Cremation or Burial?

[kimfelix]

Verse 31 of Chapter 8 of the Mausala Parvan (Book 16) of the Mahabharata refers to Arjuna cremating the bodies of Rama and Krishna--sharire ramasya vaasudevasya chobhayoh/ anvishya dahayamasa. But there is no mention of Rukmini in that passage.

[Pankaja_Dasa]

Not nice to have dead bodies floatin in Ganga. Thankgod for burnin bodies. Others that dont will goto hell;)

[Kulapavana]

 

Not nice to have dead bodies floatin in Ganga.

the crocks, buzzards, and fish probably would not agree with you on that one

[Shivaduta]

 

the crocks, buzzards, and fish probably would not agree with you on that one

 

Absolutrly right Kulapavana prabhu us crocks buzzards fishes have human rights too

[theist]

All such a nasty problem. While the soul is present and the body is so-called alive it produces mountains of waste in the form of stool and urine as well as in other ways just to maintain itself and then at death it's final slap is to pose a disposal problem for those 'left holding the bag'.

[Pankaja_Dasa]

At the end whether burned or buried ends up the same, dust.!

[raghu]

 

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Cremations Harm India’s Environment

 

 

 

If they were really interested in the environment they ought to target India's new "tradition" of having a gas guzzling, carbon-monoxide emitting, imported car in every household. The fact that one cannot get from point A to point B in a typical Indan city without having fossil fuel combustion products blown in one's face is ample illustration of which problem is more relevant to the common man.

[theist]

 

If they were really interested in the environment they ought to target India's new "tradition" of having a gas guzzling, carbon-monoxide emitting, imported car in every household. The fact that one cannot get from point A to point B in a typical Indan city without having fossil fuel combustion products blown in one's face is ample illustration of which problem is more relevant to the common man.

 

The thread is on cremations or burial.

[LoveroftheBhagavata]

 

Both Krishna and Rukmini have apraakrta deha-s, so your point makes little sense.

 

Krishna's body did not evaporate in thin air. He was definitely cremated, and shastra says so. Just do your homework properly, tackleboy.

[suchandra]

 

The thread is on cremations or burial.

Someone who is attached to his/her body, cremation - someone who isn't attached, whatever.

"It is difficult, however, for the conditioned soul to enter another body unless the present dead body is annihilated through cremation or some other means."

SB7.2.37

 

1. Causelessmercy - Ebook - Sri Caitanya-caritamrta - Madya-lila - 16.5

Temporary renunciation, or monkey renunciation, is like the renunciation one feels at a cremation ground. When a man ... he returns from the cremation grounds, he again engages

<small>http://causelessmercy.com/Madhya16.5.htm

</small>

2. Causelessmercy - Ebook - Krishna, the Supreme Personality of Godhead - 57

How mercilessly you have been killed! The dead body of Satrājit was not immediately removed for cremation because Satyabhāmā wanted to go to Kṛṣṇa in Hastināpura.

<small>http://causelessmercy.com/KB57.htm

</small>

3. Causelessmercy - Room Conversation - March 31, 1977, Bombay

He used to say it is cremation ground. Yes, without tilaka. Pasanta mukha.(? Tilaka must be there. And so far dress is concerned, you can dress up to the taste of the modern

<small>http://causelessmercy.com/t/t/770331rc.bom.htm

</small>

4. Causelessmercy - Room Conversation - December 13, 1970, Indore

He personally took the body and cremated on the bank of the Samudra and he performed the funeral ceremony. Haridāsa Ṭhākura was so And he was given the title nāmācārya,

<small>http://causelessmercy.com/t/t/701213rc.ind.htm

</small>

5. Causelessmercy - Morning Walk - January 29, 1977, Bhubaneswar

break]Prabhupāda: They have mation. What is that? Cremation ? [break]Satsvarūpa: This year in the United States several temples had very good success by advertising a cooking

<small>http://causelessmercy.com/t/t/770129mw.bhu.htm

</small>

6. Causelessmercy - Ebook - Bhagavad Gita As It Is - 2.2

When the tiger was killed, it would be offered the royal order of cremation. This system is being followed even up to the present day by the kṣatriya kings of Jaipur state. The

<small>http://causelessmercy.com/Bg2.2.htm

</small>

7. Causelessmercy - Ebook - Krishna, the Supreme Personality of Godhead - 51

turned into stool or is cremated in the crematorium and turned into ashes or is put into an earthly grave where different kinds of worms and insects are produced out of it. My

<small>http://causelessmercy.com/KB51.htm

</small>

8. Causelessmercy - Ebook - Srimad-Bhagavatam - Canto 7 - 2.1

dead body is annihilated through cremation or some other means. The living being has attachment for the present body and does not want to enter another, and thus in the interim he

<small>http://causelessmercy.com/SB7.2.1.htm

</small>

9. Causelessmercy - Ebook - The Journey of Self-Discovery - 7

Your browser does not support scripts. ... Śyāmasundara, while traveling around the world. ... Plato believed society can enjoy prosperity and harmony only if it places people in

<small>http://causelessmercy.com/JSD7.htm

</small>

10. Causelessmercy - Ebook - Srimad-Bhagavatam - Canto 7 - 2.2

a cemetery or place of cremation. As confirmed in Bhagavad-gītā, four classes of men receive an understanding of spiritual life and God ārta (the distressed), jijñāsu (the

<small>http://causelessmercy.com/SB7.2.2.htm</small>

[tackleberry]

 

Krishna's body did not evaporate in thin air. He was definitely cremated, and shastra says so. Just do your homework properly, tackleboy.

 

You can cremate a body made of prakrti, but how can anyone cremate Krishna's body which is made of jnaana, ananda, and such kalyaana guna-s? So it's to be concluded that the Lord can never be cremated, for he never takes birth and certainly doesn't die. For those who think otherwise, here's the Gita verse.

 

Gita 9.11

 

avajānanti māḿ mūḍhā

mānuṣīḿ tanum āśritam

paraḿ bhāvam ajānanto

mama bhūta-maheśvaram

 

 

SYNONYMS

avajānanti — deride; mām — Me; mūḍhāḥ — foolish men; mānuṣīm — in a human form; tanum — a body; āśritam — assuming; param — transcendental; bhāvam — nature; ajānantaḥ — not knowing; mama — My; bhūta — of everything that be; mahā-īśvaram — the supreme proprietor.

 

 

TRANSLATION

Fools deride Me when I descend in the human form. They do not know My transcendental nature as the Supreme Lord of all that be.

------

 

It clearly shows that the Lord is ever 'divya,' regardless of the forms he manifests whilst taking avatar. Only asura-s think otherwise, and allege that the Lord is also subject to prakrti, as other jiiva-s. Such asura-s go so far as to believe that the apraakrta Lord can be cremated. What ignorance!

[LoveroftheBhagavata]

 

It clearly shows that the Lord is ever 'divya,' regardless of the forms he manifests whilst taking avatar. Only asura-s think otherwise, and allege that the Lord is also subject to prakrti, as other jiiva-s. Such asura-s go so far as to believe that the apraakrta Lord can be cremated. What ignorance!

 

Nice try, son. I love these exchanges with you, for your hilarious responses succeed in making me chuckle even when I'm otherwise in a sullen mood. Just grab Ganguli's masterful rendering of the Mahabharata and consult the relevant passages. Everything should become clearly manifest.

[theist]

 

Someone who is attached to his/her body, cremation - someone who isn't attached, whatever.

"It is difficult, however, for the conditioned soul to enter another body unless the present dead body is annihilated through cremation or some other means."

SB7.2.37

 

The way you present this it looks like that quote is the verse itself. It is not. It is a sentence from the purport.

 

Prabhupada is saying that uless someone perceives that his body is annihilated he can't move on and remains as a ghost. This IMO is not a fll picture of the situation. As I mentioned earlier the attachment for the family is what really keeps them around even after cremation or burial sometimes for years afterward at least intermittently. If this were not so then there would be no ghosts of anyone cremated or buried which is simply not the case.

 

If all those quotes were in response to me somehow I suggest you reread my post and you will see I am not against cremation I am against the waste of the trees used in the funeral pyres.

 

Hopefully you now see the point.

[tackleberry]

 

Nice try, son. I love these exchanges with you, for your hilarious responses succeed in making me chuckle even when I'm otherwise in a sullen mood. Just grab Ganguli's masterful rendering of the Mahabharata and consult the relevant passages. Everything should become clearly manifest.

 

I've quoted the Lord's words reg. his apraakrta deha, which subsequently proves your cremation theories wrong. Instead of accepting it, you're referring us to some Ganguli...are you for real? Are we to believe the Lord's words or yours or ganguli's? You're a joker, keep posting, you give us great entertainment with your moronic ideas that Krishna, the Creator and the Lord, was cremated.

[LoveroftheBhagavata]

 

I've quoted the Lord's words reg. his apraakrta deha, which subsequently proves your cremation theories wrong. Instead of accepting it, you're referring us to some Ganguli...are you for real? Are we to believe the Lord's words or yours or ganguli's? You're a joker, keep posting, you give us great entertainment with your moronic ideas that Krishna, the Creator and the Lord, was cremated.

 

Unless you never managed to graduate through high school, which seems to be the case from your lack of ability to comprehend basic English, I am at a loss to explain how you misconstrued my post. Ganguli's translation of the Mahabharata, which runs 5000 pages, is widely regarded as the most faithful rendering of the text, and his edition, as well as those of other translators, clearly describe Krishna's cremation. However, I should know better than trying to get a Madhvaite to see sense where there is.

 

And with this, I'm off arguing about such a non-issue. If you feel like responding afresh, sorry, address your post to somebody else. I'm not returning to read anything further on this thread - have far better to do than fritter my time in such an unproductive manner!

[kimfelix]

Lover of the Bhagavata, Ganguli's version is certainly regarded as the best rendition of the text as it is the only complete English translation of the Mahabharata. However, it is a translation of the Vulgate rather than the Critical Edition and he has a tendency to weave Nilakantha's commentaries into his translations.

 

By the way, is there any textual basis for your statement about Rukmini becoming sati? As I said above, it is not in the Mahabharata.

[Amlesh]

Correct me if I'm wrong... What I came to know is that the Great Bhakt Haridas Thakur was buried by the hands of Chaitanya Mahaprabhu, if it is so then anyways will do.

[suchandra]

 

 

Hopefully you now see the point.

Well your point is clear, quotes from sastra are of import, Prabhupada's purports need to be highlighted: "CAUTION:THIS IS SOMEONE ELSE'S OPINION". Only problem, makes you look above Prabhupada.

[suchandra]

 

Hey retarded joker, no school of vedanta accepts ganguli as pramaana, except perhaps your brain-dead advaitin friends. OTOH, gita is accepted as valid pramaana by every school of vedanta. And since you prefer ganguli to gita, it proves you're a moron with little knowledge of what constitutes pramaana in the vedic tradition.

 

Great post, reminds of the good ole days ISKCON - give him the sauce, yes, vedic tradition.

[theist]

 

Well your point is clear, quotes from sastra are of import, Prabhupada's purports need to be highlighted: "CAUTION:THIS IS SOMEONE ELSE'S OPINION". Only problem, makes you look above Prabhupada.

 

There is a clear difference in Prabhupada's books between verse and purport. One should stick to it. Your "CAUTION..." comment is childish.

 

Clearly I don't pretend to accept everything Srila Prabhupada says blindly. I make no claims to be his disciple.

 

Bodily attachment is not jst to the gross form itself. You can creamate the form but the family attachment remains. You disagree? And besides in burials these morticians try to make the corpse look alive with cosmetic enhancements and even fancy clothes to keep the illusion aloive as long as possible. They get buried that way. Do you think ghosts are hanging around their bodies grave for years trying to figure out if they are in the box or not?

 

No problem with disagreement but I do have a problem with someone using Prabhupada's words to try to end the discussion when it's clear they haven't a personal grasp on the subject themselves.

 

This has always been a huge problem with Iskcon. No one cent for cent believes everything Prabhupada says but 99% pretend they do. That is evident from the fact that Prabhupada clearly says love Krsna 100% and who believes him enough to do that?

 

IOW's anyone who claims to believe everything Prabhupada says without question but is not on the transcendental platform of love of God is deluding himself.

 

Sorry, a bit of a tangent, but this is one of my pet peeves.

[jijaji]

Several of Krishna's wives performed Sati upon his death, including Rukmini, Rohini, Devaki, Bhadraa and Madura

[M.Bh. Mausalaparvan 7.18] [Alld.Ch. 977, 1018-1019: Rukmini]

Madri, second wife of Pandu, considered an incarnation of the goddess Dhriti, performed Sati

[M.Bh. Adiparvan 95.65] [Alld Ch 985]

Rohini, a wife of Vasudev, Krishna's father, who gave birth to Balram ( Devki's child) and later became a Sati.

[Alld. Ch. 1018]

"The 8 queens of Krishna, who have been named, with Rukmini at their head, embraced the body of Hari, and entered the funeral fire. Revati also embracing the corpse of Rama, entered the blazing pile, which was cool to her, happy in contact with her lord. Hearing these events, Ugrasena and Anakadundubhi, with Devaki and Rohini, committed themselves to the flames."

[Vishnu Pur. 5.38] [Vishnu Pur. {Wilson} p.481]

[kimfelix]

Jijaji, the 7.18 reference from the Mausala Parvan is not present in the BORI critical edition and as you can see from the mention of Devaki, Rohini and Rukmini there is clearly some confusion there. Verse 24 of Chapter 8 in the Crit Ed mentions four wives of Vasudeva, Krishna's father, mounting his funeral pyre. Verse 31 of the same chapter describes Arjuna's burning of the bodies of Rama and Vaasudeva, but there is no mention at that point of their wives becoming sati.

 

The reference from the Vishnu Purana is 5.38.2. Thank you for that.

[Shivaduta]

Friends - have been reading this thread... surprising that i am not finding either "CREMATION or BURIAL" on most of the posts on the thread... so i guess some of you are just interested in hijacking the threads and fighting your own battles here... WAY TO GO... <!-- END TEMPLATE: navbar_link -->

[jijaji]

 

Jijaji, the 7.18 reference from the Mausala Parvan is not present in the BORI critical edition and as you can see from the mention of Devaki, Rohini and Rukmini there is clearly some confusion there. Verse 24 of Chapter 8 in the Crit Ed mentions four wives of Vasudeva, Krishna's father, mounting his funeral pyre. Verse 31 of the same chapter describes Arjuna's burning of the bodies of Rama and Vaasudeva, but there is no mention at that point of their wives becoming sati.

 

The reference from the Vishnu Purana is 5.38.2. Thank you for that.

 

Thank you for the critique,

 

namaskaram

[Sunds]

Being a Hindu, I opt cremation but otherwise I prefer burial. I would want my mortal remains to be a food to other organisms.