As rose by any other name would smell just as sweet.

[theist]

Universal or equal vision is not just recognizing everyone is spirtual soul. It is also being able to recognize the same truth when it is taught by someone outside your own religious/ cultural circle.

 

Just as someone who cannot recognize the soul in another form different from his own can not truly recognize the soul within his own so someone who cannot recognize the truth when spoken by others from a different background than his own cannot truly understand the same truth within himself.

[sambya]

 

It is also being able to recognize the same truth when it is taught by someone outside your own religious/ cultural circle.

 

the famous yato mat tato path ...

 

 

dont you think you are deviating from what has been traditionally taught to you ?!!!

 

 

Just as someone who cannot recognize the soul in another form different from his own can not truly recognize the soul within his own so someone who cannot recognize the truth when spoken by others from a different background than his own cannot truly understand the same truth within himself.

 

ha ha ...you are first in that list !

[chandu_69]

 

the famous yato mat tato path ...

!

 

Yato mat tato path(As many views as many PATHS).

Famous?, yeh.

 

Even if those paths turned humanbeings in to killers and slavers.

 

Yes, all are valid paths...

 

Back to neo-hinduism and universalism.

[chandu_69]

 

rose by any other name would smell just as sweet

.

I agree.Also agree to the unsaid part.All flowers are not roses.

[Smiley]

What about Sri Krishna's contention in Bhagavad Gita that he can be worshiped 'in a wrong way'?

 

www.dharmacentral.com/universalism.htm

 

 

 

Universal or equal vision is not just recognizing everyone is spirtual soul. It is also being able to recognize the same truth when it is taught by someone outside your own religious/ cultural circle.

 

Just as someone who cannot recognize the soul in another form different from his own can not truly recognize the soul within his own so someone who cannot recognize the truth when spoken by others from a different background than his own cannot truly understand the same truth within himself.

[sambya]

 

Yato mat tato path(As many views as many PATHS).

Famous?, yeh.

 

Even if those paths turned humanbeings in to killers and slavers.

 

Yes, all are valid paths...

 

Back to neo-hinduism and universalism.

 

 

im just pointing out theist's accute shortage of intelligence !!

 

i'll illustrate it -

 

thiest's and iskcon traditional and much taught view :

 

'yato mat tato path is absolutely invalid . that is there can never be many ways to god . ramakrishna was the greatest misguider that ever existed in this earth because he said all gods are equal . he and vivekanada together is manifestation of adharma and kali ( yes you heard it right) . there is only one way through krishna and bhakti marga . christians and islam are acceptable as they believe in personal god . therefore they are fellow vaishnavs ."

 

and now theists comes up with --

 

'Universal or equal vision is not just recognizing everyone is spirtual soul. It is also being able to recognize the same truth when it is taught by someone outside your own religious/ cultural circle.

 

Just as someone who cannot recognize the soul in another form different from his own can not truly recognize the soul within his own so someone who cannot recognize the truth when spoken by others from a different background than his own cannot truly understand the same truth within himself. '

 

 

 

ha ha ha !! see that -- yato mat tato path ! thiest can we ask for an explantion or bhasya to your sutra ? ha ha..

 

chandu , i know that you cant survive without them but for gods sake dont start islam and neo hinduism again ...please!

 

moderators and administrator please dont delete the post . i have neither named anyone nor blaphemised anybody !!! just presenting the truth !

Edited July 31, 2009 by sambya

[chandu_69]

 

im just pointing out theist's accute shortage of intelligence !!

 

i'll illustrate it -

 

thiest's and iskcon traditional and much taught view :

I am talking about your guru's quote Yato..

 

 

 

'yato mat tato path is absolutely invalid

.

Yes, ofcourse.You have not answered to my objection that killers and slave makers theology cannot lead you to god.

Yes or no? be specific.

 

 

that is there can never be many ways to god .

 

There are many ways to god(krishna himself says that).

Killing people and enslaving their women and children are not on my approval list.

 

 

ramakrishna was the greatest misguider that ever existed in this earth because he said all gods are equal

.

 

Instead of getting sentimental consider answering the specific question.

 

Can a religion that advocates murdering unbelievers be considered as a valid path to god?

yes or No?

[sambya]

 

I am talking about your guru's quote Yato.

 

and i was originally talking about theist's idiocy .

 

and the last post of mine was to make you understand how you have deviated from what i was actually talking about .

 

 

Yes, ofcourse.You have not answered to my objection that killers and slave makers theology cannot lead you to god.

Yes or no? be specific.

well, though it has nothing to do with what i tried to convey i shall answer your questions out of my generosity !

 

no is the answer .... no one can reach god by killing out of envy or hatred . in fact hatred itself is a great impediment to god ...

 

illustration : the kind of hatred a christian missionaries might have towards a hindu

 

or

 

the kind of hatred that you have towards christians and muslims .

 

 

 

 

There are many ways to god(krishna himself says that).

Killing people and enslaving their women and children are not on my approval list.

 

i agree and neither it was on ramakrishna's list .

 

 

Instead of getting sentimental consider answering the specific question.

sentimental ? are you not ?

 

yes i am sentimental about what i follow and whom i follow . everyone is sentimental about it ! and if he is not then he is anything but spiritual . spirituality , sentiment and emotions go hand in hand my friend !

 

just like you are also sentimental in a negative way towards muslims christians , 'neo hindus' and ramakrishna followers and in a positive way towards hare krishnas ...... see it ? simple !!

 

 

Can a religion that advocates murdering unbelievers be considered as a valid path to god?

yes or No?

strictly speaking religions are not 'paths' to god . you yourself are the path to god and religion provide a certain amount og guidance to you ..

 

still my answer to your question(doesnt carry much sense though) would be a no ..

[chandu_69]

 

and the last post of mine was to make you understand how you have deviated from what i was actually talking about .

 

I perfectly understood what you are talking about and u used Ramakrishna quotes to drive home your point.This is where i differ with your Guru.

 

 

well, though it has nothing to do with what i tried to convey i shall answer your questions out of my generosity !

 

Thanks for your generosity.I question i raised is specifically related to R.K. hamsa quote you provided.

 

 

no is the answer .... no one can reach god by killing out of envy or hatred . in fact hatred itself is a great impediment to god ...

Then you admit R.K. was wrong when he referred to a religion that celebrates killing unbeleivers as a sure way to reach Heaven(Quran 9:111)

 

 

illustration : the kind of hatred a christian missionaries might have towards a hindu

 

No, the christian missionaries don't show that much hatred towards a hindu.Love the sinner but hate the sinner is their motto.They hate your beliefs not as much You.The missionaries are trying to save you from eternal hell.Their theology tells them that a hindu like you has no hope for salvation.They are simply following their theology.Nothing personal there.

 

or

 

 

the kind of hatred that you have towards christians and muslims .

I am unabashed in discussing their theology.If i come across as a hater let it be.I am not trying to win some popularity contest.

 

 

 

 

i agree and neither it was on ramakrishna's list .

.

 

Rama krishna was a simple saintly person but uneducated.Being uneducated he should have refrained from passing those comments he made.everybody knows which religions he was referring to.I don't have any qualms in making it bare;

 

 

sentimental ? are you not ?

Not much.

 

 

yes i am sentimental about what i follow and whom i follow . everyone is sentimental about it ! and if he is not then he is anything but spiritual . spirituality , sentiment and emotions go hand in hand my friend !

But you cannot hide falsehood under sentiment.

If you think hurting other people sentiments is bad you would have refrained making several comments against prabhupada.

Dont follow double standards.

 

 

just like you are also sentimental in a negative way towards muslims christians , 'neo hindus' and ramakrishna followers and in a positive way towards hare krishnas ...... see it ? simple !!

 

I am brutally honest(in matters of theology).Nothing negative about that.I back up with proofs for what i say.

 

Yes, i am positive about Hk's(not towards shills and noobs,though) cause they have neither killed millions of hindus nor they express their intention to do so in Future.

 

Nothing sentimental about my approach.

[sambya]

 

I perfectly understood what you are talking about and u used Ramakrishna quotes to drive home your point.This is where i differ with your Guru.

 

you are perfectly free to differ . im not trying to shove it down your throat .

 

 

 

Then you admit R.K. was wrong when he referred to a religion that celebrates killing unbeleivers as a sure way to reach Heaven(Quran 9:111)

 

no i dont admit he was wrong ....

 

why ? now thats a long answer and you might not be able to accept it as you are already biased against almost everything except hare krishnaism .

 

neverthless i shall explain for understanding of others who might be following this thread .....

 

ramakrishna never preached or advocated killing or any sinfull activites . he did not ask to randomly worship every god present in hinduism . he said everyone to hold on to their respective ishta and believed that destroying one's bhava of approaching sprituality brings no good . he said " you cannot feel the bottom of a bucket if you randomly dip your hands everywhere . one has to be determined to feel the bottom and dip his hand at one place" . but he said that different peoples are trying to reach the same god as per their different cultures and different perceptions . that is the meaning of yato mat tato path . it means that their object of pursuit is same .

 

it doesnt imply that every religion has the same amount of revealed truth ! some faiths might be one step closure towards god than other faith . but the common objective is god . a christian may wrongly think that all other gods are false but as regard to his own belief he is searching for god . and god cannot be two . if it cannot be two then it automatically imples that even a christian is pursuing the same god as an hindu , but according to a different understanding .

 

strictly speaking it is incorrect to say that one religion is more advanced than the other . why ? well , how do you determine the status of any religion ? theres no way to do that . its better to say that each religion has discovered one aspect of the same truth .

 

the parable that sri ramakrishna used to illustrate this point was - " four blind persons went to understand what an elepahant is ! the one to toched the ears said that elepahant is like a big fan . the one who felt the legs thought that it is like a small pillar . the one who felt its belly thought it to be like a roof . and one to felt the trunk thought it to be like a pipe " .. so there you are . all of them are simultaneoulsy true and wrong !! this is where yato mat comes in . they have all seen god but one aspect of the infinite . and due to ego they think that this is the end . god can be no more than what i have been taught or what i have seen .

 

this is precisely the case with missonaries , muslims , traditional advaitist and most vaishnavs . they refuse to acknowledge god beyond what they have seen and felt !

 

now what if a person searches for god and burns heretics at stake at the same time . will he go to heaven ? does he gets liberated ?

no . surely he does not .....at least to the hindu way of understanding he does not .

 

but there is one little point there . all the while he has been calling out to the supreme and searching for him(if at all) , no matter how ruthless and tyrant he was . god being infinitely compassionate and mercifull knows that his son is grossly misguided in his pursuit of him(god) . and what does his compassionate god do ? does he liberate him ? no . instead he slowly brings him to clearer paths(not neseccarily other religion , might be something within christianity itself) over numerous life(yes , a christian wont belive that , but who cares ? im hindu , speak like a hindu and showing the hindu philosophy ) and so eventually he can unite with satchidananda . this is yato mat tato path . path doesnt mean liberation or else ramakrishna would have said "yato mat tato moksha " !! but he didnt say that . you are mistaking just on this point . you are wrongly identifying 'path' with moksha !! the two are completely different .

 

when a certain individual questioned to ramakrishna about the validity of 'idol worship' and suggested that such worshipers should be corrected ramakrishna answered back-- " you and your lectures ! if there is any deficiencies in worshiping a murti god himself will take care of that , you need not think of all those matters . what do you think ? god is so dumb that he cannot understand that it is he who is being prayed to ?!! you look to your own salvation "

 

this is yato mat..... and this parable applies to you also . if muslims and christians are tyrants let them be so . nothing exists in this world without a purpose . the day your purpose in this creation ends you perish !! so if their(islam and christianity) need has ended god would see to their destruction ! you try to a good man , set an example to the world , live a spiritual and rightful life and try to love all with eye of equality . you cannot change others . all you can do is change your wretched self . the fact that other hate me should not turn me into a hater myself !! this is precisely what you have been doing . christians and muslims hate me so i shall doubly hate them !! so long as you have not seen god personally you lack right to comment on other people's god . see him yourself and them come back to instruct others on where they stand wrong ..

 

and there is only two approach - either you belive that every religion has some amount of truth and goodness in it or you believe that no religion except yours has any amount of truth or goodness . you are free to chose the one you like !!

 

 

I am unabashed in discussing their theology.If i come across as a hater let it be.I am not trying to win some popularity contest.

 

you are one my friend . even if you are not running after popularity contest remeber that its not an achievement .

 

 

 

Rama krishna was a simple saintly person but uneducated.Being uneducated he should have refrained from passing those comments he made.

tell me what do you understand by education ? to a spiritual candidate education is gossly material . it is indespensible for modern surivival but does nothing to create a man out of a homo sapien .

 

since childhood what have we been doing ?

montessori , school , exams , high shcool . holding ranks etc . what for ? to get into a good university . after university what do we do ? rush for a job . set up a business ? what for ? to eat and survive !! we invest in shares insurance and stuff to eat and survive . this is not education ?

what education are you talking of ? does getting established in society as an engineer or doctor and earn huge amount of money turn out as education ? being a politician and look after your interest amounts to education ? what is education ?!!

 

it is nothing but a highly specialized tool to help a human survive and find food and fend for itself . there it ends ! and if you think that this education gives you the right to speak as you wish and a lack of such 'education' takes away your right , then we have serious doubts on your intelligence levels ..!!

 

 

 

But you cannot hide falsehood under sentiment.

If you think hurting other people sentiments is bad you would have refrained making several comments against prabhupada.

Dont follow double standards.

 

 

i dont follow any double standards . i never criticize of any person or any body's belief unprovoked . i have certain grudges against iskcon which is because they start bonafide criticisms of almost every saint of india .

 

i cannot name the persons who criticizes or the criticized victims because the post will ineveitably get deleted ! they start the criticisms and bask in its glory . all i do is to show them their own faults in the hope that they stop their fault finding with other .

 

my criticism is not out of envy . it is not ninda . it is protest !!

 

 

Yes, i am positive about Hk's(not towards shills and noobs,though) cause they have neither killed millions of hindus nor they express their intention to do so in Future.

 

why cant you be positve towards ramakrishna when he also didnt kill millions neither expressed his desire to do so in future ?

 

and even hare krishnas accept christianity and islam and call them vaishnav . what does it sound to you ? you dont have any problems with that ?!!

 

 

Nothing sentimental about my approach.

thats what you believe and very few can analyze his own self and you certainly do not fall into that catagory !

[sambya]

sorry double post deleted !

[chandu_69]

 

ramakrishna never preached or advocated killing or any sinfull activites

 

Nobody accused him of that.But he endorsed a religion that advocates killing for god, which makes him ignorant since he is a non-violent person.

 

This is where education plays a role.Claim of spirituality cannot be a guard for ignorance.I am objecting to the ignorance of RK and the large scale embrace of this ignorance by hindu population .

 

 

he did not ask to randomly worship every god present in hinduism

 

I have no problem with that.Dont bring unrelated issues in to discussion and cloud the subject.

 

 

no i dont admit he was wrong

 

Sure, you would not, despite the evidence presented. And because of people like you who perpetuate this nonsense Hindus continue to suffer and have no clue what has hit them and what continues to hit them.

[chandu_69]

 

he said " you cannot feel the bottom of a bucket if you randomly dip your hands everywhere

 

Sure, but you cannot feel the bottom when you didn't even touch the surface.

 

This is how he felt the Bucket of water.

 

Ramakrishna - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

"Ramakrishna said that he "devoutly repeated the name of Allah, wore a cloth like the Arab Moslems, said their prayer five times daily, and felt disinclined even to see images of the Hindu gods and goddesses, much less worship them—for the Hindu way of thinking had disappeared altogether from my mind."[68] According to Ramakrishna, after three days of practice he had a vision of a "radiant personage with grave countenance and white beard resembling the Prophet and merging with his body".[69]"

 

No quote whatsoever from quran or other islamic scriptures.

[chandu_69]

 

he said " you cannot feel the bottom of a bucket if you randomly dip your hands everywhere

Sure, but you cannot feel the bottom when you didn't even touch the surface.

 

This is how he felt the Bucket of water.

 

Ramakrishna - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

"Ramakrishna said that he "devoutly repeated the name of Allah, wore a cloth like the Arab Moslems, said their prayer five times daily, and felt disinclined even to see images of the Hindu gods and goddesses, much less worship them—for the Hindu way of thinking had disappeared altogether from my mind."[68] According to Ramakrishna, after three days of practice he had a vision of a "radiant personage with grave countenance and white beard resembling the Prophet and merging with his body".[69]"

 

No quote whatsoever from quran or other islamic scriptures.

[sambya]

 

Nobody accused him of that.But he endorsed a religion that advocates killing for god, which makes him ignorant since he is a non-violent person.

This is where education plays a role.Claim of spirituality cannot be a guard for ignorance.I am objecting to the ignorance of RK and the large scale embrace of this ignorance by hindu population .

ah , back to islam and its vices ! how old are you chandu ? were you by any chance a victim of 1947 riots of india ? perhaps that is what makes you so hateful towards them .

 

firstly you have not clarified what you understand by the term education .

now i ask you one more thing - what do you understand by ignorance ? if you have even the basic knowledge and faith in hindu scriptures you shall immideately acknowledge that it is brahmagyan that if knowledge and rest all ignorance .

but to your reasoning acquiring bread earning bookish fundamentals is knowledge !

if you acknowledge ramakrishna as a saint or mahapurush(which you did in the last post) there must be a reason for his birth . every saint has something good to contribute to the huge philosophy of hinduism . every saint reflects in himself a portion of the infinite truth . ramakrishna's lack of materialistic bread earning knowledge was intentional . he willfully opted out of this deformed education system . he said " i dont want to learn bread winning gyan . i want the supreme gyan . i dont like to be a dry pandita ! oh lord keep me immersed in rasa ."

if your objection is about the ignorance of ramakrishna about material matters then i have no objection . but if you are calling ramakrishna 'ignorant' because he didnt have the conventional education then i wont support you and it automatically show your lack of faith in hindu scriptures !

ramakrishna used to give a nice example for dry panditas and people like you -- " a vulture can soar up high in the sky but its eyesight is focussed on rotting carcass !! a learned pandita often aqquires immense knowledge of scriptures but might remain entagled in kaam , fame , power and money ! "

I have no problem with that.Dont bring unrelated issues in to discussion and cloud the subject.

its not any unrelated issue . it is just a sentence that i wrote within the big paragraph in my attempt to illustrate the philosophy of ramakrishna , which you picked up in isolation and now attempting to extract menings out of it !!

Sure, you would not, despite the evidence presented. And because of people like you who perpetuate this nonsense Hindus continue to suffer and have no clue what has hit them and what continues to hit them.

evidence ? what evidence ? which evidence ? what was the crime ?

 

show me how yato mat has anything to do with sufference of hindus .

 

 

and if you want i can confidently describe to you how lack of yato mat tato pat brings sufference , not just to hindus but to the entire world !

 

fortunately most hindus of modern world accepts him and his philosophy . and some would remain like you forever ! no good thing comes without opposition , you know !

you may love ramakrishna or hate ramakrishna , but you cannot deny him . this is where all the problem starts ! sorry folks . ramakrishna's philosophy of universality of religions is already engulfed the hindu world . better luck next time ........ha ha

by the way you have still not answered how can you accept iskcon when you cannot accept ramakrishna ? they both accept islam and christianity .... i want a proper clarification ...if you have any !!

[chandu_69]

 

ah , back to islam and its vices ! how old are you chandu ? were you by any chance a victim of 1947 riots of india ? perhaps that is what makes you so hateful towards them .

 

evidence ? what evidence ? which evidence ? what was the crime ?

 

I am not that old.But i am not somebody like a neohindu who wants to forget what happened and what is happening.It is not just 1947.It is also what happened before where millions of hindus were massacred and millions more were sold as slaves.This is the proof i am talking about and the theological basis for it as explained in another thread.

 

firstly you have not clarified what you understand by the term education .

now i ask you one more thing - what do you understand by ignorance ? if you have even the basic knowledge and faith in hindu scriptures you shall immideately acknowledge that it is brahmagyan that if knowledge and rest all ignorance .

 

Brahmagyan doesn't mean behaving like a delusional person as evident from the wikipedia link i gave above.You are an expert in dodging the subject and filling the page with trash.

 

My basic objection to R.K's teachings is his [n]ignorance which is mistaken as spirituality has masked the imminent dangers of a blood thirsty theology.This kind of ignorance perpetuated has caught Hindus unaware and led to massacre and rapes in 1947.

 

Because of gurus like R.k., Gandhis and nehrus were caught unawares during Partition massacres.

[sant]

chandu are you in any way from bjp.

[sambya]

 

 

Brahmagyan doesn't mean behaving like a delusional person as evident from the wikipedia link i gave above.You are an expert in dodging the subject and filling the page with trash.

 

My basic objection to R.K's teachings is his [n]ignorance which is mistaken as spirituality has masked the imminent dangers of a blood thirsty theology.This kind of ignorance perpetuated has caught Hindus unaware and led to massacre and rapes in 1947.

 

Because of gurus like R.k., Gandhis and nehrus were caught unawares during Partition massacres.

 

you have not answered my questions !!

 

anyways , i will give you an advice how to tackle this problem .

 

publish nice and attractive pamplhets about how ramakrishna's teachings eventually led to the mass destruction of hindus under sultunate rule in an era that is atleast 300 years before ramakrishna or how his words provided direct cause that led to the social imbalances or how he brainwashed gandhi and nehru by appearing in their dreams, and distribute in front of delhi station to see is it works .

 

since you have discovered such an important thing it is your moral responsibility to inform people about it .

 

as for me i shall some back to tak to you when i find a post that doesnt have neo hinduism , islam or ramakrishna ( even a single one would do )

 

enjoy......

[sambya]

 

chandu are you in any way from bjp.

 

 

let me tell you in secret.........he had a mental shock resulting out of chronic grief the day when babri masjid was torn apart because he couldnt participate in its demolition due to certain heath problems . and this shock was so great he had to be hospitalised for three months !! shhh................

[chandu_69]

 

you have not answered my questions !!

No, i am not falling in to the trap of your's trying to side track the issue;namely all paths are valid

 

 

anyways , i will give you an advice how to tackle this problem .

publish nice and attractive pamplhets about how ramakrishna's teachings eventually led to the mass destruction of hindus under sultunate rule in an era that is atleast 300 years before ramakrishna

It is foolish on your part to assume Rk's teachings have any thing to do with what happened before.

 

 

or how his words provided direct cause that led to the social imbalances or how he brainwashed gandhi and nehru by appearing in their dreams, and distribute in front of delhi station to see is it works .

R.K didn't appear in those people's dreams.Atleast they didnt say anything to that effect.You cannot resist posting rubbish and unintelligent comments.Don't you?

 

 

I merely said

"Because of gurus like R.k.,".

He is not the only one who perpetuated this myth.

 

how his words provided direct cause that led to the social imbalances

I am not talking about imbalances.I am talking about Large scale massacres and rapes .Had the Gandhis and nehrus were aware of the theology of Killing for God they would have approved of partition before Violence or would have Amassed troops on streets to put the Murderous mobs in control.

 

And the thoughts of the Likes of RK's have prevented them from exploring that angle.Got it?

 

 

since you have discovered such an important thing it is your moral responsibility to inform people about it

.

 

That is what i am doing.But i am not the only one.There are plenty of people out there.

 

 

 

enjoy......

No, it is not an enjoyable thing to do.

[theist]

Is it a glass of water or a glass of jal? Only an idiot could not understand a point this simple.

 

 

 

[sambya]

 

Is it a glass of water or a glass of jal? Only an idiot could not understand a point this simple.

 

LOL ...........again ?

 

Jal and water the same isnt it ?

 

 

ramakrishna--

 

"it is the same god that people are searching for . the hindus are drinking the water from one ghat and calls it jal , the muslims are drinking it from another ghat and calls it pani , thr christians are drinking it from a third ghat and calles it water and some call it aqua . but in reality there is no difference in what they are searching "

 

YATO MAT TATO PATH once more ........................ha ha ha.

 

lol !!!

 

 

by this you have established this beyond doubt that you are an idiot(by your own logic ) . you didnt understand this 'simple' thing for so long !!

 

 

ha ha ha...........

[theist]

And so the obvious point is the one Supreme God the Muslims and Christians and Indian Vaisnava's call out to by different names is the same God although the understanding of the nature of that God by the adherents of different religions may be on different levels of maturity.

 

Those that are outside of this understanding are the mayavadi's and polytheists whereever they may be found.

 

But yet as simple as this is to understand we see the Muslims and Christians condemning the Indian Vaisnavas as worshippers of some strange god called Visnu or Krishna thinking Him to be one of the Hindus many demi-gods.

 

We can understand their confusion because afterall the Hindus do seem to have a god for everything. Just this last week on this forum I learned they have a smallpox god they worship with weekly fasting etc.

 

But maybe the strangest thing of all is some of those involved in bone fide Vaisnava sampradaya's who can't seem to shake the small minded sectarian viewpoint that the God of all existence, all the innumerable universes, must come from India and have a sankrit name and that He is so limited that He cannot send His messengers elsewhere to spread God conscious and draw suffering living beings back to His shelter.

 

Personally I seek to distance myself from all such narrow mindness rather it comes in the form of a human form dressed nicely in dhoti, tilak and sikha or not.

[sambya]

 

And so the obvious point is the one Supreme God the Muslims and Christians and Indian Vaisnava's call out to by different names is the same God although the understanding of the nature of that God by the adherents of different religions may be on different levels of maturity.

 

Those that are outside of this understanding are the mayavadi's and polytheists whereever they may be found.

 

human beings are different from animals by their power of logic , reasoning and discrimination .

and whatever logic you follow must be applicable to all persons at any given time . it must be universally applicable .

 

now lets see the logic you have for your statement --

 

either you doggedly follow the scriptures

or

you follow some rational sense with scriptures .

 

if you opt for the first then christians muslims etc can never ever worship the same god . they are were and will be the 'mlecchhas' (now dont come up with your 'as it is' version of the word !! )

 

and if you go for the second logic then even shaktas and mayavadis must also be following the same god . you cannot apply any logic to any two cases and drop out the rest at whim !!

 

 

so it follows that by both logic you cannot proove what you are claiming (everyones following the same god except mayvadis etc)

[chandu_69]

 

And so the obvious point is the one Supreme God the Muslims and Christians and Indian Vaisnava's call out to by different names is the same God although the understanding of the nature of that God by the adherents of different religions may be on different levels of maturity.

 

 

 

Maturity, yes.

 

The mature islamic god called Allah advocates killing christians and jews unless they pay Punitive tax(Jizya) unless OR worship Allah of Quran and accept Muhammad as the Final messenger.

 

09.029

Y: Fight those who believe not in Allah nor the Last Day, nor hold that forbidden which hath been forbidden by Allah and His Messenger, nor

acknowledge the religion of Truth, (even if they are) of the People of the Book, until they pay the Jizya with willing submission, and feel themselves subdued.

 

009.030

Y: The Jews call 'Uzair a son of Allah, and the Christians call Christ the son of Allah. That is a saying from their mouth; (in this) they but imitate what the unbelievers of old used to say. Allah's curse be on them: how they are deluded away from the Truth!.

 

Very Mature indeed.