rig vedic verse reflects the belief of hindus in religious harmony

[sambya]

religious harmony and mutual respect has been the key word of hinduism. in fact tolerance as used by western people is not a very noble concept at all. when i say i tolerate hindus(for example) i mean that i dont support or like their views but im not raising a voice against them.im just tolerating them . this is not a very noble thought .the highest nobility would be if i say i respect and believe in truth of all religions.

 

hindu scriptures have always stood for this. in the oldest religious book of mankind rig veda we find the famous verse

 

" ekam sat vipra vahuda vadanti " (Rig Veda 1.164.46)

 

ekam - unity ,only

sat - eternally existent or perment, truth ,reality

vipra - men of knowldge or intelligence, brahmins

vahuda - many,numerous

vadanti -to speak.

 

the truth is one ,the wise call it by many names.

 

this clearly shows the broadness of hinduism.the truth is one and absolute which is given various names by various people . great saint of modern era ramakrishna paramahamsa has always preached this.its sad that many modern religious movements dont believe in this doctrine at all.

[chandu_69]

 

.the highest nobility would be if i say i respect and believe in truth of all religions.

 

hindu scriptures have always stood for this. in the oldest religious book of mankind rig veda we find the famous verse

 

" ekam sat vipra vahuda vadanti " (Rig Veda 1.164.46)

 

ekam - unity ,only

sat - eternally existent or perment, truth ,reality

vipra - men of knowldge or intelligence, brahmins

vahuda - many,numerous

vadanti -to speak.

 

the truth is one ,the wise call it by many names.

 

.

 

Too much of a coincidence...lol i saw muslims quoting this verse to say that Allah is the only god.

[bija]

I do not think western people should be pigeon holed in general. Maybe Sambya, as you know, it has more to do with the cultural and religious feelings etc of collective groups of people within societies (whether religious or secular). That is not just limited to the west.

 

Infact these days it seems some people in the west do a fair job of living together with some sort of harmony. In Australia we are doing ok so far in this age of kali generally (even if conflict is under the surface). Secular societies have their flaws but in 'some ways' more tolerance exists, even if complacent about religion.

 

Srila Prabhupada taught that one can be a hindu, muslim, buddhist or christian with no need to change, and still practice sanatana dharma. So what do you think was the common factor in all these paths that he saw?

 

Personally Sambya I think it is imperative that we each individually awaken to a broader deeper state of consciousness, so that we can realize in our own beings the oneness and uniqueness of existence. This is the unique potential of the human species...we can realize our divinity. And yes, that transcendental state of consciousness may have various names (not just Krsna consciousness). But when we awaken to it we may all have similar function in service to the whole.

 

If we do not individually and collectively awaken to these deeper states of being, then all that will be is more basic states of mind awareness which always contains an element of conflict.

 

I am going to upload a great book for you called the Holotropic mind. It talks about non-ordinary states of (consciousness)being. Your RamaKrishna Paramahamsa and many other great souls lived each day in non-ordinary states of consciousness. Us humans all have that potential...I know I do. Maybe it is our destiny and only hope as a collective organism. Personally the Hare Krsna movement was the catalyst for me in that direction (thus the movement served its purpose)... And Gurudeva ofcourse, still remains the centre-piece of my devotion.

 

Harmony is one necessary factor for all bona-fide paths isnt it Sambya.

 

 

the highest nobility would be if i say i respect and believe in truth of all religions. by sambya

Just a small thought here Sambya. I think new-age eclecticism can have potential to water down the truth contained in the rig veda verse you quoted. Ofcourse saying that, such may be the case only for the neophyte seeker. (I am not saying you have new age views by the way)

 

your servant.

[bija]

 

" ekam sat vipra vahuda vadanti " (Rig Veda 1.164.46)

 

ekam - unity ,only

sat - eternally existent or perment, truth ,reality

vipra - men of knowldge or intelligence, brahmins

vahuda - many,numerous

vadanti -to speak.

 

the truth is one ,the wise call it by many names. posted by sambya

 

The Holotropic Mind by Stanislav Grof click here to download

 

 

This field is of special interest to me both subjectively from experience and objectively for study. I believe all bona-fide spiritual paths can awaken in humans a deeper unified consciousness while diversity still remains.

[bija]

 

Too much of a coincidence...lol i saw muslims quoting this verse to say that Allah is the only god. posted by chandu

Islam and Christianity

 

In 1866, Govinda Roy, a Hindu guru who practiced Sufism, initiated Ramakrishna into Islam. Ramakrishna said<sup class="reference" id="cite_ref-70">[71]</sup>:

 

I devoutly repeated the name of

Allah

, wore a cloth like the

Arab

Moslems

, said their prayer five times daily, and felt disinclined even to see images of the Hindu gods and goddesses, much less worship them—for the Hindu way of thinking had disappeared altogether from my mind.

 

 

After three days of practice he had a vision of a "radiant personage with grave countenance and white beard resembling the Prophet and merging with his body". <sup class="reference" id="cite_ref-rr_rtm_71-0">[72]</sup>

At the end of 1873 he started the practice of Christianity, when his devotee Shambu Charan Mallik read the Bible to him. Ramakrishna said that for several days he was filled with Christian thoughts and no longer thought of going to the Kali temple. One day when Ramakrishna saw the picture of Madonna and Child Jesus, he felt that the figures became alive and had a vision in which Jesus merged with his body. In his own room amongst other divine pictures was one of Christ, and he burnt incense before it morning and evening. There was also a picture showing Jesus Christ saving St.Peter from drowning in the water.<sup class="reference" id="cite_ref-72">[73]</sup><sup class="reference" id="cite_ref-roy_62-2">[63] from Wikipedia</sup>

 

Maybe Chandu, consciousness and finer potency is a deep subject matter worthy of self exploration. I really believe there is great merit in the holy name of Allah.

 

Ofcourse sectarian followers of any religion make difficulty for some. It is like trying to describe the sun. Someone on earth says the sun is round, full of light and hot. Someone who has stepped foot on the sun may say the heat is inconceivable to describe. So therefore the description will always be limited when trying to convey to the limited. Limited is the state of conditioned beings on earth. All saints have had to use terminology so that others may eventually comprehend.

 

And ofcourse some may say, stepping foot on the sun? What non-sense!

[sambya]

hi bija ,

 

today im really feeling very good. perhaps you are the first person that i have met who has such a broad and devotional attidude towards other paths and at the same time abide by srila prabhupada's teachings. personally i think a few more people like you would completely change the misconceptions that people have regaurding gaudiya vaishnavism. maybe then the real vaishnav dharma of gouranga mahaprabhu would resurface once more.

and that you have read and understood ramakrishna inspite of being an adherent of gaudiya vaishnava faith is simply unbelievable.

 

when i used the word 'western' i meant the traditional western thought that gave rise to the concept of religious tolerance.of course todays west is totally different.the number of people respecting(not just tolerating) other faiths is on a phenomenal rise all over the world. i didnt mean to generalise at all . but maybe this ever increasing acceptance of other faiths are a result of drifting away from their own faiths.after all how many christian kids identify themselves with their faith ?

 

after reading through your posts i have found that you sound strangely different from typical gaudiya followers.it really amazing.

 

i will definitely go through the book that you suggested.

 

thousand dandavats to you.

 

your admirer.

[chandu_69]

Dear Bija,

 

Every spiritual person undergoes confusions and delusions in their life time.That cannot be a basis for anything.

 

I posted a link for quran and i dont know who deleted it.

 

pls take a look at <cite>www.usc.edu/dept/MSA/quran

read the first two chapters and tell me what u learnt.

</cite>Srila Prabhupada i dare to say didnt read in depth the other religions u quoted .

What he says about other religions i will take with a pinch of salt and cross check.

[bija]

 

and that you have read and understood ramakrishna inspite of being an adherent of gaudiya vaishnava faith is simply unbelievable.

Firstly Sambhya, I am no example of a Vaisnava. Secondly I have not read RamaKrishna but simply have a broad general knowledge of things. We each have the ability to observe our own life, and have empathy with others to some degree. That is all.

 

If I have softened your heart toward my Prabhu, then I am happy.

 

 

after reading through your posts i have found that you sound strangely different from typical gaudiya followers.it really amazing.

Oneday you may be graced with soft hearted Vaisnava association. I have only had physical contact in my country city with several, as I do not have community here. That is possibly why I am a little different. I first met Iskcon devotees when I was backpacking 16 years ago...I practice on my own Sambhya due to distance, under the guidance of an internet community lead by a soft hearted soul, who is a very one pointed Gauranga bhakta. He is much more fixed than me.

 

Some on this forum think I am a closet mayavadi, and some closer to me misunderstand my mind. So we press on... And hope to be oneday free of unwanted things in the heart.

 

Sri Caitanya and Sri Nityananda are two of the greatest personalities that have ever graced this plane...IMO.

 

Thx.

[bija]

Chandu I have read one third of the Holy Quran and about 1/10th with commentary. Like any scriptures there are various interpretations, some of which are mystical.

 

If some scripture or religion is not to our liking, then it is best to leave it. Especially if it causes us spiritual doubt. The Quran can sure do that I have found. Currently I am reading one five volume commentary to understand deeper the muslim mind.

[chandu_69]

 

Chandu I have read one third of the Holy Quran and about 1/10th with commentary. Like any scriptures there are various interpretations, some of which are mystical.

 

Which translation and which commentary(tafsir)

 

 

If some scripture or religion is not to our liking, then it is best to leave it.

Likes and dislikes have nothing to do with understanding religions;).

I dont like many things in Hinduism, but that doesn't stop me from exploring.

[bija]

 

Usually we are drawn to the place where we feel the most nourished and fulfilled within. Then there is the question though, of what is it inside of us that we actually want to be nourished. If we are introspective and look deep inside of ourselves, with a willingness to confront our own motivation behind the endeavors we make, we will be able to see what is truly our necessity and where that purpose can be fulfilled. What we are on the inside, ultimately reflects outside of us in our environment with the people we associate with, hence we create our own world/association by our very state of consciousness and desire.

 

If one truly desires to know their relationship with Sri Gaura Nityananda, and Sri Sri Radha Krsna, then the Lord within the heart (Paramatma), will guide one to the topmost level of Guru (an Uttama adhikari). If you do not really want exclusive devotion or prema-bhakti for Sri Radha Krsna, then it is something else that you want to be nourished either subtle or gross (such as acceptance, recognition, fame, adoration, material relationships, intellectual stimulation, wealth etc.). There are many types of devotees and all sorts of Gurus who can fulfill these desires. It is really up to you to decide whether or not you want a Spiritual Master who will give you the highest most rare gift of pure loving devotion (prema-bhakti) for Sri Sri Radha-Krsna.

 

Srila Bhaktivedanta Narayan Goswami Maharaja is not an ordinary personality. If you are fortunate to have the opportunity to meet him, then by all means you should take this very rare, and perhaps only chance that you will get. The strength of having an empowered personality as Guru, who is an eternal associate of Sri Radha-Krsna, can genuinly nourish one at every moment. Such strength (bala) is given by the support of such a Guru. However, it is very rare to receive even a small connection with such a personality. Only after sincere hankering for advancement in bhakti will Sri Krsna lead a person to His very near and dear servant - the pure devotee of the Lord.

 

Srila Bhaktivedanta Narayan Maharaj wants help those who are eager to be Krsna-Consciousness and who want to develop pure love for Sri Sri Radha Krsna. Those of his disciples who actually follow his instructions and take shelter of him, advance very quickly on the path of bhakti.

 

If one is sincere in this process of bhakti-yoga, they will receive such a Guru and will be empowered by him to dedicate at least 16 rounds of chanting the Hare Krsna Maha-mantra each day. It is natural to feel a lack of determination and strength to chant 16 rounds every day without this. Especially we will find that our chanting becomes more tasteful and easier when we have the intimate guidance of a pure devotee of the Lord and take initiation from him. However, we must show our sincerity and gratitude to the Lord by making a decision to gradually increase our chanting and devotion. It is the quality of the chanting that should be given more focus than the quantity. Not to say that it's not important to chant a regular number of rounds.

 

Srila Narayan Maharaja wants his disciples to be chanting at least 16 rounds before getting second initiation (diksa). In the beginning (harinam inititation) he will advice the disciple to chant a certain number of rounds according to their capacity with the aim of increasing them. He wants that we should learn to chant with complete attention. It is Krsna whom we are inviting to come into our hearts by calling His name, and he says that "we should chant with love and affection, having so much honour and regard". We should be chanting while being conscious of WHO it is that we are calling out to - searching for the Lord in our heart.

 

I sincerely wish you all the best in your search for pure bhakti. There are many groups of sincere devotees in the world no matter what external institution they may be joined to. We are all part of the one family of Sri Chaitanya Mahaprabhu. Sometimes you may find help from the disciples of Srila Narayan Maharaj, sometimes from the disciples of Srila Prabhupada, or sometimes from the disciples of Srila Bhakti Rakshak Sridhar Maharaja (Sri Chaitanya Saraswat Math), or any of the other pure Guru's who have graced the Western world with pure transcendental wisdom. We should not restrict ourselves with the consciousness of joining a particular group or 'institution', as we are all Gaudiya Vaishnavas. posted by ragalekha

 

Sambya, in regards to Gaudiya devotees, the above writing was posted by a devotee on another thread here today. This is exceptional faith, and pure. Worthy of aspiration.

[bija]

This translation presently click here

This commentary is not like sufism etc.

 

Now Chandu, am I an adherent to this translation/commentary in full submission? No. But I think for study purpose it is very scholarly and realized.

 

Do I accept Mohamed as a shaktyavesa...yes.

 

I have also briefly studied Yusuf Ali translation and commentary, which is moderate even quoting some sufi perspectives, and a simple Penguin classics edition by Daewood.

[chandu_69]

 

This translation presently click here

This commentary is not like sufism etc.

 

 

 

That tafsir site u quoted is not authentic those commentaries are the opinions of those website owners.

 

There are 3 eminent tafsir writers named

 

Ibn kathir(http://www.qtafsir.com)

 

Jalalayn and ibn Abbas(http://www.altafsir.com).Ibn Abbas is a compatriot of Muhammed.

 

The starting page(for Jalalayn and Ibn abbas) is from (http://www.altafsir.com/Tafasir.asp?tMadhNo=0&tTafsirNo=0&tSoraNo=1&tAyahNo=1&tDisplay=no&LanguageID=2)

 

 

Now Chandu, am I an adherent to this translation in full submission? No. .

 

Being adherent to some thing without having complete understanding is bit naive.Please check those authentic tafsirs i quoted(The sites are muslim sources)

 

Btw: Did u read chapter 8 and 9 of holy quran.

Try to understand who is a polytheist .

 

 

Do I accept Mohamed as a shaktyavesa...yes

 

Muslims wont be taking kindly to your remarks.As per quran it is blasphemous to regard muhammed as an avatar of any kind.

As per islamic theology it is called Shirk

 

refer to verse 9:30 regarding shirk at http://www.altafsir.com/ViewTranslations.asp?SoraNo=9&Ayah=30&Language=2&TranslationBook=7&Display=yes

 

quote"

v.30 : This statement is connected with the preceding verse, which speaks of the erring followers of earlier revelation. The charge of shirk (“the ascribing of divinity [or “divine qualities”] to aught beside God”) is levelled against both the Jews and the Christians

 

Unquote..

[sambya]

 

Oneday you may be graced with soft hearted Vaisnava association. I have only had physical contact in my country city with several, as I do not have community here. That is possibly why I am a little different. I first met Iskcon devotees when I was backpacking 16 years ago...I practice on my own Sambhya due to distance, under the guidance of an internet community lead by a soft hearted soul, who is a very one pointed Gauranga bhakta. He is much more fixed than me.

 

luckily for me i have had the chance of getting the association of some of the highest bhaktas .many of them were from iskcon. one such devotee currently residing at mayapur is highly respected and admired by me. he is south american by birth and highly elevated soul. one day while speaking about srila prabhupadas contribution towards mankind he bursted into tears of love. his ears and neck region went red and speech started faltering .sensing this he quickly ended the class and fell down to offer dandavat.almost at the same time he exploded into tears of ecstasy .one could see that he was trying so hard to keep them hidden from public veiwing.but no matter how hard he tried he couldnt succeed . seeing his exalted state the other people that were in the room also became spiritually charged and started hiding their tears. i can never forget that. seeing that it at once made me remember ramakrishnas words---- " wherever you see pure ecstasy arising out of prema,where people are dancing laughing ,crying like mad for lord ,know that lord is himself present there." that was really a moment of ecstasy.

 

apart from that i had the privilege to be aqquainted with jananivas and pakajanghri prabhu,both of them well known all over the iskcon world.and the very fact that they recognise me even after long gaps makes me so blissfull.

 

as i am anti iskcon in many ways(i dont share many of their views) such talks from me might make people think that im confused.thats not the case. true devotees as with jananivas prabhu and pankajahngri prabhu can never be confined within the limits of some institution.so although im a believer of ramakrishna vivekananda i look up to them with utmost reverence. respect and harmony were the key words of ramakrishna.

 

thanks bija .

[chandu_69]

Bija,

 

You can download quran 3 translations at http://www.gutenberg.org16955/16955.txt. This is a text file.

 

For online reference to more translations-http://islamawakened.com/quran/

 

For Tafsir-Ibn-kathir you have to use a torrent application like utorrent.

http://www.mininova.org/tor/1635173

or

http://www.4shared.com/file/64909358/4837738d/Tafsir_Ibn_Kathir_all_10_volumes.html

[bija]

Thank you Chandu for the links. Maybe you can do me a favor sometime?

 

I would love pdf links to good reading for my mini portable lappie.

 

I am aware what many muslims would think of my sanatana dharma viewpoint, and I disagree with them. They see Mohamed as the final universal messenger, they see the external. But, not all muslims see us Hindus as inferior in belief, because they understand deeper.

 

Infact Chandu, I am deeply saddened by the recent crime in Mumbai. These false teachers now use children (18 yo boys) as their killing machines. Like all war-mongers. Why? Because these children have not yet reached age of maturity to understand the deeper aspects of human potential, that I have alluded to earlier in this thread. That potnetial is ever-new for us this birth.

 

These Al Queda have how many followers? Not many! They wish to break our foundations and unity. But they fail to realize one thing, due to their false pride and ignorance. And it is this...

 

We ( who hold to no ideology) have millions of peaceful warriors, enlightened souls. Who do not need to use violence, who do not need to raise arms, but will use the pen to strengthen our own fold and increase it. The Al Queda wish to manipulate our weak, our not yet enlightened elements and those in ignorance...and to lead them into snare. I intuit the next big attack will be a western country accessible to them...to bring the west into Pakistan somehow.

 

These foolish false muslims fail to realize finer potency of consciousness will bring good outcome. Their grossness will fade away like one who identifies with the temporary gross body.

 

I challenge you Chandu, to utilize your full intrinsic spiritual dimension, and manifest peace. And never become a minion of the temporary.

[bija]

Sambya...bhava bhaktas! Thx, wonderful.

[bija]

Thx very much!