kaplain2009 Posted June 10, 2009 Report Share Posted June 10, 2009 hi im just being honest,a few months back i started to take up my religion seriously for the mere benefit of material success because i didnt like how my life was going, before any worship my mind was scattered but since i started doing my daily chants,weekly fasts and prayers despite my situations from day to day i find myslef becoming more focused and deligent towards my goals but im at a point within my ownslef where i feel i want to aquire and achieve more to help benefit my life(both material and spiritual), my question is, ...is it wrong to worship based upon motivation for personal gain? and how can i justify my worship for material gain? and what should be my mind set when worshiping for material gain although i know deep within my real long term goal is to reep the benefits of worshipping Lord Krishna by gaining liberation from this material world. if anyone would like to give me some light on this that would be helpful, thank you, Hare Rama ,Hare Krishna. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kshama Posted June 10, 2009 Report Share Posted June 10, 2009 Respected Kaplain2009 Ji, Namaskar. I am glad that you are worshipping god and following your spiritual activities diligently. I see no wrong in praying to the Lord to grant you material success, infact, He is the right person even to ask for. Though His methods of granting them are beyond our comprehension, have faith in Him. Well I am glad that your ultimate motive is to gain liberation. That is good already, and you are in the right mindset. But I hope someone senior in this forum would throw some light and guide you to further strengthening your faith. Namaste. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Amlesh Posted June 10, 2009 Report Share Posted June 10, 2009 hi im just being honest,a few months back i started to take up my religion seriously for the mere benefit of material success because i didnt like how my life was going, before any worship my mind was scattered but since i started doing my daily chants,weekly fasts and prayers despite my situations from day to day i find myslef becoming more focused and deligent towards my goals but im at a point within my ownslef where i feel i want to aquire and achieve more to help benefit my life(both material and spiritual), my question is, ...is it wrong to worship based upon motivation for personal gain? and how can i justify my worship for material gain? and what should be my mind set when worshiping for material gain although i know deep within my real long term goal is to reep the benefits of worshipping Lord Krishna by gaining liberation from this material world. if anyone would like to give me some light on this that would be helpful, thank you, Hare Rama ,Hare Krishna. If the Lord has granted the wish of your desire that like any other Gods then there is nothing special. But if He got the special Eye on you and decided to grant that special thing for which he is famous for, that our mind in the ignorant stage cannot think of then you are indeed lucky. Gracias. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sambya Posted June 10, 2009 Report Share Posted June 10, 2009 now worship for material gain in itself is not wrong but definately labeled as being inferior to other forms of prayer . hindu scriptures have always spoke of sakama( with desires ) and nishkama( without desire) modes of worship . majority of indians have always followed the former and will continue to do so in future because it is in the very nature of human race . we want a return !! even while asking for moksha or even bahkti we are seeeking a favour . this is a limitation of human birth . but out of the two seeking bhakti is considered more selfless and therefore more desirable and better . but one can only ask for bahkti when he has realised that this material world is false or temporary . before that one cannot be forcefully made to do bhakti ......... it comes from within . therefore many people pray for comforts and material benefits . but one should always remember that his ultimate goal of life is the surrender to the reality or supreme . and seeking material benedictions should be kept down to a minimum . i mean if you already have three cars and are praying for one more latest model , that amounts to greed and extremely bad . but suppose you are praying because you are in a bad financial state and want a little better and easier life , then that is better . its good that you can apperiaciate the need of mukti . but so long as you want anything from god you cannot progress in the field of mukti . even little of desires are to be avoided .mukti sounds very interesting and remedial but extremely difficult !! you can definitely go on with sakama prayers but just add one more line to your demands from god-- " teach me how to be desireless , how to remain contended in little and turn me nishkama " this would do for the present ................... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Amlesh Posted June 10, 2009 Report Share Posted June 10, 2009 Bhakti is the only thing worth asking and nothing else. A vos souhaits. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hindustani Posted June 10, 2009 Report Share Posted June 10, 2009 Nothing better than that I agree Sambyaji. it comes from within. you can definitely go on with sakama prayers but just add one more line to your demands from god-- " teach me how to be desireless , how to remain contended in little and turn me nishkama Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kaisersose Posted June 10, 2009 Report Share Posted June 10, 2009 :Cynic alert! Material gain, spiritual gain..is there really a difference? You take interest in God because you want something or else there is never a need to turn towards God. This being the case, I do not see a difference in asking for material gains vs. spiritual gains. The underlying concept is exactly the same in both cases. However, there is a key difference to be noted. Asking for material gains is problematic because you will know - sooner or later - that your prayer was not answered. Material goals are time bound and specific (in most cases) which means it is possible to know if you got what you wanted or not. This problem does not arise when seeking spritual gains because the end goal is an abstraction and cannot be verified. In most cases, it is to happen after death which means you will never know in this lifetime if the time & effort spent in prayer will be fruitful or not. Going by this logic, it makes sense that a religious Guru will discourage prayer for material worship and encourage the other option instead. Cheers Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
theist Posted June 10, 2009 Report Share Posted June 10, 2009 TRANSLATION Bg 7.16 O best among the Bhāratas [Arjuna], four kinds of pious men render devotional service unto Me-the distressed, the desirer of wealth, the inquisitive, and he who is searching for knowledge of the Absolute. PURPORT Unlike the miscreants, these are adherents of the regulative principles of the scriptures, and they are called sukṛtina, or those who obey the rules and regulations of scriptures, the moral and social laws, and are, more or less, devoted to the Supreme Lord. Out of these there are four classes of men-those who are sometimes distressed, those who are in need of money, those who are sometimes inquisitive, and those who are sometimes searching after knowledge of the Absolute Truth. These persons come to the Supreme Lord for devotional service under different conditions. These are not pure devotees because they have some aspiration to fulfill in exchange for devotional service. Pure devotional service is without aspiration and without desire for material profit. The Bhakti-rasāmṛta-sindhu defines pure devotion thus: anyābhilāṣitāśūnyaṁ jñāna-karmādy-anāvṛtam ānukūlyena kṛṣṇānuśīlanaṁ bhaktir uttamā. "One should render transcendental loving service to the Supreme Lord Kṛṣṇa favorably and without desire for material profit or gain through fruitive activities or philosophical speculation. That is called pure devotional service." When these four kinds of persons come to the Supreme Lord for devotional service and are completely purified by the association of a pure devotee, they also become pure devotees. As far as the miscreants are concerned, for them devotional service is very difficult because their lives are selfish, irregular and without spiritual goals. But even some of them, by chance, when they come in contact with a pure devotee, also become pure devotees. Those who are always busy with fruitive activities come to the Lord in material distress and at that time associate with pure devotees and become, in their distress, devotees of the Lord. Those who are simply frustrated also come sometimes to associate with the pure devotees and become inquisitive to know about God. Similarly, when the dry philosophers are frustrated in every field of knowledge, they sometimes want to learn of God, and they come to the Supreme Lord to render devotional service and thus transcend knowledge of the impersonal Brahman and the localized Paramātmā and come to the personal conception of Godhead by the grace of the Supreme Lord or His pure devotee. On the whole, when the distressed, the inquisitive, the seekers of knowledge, and those who are in need of money are free from all material desires, and when they fully understand that material remuneration has nothing to do with spiritual improvement, they become pure devotees. As long as such a purified stage is not attained, devotees in transcendental service to the Lord are tainted with fruitive activities, and they search after mundane knowledge, etc. So one has to transcend all this before one can come to the stage of pure devotional service. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chandu_69 Posted June 10, 2009 Report Share Posted June 10, 2009 Nothing wrong perse in worshipping krishna for material gain and success.Concept of Material gain differs from person to person.A homeless person asking for a modest success in life is not the same as a millionaire desiring to become a billionaire. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AncientMariner Posted June 11, 2009 Report Share Posted June 11, 2009 The story of Dhruva Maharaja addresses this question if I remember right. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
theist Posted June 11, 2009 Report Share Posted June 11, 2009 The story of Dhruva Maharaja addresses this question if I remember right. How so AM? Would you elaborate a little please? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gHari Posted June 12, 2009 Report Share Posted June 12, 2009 Somehow or other, turn to God. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AncientMariner Posted June 20, 2009 Report Share Posted June 20, 2009 How so AM? Would you elaborate a little please? Well if I remember right Dhruva Maharaja went to the forrest as a young kid and it had something to do with his wicked stepmother. Dhruva underwent severe austerity and caught the attention of Narada Muni who came and instructed him in spiritual knowledge. At first Dhruva wanted a kingdom bigger than his grandfather and father but Narada Muni taught him that these things were ultimately folly and almost a hinderance to devotional service. The moral of the story was that even if you go to Krishna for something material you are still considered glorious and that eventually you will give up that notion and take to devotional service out of pure love rather than material motivation. I think that was Dhruva Maharaja but if I got the wrong name I apologize. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
theist Posted June 20, 2009 Report Share Posted June 20, 2009 Perfect example. Dhruva as a little boy being the Kings son by one of his wives, but not the son of the queen, went to sit on the king's lap but was forbidden to by the queen who wanted her own son to be king. Dhruva was hurt and angry and became determined as you described. His mother is the one who direct him to the forest to find God to help him fulfill his desires. As you mentioned by Narada's grace he became Krishna conscious and void of a desire for a kingdom. When the Visnu-dhutas came to take him to Vaikuntha he noticed his mother was also being taken to Vaikuntha. She was actually his siksa guru as the one ' who pointed the way' for Dhruva. This is an example of the disciple saving his guru. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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