Are you sectarian?

[theist]

 

Oh and by the way theist I just had a realization from supersoul:eek:

 

'You really dig these discussions dont you?' I do:)

 

There is no other subject but God. I just look forward to the day when I can speak from realization. As it is I just keep going because I am afraid of totally forgeting Krsna. Such is life in the shadows.

[bija]

'same same' lol

 

18. Do you believe that devotees can chant the glory of God in their local language and derive the same benefit from it as when chanting in Sanskrit or Bengali ?

This number 18 is a good one. My teacher onetime said to me, it is good to chant in Bengali for several reasons. He recommended it, but not to delve deeply into it when reading to an audience whose only grasp is english. He said it is still very respectful to read the Bengali in our books. The nuances of the language, and out of respect to the acaryas who wrote in this language are some of the reasons he cited to not pass over the Bengali when giving class. I recall Srila Bhaktisiddhanta Prabhupada longing for the day when devotees all over the world can read the glories of Sri Caitanya in Bengali.

 

What are we to think of this? Those who dont have the gift of grasping foreign language, will their devotion be limited in some way?

 

What is the language of the heart?

[RadheRade1657]

The language of the heart is love, which can be expressed in any language, by anyone, at anytime.

[bija]

There is no other subject but God. I just look forward to the day when I can speak from realization. As it is I just keep going because I am afraid of totally forgeting Krsna. Such is life in the shadows. theist

What I feel, I cant say

But my love is there for you anytime of day

But if its not love that you need

Then Ill try my best to make everything succeed

Tell me, what is my life without your love

Tell me, who am I without you, by my side

What I know, I can do

If I give my love now to everyone like you

But if its not love that you need

Then Ill try my best to make evrything succeed

(George)

 

 

Inarticulate speech, inarticulate speech of the heart

Inarticulate speech, inarticulate speech of the heart

 

I'm a soul in wonder (ahahah)

I'm a soul in wonder (ahahah)

I'm a soul in wonder (ahahah)

I'm a soul in wonder (ahahah)

 

Inarticulate speech, inarticulate speech of the heart

Inarticulate speech, inarticulate speech of the heart

 

I'm just wild about it I can't live without it

I'm just wild about it I can't live without it

 

Inarticulate speech, inarticulate speech of the heart

Inarticulate speech, inarticulate speech of the heart

 

I'm a soul in wonder (ahahah)

I'm a soul in wonder (ahahah)

I'm a soul in wonder (ahahah)

I'm a soul in wonder (ahahah)

 

[spoken:]

I'm a soul in wonder

I'm a soul in wonder

I'm a soul in wonder

 

A soul in wonder

 

(van morrison)

[suchandra]

 

I position I prefer to being a parrot.

 

Well yes, I can live with it being a parrot - Lord Caitanya said something similiar - "don't play with with the Vedanta philosophy". Since playing is presently something like a national sport, times have changed, therefore disport yourself by posting whatever comes to mind and have fun.

 

"After this inquiry, the Lord submissively replied: “I have taken to the saṅkīrtana movement instead of the study of Vedānta because I am a great fool.” The Lord thus represented Himself as one of the numberless fools of this age who are absolutely incapable of studying the Vedānta philosophy. The fools’ indulgence in the study of Vedānta has caused so much havoc in society. The Lord thus continued: “And because I am a great fool, My spiritual master forbade Me to play with Vedānta philosophy. He said that it is better that I chant the holy name of the Lord, for that would deliver Me from material bondage."

 

(Introduction Srimad-Bhagavatam)

[Malati dasi]

Quote:

<TABLE cellSpacing=0 cellPadding=6 width="100%" border=0><TBODY><TR><TD style="BORDER-RIGHT: #666666 1px solid; PADDING-RIGHT: 3ex; BORDER-TOP: #666666 1px solid; PADDING-LEFT: 3ex; BORDER-LEFT: #666666 1px solid; BORDER-BOTTOM: #666666 1px solid" bgColor=#e0e0e0>Originally Posted by Malati dasi

Theist said: From the Lord's perspective what would be the difference between a soul's praying for mercy whose body happens to be wearing a Christian or Islamic suit or even of no religion affiliation at all and one wearing a suit compossed of dhoti and tilak?

 

Malati : The difference is the degree of surrender. In the Gita, Lord Krishna says to the effect that as much as you surrender to me that much I give you the intimate knowledge by which you can come to me.

 

 

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Theist said: Yes but that is an individual consideration and not one based on religious or non-religious affiliation. Krsna did not tell Arjuna to join any one particular religion, He told him to abandon them all.

 

Malati dasi: So you think surrender to God is sectarianism , yeah? Maybe you need to learn the real meaning of surrender. Go get a real spiritual life and get some sadhu sanga.

 

Sectarianism is what you are showing in this forum. Debating against people who believe that they need a Guru or sadhu sanga to progress in the spiritual path that they choose to follow.

[Malati dasi]

Quote:

<TABLE cellSpacing=0 cellPadding=6 width="100%" border=0><TBODY><TR><TD style="BORDER-RIGHT: #666666 1px solid; PADDING-RIGHT: 3ex; BORDER-TOP: #666666 1px solid; PADDING-LEFT: 3ex; BORDER-LEFT: #666666 1px solid; BORDER-BOTTOM: #666666 1px solid" bgColor=#e0e0e0>Originally Posted by Malati dasi

Theist in answer to Suchandra: Thanks for the permission slip. At least I am honest and in touch with my areas of doubt and disagreement. I position I prefer to being a parrot.

 

Again I need to remind you I have never said I am a Vaisnava I leave that posturing to others.

 

 

Malati : To be a parrot is a good thing so long as you abide by this: Shastra, Guru and Sadhu.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

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The problem is a parrot does not understand what it is saying. Becoming a parrot or an echo is not self realization.

 

 

Malati dasi: How can you be sure that what you are hearing is God's voice and not your ego? You heard of the saying 3 heads are better than one, right?

 

<!-- BEGIN TEMPLATE: bbcode_quote -->Quote:

<TABLE cellSpacing=0 cellPadding=6 width="100%" border=0><TBODY><TR><TD style="BORDER-RIGHT: #666666 1px solid; PADDING-RIGHT: 3ex; BORDER-TOP: #666666 1px solid; PADDING-LEFT: 3ex; BORDER-LEFT: #666666 1px solid; BORDER-BOTTOM: #666666 1px solid" bgColor=#e0e0e0>I believe that to think that paramatma is talking to us or directing us all the time is deception of the highest order. The worst kind is self-deception </TD></TR></TBODY></TABLE>

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I would suggest rereading the Bhagavad-gita. There you will learn that Supersoul is directing the wanderings of ALL conditioned souls.

 

Malati dasi: Of course what you quoted is a very nice verse, still the Gita does not understate the importance of siksha. All religious faiths do not negate the importance of siksha, whether its the Catholic faith, Muslim, even Buddhism has their masters. But most especially I will mention Gvism. Aside from the sastras, the foundational acharyas showed that siksha is part and parcel of the progressive development of a person endevouring for spiritual perfection.

 

Doesn't the BHagavad Gita say : Learn the truth by approaching the a spiritual master . Learn from him submissively and render service unto him. The realized soul can impart knowledge unto you because he has seen the truth.

 

Whether you believe that the Guru should be physically present or can be present through his writings etc, you can't deny that YOUR understanding alone, ok, I use the realization if you like , is not the absolute benchmark by which you can know the truth.

 

You think it will hurt someone if he/she exchanges realizations with an advanced devotee?

 

I have to remind you that humility is also needed to cleanse our hearts of the dust that can block the clear appearance of paramatma.

 

 

 

 

<!-- BEGIN TEMPLATE: bbcode_quote -->Quote:

<TABLE cellSpacing=0 cellPadding=6 width="100%" border=0><TBODY><TR><TD style="BORDER-RIGHT: #666666 1px solid; PADDING-RIGHT: 3ex; BORDER-TOP: #666666 1px solid; PADDING-LEFT: 3ex; BORDER-LEFT: #666666 1px solid; BORDER-BOTTOM: #666666 1px solid" bgColor=#e0e0e0>The Supreme Lord is situated in everyone's heart, O Arjuna, and is directing the wanderings of all living entities, who are seated as on a machine, made of the material energy. Bg 18.61 </TD></TR></TBODY></TABLE>

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Not to hear Supersoul is the worst kind of self-deception.

 

Malati dasi: Well, who is Arjuna hearing from? From his Guru and friend right? Without Krishna He will not be even in a position to understand that the Lord is in his heart.

 

The worst kind of deception is to think that you are hearing the soupersoul and any sisya from anyone is not necessary.

Such arrogance !!

[suchandra]

 

Quote:

<table border="0" cellpadding="6" cellspacing="0" width="100%"><tbody><tr><td style="border: 1px solid rgb(102, 102, 102); padding-right: 3ex; padding-left: 3ex;" bgcolor="#e0e0e0">

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The problem is a parrot does not understand what it is saying. Becoming a parrot or an echo is not self realization.

 

 

Malati dasi: How can you be sure that what you are hearing is God's voice and not your ego? You heard of the saying 3 heads are better than one, right?

 

<!-- BEGIN TEMPLATE: bbcode_quote -->Quote:

<table border="0" cellpadding="6" cellspacing="0" width="100%"><tbody><tr><td style="border: 1px solid rgb(102, 102, 102); padding-right: 3ex; padding-left: 3ex;" bgcolor="#e0e0e0">I believe that to think that paramatma is talking to us or directing us all the time is deception of the highest order. The worst kind is self-deception </td></tr></tbody></table>

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I would suggest rereading the Bhagavad-gita. There you will learn that Supersoul is directing the wanderings of ALL conditioned souls.

 

Malati dasi: Of course what you quoted is a very nice verse, still the Gita does not understate the importance of siksha. All religious faiths do not negate the importance of siksha, whether its the Catholic faith, Muslim, even Buddhism has their masters. But most especially I will mention Gvism. Aside from the sastras, the foundational acharyas showed that siksha is part and parcel of the progressive development of a person endevouring for spiritual perfection.

 

Doesn't the BHagavad Gita say : Learn the truth by approaching the a spiritual master . Learn from him submissively and render service unto him. The realized soul can impart knowledge unto you because he has seen the truth.

 

Whether you believe that the Guru should be physically present or can be present through his writings etc, you can't deny that YOUR understanding alone, ok, I use the realization if you like , is not the absolute benchmark by which you can know the truth.

 

You think it will hurt someone if he/she exchanges realizations with an advanced devotee?

 

I have to remind you that humility is also needed to cleanse our hearts of the dust that can block the clear appearance of paramatma.

 

 

 

 

<!-- BEGIN TEMPLATE: bbcode_quote -->Quote:

<table border="0" cellpadding="6" cellspacing="0" width="100%"><tbody><tr><td style="border: 1px solid rgb(102, 102, 102); padding-right: 3ex; padding-left: 3ex;" bgcolor="#e0e0e0">The Supreme Lord is situated in everyone's heart, O Arjuna, and is directing the wanderings of all living entities, who are seated as on a machine, made of the material energy. Bg 18.61 </td></tr></tbody></table>

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Not to hear Supersoul is the worst kind of self-deception.

 

Malati dasi: Well, who is Arjuna hearing from? From his Guru and friend right? Without Krishna He will not be even in a position to understand that the Lord is in his heart.

 

The worst kind of deception is to think that you are hearing the soupersoul and any sisya from anyone is not necessary.

Such arrogance !!

I wrote some 2400 posts at this forum if you conclude that this is a stupid parrot then I'll be a parrot. Thanks sd.

[Shakti-Fan]

 

I wrote some 2400 posts at this forum if you conclude that this is a stupid parrot then I'll be a parrot. Thanks sd.

Could you elaborate on this. What exactly do you mean?

[cbrahma]

 

My teacher onetime said to me, it is good to chant in Bengali for several reasons

The syllables have power regardless of whether they are understood. Understanding of course improves the effect.

[theist]

 

'same same' lol

 

18. Do you believe that devotees can chant the glory of God in their local language and derive the same benefit from it as when chanting in Sanskrit or Bengali ?

This number 18 is a good one. My teacher onetime said to me, it is good to chant in Bengali for several reasons. He recommended it, but not to delve deeply into it when reading to an audience whose only grasp is english. He said it is still very respectful to read the Bengali in our books. The nuances of the language, and out of respect to the acaryas who wrote in this language are some of the reasons he cited to not pass over the Bengali when giving class. I recall Srila Bhaktisiddhanta Prabhupada longing for the day when devotees all over the world can read the glories of Sri Caitanya in Bengali.

 

What are we to think of this? Those who dont have the gift of grasping foreign language, will their devotion be limited in some way?

What is the language of the heart?

 

Indeed what is that language? What sound is made by the heart as it reaches out to God? All languages are the same to Krsna because He has absolute understanding of what is really meant by a soul who is seeking Him in any of the four ways mentioned in the Bhagvad-gita.

 

No one can bluff Krsna. Which is better.

 

1.Parroting ( not understanding what one is speaking) the prayers from the great devotees in a foreign language we don't comprehend while our minds wander all over until it's done.

 

2. Being a simple person, unsophisticated, unable to speak, unaffiliated with any established religion, suddenly realizing one's emptiness without the Lord and the need for His help and inwardly turning one's heart towards Him and in the language of the heart crying out for His help.

 

I know my choice.

[theist]

To malati and suchandra.

 

Since you both like to place words in my mouth which I never said and then attack them and neither of you seems to be willing or able to keep a converation in context from one post to the next I'll save my time and let you battle your strawmen to your hearts content.

[suchandra]

 

 

I know my choice.

 

Thanks so much theist and further on good posting!

 

theist: "Again I need to remind you I have never said I am a Vaisnava I leave that posturing to others."