The wonderful Hindu invasion of ISKCON Melbourne

[gauragopala dasa]

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The wonderful Hindu invasion of ISKCON Melbourne

 

 

 

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Devotees celebrate Janmastami 2008

 

Indian Hindus are populating ISKCON Temples in the West in a way never seen before over the last 42 years. This is happening all over the world at a massive rate and is not a phenomenon as some suggest.

 

The fact is, as India becomes a wealthier Nation, we can only expect more and more students to leave India and attend Western Educational institutions as well as many more arriving from India to become citizens of other countries.

 

Alsowe are seeing that many of these students eventually take up residency in Countries like Australia. As a result, India "Hinduism" has increased 153% just in the last 4 years in Australia! We have also seen in resent years that some of those students have moved into the ISKCON Temples and have taken up the life of a Brahmacari>/b>

 

We are all living in interesting times. As the world becomes more and more like a Global Village, due to technology, we are seeing a massive movement or the travelling of the Wolds population of population never before seen in recorded history.

 

Already the most popular Nation on the planet who speaks the English language, is not England, America, Canada or Australia, it is India whose enormous population is on the move.

 

At the Melbourne Australian ISKCON Temple on the weekend, there were 12,000 people of which 98% where Indian Hindu’s, Sikhs and even some Indian Muslims, celebrating Janmastami (Lord Krsna’s appearance day). The other 2% were of European background

 

From the perspective of a white Australians like myself, this was truly an amazing Janmastami like no other experienced in ISKCON Melbourne's history.

 

There was a queue of people, mostly Indian Hindus, that went from the front gate of the Temple for two blocks all waiting to enter the Temple, I have never seen anything like this in Australia..

 

It was truly fascinating to watch as those in different parts of the queue were having their own kirtan while waiting to see the beautiful Deities of Radha Ballabha and then honour delicious Maha-prasadam.

 

I felt very privileged to be apart of and witness this truly amazing event of Janmastami in 2008 and thought how Srila Prabhupada would be so pleased that ISKCON was providing the facility to worship Krsna in every corner of the planet.

 

This is a very auspicious historical event that is happening now and has been unfolding for the past 42 years. There is a famous saying that history is never recognized in its own time. What Srila Prabhupada achieved in the mid 1960s, will eventually be recognized as the most significant event who planted the seeds of a coming bonafide spiritual Movement that will inundate the entire World.

 

As we were watching the vast queue of people slowly making their way into the Temple, I mentioned to some young Brahmacaris, of who most are of Indian origin, that they must never forget why Srila Prabhupada came to the West in the first place. We must understand His Divine Grace came first to America to give Krsna, the Supreme Personality of Godhead, and cause of ALL causes, to EVERYONE regardless of race, colour, political persuasion, or religion

 

Srila Prabhupada further wanted to influence ALL the age-old branches of so called Hinduism and bring them back to the original essence and cream of Vedic teachings, The beautiful Bhagavat Purana or Srimad Bhagavatam. In the Caitanya Caritamrta, it is stated that the essence and conclusion of all Vedic texts is the Srimad Bhagavatam.

 

This message was brought to the West by Srila Prabhupada in 1965, and then taken back to India by Prabhupada and with his ‘dancing white elephants’ in 1970. This was a name Prabhupada used to describe his Western devotees he had brought with him to India for the purpose of building ISKCON Temples all over India.

 

In this way, ISKCON would help rejuvenate and re-establish the worship of Krsna, the original cause of all causes, Lord Caitanya and the chanting of the Hare Krsna mantra meant for this age of Kali yuga to all those of Hindu background and bring about a spiritual revolution within India.

 

It was further emphasised, as we watched this massive Hindu invasion of Melbourne Temple on Janmastami day, that we must not just preach only to the Indians Hindu’s, who are coming on their own accord anyway due to Krsna being part of their ancient tradition.

 

We, including those of Indian birth, must also be determined to preach to all others regardless of religious or cultural backgrounds. Krsna or God is for everyone and is in every living beings heart.

 

What ISKCON is offering to all the Hindu’s who are taking citizenship in Australia, is the basic foundations of the faith of their birth, however, the brahmacaris were reminded to keep up the mood of Srila Prabhupada and preach to EVERYONE regardless of race or culture and keep attracting those of Western background and follow the disposition of Srila Prabhupada.

 

Here is an interesting story in regards to demigod worship.

 

In 1974, I personally was the pujari who performed puja to Ganesha at ISKCON’s Spiritual Sky incense and clothing company in Melbourne for around four months. All the devotee workers would attend the puja as instructed by the then manager of Spiritual Sky in Melbourne, Ugrashava Prabhu. At the time, I was also dressing the small Radha Govinda Deities at the Temple and afterwards would go down town to Spiritual Sky to perform the Ganesha puja

 

When Prabhupada came to Melbourne for Rathayatra in 1974, he had heard about our worshiping of Ganesha and performing puja to him, and called for Jayadharma Prabhu and myself to come to his room. Jayadharma Prabhu was the Australian General Manager of Spiritual Sky at the time. Srila Prabhupada told us immediately to stop this worship of Ganesha with Prabhupada humbly adding,

 

“Our ISKCON properties are NOT for demigod worship, our devotees are to exclusively worship Radha Krsna, Gaura Nitai and Balarama, Subhadra and Jagannatha, and to also celebrate other various Vishnu tattva’s like Lord. Ramachandra etc though, our main focus is worshiping Radha and Krishna.

 

We always offer proper respects to all the demigods. We must always know however, that no demigod is equal to or above the Supreme Lord

 

Our ISKCON temples are known as Hare Krsna or Radha Krsna Temples, this is what we want people also in India to understand. Even on our Spiritual Sky incense packet there is Radha Krsna”

 

Srila Prabhupada then paused for a moment, then emphasised again the central status of his movement “Our ISKCON devotees exclusively worship Radha and Krsna and of course Lord Caitanya Mahaprabhu”

 

And then Srila Prabhupada finished his talk to Jayadharma Prabhu and myself by saying in very simple straightforward English.

 

“Why worship the demigods when they all get all their power from krsna anyway?

 

Then Satsvarupa Maharaj, who was also in the room, quotes from memory -

“Those whose intelligence has been stolen by material desires surrender unto demigods and follow the particular rules and regulations of worship according to their own natures. (Bhagavad Gita 7:20.)

 

Men of small intelligence worship the demigods, and their fruits are limited and temporary. Those who worship the demigods go to the planets of the demigods, but My devotees ultimately reach My supreme planet.” (Bhagavad Gita 7:23.)

 

So obviously, our worship of Ganasha at Spiritual Sky came to an abrupt end

 

Hari Bol, All glorious to Prabhupada

 

Your fallen servant Gauragopala dasa

 

[realist]

Also click <LI class=rss_item>Ecstatic slideshow from Iskcon Melbourne's Janmastami

<LI class=rss_item>10,000 guests during Janmastami in Melbourne

[theist]

A wonderful scene. Of course inducing materialists to become bhaktas is the real mission and not just importing bhaktas from India.

[Sarva gattah]

 

A wonderful scene. Of course inducing materialists to become bhaktas is the real mission and not just importing bhaktas from India.

 

Yes, this is the purpose of Srila Prabhupad coming to the West however, we cannot deny the fact that the Hindu community has revived ISKCON and possibly saved ISKCON from being lumped in as a werd cult

 

After the guru fiasco and the exudes of white Americans, Australians and Europeans we are now seeing ‘HINDU’S’ coming in to fill the ‘void’

Yes, I also saw, NOT 2% of whites at the Temple, but less than a quarter percent of 12,000 people.

 

It's all good and part of an unfolding bigger picture

 

[theist]

I hope so. ISKCON or no ISKCON success will be when everyone takes to the chanting of any one the hundreds and millions Holy Names of the Lord.

[Sarva gattah]

nice photos, you can count the 'whites' on two hands, not that there is anything wrong with that except we all have a lot of preaching in Australia to do.

 

http://flickr.com/photos/rasadd/sets/72157606960173422/show/

[theist]

 

nice photos, you can count the 'whites' on two hands, not that there is anything wrong with that except we all have a lot of preaching in Australia to do.

 

http://flickr.com/photos/rasadd/sets/72157606960173422/show/

 

It is successful no doubt. Srila Prabhupada also wanted to reignite Krishna bhakti in India also and to provide something in the west for those that immigrate. That is working nicely and is to ISKCON's eternal credit.

 

It is that it is just a very incomplete picture. Sankirtana movement or temple movement? Is there a difference? If so which one should receive the main focus?

[guliaditya]

 

I hope so. ISKCON or no ISKCON success will be when everyone takes to the chanting of any one the hundreds and millions Holy Names of the Lord.

 

Very true Theistji......

If this happens then it will become a different world....

There will be no time left for hatredness or other sinful activities....

 

Pranaam

[Amlesh]

Heal The World

Make It A Better Place

For You And For Me

And The Entire Human Race

There Are People Dying

If You Care Enough

For The Living

Make A Better Place

For You And For Me

It's only possible by Ram Naam.

Thanks guliadityaji and Theistji

[Vigraha]

 

Heal The World

Make It A Better Place

For You And For Me

And The Entire Human Race

There Are People Dying

If You Care Enough

For The Living

Make A Better Place

For You And For Me

 

Added

 

 

click -Heal the World

04:14

Added

[TRANSLATED] click -Black Or White it doesn't matter if your Indian, Ameican, European, Chinese, Australian Aborigines, Africans

 

 

 

 

 

[Vigraha]

 

Here is an interesting story in regards to demigod worship.

 

In 1974, I personally was the pujari who performed puja to Ganesha at ISKCON’s Spiritual Sky incense and clothing company in Melbourne for around four months. All the devotee workers would attend the puja as instructed by the then manager of Spiritual Sky in Melbourne, Ugrashava Prabhu. At the time, I was also dressing the small Radha Govinda Deities at the Temple and afterwards would go down town to Spiritual Sky to perform the Ganesha puja

 

When Prabhupada came to Melbourne for Rathayatra in 1974, he had heard about our worshiping of Ganesha and performing puja to him, and called for Jayadharma Prabhu and myself to come to his room. Jayadharma Prabhu was the Australian General Manager of Spiritual Sky at the time. Srila Prabhupada told us immediately to stop this worship of Ganesha with Prabhupada humbly adding,

 

“Our ISKCON properties are NOT for demigod worship, our devotees are to exclusively worship Radha Krsna, Gaura Nitai and Balarama, Subhadra and Jagannatha, and to also celebrate other various Vishnu tattva’s like Lord. Ramachandra etc though, our main focus is worshiping Radha and Krishna.

 

We always offer proper respects to all the demigods. We must always know however, that no demigod is equal to or above the Supreme Lord

 

Our ISKCON temples are known as Hare Krsna or Radha Krsna Temples, this is what we want people also in India to understand. Even on our Spiritual Sky incense packet there is Radha Krsna”

 

Srila Prabhupada then paused for a moment, then emphasised again the central status of his movement “Our ISKCON devotees exclusively worship Radha and Krsna and of course Lord Caitanya Mahaprabhu”

 

And then Srila Prabhupada finished his talk to Jayadharma Prabhu and myself by saying in very simple straightforward English.

 

“Why worship the demigods when they all get all their power from krsna anyway?

 

Then Satsvarupa Maharaj, who was also in the room, quotes from memory -

“Those whose intelligence has been stolen by material desires surrender unto demigods and follow the particular rules and regulations of worship according to their own natures. (Bhagavad Gita 7:20.)

 

Men of small intelligence worship the demigods, and their fruits are limited and temporary. Those who worship the demigods go to the planets of the demigods, but My devotees ultimately reach My supreme planet.” (Bhagavad Gita 7:23.)

 

So obviously, our worship of Ganasha at Spiritual Sky came to an abrupt end

 

Hari Bol, All glorious to Prabhupada

 

Your fallen servant Gauragopala dasa

 

 

 

demigod worship versus vishnu-tattva expansions

 

 

 

In a letter to Upendra dasa in Fiji, dated October 26, 1970, from Amritsar, India, Srila Prabhupada wrote:

"Regarding worship of demigods, the whole Hindu society is absorbed in this business, so unless our preaching work is very vigorous it is very difficult to stop them."

When I speak of Hindu "polytheism", I refer NOT to demigod worship, but to our doctrine of vishnu-tattva expansions.

A friend in college, Victor, once said he thought God was "lonely," because He is a solitary and omnipresent Being who has no equal--because there's only ONE God, right? Victor said God may create humans for companionship, but this is similar to an old lady with cats as pets.

Victor was obviously thinking in terms of the Judaic (monotheistic) conception of God. As Vaishnavas, we recognize that God can expand Himself into other Supreme Beings, yet still remain one: e.g. -- Radha-Krishna, Krishna-Balarama, Nitai-Gauranga, the Pancha-tattva, etc.

The closest concept to our doctrine of God expanding Himself into other Supreme Beings, yet still remaining one (vishnu-tattva expansions) is the doctrine of the Trinity, which Jews and Muslims reject as disguised polytheism.

In their 1990 book, Om Shalom: Judaism and Krishna Consciousness, Rabbi Jacob Shimmel even tells Satyaraja dasa (Steven Rosen) that because of belief in a Trinity, Christianity cannot be considered a truly monotheistic religion.

I wonder what Rabbi Shimmel would think of the loving exchanges between Radha and Krishna! Dr. Klaus Klostermaier says that it is in the doctrine of the Trinity that the closest parallel to Radha and Krishna can be found.

There's an old joke: "How many Christians does it take to change a light bulb?" Answer: "Three, but they're really one."

Back in 1988, a Jewish girl who had never visited a Krishna temple, asked me about the identity of Radha. What should I have told her? That we worship two Gods on our altar, and these two are "really one" ?

Upon his first visit to a Krishna temple, and seeing Sri Sri Radha-Giridhari, my friend Aaron asked me, "Why do you have two Gods on your altar?"

I pointedly asked my friend Prana-Krishna dasa (Dr. Frank Morales), a disciple of Srila Prabhupada's godbrother Sridhara Majaraja, whether we (Vaishnavas) are worshipping one God or two Gods. He replied, "We are worshipping one God divided into two persons, just as the Christians are worshipping one God divided into three persons."

When I told Prana-Krishna dasa that I had asked the very same question to my friend Nityananda dasa (Bill Hiler) and couldn't get a straight answer from him, Prana-Krishna dasa replied, "That's because Prabhupada didn't focus on things like that."

I don't know if Christians would ever refer to the Father, Son and Holy Spirit as "Them" or "Their Lordships" (i.e., in the plural) as we do with the Deities (again, note the plural!), but Srila Prabhupada did favorably compare the doctrine of the Trinity with our doctrine of the Three Aspects of God: Bhagavan, Paramatma, Brahman.

Muslims also regard the Catholic veneration of saints as idolatry and polytheism, and on the altars of ISKCON temples you see pictures of Bhaktivinoda Thakura, Bhaktisiddhanta Thakura, the six Goswamis, the Tulasi plant, etc.

I don't know how else to describe it, except to say that we're worshipping saints--these are all jiva-tattva living entities. Jews and Muslims consider it blasphemy to worship anyone other than God.

For this reason, guru worship is also foreign to Judaism and Islam. No one worships Moses or Mohammed the way we worship Srila Prabhupada--as an intermediary between God and man, who suffers for the sins of his disciples, etc.--the Christian worship of Jesus is analogous here.

In his anti-cult book, Where is Joey? Lost Among the Hare Krishnas, for example, author Morris Yanoff, a retired (secular) Jewish schoolteacher is disturbed at the thought of his grandson Joey worshipping another human being (Srila Prabhupada). A friend tells him, "If Jesus Christ were to return, don't you think a lot of people would be bowing down?"

Madhavendra Puri dasa (Steve Bernath) told me that in 1986, when devotees held a Jewish - Vaishnava interfaith conference, none of the rabbis present would take prasadam -- because it was food offered to idols. On the other hand, Catholic clergy have defended devotees against charges of idolatry from Christian fundamentalists, and some of them have even compared prasadam favorably to the Eucharist.

Dr. A.L. Basham, author of The Wonder That was India, says:

"...the old-fashioned type of missionary was quite certain that Hinduism was the work of the Devil, and hence that it was very evil. It did all the things which Christianity, especially Protestant Christianity, said you shouldn't do, such as image worship and the worship of many gods.

"Catholics were always much more tolerant of this sort of thing. Though he may be theoretically monotheistic, the simple Catholic will, to all intents and purposes, pray to quite a wide range of divinities, including the Blessed Virgin Mary and various important saints, often in the form of physical images.

"But Protestant Christianity was founded on the basis that there is one God only, divided into three persons, and that worship of images is sinful. To the Protestant of the old-fashioned kind, this was a terrible thing to do, almost as bad as it was to a traditional Jew or Muslim. So the missionaries, I think, are largely responsible for the polytheism stereotype and the 'caste-ridden' society stereotype."

Like Christians, Vaishnavas believe that souls in this world have fallen from grace, that this world is transitory, and that there is an inner conflict between one's carnal and spiritual natures.

 

In ISKCON we find priests and monks with vows, the worship of consecrated images, belief in the incarnations of God, the veneration of saints and different divinities, the chanting of the holy names on beads of prayer, two monastic orders (bramachari and sannyassa), sacramental food, the use of holy water, candles, incense and ash, etc.

Mahavishnu Swami recalls Srila Prabhupada at one time recommending devotees to investigate the structure and principles of the Roman Catholic Church as far as its applicability in ISKCON. However, Yasodanandana dasa relates an exchange between Srila Prabhupada and Tamal Krishna Goswami in Vrindavana, 1977:

"Don't turn my ISKCON into another Gaudiya Math or the Catholic Church," instructed Srila Prabhupada.

"Don't worry, Srila Prabhupada, we won't," replied Tamal Krishna Goswami.

Srila Prabhupada would not have made either of these statements if he were not aware of the already existing similarities between these two great religious traditions.

Again, when I speak of Hindu "polytheism," I am NOT referring to demigod worship, although Srila Prabhupada DID state (as recorded by Satsvarupa Maharaja in the Lilamrita) that demigod worship is higher than Christianity (and presumably Judaism and Islam as well), because if one is born within the Vedic system, he or she is more likely to become a worshipper of Lord Vishnu (i.e., a Vaishnava) than if one is born outside the Vedic system where knowledge of God is lacking.<!-- / message --><!-- sig -->

[theist]

Vigraha prabhu,

 

I am not sure whose statement this is. Please clarify. I don't understand the calling of different expansions of Krishna as "polytheism'. I am only familar with the definition prtaining to deigod worship

 

 

When I speak of Hindu "polytheism", I refer NOT to demigod worship, but to our doctrine of vishnu-tattva expansions.

[Vigraha]

 

Vigraha prabhu,

 

I am not sure whose statement this is. Please clarify. I don't understand the calling of different expansions of Krishna as "polytheism'. I am only familar with the definition prtaining to deigod worship

 

It's copied from here -

 

http://namahatta.org/en/node/8448

 

I actually put it here to see what you and others thought of, I found it hard to follow, maybe you can respond to what 'you think' he is trying to say. It appears to me it is an Indian Hindu gentleman who wrote that respnse.

[Svarupa]

 

Saturday is Hindu Day in Melbourne

 

BY: KURMA DASA

 

 

 

Aug 27, USA (SUN) —

ISKCON Melbourne Temple is a special place of worship, and is of great significance here in Australia. As is the case for all ISKCON temples worldwide, Melbourne too, has a unique connection to our Divine Spiritual Master, Srila Prabhupada. We can see this on the DVD's of Srila Prabhupada's visits here.

 

 

 

The temple is run by Aniruddha dasa and his wife, and quite frankly, you would be hard pressed to find someone better for the job. Fortunately for Melbourne, the fanatics and crooks have not been able to get their foot in the door for this position, but there are plenty of wolves and their supporters waiting at the door. Melbourne's Temple President is a person who takes his spiritual practice very seriously, someone you could depend on in upholding his vows -- a very good man.

 

 

 

A Temple President's position becomes difficult at a street level, where all the various forms of political lobbying are manifest, and it would be very hard for any Temple President to get a handle on this, especially with such a large amount of Hindus now visiting the temples.

 

 

 

The whole Hindu thing sits well with a bogus guru philosophy, because of the natural sentiment Hindus display toward the many varieties of sadhus within India, even the cheating ones. I think ISKCON's many gurus know this. They see the Hindu-ization of ISKCON as a good thing, something that will keep their $-funds rolling in.

 

 

 

Every Saturday at ISKCON's Melbourne temple is Hindu day. The Hindu community practically have control of the whole temple, including the worship of the Deities. You may never see the pujaris for this day during the week, so are they weekend pujaris? This is certainly of serious concern if Srila Prabhupada's standards are compromised, and in many areas they are.

 

 

 

The temple has at least two imported and salaried cooks from India, and many quasi-style ceremonies are now turning up at the Temple. For example, I have personally seen (more than once) one of the temples pujaris out in the front on the street doing a puja in someone's car. I assume this is a blessing of the car.

 

 

 

12,000 guests visiting a temple is a wonderful thing. How could we not want this? However, we must draw the line when it comes to Srila Prabhupada's standards. The fact is, the standards are getting lax, to cater for Hinduism.

 

 

 

As far as we know, Melbourne's temple only has two full-time Indian brahmacharis. This is poor, considering the amount of Indians visiting the Temple. Most Indians don't want to become Hare Krishna's, they simply want to attend and get a blessing. There is nothing wrong with this, provided Srila Prabhupada's standards are not compromised, and the Indians are not simply seen as a source of money.

 

 

Kurma Dasa (not the chef)

 

 

[theist]

 

It's copied from here -

 

http://namahatta.org/en/node/8448

 

I actually put it here to see what you and others thought of, I found it hard to follow, maybe you can respond to what 'you think' he is trying to say. It appears to me it is an Indian Hindu gentleman who wrote that respnse.

 

Vigraha, I also find it hard to follow. I think he is altering the definition polytheism. Amongst all eternals there is one chief eternal and that is Krishna (Visnu-tattva). That is mono-theism. Krishna consciousness is monotheistic.

[theist]

I agree with Kurma das in the above article. Everyone should be welcome at Krishna's temple but Prabhupada's principles should not be compromised as Kurma das said.

[suchandra]

 

I agree with Kurma das in the above article. Everyone should be welcome at Krishna's temple but Prabhupada's principles should not be compromised as Kurma das said.

 

This is an important point. I would also say that Lord Caitanaya's temples outside of India have the mission to spread the principles of spiritual knowledge, who am I, what is this world, what is the goal life and how to actually become situated in my original position as eternal soul?

If temples are turned into places to bless people for becoming successful in material ambition then how can this be called " to extinguish the fire of conditional life of repeated birth and death?" Lord Caitanya's mission is to save us from repeated birth and death, to take us out of this material ocean and not to become successful within this material ocean.

"I have fallen into the ocean of birth and death. Please pick me up from this ocean of death and place me as one of the atoms at Your lotus feet."

[theist]

 

This is an important point. I would also say that Lord Caitanaya's temples outside of India have the mission to spread the principles of spiritual knowledge, who am I, what is this world, what is the goal life and how to actually become situated in my original position as eternal soul?

If temples are turned into places to bless people for becoming successful in material ambition then how can this be called " to extinguish the fire of conditional life of repeated birth and death?" Lord Caitanya's mission is to save us from repeated birth and death, to take us out of this material ocean and not to become successful within this material ocean.

"I have fallen into the ocean of birth and death. Please pick me up from this ocean of death and place me as one of the atoms at Your lotus feet."

 

Yes. No place for doing puja's for automobiles as mentioned above. What a load of superstious crap. If you want to bless the energy that is your car juat use it in Krishna's service. No higher blessing is possible for anything or anyone.

[theist]

polytheism

 

<form name="entry" method="post" action="/dictionary"> One entry found.

 

<table valign="top" border="0" cellpadding="0" cellspacing="0"><tbody><tr><td> polytheism </td></tr></tbody></table> <input name="book" value="Dictionary" type="hidden"> <input name="quer" value="polytheism" type="hidden"> <input name="list" value="1,0,0,0;polytheism=823111" type="hidden"> </form>

<dl><dt class="hwrd">Main Entry:</dt><dd class="hwrd">poly·the·ism </dd><dt class="pron">Pronunciation:</dt><dd class="pron"> \ˈpä-lē-(ˌ)thē-ˌi-zəm\ </dd><dt class="func">Function:</dt><dd class="func">noun </dd><dt class="ety">Etymology:</dt><dd class="ety">French polytheisme, from Late Greek polytheos polytheistic, from Greek, of many gods, from poly- + theos god</dd><dt class="date">Date:</dt><dd class="date">1613</dd></dl> : belief in or worship of more than one god

----------------------

 

Vaisnava's only accept the existence of one Cause of all causes and worship only that Supreme Being.

 

Gauragopala das and Kurma das are right. Hindus like Christians and Muslims should approach the teachings of Lord Caitanya with an eye to transcending their religious designations. IOW's Hindus should become Vaisnava's instead of ISKCON becoming Hindu.

[Svarupa]

 

Yes. No place for doing puja's for automobiles as mentioned above. What a load of superstious crap. If you want to bless the energy that is your car juat use it in Krishna's service. No higher blessing is possible for anything or anyone.

 

I have also seen this worship in cars and yesterday asked one senior brahmacari of 25 years why he does it. He explained that it is not the car they are blessing but rather installing a photo of either Prabhupada, Radha and Krsna, Lord Caitanya, Nringha deva and Pancha tattva.

 

He told me he does not do demigods, he only instals Vishnu tattvas and pure Vaishnava jiva tattvas like Narad Muni and Srila Prabhupada

 

"For you, verdy verdy inexpensive, only phipty dollars (2000 rupees)"

 

The ISKCON Temple I visted for Janamastami collected 370,000 dollars in one day that goes towards a second bigger Temple in the pipe works.

 

As far as puja in cars is concerned, if they went to a Hindu Temple, they would get some demigod installed with the lemon cereromony under the wheels.

 

However, if they come to ISKCON, they can only get Pancha tattava, Radha Krsna, Gour Nitai etc.ISKCON wont do demigods. ONLY THE SUPREME LORD and NOT demigods.

 

This reminds them of Krsna, the Supreme Personality of Godhead if there car runs head on into a truck.

 

I understand that, I have photos of Prabhupada and the Lord in my car I offer incence and bhoga to.

 

As long as ISKCON keeps this standard, I see no probs mate

[theist]

Oh I see. Well whatever increases the rememberance of Krishna. I hope you were kidding about the fifty bucks though.

[Svarupa]

 

Oh I see. Well whatever increases the rememberance of Krishna. I hope you were kidding about the fifty bucks though.

 

Actually, I was and wasn't, ISKCON provide the photos and incence and with only a suggested donation, some give, some don't One Indian family donated 201 bucks, while others donate a tin of ghee or just two pints of milk, it is there choice. You and I know that Indians always give something. They are a wealthy community, just check out the cars they drive on Radhastami in two weeks

 

Indian weath and the present economic boom iin India s very good for ISKCON

[theist]

"Suggested donation" means pressure. Is that a brahminical quality or a vaisya

quality?

 

Since they know the Indians will donate something anyway why do they even bring it up?

 

Who needs such priests for hire when God lives in each heart already. Your approach sounds complete to me. Take a picture of the Lord and His devotee and put it somewhere on the dash board and keep on chanting.

 

Priests . I have little regard for kali-yuga priests of any religion. Just like this pujari at Krishna Balarama mandir in Vrndavan. My friend bought two really nice tulsi malas and asked that the pujari place them on the altar of Radha Syama to get them blessed by the Lord. The pujari told him he would have to give him one set of beads before he would do it.

 

I pay no attention to such small minded people except when comsidering how to avoid them.

[Svarupa]

 

"Suggested donation" means pressure. Is that a brahminical quality or a vaisya

quality?

 

Since they know the Indians will donate something anyway why do they even bring it up?

 

Who needs such priests for hire when God lives in each heart already. Your approach sounds complete to me. Take a picture of the Lord and His devotee and put it somewhere on the dash board and keep on chanting.

 

Priests . I have little regard for kali-yuga priests of any religion. Just like this pujari at Krishna Balarama mandir in Vrndavan. My friend bought two really nice tulsi malas and asked that the pujari place them on the altar of Radha Syama to get them blessed by the Lord. The pujari told him he would have to give him one set of beads before he would do it.

 

I pay no attention to such small minded people except when comsidering how to avoid them.

 

In bold is a good point, it's a shame what happened to your friend, I used to live at Krsna Balarama Mandir and also did pujari service there, I can understand that some where like that but there are good souls as well. It's best to talk among the devotees and find one you friend 'connects' with, there is always going to be a*******s where ever you go in this material world in Kali yuga

 

But I don't throw the baby out with the bath water, there are many good devotees in ISKCON who maintain the purity, humility and honesty, they are the ones to seek out and associate with

[theist]

My feelings expressed are directed to kali-yuga priests who consider themselves intermediaters between man and God. My belief is this is outdated. Each soul is a priest and one can go directly to the Lord through the altar of his on heart.

 

During an arotik does the congregation see their chanting go to the Lord through the pujari?

 

Such things are needed for temple Deity work. I am not against priests. I am against the idea of feeling one cannot resceive a blessing from Radha/Krishna except through the priest.

 

It really falls upon each person to understand this. The real problem was my friend who actually surrendered a mala to the corrupt pujari.