Guest guest Posted January 24, 2004 Report Share Posted January 24, 2004 hello i want to say some thing we can not understand the God with our mind throuh the meditaton we can knowing the God but our mind almost living in this world we are limited mind we say in our meditoin we are the aspirite it means we can not understand and conected to God by our mind if you want to (what is god ) there is one way that is medition furat <springingriver wrote: > lunduner1@b... wrote:> Hi everyone,> > I just wanted to clarify something. As far as I know to date in Sahaja Yoga, Sri Mataji says that there is only one God but that different incarnations/deities have been 'sent' by this 'one' supreme creator/God etc etc at different times and for different purposes. This to me makes sense.> > I have a friend though who asked if we believe in many different Gods (as opposed to just one) because he says that Hindus believe in many Gods and is curious that we accept multiple Gods as well as multiple incarnations/deities....I hope I am making sense here? I have always been under the impression that Sri Mataji talks of one God only but that this one God now and again incarnates part of himself onto this planet in forms more understandable to us mere humans. He said that Sri Ganesha is looked upon by Hindus as a God differently to say how Christians look upon Christ (Christ is not God, he is a part of God). Can someone please clarify Sri Mataji's view on all of this once again so I can forward him a suitable reply? I know Sahaja Yoga is not Hinduism but Hinduism does have a large connection to Sahaja Yoga for obvious reasons and people have trouble knowing where the similarity ends, can someone explain in clear terms please?> > Thank you all so much,> > ||JAI SHRI MATAJI ||> > Adam> > > > > --- mahesh khatri <maheshkhatri> wrote:> Jai Shri Mataji> > Understanding God with our limited capacity is impossible. Man has tried to understand God in different forms, but in vain. Even Sahaja yoga is Just one part of God as said by Shri Mataji. Shri Mataji has said in some speech that Sahaja Yoga is just one part of myself. > We find that we cannot surrender ourselves fully to Shri Mataji inspite of so much proof we have been given by her divine self. Our minds are so flooded by doubts, questions, greed, which has to be overcome.> Nothing matters more than vibrations.> What are we going to gain by achieving knowledge about God. Now for eg. NASA is looking for water at mars. Suppossing we know there was or is water, what are we going to gain by this knowledge. And this is just one planet and one aspect. Forget about outside, we dont even know our own internal parts of the body.> Trying to know each and every thing is a sheer waste of time and energy. God will reveal us what is relevant to us at the proper time. for eg. giving the details of a particular law in foreign country will not be of any use. We will say how does it matter to me? That knowledge and information given to us is wasted. > We should take life as it comes and take appropriate decisions and actions we feel is good for us. At the moment Sahaja yoga is the best thing that has happened to us in our life time. > Let us all surrender all our thoughts, doubts, arguments to Shri Mataji and enjoy the blessings and protection in her glory. Also we should explain to the newcomers and seekers to come to Sahaja and feel for yourself the vibrations and its effects on your life. How it soothes you, nourishes you, makes you happy and joyous, takes care of all your problems and brings you to the kingdom of God. What does anything else matters?> Enjoy the Kingdom of God, i.e the Kingdom of Shri Mataji.> The defination of God for us now is Shri Mataji. She is the God. We know now. The whole world will know sooner or later.> > > Jai Shri Mataji> > > Regards,> > Mahesh Khatri> www.shalstudios.com > > > > Jai Shri Mataji!Thank you, Mahesh, and thank you, Adam. Mahesh. Yours is the answer we all arrive at eventually. It is all we need to know when we go to meditation. But the mind will never be satisfied. The whole world is built on the mental perception. If we drop it altogether, then we have to quit language and communication as well. What the mystics throughout ages have been doing is cheating it into satisfaction. Like in Arabic the word for existence ("wujood") means just that: 'that which is to be found'. So if anybody asks "How do you prove the existence of God?". The answer automatically is "You can only prove that He is to be found [and all the Saints say they have]". So then it is clear that it's up to you if you want to do your yoga or not. I do not find Adam's question difficult. The answer is: there has been originally only one religion in the whole universe. The ancient Pagan ones preserved some traces of it, Hinduism today preserves even more. And Sahaja Yoga revives that Vishwa Nirmala Dharma by making use of what is here already and providing a new experience (or "making the same ancient one more available today" etc). So our concept of the deities is no different from that uninanimous one which is found in all the scriptures of the world: "In the beginning God created the heaven and the earth." (Genesis 1:1)There are two Hebrew words for "God" in the Book of Genesis: 'El' ("God") and 'Elohim' ("Gods"). I think it is obvious that 'El' is for Sadashiva, God the Father, and 'Elohim' for the Devas, the Deities (just as 'Ruah' is for Shakti): "And out of the throne proceeded lightnings and thunderings and voices: and there were seven lamps of fire burning before the throne, which are the Seven Spirits of God." (Revelation 4:5)14. Then let us study God, the One, the Three, the Seven.15. Before the worlds were formed all things were One; just Spirit, Universal Breath.16. And Spirit breathed, and that which was not manifest became the Fire and Thought of Heaven, the Father-God, the Mother-God.17. And when the Fire and Thought of heaven in union breathed, their son, their only son, was born. This son is Love whom men have called the Christ.18. Men call the Thought of heaven the Holy Breath.19. And when the Triune God breathed forth, lo, seven Spirits stood before the throne. These are Elohim, creative spirits of the universe.20. And these are they who said, Let us make man; and in their image man was made.21. In early ages of the world the dwellers in the farther East said, Tao is the name of Universal Breath; and in the ancient books we read,22. No manifesting form has Tao Great, and yet he made and keeps the heavens and earth.23. No passion has our Tao Great, and yet he causes sun and moon and all the stars to rise and set.24. No name has Tao Great, and yet he makes all things to grow; he brings in season both the seed time and the harvest time.25. And Tao Great was One; the One became the Two; the Two became the Three, the Three evolved the Seven, which filled the universe with manifests.26. And Tao Great gives unto all, the evil and the good, the rain, the dew, the sunshine and the flowers; from his rich stores he feeds them all.27. And in the same old book we read of man: He has a spirit knit to Tao Great; a soul which lives within the seven Breaths of Tao Great; a body of desires that springs up from the soil of flesh.28. Now spirit loves the pure, the good, the true; the body of desires extols the selfish self; the soul becomes the battle ground between the two.29. And blessed is the man whose spirit is triumphant and whose lower self is purified; whose soul is cleansed, becoming fit to be the council chamber of the manifests of Tao Great. (Aquarian Gospel, Chapter IX) These principles are eternal, but that which is born and dies is not: The Christians came to Muhammad and argued with him about Jesus, son of Mary. They asked him who his father was and uttered many lies and slanderous things about Allah - he is the only god; he has neither wife nor child. Muhammad said to them: "Do you not know that our lord is living and that he will not die? Jesus, however, was exposed to mortality." They said, "Yes." He asked them, "Was there a reason for Jesus being different?" They said, "No." He said, "Do you not know that nothing is hidden from Allah, whether on earth or in heaven?" They said, "Yes." He said to them, "Did Jesus know more than Allah taught him?" They said, "No." He said: "Our Lord fashioned Jesus as he pleased, in his mother's womb. Do you not know that our Lord neither eats nor drinks nor eliminates anything unclean?" They answered, "Yes." He said: "Do you not know that Jesus' mother was pregnant with him and bore him as every mother does her child; that he was nourished like every child, and that he ate, drank, and relieved himself of impurities?" They said, "Yes." He said, "How can what you claim be true?" (Hadith; Ibn Hisham, as-Siratu'n-nabawiyya, Cairo 1955, Vol. 1, pp. 224-225.) "Guru Nanak is reported to have said to Babur (the first Mughal invader): There are millions of Muhammads, but only one God. The unseen is True and without anxiety. Many Muhammads stand in His court. So numberless, they cannot be reckoned. Prophets have been sent and come into the world. Whenever He pleaseth, He hath them arrested, and brought before Him. The slave Nanak hath ascertained, That God alone is pure and all else is impure." (Cf. Max Arthur Macauliffe, "The Sikh Religion," Oxford, 1909, Vol.I, p.121)"You won't find this in the history books, because those who have written the history of the Punjab have deliberately concealed it. But this is what I have heard from my elders. In order to draw away the masses who were joining the Sikhs in droves, he (Raja Chandu Mal, governer of Lahore) established what he called the 'Ram Rahim' movement. As soon as he heard about the Guru's plans of inviting Hazrat Mian Mir Sahib (a Sufi master) to Amritsar, he sent one of his deputies, who called himself as Ahmad Das, to Hazrat Mian Mir Sahib seeking to convince him not to lay the foundation stone of the Harminder Sahib. Instead of helping the Guru, he said, Hazrat Mian Mir sahib should co-operate with Raja Chandu Mal, for Chandu, too, he insisted, believed that 'Ram and Rahim are one'. But Hazrat Mian Mir Sahib rebuked him, saying: "The Ram you believe in was not God himself, but a mere mortal-the son of Raja Dashrath, husband of Sita Mai and father of Luv and Kush, while God has neither parents nor children." And then he said, "People can be united only on the basis of the love for the one formless God, and this task Arjan Dev is doing best and so I shall help him". " (www.sikhspectrum.com/102002/pir_sahib.htm)God does not incarnate, though everything living is divine: 31. The Spirit of eternity is One unmanifest; and this is God the Father, God the Mother, God the Son in One. 32. In life of manifests the One became the Three, and God the Father is the God of might; and God the Mother is omniscient God, and God the Son is love. 33. And God the Father is the power of heaven and earth; and God the Mother is the Holy Breath, the thought of heaven and earth; and God the Son, the only son, is Christ, and Christ is love. 34. I came as man to manifest this love to men, 35. As man I have been subject unto all the trials and temptations of the human race; but I have overcome the flesh, with all its passions and its appetites. 36. What I have done all men can do. 37. And I am now about to demonstrate the power of man to conquer death; for every man is God made flesh. (Aquarian Gospel, Chapter 163)So the true question has rather always been: "what is the true relationship between those Divine Principles and their manifestations in the physical body?". The incarnations were humans, who were perfect. Maybe humans who had achieved perfection. Man can achieve those principles and reincarnate again to ahieve more. Angels can take on a physical body and then disappear (as Sainth did). And yet the Principles Themselves remain transcendant and eternal, but above all internal: 11. Men call me Christ, and God has recognised the name; but Christ is not a man. The Christ is universal love, and Love is king. 12. This Jesus is but man who has been fitted by temptations overcome, by trials multiform, to be the temple through which Christ can manifest to men. 13. Then hear, you men of Israel, hear! Look not upon the flesh; it is not king. Look to the Christ within, who shall be formed in every one of you, as he is formed in me. (Aquarian Gospel, Chapter 68)rgdsfurat-----------------------------" Q. from Sahaja Yogi.Shri Mataji: - When in the beginning Sadashiva and Adi Shakti separated, that time the "Tunkaar" which took place, that is the main thing that started. Then the Adi Shakti went into three forms -and with one form She started all the elements. That Tunkaar (ONKARA) which is auspiciousness, which is holiness. The Tunkaar is the one which has spread into the whole atmosphere, is the auspiciousness and the holiness. Went with everything that was created, but it was created by the right side. So though it is surrounded by it, like this house is made but it's surroundings are different. So the surrounding air supposing the Omkara, then this house is made. So this is not that the Omkara has made this, but it surrounds and because of it's surrounding also it moulds, it moves, because the Chaitanya which is actually the Omkara, we should say, is all the time guiding, penetrating, organising, improving everything.Q. by Sahaja Yogi: It is only the Devi that does Shri Mataji?Shri Mataji: -She does everything. No doubt about it. She does everything. She is the doer. She first created Ganesha, through which auspiciousness is controlled through which holiness is controlled and through which all universe gets surrounded by Her. Then it also enters - like supposing I touch anything - it becomes holy, because the Chaitanya goes into and it becomes holy, it becomes auspicious. So it can pass into it, it can pass into anything. But anything dead, it doesn't have Omkara. It has got electromagnetic forces and then electro magnetic goes into higher stage when the nitrogen enters into it, then it becomes 'Prana'.So at different stages it goes, then it becomes a human being. Still is a human being till he becomes a Realised Soul, then it's different story. So the evolutionary stage, every stage in Omkara -which you call -Chaitanya, which goes into everything. Now this Chaitanya also is used by all these three powers. That's why it is called as Omkara -A -U -Ma, because the Goddess uses different types of powers of this Chaitanya to do other work. So the whole of 'Aum' is not used. Quite a complicated stuff. Better not to understand. The more you try to complicate yourself like this. The more your agnya will be catching. Better you keep your agnyas down. I Should say keep more to 'Bhakti' than to agnya. This will all come to you very soon.But more over, all the time what is this -what is that what is that. That goes on churning your agnya all the time, it's a big wheel going on. Best is stop it. Just enter into 'Bhakti' what Shankaracharya did. He first wrote 'Vivekachuramani' Then he got so fed up with arguments, this that. Then he said nothing doing. Just the 'Bhakti', of it. So, then he writes all these things. So, you get into 'Bhakti' first of all. Because this kind of enquiry, there's no end to it. I am going to publish my book -so you can read it.Like Gregorie's book, he wrote a book, first few chapters -first one was nice-how he met me and all, that was very sweet and suddenly there is a rock of Gibraltar. All that he knew- he put it. I said finished! Nobody is going to read this book for you. So I revised with him for a year and very difficult it was, too much of agnya, very difficult. At the end of it, I said, now everything is connected, only one thing is to be done that these two chapters have to go in the end, he just fainted. I said because these two chapters were like rock of Gibraltar. Only the people who are sort of intellectual feats would like to read it. So you better stop it and take it that side. He said, how can you do it, I'll have to change the whole book. I said, no I'll read it from the very beginning it's better just remove it and put it there because I say so. Now nobody reads them and those who are 'agnya-walas' read them and then catch. So what I am saying-to get over your agnya, you better get to 'Bhakti'.Out of the whole thing, how much I explain to you. Wee bit. If you ask me- Mother how do you get so many hands out of the blue? How do you get a light there? You people don't have that 'Chitti' you don't have that computer within you. That I can explain you. So it will get complicated. Just go to Bhakti.The killer of Bhakti is enquiry. Just see for yourself. Supposing you go in the water, do you ask the water - where do you come from? You just swim. Otherwise you should go and ask the water-where do you come from, what is your component, this that. Or if you have to eat something do you ask how it is made? What are the derivatives? Where it came? What is this? What is that? Make the chemical analysis? Just eat it. Is the hunger you get, just enjoy. Mental feats are the worst thing, I tell you.When you are doing Puja, you should never ask questions. Puja gets 'Khandit'. Questioning is the big headache for me. All the time people are questioning. What I find that they are not deep in their 'Bhakti'. When you are in the 'masti' (ecstasy), you don't ask anything. (Jab mast huey phir kya bole).Even to a Brahmin, if you ask a question he will take 'Sopan' and hit you or in the Church, you just get up and say, Sir, what do you mean by this? he is reading a sermon. He will throw whatever he gets in his hand.*In the heart as the buddhi.What do you say to that? In the heart as intelligence. (resides Goddess).Like in the well if you put, say a pitcher, then the water is inside as well as outside.One has to realise that the man is the kinetic thing. I mean the male "Avatars" are the kinetic side. The potential energy is the female energy. So, even when Krishna has to kill Kansa, he had to ask Radha to help him. So, is the Shakti. Without the Shakti they have no existence. It's like without a light the lamp has no existence. So these are main forms, but behind them are the Shaktis, which have performed all these acts.That's how the Shiva become ferocious and killed the demons, because that energy goes into him. She didn't come with any male power herself and say-if you conquer something or you do something good, you get a badge on something like that. You might be garlanded with a medal. So she used the 'rakshasas' whom she had killed, their heads as her garland to frighten other 'rakshasas'. That I will kill you, take your heads and put them around. Just to frighten.The attitude to the Puja should be, that you are enamoured by the Devi. That you are praising the Goddess. It's not an intellectual understanding, you see. It is, you are saying all these things just to please. So the attitude should be such, is not some sort of intellectual teatrise, that is going on but it is, you are expressing the Goddess! Like if you love someone, then you say something, just to please that person. In the same way you are saying to Goddess something. Now these saints who have written are saying this. Just to express themselves that You are Goddess, You are like this, You are like that. Some of the letters I receive also are like that. So much full of expression of their feeling. But it's not a sort of a lecture course or anything. It is just the feeling of that attitude. So in complete 'Bhakti' it should be done.Try to feel it in your heart, whatever is said, and that you are sitting before me. You have to say that from your heart. This is what we are saying to You., With complete humility. It is the expression like a prayer. It is a prayer. Should be a prayer and not some sort of intellectual discussion. It is a prayer to Goddess. Unless and until you develop that attitude, you cannot go very far.From your heart completely pouring out saying these things. Open your heart, pour it out. But every word if you take like that and start analysing it's useless. It's like flowers which you are. Because you can say it to me through your 'Vaikhari'. You want to say it. But otherwise whatever you are saying is just a sort of lip service whatever you ever want to say it, will be just a lip service. Something going on.To enlighten your heart, you have to praise, express yourself. Should be such that you just feel like saying these things to me. You can't say it in my presence- should become one with that, you should become one with it. You are saying all these things.Now this is a thankfulness. It's an expression that you are doing this, that. Take it as a thankfulness. It's an expression of your heart.Even the 'Vishveshwara' becomes humble. Vishweshwara is the one who is the Ishwara of the whole universe, who is Sadashiva or Shiva also becomes that.Be in Nirvichara doing Puja, don't think. Because you see, I am knowledge, all right, and I give you knowledge but your pursuit should be after that, your pursuit should be after 'Bhakti'.It gives you a spontaneous enjoyment and all such people I have seen have gone out of Sahaja Yoga. I am warning you. All of them have gone out those who have intellectual pursuits, all of them have gone out one by one. You should never ask me questions. That's what I call as pure intelligence. What is the use of knowing all this. If you are thirsty, you better drink the nectar of 'Bhakti' - supposing you are thirsty and I start giving you a lecture, you will say "Ah baba" please give us water. If you are really thirsty. You cannot bring people by your intellectual feats, no never. Only through vibrations through Realisations. If somebody starts arguing, if he is talking through his ego, how can you talk to him. You are talking through your Atma, he is talking through his ego. Either bring him down to Atma or just stop it. It is like you are talking to a deaf person. You are saying something and he is saying something. No amount of arguments can bring them around. It's the experience only through transformation."(8th DAY (ASHTMI) - 18th October 1988; Pune) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted January 26, 2004 Report Share Posted January 26, 2004 shriadishakti , <lunduner1@b...> wrote: > Hi everyone, > > I just wanted to clarify something. As far as I know to date in > Sahaja Yoga, Sri Mataji says that there is only one God but that > different incarnations/deities have been 'sent' by this 'one' > supreme creator/God etc etc at different times and for different > purposes. This to me makes sense. > > I have a friend though who asked if we believe in many different > Gods (as opposed to just one) because he says that Hindus believe > in many Gods and is curious that we accept multiple Gods as well > as multiple incarnations/deities....I hope I am making sense here? > I have always been under the impression that Sri Mataji talks of > one God only but that this one God now and again incarnates part > of himself onto this planet in forms more understandable to us > mere humans. He said that Sri Ganesha is looked upon by Hindus as > a God differently to say how Christians look upon Christ (Christ > is not God, he is a part of God). Can someone please clarify Sri > Mataji's view on all of this once again so I can forward him a > suitable reply? I know Sahaja Yoga is not Hinduism but Hinduism > does have a large connection to Sahaja Yoga for obvious reasons > and people have trouble knowing where the similarity ends, can > someone explain in clear terms please? > > Thank you all so much, > > ||JAI SHRI MATAJI || > > Adam > " The Hindu scriptures also preached 'ONE GOD' Hinduism, as most Hindus would say, is not a religion but a " Dharma " and a Culture. The Vedas, the Upanishads, the Puranas, the Brahmanas Granth are considered to be the holy scriptures, most sacred being the Vedas. Also there is the Bhagavada Gita, the Mahabharata and the Ramanayan. The degeneration of any society starts with becoming heedless to the guidance of God and falling prey to our own whims and desires. This eventually may lead to the degeneration of the concept of God itself. The worship of innumerable Gods in Hindu society is a degeneration of the message of God and in stark contrast to the oneness of God preached in the Hindu Holy Scriptures Vedas and Upanishads. A few examples from these scriptures reveal that they also preach Oneness of God, which is exactly the same truth which was conveyed by God through His final messenger Muhammad (There is no god, but God). " There is only one God, worship Him " (Rig Veda, Vol.6, Hymn 45:16) " Do not worship any one beside Him " (Rig Veda Bk. 8, Hymn 1, Vs 1) " God is only one, - not a second " - (Chandogya Upanishad Ch. 6, Section 2, verse 1). " na tasya pratima asti " There is no image of Him. " [Yajurveda 32:3] Consider the following expositions about the true concept of God from the Hindu scriptures. Concept of God in Hinduism by Dr. Zakir Naik On the Belief of the Hindus in God - Al Beruni (AD 1030) From the Islamic point of view, the message of Unity of God was being conveyed down through ages via chosen messengers to mankind. Allah says in the Holy Quran that each tribe was sent a messenger and a guide to convey this universal message of Unity of God. For more articles, please visit the section Who is Allah ? We thus invite our Hindu brethren to return to the worship of the One true God as reminded to us by God through His last and final messenger Muhammad (peace be upon him). The biggest injustice (which is also the biggest lie) which we humans can commit is to say that there are other gods as partners to the only One God. Proclaiming that there is no god besides the One God of all is what God wants to hear from us in words and deeds and this is the true step towards honesty and justice to ourselves and to society around us. " http://saif_w.tripod.com/interfaith/hinduism.htm Thank you Jagbir and all the others who replied to my above post, some of the answers were very deep I thought but Jagbir's I understood the most... I think your above reply will answer my friends question nicely. So, let me get this straight..Hindus originaly worshipped one God only...as preached in the earliest Hindu scriptures and the more recent worship of many Gods is a form of confusion/degeneration. I must confess that I don't know much about Hinduism apart from some of the deities I have learnt about through SY. I think generally human beings (from whatever religeon/race) seem to believe in one overall creater and they accept this creater makes some of us 'more special' than others and talk of many Gods just takes even more people away from seeking. Surely there can only be one God for us humans anyhow and if this God has another creater, who knows?, but surely we can only try and understand the God who has given us (ALL) kundalini and Sri Mataji the ability to understand it like she does? Thanks again, Adam Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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