Gaudiya Vaishnava Conception of Shiva

[raghu]

 

Dear Raghu,

 

I know you belong to Sri Vaishnava. I want you to throw some light on this particular subject.

 

Do you now? Well, good luck to you!

[ranjeetmore]

raghu,ur obviously from ramanuja school of thought...

 

I earnestly want to know what Ramanuja HIMSELF says about shankara.

[ranjeetmore]

and please try to be careful...offenses are inevitable if you continue at this rate..

[hindustani]

What offense you refer to?Telling some soul a Rascal is even a bigger offense,think twice before trowing stones to others Ranjeet.

 

and please try to be careful...offenses are inevitable if you continue at this rate..

[Harihar]

 

Do you now? Well, good luck to you!

 

This is not the reply expected from you. The persons who are giving replies to your query, you are not accepting it.In such scenario you should give the reply. Just writing one line reply to my post is not enough.

Tell us about your thoughts on the thread started by you.

Good luck to you.....

[raghu]

 

raghu,ur obviously from ramanuja school of thought...

 

I earnestly want to know what Ramanuja HIMSELF says about shankara.

 

Then try reading Ramanuja's own writings on the subject, if you really are that earnest about it.

 

 

and please try to be careful...offenses are inevitable if you continue at this rate..

 

Whatever that means...

[ranjeetmore]

repulsive

[Guest padma]

Brahma and shiva are gunavataras. They are both jivas sometimes and sometimes Vishnu himself takes up the job when suitable jivas are not available in some kalpas. The fact is that the gunavataras Shiva is the highest among the devas.Lord Sahashiva is Vishnu tattva as evidenced in the Vayu Purana. Most of the time, Vishnu himself becomes the gunavatara Shiva but sometimes a jiva is employed empowered by Vishnu to do it. Brahma, Vishnu, Indra etc. are actually posts which are taken up by either the jivas or Vishnu himself.

Even if the gunavatara shiva is being called Sadashiva, it doesn't mean that he is Lord Sadashiva. This term is used to show respect to that particular deva.

 

Regarding Vishnu being a devotee of Krishna, there is an example in the Bhagavatam itself.there is a reference of shankarshana meditating on Vayu deva though they are both the same:

 

āsīnam urvyāḿ bhagavantam ādyaḿ

sańkarṣaṇaḿ devam akuṇṭha-sattvam

vivitsavas tattvam ataḥ parasya

kumāra-mukhyā munayo 'nvapṛcchan

 

svam eva dhiṣṇyaḿ bahu mānayantaḿ

yad vāsudevābhidham āmananti

pratyag-dhṛtākṣāmbuja-kośam īṣad

unmīlayantaḿ vibudhodayāya

 

Meaning:

Some time ago, being inquisitive to know, Sanat-kumāra, the chief of the boy-saints, accompanied by other great sages, inquired exactly like you about the truths regarding Vāsudeva, the Supreme, from Lord Sańkarṣaṇa, who is seated at the bottom of the universe.

At that time Lord Sańkarṣaṇa was meditating upon His Supreme Lord, whom the learned esteem as Lord Vāsudeva, but for the sake of the advancement of the great learned sages He slightly opened His lotus like eyes and began to speak.

(Srimad Bhagavatam 3.8.3-4)

This verse itself speaks that shankarshana though being the same as Vāsudeva still meditates on him.same is for other v you has and avatar as. They all meditate on krishna even though they are same as Him.

 

Whatever pr a hup add says at siva, that is to b examined if they agree with the shad Goswamis and other acharyas of our sampradaya.it is like if vedas and puranas contradict, the vedas are given prominence

[Guest padma]

 

But, those quotes seems to be at odds with Srimad Bhagavatam.I don't know where you got those translation of if they are dependable.Here is the best explanation that I can find. Srila Prabhupada says that Siva is simultaneously an expansion of Vishnu and jiva.As the annihilator of the universe, the jiva aspect of Siva is acting.It doesn't appear as Siva is two different types but simultaneously a combination of jiva tattva and Vishnu tattva.As pointed out in this purport, the original Sadasiva in Vaikuntha is the consort of Rama-devi, so that makes the original Sadasiva a form of Vishnu that has not actually been transformed into the consort of Mahamaya.When Rama-devi transforms into Mahamaya, then Sadasiva transforms into Rudra. That Rudra Siva is simulataneously jiva tattva and Vishnu tattva.It appears that this combination of jiva tattva and Vishnu tattva is what we know as Siva-tattva.Śrī Caitanya Caritāmṛta Ādi 6.79ananta brahmāṇḍe rudra — sadāśivera aḿśaguṇāvatāra teńho, sarva-deva-avataḿsaSYNONYMSananta — unlimited; brahmāṇḍe — in the universes; rudra — Lord Śiva; sadāśivera aḿśa — part and parcel of Sadāśiva; guṇa-avatāra — an incarnation of a quality; teńho — he also; sarva-deva-avataḿsa — the ornament of all the demigods.TRANSLATIONRudra, who is an expansion of Sadāśiva and who appears in unlimited universes, is also a guṇāvatāra [qualitative incarnation] and is the ornament of all the demigods in the endless universes.PURPORTThere are eleven expansions of Rudra, or Lord Śiva. They are as follows: Ajaikapāt, Ahibradhna, Virūpākṣa, Raivata, Hara, Bahurūpa, Devaśreṣṭha Tryambaka, Sāvitra, Jayanta, Pināki and Aparājita. Besides these expansions there are eight forms of Rudra called earth, water, fire, air, sky, the sun, the moon and soma-yājī. Generally all these Rudras have five faces, three eyes and ten arms. Sometimes it is found that Rudra is compared to Brahmā and considered a living entity. But when Rudra is explained to be a partial expansion of the Supreme Personality of Godhead, he is compared to Śeṣa. Lord Śiva is therefore simultaneously an expansion of Lord Viṣṇu and, in his capacity for annihilating the creation, one of the living entities. As an expansion of Lord Viṣṇu he is called Hara, and he is transcendental to the material qualities, but when he is in touch with tamo-guṇa he appears contaminated by the material modes of nature. This is explained in Śrīmad-Bhāgavatam and the Brahma-saḿhitā. In Śrīmad-Bhāgavatam, Tenth Canto, it is stated that Lord Rudra is always associated with the material nature when she is in the neutral, unmanifested stage, but when the modes of material nature are agitated he associates with material nature from a distance. In the Brahma-saḿhitā the relationship between Viṣṇu and Lord Śiva is compared to that between milk and yogurt. Milk is converted into yogurt by certain additives, but although milk and yogurt have the same ingredients, they have different functions. Similarly, Lord Śiva is an expansion of Lord Viṣṇu, yet because of his taking part in the annihilation of the cosmic manifestation, he is considered to be changed, like milk converted into yogurt. In the Purāṇas it is found that Śiva appears sometimes from the heads of Brahmā and sometimes from the head of Viṣṇu. The annihilator, Rudra, is born from Sańkarṣaṇa and the ultimate fire to burn the whole creation. In the Vāyu Purāṇa there is a description of Sadāśiva in one of the Vaikuṇṭha planets. That Sadāśiva is a direct expansion of Lord Kṛṣṇa's form 8for pastimes. It is said that Sadāśiva (Lord Śambhu) is an expansion from the Sadāśiva in the Vaikuṇṭha planets (Lord Viṣṇu) and that his consort, Mahāmāyā, is an expansion of Ramā-devī, or Lakṣmī. Mahāmāyā is the origin or birthplace of material nature.

If it is said that the gunavatara shiva who is sometimes a jiva is an expansion of Sadashiva it means that he is the shaktiavesha avatara of Sadashiva.mahamaya is compared to the shadow of yogamaya.vishnu sometimes empowers a jiva to act as shiva, the controller of maya and sometimes he himself acts like that in some kalpas.

[hinduism♥krishna]

Gaudiyas view of Shiva & bhagavata puranas view is much much different.

 

Shri Krishna himself says in Bhagavata Purana " only those who see oneness between shiva & me, can attain peace. Others can't"

 

Bhagavata Purana view on shiva is that both krishna and shiva are one ie they're parabramhan themselves.

 

Read Bhagavata Purana 8.7 wherein Shuka declares shiva as supreme God, Paramatma, origin of all, who is none other than vishnu..

 

Hare krishna