Exploring Sanskrit writings about Kali

[Guest guest]

Namaste.

I've uploaded a number of longish articles about Kali-related writings,

from past issues of the journal Ferment.

* How to study the literature of Kali? Reflections on David Kinsley.

<http://home.pacific.net.au/~ferment/study.html>

 

* A cloud-like lady - Kali and rainclouds in Sanskrit literature.

<http://home.pacific.net.au/~ferment/cloud.html>

 

* The word Kali in the Devi-Mahatmya - a new look at an old book.

<http://home.pacific.net.au/~ferment/devimahat.html>

 

* A God for the Goddess -- notes on the masculine word Kala.

<http://home.pacific.net.au/~ferment/kala.html>

 

* Ramprasad's poetic vision of Kali -- synthesis or revival?

<http://home.pacific.net.au/~ferment/ramprasad.html>

 

These uploads are different from past ones, in that (like Wikipedia)

I've used Unicode for letters marked with accents, and to present short

Sanskrit quotes in their original form. For this to work, you need a

Unicode-capable browser and devanagari font. Otherwise, you may see

question marks or odd little squares.

Will welcome your feedback, either about the substance or the

presentation.

Om ShantihColin of Ferment

 

 

 

 

[Guest guest]

Jai Ma!

 

It's been many years since I've read " The Sword and the Flute. " As I recall, I

was disappointed that Kinsley didn't address very much about the

interrelationship between Kali and Krishna. Both deities became popular objects

of worship in medieval Bengal; their devotees appeared to be rivals for each

others' devotion. The expression I've always heard about the related natures of

Kali and Krishna is that " Kali is Krishna turned inside out. " Externally,

Krishna is all-attractive, but scratch below the surface and he is frightening

and awe inspiring (see Yashoda's reaction when she looks into baby Krishna's

mouth, or Arjuna's observations when Krishna reveals his cosmic form). On the

other hand, externally Kali is frightening and awe inspiring, but below the

surface, she is all-attractive, the nurturing World-mother.

 

I would love to see a book or study explorng the ways Krishna and Kali

interpenetrate each other, and how their devotees debated and squabbled between

each other in Bengal. And I especially revere sages

who see beyond the differences to the unity of thetwo dark divinities. Only

Ramakrishna comes immediately to mind, but there are probably others.

 

-- Len/ Kalipadma

 

, " colin777au " <colinr wrote:

>

> * How to study the literature of Kali? Reflections on David Kinsley.

> <http://home.pacific.net.au/~ferment/study.html>

>

> * A cloud-like lady - Kali and rainclouds in Sanskrit literature.

> <http://home.pacific.net.au/~ferment/cloud.html>

>

> * The word Kali in the Devi-Mahatmya - a new look at an old book.

> <http://home.pacific.net.au/~ferment/devimahat.html>

>

> * A God for the Goddess -- notes on the masculine word Kala.

> <http://home.pacific.net.au/~ferment/kala.html>

>

> * Ramprasad's poetic vision of Kali -- synthesis or revival?

> <http://home.pacific.net.au/~ferment/ramprasad.html>

>

> Om Shantih Colin of Ferment

>

>

[Guest guest]

Hello Len,

 

>The expression I've always heard about the related natures of

Kali and Krishna is that " Kali is Krishna turned inside out. " Externally,

Krishna is all-attractive, but scratch below the surface and he is frightening

and awe inspiring (see Yashoda's reaction when she looks into baby Krishna's

mouth, or Arjuna's observations when Krishna reveals his cosmic form). On the

other hand, externally Kali is frightening and awe inspiring, but below the

surface, she is all-attractive, the nurturing World-mother.

 

Very well expressed. And in the Gita, when Krishna reveals his cosmic form, he

identifies himself in Sanskrit as " kala " (chapter 11 verse 32).

 

>It's been many years since I've read " The Sword and the Flute. " As I recall, I

was disappointed that Kinsley didn't address very much about the

interrelationship between Kali and Krishna.

 

Funny thing is, the expression " the sword and the flute " predates Kinsley's

book. I found it in J.D.Sinha's translation of one of Ramprasad's songs (song

220 in Sinha's book Ramaprasada's Devotional Songs - the Cult of Shakti). That

was published in 1966, Kinsley's book in 1975.

 

" Oh mind! thy error is not yet removed.

Thou art engrossed in the worship of Shakti; Hari and Hara are not yet one to

thee...

Thou hast done no action, realizing the secrets of the sword and the flute. "

 

>I would love to see a book or study explorng the ways Krishna and Kali

interpenetrate each other, and how their devotees debated and squabbled between

each other in Bengal.

 

Have you looked at Malcolm McLean's book about Ramprasad _Devoted to the

Goddess_? McLean is an academic writer fascinated with the conflict between

those two schools (shakta and vaishnava), to the extent (unfortunately) that he

denies their mutual influence. Still, like David Kinsley, he presents

interesting material, including titles of other books that cover this area of

religious history, both in English and Bengali. Would you like a list of some of

the titles he mentions?

 

>And I especially revere sages

who see beyond the differences to the unity of thetwo dark divinities. Only

Ramakrishna comes immediately to mind, but there are probably others.

 

I would say that Ramprasad does, for a start...

 

Om Shantih

Colin

 

 

 

, " BlackLotus " <kalipadma108 wrote:

>

> Jai Ma!

>

> It's been many years since I've read " The Sword and the Flute. " As I recall,

I was disappointed that Kinsley didn't address very much about the

interrelationship between Kali and Krishna. Both deities became popular objects

of worship in medieval Bengal; their devotees appeared to be rivals for each

others' devotion. The expression I've always heard about the related natures of

Kali and Krishna is that " Kali is Krishna turned inside out. " Externally,

Krishna is all-attractive, but scratch below the surface and he is frightening

and awe inspiring (see Yashoda's reaction when she looks into baby Krishna's

mouth, or Arjuna's observations when Krishna reveals his cosmic form). On the

other hand, externally Kali is frightening and awe inspiring, but below the

surface, she is all-attractive, the nurturing World-mother.

>

> I would love to see a book or study explorng the ways Krishna and Kali

interpenetrate each other, and how their devotees debated and squabbled between

each other in Bengal. And I especially revere sages

> who see beyond the differences to the unity of thetwo dark divinities. Only

Ramakrishna comes immediately to mind, but there are probably others.

>

> -- Len/ Kalipadma

>

[Guest guest]

Please do forward the list! My Bengali is virtually non-existant, but I can

find a friendly polyglot to help translate.

 

-- Len/ Black Lotus

 

 

, " colin777au " <colinr wrote:

>> Len wrote:

> >I would love to see a book or study explorng the ways Krishna and Kali

> interpenetrate each other, and how their devotees debated and squabbled

between

> each other in Bengal.

>

> colin answered:

> Have you looked at Malcolm McLean's book about Ramprasad _Devoted to the

Goddess_? McLean is an academic writer fascinated with the conflict between

those two schools (shakta and vaishnava), to the extent (unfortunately) that he

denies their mutual influence. Still, like David Kinsley, he presents

interesting material, including titles of other books that cover this area of

religious history, both in English and Bengali. Would you like a list of some of

the titles he mentions?

>

[Guest guest]

OK.

 

A list of books cited by Malcolm McLean when talking about relations between

worshippers of Kali and Krishna in Bengal.

 

In English

 

Sen, D.C.; History of Bengali Language and Literature; Calcutta, University of

Calcutta Press, 1954

 

Sen, D.C.; Glimpses of Bengal Life; Calcutta, University of Calcutta Press, 1925

 

Rahim, M.A.; Social and Cultural History of Bengal, vol II; Karachi, Pakistan

Publishing House, 1967

 

De, S.K.; Early History of the Vaisnava Faith and Movement; Firma

K.L.Mukhopadhyay, 2nd edition, 1961

 

De, S.K.; History of Bengali Literature; [Firma K.L.Mukhopadhyay, 2nd edition,

1962]

 

Goudriann, T., and Gupta, S.; Hindu Tantric and Sakta Literature, Wiesbaden,

Otto Harrassowitz, 1981

 

In Bengali

 

Sanyal, Hiteshranja; Bangla kirtaner itihas [= " History of Bengali kirtan " ],

Calcutta, P.K.Bagchi, 1989

 

Datta, Sukumar Ranjan; Shakto Boishnaba milan [= " Shakta-vaishvava

reconciliation " ], Calcutta, Basu Bhavan, 1974

 

Best wishes

Colin of Ferment

 

, " BlackLotus " <kalipadma108 wrote:

>

> Please do forward the list! My Bengali is virtually non-existant, but I can

find a friendly polyglot to help translate.

>

> -- Len/ Black Lotus

>

>

> , " colin777au " <colinr@> wrote:

> >> Len wrote:

> > >I would love to see a book or study explorng the ways Krishna and Kali

> > interpenetrate each other, and how their devotees debated and squabbled

between

> > each other in Bengal.

> >

> > colin answered:

> > Have you looked at Malcolm McLean's book about Ramprasad _Devoted to the

Goddess_? McLean is an academic writer fascinated with the conflict between

those two schools (shakta and vaishnava), to the extent (unfortunately) that he

denies their mutual influence. Still, like David Kinsley, he presents

interesting material, including titles of other books that cover this area of

religious history, both in English and Bengali. Would you like a list of some of

the titles he mentions?

> >

>