The dividing line

[Kulapavana]

 

Besides it the vision of the Bhativedanta that is desirable and not knowledge of sanskrit.

I understand why Prabhupada translated this verse in the way he did. Still, from an academic as well as logical point of view you can not use this translation to proclaim that such a line has been drawn by the author of this Upanishad. The line was drawn by Srila Prabhupada for his disciples, to get them to move closer to Krsna. Yet objectively speaking such a line simply does not exist.

[theist]

 

I understand why Prabhupada translated this verse in the way he did. Still, from an academic as well as logical point of view you can not use this translation to proclaim that such a line has been drawn by the author of this Upanishad. The line was drawn by Srila Prabhupada for his disciples, to get them to move closer to Krsna. Yet objectively speaking such a line simply does not exist.

 

Yes I can. I don't accept the verse as being different from the view of it offered by His Divine Grace.

 

To say no line exists between the mayavadi conception and the Vaisnava conception is itself a mayavada conception. There is a difference between a cotton ball and a cotton shirt even though they are both cotton. Even within oneness lines are drawn everywhere.

[Kulapavana]

 

To say no line exists between the mayavadi conception and the Vaisnava conception is itself a mayavada conception.

 

You said:

 

"The line is drawn here between Vaisnava's (mono-theists) and all other philosophies and religious systems"

 

And I say there is no such line in actuality. In real life it is all a smooth, multidimensional transition. There are various mono-theist sects which contain various elements of maya-vada philosophy in them. The line is only in your head.

 

There is no reference to maya-vada philosophy in any classic vedic literature. Maya-vada is a corrupted version of the vedic monism, relatively new in the historical sense. Even Sankaracarya's original teachings are not maya-vada - it was his disciples who invented it.

[shvu]

 

The line is drawn here between Vaisnava's (mono-theists) and all other philosophies and religious systems.

 

Sure, there is a line between groups who hold identity between the soul and the Lord and groups who do not.

 

But if you are thinking Advaita is not mono-theist, you are wrong. In fact, Advaita is more mon-theistic than any other religious branch in India including Vaishnavas. Advaita holds all Gods are ultimately the same, whereas Vaishnavas rank Gods and hold the difference between them is permanent.

 

Advaita: Vishnu = Shiva = Ganesha = one God

Vaishnava = Vishnu != Shiva != Ganesha = 3 Gods, ranked in a sequence.

 

Who is mono-theist here? And for the sake of completeness (from the urban dictionary),

 

==========

 

 

<TABLE cellSpacing=0 cellPadding=0 width="100%" border=0><TBODY><TR vAlign=top><TD class=def_number width=20></TD><TD class=def_word>theism</TD><TD class=def_thumbs>

 

 

</TD></TR><TR><TD></TD><TD colSpan=2>Theism is not a religion, rather it is a belief in god(s). This can be a belief in a single God, as in Islam, Christianity, or Judaism (monotheism), or a belief in deities or multiple gods, such as Hinduism & many ancient religions.

Islam is a type of theism.

Christianity is a type of theism.

Judaism is a type of theism.

Theism can be unrelated to organised religion.

 

Theism is not the same as religion. Religions can be atheistic, i.e. Buddhism.

 

 

========

Cheers

</TD></TR></TBODY></TABLE>

[shvu]

 

There is no reference to maya-vada philosophy in any classic vedic literature. Maya-vada is a corrupted version of the vedic monism, relatively new in the historical sense. Even Sankaracarya's original teachings are not maya-vada - it was his disciples who invented it.

 

An Advaitin will say all classic literature says only thing - oneness as interpreted by Shankara. They also hold that there are no additions to the philosophy since Shankara. Some scholars may differ among themselves in the way they teach the doctrine, but they do not differ from Shankara.

 

I cannot speak for everyone, but at least Ramanuja and Madhva in their commentaries referred to Shankara's philosophy as Mayavada.

 

Cheers

[theist]

From your own post.

 

 

Theism is not a religion, rather it is a belief in god(s). This can be a belief in a single God, as in Islam, Christianity, or Judaism (monotheism), ...

[Redsox]

 

Sorry you still don't understand. Please read beggars post again where he posted 14.27 and purport. Nothing more I can add.

 

I am not demonizing mayavadis or anyone else. People are free to relate to krsna however they wish or not relate at all and enter the state of suspended animation know as Brahman realization.

 

Just as I was an atheist in my younger years I am sure I have been all manner of things in my past from angel to demon animal to human murderer to pacifist whatever. Theis is not a pronouncement of judgement as a condemnation it is simply an observation.

 

 

I am simply pointing out there is a difference between the goals of advaita and bhakti. I kind of thought that was known already by most everyone but I am really dismayed that many who see themselves as followers of Mahaprabhu and Srila Prabhupada don't understand this fundemental point.

 

Well atleast jnanis/mayavadis don't discriminate between "This krishna" and "that krishna", nor do they classify one form of God as superior to the other. God is God according to them and he is everywhere in all his might and power. They see that, and concentrate and surrender to Him. They certainly don't see vaishnavas as the treaders of the wrong path and them as the treaders of a greater or even a different path and they certainly don't draw artificial lines or distinctions.

With that said, goodluck with your devotion to krishna.

[Beggar]

Srila Sridhar Maharaj,

 

The preaching mission of Srila Bhaktisiddhanta Sarasvati Thakura, the Gaudiya Matha, has declared totalitarian war against maya, illusion, and all other existing conceptions of religion.

[Redsox]

sorry can't attend, I got an appointment with Krishna sometime in the next million births.