Kali: a concern that recently came up, socioculturally.

[Guest guest]

Hello,

 

I recently talked to an Indian-American at the university. I asked her, out of

curiosity and out of getting more personal experiences from others, if her

family ever talked about Kali. She said that Kali was the " evil destroyer

force. " This sort of bothered me, not because I thought the same, but that it

raised the question of whether or not there existed Hindus who actually did

promote the " evil Kali " theme that from what I understand, many of those of the

Sanatana Dharma have been trying to dispel through educating others.

 

I always found Kali, though fierce in appearance, to be the goddess of

liberation, as she destroys demons and restores order to the many worlds and

universes by destroying the source of evil and the ego. I only found her to

only be harsh to those who approach her selfishly, out of a means to humble them

and make them keep the ego at bay.

 

Any thoughts on the matter?

 

Jai Ma!

 

 

Sincerely,

Christina H.

[Guest guest]

Evil is due to self cherishing over other cherishing. That is, placing

oneself over others, instead of equally. Thus Kali - the Black Goddess sees

no differences, so all are her children. Thus, she will bash your head in if

you're a total putz. And since she is the true sole refuge you really have

no other options. Oh sure some people worship Jesus, Buddha, etc, but it's

all Kali.

 

There are no evil

Kali cults. That would be like putting you hand in the garbage disposal when

it's running.

 

Yes, if you're a typical okay person then Kali is very generous and warm and

since she is colorblind she really doesn't judge. But if you're wreaking

havoc on others, or even on yourself, then feel her wrath. It is

inescapable. But again, so long as you're merely okay as a human, then she

is behind you.

 

 

-

<IlluminatedCelestial

 

Wednesday, November 07, 2007 9:51 AM

Kali: a concern that recently came up,

socioculturally.

 

 

> Hello,

>

> I recently talked to an Indian-American at the university. I asked her,

> out of curiosity and out of getting more personal experiences from others,

> if her family ever talked about Kali. She said that Kali was the " evil

> destroyer force. " This sort of bothered me, not because I thought the

> same, but that it raised the question of whether or not there existed

> Hindus who actually did promote the " evil Kali " theme that from what I

> understand, many of those of the Sanatana Dharma have been trying to

> dispel through educating others.

>

> I always found Kali, though fierce in appearance, to be the goddess of

> liberation, as she destroys demons and restores order to the many worlds

> and universes by destroying the source of evil and the ego. I only found

> her to only be harsh to those who approach her selfishly, out of a means

> to humble them and make them keep the ego at bay.

>

> Any thoughts on the matter?

>

> Jai Ma!

>

>

> Sincerely,

> Christina H.

[Guest guest]

Just a few thoughts.

 

I have had numerous conversations with the large number of Indian born nurses I

have worked with over the years in hospitals in America. Being a longtime

devotee of Sanatana Dharma and a Western Neopagan I sought understanding of how

S D figured in the daily life of those who had been raised in India. [....]

 

I must say that I was quite surprised to find that many of these folks were

practicing christians [....]

 

I am happy to say that I have also had the privilege to know many native Indians

in the US who are practitioners of Santana Dharma who have helped me understand

that many people from India have been indoctrinated from birth that the western

" ideal " is somehow better than the richness of their native culture.

 

We all chose our path through our incarnations. I much prefer one that accepts

another's expression without " demonizing " that which is different.

 

Namaste

Cliff

 

-

IlluminatedCelestial

Wednesday, November 07, 2007 7:51 AM

Kali: a concern that recently came up,

socioculturally.

 

 

Hello,

 

I recently talked to an Indian-American at the university. I asked her, out of

curiosity and out of getting more personal experiences from others, if her

family ever talked about Kali. She said that Kali was the " evil destroyer

force. " This sort of bothered me, not because I thought the same, but that it

raised the question of whether or not there existed Hindus who actually did

promote the " evil Kali " theme that from what I understand, many of those of the

Sanatana Dharma have been trying to dispel through educating others.

 

I always found Kali, though fierce in appearance, to be the goddess of

liberation, as she destroys demons and restores order to the many worlds and

universes by destroying the source of evil and the ego. I only found her to only

be harsh to those who approach her selfishly, out of a means to humble them and

make them keep the ego at bay.

 

Any thoughts on the matter?

 

Jai Ma!

 

Sincerely,

Christina H.

 

 

 

 

 

 

[Guest guest]

Here's a related news article: it's about a group

staging a protest against folk beliefs in " black magic "

(as practiced by " Tantriks " .)

 

So here we see repeated the relatively common Northern

Indian association of Tantra with " black magic " , along with

an attempt to disassociate " black magic " from the observance

of Kali Chaudas.

 

The regional differences in beliefs are interesting, to say

the least.

 

Blindfolded bikers [scooter drivers] preach people against

superstition in Gujarat

 

By Devesh

DailyIndia.com

Porbander, Gujarat

Nov. 8, 2007

 

Members of a social awareness forum on Thursday took out a

rally of blindfolded motorists to dispel superstitions related to

observing Kali Chaudas, the 14th day of Ashwin month of Hindu

calendar, devoted to the worship of Goddess Maha Kali.

 

About a hundred members of the Bharat Jan Vigyan Jatha, a

local voluntary organisation, covered their eyes with a piece of

cloth to draw public attention towards prevailing blind faith and

myths related to " Kali Chaudas " observed on the eve of Diwali.

 

" Today, we organised a rally in our city, which was basically

meant to dispel all the blind beliefs regarding Kali Chaudas. Our

blindfolded and masked members rode on scooters. We want to

show that the stories of black spirit and ghosts are all myths, "

asserted Jaichand Pandya, Chairman, Bharat Jan Vigyan Jatha.

 

Organisers enlightened the people to realise as to what is

theology and not to confuse it with hoodwinking tricksters who

spread superstitious ideas in the society.

 

Many individuals take part in yajna and Siddhi rituals performed

by Tantriks (sorcerers) at crematoria at midnight on the

contention of controlling spirits and gaining supernatural powers.

 

" I don't believe in any kind of magic. And that is why I

participated in this rally to educate my peers to dispel their fears

and irrational belief regarding the festival. Riding bikes

blindfolded is no magic, it is just a technique. " said Sweta

Shringala, a participant in the rally.

 

Kali Chaudas is a day devoted to the worship of Goddess Maha

Kali. It is believed that on this day Kali killed the wicked

Raktavija. Also referred to as Narak-Chaturdashi, Kali Chaudas

is day to abolish laziness and evil which create hell in our life and

shine light on life.

 

http://www.dailyindia.com/show/189809.php/Blindfolded-

bikers-preach-people-against-superstition-in-Gujarat

 

 

, <IlluminatedCelestial

wrote:

>

> Hello,

>

> I recently talked to an Indian-American at the university. I asked

her, out of curiosity and out of getting more personal experiences

from others, if her family ever talked about Kali. She said that

Kali was the " evil destroyer force. " [....]

[Guest guest]

Just my own knowledge and experience which stand to be corrected.

 

Goddess kali has an interesting nature. in her dimension, it is

absolute neutrality.

 

Wrong and right, good and bad does not exist. She gives all and takes

all. She is like a sword. A sword is neutral object . The sword is

handed to you. Good and bad is in your hands. Its your decision to use her to

seek liberation or to create havoc with

her powers.

 

She is divinely compassionate, protective, all encompassing and

very, very nice and sweet despite her appearance. She comes in

whichever way you call her. She forgives readily as she knows that

people are capable of all kinds of crap.

 

She wants you to be spiritually enlightened and protect

and nourish her creations. She does not want you to do cheap magic

for destruction.

 

Its not common for one to abuse her powers. Since one is the judge

and jury of their own actions, negative karmic consequences is

cultivated if one chooses the dark path.

 

If you really piss her off then you are asking for trouble.

 

There are many so called gurus and practitioners of the dark arts who

use her powers for their own selfish needs. Eventually these

individuals who goes against the ways of the universe may find

themselves stuck in some pitfall. That's when she bashes their head

up.

 

 

 

 

, <IlluminatedCelestial

wrote:

>

> Hello,

>

> I recently talked to an Indian-American at the university. I asked

her, out of curiosity and out of getting more personal experiences

from others, if her family ever talked about Kali. She said that

Kali was the " evil destroyer force. " [....]

[Guest guest]

I guess it is a matter of also how people view what good and evil is.

 

From what I understand, evil is selfishness, ignorance, greed, and the things

that do harm to more than other options available...for lack of better words.

 

In a way, one could say Kali created good and evil since she is Devi, and Devi

is the children of all. But at the same time, I always understood God/dess to

be the one to come in to the Material World as an incarnation to correct wrongs,

which I thought was one of the themes of the Devi Mahatmya.

 

I will agree though that literal destruction is neither good nor evil, but just

is; but I also know that usually destruction in the case of Kali meant the

destruction of the ego. At the same time, though, I could also see the aspect

of dying at the appropriate time to be relieved from the burdens of the external

world. I suppose I try to look at as many aspects as I can in these things.

Intent and context plays a role in determining what is " good " and " evil. " The

Sanatana Dharma does not seem one to generally involve dualism (though some

branches might exist that do), but from my limited knowledge, there still

existed something affront to the dharma, so in a way an evil is there, just not

in the same sense as...say, Judeo-Christian faiths. Not to single any other

religion out, and I have nothing against Christianity, but it was an example

that I think many would know about.

 

I also stand to be corrected. And I thank everyone who has given feedback so

far.

 

 

Jai Ma!

 

Sincerely,

Christina H.

 

On a note: The article you posted msbauju was very enlightening and interesting.

Thank you for sharing it with us.

 

---- Tulasi <thundergod999 wrote:

> Just my own knowledge and experience which stand to be corrected.

>

> Goddess kali has an interesting nature. in her dimension, it is

> absolute neutrality.

>

> Wrong and right, good and bad does not exist. She gives all and takes

> all. She is like a sword. A sword is neutral object . The sword is

> handed to you. Good and bad is in your hands. Its your decision to use her to

seek liberation or to create havoc with

> her powers.

>

> She is divinely compassionate, protective, all encompassing and

> very, very nice and sweet despite her appearance. She comes in

> whichever way you call her. She forgives readily as she knows that

> people are capable of all kinds of crap.

>

> She wants you to be spiritually enlightened and protect

> and nourish her creations. She does not want you to do cheap magic

> for destruction.

>

> Its not common for one to abuse her powers. Since one is the judge

> and jury of their own actions, negative karmic consequences is

> cultivated if one chooses the dark path.

>

> If you really piss her off then you are asking for trouble.

>

> There are many so called gurus and practitioners of the dark arts who

> use her powers for their own selfish needs. Eventually these

> individuals who goes against the ways of the universe may find

> themselves stuck in some pitfall. That's when she bashes their head

> up.

>

>

>

>

> , <IlluminatedCelestial

> wrote:

> >

> > Hello,

> >

> > I recently talked to an Indian-American at the university. I asked

> her, out of curiosity and out of getting more personal experiences

> from others, if her family ever talked about Kali. She said that

> Kali was the " evil destroyer force. " [....]