Drutakarma das - mastermind of sleepervada

[Guruvani]

 

Recently, somebody (I believe it was Gurudev himself) was reminiscing how Srila Prabhupada was trying to get Srila Sridhar Maharaja to see Gandhi when he came to Kolkatta in order to "convert" Gandhi, but Srila Sridhar Maharaja was reluctant to go.

 

Truly Abhay!!! Truly fearless!!!

 

Jai Srila Prabhupada!

 

Actually, in one meeting Srila Prabhupada told Sridhar Maharaja that he wanted a Vedic planetarium to be built under his guidance.

 

But, ISKCON flopped after the passing of Srila Prabhupada and they didn't have enough funds to even think about building the Vedic planetarium Srila Prabhupada wanted built under the guidance of Srila Sridhar Maharaja.

[Vigraha]

 

So, maybe we should all just buy into the doctrine that all the disciples of Srila Bhaktisiddhanta except Srila Prabhupada were mayavadis?

 

Bhaktisiddhanta only had ONE real disciple and Srila Prabhupada has hundreds?

 

That is about what they are trying to say.

 

Guruvani prabhu, no-one would say that. You have put an interpretation on what some have written. I personally see Sridhar Maharaj and Narayana Maharaj as another bonafide branch of Lord Caitanya's tree and NOT on the level of a glass imitation - they are the real thing, they are also dear friends of Srila Prabhupada, they are diamonds in the Vaishnava tradition of Lord Caitanya however, regardless of the different philosophical viewpoints, we all must acknowledge the fact that without Srila Prabhupada, very few would of known Sridhar Maharaj and Narayana Maharaj.

[Murali_Mohan_das]

 

we all must acknowledge the fact that without Srila Prabhupada, very few would of known Sridhar Maharaj and Narayana Maharaj.

True. We also must admit that, without the encouragement and nurturing of Srila Sridhar Maharaja, very few would have known of Srila Prabhupada.

[Guruvani]

 

regardless of the different philosophical viewpoints, we all must acknowledge the fact that without Srila Prabhupada, very few would of known Sridhar Maharaj and Narayana Maharaj.

 

They had NO philosophical differences.

Anyone that says they did is just an ass-kissing GBC cronie with an agenda of personal gain.

[Guruvani]

 

George,

My name is not George.

My name is James.

My devotee name is Kshamabuddhi das and most everyone on this forum knows it.

I have never kept my real identity a secret.

I say it regularly and am not afraid to do so.

What is YOUR real devotee name?

To much of a cheater to say?

I thought so.

[Sarva gattah]

 

My name is not George.

My name is James.

My devotee name is Kshamabuddhi das and most everyone on this forum knows it.

I have never kept my real identity a secret.

I say it regularly and am not afraid to do so.

What is YOUR real devotee name?

To much of a cheater to say?

I thought so.

 

I warned Vigraha dasa you can not be humble to people like you, you and realist make a good pair, bitter, angry, nasty, fault finding, scared and on the mental plateform. Get over it!

[Sarva gattah]

Quote:

<TABLE cellSpacing=0 cellPadding=6 width="100%" border=0><TBODY><TR><TD style="BORDER-RIGHT: #666666 1px solid; PADDING-RIGHT: 3ex; BORDER-TOP: #666666 1px solid; PADDING-LEFT: 3ex; BORDER-LEFT: #666666 1px solid; BORDER-BOTTOM: #666666 1px solid" bgColor=#e0e0e0>Originally Posted by Vigraha

regardless of the different philosophical viewpoints, we all must acknowledge the fact that without Srila Prabhupada, very few would of known Sridhar Maharaj and Narayana Maharaj.

 

 

 

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Quote:

<TABLE cellSpacing=0 cellPadding=6 width="100%" border=0><TBODY><TR><TD style="BORDER-RIGHT: #666666 1px solid; PADDING-RIGHT: 3ex; BORDER-TOP: #666666 1px solid; PADDING-LEFT: 3ex; BORDER-LEFT: #666666 1px solid; BORDER-BOTTOM: #666666 1px solid" bgColor=#e0e0e0>Originally Posted by Vigraha

regardless of the different philosophical viewpoints, we all must acknowledge the fact that without Srila Prabhupada, very few would of known Sridhar Maharaj and Narayana Maharaj.

 

 

 

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From the teachings of Guruvani

 

Srila Prabhupada said he had nothing else to teach other than what he wrote in his books, so there is no need to physically approach him for receiving of knowledge.

We approach a guru to get knowledge.

Srila Prabhupada said that everything he had to teach was in his books.

Oh my god! The editors are not to blame for what is in the books of Srila Prabhupada.

The facts are, Narayana Maharaja is criticizing Srila Prabhupada indirectly, but I for one am not so stupid as to not see that.

Prabhupada said what he said and Narayana Maharaja is trying to present himself as the hero when in fact he abandoned a young wife wife two children to become a sannyasi and live off of the hard work of other people

Narayana Maharaja has never given a class from the books of Srila Prabhupada, yet he claims that Srila Prabhupada is his siksha guru?

I call that lies.

I have read many lecures of Narayana Maharaja and seen the website many times and I have never seen him reading from the books of Srila Prabhupada and quoting Srila Prabhupada and the books.

Only he likes to remind everyone that in the books of Srila Prabhupada there is racist words and woman hating.

If you look back and find my remarks you will find that they were made in response to some very callous and harsh statements being made by the fan club of Sridhar Maharaja about Srila Prabhupada.

Sridhar Maharaja said "I am not wholly one with Swami Maharaja".

So, is it a crime if I am not wholly one with Sridhar Maharaja?

My idea behind this topic was simply to find out if Narayana Maharaja gives classes from the books of Srila Prabhupada, as in my admittedly limited experience I haven't seen that, but now there are some who are telling me that in fact he does occasionaly read from the books

of Srila Prabhupada.

If Narayana Maharaja does read from the books of Srila Prabhupada, then that is something that increases my appreciation for him quite a bit.

However, the BBT editors did not put sexist or racist comments in the books of Srla Prabhupada.

If Narayana Maharaja has objections to some of the things that are written in the books of Srila Prabhupada, then he shouldn't make some wild claim that those things were put int he books by the BBT editors.

That is pure nonsense, but maybe some ridiculous excuse that Jadurani and the gang are feeding Narayana Maharaja.

What is Narayana Maharaja talking about?

The so-called racist and sexist views that Narayana Maharaja is objecting to are traditional Vedic views.

Srila Prabhupada was making sannyasis, and brahmans out of black men before Narayana Maharaja became a world preacher on the coattails of Srila Prabhuapda, so Narayana Maharaja doesn't need to say that there are racist views in the books of Srila Prabhupada and then blame them on the BBT editors.

The very idea that Narayana Maharaja says there are racist and sexist views in the books of Srila Prabhupada is proof that he doesn't understand what Srila Prabhupada has written.

What Narayana Maharaja is saying is racist and sexist in the books of Srila Prabhupada are the words of Srila Prabhupada, not the BBT editors.

So, in essence Narayana Maharaja has criticised Srila Prabhupada and shown that his understanding of the books of Srila Prabhupada are very superficial and shallow.

Then of course, after showing how the books of Srila Prabhupada are racist and sexist, Narayana Maharaja presents himself as the perfect angel with no sexist or racist views, even though he abandoned a devout Hindu wife with two small children to run off and become a "Holy" man.

Holy men don't father children and then run off and leave a young wife and innocent children to suffer and struggle without a husband or a father.

To me that is just despicable and a good example of how callous and hard is the heart of Narayana Maharaja.

Srila Prabhupada stressed in his own books that the devotees of ISKCON should limit their study to his four books: Bhagavat-gita, Nectar of Devotion, Chaitanya Caritamrita and Srimad Bhagavatam, so that leaves no room for reading these other books being written by Narayana Maharaja.

If Narayan Maharaja was a genuine "siksha disciple" of Srila Prabhupada he would not even be translating all these other books, but simply reading and preaching exclusively from the books of Srila Prabhupada that Srila Prabhupada mentioned his disciples to limit themselves too.

The books of Narayana Maharaja are not authorized reading for the disciples and followers of Srila Prabhupada.

To say that the "AS IT IS" idea is not siddhantic is dullard thinking.

All the acharyas have stressed that spiritual knowledge must come down unadulterated, intact and "As It Is".

"As It Is" simply means that it is coming down through disciplic succession.

To say that "As It Is" is not siddhantic is a blatant assault on the integrity of Srila Prabhupada.

Please show us any original Vedic text which promotes the concept of "subjective evolution of consciousness" as told by Sridhar Maharaja.

On the basis of what Gaudiya text is that idea based on?

Is consciousness evolving or unfolding?

Is there something in the consciousness that evolves or it is something that is unearthed from the coverings of illusion?

Don't fool yourself.

Narayana Maharaja has been in the mix from the very beginning as being involved with all the senior ISKCON men during the funeral process of Srila Prabhupada.

Right off the bat Narayana Maharaja was hatefully decrying the ritvik concept and saying that nothing except the "traditional" parampara can be acceptable.

Sridhar Maharaja NEVER espoused the kind of vile contempt for the ritvik system that Narayana Maharaja has from the very beginning.

One difference between the way Srila Prabhupada operated and the way Narayana Maharaja operates is that Srila Prabhupada always built temples and centers for his disciples to have some support structure and devotee society for their assocaition, but Narayana Maharaja is not opening hardly any temples or centers and he just tells everyone to come to the Mayapura parikrama every year and give money to support his temples in India.

He intiates lots of devotees around the world, but then he doesn't provide them any temples or support structures and just expects that ISKCON should accomodate them and integrate them into that society, but it most likely will not happen.

Someday, I think there will be lots and lots of displaced and dis-enchanted disciples of Narayana Maharaja who will feel somewhat neglected because they don't have the temples and structure that ISKCON has for it's members.

They are all big talk and sadhu-sanga now, but when he is gone they will be like orphans without a home.

Narayan Maharaja just doesn't care if his followers have temples and communities and is just satisfied to take money from the west and support his temples in India?

It's obvious that Narayana Maharaja does not share the same vision and same goals as Srila Prabhupada, so the ISKCON people and others have good reason to keep Narayana Maharaja from ISKCON?

It's easy to go all over the world an initiate people.

The hard part is helping them create temples and communities that will support and promote spiritual life.

It's no big accomplishment to initiate a lot of people.

The real accomplishment is to give them something substantial for their maintenance and support.

Srila Prabhupada didn't just initiate a lot of people, but he directed them to build temples and farm communities which would give them an alternative to the materialistic lifestyle that Narayana Maharaja condemns.

all this talk about sadhu sanga, but the only sadhu sanga that is promoted is to chase the old sadhu around the world begging for a glance or a word.

Sadhu sanga requires more than one old holy man to chase around.

Sadhu sanga necessitates organization and a community of devotees.

Obviously, Narayana Maharaja cannot accomplish that with his followers.

If Narayana Maharaja and his gang thinks they can insult, assault and denigrate a large section of followers of Srila Prabhupada who sincerely believe in the ritvik system, well then they shouldn't be surprised if Prabhupada's monkey army starts throwing some rocks back at them from the trees of the jungle.

If Narayana Maharaja would have just kept his mouth shut about the ritvik system, as Srila Sridhar Maharaja did, then he certainly would have had a few thousand less enemies in the world.

In many ways Narayana Maharaja has been a pawn and a puppet of certain irate ISKCON renegades.

We can't put all the blame on him, because many haters of the GBC have been using him for years as a club to pound on the GBC with.

If Narayan Maharaja would have kept his nose out of the ritvik business, I never would have had any problem with him.

I know that he doesn't believe that pancaratrika diksha in the KC movement is just a formality. He thinks it's all important.

Srila Prabhupada told many times that intiation was just a formality and that is why he established a ritvik system to perform this ceremonial ritual in ISKCON.

Narayana Maharaja entered the battlefield willingly and enthusiastically with his attacks on the ritviks, so why in the hell are his goons whining that the enemy is fighting back?

But when it comes to the ritviks, Narayana Maharaja has no humbleness.

He tells about about being humble and offenseless, except towards the ritviks.

His message is to be humble except towards the ritviks,

With the ritviks we can be all mouthy and nasty and rude?

Why does his lessons on humbleness disappear when the issue or ritvik comes up?

Mention ritvik and then Narayana Maharaja goes on a rampage of terror.

Srila Prabhupada said that Jesus was a Vaishnava, but Narayana Maharaja says that devotees who worship Krishna, Srila Prabhupada and all the predecessor acharyas are not Vaishnavas or bhaktas because they don't worship a "living guru" like him.

Well, it's obvious that he is a bigot and a scoundrel who contradicts so many statements by Mahaprabhu and the shastra that the chanters of the Holy Name are the highest bhaktas of all.

Vapuvada rears it's ugly heard again in the hateful words of Narayana Maharaja.

However, because these 11 ritviks knew that Srila Prabhupada gave more seniority and recognition to Sridhar Maharaja than Narayana Maharaja, they preferred to use Sridhar Maharaja as the fall-guy for the zonal guru scam, even though Narayana Maharaja was always there in the background spewing hatred and venom against the ritvik concept.

don't limit the idea of sadhu sanga to Narayana Maharaja or Govinda Maharaja or any of the other Indian Swamis that are getting in on the action of a disintegrating ISKCON.

Thanks to Srila Prabhupada there are embodied sadhus all over the world.

I regret missing them all, not just the old Indian Swamis that so many people are going gahgah over.

http://www.indiadivine.org/audarya/spiritual-discussions/434959-quotes-narayana-maharaja-prabhupadas-books-3.html

[cbrahma]

 

You only think you know.

You don't really KNOW until you have realized the truth in fact.

 

You just say "I know" and I say "I think" because I don't like being so arrogant as to come across so sure of myself.

 

You really don't KNOW anything.

You just have things you believe in like everyone else does.

How would you know?

[Sarva gattah]

 

How would you know?

 

Agree, There is an old saying, 'As I think the whole world thinks' Guruvani how do you know everyone does not know anything? Some great realized devotees may be posting on these threads. Srila Prabhupada said that even Naradha Muni cames in disguise amongst the devotees. In fact I would not be suprised if there are advanced devotees coming on these threads, like, maybe krsna,Jahnava Nitai Das, Hari Sauri dasa, Theist or even cbrahma etc trying to help us get off the argumentive mental level.

[Guruvani]

I am getting bored.

These clowns are trying to make me an issue.

 

If you clowns think that attacking me excites me or angers me you should think again.

 

Don't make me the topic or issue here.

As far as I am concerned that is the most boring topic you could make an issue out of.

 

I am not the enemy of Sleepervada.

The entire Gaudiya tradition is so attack the tradition and not some insignificant fool.

[Vigraha]

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<TABLE cellSpacing=0 cellPadding=6 width="100%" border=0><TBODY><TR><TD style="BORDER-RIGHT: #666666 1px solid; PADDING-RIGHT: 3ex; BORDER-TOP: #666666 1px solid; PADDING-LEFT: 3ex; BORDER-LEFT: #666666 1px solid; BORDER-BOTTOM: #666666 1px solid" bgColor=#e0e0e0>Originally Posted by Vigraha

George,

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My name is James.

My devotee name is Kshamabuddhi das .

 

I apologize for my frivolity Guruvani Prabhu, I have corrected the mistakes

[Guruvani]

 

Quote:

<table border="0" cellpadding="6" cellspacing="0" width="100%"><tbody><tr><td style="border: 1px solid rgb(102, 102, 102); padding-right: 3ex; padding-left: 3ex;" bgcolor="#e0e0e0">Originally Posted by Vigraha

George,

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I apologize for my frivolity Guruvani Prabhu, I have corrected the mistakes

 

Well you were close.

My Dad's name was George.

[Murali_Mohan_das]

Good morning, oh best of the George-avas.

 

 

Well you were close.

My Dad's name was George.