Real Meaning Of Brahmana

[suchandra]

All the great Vaishnava Acaryas like Sri Ramanujacarya, Madhvacarya, Visnusvami and Nimbarka strictly prohibit to accept dubious so called spiritual leadership, ruin your life and go to hell. Blind faith, blind believe, walking on thin ice, being disoriented, to agree getting hoaxed, not being 100% sure - all terms which DON'T exists in the Vaishnava vocabulary and are resolutely rejected by genuine members of the Brahma-Madhava-Gaudiya Sampradaya.

Already when it comes to the rules of what is brahmana, no cheating is possible.

 

Real Meaning Of Brahmana

Los Angeles, June 13, 1972

"Therefore, after education you'll have to write application, "My dear sir, I am such and such qualified dog. If you'll kindly give me some service." And the tail is waggling. You see? Just imagine. If by education he becomes independent … Just like Vedic culture. The brāhmanas, the ksatriya, the vaisyas, they are independent. The śūdras are compared with the dogs because they cannot live without a master.

 

 

 

 

 

 

Brahmana , he will not accept anyone's service. That is real brahmaṇa. A ksatriya will never accept anyone's service. Why the battle of Kurukṣetra was there? The Kurus, they took away the whole kingdom of the Pāndavas. But they were ksatriyas. How they will live? Therefore the fight was necessity. The ksatriyas must be, must have some land to collect taxes. That is the ksatriya's source of income. The brāhmana's source of income, paṭhana pāṭhana yajana yajana … They must be learned scholar, they must teach others, they must be devotee and teach others how to become devotee.

They must take contribution and must spend for Krishna. This is brahmaṇa. No service. Formerly, no brāhmaṇa … Sanātana Gosvāmī, Rūpa Gosvāmī, they were born in high-class brāhmana family, Sārasvata brahmana, but because they accepted the service of Nawab Hussein Shah, immediately they were rejected from brāhmaṇa society. It is by the grace of Caitanya Mahāprabhu that they again became gosvamī. Otherwise, they were rejected. No brāhmaṇa could take service and especially service of a low-class man. That is … In Bhāgavata you will see especially that if a brāhmaṇa is in difficulty, he may accept the profession of a ksatriya or utmost of a vaiśya, but never take the profession of a śūdra. What is the profession of sudra? Sudra … Paricaryatmakaṁ karyaṁ śūdra- karma svabhava-jam. One who is hankering after service, he is śūdra. He has no capacity to live independently. The brāhmaṇa, real brahmaṇa, he will starve, he will die out of starvation.

He will never accept anyone's service. That is brāhmaṇa. Uñcha- vṛtti. If he has no income, he will go on the field … And when the grains are taken away, some grains fall down. They will pick up all those grains and live on that. Still, they will not go to anyone that "I am hungry. Give me something." No. Uñcha-vṛtti. So our education … And why we were so independent? Because the education was very high, Vedic education. Satisfied with Brahman realization. Brahma-bhūtaḥ prasannātmā [Bg. 18.54]. Not very long ago, say about 300 years ago, there was a brāhmaṇa , a very rigid brāhmaṇa, in Krishna-nagara, near our Māyāpura. And brāhmaṇa's business, he was teaching. So the king of that place, means a big zamindar, Rājā Krishna-candra … By his name, that place is Krishna-nagara. So he heard about the brahmaṇa, very learned brahmaṇa, but very poor. So he one day came to him and asked him, "Brahmaṇa, can I help you any way?" So he said, "No, I don't require any help from you."

"No, I see you are so poverty-stricken. You have no sufficient means.No, I am not poverty-stricken. My students, they get some alms of rice. So my wife boils the rice, and here is a tamarind tree. So I take some leaves and boil it, and that's sufficient. Why I am poverty-stricken?" He's satisfied, whatever is coming automatically, that's all. He doesn't require any higher standard of life, any botheration. He is satisfied, little rice and tamarind juice. That's all. So in each and every home, formerly, this independence was very much valued. So at the modern education this independence is being killed. People are becoming unemployed, machine. Machine … High technologist means he must find out a job where technological machines are there. Otherwise he will starve, and he will have to go round, factory to factory: "Will you give me some service?No vacancy." Yes. So we shall discuss further next, tomorrow." (end)

 

 

 

Śrīmad-Bhāgavatam 2.3.18-19

by His Divine Grace A. C. Bhaktivedanta Swami Prabhupāda

Los Angeles, June 13, 1972

720613SB.LA

[krsnaraj1]

 

All the great Vaishnava Acaryas like Sri Ramanujacarya, Madhvacarya, Visnusvami and Nimbarka strictly prohibit to accept dubious so called spiritual leadership, ruin your life and go to hell. Blind faith, blind believe, walking on thin ice, being disoriented, to agree getting hoaxed, not being 100% sure - all terms which DON'T exists in the Vaishnava vocabulary and vigerously rejected by genuine members of the Brahma-Madhava-Gaudiya Sampradaya.

Already when it comes to the rules of what is brahmana, no cheating is possible.

 

One can`t detect a real brahmana if one hasn`t been touched by a real one

[suchandra]

 

 

Since you consider the ashram of Brahmin as some guessing game - you guessed wrong, please try again:cool:.

[Kulapavana]

 

 

 

actually this story is a very bad example of what a true brahmana should be. three sly crooks outwitted a dumb brahmana.

[Ashvatama]

 

One can`t detect a real brahmana if one hasn`t been touched by a real one

 

Very true. So many today think; 'because I have thread or I am born in a Brahmana family then I am Brahmana'.

 

In this Kali yuga devotees of Lord Caitanya are Vaishvava's however, like the real Brahmana's, being Vaishnava is not cheap. One must act, live and preach as a Vaishnava and always chant Hare Krishna.

[suchandra]

 

actually this story is a very bad example of what a true brahmana should be. three sly crooks outwitted a dumb brahmana.

As usual, a temper tantrum by Kulapavana when reading a post which contains a quote by Prabhupada.

"Dumb brahmana" might be a frequently heard term from present institutionalized so called centers for vedic studies, but "dumb brahmana" is not to be found anywhere and Krishna Himself defines what is a brahmana differently. No dumb-quality mentioned.

 

śamo damas tapaḥ śaucaḿ

kṣāntir ārjavam eva ca

jñānaḿ vijñānam āstikyaḿ

brahma-karma svabhāva-jam

SYNONYMS

śamaḥ — peacefulness; damaḥ — self-control; tapaḥ — austerity; śaucam — purity; kṣāntiḥ — tolerance; ārjavam — honesty; eva — certainly; ca — and; jñānam — knowledge; vijñānam — wisdom; āstikyam — religiousness; brahma — of a brāhmaṇa; karma — duty; svabhāva-jam — born of his own nature.

TRANSLATION

Peacefulness, self-control, austerity, purity, tolerance, honesty, knowledge, wisdom and religiousness — these are the natural qualities by which the brāhmaṇas work.

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[Kulapavana]

 

As usual, a temper tantrum by Kulapavana when reading a post which contains a quote by Prabhupada.

 

hardly. all I was getting at was that if you are trying to prove that brahmanas are never dumb this Pancatantric story (pictured above by you) is a very bad example to prove your point. I'm sure you would not use this picture if you actually knew the story. The extra irony is that the brahmana in this story is also a meat-eater. So much for cleanliness...

[suchandra]

 

hardly. all I was getting at was that if you are trying to prove that brahmanas are never dumb this Pancatantric story (pictured above by you) is a very bad example to prove your point. I'm sure you would not use this picture if you actually knew the story. The extra irony is that the brahmana in this story is also a meat-eater. So much for cleanliness...

"As a native of India now living in the West, it has given me much grief to see so many of my fellow countrymen coming to the West in the role of gurus and spiritual leaders. For this reason, I am very excited to see the publication of Bhagavad-gita As It Is by Sri A.C. Bhaktivedanta Swami Prabhupada. It will help to stop the terrible cheating of false and unauthorized 'gurus' and 'yogis' and will give an opportunity to all people to understand the actual meaning of Oriental culture."

 

Dr. Kailash Vajpeye, Director of Indian Studies Center for Oriental Studies, The University of Mexico

"The increasing numbers of Western readers interested in classical Vedic thought have been done a service by Swami Bhaktivedanta. By bringing us a new and living interpretation of a text already known to many, he has increased our understanding manyfold."

 

Dr. Edward C Dimock, Jr. Department of South Asian Languages and Civilization University of Chicago

 

"The scholarly world is again indebted to A. C. Bhaktivedanta Swami Prabhupada. Although Bhagavad-gita has been translated many times, Prabhupada adds a translation of singular importance with his commentary."

 

Dr. J. Stillson Judah, Professor of the History of Religions and Director of Libraries Graduate Theological Union, Berkeley, California

 

 

"Srila Prabhupada's edition thus fills a sensitive gap in France, where many hope to become familiar with traditional Indian thought, beyond the commercial East-West hodgepodge that has arisen since the time Europeans first penetrated India.

"Whether the reader be an adept of Indian spiritualism or not, a reading of the Bhagavad-gita As It Is will be extremely profitable. For many this will be the first contact with the true India, the ancient India, the eternal India."

 

Francois Chenique, Professor of Religious Sciences Institute of Political Studies, Paris, France

[Murali_Mohan_das]

Was that an apology to Kulapavana, Suchandra-ji? Seems like you were trying to avoid humbling yourself by changing the subject.

 

In any case, we watched the 1972 film adaptation of "Siddhartha" last night. It's a great depiction of what can happen when a Brahmana ("I can think, I can fast, I can wait") comes to serve a Vaishya.

[krsnaraj1]

We call brahmana in our area a catholic priest. Because he earns a living preaching God consciousness. He`s practicing celibacy. Maybe not all of them are carnivorous. There are exceptions to the rule. But believe me, I`ve been touched( not literally) by a catholic priest. Because of that I no longer ostracize one. Forgiving what their mistakes are. After all, we are only humans here in this forum. Nobody`s perfect. & that`s the truth. We are all hypocrites if we don`t accept that!

[suchandra]

 

Was that an apology to Kulapavana, Suchandra-ji? Seems like you were trying to avoid humbling yourself by changing the subject.

 

In any case, we watched the 1972 film adaptation of "Siddhartha" last night. It's a great depiction of what can happen when a Brahmana ("I can think, I can fast, I can wait") comes to serve a Vaishya.

No, Kulapavana was recently banned and kicked out of audarya-fellowship for 6 months because he exceeded the limit. Then he was begging the moderator to let him post again to contribute for the cause of Vaishnavism. He is an academic but as you see above whenever there's a post about a great acharya explaining what is real knowledge his intelligence is suddenly at absolute zero to contemplate the spiritual wisdom a great Vaishnava is giving - keeping silent. Instead working hard to find something to make one look silly. But somehow this mentality seems to have become a fashion in general. People are more interested to look at films because Tinseltown film versions explain way better what is real Vaishnavism?

[Kulapavana]

 

No, Kulapavana was recently banned and kicked out of audarya-fellowship for 6 months because he exceeded the limit. Then he was begging the moderator to let him post again to contribute for the cause of Vaishnavism.

 

Another one of Suchandra's delusions and lies... Yes, my account was temporarily suspended some time ago, but it was reopened without my intervention.

 

I dont care for your apologies. Just stop writing lies about me.

[suchandra]

 

Another one of Suchandra's delusions and lies... Yes, my account was temporarily suspended some time ago, but it was reopened without my intervention.

 

I dont care for your apologies. Just stop writing lies about me.

Everybody at this forum knows that my posts are excerpts of Srila Prabhupada's lectures, you call this delusions and lies? What can be said, just another paid mole struggling hard to fullfill the mandate of disuniting Vaishnavism via cyberspace. Why should one make an apology for people who got banned because they offended Prabhupada?

[Murali_Mohan_das]

You are a liar. Kula-ji took issue with an illustration *you* added to your quote from Srila Prabhupada, not the quote itself. He's explained that to you. For you to not understand makes you either thick or disingenuous.

 

You have demonstrated that you are not qualified to even *quote* Srila Prabhupada due to your lack of sincerity.

 

 

Everybody at this forum knows that my posts are excerpts of Srila Prabhupada's lectures, you call this delusions and lies? What can be said, just another paid mole struggling hard to fullfill the mandate of disuniting Vaishnavism via cyberspace. Why should one make an apology for people who got banned because they offended Prabhupada?

[Lokeshav]

"Shri Radhey"

 

The Four human kinds i.e. Brahamana, Kshtriya, Vaishya and Shudra, have been formed by Shri Krishna as per the Karmas they have been allocated to perform.

 

But in any case if any one goes higher throufh some Great Karmas in one's life, due to some great sacrifice for the benefit of Truth and Human kind, He certainly is assured by the Nature to be promoted to the upper position.

 

Like the Kshatriya may become Brahamana too without even taking birth in a Brahmana's house. And vise versa too.

 

Definitely this is not possible without a GURU in your life.

 

Shri Radhey

Lokeshav 'Pratikshak'

[suchandra]

 

You are a liar. Kula-ji took issue with an illustration *you* added to your quote from Srila Prabhupada, not the quote itself. He's explained that to you. For you to not understand makes you either thick or disingenuous.

 

You have demonstrated that you are not qualified to even *quote* Srila Prabhupada due to your lack of sincerity.

There will no end to this discussion as both of us interpret things differently. Anyway “The dogs bark, but the caravan moves on”. There is no point in continuing a discussion in this manner. At least you have a reason to NOT anymore read or comment on my posts, your comments were anyway nothing but meaningless botheration.

[suchandra]

 

"Shri Radhey"

 

The Four human kinds i.e. Brahamana, Kshtriya, Vaishya and Shudra, have been formed by Shri Krishna as per the Karmas they have been allocated to perform.

 

But in any case if any one goes higher throufh some Great Karmas in one's life, due to some great sacrifice for the benefit of Truth and Human kind, He certainly is assured by the Nature to be promoted to the upper position.

 

Like the Kshatriya may become Brahamana too without even taking birth in a Brahmana's house. And vise versa too.

 

Definitely this is not possible without a GURU in your life.

 

Shri Radhey

Lokeshav 'Pratikshak'

 

Thanks for posting, yes there's a verse which says,

 

yatha kancanatam yati

kamsyam rasa vidhanatah

tatha diksa vidhanena

dvijatvam jayate nrinam

 

"As bell metal is turned to gold when mixed with mercury in an alchemical process, so one who is properly trained and initiated by a bona fine spiritual master immediately becomes a brahmana".

(Tattva-sagara, quoted in Hari-bhakti-vilasa 2.12)

[Murali_Mohan_das]

Wow!! How deliberately ignorant you can be. There's no question of interpretation here. Kulapavana Prabhu pointed out a shortcoming in your choice of illustration. You have done nothing but accuse him of disagreeing with Srila Prabhupada when he did no such thing.

 

Pardon me if I do not accept your invitation to ignore your inanities. I will point out your foolishness when I am so inclined. Feel free to ignore me. I point out your inconsistencies not for your own benefit (since you seem incapable of admitting a mistake), but for the presumed benefit of others who might be deceived by a devil quoting scripture.

 

 

There will no end to this discussion as both of us interpret things differently. Anyway “The dogs bark, but the caravan moves on”. There is no point in continuing a discussion in this manner. At least you have a reason to NOT anymore read or comment on my posts, your comments were anyway nothing but meaningless botheration.