Prabhupada's teachings on attaining manjari-bhava

[Sonic Yogi]

On a previous topic one devotee suggested that the concept pf manjari bhava was never encouraged by Srila Prabhupada and was not advocated in ISKCON during the Prabhupada era.

 

This topic will expose the fallacy of such a claim and present evidence from the teachings of Srila Prabhupada to the contrary.

 

In the books and writings of Srila Prabhupada the term manjari is translated as "assistant maidservant of the gopis".

 

 

 

I will start off this topic with a quote from a letter from Srila Prabhupada to his disciple Govinda dasi...........

 

 

Friday, May 28, 1971 Calcutta

 

My Dear Govinda Dasi,

 

 

.............................May Tulasi be kind upon you and introduce you to Krishna, to be one of the assistant maid-servant gopis in Vrindaban.......................

 

[Sonic Yogi]

TLC ch.30

 

 

No common man can understand the ecstasy of transcendental love between Rādhārāṇī and Kṛṣṇa, nor can he understand the transcendental flavor of the transcendental love between Kṛṣṇa and the gopīs. Yet if one tries to follow in the footsteps of the gopīs, he may become situated in the highest stage of transcendental love. Thus one who wants to be elevated to the transcendental stage of perfection should follow in the footsteps of the damsels of Vraja as an assistant maidservant of the gopīs.

[Sonic Yogi]

 

Initiations

—

Los Angeles, May 23, 1972

Prabhupāda: (Devotees chant prayers responsively) Chant. (devotees chant) Names? (japa)

Devotee: Serge?

Prabhupāda: You know the rules? What is that?

Devotee: No meat, fish or eggs, no illicit sex, no gambling.

Prabhupāda: Thank you. Your name is Śuklāmbara. Śuklāmbara was a great brahmacārī devotee of Lord Caitanya Mahāprabhu. You are servant of Śuklāmbara. Hare Kṛṣṇa.

(Another devotee is called; sounds like Carla) (japa) Kaumudī. Do you know the rules and regulations? Yes, tell. (devotee recites rules) So, your name is Kaumudī dāsī. Kaumudī is a nice flower liked by Kṛṣṇa. (japa)

Next. What is your name? You know the rules and regulations? What is that? (devotee recites rules) Hm. Hare Kṛṣṇa. So your name is Rūpa-mañjarī dasi. There are different gopīs. The assistant gopīs is mañjarīs. So Rūpa-mañjarī, you, this maidservant of Rūpa-mañjarī.

Come on. (another devotee is called) What are the rules? (devotee recites rules) Hm. Thank you. Brahmaṇya-tīrtha dāsa. (japa)

Devotee: Will? Will McLoughlin.

Prabhupāda: ... just do it nicely. You know the rules and regulation?

Will: ... meat, fish or eggs, no intoxication, no gambling, no illicit sex.

Prabhupāda: Hm. Thank you. Varuṇa dāsa. Varuṇadeva. Varuṇadeva is the demigod of sea? Yes. You have to control the Pacific Ocean. (laughter) Preaching. (laughter) All the Pacific islands, you have to preach. Is that all right? (laughter) Hare Kṛṣṇa. Kaumadakī(?)

(another devotee is called) (japa) So you know the rules and regulations? Yes. What are they?

Sheila: ...meat, fish or eggs, no intoxication...

Prabhupāda: What is that, next? Four you have not mentioned.

Sheila: I have not mentioned four? No intoxicants, no eating meat, fish or eggs, no gambling and no illicit sex.

Prabhupāda: That's all. So your name is Śrīla dāsī, maidservant of the goddess of fortune. Śrīla. Yes. S-r-i-l-a. (japa)

Devotee: Next, ah, Laurie? Laura?

Prabhupāda: (japa) Hm, you know the rules? Yes.

Laura: ...no meat, fish or eggs, no intoxicants, no illicit sex.

Prabhupāda: Thank you.

Devotee: Lakaṅga-mañjarī dasi ...

Prabhupāda: Lakaṅga? Lavaṅga.

Devotee: Lakaṅga ...

Prabhupāda: What is the spelling?

Devotee: L-a-k(?)-a-n-g-a. Lavaṅga. Lavaṅga-mañjarī.

Prabhupāda: Lavaṅga-mañjarī is already there. (japa) The Lavaṅga is already there. Lavaṅga mañjarī, Lavaṅga-latika. Hm? Anaṅga-mañjarī, all right? No. Anaṅga-mañjarī is there?

Devotee (2): Yes.

Prabhupāda: So all right, Lavaṅga-mañjarī. Lavaṅga-mañjarī. Assistant of Lavaṅga-latā. (japa)

Pradyumna: Robert Dorman?

Prabhupāda: (japa) You know the rules and regulations? (indistinct) And how many rounds you have to chant? Thank you. Vyāsatīrtha, one of the ācāryas in our sampradāya. Vyāsatīrtha. Remember; don't forget. (laughter)

Pradyumna: Katherine?

Prabhupāda: (japa) Very good. Kalā ... What is that? (indistinct) There is no such name. All right, give her name. Kalāvatī. So your name is Kalāvatī dāsī. You know the rules and regulations?

Kalāvatī: Yes, Śrīla Prabhupāda.

Prabhupāda: Hare Kṛṣṇa. Come on. Come on, that's all right. Don't take ...

Pradyumna: Dirk.

Prabhupāda: You know the rules and regulations? What are they? (indistinct) That's nice. So you are Dattātreya dāsa. Dattātreya dāsa, the incarnation of Kṛṣṇa, Dattātreya. Hare Kṛṣṇa. So ārati, begin. Bhaja bhakata-vatsala? (japa) (end)

 

[Sonic Yogi]

April 25, 1970 Los Angeles

 

My Dear Daughter Kasturikadevi Dasi,

 

Kasturika is the name of one of the Gopis, associates of Krishna. And you are Kasturika Dasi or the maid servant of Kasturika by name.

 

In this letter from Srila Prabhupada we can see the vatsalya-rasa that Srila Prabhupada felt for his disciples.

He referred to Kasturika Devi as "my dear daughter".

In caring for so many disciples, even this vatsalya-rasa between the guru and the disciple can be a very profound mood of the acharya.

[Sonic Yogi]

NOI verse 11 purport:

 

 

Srila Bhaktivinoda Thakura writes in this connection that Sri Radha-kunda is the most select place for those interested in advancing their devotional service in the wake of the lady friends (sakhis) and confidential serving maids (manjaris) of Srimati Radharani. Living entities who are eager to return home to the transcendental kingdom of God, Goloka Vrindavana, by means of attaining their spiritual bodies (siddha-deha) should live at Radha-kunda, take shelter of the confidential serving maids of Sri Radha and under their direction engage constantly in Her service. This is the most exalted method for those engaged in devotional service under the protection of Sri Caitanya Mahaprabhu.

[Narasingh]

And yet, Srila Bhaktisiddhanta Sarasvati chose to "remain distanced respectfully from Radha Kunda, so as not to disturb the residents." Prabhupada also maintained this standard.

The mission of Mahaprabhu is a simultaneous one. As Sarasvati Thakura saw it, it has less to do with taking up "residence" at Radha Kunda than it does with saranagati and Brhat Mrdanga Seva.

[andy108]

 

And yet, Srila Bhaktisiddhanta Sarasvati chose to "remain distanced respectfully from Radha Kunda, so as not to disturb the residents." Prabhupada also maintained this standard.

The mission of Mahaprabhu is a simultaneous one. As Sarasvati Thakura saw it, it has less to do with taking up "residence" at Radha Kunda than it does with saranagati and Brhat Mrdanga Seva.

 

Of course, an advanced sankirtana devotee and disciple of Srila Bhaktivedanta Swami, while outwardly maintaining all the rules and regs, engaging in daily harinama, arcana seva, distributing prasadam and books, etc, can live at radha kunda by reading about and remembering the pasttimes there at any time of day.

[Narasingh]

 

Of course, an advanced sankirtana devotee and disciple of Srila Bhaktivedanta Swami, while outwardly maintaining all the rules and regs, engaging in daily harinama, arcana seva, distributing prasadam and books, etc, can live at radha kunda by reading about and remembering the pasttimes there at any time of day.

Why only of "Srila Bhaktivedanta Swami"?

[andy108]

 

Why only of "Srila Bhaktivedanta Swami"?

 

Why?

 

First, I did not say ONLY, but I used his disciples of his as the example in response to YOUR post which said.

 

 

Originally Posted by Narasingh

And yet, Srila Bhaktisiddhanta Sarasvati chose to "remain distanced respectfully from Radha Kunda, so as not to disturb the residents." Prabhupada also maintained this standard.

 

 

Wherein you were finding a possible contradiction in Sonics post.

 

Wherein you were implying that Sonics reference to the NOD Ch.11 commentary might be encouraging something that was simultaneously NOT encouraged by either Bhaktivedanta Swami or his Guru.

 

It was a good catch.

 

But you only found the contradiction, while not offering a harmonious solution.

 

So I pointed out that a disciple of Bhaktivedanta Swami, upon reading that NOD commentary, could take its essence, and I described how that could be done, while simultaneously fulfilling the precautions you alluded to.

 

Of course this could apply to anyone who considers Bhaktivedanta Swami as one of his Siksa Gurus. And who would take what Bhaktivednata's Guru instructed as relevant as well.

 

Of course such a person would Also be a disciple of Bhaktivedanta Swami would he not?

 

Of course. Unless you were just trying to neglect my offering by painting me some kind of fanatic, after baiting a trap.

 

But there is no trap that can hold a mind broadened by my Srila Prabhupada.

[Sonic Yogi]

Hriskesha prabhu recalls his session with Srila Prabhupada during the couple of weeks he spend with Srila Prabhupada working on the Upadeshamrta translation,

 

 

HD: Gurudev, what about rupanuga bhakti. What is the eternal relationship between us (disciples) and you?

ACBSP: (Prabhupada quotes the 2nd half of sloka 6 of Gurvastaka) Guru is serving under his master and you all can do likewise. In Nitya-lila every devotee thinks like that, that my master is the most dear to Radha-Krsna.

HD: So that means that my relationship with you is eternal, that it will continue in Nitya-lila?

ACBSP: Yes.

HD: As manjaris?

ACBSP: Down to shakya.

HD: But for 'Rupanugas' isn't it always manjari-bhava?

ACBSP: Yes. That is the highest; but in the spiritual world there is no such distinction. Every one is Krsna conscious, even the ------ (something like flowers or clouds, i.e., a santa-rasa example).

 

l

 

http://www.bvml.org/contemporary/HD_sposrb.html

 

When Hriskesha prabhu asked if the manjari-bhava was always the case in the Rupanuga sampradaya, Srila Prabhupada said "yes".

[Sonic Yogi]

 

And yet, Srila Bhaktisiddhanta Sarasvati chose to "remain distanced respectfully from Radha Kunda, so as not to disturb the residents." Prabhupada also maintained this standard.

The mission of Mahaprabhu is a simultaneous one. As Sarasvati Thakura saw it, it has less to do with taking up "residence" at Radha Kunda than it does with saranagati and Brhat Mrdanga Seva.

 

 

But, Hrisikesa prabhu who worked closely with Srila Prabhupada on the Upadesamrita was not instructed by Srila Prabhupada to put anything about any restrictions on his disciples from going to Radha-kunda in that purport.

Prabhupada had that option in the writing of the book, but he made no effort to do so.

 

In fact, wasn't his senior disciple Svarupa Damodar Maharaja placed in samadhi there?

 

Obviously, this senior disciple of Srila Prabhupada was culturing madhurya-rasa which he imbibed from his Gurudeva Srila Prabhupada.

 

 

Mainly, the restrictions on Radha kunda are coming in the line of Srila Sridhar Maharaja.

 

I would like to know if all the other Gaudiya Math Godbrothers observed such strict distancing from Radha kunda.

[Narasingh]

 

Why?

 

First, I did not say ONLY, but I used his disciples of his as the example in response to YOUR post which said.

 

 

 

Wherein you were finding a possible contradiction in Sonics post.

 

Wherein you were implying that Sonics reference to the NOD Ch.11 commentary might be encouraging something that was simultaneously NOT encouraged by either Bhaktivedanta Swami or his Guru.

 

It was a good catch.

 

But you only found the contradiction, while not offering a harmonious solution.

 

So I pointed out that a disciple of Bhaktivedanta Swami, upon reading that NOD commentary, could take its essence, and I described how that could be done, while simultaneously fulfilling the precautions you alluded to.

 

Of course this could apply to anyone who considers Bhaktivedanta Swami as one of his Siksa Gurus. And who would take what Bhaktivednata's Guru instructed as relevant as well.

 

Of course such a person would Also be a disciple of Bhaktivedanta Swami would he not?

 

Of course. Unless you were just trying to neglect my offering by painting me some kind of fanatic, after baiting a trap.

 

But there is no trap that can hold a mind broadened by my Srila Prabhupada.

You misunderstood my question of why. I felt that upon speaking of Saraswati Thakura I was broadening the base of Saraswati's Succession. It certainly wasn't a trap, and I agree with the overall gist of your comment, but wondered why you specified disciples of Swami Prabhupada. I wondered if there was an inherent "exclusivity" in your remark. I was not trying to find a contradiction, simply wondering the reason for the perceived exclusivity. That is all. Cheers

[Narasingh]

 

I would like to know if all the other Gaudiya Math Godbrothers observed such strict distancing from Radha kunda.

I think you will find it to be a general rule with very few (and questionable) exceptions.

[stonehearted]

 

When Hriskesha prabhu asked if the manjari-bhava was always the case in the Rupanuga sampradaya, Srila Prabhupada said "yes".

Just before that, Hrishikesha asks if his relationship with Srila Prabhupada is eternal, as manjaris, Srila Prabhupada says, "Down to sakhya."

 

And here, where you're citing, Srila Prabhupada says, "Yes, that is the highest, but in the spiritual world there is no difference."

 

And in another comment on my Web site, Hrishikesha says, "Sripad Bhakti Siddhanta Saraswati Prabhupada was a siddha-purusha fixed in manjari bhava. ACBSP told me that his Guru was already fixed in Nitya Lila before he started his mission. It seems that in at least two cases, e.g., Krishnadas Bababji Maharaj and Srila Prabhupada, the disciple has a different specific bhava than their Guru. . . . If Srila Prabhupada serves Krishna as a Sakha, still that is pleasing to Radha Rani, as She needs Krishna to have His friends."

[andy108]

 

You misunderstood my question of why. I felt that upon speaking of Saraswati Thakura I was broadening the base of Saraswati's Succession. It certainly wasn't a trap, and I agree with the overall gist of your comment, but wondered why you specified disciples of Swami Prabhupada. I wondered if there was an inherent "exclusivity" in your remark. I was not trying to find a contradiction, simply wondering the reason for the perceived exclusivity. That is all. Cheers

 

It is true that it is good advice to the neophyte to remain at a respectful distance, because that implies SOME proximity and awareness of the glories of Radha-Kunda.

 

You were right that Srila Bhaktisiddhanta Saraswati made greater emphasis on gosthanandi preaching, and focus on Saranagati.

 

I need to make a point here and to do so we must bear in mind that the topic of this thread is to explore the instances where Bhaktivedanta Swami Prabhupada was encouraging his disciples to consider Manjari Bhava. This would be something for more advanced disciples to consider and perhaps give some focus upon when the time was right.

 

You inserted some truth in your post, yet it was somewhat non-sequitur to the topic and slightly contrarian. So I tried to harmonize your point anyway and then you actually did as so many do and question a perceived exclusivity.

 

When what I posted was keeping with the topic, those taking discipline from A.C. Bhaktivedanta Swami. "HIS TEACHINGS" is the topic. Anyone taking his teachings to heart is his disciple.

 

Of course it is likely that the activities I listed are probably instructed by other Bhaktas in the Gaudiya Line, "Advanced Sankirtana devotees" alone would have sufficed, so I really didn't need to say "and disciples of Bhaktivedanta Swami."

[Narasingh]

andy108, We are in total agreement here! I am guilty of questioning if there was exclusivity, and I now see why you may have used it.

[Narasingh]

 

Imagine just for a moment that I landed in rather large celestial spaceship and abducted a few worry ffice:smarttags" /><st1:place w:st="on">Krishna</st1:place> devotees who were busy trying to figure out scriptural mental analysis and speculation

Bordering on linguistically delusions' were would we go!

And then....? Scriptural mental analysis? Linguistically delusions'? Go on! I feel as if it truly happened. You actually did assert yourself right in the middle of a considerate conversation with your "e-Spaceship" giving your non-sequitur propositions. Beam me away, Scotty!

[Sonic Yogi]

Friday, May 28, 1971 Calcutta

 

My Dear Govinda Dasi,

 

<!-- BEGIN TEMPLATE: bbcode_quote --> Quote:

<table border="0" cellpadding="6" cellspacing="0" width="100%"><tbody><tr><td style="border: 1px solid rgb(102, 102, 102); padding-left: 3ex; padding-right: 3ex;" bgcolor="#e0e0e0"> .............................May Tulasi be kind upon you and introduce you to Krishna, to be one of the assistant maid-servant gopis in Vrindaban.......................</td></tr></tbody></table>

One thing I noticed in this letter to Govinda Das is the concept that Tulasi Devi worship can grant madhurya-bhava.

 

Even if the guru acharya is in sakhya-rasa he was very particular to establish Tulasi worship in all his ISKCON temples, which according to this letter of blessings from Prabhupada to Govinda dasi has the potential to attract the blessings of Tulasi Devi and grant one entry into the madhurya-rasa lila.

 

From this letter of Srila Prabhupada we can see the value and the benefit as well as the potential attainment of Tulasi Devi worship.

 

I need to get me some Tulasi seeds.

I have been wanting to cultivate Tulasi worship for a long time but have not done that here at my home.

I did do the Tulasi worship in the temples for years.

So, maybe it had some benefit.

 

I would love to get some Tulasi seeds from Govinda dasi.

I wonder if she can be reached?

[Sonic Yogi]

 

It seems that in at least two cases, e.g., Krishnadas Bababji Maharaj and Srila Prabhupada, the disciple has a different specific bhava than their Guru. . . . "

 

It is a well known fact in the camp of Srila Sridhara Maharaja that Srila Bhaktisiddhanta Saraswati Thakur was not pleased with the babaji lifestyle of Krsnadas Babaji.

So, to use him as an example of a disciple of Srila Saraswati Thakur who did not follow the manjari bhava of his Gurudeva is not a very strong argument.

 

I don't have an exact formal quote from any web page of book quote, but in the camp of Sridhar Maharaja it is well known that Sridhar Maharaja told that Srila Siddhanta Saraswati Thakur said about Krsnadas Babaji:

 

 

I do not consider counting beads in the forest of Balihati (spelling) as Krsnanusilanam

 

He did not consider the babaji lifestyle of Krsnadas Babaji as favorable for the cultivation of Krsna consciousness. (Krsnanusilanam)

 

Srila Bhaktisaiddhanta neither approved, authorized or appreciiated the babaji lifestyle of his disciple Krsnadas babaji.

 

That is a well known story in the camp of Sridhar Maharaja.

 

So, to use Krsnadas Babaji in the same breath as Srila Prabhupada as both being in sakhya-rasa could be seen by some as actually offensive to Srila Prabhuapda.

 

If the Guru of Krsnadas Babaji was not pleased with his babaji lifestyle, then how are we supposed to believe that Krsnadas Babaji was actually on the transcendental platform in his so-called position in sakhya-rasa?

 

Bhaktisiddhanta Saraswati Thakur was not pleased with Krsnadas Babaji.

So, without the blessings of the spiritual master, then how are we to think that his position in sakhya-rasa was actually genuine and transcendental?

 

I am not convinced.

He was no doubt a very nice devotee, but he could not please his guru with his babaji lifestyle.

 

His perfection in sakhya-rasa is questionable.

 

His claim to sakhya-rasa along with his unapproved babaji lifestyle do not seem to be a very good combination for pleasing the acharya who's blessing are the secret to spiritual perfection and revelation of siddha-deha.

[stonehearted]

 

From this letter of Srila Prabhupada we can see the value and the benefit as well as the potential attainment of Tulasi Devi worship.

 

I need to get me some Tulasi seeds.

I have been wanting to cultivate Tulasi worship for a long time but have not done that here at my home.

I did do the Tulasi worship in the temples for years.

So, maybe it had some benefit.

 

I would love to get some Tulasi seeds from Govinda dasi.

I wonder if she can be reached?

Govinda dasi has been my close friend for 40 years, and the fact is that, although she planted the first Tulasis in the West, I cared for them beginning from when they got their first leaves. Srila Prabhupada wrote me, when I finally got initiated, that he was very pleased with my service and that I would make rapid advancement in Krishna consciousness by Tulasi-devi's grace. Govinda dasi has often referred to those of us with long, deep ties to Tulasi's service (including my older daughter, Krishnamayi) as manjaris, but in a looser sense, the sense that we are Tulasi's personal attendants, not in any rasika sense. In fact, based on our 40 years of friendship, I believe Govinda herself tends toward another relationship with Krishna. She would never discuss such things or encourage any speculation of this sort. She will assert strongly that she's too engrossed in material desire to have any sense of what her specific relationship might be.

 

Sonic, I would strongly suggest that you get Tulasi seeds here. They will have developed over many generations to thrive in this climate much better than seeds from Hawaii, which are descended from almost 40 years of Tulasi's life in the Islands. Based on my long experience with Tulasi, I believe they'll do better here. If you like, maybe I can help.

[Beggar]

 

...Bhaktisiddhanta Saraswati Thakur was not pleased with Krsnadas Babaji.

So, without the blessings of the spiritual master, then how are we to think that his position in sakhya-rasa was actually genuine and transcendental?

 

I am not convinced.

He was no doubt a very nice devotee, but he could not please his guru with his babaji lifestyle.

 

His perfection in sakhya-rasa is questionable.

 

His claim to sakhya-rasa along with his unapproved babaji lifestyle do not seem to be a very good combination for pleasing the acharya who's blessing are the secret to spiritual perfection and revelation of siddha-deha.

 

Perhaps Srila Babaji Maharaja was a unique exception to many 'rules'. He was bhajanandi, whereas his guru was training his disciples to be gosthyanandi, as was Srila Sridhar Maharaja. Maybe the different 'chastisments', by his guru and his esteemed godbrother were for the sake of their general followers, not Babaji Maharaja.

When a group of Western devotees went to Navadvipa in '76 to learn mrdanga beats from Babaji Maharaja, they were told that they could find him at Srila Sridhar Maharaja's Math. Sometimes when they asked him about a beat, he would show them. Sometimes he would just break into a bhajana and sometimes he would grab them by the arm and drag them upstairs to hear Srila Sridhar Maharaja speak. It is all on a tape which is quite amazing.

[Sonic Yogi]

 

Govinda dasi has been my close friend for 40 years, and the fact is that, although she planted the first Tulasis in the West, I cared for them beginning from when they got their first leaves. Srila Prabhupada wrote me, when I finally got initiated, that he was very pleased with my service and that I would make rapid advancement in Krishna consciousness by Tulasi-devi's grace. Govinda dasi has often referred to those of us with long, deep ties to Tulasi's service (including my older daughter, Krishnamayi) as manjaris, but in a looser sense, the sense that we are Tulasi's personal attendants, not in any rasika sense. In fact, based on our 40 years of friendship, I believe Govinda herself tends toward another relationship with Krishna. She would never discuss such things or encourage any speculation of this sort. She will assert strongly that she's too engrossed in material desire to have any sense of what her specific relationship might be.

 

Sonic, I would strongly suggest that you get Tulasi seeds here. They will have developed over many generations to thrive in this climate much better than seeds from Hawaii, which are descended from almost 40 years of Tulasi's life in the Islands. Based on my long experience with Tulasi, I believe they'll do better here. If you like, maybe I can help.

 

Well, whether or not Govinda Dasi aspires for madhurya-rasa herself or not does not change the point I am trying to make that Srila Prabhupada did encourage the pursuit of manjari-bhava, even if Govinda Dasi was not particularly aspiring in that way.

That just enhances the point I am trying to make that in the Prabhupada era he did encourage disciples to think about pursuing manjari-bhava even in such an early stage in the early years of ISKCON.

 

Where she is at today is not really affecting the point I make by posting the letter to her from Srila Prabhupada.

It really just makes my point all the more strong.

 

Your suggestion about getting Tulasi seeds from here in Florida is a good one I am sure.

 

I don't know if I am quite ready to commit to it at this time, but if and when I get more serious and able to improve my sadhana I will try and do that.

 

Right now I am just a working man with little time for anything except my 16 rounds in the morning which I just took up again last year after many years away from nama-bhajan.

 

I am trying to crawl back to Krsna consciousness one step at a time.

For sure though, I am getting a lot of results from my chanting the 16 rounds and am becoming quite addicted to the pleasure and taste of chanting on beads.

 

I don't remember getting this much taste in my ISKCON years and I can't account for why I now seem to get some taste, but I am very grateful that Sri Harinama is so kind to me.

 

I am a believer.

There really is something to this chanting Hare Krsna.

That I can practically experience now.

[Sonic Yogi]

 

Perhaps Srila Babaji Maharaja was a unique exception to many 'rules'. He was bhajanandi, whereas his guru was training his disciples to be gosthyanandi, as was Srila Sridhar Maharaja. Maybe the different 'chastisments', by his guru and his esteemed godbrother were for the sake of their general followers, not Babaji Maharaja.

 

 

You took the words right out of my mouth.

Would you please stop stealing my thunder?

[Sonic Yogi]

 

Perhaps Srila Babaji Maharaja was a unique exception to many 'rules'.

 

In the same vein one could say that breaking the no bathing in Radha kunda rule can also be done without becoming an aparadhi to the guru.

 

As "Rupanugas" it seems a little out of character for a devotee to go through his whole life without taking some Radha Kunda water on his head or bathing in the kunda.

 

Rupa Goswami highly recommended it.

Why should a "Rupanuga" be so against it?

 

I have never seen any written or spoken record of Srila Prabhupada restricting the bathing in Radha Kunda even when he wrote a purport recommending that very thing in his translation of Upadesamritam.

 

Prabhupada was no carbon copy of Srila Saraswati Thakur.

 

I wouldn't be surprised even if Srila Prabhupada actually enjoyed the idea of hordes of his disciples descending on Radha Kunda en masse and stepping on the toes of the babajis there.

[Sonic Yogi]

 

Based on my long experience with Tulasi, I believe they'll do better here. If you like, maybe I can help.

 

Yeah right.

I don't trust you cowherd boys.

:eek2::outta: