TV's 'Mythbusters' Prove The Claim The Moon Landing was a Hoax as nonsense

[weallshineon]

TV's 'Mythbusters' Prove The Claim The Moon Landing was a Hoax as nonsense

For those who don't know, ISKCON members foolishly believe man did not go to the moon

 

http://au.youtube.com/watch?v=XAcXBT-GZCo&feature=related

 

http://au.youtube.com/watch?v=VmVxSFnjYCA

 

http://au.youtube.com/watch?v=WhkJ0qD42Fo

 

MythBusters: Moon Landing Hoax Myth

 

Moon hoax - Wire Supports (Mythbusters)

 

Mythbusters Moonwalk hoax

 

Mythbusters Moon flag waving hoax

 

I have sent a email to Mythbusters to tackle ISKCON's claim the Moon is further away from Earth than the Sun:rolleyes:

 

 

Srila Prabupada said many times that the Moon is further away than Sun in the linear sense, using that as his argument that lunar mission was a hoax. That is a fact.

Even with a naked eye one can see (by observing the shadow pattern on the Moon when Sun and Moon are visible together) that this is not the case, let alone using any other calculation method known even to the ancient astronomers. Iskcon still does not dare to contradict Prabhupada on that issue, even as they attempt to build a Vedic planetarium. Srimad Bhagavatam does not say that Sun is closer to Earth than Moon in the linear sense. That was SP interpretation. Even the writings of Srila Bhaktisiddhanta (which give correct distances to Sun and Moon) were not considered authoritative enough to reject Sp's statements in that regard.

As to the flat world or Earth that is another misunderstanding and over-simplification. Many good devotees left the movement when these issues became public, mainly because of the dogmatic way in which they were presented. There was no room for argument to the contrary. To this very day many devotees do not dare to question such things and repeat the same misconstrued version.

 

[weallshineon]

Quote:

<TABLE cellSpacing=0 cellPadding=6 width="100%" border=0><TBODY><TR><TD style="BORDER-RIGHT: #666666 1px solid; PADDING-RIGHT: 3ex; BORDER-TOP: #666666 1px solid; PADDING-LEFT: 3ex; BORDER-LEFT: #666666 1px solid; BORDER-BOTTOM: #666666 1px solid" bgColor=#e0e0e0>Originally Posted by Sarva gattah

Stop being arrogent and blinded by 'so called faith' It's a fact man walked on Moon!! But could not enter the subtle heavenly ethreal atmosphere there in their gross biological body (vessel) and it's material extentions (Apollo 11-16)

Fortunately the Soviets didn't think of the gag first. They could have filmed their own fake Moon landings and really embarrassed the free world.

faking a Moon rock well enough to hoodwink an international army of scientists might be more difficult than the Manhattan Project. "It would be easier to just go to the Moon and get one,"

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Explained here is the evidence and facts that man went to the moon and clearly proves Srila Prabhupada's understanding was based on misinformation

http://au.youtube.com/watch?v=VmVxSFnjYCA

 

Quote:

<TABLE cellSpacing=0 cellPadding=6 width="100%" border=0><TBODY><TR><TD style="BORDER-RIGHT: #666666 1px solid; PADDING-RIGHT: 3ex; BORDER-TOP: #666666 1px solid; PADDING-LEFT: 3ex; BORDER-LEFT: #666666 1px solid; BORDER-BOTTOM: #666666 1px solid" bgColor=#e0e0e0>

Srila Prabupada said many times that the Moon is further away than Sun in the linear sense, using that as his argument that lunar mission was a hoax. That is a fact.

Even with a naked eye one can see (by observing the shadow pattern on the Moon when Sun and Moon are visible together) that this is not the case, let alone using any other calculation method known even to the ancient astronomers.

 

Iskcon still does not dare to contradict Prabhupada on that issue, even as they attempt to build a Vedic planetarium.

 

Srimad Bhagavatam does not say that Sun is closer to Earth than Moon in the linear sense. That was SP interpretation.

 

Even the writings of Srila Bhaktisiddhanta (which give correct distances to Sun and Moon) were not considered authoritative enough to reject Sp's statements in that regard.

As to the flat world or Earth that is another misunderstanding and over-simplification. Many good devotees left the movement when these issues became public, mainly because of the dogmatic way in which they were presented.

 

There was no room for argument to the contrary. To this very day many devotees, out of fear of being pschologically bullied, do not dare to question such things and repeat the same misconstrued version.</TD></TR></TBODY></TABLE>

[Priitaa]

O ye of little faith. sigh.

 

Even if by chance there is some (material) evidence that man walked on the moon, isn't it interesting one is viewed as blinded by faith, rather than having genuine faith. After all, science is proving and disproving itself regularly. In any case, I once read a post here explaining that there are "shadow" planets which are rock, etc. If anything was walked on, it was that, not the heavenly planet known as the moon.

[jeffster]

I watched the Mythbusters videos and frankly, if you think about it, all they proved in photo # 1 was how incredibly easy it is to fake a photo like that.

In foto # 2, all they proved is that cameras have a great range of (I forgot the technical term) ability to show images under low light conditions. Neither experiment proved that Americans landed on the moon, but it does serve to demonstrate how incredibly arrogant and lacking in logic these mythbuster guys are to claim somehow that these photos proved that Americans landed on the moon. If this is any indication of the intelligence of scientists, then it is plain to see that they are lacking even rudimentary intelligence by making such a claim.

jeffster/AM das

[RadhaMukunda]

Most ISCKON members have completely reverted from common sense and logic. It's a waste of time trying to explain their flaws in thinking. Thanks for the videos anyway, I enjoyed watching them.

[ignore stereotypes]

 

Priitaa O ye of little faith. sigh.

 

Even if by chance there is some (material) evidence that man walked on the moon, isn't it interesting one is viewed as blinded by faith, rather than having genuine faith. After all, science is proving and disproving itself regularly. In any case, I once read a post here explaining that there are "shadow" planets which are rock, etc. If anything was walked on, it was that, not the heavenly planet known as the moon.

 

Priitaa this is no big thing, when you get on a 747 is it a plane, is it real? Denying mans walk on the moon is so nonsense. Watch the Video

"It is blind faith that puts man in darkness, a religious superstitious darkness that will only lead to a 'dark ages' period of human existence where the Catholic Chuch contolled Europe with the 'fear of God" Sir Rod

 

Explained here is the evidence and facts that man went to the moon and clearly proves Srila Prabhupada's understanding was based on misinformation

 

The above is not true. Srila Prabhupada once said in 1972, that if they did go to the moon, they could not enter the Heavenly astmoshere their and all they would see was a lifeless world of rocks with their gross material bodies and mundane technological instruments

[Kulapavana]

Not all Iskcon members are so naive...

 

Anybody with a $200 telescope can look at the surface of the Moon in the light-to-shadow transition zone and observe how the sunlight interacts with the Moon's mountains and craters. If the Moon was further away than Sun, it's side visible from Earth would always be fully (or almost fully) illuminated by the Sun, i.e the Moon would always be full. You can make a very simple observation using a lightbulb (Sun) and a ball (Moon). This exercise should be mandatory for all Iskcon devotees.

 

The object of this discussion is not to destroy anybody's faith in their guru, but to put that faith into a proper context.

 

Srila Prabhupada was a perfect guru because he gave his disciples Krsna, and because he was fully surrendered to Krsna's service - not because everything he said was infallible. He was infallible in his devotion to Krsna.

 

SP did not believe in Moon landing and I see that as a healthy scepticism. But his insistance on the Moon being further away than Sun is clearly a misunderstanding on his part, most likely due to being unfamiliar with the subject matter. His guru, Srila Bhaktisiddhanta, gave a correct distance to the Moon in his translation of Surya Siddhanta.

 

 

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[gHari]

Giving it a little more thought I concluded:

 

 

 

http://geocities.com/caitanyamahaprabhu/moonthing1.htm

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

[jeffster]

I generally agree with Kulapavana's post # 7, but, conversely, my point was only that Mythbuster's proving a technical feature of the photos does not prove that the photos were actually shot on the moon.

jeffster/AM das

[sambya]

once again the problem stems from interpreting shastras literally.for example , in gita as it is , prabhupad also says there are living beings in moon.

the sanskrit word chandralok is interpreted in iskcon as moon. but as chandralok is described as being much far away than moon itself , it might be a completely different universe alltogether.

 

the latest hypothesis in astrophysics is the theory of multiverse.it believes in not just one universe but numerous universes that together build up the cosmos.this fabled chandralok might have been such an universe somewhere in the vast cosmic world.

 

if we accept this theory then the problem is easily solved.chandralok becomes a scientific reality(although hypothetically) and animate beings becomes a possibility.

 

but sadly iskcon always understands shastras literally and in doing so often gets caught in its own words.christianity also adopted a similar path of conflict with science in the middle ages and look at it now.its almost a dead religion.its high time for isckon to wake up and refine their thoughts to avoid landing in a same fate.

[jeffster]

Hypotheses come and hypotheses go because the knowledge of the scientists is based on the imperfect senses and the instruments that extend their imperfect senses, but we need not be influenced here by the specious arguments of the "mythbusters," who erroneously claim that their demonstration that cameras have high contrast ratios is somehow proof that the pictures were taken on the moon. I am not a scientist and, as such, I don't like to comment on the topic, but my point is simply that the logic of the mythbusters, in this particular instance, is fallacious. We do know conclusively, however, from shastra that there ARE innumerable universes with innumerable Brahmas as their chief. Amazing, the scientists are just now getting around to a hypothesis that there are multiverses !! Does this not echo the Vedic knowledge which has already been long established ? It is difficult to synthesize shastra with science, but in some cases, not all, it may be possible; actually, the scientists should attempt to synthesize science with shastra because, truly, shastra is infallible and beyond the defects of the imperfect senses. Old skool shastra rules !!

Regards, Jeffster/AM das

P.S. If it matters, I have been out of Iskcon since 1980, living and working independently.

[sambya]

 

It is difficult to synthesize shastra with science, but in some cases, not all, it may be possible; actually, the scientists should attempt to synthesize science with shastra because, truly, shastra is infallible and beyond the defects of the imperfect senses. Old skool shastra rules !!

in olden days in india religion was at the center of the society.people tried to interpret science tthrough their religious scriptures.slowly things changed.now people try to seek science in every religious concept.

 

science deals with observation,experimentation and inference.but sadly most scientists today seem to forget this golden rule of science when it comes to believe in god.in such a case they instantly deny gods existence.this is not proper scientific approach.one may say,"theres no proof that god exist but he might." that would be more scientific.

 

its true that shastra is infalliable.but its interpretations vary immensly in differnt eras and situations.so although shastra is infalliable a particular interpretation may be wrong . thats why we see so many bhasyas(interpretations) dissapear in history and many new being written.god chooses to dissolve invalid outdated explanations and introduce new ones.

[jeffster]

Sambya,

Yes, that is reasonable. Shastra needs to be applied according to time, place and circumstance. Yet the statement that there are many universes with many different Brahmas as their chiefs needs no interpretation. It is valid for all time, yes ?

I was just attempting to point out that spiritual practitioners should not be taken in by scientific claims without thoroughly investigating their validity in the light of shastra. Good science should be consistent with shastra. I believe that that is what the BI (Bhaktivedanta Institute) was attempting to demonstrate. Again, I am not a scientist, but I have somehow validated, at least to myself, that chanting Hare Krishna is the apex of spiritual science. You are certainly correct in suggesting that it would behoove scientists to keep an open mind regarding the existence of God. We know from Gita that God (Krishna) is the intelligence in man, thereby giving man the ability to question his own existence- athato brahma jijnasa (sp?). Let us hope that scientists don't misuse their God-given intelligence, although in fact, most of them do, simply focusing on the permutations of the external energy and missing the spiritual element altogether. We transcendentalists have as our duty the obligation to attempt to correct the shortsightedness of the so-called scientific mindset by pointing out that there is a continuum beginning with dense matter, consisting of earth, water, fire, air and either; then progressing to the more subtle level of senses, mind, intelligence and false ego; then finally extending to the plane of soul and Supersoul. The scientists most often get stuck on the sensual or intellectual plane and cannot proceed beyond it.

jeffster/AM das

[Sarva gattah]

 

Originally Posted by gHari

 

 

 

 

 

MOON-THING

 

 

 

 

 

SYNOPSIS

 

A world where God's word carries more weight than Dr. Frog's latest speculations - that is the domain of His Divine Grace A.C. Bhaktivedanta Swami Prabhupada.

 

It is the late sixties and everyone seems to be in moon consciousness - the reporters, the guests, even the disciples in every temple. Then, we will talk about the moon, and perhaps that will get around to the Vedas, and from there to real talk, talk about God. My message would be the same a trillion years from now and a trillion years in the past: kRSNas tu bhagavAn svayam. But they want to talk about current events. I must have compassion for their lack of discernment.

 

Forme, the kingdom of God is not fanciful speculation, but a real place of beauty where blissful people enjoy perfection in God's presence. The moon is a real place where people drink soma-rasa and enjoy thousands of years of heightened knowledge and intelligence.

 

Can man somehow get to this moon planet, Candraloka, without performing the necessary austerities and reaching the level of piety that is prescribed in the Vedas by Lord Krsna? No, I don't think so. Ravana couldn't get to heaven like that. So how can these rascals? No, they will never get to the moon planet.

 

Now they say they have landed on the moon and brought back some dust. They saw nothing there; no people, no soma-rasa, no life. Then, no, they were not on the moon planet. It is not like that.

 

But where were they ... surely they were somewhere? Rahu? Perhaps they mistakingly went to Rahu and thought they had reached the moon planet? Perhaps they just couldn't see the esoteric forms of the residents of Candraloka - they would be almost invisible to earth eyes?

 

Perhaps they landed in a remote area?

 

Perhaps the moon denizens diverted them with their mystical powers?

 

Perhaps, I hate to say it, but perhaps they are just inventing the whole story to save their jobs and rationalize having spent billions of dollars that could have helped all the needy people on this planet right here?

 

Indeed, if the sun is as far away as they say and we know that the moon is even farther, then they would have to travel twenty million miles a day! Oh my, Dr. Frog, what have you done?

 

But whatever it was, they definitely did not see the moon planet with its advanced culture.

 

Hopefully Srila Prabhupada will excuse me for having used this perhaps presumptuous literary vehicle to depict quickly the events surrounding the moon-thing.

 

My feeling after spending nine hours examining the Folio VedaBASE references to the moon in all the books, lectures, conversations, and letters is that there are three main phases of the moon-thing. Before landing: Srila Prabhupada was about convinced that they could not go to the moon planet because they would not be qualified.

 

After landing and seeing nothing: Srila Prabhupada searched for some rational explanation of how this could have happened.

 

A number of speculative conspiracy theories were advanced by the moon conscious group. The last phase, after the dust had settled: Srila Prabhupada is not sure how or why, but they definitely did not experience the real moon planet. It was all a waste of time.

 

As a mathematician, I can see that the argument about the distance is not necessarily a good one. That is, we assume firstly that their number for the distance to the sun is correct.

 

Secondly and more importantly, the anomaly that causes them to mismeasure the distance to the moon will also produce a mismeasurement of the speed of the voyage to the moon (likely deviated proportionately).

 

Dr. Thompson in his book "Cosmography and Vedic Astronomy" has dealt with the moon-thing topic at some length. Some ideas I remember, in addition to that last one which I likely stole from him, is that the distance between the earth and moon may not be that great, when considering different understandings of the planetary descriptions given in the Srimad-Bhagavatam.

 

Oh my, were only Srila Bhaktisiddhanta Saravati, the great Vedic astronomer, still here. May he shower his blessings on the good Dr. Thompson and his colleagues as they accept the monumental task of presenting Vedic astronomy in the upcoming Vedic Planetarium.

 

But back to kRSNas tu bhagavAn svayam, which is really what this is all about. Isn't it.

 

Making the best use of a bad bargain, Srila Prabhupada would seize the interest of his audience, use their attachment to the moon-thing to help sustain their interest, and then deliver the prime message. God exists.

 

He is your friend. You have an eternal relationship with Him. That is what life is about. Thank you very much. Hare Krsna.

 

Please allow me too to make the best use of a bad bargain. KRSNas tu bhagavAn svayam. Compared to knowing the eternal Lord Krsna, the Cause of all that is was and will be, knowing the moon, venus or vulcan in this temporary world is really not very important at all. And that, is logical, Mr. Spock.

Haribol,

gHari

 

The above article was first published several years ago in the now defunct soc.religion.vaishnava newsgroup. The following are the Bhaktivedanta sources relating to the moon-thing:

THESE QUESTIONS DO NOT ARISE

BOOK REFERENCES

LECTURES

SRIMAD BHAGAVATAM

PRESS INTERVIEW

MOON DISTANCE DIFFERENCE

CONCLUSION

 

 

Very interesting read.

 

 

gHari's conclusion is - My feeling after spending nine hours examining the Folio VedaBASE references to the moon in all the books, lectures, conversations, and letters is that there are three main phases of the moon-thing. Before landing: Srila Prabhupada was about convinced that they could not go to the moon planet because they would not be qualified.

 

As far as the Moon our gross material body perceives in the sky with our naked eye and with our primitive technology is concerned, the evidence is overwhelming that the Apollo 25 crew left a beacon or reflector on the Moon.

 

And if anyone on Earth shoots radio waves or a Laser at that part of the Moon where they landed, it will be reflected back proving man made objects are on the Moon.

The beacon or retroreflector on the Moon is explained here- http://au.youtube.com/watch?v=VmVxSFnjYCA.

 

As far as I'm concerned, this proves man went to that object in the Sky we call the Moon

 

Obviously they did not go to the heavenly Moon planets atmosphere however that makes me wonder if the Astronauts could not see the celestial Moon then what are we, trapped in these gross biological vessels, are NOT seeing around us on earth???

 

The fact is, we are surrounded with life in other dimensional realms of time and space that is individually contained in ethereal vessels of both heavenly, hellish and in-between (ghosts who are suicides, sudden horrific deaths etc) realties

The fact is, we see only one third of material creation, the rest our biological bodies and its technological extensions, such as the Hubble telescope and Electron microscope, CANNOT DETECT the ethereal and sub-space worlds of the material creation.

Only through pious activities can one see the mundane material creation for what it really is.

However, to serve Krsna’s PURE devotees is the highest goal of both the material and Spiritual worlds

 

[suchandra]

 

In any case, I once read a post here explaining that there are "shadow" planets which are rock, etc. If anything was walked on, it was that, not the heavenly planet known as the moon.

This is surely right, our Moon is an earthly Moon which affects only our planet, growth of vegetables, cooling effect, full Moon phenomenon etc.

 

However, since there're millions of planets in this Universe which need Moon light to enable vegetables to grow there must be either a Moon like ours at each planet, or, b) a huge Moon somewhere in the center who does its job for many planets.

 

Since the Vedas teach that the real Moon is a heavenly planet the real Moon must be among the 7 higher planetary systems.

 

When Krishna says He spoke the Bhagavad-gita to the Sun god, he surely didn't refer to the Moon of our Earth. In other words, He spoke about that Moon which affects the Sun.

 

O son of Kunti [Arjuna], I am the taste of water, the light of the sun and the moon, the syllable om in the Vedic mantras; I am the sound in ether and ability in man.