{LAYA-YOGA-CHAKRAS} OM: need advise & guidance

February 9, 2007

Rudruksha beads are the best. They are powerful beads

that contain Lord Shiva's blessings especially for

healing, not to mention self-realization. It doesn't

matter whether it is himalayan or nepali. What matters

is that it is Rudruksha beads.

Best Wishes, & OM Namah Shivaya,

Keith Johnson

http://www.sacredsyllable.com

--- Vikrant <free_for_blue wrote:

> i request all rudraksh knowledgable people to advise

> on the folowing....

> which rudraksh bead is better the himalayan bead

> or the nepali bead..?

> here in my above statement i am speaking in terms

> of the potency,power & effects..?

> also which rudraksh bead size is better viz-the

> normal size or the collector giant size.?

> pls advise and guide me and help me make a

> decision...

> thanks...

>

> Vikrant

> Everyone is raving about the all-new Mail

beta.

______________________________\

____

Finding fabulous fares is fun.

Let FareChase search your favorite travel sites to find flight and hotel

bargains.

http://farechase./promo-generic-14795097

February 9, 2007

Namaskar Dear All,

This is a perfect example of DOGMA, developed

over the centuries. Beads can be made from any

material. It is irrelevant. Actually you don't need any

beads. You can use your fingers and in the ultimate stage

of practice, you could avoid all the props together.

Being dependent on any accessories like beads, statues,

pictures or places of worship and pilgrimage is only additional

burden, creating more samskars. It is also the commercial commodity

which is the essential part of religious traditions, which have very

little to do with a spiritual practice, self realization or service to humanity

and all creation. From complexity to simplicity, from diversity to the

onepointness, is the essence of any PATH OF BLISS. You only need to LOVE

ALL.

In Him

Trilokesh

===========================================

Rudruksha beads are the best. They are powerful beads

that contain Lord Shiva's blessings especially for

healing, not to mention self-realization. It doesn't

matter whether it is himalayan or nepali. What matters

is that it is Rudruksha beads.

Best Wishes, & OM Namah Shivaya,

Keith Johnson

http://www.sacredsyllable.com

--- Vikrant <free_for_blue >

wrote:

> i request all rudraksh knowledgable people to advise

> on the folowing....

> which rudraksh bead is better the himalayan bead

> or the nepali bead..?

> here in my above statement i am speaking in terms

> of the potency,power & effects..?

> also which rudraksh bead size is better viz-the

> normal size or the collector giant size.?

> pls advise and guide me and help me make a

> decision...

> thanks...

>

> Vikrant

>

> Everyone is raving about the all-new Mail

beta.

________

Finding fabulous fares is fun.

Let FareChase search your favorite travel sites to find flight and

hotel bargains.

http://farechase./promo-generic-14795097

February 10, 2007

Namaskaram!

Calling wisdom of yogis and vedas a doma is stupidity and ignorance itself. Yogis have been using specific materials as a help on spiritual path not because of blind belief or dogma, but because of real power and energy they have and help they bring. Someone, who's ignoring this simple fact is surely not a yogi, but impostor and would be better for him to remain silent then to tell lies and make a karma of false teacher (and many samskara seeds). Using rudraksha beads is making your spiritual path easier, as they giving you both strong spiritual protection and lots of blessings of Śhiva.

Besides, there is no love for enemies of God, and murderers of soul. There is no love between devas and asuras, as asuras and murderers of soul hate the light and goodness, and angels of God and other spiritual beings, including spiritual Masters and disciples feel UPEKSHA, indifference, neutrality or peace toward the enemies of Spirituality. If you love, then you give power, support and energy to act, and if you love something or somebody, that is evil and who acts evil, you support evil. Gautama Buddha recommended to his disciples, to dissolve all relationships with the enemies of Sangha, to make them so neutral and non-existent, that they all dissapear from our lives and memory. And this is divine attitude on spiritual path.

As Shree Patanjali explains in Yogasutras:

MAITRI-KARUNA-MUDITO-PEKSANAM

Maitri - friendship, love for good and friendly beings

Karuna - compassion for beings in pain, suffering

Mudita - joy, happiness from being with good and decent beings

Upeksha - neutrality to evil

And these are fundamentals of yoga.

Om Śri Rudraya Namah!

Om Śanti, Śanti, Śantih!

Mariici

-

Tadeusz Majewski

Friday, February 09, 2007 5:42 PM

Re: {LAYA-YOGA-CHAKRAS}>OM: need advise & guidance

Namaskar Dear All,This is a perfect example of DOGMA, developedover the centuries. Beads can be made from any material. It is irrelevant. Actually you don't need anybeads. You can use your fingers and in the ultimate stageof practice, you could avoid all the props together.Being dependent on any accessories like beads, statues,pictures or places of worship and pilgrimage is only additionalburden, creating more samskars. It is also the commercial commoditywhich is the essential part of religious traditions, which have verylittle to do with a spiritual practice, self realization or service to humanityand all creation. From complexity to simplicity, from diversity to theonepointness, is the essence of any PATH OF BLISS. You only need to LOVE ALL.In HimTrilokesh===========================================

Rudruksha beads are the best. They are powerful beadsthat contain Lord Shiva's blessings especially forhealing, not to mention self-realization. It doesn'tmatter whether it is himalayan or nepali. What mattersis that it is Rudruksha beads. Best Wishes, & OM Namah Shivaya,Keith Johnsonhttp://www.sacredsyllable.com--- Vikrant <free_for_blue > wrote:> i request all rudraksh knowledgable people to advise> on the folowing....> which rudraksh bead is better the himalayan bead> or the nepali bead..?> here in my above statement i am speaking in terms> of the potency,power & effects..?> also which rudraksh bead size is better viz-the> normal size or the collector giant size.?> pls advise and guide me and help me make a> decision...> thanks...> > > > Vikrant> > > > > > > > Everyone is raving about the all-new Mailbeta.________Finding fabulous fares is fun. Let FareChase search your favorite travel sites to find flight and hotel bargains.http://farechase./promo-generic-14795097

February 11, 2007

Namaskar Dear Mariici,

Not questioning the wisdom is dogma.

Your respond is only a proof of, how dangerous is

blind believe, which have no base on rationality.

Yogis are the most rational practitioners, unfortunately, they

are minorities. Following the religious sentiments without

analysis , synthesis and critical approach, brings people to

the path of fundamental fanaticism. This is not spirituality at all.

I'm wondering why are you so angry ? Is this the way of yogis

and vedas ? I'm sure not. Rather it is your inability to contain your emotions

?

You have some work to do before preaching WISDOM of Shree Patanjali.

In Him,

Trilokesh

==============

Mariici wrote:

Namaskaram!

Calling wisdom of yogis and vedas a doma is stupidity

and ignorance itself. Yogis have been using specific materials as a help

on spiritual path not because of blind belief or dogma, but because of real

power and energy they have and help they bring. Someone, who's ignoring

this simple fact is surely not a yogi, but impostor and would be better

for him to remain silent then to tell lies and make a karma of false teacher

(and many samskara seeds). Using rudraksha beads is making your spiritual

path easier, as they giving you both strong spiritual protection and lots

of blessings of Śhiva.

Besides, there is no love for enemies of God, and murderers

of soul. There is no love between devas and asuras, as asuras and murderers

of soul hate the light and goodness, and angels of God and other spiritual

beings, including spiritual Masters and disciples feel UPEKSHA, indifference,

neutrality or peace toward the enemies of Spirituality. If you love, then

you give power, support and energy to act, and if you love something or

somebody, that is evil and who acts evil, you support evil. Gautama Buddha

recommended to his disciples, to dissolve all relationships with the enemies

of Sangha, to make them so neutral and non-existent, that they all dissapear

from our lives and memory. And this is divine attitude on spiritual path.

As Shree Patanjali explains in Yogasutras:

MAITRI-KARUNA-MUDITO-PEKSANAM

Maitri - friendship, love for good and friendly beings

Karuna - compassion for beings in pain, suffering

Mudita - joy, happiness from being with good and decent

beings

Upeksha - neutrality to evil

And these are fundamentals of yoga.

Om Śri Rudraya Namah!

Om Śanti, Śanti, Śantih!

Mariici

-----

Original Message -----

Tadeusz Majewski

To:

Sent:

Friday, February 09, 2007 5:42 PM

Subject:

Re: {LAYA-YOGA-CHAKRAS}>OM: need advise & guidance

Namaskar Dear All,

This is a perfect example of DOGMA, developed

over the centuries. Beads can be made from any

material. It is irrelevant. Actually you don't need any

beads. You can use your fingers and in the ultimate stage

of practice, you could avoid all the props together.

Being dependent on any accessories like beads, statues,

pictures or places of worship and pilgrimage is only additional

burden, creating more samskars. It is also the commercial commodity

which is the essential part of religious traditions, which have very

little to do with a spiritual practice, self realization or service to humanity

and all creation. From complexity to simplicity, from diversity to the

onepointness, is the essence of any PATH OF BLISS. You only need to

LOVE ALL.

In Him

Trilokesh

===========================================

Rudruksha beads are the best. They are powerful beads

that contain Lord Shiva's blessings especially for

healing, not to mention self-realization. It doesn't

matter whether it is himalayan or nepali. What matters

is that it is Rudruksha beads.

Best Wishes, & OM Namah Shivaya,

Keith Johnson

http://www.sacredsyllable.com

--- Vikrant <free_for_blue >

wrote:

> i request all rudraksh knowledgable people to advise

> on the folowing....

> which rudraksh bead is better the himalayan bead

> or the nepali bead..?

> here in my above statement i am speaking in terms

> of the potency,power & effects..?

> also which rudraksh bead size is better viz-the

> normal size or the collector giant size.?

> pls advise and guide me and help me make a

> decision...

> thanks...

>

> Vikrant

>

> Everyone is raving about the all-new Mail

beta.

________

Finding fabulous fares is fun.

Let FareChase search your favorite travel sites to find flight

and hotel bargains.

http://farechase./promo-generic-14795097

February 11, 2007

Namaskaram!

I see your ignorance is deeper than I even thought :-)))Your anger and fight against religious, devotional approach could be called a fanaticism, indeed :-) You should maybe read more stories about yogis who follow the path of bhakti and devotion rather than analysis and mind, it could spread your horizon about differences of individuals... 'Autobiography of Yogi' could be good beginning for you, he he, to learn more about PATH OF DEVOTION (BHAKTI).

Where rationality and mind (ego) ends, there yoga, and spiritual path start, as they are based more on BLIND BELIEVE and TRUST to the Guru rather then on one's limited mind and its rationality... TRUST AND BELIEVE to living Guru are something unimaginable for people of the West, but natural for people of the East, and necessary on spiritual path. Maybe that is the reason why is so hard to find real Guru, Spiritual Master originating from the western world, but so easy to find self-ordained masters leading people to spiritual downfall...

There is nice story in Śri Yogananda's 'Autobiography of Yogi' that should last you for answer in this discussion, story about Sacred Stone at Tarakeswar Temple. God taught young Yogananda, that all sacred symbols have got meaning and importence, and ignoring them leads spiritual aspirant to wrong path. You should read it sometimes :-)

And about anger... Even Śhiva Himself is getting angry sometimes, he he. One of His angry forms, destroyer of asuras is known as Bhairava, good form to meditate with and on :-)

And as for my mood: no more shooting blinds, please... :-)

Om Bhairavam!

Mariici

-

Tadeusz Majewski

Saturday, February 10, 2007 11:51 PM

Re: {LAYA-YOGA-CHAKRAS}>OM: need advise & guidance

Namaskar Dear Mariici,Not questioning the wisdom is dogma.Your respond is only a proof of, how dangerous isblind believe, which have no base on rationality.Yogis are the most rational practitioners, unfortunately, theyare minorities. Following the religious sentiments withoutanalysis , synthesis and critical approach, brings people to the path of fundamental fanaticism. This is not spirituality at all.I'm wondering why are you so angry ? Is this the way of yogisand vedas ? I'm sure not. Rather it is your inability to contain your emotions ?You have some work to do before preaching WISDOM of Shree Patanjali.In Him,Trilokesh==============Mariici wrote:

Namaskaram!

Calling wisdom of yogis and vedas a doma is stupidity and ignorance itself. Yogis have been using specific materials as a help on spiritual path not because of blind belief or dogma, but because of real power and energy they have and help they bring. Someone, who's ignoring this simple fact is surely not a yogi, but impostor and would be better for him to remain silent then to tell lies and make a karma of false teacher (and many samskara seeds). Using rudraksha beads is making your spiritual path easier, as they giving you both strong spiritual protection and lots of blessings of Śhiva.

Besides, there is no love for enemies of God, and murderers of soul. There is no love between devas and asuras, as asuras and murderers of soul hate the light and goodness, and angels of God and other spiritual beings, including spiritual Masters and disciples feel UPEKSHA, indifference, neutrality or peace toward the enemies of Spirituality. If you love, then you give power, support and energy to act, and if you love something or somebody, that is evil and who acts evil, you support evil. Gautama Buddha recommended to his disciples, to dissolve all relationships with the enemies of Sangha, to make them so neutral and non-existent, that they all dissapear from our lives and memory. And this is divine attitude on spiritual path.

As Shree Patanjali explains in Yogasutras:

MAITRI-KARUNA-MUDITO-PEKSANAM

Maitri - friendship, love for good and friendly beings

Karuna - compassion for beings in pain, suffering

Mudita - joy, happiness from being with good and decent beings

Upeksha - neutrality to evil

And these are fundamentals of yoga.

Om Śri Rudraya Namah!

Om Śanti, Śanti, Śantih!

Mariici

-

Tadeusz Majewski

Friday, February 09, 2007 5:42 PM

Re: {LAYA-YOGA-CHAKRAS}>OM: need advise & guidance

Namaskar Dear All,This is a perfect example of DOGMA, developedover the centuries. Beads can be made from any material. It is irrelevant. Actually you don't need anybeads. You can use your fingers and in the ultimate stageof practice, you could avoid all the props together.Being dependent on any accessories like beads, statues,pictures or places of worship and pilgrimage is only additionalburden, creating more samskars. It is also the commercial commoditywhich is the essential part of religious traditions, which have verylittle to do with a spiritual practice, self realization or service to humanityand all creation. From complexity to simplicity, from diversity to theonepointness, is the essence of any PATH OF BLISS. You only need to LOVE ALL.In HimTrilokesh===========================================

Rudruksha beads are the best. They are powerful beadsthat contain Lord Shiva's blessings especially forhealing, not to mention self-realization. It doesn'tmatter whether it is himalayan or nepali. What mattersis that it is Rudruksha beads. Best Wishes, & OM Namah Shivaya,Keith Johnsonhttp://www.sacredsyllable.com--- Vikrant <free_for_blue > wrote:> i request all rudraksh knowledgable people to advise> on the folowing....> which rudraksh bead is better the himalayan bead> or the nepali bead..?> here in my above statement i am speaking in terms> of the potency,power & effects..?> also which rudraksh bead size is better viz-the> normal size or the collector giant size.?> pls advise and guide me and help me make a> decision...> thanks...> > > > Vikrant> > > > > > > > Everyone is raving about the all-new Mailbeta.________Finding fabulous fares is fun. Let FareChase search your favorite travel sites to find flight and hotel bargains.http://farechase./promo-generic-14795097

February 11, 2007

Namaskar Dear Mariici

M > I see your ignorance is deeper than I even thought

:-)))

Childish respond. No comments.

M > Your anger

and fight against religious, devotional approach could be called a fanaticism,

indeed :-)

Baseless accusations. No comments

M > it could spread

your horizon about differences of individuals.

Autobiography of Yogi' could be good beginning for you, he he, to learn

more about PATH OF DEVOTION (BHAKTI).

True Devotion is based on Viveka (spiritual discrimination

)

Understanding what is real and what is unreal and ability to select the proper

path is the

essence of yogic practice. I agree with you that "Autobiography of Yogi

' is a very inspirational

book which I read on many occasions, and reader takes the wisdom from his

pages based on

individual understanding. The actual teachings are between the sentences.

It looks you missed those.:-)

M > Where rationality and mind

(ego) ends, there yoga, and spiritual path start, as they are based more

on BLIND BELIEVE and TRUST to the Guru rather then on one's limited mind

and its rationality... TRUST AND BELIEVE to living Guru are something

unimaginable for people of the West, but natural for people of the East,

and necessary on spiritual path

I agree and support the principal of Surrender and

Trust to the Guru. But true Master,

Satguru want you to evaluate and test His qualities. He wants you to accept

Him by merits of His Universal Love, Omnipotent Wisdom, Tolerance and Compassion.

He don't need

blind followers. He wants devotee free from inferiority or superiority complex.

He wants Jiva becoming Shiva. He wants all

of living beings to realize their true nature by sadhana. service and sacrifice,

but with critical and open minded approach.

Blind followers are dangerous to themselves and others. The true Devotion

is based on trust , evolved throughout the practice

and constant evaluation. This is why Jinana Yogis or Karma Yogis must embrace

Bhatki Yoga as the Supreme Path through

realization and not the imposition. There is a big difference between "Mahasatguru

worship" and distorted by misunderstanding "idol worship" One

brings you to the emancipation and salvation ( Moksa and Mukti ), the other

one to the bondage of the Prakrtii. Tantric scriptures very clearly shows

this difference. Below are few examples:

About Patanjali and idol worship:

It's from from Tattvik Praveshika:

Ka'pil Sam'khya and Pa'ta'injal Yoga

The common features of these two philosophies include the following:

(1) Both believe in the existence of many Purus'as.

(2) Both believe that the universe is created by Prakrti for the

satisfaction of these Purus'as. This is not logical as no bhoga or

satisfaction is possible without the existence of mind. Purus'as do not have

mind and they cannot be satisfied by the creation of the universe by

Prakrti.

(3) Both believe that Prakrti is not within Purus'a but is a separate

Entity. This is also illogical since Prakrti is only energy or the shakti of

Purus'a, and like the dahika shakti or burning facility of agni or fire, it

cannot be a separate entity. These philosophies are called Dvaetava'dii or

dualistic because they believe in two separate entities of Purus'a and

Prakrti.

(4) In Sa'm'khya there is no god and thus it is called Niriishwarava'da or

atheism, while Pa'tainjala philosophy believes in God but does not believe

in Brahma. This is therefore called Seshvarava'da or theism.

(5) Idol worship is supported by both these philosophies.

Below is the whole discourse:

VIEWS OF OTHER FAITHS

official source: Ta'ttvika Praveshika'

The important philosophies and religions or faiths prevalent in the world

at the present time are Buddhism, Sha'unkara philosophy, Pa'tainjala

Philosophy, Sa'm'khya Philosophy, A'rya Sama'j, Marxism, Judaism,

Christianity and Islam. These are arranged into the following groups due to

their similarities, and their outstanding principles and beliefs are

discussed together.

(1) Buddhism and Sha'unkara Philosophy

(2) Pa'tainjala Philosophy and Ka'pil Sa'm'khya Philosophy

(3) A'rya Sama'ja

(4) Marxism

Besides these there are the Semitic faiths comprising Judaism, Christianit

y

and Islam.

Buddhism and Shaunkara Philosophy

All As'tika or theistic Indian philosophies unanimously believe that A'tma

n

or unit consciousness is a continuous flow of Jina'na or knowledge. This is

called Vijina'na in Pa'li. There is a continuous flow of Jina'na, or in

other words Jina'na itself is a flow (Prava'ha). Every object in the

universe has its own flow and wave or dynamic force. According to Yoga

philosophy Parama'tman or Supreme Consciousness is an infinite flow of

Jina'na.

Ekam jina'nam nityama'dantashu'nyam,

Na'nyat kimcit va'rtate vastu satyam,

Tayor bhedosminindriyopadhina vae,

Jina'nasya'yambha'sate nannyathaeva.

(Shiva Sam'hita')

Lord Buddha did not use the word A'tman, hence there was a difference of

opinion among the Bhikksus or Buddhist monks after his death. Three

conferences were held to compile the Tripitaka or Buddhist scriptures and a

s

a result the Tripita'ka was compiled in three parts in Pa'li -- Vinaya

Pita'ka or the practical side, Suttapitaka or the theoretical side and

Abhidhamma Pitaka or the philosophical side.

All of these parts combined together were known as the Tripitaka and were

called the Buddhist scriptures. The Bhikhus who patronised or supported the

Sannya'sa Ma'rga or the path of renunciation were not prepared to accept

anything more than what was laid down in the Tripitaka, and hence they were

called Sthavira'va'dii or Therava'dii, the southern school of Buddhism.

Those who were influenced by the Nya'ya school of philosophy were called

Maha'sa'm'ghika or the northern school of Buddhism.

The word Pa'li originated from Pallii which means 'rural', rustic or

unsophisticated. As Bhagava'n Buddha preached in the language of common

people, Hindu scholars called his language Bha'kha'. Pa'li was also known a

s

Pa'li Bha's'a. The common people could not follow Sam'skrta which was the

language of scholars only.

Later on the Maha'sa'm'ghikas called themselves Maha'ya'nii and they called

the Sthavirava'diis Hiinaya'nii. But the Hiinaya'niis called themselves

Therava'dii. In India there was no state backing for Hiinaya'niis except at

the time of the rulers Kaniska, and Vasiska, and hence the Hiinaya'na did

not flourish. The Maha'ya'na had state backing so it naturally had a larger

number of followers. The philosophy of the Hiinaya'niis was preached in

Ceylon, Burma, Siam, Java and Borneo, etc., whereas the philosophy of the

Maha'ya'niis was propagated in India, Siberia, Japan Tibet, etc.

There are four kinds of philosophical doctrines among the Maha'ya'niis. The

reason for this difference of opinion is A'tman and its object. Bhagava'n

Buddha used the word 'Atta' in Pa'li for A'tman. The word Atta is also used

in place of 'Self'. The Bhikkhus could not understand the sense in which

Bhagava'n Buddha used the word Atta.

Ca'rva'ka

At the time of Buddha, Na'stika Va'da or non-belief in God was dominant.

Mahars'i Ajita Keshakamballi was the scholar of the Na'stika' Va'da. Most o

f

the books on Na'stikyava'da were written in incomprehensible language and s

o

its propagation was not very widespread. Ajita Keshakambalii followed

Ca'rva'ka who had a materialistic philosophy. The Ca'rva'ka school of

philosophy believes in Caturbhu'ta or the four fundamental factors. This is

also known as Deha'tmava'da, that is, the belief that the body is everythin

g

and that the soul is identified with the body. This philosophy accepts

Caturbhu'ta, namely earth, water, fire and air or Ks'iti, ap, tejas and

marut respectively. According to Ca'rva'ka, Caetanya or Conscious came into

existence by the combination of the four bhu'tas in the same way as the

mixing of lime and catechu produces a red colour. According to Ca'rva'ka,

Paincabhu'ta or the fifth factor is formed in this way and does not actuall

y

exist. Ca'rva'ka philosophy does not believe in A'tman, Parama'tman and the

Vedas and hence Ca'rva'ka was termed Na'stika, since those who do not

believe in A'tman, Parama'tman or the Vedas are called Na'stika ([a]theist)

..

Pu'rva Mima'm'sa' school of philosophy also does not admit the existence of

Parama'tman. Kapila, the propounder of the Sa'mkhya philosophy, accepted

A'tman and the Vedas, but he did not believe in Parama'tman. The

Sar'adarshana or the six major school of theistic Indian Philosophy believe

in the Vedas. The following are the six schools of philosophy.

(1) Kapila Sa'm'khya which accepts the existence of Prakrti and the Vedas

but does not accept Parama'tman.

(2) Pa'tainjala Sa'm'khya which believes in innumerable Purus'as and one

Prakrti. The creator of the universe according to this school cannot be a

Mukta Purusa or a liberated being.

(3) Gaotama Nya'ya philosophy.

(4) Kan'a'da's Nya'ya philosophy or Vaeshes'ika.

(5) Jaemini's Pu'rva Miima'msa' or early Miima'msa' philosophy which

believes in Kriya'kanda or the doctrine of action. Those who believe in thi

s

school accept the existence of heaven and hell.

(6) Utta'ra Miima'msa' or later Miima'msa' philosophy propounded by

Va'dra'yana' Vya'sa believes in Brahma and the vedas but does not believe i

n

A'tman and Jagat or the world. This philosophy is commonly known as Vedanta

philosophy.

The Buddhist philosophy believes in all the five bhu'tas or fundamental

factors while Ca'rva'ka believes in Caturbhu'ta or four fundamental factors

..

Baoddha Darshana and Ca'rva'ka philosophy do come under the purview of

S'ar'adarshana, and neither of them believe in the Vedas. They are atheisti

c

philosophies.

Prama'na or validity is of three kinds, that is, Pratyaks'a or direct

knowledge, anuma'na or inference and a'gama or authority. Ca'rva'ka accepts

only pratyaks'a as prama'na.

Pratyaks'aeka prama'n'ava'ditaya' anuma'na'de

Anaungiika'rena prama'n'ya'bha'vat."

"Pratyaks'a or perception is the only source of knowledge, and inference

(An'uma'na) and authority (A'gama) are not to be recognized as sources of

knowledge."

Buddha accepts karmaphala or the reactions of actions, whereas

Ca'rva'ka does not.

Ya'vajjiivam'sukham' jiivam' na'sti mrtyuragocarah.

Ya'vajjiivet sukham jiivet Rn'am'krta' [ghrtam'] pivet.

Na svargo na pavargo va' naeva'tma pa'ralaokikam.

Bhasmiibhu'tasya dehasya purnara'gamanam' kutah.

"As long as you live, you should live in joy and happiness for we do not

know what happens after death. As long as one lives in the world, one shoul

d

live in comfort and happiness. One should even eat clarified butter (ghee)

by incurring debts, for there is neither heaven nor the reactions of

actions, nor A'tman or Soul, nor the world beyond death. After the body is

cremated how can it be reborn again?

There is another aspect of Ca'rva'ka philosophy, Dehaparina'ma'va'da.* (i.

e.

The death of body signifies the end of everything).

Caturbhyokhalu bhu'tebhyo caetanyamupaja'yate.

Kin'va'dibhyoh sametebhyo dravyebhyo madashaktivat."

In this respect Buddhist philosophy is superior to Ca'rva'ka philosophy.

Bhagavan Buddha says, At'ta' hii at'ta'nam na'thah.

Buddhism

Why did India accept Buddhism? There are various reasons for this and the

main ones are as follows. First, the scholars of that time never preached

philosophy to the common people. They hated the language of the common

people and called it Bha'kha'. Secondly, at that time there was no

Tattvadarshii or eminent philosopher. Thirdly, the people in general were

not ready to accept the pandits or scholars. Fourthly, the A'ca'ryas of tha

t

age, Shrii Sainjaya and Shrii Gaya' Kashyapa, could not convince Buddha. Al

l

these factors led to the wide propagation and acceptance of Buddhism.

Buddhism believes in rebirth and transmigration of souls, so the question

arises: Who is reborn if there is no A'tman? This question became a point of

controversy among the Bhikkus (monks) and later among the Maha'ya'nii

scholars.

Buddhism believes in Karmaphala or the reaction of actions. If karmaphala i

s

accepted, the question arises: who performs karma or action and who gets th

e

karmaphala? Therefore, the existence of A'tman has got to be

recognized.

Towards the end of Buddha's life some of his disciples asked Buddha about

the existence of God. They asked two questions: "Does God exist?" and "Is i

t

a fact that God does not exist?" In reply to both questions Buddha remained

silent. As Buddha remained silent to both the questions some of his

disciples interpreted this to mean that there is no God. Another section of

disciples understood that God exists. Yet a third section came forward with

the interpretation that there is God, but God is beyond the expression of

'Asti' and 'na'sti' or "is" and "is not"; that is, God's existence is

inexplicable. Actually God is supramental.

Yato va'co nivartante apra'pya manasa'saha,

A'nandam' brahmano vidva' ma' vibheti kutahcanah.

There are four sections in Buddhist philosophy -- Pratyaks'a Va'hya

Vastuva'da or Soutan'trika Darshana, Anumeya Va'hya-vastuva'da or

Vaebha's'ika Darshana, Sarvashu'nyava'da or Ma'dhyamika Darshana and

Ks'an'ika Vijina'nava'da or Baoddha Yoga'ca'ra.

Pratyaks'a Va'hyavastuva'da accepts the universe as infinite, that is,

ana'dii and ananta or beginningless and infinite when Caetanya or

Consciousness becomes a'layiibhu'ta or objectivated then it becomes jina'na

..

The outer world is transitory but due to rapid movement (Saincara or

Prati-saincara: extroversion or introversion) it appears to exist

constantly. (According to Hindu philosophy Saincara means "to go away from

Brahma and Pratisaincara meanss "to come near to Brahma," that is Saincara

means the Vikars'anii Shakti of Brahma and Prati-saincara means the

A'kars'anii Shakti of Brahma).

Anumeyava'hya Vastuva'da accepts the waves of Jina'na as a permanent entity

(satta'). There is the external world but the world will never be realised.

When the waves of consciousness (Jina'na) come, the mind takes a form

according to the Sam'ska'ras or potential reactions of past actions of the

Citta or mental plate. Formations created in the mind are taken to be Satya

or veracity. When Jina'na comes in contact with A'lambana or desideratum,

Citta takes a form: it takes the outward a'lambana as the object realised.

Sarvashu'nyava'da is also called Ma'dhyamika Darshana and was propounded by

Shriina'ga'rjuna. He did not accept the pa'incabhaotika world or the world

of the five fundamental factors. The external world which we see is Ma'ya'

or illusion. This philosophy is similar to Sham'kara's philosophy, Brahma

Satyam jagatmithya'. According to Sham'kara the universe has been created

out of nothing and is like a dream, nothing more. Bha'va' i.e. something ha

s

been created out of Abha'va' i.e. nothing. This school of philosophy accept

s

only the present and ignores the past and the future. It also says that the

universe will merge into nothing.

Ks'an'ika-vijina'nava'da does not admit the physical world: here everything

is internal. Even a'lambana is internal. Whatever is seen in this physical

world is pratikriya' or the outer projection of internal a'lambana. A'tman

is the collection of the 'I' feelings. It is not a continuous flow but

appears to be so on account of the quick succession of its creation and

destruction.

During the age of Bhagava'n Sham'kara'ca'rya there was no outstanding

philosopher (tattvadras't'a) among the Buddhists. Among different sections

of the Buddhist schools of philosophy a serious dispute was going on. At

that time Shrii Manadana Mishra was the only scholar who believed in Sarva

Shu'nyava'da or complete nihilism and he was also a Kriya' Ka'n'dii or

follower of the path of action. He debated with Sham'kara'ca'rya and was

defeated.

According to Buddhist philosophy there are four noble truths (Satya) which

are called Caturajja satya. They are as follows:

(1) Duhkha or sorrow

(2) Ka'ran'a of duhkha or the cause of sorrow

(3) Nivrtti of duhkha or the cessation of sorrow

(4) Upa'ya of duhkha nivritti or the means of the cessation of sorrow.

The Vikrti or distortion of the Duhkhava'da or the school of pessimism

became Atisukhava'da or ultra-hedonism. Atisukhava'da was prevalent in

Bengal, Assam and Tibet.

According to Buddhism, duhkha is A'rya Satya or the absolute truth. This is

a wrong interpretation as it is only the Ma'nas or mind which experiences

dukha. Dukha can thus be only a relative truth but it cannot be an absolute

truth

[sham'kara's Philosophy]

Sham'kara'ca'rya was a Shaeva Tantrika or a practitioner of Tantra who

followed Shiva, and that is why he did not go against Tantrava'da or the

doctrine of Tantra. He believed in Nirgun'a Brahma or the non-qualified

Supreme Entity only. His theories to some extent fall in line with the

theories of the Baoddha Shun'yava'da or the Buddhist nihilists. He did not

believe in the existence of jagat or the physical world. He accepted

Gun'a'nvita Ma'ya'va'da or the doctrine of qualified illusion. Due to his

influence Buddhist Tantra disappeared. In Hindu Tantra, gods and goddesses

still remained. Even today the common people worship the goddesses of

Buddhist Tantra like Ta'ra', Manasa' (the goddess of snakes) Shiitala',

Ba'rahii etc. out of devotion.

Shunyava'da was very influential during the time Shrii Sham'kara'ca'rya

preached. Shrii Sham'kara'ca'rya accepted Utta'ra Miima'm'sa' as later

Miima'm'sa' philosophy propounded by Shrii Va'dara'yana Vya'sa.

Shrii Sham'kara'ca'rya discussed the following subjects with Buddhist

philosophers. The Shu'n'yava'diis said that the universe came out of nothin

g

and will go into nothing, that everything is a dream. This was questioned b

y

Sham'kara who said that even if the universe is nothing or a dreamland,

there should be someone who witnessed the dream. The Shu'nyava'diis replied

that there was no dreamer. The universe is an illusion just as a rope

mistaken for a snake is an illusion. Sham'kara said, that could not be

possible. The Shu'nyava'diis replied that this could only be understood by

Sa'dhana' while Sham'kara said that it was not possible to have a dream

without a dreamer. If the universe is an illusion like mistaking a rope for

a snake, there had to be something like a rope which could be mistaken for

the universe. Without a rope it would be impossible to mistake it for a

snake. Besides this there must be a person to make the mistake. Similarly,

there must be someone to experience the illusion of the universe. This mean

s

that there must be some other entity to experience it. Ma'dhyamika said tha

t

nothing does not mean actually nothing (Shu'nya). What you call Brahma we

call nothing. So the illusion of the universe is Brahma. That is,

Yatha' shu'nya va'dina'm' shu'nym

Brahma Brahmavida'm'statha'.

"What Brahma is to the Brahmava'diis, Shu'nya or nothing is to the

Shu'nyava'dins".

Sham'kara replied that this means that the one who sees and the object whic

h

is seen are both illusion. Where there is no one to see, who will mistake

the rope for snake? The Shunyavadiis could not give any explanation for

this. The Kshanikavadiis -- those who believed in the doctrine of transienc

e

-- explanation of Sham'kara's questions was that the illusion is always

Ks'anika or transient. Sham'kara's point was that he believed that Brahma

was ana'di and ananta but that Ks'an'a comes in a moment and disappears the

very next moment. Thus where does the Ks'anika entity come from? Something

must exist between the span of creation and the span destruction. The

Ks'anikava'diis replied that it is destroyed with the creation, but

Sham'kara replied that this shows that there is no existence. The

Ks'an'ikava'diis felt defeated but they still replied that existence was

negligible. This was not a satisfactory explanation. The scholars of the

Pratyaks'a Va'hyavastuva'da and Anumeya Va'hyavastuva'da argued for their

philosophies but no one could withstand that questioning of Shamkaracarya,

hence all the four sections of Buddhism were defeated by Shrii Sham'kara. O

n

defeat they made friends with Shrii Sham'kara and accepted Ku'lakun'd'alini

i

Tattva or the practice of raising the serpentine power in human beings, and

as a result Baoddha Yoga'ca'ra came into existence.

There are several defects in Sham'kara's philosophy. According to Shamkara

the universe is based on a fixed object by the illusion of Ma'ya', which is

called Brahma. There is an illusion of a snake for a rope. Now the question

arises, who has the illusion of a snake? One who already knows about snakes

..

If there is an illusion of the universe for Brahma it means that the real

universe is somewhere else. Thus the theory Brahma satyam jagatmithya is

defective. This is a wrong interpretation given by Sham'kara. The Buddhists

did not question it and hence it was accepted at the time.

Sham'kara does not believe in jiiva and jagat. Thus the question arises, fo

r

what reason does the illusion exist?

As'ta'kula'cala'h saptasamudra'h

Brahmapurandara dinakara rudrah.

Na tvam na' ham na' yam lokah

Vyartha kimartham kriyate shokah.

"The eight mountains, the seven seas, the creation, Brahma', the sun, and

the god of death, neither you, nor I, nor this world the are all

non-existent. Why should you lament for something non-existent?"

The universe has not been created and hence there is no Sagun'a Brahma or

Qualified Supreme Entity. Sham'kara believed only in Nirgun'a Brahma or the

non-qualified Supreme entity. Sham'kara said that the universe is like a

dream and the dreamer is also Brahma, as he did not believe in jiiva. When

Brahma is Nirgun'a how could Sham'kara see, as seeing is a quality? But thi

s

was also forgotten by Shamkara.

Again, according to Sham'kara's philosophy what is seen and experienced is

all due to the influence of Ma'ya'. This means Ma'ya' is also an entity

which Advaetavada or monism cannot accept.

Sham'kara's philosophy believes in the necessity of sa'dhana', but who will

perform the Sa'dhana' when the existence of jiiva is not accepted?

When Brahma is ana'di and ananta, why should Brahma be influenced by Ma'ya'

?

Secondly, when the universe is created by the influence of Ma'ya', how is i

t

that Brahma remains Nirguna? Ma'ya' is a greater force than Brahma as it

influences Brahma!

In addition, Sham'kara says that there is nothing exactly like Ma'ya' as it

is an illusion. A person in the desert sees water, houses, and trees etc.

from a distance but there is actually nothing. In the absence of Jina'na th

e

person experiences an illusion. When there is Vika'ra or distortion in

Brahma, how can the universe be an illusion?

Sham'kara says where there is Brahma there is Ma'ya'. Then the question

arises , is Ma'ya' nothing? If there is no Ma'ya', how can it influence

Brahma? To overcome this Sham'kara says that it is not even nothing. It is

inexplicable (anirvacaniiya). Again the question arises as to who created

Ma'ya' if Brahma did not create it. Then Ma'ya' becomes Saguna Brahma.

Sham'kara was able to defeat Buddhist philosophers only by a display of

words. The Ma'ya' of Sham'kara is not the Prakrti of Ananda Marga.

One of the great critics of Sham'kara philosophy was Jayanta Bhatta, the

propounder Nya'ya Manjari philosophy.

Ka'pil Sam'khya and Pa'ta'injal Yoga

The common features of these two philosophies include the following:

(1) Both believe in the existence of many Purus'as.

(2) Both believe that the universe is created by Prakrti for the

satisfaction of these Purus'as. This is not logical as no bhoga or

satisfaction is possible without the existence of mind. Purus'as do not hav

e

mind and they cannot be satisfied by the creation of the universe by

Prakrti.

(3) Both believe that Prakrti is not within Purus'a but is a separate

Entity. This is also illogical since Prakrti is only energy or the shakti o

f

Purus'a, and like the dahika shakti or burning facility of agni or fire, it

cannot be a separate entity. These philosophies are called Dvaetava'dii or

dualistic because they believe in two separate entities of Purus'a and

Prakrti.

(4) In Sa'm'khya there is no god and thus it is called Niriishwarava'da or

atheism, while Pa'tainjala philosophy believes in God but does not believe

in Brahma. This is therefore called Seshvarava'da or theism.

(5) Idol worship is supported by both these philosophies.

A'rya Sama'ja

(1) It believes that jiiva, jagat and Brahma are all ana'di. This only show

s

that jiiva and jagat do not need any further entity like Brahma and all the

three alike are ana'di. This is unacceptable as this leaves no necessity fo

r

sa'dhana' or spiritual practice which is the Dharma or essential duty of

every jiiva or human being. This also does not explain the reason for actio

n

and progress in the universe.

(2) It believes in yajinas or sacrifices not as karma or action but as a fo

r

of worship. Yajina means karma but in A'rya Sama'ja it means offering to

agni or fire in a particular form. There is no rational meaning in

performing such Yajinas.

(3) They also believe in pralaya or dissolution which is also irrational,

since jiiva and jagat are ana'di and as such there is no place for pralaya.

Marxism

(1) It believes in equality between human beings which is only theoretical

and not possible in practice because no two individuals are alike, hence

they cannot be equal.

(2) This faith finds its field in the exploitation of poverty and hence it

can only thrive in poverty-stricken areas.

(3) It has no tolerance for other religions or organisations.

(4) Its goal is purely imaginary equality.

(5) This faith exists on violence only.

Besides these, the following three groups belong to the Semitic [faith] --

Muslims, Christians and Jews.

1957, Jamalpur

Ta'ttvika Praveshika'

Another artical:

Here is another quotation about Patainjali from Namah

Shivaya Shantaya:

Long after the Samkhya philosophy was propounded, another great

philosopher was born in Rarh - Maharshi Patanjali. He took special

care to correct some of the basic defects of the Samkhya philosopy

but in some matters he lagged behind. His school of philosophy, whichis popularly known as Patainjala Yoga, Yoga Sutram or Seshvara

Samkhya,

is an eloquent testimony to his high degree of intellect

and erudition. Some aspects of

the philosophy were explained in a very

psychological way, but it lacked

the detailed analysis of Kapila's

SaB4mB4khya. Another positive aspect

of Patain?jali's philosophy was

that it accepted the existence

of the all-controlling Iishvara and

provided spiritual aspirants valuable

guidelines for their intuitional

practice. But a most glaring defect

was that it failed to demarcate

the relation between the jiivas

[living beings] and Iishvara, the

Supreme Controller of the universe.

Moreover, it did not explain

clearly and conclusively how Iishvara

exercises His supreme authority

in controlling the universe, nor

why people should practise yoga, why

they should try to suspend all

their psychic propensities, etc.

Thus the fundamental difference

between Shiva and the Iishvara of

Patanjali's philosophy is obvious.

Shiva looked upon all the living

beings of the universe as His loving

children. He raised them with

loving care and, at the end of

their physical existence, pulled them

onto His affectionate lap. Not

even a hint of the glory and sweetness

Patainjala Yoga is a dull and dry school of yogic discipline; it

does not make the yogi's heart

ever-fresh and ever-green. And unless

the heart of a yogi is fresh and

tender, the seed of devotion,

although sown in time, does not

sprout. Without that blissful flow of

devotion which vibrates and inspires

living beings to attain the

highest spiritual realization,

the PaB4tain?jala school of philosophy

could not create a large group

of devotees, a HariparimanB4dB4ala

[circle of people around the Lord].

Not only the gods are fond of the

fragrance of flowers; devotees also

it has no value for a devotee. One should remember that the fragrance

of a flower and the tender sweetness

of a devotional heart together

make a perfect combination. What

does the perfume of the flower

represent? The worldly activity

which a devotee does with a heart

filled with love is the perfume

of the flower, and the overflowing

devotion for one's Ista is the

tender sweetness in the devotee's

heart. With these two together,

the devotee makes a garland. Now, if

there are fragrant flowers, but

there is no sweetness in the devotee's

heart, then the devotee cannot

make a garland for his or her IsB4tB4a -

then there is no question of garlanding

Him at all, and though the

flower basket may be full of flowers,

they wither with the pain of

emptiness and the agony of unfulfilled

yearning. Then if the Beloved

does not accept the garland, what

is the use of holding the basket

full of flowers and crying -

Bhara saji ki go

He mor Devata

Emni bhariya rabe.

[O beloved Lord,

Will my basket of flowers

Ever remain full?]

The Patainjala philosophy may have

accepted Shiva as Iishvara, but

certainly did not accept Him as

the Lord of the heart. This was indeed

a great injustice to Shiva, because

He was the Supreme Lord of the

human heart. The glory of Shiva

is not properly reflected in the light

of Patainjala Yoga philosophy.

How, indeed, can it be reflected?

Compared to the dazzling brilliance

of Shiva's effulgence, the dim

light of the Patainjala philosophy

is fainter than that of a

glow-worm.

Shiva in the Light of Philosophy

(Discourse 17 (continued))

Published in:

Namah Shivaya Shantaya

~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

M> And about anger... Even Śhiva Himself is getting angry sometimes.....

You are not SHIVA yet. But you will become

.

In Him

Trilokesh

February 12, 2007

Namaskaram!

Thanks for the letter, good job, he he, very good :-) We finally have some discussion on the list, anyone would like to join? :-D

I'll answer your letter in the next two days :-)

Hara Śhiva Hara Śhiva Hara Hara Śhiva Śhiva!

Om Śrii Śhivaaya Namah!

Mariici

-

Tadeusz Majewski

Sunday, February 11, 2007 7:48 PM

Re: {LAYA-YOGA-CHAKRAS}>OM: need advise & guidance

Namaskar Dear Mariici

M > I see your ignorance is deeper than I even thought :-)))Childish respond. No comments.M > Your anger and fight against religious, devotional approach could be called a fanaticism, indeed :-)Baseless accusations. No commentsM > it could spread your horizon about differences of individuals. Autobiography of Yogi' could be good beginning for you, he he, to learn more about PATH OF DEVOTION (BHAKTI).True Devotion is based on Viveka (spiritual discrimination )Understanding what is real and what is unreal and ability to select the proper path is theessence of yogic practice. I agree with you that "Autobiography of Yogi ' is a very inspirationalbook which I read on many occasions, and reader takes the wisdom from his pages based onindividual understanding. The actual teachings are between the sentences. It looks you missed those.:-)

M > Where rationality and mind (ego) ends, there yoga, and spiritual path start, as they are based more on BLIND BELIEVE and TRUST to the Guru rather then on one's limited mind and its rationality... TRUST AND BELIEVE to living Guru are something unimaginable for people of the West, but natural for people of the East, and necessary on spiritual path I agree and support the principal of Surrender and Trust to the Guru. But true Master, Satguru want you to evaluate and test His qualities. He wants you to accept Him by merits of His Universal Love, Omnipotent Wisdom, Tolerance and Compassion. He don't needblind followers. He wants devotee free from inferiority or superiority complex. He wants Jiva becoming Shiva. He wants allof living beings to realize their true nature by sadhana. service and sacrifice, but with critical and open minded approach.Blind followers are dangerous to themselves and others. The true Devotion is based on trust , evolved throughout the practiceand constant evaluation. This is why Jinana Yogis or Karma Yogis must embrace Bhatki Yoga as the Supreme Path throughrealization and not the imposition. There is a big difference between "Mahasatguru worship" and distorted by misunderstanding "idol worship" One brings you to the emancipation and salvation ( Moksa and Mukti ), the other one to the bondage of the Prakrtii. Tantric scriptures very clearly shows this difference. Below are few examples:About Patanjali and idol worship: