Guest guest Posted November 2, 2009 Report Share Posted November 2, 2009 jai gurudev dear kulasundariji, in kula ie shaiva there r many branches,like kapalika,aghora, veershaiva,etc maybe 6-8 or more. in kaula,there r atleast 2 major branches : kaali kul and shreekul the subject and matter is very deep indeed and i am not fully knowledgable.but i will try to say a few humble words in service to maa adi shakti lalita tripura sundari. in dash mahavidya sadhana this is clearly demarcated. although both kaalikul and shreekul both worship the same divine mother adi shakti lalita tripura sundari,there r some differences in worship of deity etc and also different deities of the 10 mahavidya r worshipped in both. even in 10 mahavidya,some schools say there r 18 mahavidya and include mother kamahska as a mahavidya, and also there r many upmahavidyas like 15 nityas, 8-16 matrikas,etc... some schools say both cannot be worshipped together some say both can be worshipped together. for more details,u can study some tantra books like mantra mahodadhi,etc.... om shakti gopal On 11/2/09, Kulasundari Devi <sundari wrote: > > > > Hello all, > > I was wondering if anyone had thoughts or insight into kaula vs. kula as > descriptive terms. They get used a lot and I read recently that kaula is > Shaiva (i.e. Abhinavagupta) and kula is Shakta (i.e. Kalikula), and my > experience has reflected this, but I know that there's some amount of > contention. If anyone has additional knowledge/resources/literary sources > about the use of these terms, I would be interested to hear more. I've > already read the Wikipedia entry and a few other basic resources... > > Thank you! > > Jai MA kamesvari > -kulasundari > > Sri Kamakhya Mahavidya Mandir > www.kamakhyamandir.org > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted November 2, 2009 Report Share Posted November 2, 2009 Dear Gopal, Thanks for your response - it was helpful in articulating some of the things I'm already familiar with. Perhaps I'll read Mantra Mahodadhih again with this in mind. I've heard elsewhere that kaula & kula schools are totally separate (i.e. kaula is shaiva, kula has nothing to do with shaiva) and just wondering if there is any textual or historical basis for this, or even anecdotal evidence, that anyone knows about. jai MA kameswari -kulasundari Sri Kamakhya Mahavidya Mandir www.kamakhyamandir.org On Mon, Nov 2, 2009 at 1:39 AM, gopal narayan <gopalnarayan123wrote: > > > jai gurudev > > dear kulasundariji, > > in kula ie shaiva there r many branches,like kapalika,aghora, > veershaiva,etc maybe 6-8 or more. > > in kaula,there r atleast 2 major branches : > > kaali kul and shreekul > > the subject and matter is very deep indeed and i am > not fully knowledgable.but i will try to say a few > humble words in service to maa adi shakti lalita tripura sundari. > > in dash mahavidya sadhana this is clearly demarcated. > > although both kaalikul and shreekul both worship the same divine > mother adi shakti lalita tripura sundari,there r some differences > in worship of deity etc and also different deities of the 10 > mahavidya r worshipped in both. > > even in 10 mahavidya,some schools say there r 18 > mahavidya and include mother kamahska as a mahavidya, > and also there r many upmahavidyas like 15 nityas, > 8-16 matrikas,etc... > > some schools say both cannot be worshipped together > some say both can be worshipped together. > > for more details,u can study some tantra books > like mantra mahodadhi,etc.... > > om shakti > > gopal > > > On 11/2/09, Kulasundari Devi <sundari<sundari%40kamakhyamandir.org>> > wrote: > > > > > > > > Hello all, > > > > I was wondering if anyone had thoughts or insight into kaula vs. kula as > > descriptive terms. They get used a lot and I read recently that kaula is > > Shaiva (i.e. Abhinavagupta) and kula is Shakta (i.e. Kalikula), and my > > experience has reflected this, but I know that there's some amount of > > contention. If anyone has additional knowledge/resources/literary sources > > about the use of these terms, I would be interested to hear more. I've > > already read the Wikipedia entry and a few other basic resources... > > > > Thank you! > > > > Jai MA kamesvari > > -kulasundari > > > > Sri Kamakhya Mahavidya Mandir > > www.kamakhyamandir.org > > > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted November 3, 2009 Report Share Posted November 3, 2009 Dear friends, It is very interesting. I had not thought of Kaula and Kula as seperate, but this debate is now leading us to find out the roots. I know there is book " Koula Gnan Nirnaya " written by lord Matsendra Nath . He was a Great Saiva ,even Abhinava Gupta Acharya had a great respect for him. In spite of being a Saiva, he was the founder of Kamakhys Peetha of Sakti. And their philosophy was the union of Siva and Sakti. Siva is the potential energy and Sakti is the Kinetic Energy. The Kulakundalini Sakti to be moved up to join with Sahasrarara. This can be done in various methods. the shortest route is through Sakti sadhana. Since the route is very fast tract, the danger is also equally high, and as a result very few could achieve it. Most of the sadhakas failed in between. So Koula is Shiva and Kula is Sakti as I know from a study of Nath literature. In fact , apperently Kula and Kaula are seperate and having distinct identities, but when the join together and become one and the distinction vanishes. In view of this the Philosophy of Nathism is " Dwait-adwaita Bibajita " . If you are aware of more please share your knowledge with us. With regards. --- On Mon, 2/11/09, Kulasundari Devi <sundari wrote: Kulasundari Devi <sundari Re: kula vs kaula Monday, 2 November, 2009, 5:25 PM Dear Gopal, Thanks for your response - it was helpful in articulating some of the things I'm already familiar with. Perhaps I'll read Mantra Mahodadhih again with this in mind. I've heard elsewhere that kaula & kula schools are totally separate (i.e. kaula is shaiva, kula has nothing to do with shaiva) and just wondering if there is any textual or historical basis for this, or even anecdotal evidence, that anyone knows about. jai MA kameswari -kulasundari Sri Kamakhya Mahavidya Mandir www.kamakhyamandir. org On Mon, Nov 2, 2009 at 1:39 AM, gopal narayan <gopalnarayan123@ gmail.com>wrote: > > > jai gurudev > > dear kulasundariji, > > in kula ie shaiva there r many branches,like kapalika,aghora, > veershaiva,etc maybe 6-8 or more. > > in kaula,there r atleast 2 major branches : > > kaali kul and shreekul > > the subject and matter is very deep indeed and i am > not fully knowledgable. but i will try to say a few > humble words in service to maa adi shakti lalita tripura sundari. > > in dash mahavidya sadhana this is clearly demarcated. > > although both kaalikul and shreekul both worship the same divine > mother adi shakti lalita tripura sundari,there r some differences > in worship of deity etc and also different deities of the 10 > mahavidya r worshipped in both. > > even in 10 mahavidya,some schools say there r 18 > mahavidya and include mother kamahska as a mahavidya, > and also there r many upmahavidyas like 15 nityas, > 8-16 matrikas,etc. .. > > some schools say both cannot be worshipped together > some say both can be worshipped together. > > for more details,u can study some tantra books > like mantra mahodadhi,etc. ... > > om shakti > > gopal > > > On 11/2/09, Kulasundari Devi <sundari@kamakhyaman dir.org<sundari%40kamakhya mandir.org> > > wrote: > > > > > > > > Hello all, > > > > I was wondering if anyone had thoughts or insight into kaula vs. kula as > > descriptive terms. They get used a lot and I read recently that kaula is > > Shaiva (i.e. Abhinavagupta) and kula is Shakta (i.e. Kalikula), and my > > experience has reflected this, but I know that there's some amount of > > contention. If anyone has additional knowledge/resources /literary sources > > about the use of these terms, I would be interested to hear more. I've > > already read the Wikipedia entry and a few other basic resources... > > > > Thank you! > > > > Jai MA kamesvari > > -kulasundari > > > > Sri Kamakhya Mahavidya Mandir > > www.kamakhyamandir. org > > > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted November 3, 2009 Report Share Posted November 3, 2009 jai gurudev dear kulasundari, pls read saundarya lahiri,by lord adi shankaracharyaji.even in english its ok. pls read the first verse very carefully,u will know, that shakti is shiv and shiv is shakti.both r inseperable.and both dwell in us too in our 7 chakras as 7 shaktis and 7 rudras !!! this is the real truth,people percieve both as seperate or united,it is the wish or lord and maa,we can say it is theyr leela-play. we know that both r one,some see them as different,so it is their personal choice. we r follower of navnath tradition and lord gorakshnathji,and we see lord and maa as 1,and also we see lord,mother,guru,mantra yantra,and ourself as part of the whole,or rather only one. when this ekya oneness is established in our mind by grace of lord and mother and guru,that is real jeevan mukti ie - salvation when still alive. even by simply reading saundarya lahiri, one can get kundlaini awakening,such is the power of this poem to divine mother. for more info on kundalini u can visit this site : http://www.kheper.net/topics/chakras/Muladhara.htm u can do simple mantras to mother kundalini,and also awaken her. if u know hindi then u can read : rudrayamal tantra - uttar tantra. it gives great detail of the kundalini working,and also various armour - kavach,stotras,etc to each shakti and each rudra in detail. like root chakra the presiding deities : mother dakini and lord adinath crown chakra : mother nirvaanshakti and lord paramshiv i wud like to add : look at shivalingam.what do we see ??? we see the shivlingam and the yoni below,ie it is also symbol of shiv and shakti. its a symbol of mother tripurasundari on top,and lord shiv as her asana. finally,lord ardhanarishwar is also symbol of shik-shakti. om shakti gopal om shakti gopal On 11/2/09, Kulasundari Devi <sundari wrote: > > > > Dear Gopal, > > Thanks for your response - it was helpful in articulating some of the > things > I'm already familiar with. Perhaps I'll read Mantra Mahodadhih again with > this in mind. > > I've heard elsewhere that kaula & kula schools are totally separate (i.e. > kaula is shaiva, kula has nothing to do with shaiva) and just wondering if > there is any textual or historical basis for this, or even anecdotal > evidence, that anyone knows about. > > jai MA kameswari > -kulasundari > > Sri Kamakhya Mahavidya Mandir > www.kamakhyamandir.org > > On Mon, Nov 2, 2009 at 1:39 AM, gopal narayan <gopalnarayan123<gopalnarayan123%40gmail.com> > >wrote: > > > > > > > jai gurudev > > > > dear kulasundariji, > > > > in kula ie shaiva there r many branches,like kapalika,aghora, > > veershaiva,etc maybe 6-8 or more. > > > > in kaula,there r atleast 2 major branches : > > > > kaali kul and shreekul > > > > the subject and matter is very deep indeed and i am > > not fully knowledgable.but i will try to say a few > > humble words in service to maa adi shakti lalita tripura sundari. > > > > in dash mahavidya sadhana this is clearly demarcated. > > > > although both kaalikul and shreekul both worship the same divine > > mother adi shakti lalita tripura sundari,there r some differences > > in worship of deity etc and also different deities of the 10 > > mahavidya r worshipped in both. > > > > even in 10 mahavidya,some schools say there r 18 > > mahavidya and include mother kamahska as a mahavidya, > > and also there r many upmahavidyas like 15 nityas, > > 8-16 matrikas,etc... > > > > some schools say both cannot be worshipped together > > some say both can be worshipped together. > > > > for more details,u can study some tantra books > > like mantra mahodadhi,etc.... > > > > om shakti > > > > gopal > > > > > > On 11/2/09, Kulasundari Devi <sundari<sundari%40kamakhyamandir.org> > <sundari%40kamakhyamandir.org>> > > wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > Hello all, > > > > > > I was wondering if anyone had thoughts or insight into kaula vs. kula > as > > > descriptive terms. They get used a lot and I read recently that kaula > is > > > Shaiva (i.e. Abhinavagupta) and kula is Shakta (i.e. Kalikula), and my > > > experience has reflected this, but I know that there's some amount of > > > contention. If anyone has additional knowledge/resources/literary > sources > > > about the use of these terms, I would be interested to hear more. I've > > > already read the Wikipedia entry and a few other basic resources... > > > > > > Thank you! > > > > > > Jai MA kamesvari > > > -kulasundari > > > > > > Sri Kamakhya Mahavidya Mandir > > > www.kamakhyamandir.org > > > > > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted November 3, 2009 Report Share Posted November 3, 2009 Dear all, Please read the article appearing the below link: http://www.nathorder.org/wiki/Nath_Kula_Kaula With best regards Rohri --- On Tue, 11/3/09, Abhijit Dasgupta <abhijitdasgupta92 wrote: It is very interesting. I had not thought of Kaula and Kula as seperate, but this debate is now leading us to find out the roots. I know there is book " Koula Gnan Nirnaya " written by lord Matsendra Nath . He was a Great Saiva ,even Abhinava Gupta Acharya had a great respect for him. In spite of being a Saiva, he was the founder of Kamakhys Peetha of Sakti. [....] So Koula is Shiva and Kula is Sakti as I know from a study of Nath literature. In fact , apperently Kula and Kaula are seperate and having distinct identities, but when the join together and become one and the distinction vanishes. In view of this the Philosophy of Nathism is " Dwait-adwaita Bibajita " . Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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