein it explains that the spirit soul has no death and is eternal and inexhaustible. He is completely different from the material body, but because of being misled by misuse of his slight independence, he is obliged to accept subtle and gross bodies created by the material energy and thus be subjected to so-called material happiness and distress. The eternal nature of the self is also explained in Bhagavad-gita by Lord Sri Krishna where He specifically says that there was never a time when He did not exist, nor any of the living beings, including you. Nor shall any of us cease to be in the future. The embodied soul continually passes from boyhood to youth to old age in this body. Similarly the soul enters another body at the time of death. But for one who is self-realized, there is no bewilderment through such a change. Certainly this knowledge can relieve anyone from the anxiety that comes from thinking our existence is finished at death. Spiritually, we do not die; yet, the body is used until it is no longer fit to continue. At that time, it may appear that we die, but that is not the case. The soul continues on its journey to another body according to its destiny. The indestructibility of the soul is also explained. The individual soul is unbreakable and insoluble, and can be neither burned nor dried. The soul is everlasting, unchangeable, and eternally the same. Knowing this, we should not grieve for the temporary body. So, the body dwindles and dies but the soul does not die: it simply changes bodies. Therefore, the body is like a shirt or coat that we wear for some time, and when it is worn out, we change it for a new one. Therefore, the Vedic literature, such as the Chandogya Upanishad (8.1.1), mentions that knowledge of the self within is what should be sought and understood by all. Realizing one’s spiritual identity solves the problems and mysteries of life. The more we realize our spiritual identity, the more we will see that we are beyond these temporary material bodies, and that our identity is not simply being a white body, or black, or yellow, or fat, skinny, intelligent, dumb, old, young, strong, weak, blind, etc. Real blindness means not being able to see through the temporary and superficial bodily conditions and into the real person within. Seeing reality means to recognize the spiritual nature of everyone. The Srimad-Bhagavatam (11.28.35) explains that the soul is self-luminous, beyond birth and death, and unlimited by time or space and, therefore, beyond all change. The Bhagavatam (11.22.50) also points out that as one witnesses the birth and death of a tree and is separate from it, similarly the witness of the birth, death, and various activities of the body is within but separate from it. The size of the soul is also described in the Svetasvatara Upanishad (5.9): “When the upper point of a hair is divided into one hundred parts and again each of such parts is further divided into one hundred parts, each such part is the measurement of the dimension of the spirit soul.” So considering that the diameter of a typical hair is about three-thousandths of an inch wide, then to divide that into one hundreds parts, and then divide one of those parts again into one hundred parts means that it would be microscopic. And since it is spiritual and not made of material substance, to perceive the presence of the soul is not so easy. It is invisible to our material vision. The Katha Upanishad relates that within the body, higher than the senses and the sense objects, exists the mind. More subtle than the mind is the intelligence, and higher and more subtle than the intellect is the self. That self is hidden in all beings and does not shine forth, but is seen by subtle seers through their sharp intellect. From this we can understand that within the gross physical body, composed of various material elements, such as earth, air, water, etc., there is also the subtle body composed of the finer subtle elements of mind, intelligence and false ego. The psychic activities take place within the subtle body. It is also within the subtle body wherein exist the memories of past lives, however deep they may be. Yet, the living being has his spiritual form that is deeper than this subtlety, otherwise he could not have repeated births. A person actually sees his spiritual self as well as the presence of the Supreme Being when he perceives that both the gross and subtle bodies have nothing to do with the pure, spiritual self within. Therefore, it could be asked that since we are separate from the gross and subtle bodies, why do we so strongly identify with the material body? It is explained that though the material body is different from the soul, it is because of the ignorance due to material association that one falsely identifies oneself with the high and low bodily conditions. It is further elaborated that only because of the mind and ego that we experience material happiness and distress. Yet, in actuality, the spirit soul is above such material existence and can never really be affected by material happiness and distress in any circumstance. A person who truly perceives this has nothing to fear from the material creation, or the appearance of births and deaths. Thus, he can attain real peace. The Chandogya Upanishad (8.1.5-6) goes on to explain that the self is free from sin and old age, death and grief, hunger and thirst, lamentation and sadness, and all forms of bodily identification. It desires only what it ought to desire, and imagines nothing but what it ought to imagine. Those who depart from this life without having discovered the self and those true or spiritual desires have no freedom in all the worlds. But those who depart from here after realizing one’s genuine spiritual identity and those spiritual inclinations have freedom in all the worlds. So, to summarize, the soul is a particle of consciousness and bliss in its purified state of being. It is not material in any way. It is what departs from the body at the time of death and, in the subtle body, carries its mental impressions, desires and tendencies, along with the karmic results of its activities from one body to another. To understand and perceive this self, which is our genuine spiritual identity, is the real goal of life. Such a realization relieves one of further material existence. As it is explained, those who have purified their consciousness, becoming absorbed in spiritual knowledge and absolving any impurities in the mind, are liberated from karma that frees them from any future births. They are free from any more births in the material world and are delivered to the spiritual atmosphere. How to do this is the ultimate accomplishment of human existence. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
phk12 Posted September 25, 2007 Author Report Share Posted September 25, 2007 Thankyou all for your input it has made a few things clearer and i feel a little more confident i mean i have read the bible and i have also read the bhagavad-gita i am first and foremost a catholic but i am not letting that restrict me in looking at other peoples religions faiths and beliefs because all these different practises of worshiping god all lead to the same god be his name krishna, allah, jahova some are just a little harder to find the message than others but if you remain sincere god will reveal himself to that person whichever path he chooses to take in looking for him Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
suchandra Posted September 27, 2007 Report Share Posted September 27, 2007 Thankyou all for your input it has made a few things clearer and i feel a little more confident i mean i have read the bible and i have also read the bhagavad-gita i am first and foremost a catholic but i am not letting that restrict me in looking at other peoples religions faiths and beliefs because all these different practises of worshiping god all lead to the same god be his name krishna, allah, jahova some are just a little harder to find the message than others but if you remain sincere god will reveal himself to that person whichever path he chooses to take in looking for him Prabhupada: "So at least, those who sincerely begin spiritual life, so their next life is guaranteed as human life, human form of life." Lecture, Bhagavad-gita 6.40-44 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
theist Posted September 27, 2007 Report Share Posted September 27, 2007 Prabhupada: "So at least, those who sincerely begin spiritual life, so their next life is guaranteed as human life, human form of life." Lecture, Bhagavad-gita 6.40-44 Yes this is encouraging. Let's hope we are truly at least a little sincere so that we may have this benefit. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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