Shiv Maha Puran doubts

[hindustani]

Sant Bhaktajan

Yes it comes from within.Driving schools teach us how to drive but many drivers crash their cars!Means theory is not inuf.One has to apply their minds to grab and swallow spiritual lessons.Example Shri Krishna took away clothes of Gopis,lesson was to take them away from maya but without appling ones mind if someone do this today he will be in jail!Removing shoes and washing hands is not inuf unless your mind is pure while entering into a temple Shriman Bhaktajanji.Ego must meltdown first and which is not in your case.You said [ARE YOU READY? HERE IT COMES NEWBEE:]no one is newbee in this universe,we are just in the process of cycles of birth and rebirth and if you feel you are a senior than you still need to attend your Iskcon classes from begining. Because....... you seldom said "You are not the material body--you are spirit SOUL"and after spending all your years with Iskcon you call the other guy i.e me a newbie...so contradictions in your statements LOL LOL.Better meet some real Vaishnava and take his advise,better for you better for others.

[hindustani]

Examples:-Check confusion and confidence below.

Sugriva was confused and frightened while fighting with Bali inspite of he had Raghunandan with him.

 

Yudhishthir choose Keshava and not his army during Mahabharat.

 

Gyan never comes from attending classes it comes from within Mr.C.P

 

If one reads all Vedas,puranas,shashtras only one thing will comeout of them,Intelligent people will try to understand this cycle of birth and rebirth and put efforts to serve God and Society to attain Moksha,others will keep singing this song presuming this cycle is endless(do listen this song,its beautiful).

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mJ2J_UkH88Y

The story of everything in this world is just this much.

emerging from one fog and disappearing into another fog.

 

From where this road is coming, and to where this road is going. No traveler had ever understood this secret so far.

[melvin]

 

Sant Bhaktajan

Yes it comes from within.Driving schools teach us how to drive but many drivers crash their cars!Means theory is not inuf.One has to apply their minds to grab and swallow spiritual lessons.Example Shri Krishna took away clothes of Gopis,lesson was to take them away from maya but without appling ones mind if someone do this today he will be in jail!Removing shoes and washing hands is not inuf unless your mind is pure while entering into a temple Shriman Bhaktajanji.Ego must meltdown first and which is not in your case.You said [ARE YOU READY? HERE IT COMES NEWBEE:]no one is newbee in this universe,we are just in the process of cycles of birth and rebirth and if you feel you are a senior than you still need to attend your Iskcon classes from begining. Because....... you seldom said "You are not the material body--you are spirit SOUL"and after spending all your years with Iskcon you call the other guy i.e me a newbie...so contradictions in your statements LOL LOL.Better meet some real Vaishnava and take his advise,better for you better for others.

Things are not really what they seemed. My first impression when I clashed with you, Hindustani, was that you were a bully. That has now changed. I hope someday you, me, and the rest do some bonding of sorts over a white sandy beach underneath coconut trees drinking ice-cold coconut water, eat broiled bananas, buttered corn, etc. While others are swimming in the clear blue water on the beach, we sing songs to refresh our memories of the way we were with a videoki. Deal or No Deal?

[hindustani]

Melvin we if I remember never had any clash with you buddy.

About the deal wow such deals are always welcome,show me a place and beach I am ready to fly.

Hari Om.

[melvin]

 

Melvin we if I remember never had any clash with you buddy.

About the deal wow such deals are always welcome,show me a place and beach I am ready to fly.

Hari Om.

 

There are lots of white sandy beaches in the Philippines, Hindustani. We could go to Boracay Island in Antique, the El Nido in Palawan, Daan Bantayan Island in Cebu, the White Island in Camiguin, Panglao Beach Club in Bohol, etc.

[ranjeetmore]

 

It is unfortunate that someone asks a sincere question about shiva purana, and some members want to immediately come out with their sectarian attacks. It is for this reason that I feel a religious forum is pointless.

 

Is it justified to attack someone because they like Lord Shiva? Suppose we replace Shiva with some other religion. Would the same attack be appropriate?

 

For example, would it be appropriate to mock other religious people as follows:

 

Oh great, we have two Christ Afficinados on board here!

 

Oh great, we have two Buddha Afficinados on board here!

 

Oh great, we have two Islam Afficinados on board here!

 

Oh great, we have two Yahwey Afficinados on board here!

 

It is sad to see some people's hatred for Hinduism while they themselves follow a subset of it. Sectarian hatred is what makes religion useless. Whether it is Christian sectarianism, Islamic sectarianism, or Hindu sectarianism (under the brand Vaishnava).

 

If a thread doesn't interest you or tally with your belief system, then please don't read it. If there is someone asking about Shiva, Shakti or Ganesh, and if you hate those devas, then please don't read the thread. Try to control your speech. Only speak on those topics which you hold dear.

 

As has been mentioned many times, this is not a vaishnava forum. Have the courtesy to respect all vedic religions here even if you disagree with them. It is a fact that basically all Vaishnavas here have never even read Shiva Purana, so they should just keep quiet. If you don't know a topic, please resist the uncontrollable urge to speak.

 

I used to participate regularly in these forums, but because of so many meaningless posts I lost interest in even reading the forums. Now I don't even have much interest to keep the forums open, as 50% of what is posted here is basically rubbish, with the other 50% being actually valuable information. If we count the number of innocent posters like the starter of this thread who have visited and posted sincere questions on Hinduism, only to be smashed with the vaishnava know it all hammer, it will be thousands and thousands of people. Is it worth it, offending thousands of sincere seekers, just to have a place for religious people to argue?

 

The mistake was that I thought Vaishnavas and Hindus could co-exist and discuss religion and philosophy in close proximity. This has obviously proven to be a false assumption.

 

 

Saying Shiva Purana is tamasic is smashing thousands of beliefs ??

These thousands of beliefs also include eating human flesh,worshipping small boys' penises and eating from a human skull.

WHY IS IT SO HARD TO ACCEPT THAT TAMASIC PEOPLE ARE ATTRACTED TO UMA MAHESVARA ??

Some of Visnu's Puranas are said to be rajasic..so does that make Sri Visnu Rajasic in nature ???

 

In the same way,Shankara is never tamasic...NEVER.

The forms of Uma and Mahesvara are many times horrendous...even revolting...but it IS NECESSARY for all the goblins and ghosts...These are forms of God Himself- Sri KRsna.Tulsidasa and the earlier Gaudiyas BELIEVED SO.

This is the right knowledge.Lord Shiva is a form of Godhead.God himself,for all those who are attracted to His person.

 

Similarly,Ramacandra is the Supreme Lord in all His entirety for the ramanandis.

But you cannot deny certain facts...The left hand tantriks,the aghoris,etc. are people whose practices are tamasic and that is that.

Thus the stress on Vaishnava way of worship

[ranjeetmore]

You cannot grasp how deep this actually runs...

 

Shankara's parshads hardly glorify Him as Lord Hari's devotee.

 

They always maintain Him as the Supreme Truth.

 

Hanuman never said that Goloka is situated somewhere above His master's abode.Rama is Godhead,this was his belief.

 

The vaikunthavasis don't confirm in the visnu purana etc. that Sri Mahavishnu is a amsa of Sri KRsna.

 

All forms of God in Vaikuntha-Sri Krsna ,Sri Rama,Sri Narayana,Durga and Shiva are all God.God doesn't become inferior.That's nonsense...

 

but you must be plain dumb to not know the mode of worship of some forms of Uma-Mahesvara.

[Jahnava Nitai Das]

 

The forms of Uma and Mahesvara are many times horrendous...even revolting...

This is the most ridiculous statement I've ever seen in these forums in 10 years. These are the forms that the devas, siddhas and rishis worship. You are exactly like Daksha Prajapati, who offended Shiva with the same words.

[sambya]

 

Originally Posted by ranjeetmore: WHY IS IT SO HARD TO ACCEPT THAT TAMASIC PEOPLE ARE ATTRACTED TO UMA MAHESVARA ??

The forms of Uma and Mahesvara are many times horrendous...even revolting...but it IS NECESSARY for all the goblins and ghosts...These are forms of God Himself- Sri KRsna.Tulsidasa and the earlier Gaudiyas BELIEVED SO.

 

god !!! you are the worst human being in this forum ranjeet . you dont have the minimum courtsey to show atleast outward respect to other people's ishtas .

 

is this what your guru taught you ???????? i mean uma maheswar is the revolting form of god and all people worshiping them are undoubtedly tamasic ? if not then by what authority are you making this claim ??

[ranjeetmore]

In the thread,"Maha shiv puran doubts" i posted : some forms of Uma Mahesvara are horrendous,even revolting.

 

(obviously all the people who replied to that actually missed the word which i have now underlined.)

 

It sounded harsh(i reread it later) but none of you can actually ever know the tone in my mind while I was posting.

 

Many may know the characteristics of one the Mahavidyas-Dhumavati.And so she has many associates...

 

Even Mother Kali has many associates...Are they not naked? Are they not wearing Skulls around their necks ? Do they not drink blood ?

Yes they do all those things.

 

 

I think 'frightening' would me more apt...since this is such a impersonal way of communicating what i feel...But it is true that people who are weak at heart(myself) cannot imagine myself going near a Mother Who has such frightening associates and a frightening appearance Herself(thus,revolting).

 

 

Now comes 'some of her devotees'.

 

IT IS COLD HARD FACT THAT MOST LEFT HAND TANTRIKS DO LOTS OF DISGUSTING THINGS-YES DISGUSTING AND MOST OF THEM ARE SIMPLY AFTER SIDDHIS.

 

SAME GOES WITH(some of the) AGHORIS.

 

 

Am i denying the Nayanmars' pure devotion,or am I denying saints like Ramakrishna ????

 

Same goes with the Kumaras.They sure as hell worshipped Shankra on Kailasa.These four paramhamsas have better realistion than most of the devas even.

 

I accept this.

 

But have you heard of Ravana ??

Yes.

There are many such examples.

 

Demons are attracted to Uma-Mahesvara-or forms of Them.THIS IS FACT.

 

If you can't take the facts in your face...say so.I shall shut up and please for God's sake,don't delete this thread.

 

 

***

 

A certain reply was,"Has your Guruji taught you this ????"

 

The answer is no.

 

Instead he has only taught:

 

that Uma and Mahesvara are not different from Sri Krsna.

 

But the thing is; I have eyes and a general definition of tamasic-rajasic-sattvic gunas is at the back of my head (weren't you the one who defended meat eating as harmless ?).

At the end of the day,

 

what should i have said is:

 

Some forms of Uma-Mahesvara are frightening.And some of Their 'devotees' are tamasic in nature.

 

 

But unless you consider my stance on the nature/position of Uma MAhesvara,and you read the previous line,you will obviously consider me as an offender(Daksha ?).

[Jahnava Nitai Das]

 

In the thread,"Maha shiv puran doubts" i posted : some forms of Uma Mahesvara are horrendous,even revolting.

 

(obviously all the people who replied to that actually missed the word which i have now underlined.)

No, that is a lie. Your exact statement was, "The forms of Uma and Mahesvara are many times horrendous...even revolting..."

 

English may not be your first language, but then you should have the humility and decency to admit your mistake. What you said was "The forms", which means the two forms mentioned, Uma and Mahesvara. You have not mentioned "some" anywhere. Your intention may have been to say "Some of the forms taken by the beautiful Uma and Maheswara are occasionally ferocious", but what you wrote is nothing related to that. Talking about God is not like talking about a comic book, to be done carelessly and cheaply.

 

 

But it is true that people who are weak at heart(myself) cannot imagine myself going near a Mother Who has such frightening associates and a frightening appearance Herself (thus,revolting).

I am sure you are frightened when you think of Kali, but there is no reason to be scared of Kali, as she is everyone's mother in this material world. Those who are her devotees aren't the least bit afraid of her, in fact there is nothing fearful in her at all. For that we have to go beyond seeing the external picture and understanding who she is and why she does what she does. There is no difference between Kali and Uma, just as there is no difference between Krishna and Narasimha. There is no reason to be scared of Narasimha, as he is there to protect his devotees, and in the same way, there is no reason to be scared of Kali. Every deity has their ugra (ferocious) rupa, including shiva, vishnu, shakti and hanuman. The devotees are not scared by such forms.

 

 

IT IS COLD HARD FACT THAT MOST LEFT HAND TANTRIKS DO LOTS OF DISGUSTING THINGS-YES DISGUSTING AND MOST OF THEM ARE SIMPLY AFTER SIDDHIS. SAME GOES WITH(some of the) AGHORIS.

It is also a cold hard fact that most (99.95%) devotees of Kali and Bhairava are not tantriks nor aghoris, but ordinary pious hindus. Don't base your understanding of religion from television serials and movies.

 

 

But have you heard of Ravana ?? Yes. There are many such examples. Demons are attracted to Uma-Mahesvara-or forms of Them.THIS IS FACT.

 

Ravana worshiped Shiva, Hiranyakashipu worshiped Brahma, so what? They were after material benedictions and Narayana does not give such benedictions to people. Shiva is pleased quickly (his name is Ashutosha, "who is quickly satisfied"), so people have historically worshipped him because it is the quickest and easiest method to attain material benediction. The list of Shiva devotees includes thousands of saints, rishis, devas, and nayanmars, but the only person you can think of is Ravana and some aghoris? It just shows if you want to find a fault you can overlook a thousand good qualities.

 

 

If you can't take the facts in your face...say so.I shall shut up and please for God's sake,don't delete this thread.

 

You speak as though you are a 10 year old child. Spiritual discussions need a higher level of discipline and control.