Did NASA land men on the Moon?

[indulekhadasi]

 

 

By the way, there are multiple opinions on various other issues which Bhaktivedanta Swami gave, and which I dare you to quote on Audarya; remember his citations of Pandit Chanakya on women being unintelligent and untrustworthy, having brains half the size of those of men.

 

I being a girl have seen with my own experience how untrustworthy and unintelligent women are. And I don't doubt that my brain is half the size of that of a man. But Srila Prabhupada himself said that these things don't apply to Vaishnavis. I am far from being a Vaishnavi so these things do apply to me, I will openly admit that I am probably an untrustworthy person and I am definitely unintelligent.

 

Hare Krishna.

 

P.S- I do not have a low self esteem and I am not humble. Whatever I wrote above is true.

[skp]

 

Sure, scientists alter and modify their views from time to time because the cosmos is inconceivably large and complex, and novel data occasionally surfaces, changing certain concepts in a given field, and this in turn elicits a commensurate response from the concerned practitioners. After all, the search for knowledge is a never-ending quest, isn't it?

 

Search for knowledge could be never ending quest for the scientists because they do not have faith in the existence of the Supreme Person. I am not saying that all the scientists are like that, but surely there are many who do not have faith in an Ultimate Person who controls everything.

 

This lack of faith is what makes the scientist think that they can do superb activities when the fact is that they even do not know whether they are going to live the next moment or not?

 

 

Do the Hindu scriptures remain forever intact? Try looking at some of the books authored by some of the world's most eminent Indologists and Sanskritists, and it should be plain that this is not necessarily so. The original, shorter Bharata eventually got transformed into the 100,000-couplet-long Mahabharata, the Bhagavad Gita was initially composed in just a few dozen stanzas, only later to develop into what it is today, largely due to Buddhist influence which according to some scholars is obvious in the text of the Upanishadic treatise itself. The Srimad Bhagavata Purana begins in a Himalayan setting with the predicament of Vedavyasa, but bears many unmistakable elements of the South Indian Alvar tradition, which again raises the question of cultural borrowing. Also, the Bhagavata has several undeniably ancient ideas but in its current form dates from the 7th or 8th century CE, not before.

 

You have stated all this from the so-called "History" which also changes in accordance with time. Why do you want to quote mundane so-called historical findings to prove your point that the Vedic knowledge has changed. Why not be assured by Krishna's instruction that the thing which constantly changes is temporary and hence faith cannot be placed in that?

 

Of course, from your arguements I can clearly understand that you have chosen to follow the path of scientist and wish you Good luck with that :-)

[Kulapavana]

 

Prabhupada stated many times which I'm paraphrasing as -- Either you believe the Scientists who change their theory constantly or you try to have constant faith in the Vedic scriptures which do not change.

 

 

Everything changes in this world. It is a simplified version of reality that Prabhupada presented above. Scriptures change, grow, and evolve just like material science does. Are we using Rig Veda in our movement? No, we do not. It's time has passed. We are using primarily the Gaudiya Vaishnava interpretation of reality as given to us by the associates of Lord Caitanya.

 

If you are daily using the things material science produced and yet you claim that such science is useless - you can hardly be taken seriously by intelligent people. Prabhupada was flying around the world not on a vedic vimana but on a plane put together by material scientists. If you think he was the greatest authority on the subject matter of science you are quite likely mistaken.

[skp]

 

Everything changes in this world. It is a simplified version of reality that Prabhupada presented above. Scriptures change, grow, and evolve just like material science does. Are we using Rig Veda in our movement? No, we do not. It's time has passed. We are using primarily the Gaudiya Vaishnava interpretation of reality as given to us by the associates of Lord Caitanya.

 

Gaudiya Vaishnava teaching of Shree Krishna Chaitanya Mahaprabhu is not an interpretation of reality but "Reality" itself. Ok, even if hypothetically agreed that the scriptures can change over time, but the basics of scriptures never change. For the material science even the basic theory is changed over a period of time.

 

 

If you are daily using the things material science produced and yet you claim that such science is useless - you can hardly be taken seriously by intelligent people. Prabhupada was flying around the world not on a vedic vimana but on a plane put together by material scientists. If you think he was the greatest authority on the subject matter of science you are quite likely mistaken.

 

Please note that I am not terming that science is useless. Anything, if it is used in the service of Krishna, is not useless. If science can be used to establish faith in the Supreme Person, then it's not useless. If sceintific tools are used to glorify Krishna, then surely it's not useless. In fact, the aim of developing all the scientific things is fulfilled if it can be used in the Lord's service.

[Kulapavana]

 

Gaudiya Vaishnava teaching of Shree Krishna Chaitanya Mahaprabhu is not an interpretation of reality but "Reality" itself. Ok, even if hypothetically agreed that the scriptures can change over time, but the basics of scriptures never change. For the material science even the basic theory is changed over a period of time.

 

 

Do you see this "Reality" expressed in the Rig Veda? You do not. That is why I said that scriptures change, and it is not a minor adjustment.

 

 

 

Please note that I am not terming that science is useless. Anything, if it is used in the service of Krishna, is not useless. If science can be used to establish faith in the Supreme Person, then it's not useless.

 

 

Tamala Krsna: Apart from science, we have very nice philosophy and literature, studying art.

Prabhupada: That is real science. Science we admit, but your science is not. You are trying to go against the laws of nature.

Tamala Krsna: What about our art and literature which just shows that... Prabhupada: No. That is different department so far science is concerned. But pure science is useless, simply useless.

>>> Ref. VedaBase => Conversation with Devotees -- April 14, 1975, Hyderabad

 

If you are not giving credit where credit is due, you are not seen as an objective person.<!-- et ici -->

[skp]

 

Do you see this "Reality" expressed in the Rig Veda? You do not. That is why I said that scriptures change, and it is not a minor adjustment.

Well, the Rig Veda can be "interpreted" to see this "Reality". After all, Absolute Truth is only One. Sure scriptures do change, that is the reason Krishna said: Sa Kaaleneha Mahat Yogo Nashtah Parantapah.

 

But, the greatness is that Krishna personally comes and helps us understand the difference between Reality and Illusion and unfortunately due to our conditioned nature we are attracted towards the illusion.

 

 

 

If you are not giving credit where credit is due, you are not seen as an objective person.<!-- et ici -->

I am trying to give credit where it is due and am trying to be as practical as possible, at the same time trying to understand the Vedic viewpoint.

[suchandra]

 

Completely irrelevant and out-of-context reply to my posting.

 

No, you said, "not a know-all whose instructions are to be consulted in EVERY aspect...."

In other words you deny A.C.Bhaktivedanta Swami to be a religious leader, because a religious leader can be consulted in every aspect. Spirit over matter.

[Vikram Ramsundar]

 

 

I being a girl have seen with my own experience how untrustworthy and unintelligent women are. And I don't doubt that my brain is half the size of that of a man. But Srila Prabhupada himself said that these things don't apply to Vaishnavis. I am far from being a Vaishnavi so these things do apply to me, I will openly admit that I am probably an untrustworthy person and I am definitely unintelligent.

 

Hare Krishna.

 

P.S- I do not have a low self esteem and I am not humble. Whatever I wrote above is true.

 

Try telling that to Hillary with her IQ score of 140, and see what reaction you draw.

[Vikram Ramsundar]

 

No, you said, "not a know-all whose instructions are to be consulted in EVERY aspect...."

In other words you deny A.C.Bhaktivedanta Swami to be a religious leader, because a religious leader can be consulted in every aspect. Spirit over matter.

 

And I suppose someone who's an expert who can speak with authority on Krishnaism just as on astrophysics or molecular genetics, right?

[theist]

The point is I believe that as a general rule men and women have been assigned different roles in nature. Along with bodies that can carry and birth a child woman have softer more nurturing hearts to care for the baby after it is born. These are basic estrogenic characteristics.

 

Men are built physically and mentally to be more aggressive and to assume the provider protecter roles. Testosterone based natures.

 

It also must be recognized that men have been the leaders in all technical fields FOR BETTER OR WORSE. Atomic bombs for example.

 

For someone to say they are all the same and equal in every respect is just plain stupid on it's face.

[suchandra]

 

And I suppose someone who's an expert who can speak with authority on Krishnaism just as on astrophysics or molecular genetics, right?

If you ever would have read Bhagavad-gita you would have found out that Krishna speaks a lot about Krishnaism. And who is the inventor of astrophysics and molecular genetics, again, Krishna, right?

[Vikram Ramsundar]

 

For someone to say they are all the same and equal in every respect is just plain stupid on it's face.

 

 

That is neither what I implied nor what I personally think, Theist Prabhu. My reference was to Prabhupada's anachronistic pronouncements on intelligence and character traits.

[Vikram Ramsundar]

 

If you ever would have read Bhagavad-gita you would have found out that Krishna speaks a lot about Krishnaism. And who is the inventor of astrophysics and molecular genetics, again, Krishna, right?

 

Sure, Krishna for you, Shiva for my Shaivite pals, Durga for most Bengalis (who happen to be Shaktas fyi), Elohim or Yahweh for the followers of the Judaeo-Christian philosophies, Allah for yet another massive group, Brahman for exalted jivan-muktas like Swami Sivananda, Maharishi Mahesh Yogi or Swami Dayanand Saraswati, and all or none of the above for me, as I am an agnostic, as you already know.

[theist]

 

That is neither what I implied nor what I personally think, Theist Prabhu. My reference was to Prabhupada's anachronistic pronouncements on intelligence and character traits.

 

Sorry I wasn't thinking of you when I wrote that sentence but it is a common propaganda statement by the so-called feminists in society who think that men and women are identical except for social conditioning.

 

I understand my not making that clear caused the confusion and I apologize for my hastiness in expression.

[theist]

 

... as I am an agnostic, as you already know.

 

I didn't know that Vikram. I have great respect for agnostics in that it shows a deep level of honesty.

[Vikram Ramsundar]

 

I didn't know that Vikram. I have great respect for agnostics in that it shows a deep level of honesty.

 

Pranam, Theist Prabhu. As a matter of fact, I am an agnostic with a deep appreciation of Gaudiya Vaishnavism, and Vaishnavism generally. Of course, I haven't embraced Indian personal monotheism as such otherwise I wouldn't call myself an agnostic, but this does explain my presence here just in case you're wondering.

[theist]

 

Pranam, Theist Prabhu. As a matter of fact, I am an agnostic with a deep appreciation of Gaudiya Vaishnavism, and Vaishnavism generally. Of course, I haven't embraced Indian personal monotheism as such otherwise I wouldn't call myself an agnostic, but this does explain my presence here just in case you're wondering.

 

I wasn't really wondering. People become attracted to Krsna from different angles. I grew up an atheist. I am confident that someone who is honest enough to say they are agnostic and applies their intelligence to monotheism, especially as taught by the Gaudiya Vaisnavas, will become increasingly attracted to the Supreme Person Sri Krsna.

[mahak]

I worked for the military for many years, top secret projects. A friend of mine, bradford budd, was a construction person, heavy equipment, who moved from Long Beach Navy Shipyard to Ft Irwin, near death valley.

 

He did a one week job in 73, to bull doze and rearrange dirt in the middle of nowhere. He unearthed a lunar lander, and quickly re-buried it under duress of some general in charge of the operation.

 

In kali yuga, control by lies is what takes place. Lies of political nature, lies of economics, lies of what will gratify ones senses. So, I had opportunity to discover many such lies that if I spoke about here, Id be in Guantanimo bay by midnight.

 

But it all comes down on who one has faith in, one who does not lie.

 

Find such a person, there is where the TRUE exists.

 

Hare Krsna, ys, mahaklsadasa

[gHari]

 

[...]

He unearthed a lunar lander, and quickly re-buried it under duress of some general in charge of the operation.

[...]

I knew it. We are living on the moon! I knew it all along. We went to the moon and stayed - we were all transported in our sleep. The earth was destroyed by the Russia/America nuclear war. That barren ball in the sky is actually all that's left of the earth. It's all a hoax. The machines have taken over. At the end of my self-realization meditations it was revealed: the truth - I have become ................. <img src=http://re3.mm-a11.yimg.com/image/21142065 align=top>

 

 

Free your mind. Unplug from the matrix of the gunas. The truth shall set you free.

[omsadhak]

Srila Prabhupada just retold what was told by Krsna in dwapar yug. But which dwapar yug ? As the yug cycle had been already revolved for many times for the souls away from hari and in the grip of kal. The moon we see and analyze in this kalyug might be in different condition during that time. Just like in treta yug even a monkey had better divine knowledge than a kalyugs human. We can dig upto earths crust and find out the artifacts but what lies in mantle in molten state ,due to earth convection, is almost impossible to know.

[Guruvani]

 

Well I have heard that many ISKCON devotees (and maybe sanyassi) were consuming "mind expanding" foodstuffs in the 60s and 70s.

 

They can simply see things that we cannot!

Yep, I have seen musical notes coming out of stereo speakers.

I have seen all kinds of things.

 

I saw Jesus coming out of the clouds.

 

It was really cool man.

[sevabhakta]

Mahak is right.

 

If most people were to find out how many lies have been crammed between their ears, and how many experiments have and are being done upon them, they would loose their bowels.

 

There is a huge propaganda machine which promotes a theory of a unified nation marching into a frontier, facing challenges and progressing the "human race". This to cover the simple desires of a cabal of greedy powerful elite who seek to control nature by their speculative mind.

 

Due to the absence of qualified vedic Ksyatrias, we have rapacious fallen dwija-bhandus with a polished veneer of civility who are fighting to control the fantasies of their slave populations in order to gain world domination.

 

Getting to the moon was just enough of a tittilation for the masses that kept the positive energy flowing to Nasa in order to increase their budget and justify their public persona.

 

So where do all those rockets and shuttles really go? What are their real missions? How top secret is it?

 

If anyone thinks the brains and money behind all these missions was simply a manifestation of the intellectual curiosity of mankind to visit the moon, I have a bridge to sell you.

 

All you have seen and heard from the oil soaked monopoly press is "bought and paid for" by the military industrial complex whose editorial agenda is framed by government subsidized "think tanks" or worse, the shadow ops masters, and are duly applied to the daily offerings of the mainstream media.

 

Like a shell game.

 

Meanwhile, on the periphery of your vision, you should just be able to start picking up glimpses of what these controllers have been building and working toward. As the net that begins to be drawn in tight.

 

Hint: They want your awe and reverence first, then your allegience, money, and first born. The all mighty impersonal big brother government "at your service".

 

Vedic monarchy or bust.

 

Hare Krsna

[Vikram Ramsundar]

Can we please refrain from spinning those conspiracy yarns and making allegations which nobody can prove one way or the other? We all live in this contemporary society, and I, for one, consider myself fortunate to be on earth at this time. Those who don't should seriously ponder over whether they would prefer to have existed during the ancient or medieval epochs, when human life was more of a struggle for survival than anything else.

 

We are indeed lucky that technology has afforded us the advantages which we benefit from today. One can hop on an aeroplane and visit any part of this planet thanks to modern science. From tiny Mauritius, I am able to exchange ideas with you people from the old and new worlds because of the internet. And that's not it, improved medical science shall soon enable us to last 120 years or so in these bodies.

 

The cars that we drive and use as means of conveyance are incomparably faster, more comfortable and efficient than the bullock carts of my forefathers. So, rather than hypocritically condemning all those gizmos which WE ALL require, let us be upfront for once and admit our dependence on technology. As for the astronomers and other space scientists, they do realise that this is essentially a dying planet, and understand the urgent need to find a second home for humanity. What is wrong with that? I was watching a documentary not that long ago, and some of the authorities interviewed made the point that the time is not that far off when humans will be able to travel to the stars within short spans, as NASA have practically found ways to overcome the limitations of the speed of light and the vast interstellar distances - this shall be made possible by the bending of our ordinary space-time continuum. Only someone who is filled with envy and jealousy and totally opposed to the concept of progress could not be excited about the limitless frontiers of possibility of science and technology.

[skp]

 

Can we please refrain from spinning those conspiracy yarns and making allegations which nobody can prove one way or the other? We all live in this contemporary society, and I, for one, consider myself fortunate to be on earth at this time. Those who don't should seriously ponder over whether they would prefer to have existed during the ancient or medieval epochs, when human life was more of a struggle for survival than anything else.

 

Even the people who are inclined to Krishna consciousness consider this age to be very good because in this age of Kali the process of spirituality has been eased out considering that people will get too much attracted to the material comforts.

 

 

 

We are indeed lucky that technology has afforded us the advantages which we benefit from today. One can hop on an aeroplane and visit any part of this planet thanks to modern science. From tiny Mauritius, I am able to exchange ideas with you people from the old and new worlds because of the internet. And that's not it, improved medical science shall soon enable us to last 120 years or so in these bodies.

 

Yes, there is nothing wrong in the development of technology and it is indeed very good. But while developing the technology if we can also try to understand the Supreme Person because of whom the whole universe is functioning, then it will be great.

 

 

The cars that we drive and use as means of conveyance are incomparably faster, more comfortable and efficient than the bullock carts of my forefathers. So, rather than hypocritically condemning all those gizmos which WE ALL require, let us be upfront for once and admit our dependence on technology. As for the astronomers and other space scientists, they do realise that this is essentially a dying planet, and understand the urgent need to find a second home for humanity. What is wrong with that? I was watching a documentary not that long ago, and some of the authorities interviewed made the point that the time is not that far off when humans will be able to travel to the stars within short spans, as NASA have practically found ways to overcome the limitations of the speed of light and the vast interstellar distances - this shall be made possible by the bending of our ordinary space-time continuum. Only someone who is filled with envy and jealousy and totally opposed to the concept of progress could not be excited about the limitless frontiers of possibility of science and technology.

 

Real person who loves The Supreme Person does not hypocritically condemn anything but uses everything in the service of the Supreme Person, thus fulfilling the real purpose for which the thing was made in the first place :-)

[suchandra]

 

Only someone who is filled with envy and jealousy and totally opposed to the concept of progress could not be excited about the limitless frontiers of possibility of science and technology.

Thanks Vikram for this eye-opening words, I tried to preach and preach and preach something similiar to Arun but instead Arun writes articles like, see below, "filled with envy and jealousy and totally opposed to the concept of progress":

 

Biotech GM Seeds Buccaneers destroy India's Rice Economy

 

by Arun Shrivastava

 

Global Research, December 12, 2007

 

The India Government is firmly under control of buccaneers of bio-technology and spurious Life Sciences multinational corporations. Despite rules to the contrary, GM experiments have been going on across India with the complicity of the Indian Government. Most importantly, the attack is now on rice.

 

"My name is Nancy Scola"

 

India is a centre of origin for rice and the centre for diversity for rice genes, in the same way as Mexico is for corn. It is therefore much more than just a rice country. This makes the Government’s cavalier attitude to India’s Non-GM status for rice, one of irresponsible criminal negligence. In embarking on high-risk field trials of GM-rice, it exposes our rice farmers to contamination by GM including transgenic contamination of wild species and the rice seed stock. If we Indians lose control over local rice seeds we lose our right to food and nutrition. We lose our sovereignty. etc. etc.