Some Advice

[iamwhatisayiam]

First of all thanks for reading this post

 

My faith in Gaudiya Vaishnavism is stronger than ever right now,after reading and contemplating several arguments and refutations i can with full honesty say the Vinoda Saraswat parampara lineage is for me.

 

So i beg the senoir devotees to help me with some questions.

 

1) What is the relationship between Swami Narasingha and Srila Govinda Maharaj? ( just curious)

2)Who is an ideal Guru for a aspiring devotee who wishes to practice the sadhana/raganuga path as taught by Srila Bhaktisiddantha Saraswati Thakur? (between Srila BV Narayana Maharaj, Swami BV Tripurari and Swami Narasingha)

 

i know there may be diffrences but i would like to hear the diffrences in order to understand myself better and help me make a proper decision, please any suggestions or advice.

 

Haribol!! Hare Krsna!!

[Beggar]

 

First of all thanks for reading this post

 

My faith in Gaudiya Vaishnavism is stronger than ever right now,after reading and contemplating several arguments and refutations i can with full honesty say the Vinoda Saraswat parampara lineage is for me.

 

So i beg the senoir devotees to help me with some questions.

 

1) What is the relationship between Swami Narasingha and Srila Govinda Maharaj? ( just curious)

2)Who is an ideal Guru for a aspiring devotee who wishes to practice the sadhana/raganuga path as taught by Srila Bhaktisiddantha Saraswati Thakur? (between Srila BV Narayana Maharaj, Swami BV Tripurari and Swami Narasingha)

 

i know there may be diffrences but i would like to hear the diffrences in order to understand myself better and help me make a proper decision, please any suggestions or advice.

 

Haribol!! Hare Krsna!!

 

Hare Krsna. It seems that you are looking for an objective answer, but guru bhakti, which is an important component of Krsna bhakti is anything but objective. Rather, it is subjective based on love and affection. Since we are of mixed diksa (initiating) and siksa (instructing) gurus on this site, definitive answers would sound sectarian and are bound to ruffle some feathers and hurt some feelings. Of course on Audarya, Spiritual Discussions we are known to engage in such things but we have to remember that we are on the eve of Gaura Purnima, so really it is a time to unite under the banner of Sri Caitanya Mahaprabhu, at least for a day or so. So as Srila Sridhar Maharaja has said, "the heart is a tasting machine".

So do the research on your own and correspond with different followers of different gurus and ask them about their experiences and their guru's opinions on this subject. Maybe if you can, actually meet the teachers that you are refering to, and then let your heart be your guide.

[Narasingh]

 

First of all thanks for reading this post

 

My faith in Gaudiya Vaishnavism is stronger than ever right now,after reading and contemplating several arguments and refutations i can with full honesty say the Vinoda Saraswat parampara lineage is for me.

 

So i beg the senoir devotees to help me with some questions.

 

1) What is the relationship between Swami Narasingha and Srila Govinda Maharaj? ( just curious)

2)Who is an ideal Guru for a aspiring devotee who wishes to practice the sadhana/raganuga path as taught by Srila Bhaktisiddantha Saraswati Thakur? (between Srila BV Narayana Maharaj, Swami BV Tripurari and Swami Narasingha)

 

i know there may be diffrences but i would like to hear the diffrences in order to understand myself better and help me make a proper decision, please any suggestions or advice.

 

Haribol!! Hare Krsna!!

Hare Krsna. It seems that you are looking for an objective answer, but guru bhakti, which is an important component of Krsna bhakti is anything but objective. Rather, it is subjective based on love and affection. Since we are of mixed diksa (initiating) and siksa (instructing) gurus on this site, definitive answers would sound sectarian and are bound to ruffle some feathers and hurt some feelings. Of course on Audarya, Spiritual Discussions we are known to engage in such things but we have to remember that we are on the eve of Gaura Purnima, so really it is a time to unite under the banner of Sri Caitanya Mahaprabhu, at least for a day or so. So as Srila Sridhar Maharaja has said, "the heart is a tasting machine".

So do the research on your own and correspond with different followers of different gurus and ask them about their experiences and their guru's opinions on this subject. Maybe if you can, actually meet the teachers that you are refering to, and then let your heart be your guide.

You took the words right out of my mouth, Beggar I had to leave the keyboard for a few minutes and meant to get back to this post. I was (an am) going to say that this sort of question is bound to create a lively discussion here, (which is not necessarily a bad thing), but that there may be more value in trying to approach the individual acharyas to find out the answers to these questions. I have had personal dealings with these acharyas and know that they are all accessible for answering questions. If our questioneer has difficulties, I can try to put him/her in touch directly. As you said, Sriman Mahaprabhu's advent celebrations are upon us. The mood of all of these acharyas at this time is to encourage one to immerse one's self in the mood of service of the Hari, Hari Nam, Guru, Murti, and Bhagavata (grantha and Vaishnava). Let us all be grateful for the magnanimous gift of Sri Chaitanya and take shelter of the Maha Mantra, Hare Krsna Hare Krsna Krsna Krsna Hare Hare Hare Rama Hare Rama Rama Rama Hare Hare! Sri Guru will surely give you answers to your questions if they are sincere. In a couple days I will check back here with the hopes to see some discussion in place. If you feel so inclined, "iamwhatisayiam", you may send me a message. Beggar is a thoughtful Vaishnava (although at times relinquishing his gravity and giving to frivolity hard to hold it against him) and his post here was said with sweet gravity.

[Narasingh]

Also, have you considered availing yourself of some background of Sri B.V. Tirtha Maharaja's delivery? Srila B.B. Bodhayan Maharaj?

[iamwhatisayiam]

 

Also, have you considered availing yourself of some background of Sri B.V. Tirtha Maharaja's delivery? Srila B.B. Bodhayan Maharaj?

 

haven't before but i will now:)

[iamwhatisayiam]

Thanks for replying. I do not wish to cause any dirstubance, epecially before the arrival of Gaura purnima.

 

beggar:

Im so unfortunate because i have no physical connection with any devotees, just via internet. that is why im asking for any type of advice.

but like you said it is subjective,who feels it knows it.

[visnujana]

Iamwhatisayiam, from what I read here you seem to be very fortunate! I understand that you have faith in the Saraswata Parampara. So, just trust them in this practical question as well. They will definitely guide you on how to connect with Their now living true representative. Just apply all of your sincerity, all your heart in this process, - and pray to them for guidance. Have no doubt they WILL guide you. Other than that, as many have explained, there seems to be no way of ascertaining of WHO THAT IS... well, not that I know. When you get some attraction to a particular person, ask his disciples and followers to share their hearts with you. They will sure gladly do, although I would do it in person or through PM... because a lot of things about one's relationship with his or her Guru will probably be quite confidential.

Well, that's what I did a while ago; and I think that worked really good for me!

Good luck!

[stonehearted]

I'll join the chorus seconding Beggar's good advice. If you can meet these devotees and hear from them personally, that's always the best course, I think. Failing that, why not explore further by reading their books, getting recordings of some of their talks, maybe even corresponding with them, to the extent that's possible? Get to know them as well as you can, and see what happens in your heart.

[iamwhatisayiam]

I realize how limited i was in the original questions, please excuse this mistake.

 

stonehearted: thank you for that advice!

[iamwhatisayiam]

The reason im so attracted to the Saraswata parampara, is how Srila Bhaktisiddantha Prabhupada taught that sankirtan was the highest means to attain prema!! It is the same teaching of Sri Chaitanya Mahaprabhu,and thae fact he was a genius:cool: . Sometimes trying to read his written works is mindboggling

[Sonic Yogi]

Don't rush it.

Take your time.

If you have heard the maha-mantra from an initiated devotee then you already have empowerment to chant and make progress.

 

It is really a task to sort through all the politics that contaminate the atmosphere of Mahaprabhu's movement, so take your time, you don't have to be in any big hurry.

 

But, if you are really into Prabhupada and not as familiar with Sridhar Maharaja, then I think Narasimha Maharaja would be a good balanced choice.

 

In the camp of Govinda Maharaja there is a serious leaning towards Srila Sridhar Maharaja and a very Prabhupada oriented devotee might not find enough emphasis on Srila Prabhupada there.

There the emphasis is on Sridhar Maharaja.

 

In the camp of Narasimha Maharaja, you get the main focus on Srila Prabhupada with a nice blending of Srila Sridhar Maharaja.

 

It is a good option for a Prabhupada oriented devotee who is willing to accept some sweet nectar from the camp of Srila Sridhar Maharaja as well.

 

You have to sort out your inner leanings and then we can all help you find the camp that most suits your personal needs.

[iamwhatisayiam]

The reason i proposed Swami Narasingha is because his articles helped me solidify my faith.I also proposed Swami BV Tripurari for that same reason.and I proposed Srila Narayana Maharaj because he is a rasika bhakta.

But what i failed to realize is there are more Gurus in the lineage of Saraswata such as Srila B.B. Bodhayan Maharaj, and i feel safe to say that his soft spoken heart felt words attract me.

 

Sonic yogi: thank you for telling me there is no rush, i always have the tendecy to get ahead of myself and become confused.I also first heard the mahamantra from Srila Prabhupada and i beleive my soul is constantly pulling me towards bhakti because of him. All glories to Srila Prabhupada!!

[Sonic Yogi]

 

The reason i proposed Swami Narasingha is because his articles helped me solidify my faith.I also proposed Swami BV Tripurari for that same reason.and I proposed Srila Narayana Maharaj because he is a rasika bhakta.

But what i failed to realize is there are more Gurus in the lineage of Saraswata such as Srila B.B. Bodhayan Maharaj, and i feel safe to say that his soft spoken heart felt words attract me.

 

Sonic yogi: thank you for telling me there is no rush, i always have the tendecy to get ahead of myself and become confused.I also first heard the mahamantra from Srila Prabhupada and i beleive my soul is constantly pulling me towards bhakti because of him. All glories to Srila Prabhupada!!

 

One thing I would advise is not to go "guru shopping".

Don't try to find a guru, try to find out who actually is your guru and who has been the most genuine link between you and Krsna.

 

It's not a matter of choosing a guru, but trying to find out which guru Krsna sent for you.

 

So, the siksha guru parampara of the Saraswata Gaudiyas puts more importance on the siksha guru.

 

The diksha guru is not of supreme importance if he is legitimate.

 

Most important is the siksha guru who can even take you farther than the diksha guru in understanding KC.

 

So, don't get too hung up on the diksha guru.

Try to find a nice diksha guru who will accommodate you in having a siksha guru who might just happen to be more advanced than him.

 

Don't sell your soul to a diksha guru who wants to own your soul and not allow you to accept a siksha guru that you find strong faith in.

 

If you can find your most dear siksha guru and diksha guru in the same person, then that is very nice as well.

 

But, nowadays, with so many diksha gurus taking disciples it is easy to end up with a siksha guru who you might happen to love more than the diksha guru if he touches your soul deeper.

 

So, no guru shopping.

Search your soul for the one who actually IS your guru and don't take diksha just because it is fashionable and end up with regrets.

[iamwhatisayiam]

Yes your words mean so much to me,by pointing out my misunderstandings i learn so much.

I guess it is because i have no personal connections with any devotees,and for that reason i put so much importance of finding a Guru so i can be in proper association. But as you pointed out its not about "shopping" for a guru,i really need to take my time with this.

I have 2 more questions now that this has been brought to my attention:

1)can a person who really wants to be a devotee of Sri Sri Radha Krsna chant the mahamantra on tulasi beads even though he hasn;t received initiation?

2) Is the teachings of Acharyas considered siska guru in the sense they instruct one on how to perform proper devotional service?

[Sonic Yogi]

 

1)can a person who really wants to be a devotee of Sri Sri Radha Krsna chant the mahamantra on tulasi beads even though he hasn;t received initiation?

2) Is the teachings of Acharyas considered siska guru in the sense they instruct one on how to perform proper devotional service?

 

Answer #1.

In ISKCON of Srila Prabhupada uninitiated devotees most certainly did chant on Tulasi beads.

 

Answer #2.

There are two kinds of instructing spiritual masters. One is the liberated person fully absorbed in meditation in devotional service, and the other is he who invokes the disciple's spiritual consciousness by means of relevant instructions. Thus the instructions in the science of devotion are differentiated in terms of the objective and subjective ways of understanding. The acarya in the true sense of the term, who is authorized to deliver Krsna, enriches the disciple with full spiritual knowledge and thus awakens him to the activities of devotional service.

[iamwhatisayiam]

What i mean to ask is the teachings of "prevoious"Acharyas as presented in book form? is that also a type of siksha?

[visnujana]

 

What i mean to ask is the teachings of "prevoious"Acharyas as presented in book form? is that also a type of siksha?

Yes, in some countries like the former USSR (Russia) the whole generations of devotees grew mostly on the inspiration received from reading Srila Prabhupada's books. All the other forms of association were prohibited (illegal). I used to have a quote from Srila Bhaktivinoda Thakura where he stated it similar to this: 'Acariyas who have already passed way always help the sincere practitioners of bhakti, who have faith in them and call out for help.' Vaisnavas never die, they keep watching out for us and always extend their help. But we need to have faith in that. Otherwise we won't be able to take the advantage. Srila Gour Govnda Swami has also explained this in his book Pariprashna.

[Narasingh]

It is always beneficial to have association of Vaishnavas who have practical experience in Krsna Consciousness, especially to assist in digesting written materials.

S.B. 1.2.18

naṣṭa-prāyeṣv abhadreṣu

nityaḿ bhāgavata-sevayā

bhagavaty uttama-śloke

bhaktir bhavati naiṣṭhikī

By regular attendance in classes on the Bhāgavatam and by rendering of service to the pure devotee, all that is troublesome to the heart is almost completely destroyed, and loving service unto the Personality of Godhead, who is praised with transcendental songs, is established as an irrevocable fact.

 

 

 

 

[iamwhatisayiam]

discovered a temple in Atlanta!!!

[Sonic Yogi]

 

What i mean to ask is the teachings of "prevoious"Acharyas as presented in book form? is that also a type of siksha?

Most certainly, the written words of the previous acharyas are siksha in the most dependable and authentic form.

Better than second hand information coming from questionable sources is the actual authorized writings of the acharyas.

 

Actually, most any more experienced senior devotee who helps us learn the ways of a devotee should be seen as a siksha guru of sorts.

 

We need many siksha gurus to help us along.

When we join the temple we have senior devotees show us how to bathe properly, wear temple clothing, apply Tilak, honor prasada and perform routine services etc. etc.

 

In the life of an aspiring devotee there will be many siksha gurus, but Srila Prabhupada is very prominent because of his books being the foundation for Krsna consciousness for most of the devotees of the KC movement in the western world.

 

For an English speaking devotee in the western world, Srila Prabhupada will certainly be the principle siksha guru if that devotee depends heavily on the books of Srila Prabhupada for his spiritual knowledge.

 

There are other gurus and acharyas who have also produced works in English and they can also be accepted as siksha guru if one takes inspiration and guidance from those books of instruction.

 

Just make sure you don't get all entangled with a diksha guru who wants to exploit you for personal livelyhood and does not allow you to accept whatever siksha guru you choose to accept.

 

If the diksha guru wants wholesale and exclusive authority in your spiritual life, then most likely he is a career guru that exploits disciples as a mean of livelyhood.

You might want to avoid that.

[iamwhatisayiam]

Thank you:)

[Narasingh]

discovered a temple in Atlanta!!!

Congratulations!