Will we ever understand fully the greatness of Krsna and His opulence?

[Amlesh]

 

Maybe we can talk about our realizations why it is important oneday. And the inner aspect of the benefit with such an approach.

 

Yes, it would be nice. But in a forum, I'm wondering how it would be.

 

 

Good night (how do I say that in tamil)

 

 

If I'm not wrong, it's Kalai Vanakam.

[bija]

Yes, it would be nice. But in a forum, I'm wondering how it would be.amlesh

 

My Gurudeva is an internet teacher Amlesh. Its funny I even learn the internet from him lol. We have live chat, live video, live forum....he is online most of the day and he moderates everything. He is very strict in this regard. We are building a dream and aspiration of a nice vaisnava environment.

 

Audarya Forum is very different in its heated debates and more free in its approach. The danger is that we may offend a devotee. As you know even an offence toward a sinner who has bhakti is grave. So yes....it may be wise to not discuss somethings so that offences do not occur. Personally I would not like to lead a person that way, into deeper difficulty.

 

I would like to see it be possible here to discuss real katha. Visitors would be blessed that way. And I know many others would like to hear of the beauty of inner spiritual life. Ofcourse we are all learning how to share one with another, I am learning day by day...long way to go. And by Nitaai's mercy, if he wills, oneday we will do it, and do it well! lol .

 

A pure soul never considers offence...and the one aspiring for purity sees the opportunities to work at it.

 

Good night Prabhu.

 

All glories to Lord Nityananda whose mercy saved the drunkards and dacoits, Jagai and Madhai!

[Laulyam]

TEXT 230

 

gopi-anugatya vina aisvarya-jnane

bhajileha nahi paya vrajendra-nandane

 

SYNONYMS

 

gopi-anugatya--subservience to the gopis; vina--without; aisvarya-jnane--in the knowledge of opulence; bhajileha--if serving the Supreme Lord; nahi--not; paya--gets; vrajendra-nandane--the son of Maharaja Nanda, Krsna.

 

TRANSLATION

 

"Unless one follows in the footsteps of the gopis, he cannot attain the service of the lotus feet of Krsna, the son of Nanda Maharaja. If one is overcome by knowledge of the Lord's opulence, he cannot attain the Lord's lotus feet, even though he is engaged in devotional service.

 

PURPORT

 

One can worship Laksmi-Narayana by the process of vidhi-marga, worshiping the Lord with regulative principles according to the instructions of the sastra and the spiritual master. But the Supreme Personality of Godhead, Radha-Krsna, cannot be directly worshiped by this process. The dealings between Radha and Krsna and the gopis are devoid of the opulences of Laksmi-Narayana. The process of vidhi-marga, following the regulative principles, is utilized in the worship of Laksmi-Narayana, whereas the process of spontaneous service--following in the footsteps of the gopis, who are the denizens of Vrndavana--is transcendentally more advanced and is the process whereby Radha and Krsna are worshiped. One cannot attain this elevated position while worshiping the Lord in His opulence. Those attracted by the conjugal love between Radha and Krsna must follow in the footsteps of the gopis. Only then is it possible to enter into the Lord's service in Goloka Vrndavana and directly associate with Radha and Krsna.

[bija]

In our temples we first worship the Radha-Krishna Deities by the mood of Lakshmi-Narayana worship with vidhi-marga until we are purified. We begin worshiping them in Their opulence until we gradually become free of offences.

 

At some stage we may be fortunate and purified enough to begin raganuga (spontaneous) bhakti practice.

 

I was talking to my teacher last night about raganuga practice in jaap. He was very straight forward with me and said, 'you are not qualified for raganuga jaap yet. You should practice rules and regulations'.

 

I asked him indirectly, 'what is the test of my qualification?'

 

His response was, 'when you chant the Holy Name are you seeing the form constantly? If not then how can you practice raganuga?'

 

I am sure fortunate souls are qualified for this spontaneous devotion, some of us a trying to devevlop greed for it, and others are humble and practicing vidhi-marga worshiping the Deity by rules and regulations.

 

Ofcourse Sri Caitanya came to give raganuga as in the above quotes you have given, but this does not mean that we look down upon other vaisnava's and their practice of devotion.

 

As far as I understand, I am very basic....

[gHari]

<BLOCKQUOTE><CENTER><FONT COLOR=RED>mattaH parataraM nAnyat

kiJcid asti dhanaJjaya

mayi sarvam idaM protaM

sUtre maNi-gaNA iva

</CENTER>

mattaH--beyond Me; para-taram--superior; na--not; anyat kiJcit--anything else; asti--there is; dhanaJjaya--O conqueror of wealth; mayi--in Me; sarvam--all that be; idam--which we see; protam--is strung; sUtre--on a thread; maNi-gaNAH--pearls; iva--like.

<B></FONT>

O conqueror of wealth, there is no truth superior to Me. Everything rests upon Me, as pearls are strung on a thread.</B>

[bija]

Everything rests upon Me, as pearls are strung on a thread.

The source of harmony...

mayi--in Me; sarvam--all that be

[guliaditya]

Excellent post by dark warrior on great Alvars.I have read about all the 12 great alvars.Even the divine charitra of Andal is worth reading.

This is what should be posted on this forum.Thru great devotees only we can understand about Sreeman Narayana. Doing bhakti of Sreeman Narayana & reading divine charitra of great devotees of Sreeman Narayana should be the sole objective of human being.

Thanks a lot Dark warrior(would be highly obliged if u write your real name).

Pls post for other Alvars also.

 

Pranaam

[bija]

This is what should be posted on this forum. by guliaditya

For sure. Last night I was sitting talking to dark warrior, and his posts were awakening devotional feelings within me. It was blissful to be honest. Also I felt I was having a devotional dealing with a vaisnava. I relished that so much. He was my guest in my house!

 

I am sure others would love to hear more about bhakti. That is what we all have in common.

 

There may be differences in dark's and my tradition, but we can still relish bhakti and its feelings. We can relish seeing bhakti vibrant in the heart of the other. Inspiring the bliss of devotion in another is true service, and very self-less.

 

I think 'difference' in the subtle teachings of our traditions becomes a treasure when we grow spiritually. We can see the subtle nuances gradually, and the rich diversity that is in God's personality.

 

If we are not developed so much spiritually, discussing differences may be contentious. When dealing with others in this world we need to be aware of that.

 

 

from Madhurya Kadambini: The scriptures also state that if a person, after considering all these facts, adamantly equates Lord Vishnu with demigods like Lord Brahma, Lord Siva, and so on he is condemned as an atheist and an offender. The basis of this scriptural injunction lies in the fact that while Lord Brahma is generally an empowered jiva, Lord Siva at times is also an empowered jiva. Persons who have not researched deeply 'into this subject matter end up forming their own speculative ideas. They make such comments as, “Lord Vishnu is God and not Lord Siva”, or “Lord Siva is the Supreme, not Lord Vishnu.” They continue to say, 'We are undeviating devotees of Lord Vishnu; we do not care for Lord Siva”, and vice versa. Hence their inclination to polemics leads them to commit offences. Now, the only way they can mitigate their offences is to meet a devotee well-versed in this topic who is willing to instruct them properly. The confused can become enlightened about everyone's real position, including in which way Lord Siva and Lord Vishnu are qualitatively nondifferent. Such persons begin to repent of having committed such offences and sincerely take up chanting the Lord's holy name. In fact, it is this chanting that finally exonerates such people from their offence.

 

[guliaditya]

 

This is what should be posted on this forum. by guliaditya

There may be differences in dark's and my tradition, but we can still relish bhakti and its feelings. We can relish seeing bhakti vibrant in the heart of the other. Inspiring the bliss of devotion in another is true service, and very self-less.

 

I think 'difference' in the subtle teachings of our traditions becomes a treasure when we grow spiritually. We can see the subtle nuances gradually, and the rich diversity that is in God's personality.

 

if we are not developed so much spiritually, discussing differences may be contentious. When dealing with others in this world we need to be aware of that.

 

There can be philosophical differences but the center theme is bhakti. It is thru bhakti only we can attain Sreeman Narayana.Quoting 2 verse from Bhagavatam.

 

na yad vacas' citra-padam harer yas'o

jagat-pavitram pragrinîta karhicit

tad vâyasam tîrtham us'anti mânasâ

na yatra hamsâ niramanty us'ik-kshayâh (SB 1.5.10)

 

Those words which do not describe the glories of the Lord Hari, who alone can sanctify the atmosphere of the whole universe, are considered by saintly persons to be like unto a place of pilgrimage for crows. Since the all-perfect persons are inhabitants of the transcendental abode, they do not derive any pleasure there.

 

tad-vâg-visargo janatâgha-viplavo

yasmin prati-s'lokam abaddhavaty api

nâmâny anantasya yas'o 'nkitâni yat

s'rinvanti gâyanti grinanti sâdhavah (SB 1.5.11)

 

On the other hand, that literature which is full of descriptions of the transcendental glories of the name, fame, forms, pastimes, etc., of the unlimited Supreme Lord is a different creation, full of transcendental words directed toward bringing about a revolution in the impious lives of this world's misdirected civilization. Such transcendental literatures, even though imperfectly composed, are heard, sung and accepted by purified men who are thoroughly honest.

 

Pranaam

 

 

[Amlesh]

 

There can be philosophical differences but the center theme is bhakti. It is thru bhakti only we can attain Sreeman Narayana.

 

Perfectly true. Take for example the Gita... It is the only sacred text where anyone can find Himself in the role of Arjuna. Be it, a vegetable seller, a manager, a teacher, a sad person, happy person, greedy fellow, gentleman etc.

 

The Divine song accomodates its tune according to the listener's ears.

 

We can see that the text of the Gita has the unique attribute of changing its meaning according to the context.

 

However, there is one central meaning that is the secret of all understandings and it remains unchange and is eternal.

 

And that secret is what guliaditya has just revealed.

 

Thumbs Up to you my friend.

 

Cheers.