vishnu not supreme- proof (no tamasic texts have i mentioned)?

[Sonic Yogi]

The author of Śrīmad-Bhāgavatam, Śrīla Vyāsadeva, first offers his respectful obeisances unto the paraḿ satyam (Absolute Truth), and because the paraḿ satyam is the ultimate source of all energies, the paraḿ satyam is the Supreme Person. The gods or the controllers are undoubtedly persons, but the paraḿ satyam from whom the gods derive powers of control is the Supreme Person. The Sanskrit word īśvara (controller) conveys the import of God, but the Supreme Person is called the parameśvara, or the supreme īśvara. The Supreme Person, or parameśvara, is the supreme conscious personality, and because He does not derive any power from any other source, He is supremely independent. In the Vedic literatures Brahmā is described as the supreme god or the head of all other gods like Indra, Candra and Varuṇa, but the Śrīmad-Bhāgavatam confirms that even Brahmā is not independent as far as his power and knowledge are concerned. He received knowledge in the form of the Vedas from the Supreme Person who resides within the heart of every living being. That Supreme Personality knows everything directly and indirectly. Individual infinitesimal persons, who are parts and parcels of the Supreme Personality, may know directly and indirectly everything about their bodies or external features, but the Supreme Personality knows everything about both His external and internal features.

[hindustani]

I don't know how much time left with me,neither you.Then why to waste time on such discussion if it meant for a fun?

If it was for fun yes you totally wasted my time,not mine but yours as well and in this time you could have done something better to clean your soul.

 

thank you

I WAS JUST HAVING FUN WITH DISCUSSION

SORRY IF I WASSTED YOUR TIME.

[ranjeetmore]

Hindustani.

 

whatever your faith is,the Supreme truth is unchangeable.It's quite safe to say that your disbelieving is not going to change the Supreme status of Sri radhika.

Now,if some rascal states that Sri Radhika is not mentioned ANYWHERE before the 15th century and also declares that Brahm sanghita is a false text,he has to be corrected.You can have me removed from this forum,but if you cannot stand up for your own mother,do not stop others from doing so.

[sant]

This Is Not Whos God Forum

This Is Devi Bhagwatam One.

[hindustani]

There are better ways to talk and this one must keep in mind while addressing to others-period.

I never involve myself in judging who is supreme saga.Like Shankaracharya said Bhaj Govindam so better I do worship God and thats all,I leave this judging thing to others who keep wasting their time discussing it again and again,not my cup of tea Ranjeet.

Why should I advocate you to remove from this forum?Yes decipline must be maintained because we talk spiritual stuff here and no street talks should be entertained for the sake of the health of this forum.

 

Hindustani.

 

whatever your faith is,the Supreme truth is unchangeable.It's quite safe to say that your disbelieving is not going to change the Supreme status of Sri radhika.

Now,if some rascal states that Sri Radhika is not mentioned ANYWHERE before the 15th century and also declares that Brahm sanghita is a false text,he has to be corrected.You can have me removed from this forum,but if you cannot stand up for your own mother,do not stop others from doing so.

[ranjeetmore]

You mean to say that punishable acts should be overlooked to maintain superficial decorum in the forum

[sambya]

once again ranjeet comes to field with his theory of 'perfect absoluteness of all material things' .

 

im saying this once more that there is nothing absolute in this world except god .

 

what is punishable in your eyes might be perfectly okay to someone else's . a hindu marrying two wives is punishable in law whereas an muslim might marry upto 4 individuals as per indian law . things such as these vary with place time , situation ,etc .

 

a wronged individual might commit an murder as an act of revenge with the full belief that he is guitless . but law would not spare him . this is because although he is merely taking a revenge in form of a murder his act would set a bad precedent for others to follow . therefore only such things are to be held punishable which affects the collective interest of the society as a whole

 

and in your case even a child can see that your orthodoxy , fanaticism , ignorance and narrow mindedness towards other religions have the full potential to affect the collective interest of other's here in this forum .

 

ultimately , going by this noble principle it you who should be punished without delay .

[bhaktajan]

oh sambya, sambya --such impudent thuggish unabashed doltish logic . . .

 

"im saying this once more that there is nothing absolute in this world except god ."

 

???? --My presumption is that I should pray hard and hope to understand you!!!!

 

Your marrage metaphors are down right false. Such social morals are universal and ammended ONLY when best, under dire circumstances.

 

The Rod of chasticement IS BEST [for all concerned citizens] when it's stewardship is helmed by Honest Men.

 

:::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::

Classical writs are re-confirmed by succeeding generations.

 

vs.

 

New & Improved methods/ideas of Collective-Interests.

 

The American Civil war between the Northern Union versus the Southern-Conferaracy proved that hugh Collective-Interests were immoral in the minds of learned gentlemen.

 

To spare or not to spare depends on the Leader's Foresight.

 

::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::

Sambya,

The Collective-Interests of our mutual forum readers in certainly 'put-off' by your bizarre choice of avatara [obviously you want to purposely be a bizarre provocature even before making your usual spuriuos, specious, contrarian test of patience that you impose on readers of your improvised self-manifest indecisive diatribes]

[sant]

light of devi

51-61. Then on the ninth lunar day of the month of Chaitra when the Sun entered the meridian, suddenly there appeared in that place a Great Mass of Light as was seen before. Indra saw, then, within that Mass of Light, a Virgin Form in full youth. The lustre from Her body was like that of ten million Rising Suns; and the colour was rosy red like a full-blown Javâ flower. On Her forehead was shining the digit of the Moon; Her breasts were full, and, though veiled under the cloth, they looked very beautiful. She was holding noose and a goad in Her two hands and Her other two hands indicated signs of favour and fearlessness.

Her body was decked with various ornaments and it looked auspicious and exceedingly lovely; nowhere can be seen a woman beautiful like Her. She was like a Kalpa Vriksa (celestial tree yielding all desires); she was three eyed and Her braid of hair was encircled with Mâlatî garlands. She was praised on Her four sides by the Four Vedas, Incarnate, in their respective Forms. The brilliancy of Her teeth shed lustre on the ground as if ornamented with Padmarâga jewels. Her face looked smiling. Her clothing was red and Her body was covered with sandalpaste. She was the Cause of all causes. Oh! She was all Full of Mercy. O King Janamejaya! Thus Indra saw, then, the Umâ Parvatî Mahes’varî Bhagavatî and the hairs of his body stood on ends with ecstasy. His eyes were filled with tears of love and deep devotion and he immediately fell prostrate before the feet of the Devî. Indra sang various hymns to Her and praised Her. He became very glad and asked Her, “O Fair One! Art Thou that Great Mass of Light? If this be, kindly state the cause of Thy appearance.” O King! Hearing this, the Bhagavatî replied.

62-83. This My Form is Brahmâ, the Cause of all causes, the Seat of Mâyâ, the Witness of all, infallible and free from all defects or blemishes. What all the Vedas and Upanisadas try to establish, what ought to be obtained, as declared by all the rules of austerity, and for which the Brâhmanas practise Brahmacharyam, I am all that. I have told you about that Brahmâ, of the nature of the Great Holy Light. The sages declare that That Brâhman is revealed by “Om” and “Hrîm”, the two Vîjas (mystic syllables) that are My two first and foremost Mantras wherein I remain hidden. I create this universe with My two parts (in My two aspects); therefore My Vîja mantra is two. “Om” Vîja is denominated as Sachchidânanda (everlasting existence, intelligence and bliss) and “Hrîm” Vîja is Mâyâ Prakriti, the Undifferentiated Consciousness, made manifest. Know, then, That Mâyâ as the Highest S’akti and know Me as that Omnipotent Goddess at present revealed before your eyes. As moonlight is not different from the Moon, so this Mâyâ S’akti in the state of equilibrium is not different from Me. (The powerful man and the power he wields are not different. They are verily one and the same.) During Pralaya (the Great Latency period), this Mâyâ lies latent in Me, without there being any difference. Again at the time of creation, this Mâyâ appears as the fructification of the Karmas of the Jîvas. When this Mâyâ is potential and exists latent in Me, when Mâyâ is Antarmukhî, it is called Unmanifested and when the Mâyâ becomes Kinetic, when the Mâyâ is Bahirmukhî, when She is in an active Kinetic state, it is said to be Manifested. There is no origin or beginning of this Mâyâ. Mâyâ is of the nature of Brahmâ in a state of equilibrium. But, during the beginning of the creation, Her form consisting of the several Gunas appears, when Mâyâ is Bahir Mukhî, She becomes Tâmas, in Her Unmanifested state. O Indra! For this reason Her state of abstraction, and becoming introspective, this is Her Antarmukhî state; it is known as Mâyâ and Her looking outward is Her Bahirmukhî state; it is denominated by Tâmas and the other gunas. From this comes Sâttva and then Râjas and Brahmâ, Visnu and Mahes’a are of the nature of the three gunas. Brahmâ has the Râjo guna in Him preponderating; in Visnu, the Sâttva guna preponderates and in Mahes’a, the Cause of all Causes, is said to reside the Tâmo guna. Brahmâ is known as of the Gross Body; Visnu is known as of the Subtle Body; and Rudra is known as of the Causal Body and I am known as Turîya, transcending the Gunas.

This Turîya Form of Mine is called the state of equilibrium of the Gunas. It is the Inner Controller of all. Beyond this there is another state of Mine which is called the Formless Brahmâ (Brâhman having no Forms). Know, verily, that my Forms are two, as they are with or without attributes (Saguna or Nirguna). That which is beyond Mâyâ and the Mâyic qualities is called Nirguna (without Prâkritic attributes) and that which is within Mâyâ is called Saguna. O Indra! After creating this universe, I enter within that as the Inner Controller of all and it is I that impel all the Jîvas always to their due efforts and actions. Know, verily, that It is I that engage Brahmâ, Visnu and Rudra, the causes of the several works of creation, preservation and destruction of this universe (they are performing their functions by My Command). Through the terror from Me the wind blows; through my terror, the Sun moves in the sky; through My terror, Indra, Agni, and Yama do their respective duties. I am the Best and Superior to all. All fear Me. Through My Grace you have obtained victory in the battle. Know, verily, that it is I that make you all dance like inert wooden dolls as My mere instruments. You are merely My functions. I am the Integral Whole. I give sometimes victory to you and sometimes victory to the Daityas; Yea, I do everything as I will, keeping My independence duly and, according to the Karmas, justly. Oh! You all, have forgotten me though your pride and sheer nonsense. You have been carried deep into dire delusion by your vain egoism. And know now that to favour you, this My Adorable Light has issued suddenly. Hence forth banish ever from your heart all your vain boastings and idle pratings. Take refuge wholly unto Me with all your head, heart and soul, unto My Sachchidânanda Form and be safe. (At times the Devas forget and so fall into troubles).

84-93. Vyâsa said :-- Thus saying, the Mûla Pakriti, the Great Devî, the Goddess of the Universe, vanished from their sight. The Devas, on the other hand, began to praise Her then and there, with rapt devotion. Since that day, all the Devas quitted their pride and engaged themselves in worshipping the Devî devotedly. They worshipped the Gâyatrî Devî daily during the three Sandhyâ times and performed various Yajñâs and thus they worshipped Bhagavatî daily. Thus, in the Satya Yuga, everybody engaged themselves in repeating the Mantra Gâyatrî and worshipped the Goddess indwelling in the Pranava and Hrîmkâra. So, See now for yourself, that the worship of Visnu or S’iva or initiation in the Visnu Mantra or in the S’iva Mantra are not mentioned anywhere in the Vedas as to be done always and for ever. They are done for a while and not required any more when the objects are fulfilled; only the worship of Gâyatrî is always compulsory, to be done at all times, as mentioned in the Vedas. O King! If a Brâhmana does not worship the Gâyatrî, know, then, for certain, that in every way, he is sure to go down lower and lower. There is no doubt in this. A Brâhmin is not to wait, no never, to do any other thing; he will have all his desires fulfilled if he worships only the Devî Gâyatrî. Bhagavân Manu says that a Brâhmin, whether he does any other thing or not, can be saved if he worships only the Divine Mother Gâyatrî. (This worshipping the Gâyatrî is the highest, greatest, and most difficult of all the works in this universe). If any devotee of S’iva or Visnu or of any other Deity worships his desired Deity without repeating the Gâyatrî, he is sure to suffer the torments of hell. (But this age of Kâlî deludes the people and draws away their minds from reciting this Gâyatrî save a few of them.) O King! For this reason, in the Satya Yuga, all the Brâhmanas kept themselves fully engaged in worshipping the Gâyatrî and the lotus feet of the Devî Bhagavatî.

 

is this point in maroon true

visnu or siva mantras are not mentioned in the vedas

 

 

 

 

 

[sant]

On the cause of S’râddha in other Devas than the Devî Gâyatrî

 

1-20. Vyâsa said :-- O King Janamejaya! Once on a time, on account of an evil turn of Fate (Karma) of the human beings, Indra did not rain on this earth for fifteen years. Owing to want of rain, the famine appeared horribly; and almost all the beings lost their lives. No one could count in every house the number of the dead persons. Out of hunger the people began to eat horses; some began to eat bears and pigs, some began to eat the dead bodies while some others carried on any how their lives. The people were so much distressed with hunger that the mother did not refrain from eating her baby child and the husband did not refrain from eating his wife. O King! The Brâhmanas then united and after due discussion, came to the conclusion that they would go to the hermit Gautama who would be able to remove their distress. So all of them wanted to go quickly to the hermitage of the Muni Gautama. They began to say :-- “We hear that there is no famine in the hermitage of Gautama. Various persons are running there from various quarters.” Thus coming to a conclusion, the Brâhmanas went to the Gautama’s Âs’rama with their cows, servants and relations. Some went from the east; some from the south; some from the west, and some from the north. Thus from various quarters the people flocked there. Seeing the Brâhmanas coming there, the Risi Gautama bowed down to them and gave them a cordial welcome and served them with seats, etc. When all took their seats and became calm and quiet, Gautama enquired about their welfare and the cause of their arrival. They described everything about the dire famine and their own states and expressed their deep regret. Seeing them very much distressed, the Muni gave them word not to have any fear; he said :-- “I am today become blessed by the arrival of the great ascetics and honourable persons like you. I am your servant. You consider all my houses as yours. Be quite comfortable. Bear no uneasiness. When your servant is alive, what fear do your entertain and whom do you fear? When the demerits are transformed into good merits by your mere sight, and when you have blessed my house with the dust of your holy feet, then who is more blessed than me? O Vipras! Kindly perform your Sandhyâs, and Japams and rest here at ease.” Vyâsa said :-- O King Janamejaya! Thus consoling the Brâhmanas, the Risi Gautama began to worship the Gâyatrî Devî with rapt devotional trance. “O Devî Gâyatrî! Obeisance to Thee! Thou art the Great Vidyâ, the Mother of the Vedas, Higher than the Highest; Thou art Vyârhiti represented by the Mantra ‘Om Bhur Bhuvah Svah,’ O Mother! Thou art the state of equilibrium, i.e., the Turîya; Thou art of of the Form of Hrîm; Thou art Svâhâ and Svadhâ; Thou grantest the desires of the Bhaktas. Thou art the Witness of the three states, Jâgrat (waking), Svapna (dreaming) and Susupti (deep sleep). Thou art the Turîya and Sachchidânanda Brahmâ. O Devî! Thou resident in the Solar Orb and appearest as a ruddy girl in the morning, an youthful maiden at noon and a black old woman in the evening. O Devî! Obeisance to Thee! Now shew favour on us at this severe famine time when all the beings are well nigh on the way to destruction.”

 

21-40. Thus praised and worshipped, the World-Mother appeared and gave to the Risi one vessel (cup) full to the brim by which every one can be fed and nourished. The Mother told the Muni :-- “This full vessel, given by me to you will yield whatever you wish.” Thus saying, the Devî Gâyatrî, Higher than the Highest, vanished. Then, according to the wish of the Muni, came out from that cup, mountains of cooked rice, various curries and sweetmeats, lots of grass and fodder, silken clothings, various ornaments and various articles and vessels for sacrificial purposes. In fact whatever the Muni Gautama wished, that came out of the brimful cup, given by the Devî Gâyatrî. Then the Muni Gautama called the other Munis that came there and gave them wealth, grains, clothing, ornament, and the sacrificial ladles and spoons and cows and buffaloes for the sacrificial purposes. The Munis then assembled and performed various yajñâs. The place all round, then flourished and became so much prosperous that it looked like a second heaven. In fact whatever fair and beautiful there exist in the Trilokas, all came from the brimful cup given by the Devî Gâyatrî. At this time the Munis, with sandalpaste all over on their bodies, and decorated with very bright ornaments looked like the gods and their wives looked like goddesses. Daily utsabs began to be held in in the Âs’rama of Gautama. Nowhere were seen any diseases or dacoities and there was no fear from any such things. Gradually the Âs’rama’s boundary extended to one hundred Yojanas (4 hundred miles). Hearing this greatness of Gautama, many persons came there from various quarters. And the Muni Gautama, too, gave them words, “cast away fear” and fed them. The Devas, on the other hand, became very much satisfied by the various Yajñâs and extolled the Muni’s greatness. So much so, that the famous Indra, the Lord of the Devas, came in the midst of the assembly and extolled his greatness, thus :-- “This Gautama has fulfilled all our wishes and has verily become a Kalpa Vriksa (celestial tree yielding all desires). If this man had not done such things, in this hard famine time, we would not have got the Havih offered in sacrifices and the prospect of our lives would have been at stake.” O King Janamejaya! Thus the Muni Gautama fed and nourished for twelve years all the Munis, like his sons and that place came to be recognised as the chief centre (the Head Quarters) of the Gâyatrî Devî. Even today, all the Munis perform with devotion the Purasacharanams and worship thrice the Bhagavatî Gâyatrî Devî. Even today the Devî is there seen as a girl in the morning, as a youthful maiden at noon, as an old woman in the evening. Then, once on a time, Nârada, of best conduct, came there playing on his great lute and singing in tune the highest glories of Gâyatrî and took his seat in the assembly of the Munis.

 

41-62. Seeing the tranquil hearted Nârada coming there, Gautama and the other Munis received him duly and worshipped him with the Pâdya and Arghya. In course of conversation he began to describe the glories of Gautama and said :-- “O Best of Munis! I have heard from the mouth of Indra, in the assembly of the Devas, your glories as to your supporting and feeding the pure-hearted Munis and I have come to see you. By the Grace of S’rî Bhagavatî Gâyatrî Devî, you have now become blessed. There is no doubt in this.” Thus saying, the Devarsi Nârada entered into the temple of the Devî Gâyatrî and with eyes gladdened by love, saw the Devî there and offered due hymns in praise of Her and then ascended to the Heavens. Here, on the other hand, the Brâhmanas that were fed by Gautama, became jealous at so much honour offered

to Gautama and tried their best so that no further honour be paid to him. They further settled not to stay any longer in his Âs’rama, when the next good harvest season comes. (Thus his glories will wane). O King! Some days passed when good rains fell and there was an abundance of crops everywhere and the famine ended. Hearing this, all the Brâhmins united, Alas! O King! to curse the Gautama. Oh! Their fathers and mothers are blessed in whom do not arise such feelings of jealousy! This all is the wonderful play of the powerful Time; it cannot be expressed by any person. O King! These Brâhmins created, by Mâyâ, an aged cow, who was to die and pushed her in the sacrificial hall of the Muni Gautama at the time of the Homa ceremony. Seeing that cow entering into the enclosure where the Homa was being performed, Gautama cried out “Hoom Hoom” when the cow fell there and died. And the other Brâhmanas instantly cried out “Look! Look! The wicked Gautama has killed the cow.” Seeing this inconceivable event, Gautama was greatly nonplussed and, completing his Homa ceremony, entered into Samâdhi and began to think the cause of it. Then, coming to know that this has been concocted by the Mâyâ of the Brâhmins, he became angry like Rudra at the time of dissolution; his eyes were reddened and he cursed the Risis, thus :-- Oh vile Brâhmins! When you are ready to cause mischief to me unjustly then let you be averse to meditate and do the japam of the Devî Gâyatrî, the Mother of the Vedas. For your this act, never you will be eager to perform any Vedic sacrificial acts or any action concerning thereof. There is no doubt in this. You will be always averse to the mantra of S’iva or the Tantra of S’iva. You will be always averse to Mûla Prakriti S’rî Devî, to Her Dhyânam, mantra, to any conversation regarding Her; to the visiting of Her place or Temple, to do worship and other ceremonies to Her, to see the Grand Festivals of the Devî, to singing the names and glories of the Devî, to sit before the Devî and to adore Her.

 

63-81. O vile Brâhmanas! You will be always averse to see the festivals of S’iva, to worship S’iva, to Rudrâksa, to the Bel leaves, and to the holy Bhasma (ashes). You will be wholly indifferent to practise the right ways of living as presented in the Vedas and Smritis, to preserve your conduct good and to observe the path of knowledge to Advaita Jñânam, to practise restraint of senses and continence, to the daily practices of Sandhyâ Bandanam, to performing the Agnihotra ceremonies, to the study of the Vedas according to one’s own S’âkhâ or to the daily studies thereof as to teach those things or to give, as gifts, cows, etc., or to perform the S’râddhas of the fathers, etc., or to perform Krichchra Chândrâyana and other penances. O Vile Brâhmanas! As you are ready to do these mean things, you will have to suffer for this that you will desist from worshipping the Most Adorable S’rî Bhagavatî Devî and that you will worship the other Devas with faith and devotion and hold on your bodies S’amkha, Chakra and other signs. You will follow the Kâpâlikas, Bauddha S’âstras and other heretics. You will sell your father, mother, brothers, sisters, sons and daughters and even your wives too!

 

You will sell the Vedas, Tîrthas, and your Dharma. You will not feel ashamed in any way to sell all these. You will certainly have faith in Kâpâlika and Bauddha opinions, Pâñcharâtras and Kâma S’âstras. O vile Brâhmanas! You will not hesitate to go to your mother, daughters or sisters and you will always be licentious with others’ wives and spend your time in that. This is not to you only but to the women and men, all that will come in your families. Let the Gâyatrî Devî be always indignant with you and let you all go in the end to the Andha Kûpa hells, etc. Vyâsa said :-- O Janamejaya! Thus taking the water symbolising the true rules and laws of creation, and cursing the Brâhmanas, the Muni Gautama went hastily to see the Gâyatrî Devî and, on arriving at the temple there bowed down to Her. The Devî, too, became surprised to see their actions. O King! Even to day Her Lotus Face looks similarly astonished!

 

82-90. Then the Gâyatrî Devî told Gautama with amazement :-- “O Gautama! The venom of the snake does not become less if you feed the serpents with milk; so never mind all these things; the Karmas take their peculiar turns; it is hard to say when will happen what things. Now be peaceful. Do not be sorry.” Hearing these words of the Devî, Gautama bowed down to Her and went thence to his own Âs’rama. Here, on the other hand, the Brâhmanas forgot everything due to the curse of Gautama, of the Vedas and the Gâyatrî Mantra. They then began to look at this event with wonder as unique and extraordinary. All united they afterwards repented and going before Gautama, fell prostrate at his feet. But they could not speak any word out of shame. Only they said frequently :-- “Be pleased, be pleased with us.” When all the assembly of the Brâhmanas prayed to him for favour and grace, the Muni Gautama took pity on them and replied. My word will never turn out false. You will have to remain in Kumbhîpâka hell upto the time when S’rî Krisna will take his incarnation. Then you will be born in the earth in the Kâlî age and whatever I have uttered will exactly come unto you. And if you are in earnest to avert my curse then go and worship the Lotus Feet of S’rî Gâyatrî Devî. The is no other remedy.

 

91-100. Vyâsa said :-- Thus dismissing the Brâhmanas, Gautama Muni thought that all these occurred as a result of Prârabdha Karma and he became calm and quiet. For this reason, after S’rî Krisna Mahârâja ascended to the Heavens, when the Kâlî age came, those cursed Brâhmanas got out of the Kumbhîpâka hell and took their births in this earth as Brâhmins, devoid of the three Sandhyâs, devoid of the devotion to Gâyatrî, devoid of faith in the Vedas, advocating the heretics’ opinion and unwilling to perform Agnihotra and other religious sacrifices and duties and they were devoid of Svadhâ and Svâhâ. They forgot entirely the Unmanifested Mûla Prakriti Bhagavatî. Some of them began to mark on their bodies various heretical signs, e.g., Taptamûdrâ, etc.; some became Kâpâlikas; some became Kaulas; some Bauddhas and some Jainas. Many of them, though learned, became lewd and addicted to other’s wives and engaged themselves in vain and bad disputations. For these, they will have to go again surely to the Kumbhîpâka hell. So O King! Worship with your heart and soul S’rî Bhagavatî Parames’varî Devî. The worship of Visnu or S’iva is not constant (to be done everyday); only the worship of S’akti is to be constantly performed. For this reason whoever does not worship S’akti is sure to fall. Thus I have answered all your questions. Now I shall describe the highest and most beautiful place, Manidvîpa of the Primal Force Bhagavatî, the Deliverer from this bondage of world. Listen

[bhaktajan]

"Thus, in the Satya Yuga, . . . O King! For this reason, in the Satya Yuga,"

 

Which Satya-yuga? There are 71 that pass for each of the 14 Manus.

 

There are other eras of 14 Manus [a waking-Day of Lord Brahma].

 

Lord Brahma has passed approx 50 years.

 

{50 years x 365 Days/year x 14 Manus per day of Brahma = 255,500 Satya yuga epochs have transpired --- are you looking for something absolute or not?}

[sant]

can be any

true

[sant]

excerpts from vidya gita

1-20. "I shall now relate to you an ancient sacred story. On one occasion very long ago there was a very distinguished gathering of

holy saints collected in the abode of Brahma, the Creator, when a very subtle and sublime disputation took place. Among those

present were Sanaka, Sanandana, Sanatkumara and Sanatsujata, Vasistha, Pulastya, Pulaha, Kratu, Bhrigu, Atri, Angiras,

Pracheta, Narada, Chyavana, Vamadeva, Visvamitra, Gautama, Suka, Parasara, Vyasa, Kanva, Kasyapa, Daksha, Sumanta,

Sanka, Likhita, Devala and other celestial and royal sages. Each one of them spoke of his own system with courage and conviction

and maintained that it was better than all the rest. But they could reach no conclusion and so asked Brahma: 'Lord! We are sages

who know all about the world and beyond, but each one's way of life differs from that of the others because the dispositions of our

minds differ. Some of us are always in Nirvikalpa Samadhi, some engaged in philosophical discussions, some sunk in devotion,

some have taken to work, and others seem exactly like men of the world. Which is the best among us? Please tell us. We cannot

decide ourselves because each thinks that his way is the best.'

"Thus requested, Brahma seeing their perplexity answered: 'Best of saints! I also would like to know. There is Parameswara who is

the All-knower. Let us go and ask him.' Collecting Vishnu on their way, they went to Siva. There the leader of the deputation,

Brahma, asked Siva about the matter. Having heard Brahma, Siva divined the mind of Brahma and understood that the rishis were

wanting in confidence and so that any words of his would be useless. He then said to them, 'Hear me, Rishis! Neither do I clearly

see which is the method. Let us meditate on the Goddess - Her Majesty Unconditioned Knowledge - we shall then be able to

understand even the subtlest of truths by Her Grace.' On hearing these words of Siva, all of them, including Siva, Vishnu and

Brahma, meditated on Her Divine Majesty, the Transcendental Consciousness pervading the three states of life (waking, dream and

sleep). Thus invoked, She manifested in Her glory as the Transcendental Voice in the expanse of pure consciousness.

"They heard the Voice speak like thunder from the skies, 'Speak out your minds, O Rishis! Be quick, the desires of my devotees will

always be fulfilled immediately.'

21-28. "Hearing the Voice, the exalted rishis prostrated and Brahma and the others praised the Goddess - namely Absolute

Consciousness pervading the three states of life.

"Salutations to Thee! the Greatest! the Best! the Most Auspicious! the Absolute Knowledge! the Consciousness of the three states!

the Creatrix! the Protectress! the Dissolver in the Self! the Supreme One transcending all! Salutations again!

"There was no time when Thou wert not, because Thou art unborn! Thou art ever fresh and hence Thou never growest old. Thou art

all; the essence of all, the knower of all, the delighter of all. Thou art not all. Thou art nowhere, with no core in Thee, unaware of

anything, and delighting no one.

"O Supreme Being! Salutations to Thee, over and over again, before and behind, above and below, on all sides and everywhere.

"Kindly tell us of Thy relative form and Thy transcendental state, Thy prowess, and Thy identity with jnana. What is the proper and

perfect means for attaining Thee, the nature and the result of such attainment? What is the utmost finality of accomplishment,

beyond which there remains nothing to be accomplished? Who is the best among the accomplished sages? Salutations again to

Thee!

29. "Thus besought, the Goddess of ultimate knowledge began with great kindness to explain it clearly to the sages:

30. "Listen, sages! I shall categorically explain to you all that you ask. I shall give you the nectar drawn out as the essence from the

unending accumulation of sacred literature.

31-40. "I am the abstract intelligence wherefrom the cosmos originates, whereon it flourishes, and wherein it resolves, like the

images in a mirror. The ignorant know me as the gross universe, whereas the wise feel me as their own pure being eternally glowing

as 'I-I' within. This realisation is possible only in the deep stillness of thought-free consciousness similar to that of the deep sea free

from waves. The most earnest of devotees worship me spontaneously and with the greatest sincerity which is due to their love of

me. Although they know that I am their own non-dual Self, yet the habit of loving devotion which is deep-rooted in them makes them

conceive their own Self as ME and worship ME as the life-current pervading their bodies, senses and mind without which nothing

could exist and which forms the sole purport of the holy scriptures. Such is my Transcendental State.

"My concrete form is the eternal couple - the Supreme Lord and Energy - always in undivided union and abiding as the eternal

consciousness pervading the three phenomenal states of waking, dream and sleep, and reclining on the cot whose four legs are

Brahma (the Creator), Vishnu (the Protector), Siva (the Destroyer) and Isvara (Disappearance) and whose surface is Sadasiva

(Grace) which is contained in the mansion known as 'fulfilment of purpose' enclosed by the garden of 'Kadamba' trees in the jewel

island situated in the wide ocean of nectar surrounding the cosmos and extending beyond.

'Brahma, Vishnu, Siva, Isvara, Sadasiva, Ganesa, Skanda, the gods of the eight quarters, their energies of her gods, celestials,

serpents and other superhuman beings all manifestations of myself. However, people do not know ME because their intellect is

shrouded in ignorance.

41. "I grant boons to those who worship ME. There is no one besides ME worthy of worship or capable of fulfilling all desires.

[ranjeetmore]

Sambya seems to think 'his' theory of relativity is Supreme and universal.The fact that his theories are NEVER supported by sastras or even the acaryas,has been overlooked by him.

 

On the other hand,the four vaishnava doctrines which are in perfect conformation with the vedas,have revealed the Supreme tattva as mentioned in my earlier posts.

 

If sambya thinks that the Supreme truth is changeable and temporary,he is very foolish.But since it is not,the Supreme truth or Sri Radha,is not subject to the masterclass theory of relativity as provided by sambya.

 

***

[ranjeetmore]

Ignorant persons of the highest order think themselves to be God,eventhough they cannot even control their urine for more than 8 hours.They term this 'compulsion' as a 'trick' of the mind.

 

I pray to sambya to act according to the nature of his Higher Self.If he cannot,i think he should be crowned as the biggest fool.

[sambya]

 

Sambya seems to think 'his' theory of relativity is Supreme and universal.

 

it is !! as i said -- except god all other things are essentially relative .

 

 

 

The fact that his theories are NEVER supported by sastras.........

 

ha ha !! even your vaishnav doctrines would agree that everything except god is temporary and relative . what are you speaking of ?

 

 

.......................or even the acaryas,

 

i go by my acharyas and you by yours . can you draw a line and say --such and such person is the only or last bonafide knower of god ?...... like the muslims do with mohammad .

 

 

the four vaishnava doctrines which are in perfect conformation with the vedas,

 

thats what the vaishnavs think . tantrics believe tantra to be in perfect conformation , saivas believe saivite texts to be in perfect conformation ...so on and so forth !!!

 

 

If sambya thinks that the Supreme truth is changeable and temporary,he is very foolish.

 

are you a kindergarten student ??!!!!

 

refer back to my post once more and loudly spell out each word ten times . maybe then you would understand . i expressedly said that except god all other things are temporary . that makes the position of god as permanent and unchanging .

 

i think you are having some mental problems ......tell me -- do you feel a tingling pain on the left side of your brain every morning after waking up ??

 

 

 

Ignorant persons of the highest order think themselves to be God,eventhough they cannot even control their urine for more than 8 hours.They term this 'compulsion' as a 'trick' of the mind.

 

rush to bed for a sound sleep before you turn completely mad ..............

[sant]

<TABLE cellSpacing=0 cellPadding=6 width="100%" border=0><TBODY><TR><TD style="BORDER-RIGHT: #666666 1px solid; PADDING-RIGHT: 3ex; BORDER-TOP: #666666 1px solid; PADDING-LEFT: 3ex; BORDER-LEFT: #666666 1px solid; BORDER-BOTTOM: #666666 1px solid" bgColor=#e0e0e0>If sambya thinks that the Supreme truth is changeable and temporary,he is very foolish. </TD></TR></TBODY></TABLE><!-- END TEMPLATE: bbcode_quote -->

SAMBYA YOUR A HE?

[Sonic Yogi]

The very term "Bhagavat" as in Devi Bhagavat in fact means "in relationship to Bhagavan".

So, the title of the Purana called Devi Bhagavat indicates that the book predominantly relates knowledge of Durga Devi in regards to her position concerning Bhagavan.

 

It relates the position of Devi in terms of her relationship to Bhagavan who ultimately is none other than Lord Krishna.

 

So, the very title of the Purana suggests that Devi must in fact be understand in regards to her position with the absolute Bhagavan Sri Krishna or Lord Vishnu.

 

The couple of verses that seem to promote Devi as supreme above Vishnu are taken out of context and abused for dishonest purposes.

 

The whole body of the book most certainly shows Vishnu as supreme, though dishonest people can take a couple of verses out of context and try to show supremacy of Devi, ignoring the verses that explain the supreme position of Lord Vishnu.

 

A thorough, scholarly study of the Devi Bhagavat most certainly will not show Devi as the Supreme Isvara Mukunda.

Such a conclusion can only be promoted by taking a few select verses out of context ignoring the many verses that show otherwise.

[ranjeetmore]

doesn't She say ,"My concrete form is the eternal couple: the Supreme Lord and His energy."

From earlier reference,it suggests Sri Radha krishna.

 

???

[sambya]

 

SAMBYA YOUR A HE?

 

no ! im neither he nor she nor nothing . im not body neither the soul , im not buddhi , nor ego nor existence .

 

CHIDANANDARUPAM SHIVOHAM SHIVOHAM !!!

 

 

ha ha ha !!!!

[sambya]

 

The very term "Bhagavat" as in Devi Bhagavat in fact means "in relationship to Bhagavan".

 

in fact the term bhagavat is just one word short from bhagavati whereas it is two words short from bhagavan .

 

enjoy

 

 

 

So, the title of the Purana called Devi Bhagavat indicates that the book predominantly relates knowledge of Durga Devi in regards to her position concerning Bhagavan.

 

 

thus spake sonicacharya !! who's listening anyway ?? or should the name be chronicacarya ? he he !!

 

 

 

The couple of verses that seem to promote Devi as supreme above Vishnu are taken out of context and abused for dishonest purposes.

 

ok , so does that mean the indian rishis had real dishonest thoughts in mind while writting these ?

 

 

 

The whole body of the book most certainly shows Vishnu as supreme,

 

my my ..........you have finished reading it within a week ...barely ??

 

BTW , shakta texts never talk of vishnu as not being the supreme . tantra always respects the supremacy of vishnu . this is so because the supremacy of any male god can never undermine the importance of devi . sh is the inner potential of all male gods . she is laxmi and durga also . and she is the only existing female principle (prakriti) her relevence remains unchanged even if vishnu or krishna is asigned the highest post , simply because of the fact that she is the inner power of krishna . refer back to prabhupada books to confirm .

 

 

 

 

A thorough, scholarly study of the Devi Bhagavat most certainly will not show Devi as the Supreme Isvara Mukunda.

 

you have lost your mind !! why would devi be ishwara mukunda in the first place ? devi is devi . she is the inherent power of the mukunda , not mukunda hirself . she is the power , mukunda the powerfull . she is prakriti , mukunda the purush . they are two sides of a same coin and are inseperable .

 

secondly , what scholarly study have you undertaken ? are you writing a thesis on devi bhagavat ?

[Guest Melvin1]

 

no ! im neither he nor she nor nothing . im not body neither the soul , im not buddhi , nor ego nor existence .

 

CHIDANANDARUPAM SHIVOHAM SHIVOHAM !!!

 

 

ha ha ha !!!!

 

It would make a difference indeed if one`s body is male or female. Because duality also exists in the spirit world. If we rise above this duality we become one with God. & what is God`s gender? Well, it depends on what side of the coin, so to speak, you were. We know that God is male and his internal/external potency is female. God can never separate his femaleness from his maleness. Some chose the femaleness of God because maybe they are females themselves. While others chose the maleness of God maybe because they want to have forms similar to God. We can never ever detach ourselves from this desire, to become either one with God or not. Some chose duality some chose oneness. Some things therefore never change.

[sambya]

 

Some chose the femaleness of God because maybe they are females themselves. While others chose the maleness of God maybe because they want to have forms similar to God.

but i think it would be more natural for males to pray to female forms of god in form of mother . this might be the reflection of our material life where a male child is more closer to his mom than his dad . in a same way a female child feels more drawn towards his father than mother .

 

going by this principle we see numerous ladies who worship lord as krishna(male) in india . it is infinetely easier for a female to accept god as her husband than a male for obvious reasons . unfortunately a male cannot think of devi as his wife . devi is the embodiment of matribhava ( bhava of motherhood ) . and its too hard for a male devotee to think of krishna as his lover except for the highest of bhaktas . although all these are my personal thoughts .......

 

its not necessary that a female desires a female form of god . in fact a female has greater desire for a male form of god as her beloved or master .much in the same manner a male might have a greater affection for a female god than a male one .

 

although there are numerous exceptions to this .

 

actually all such things are based on individual taste and inclinations . countless saints of highest order assumed gopibhava to attain him in his male form .

Some chose duality some chose oneness.

thats correct ! i would prefer the latter !!

his creation is truly wondrous and complex . far to complex for us to understand or speculate ...................................

[Guest Melvin1]

Yes, Sambya. Your indeed a wonderful creation of God. You are a fighter and humble warrior. You don`t easily ran away from your enemy. You`re a brave and a courageous one. I salute you for your very incisive views in this discussion forum.

[chandu_69]

 

im saying this once more that there is nothing absolute in this world except god .

.

 

How do you know this?.Do u have name(s).How about Allah.