How Christian Fundamentalists have lost the 'fundamentals'...

[Guest guest]

Dear Jagbir and All,

 

, " jagbir singh "

<adishakti_org wrote:

 

" Today i received an email that justifies the need to have a website entirely

dedicated to the Holy Spirit. (i think some SYs may have questioned the need for

seven different sites.) The email reads:

 

" Thank you for the quick reply. The reason I am writing is because a friend of

mine gave me the link to your website, and I now have a question or two that I

can't find the answer to on there. I do pray you can and will answer them for

me:-

 

1) Does your belief system allow that Jesus Christ is God Almighty as proclaimed

by the prophet Isaiah in Isaiah 9:6 and by Jesus Himself in the book of

Revelation chapter 1 verse 8?

 

2) Do you believe that Jehovah/Yahweh and Allah are the same Deity?

 

3) Do you promote the Adi Shakti to be the same Holy Spirit of God that was

poured out on the day of Pentecost in Acts chapter 2 as prophesied it would be

in Joel 2:28 and was confirmed by Peter as being such in Acts 2:16-17?

 

Thank you so much!

 

(J) "

 

This is my answer to " J's " questions:-

 

 

" Dear " J " ,

 

I would first of all like to welcome you " J " to our forums.

 

I am glad that Jagbir has referred you to me, because I am a Christian Sahaja

Yogi and will understand where you are coming from.

 

By the way, the word " Sahaja " means `born with you', which refers to the Holy

Spirit that is `with you' but will be `in you'. " Yoga " means Union with the

Divine, the Second Birth of the Spirit (not of water),or the Baptism of the Holy

Ghost. When this experience is had, you become raised up to be your Spirit. You

start to live the life of the Higher Self rather than the Lower Self.

 

I have experienced that " J " , that is, the Holy Spirit `within me'. It is felt on

my head and hands as a Cool Breeze or Wind of the Holy Ghost like the Disciples

of Jesus experienced on the Day of Pentecost. It is an actual experience. It is

real.

 

 

1) Does your belief system allow that Jesus Christ is God Almighty as proclaimed

by the prophet Isaiah in Isaiah 9:6 and by Jesus Himself in the book of

Revelation chapter 1 verse 8?

 

I believe that Jesus is as Isaiah says, which is " Wonderful Counsellor, Mighty

God, Eternal Father, Prince of Peace " .

 

The Prophet Isaiah says:

 

" For a child will be born to us, as son will be given to us; and the government

will rest on His shoulders; and His name will be called Wonderful Counsellor,

Mighty God, Eternal Father, Prince of Peace. " (Isaiah 9:6)

 

I also believe that that Jesus is the Alpha and the Omega, that is, 'the

beginning and the end'.

 

Lord Jesus's Words:

 

" I am the Alpha and the Omega, " says the Lord God, " who is and who was and who

is to come, the Almighty. " (Revelations 1:8)

 

 

2) Do you believe that Jehovah/Yahveh and Allah are the same Deity?

 

The answer is yes. `Allah' translated into English is `God'. They are different

Names for God. There is Only One God, but many manifestations of One God. This

needs to be understood by Christians and Muslims especially. It is well

understood by Hindus.

 

 

3) Do you promote the Adi Shakti to be the same Holy Spirit of God that was

poured out on the day of Pentecost in Acts chapter 2 as prophesied it would be

in Joel 2:28 and was confirmed by Peter as being such in Acts 2:16-17?

 

The answer is yes. I do promote the Adi Shakti to be the same Holy Spirit of God

that was poured out on the Day of Pentecost and the Holy Spirit is now being

`poured out upon all flesh'...that is...whoever desires it. A person has to

desire it. The Holy Spirit will not give the Baptism unless asked by the person

for it. She is the Comforter within each of us who is our Spiritual Mother

within us that gives us our Spiritual Birth, in a similar way that our Physical

Mother has given us our Physical Birth.

 

The Prophet Joel says:

 

" And it will come about after this, that I will pour out My Spirit on all

mankind; and your sons and daughters will prophesy, your old men will dream

dreams, your young men will see visions. "

 

The Disciple of Jesus (Peter) says:

 

" But this is what was spoken of through the prophet Joel: And it shall be in the

last days, God says, that I will pour forth of My Spirit " .

 

I hope this helps, " J " . I am happy to answer any questions to the best of my

ability. Please feel most welcome.

 

Regards,

 

Violet

 

 

I received a reply a few days later from " J " . i will let you in on a 'secret'

and this is that " J " is a 'fundamentalist Christian'. All

fundamentalists...regardless of what spiritual tradition they come

from...believe that they are the ONLY TRUE ONE. What Shri Mataji has told us is

true...and this is that... " all fundamentalists have lost the fundamentals " .

 

So...what are these 'fundamentals' that they have lost???!!!

 

They have lost the fundamental right to genuine spiritual inquiry. They have

lost the fundamental right to seek the Divine within without also having to

succumb to the pressure of external dogma and doctrines. They have lost the

ability to understand that all Incarnations and the Prophets are branches of the

same " Tree of Life " that have come at Different Times to Enlighten Humanity.

They have lost the understanding that the Essence of the Teachings of All

Incarnations and Prophets ACTUALLY AGREE WITH EACH OTHER. They have also lost

the ability to realize that no spiritual tradition has all the answers, but that

taken together, all the Original Teachings of the Incarnations and Prophets

actually complement and illuminate each other, so that if you only take one

teaching, you really are missing 'pieces of the spiritual puzzle'.

 

For all the above reason...'fundamentalists tend to be fanatical'. In other

words, you JUST CANNOT REASON WITH THEM. This is why 'fundamentalistic'

attitudes have always predisposed them to religious disagreements, even within

their own spiritual tradition.

 

All this...does not paint a 'pretty' picture and yet 'fundamentalists' all have

the common belief that they are 100% correct. They are blind to the simple fact

that all these characteristics of 'fundamentalism' are the opposite of

Spirituality Reality, which comes from genuine and honest spiritual seeking,

genuine enquiry, and acceptance of the Essence of Truth in All Spiritual

Traditions.

 

" J " being true to his 'fundamentalistic tendancies' could not respond to genuine

answers, because his 'answers' had already been provided for him by the

Christian Doctrine and Dogma Makers of his 'denominational' choice. He does not

realize that being 'indoctrinated' and 'dogmatised' is the equivalent of being

'spiritually traumatised'. This trauma...perpetrated by External Religious

Conditioning...does not allow for Freedom of Spiritual Seeking and Spiritual

Experience. The Religious Elite...through the power of Dogma and

Doctrine...would not allow " J " to even CONSIDER MY ANSWERS, which have been

found through genuine spiritual seeking and spiritual experience.

 

It is therefore a very frightening indictment of 'fundamentalism' that with all

" J's " request and prayer for answers, when he actually got them, he found that

his 'answers' had already 'been made for him' by the D & D Makers, and even though

he had 'posited' genuine questions, he was not allowed to benefit from the

genuine answers.

 

This is what 'organized religion' 'has done' and 'still does do' to people. That

is why 'organized religion' is going to have to change if they do not want to

suffer a natural death. The Time Has Come! Their Death Knell is Sounded! The

" Absolute Truth " of the Holy Spirit has come on Earth through the Incarnation of

the 'Christian Comforter', but Fundamentalist Christians have become so blinded

by the 'Doctrine and Dogma Makers', that they cannot recognize the Truth when it

is staring them in the face.

 

However, all Untruth is going to be exposed by the Absolute Truth of the Holy

Spirit. This " Absolute Truth " cannot be 'faked'. It is felt as a Cool Breeze or

Wind like the Disciples of Jesus felt on the Day of Pentecost!

 

Unfortunately, that is why " J's " only 'possible' and 'expected' response was as

per below, and he also had the need to write " Null " three times, because he

could not face the Truth that i have told to him:-

 

" Thank you, Violet. I disagree with almost all of your beliefs, and I pray that

the Lord Jesus Christ, Jehovah God Almighty in flesh AND the comforter(Isaiah

9:6, John 14: 6-18, Revelation 1:8), will open your eyes to truth before His

return. If you are interested in knowing more, I'd be happy to share with you

these Biblical truths.

 

In peace and in the name of Jesus,

 

" J "

 

[NULL]

 

>>> " Violet Tubb " <violet.tubb >>>

Dear John,

 

I would first of all like to welcome you John to our forums.

 

I am glad that Jagbir has referred you to me, because I am a Christian Sahaja

Yogi and will understand where you are coming from.

 

By the way, the word " Sahaja " means 'born with you', which refers to the Holy

Spirit that is 'with you' but will be 'in you'. " Yoga " means " Union with the

Divine " , the Second Birth of the Spirit (not of water). It is the Baptism of the

Holy Ghost. When this experience is had, you become raised up to be your Spirit.

You start to live the life of the Higher Self rather than the Lower Self.

 

I have experienced that John, that is, the Holy Spirit 'within me'. It is felt

on my head and hands as a Cool Breeze or Wind of the Holy Ghost like the

Disciples of Jesus experienced on the Day of Pentecost. It is an actual

experience. It is real.

 

1) Does your belief system allow that Jesus Christ is God Almighty as proclaimed

by the prophet Isaiah in Isaiah 9:6 and by Jesus Himself in the book of

Revelation chapter 1 verse 8?

 

I believe that Jesus is as Isaiah says, which is " Wonderful Counsellor, Mighty

God, Eternal Father, Prince of Peace " .

 

The Prophet Isaiah says:

 

" For a child will be born to us, as son will be given to us; and the government

will rest on His shoulders; and His name will be called Wonderful Counsellor,

Mighty God, Eternal Father, Prince of Peace. "

(Isaiah 9:6)

 

I also believe that that Jesus is the Alpha and the Omega, that is,'the

beginning and the end'.

 

Lord Jesus's Words:

 

" I am the Alpha and the Omega, " says the Lord God, " who is and who was and who

is to come, the Almighty. " (Revelations 1:8)

 

2) Do you believe that Jehovah/Yahveh and Allah are the same Deity?

 

The answer is yes. 'Allah' translated into English is 'God'. They are different

Names for God. There is Only One God, but many manifestations of One God. This

needs to be understood by Christians and Muslims especially. It is well

understood by Hindus.

 

3) Do you promote the Adi Shakti to be the same Holy Spirit of God

that was poured out on the day of Pentecost in Acts chapter 2 as

prophesied it would be in Joel 2:28 and was confirmed by Peter as

being such in Acts 2:16-17?

 

The answer is yes. I do promote the Adi Shakti to be the same Holy Spirit of God

that was poured out on the Day of Pentecost and the Holy Spirit is now being

'poured out upon all flesh'.. that is...whoever desires it. A person has to

desire it. The Holy Spirit will not give the Baptism unless asked by the person

for it. She is the Comforter within each of us who is our Spiritual Mother

within us that gives us our Spiritual Birth, in a similar way that our Physical

Mother has given us our Physical Birth.

 

The Prophet Joel says:

[NULL]

 

" And it will come about after this, that I will pour out My Spirit on all

mankind; and your sons and daughters will prophesy, your old men will dream

dreams, your young men will see visions. "

 

The Disciple of Jesus (Peter) says:

 

" But this is what was spoken of through the prophet Joel: And it shall be in the

last days, God says, that I will pour forth of My Spirit " .

 

I hope this helps, John.

 

[NULL]

I am happy to answer any questions to the best of my ability. Please feel most

welcome.

 

 

-------By the way, before " J " replied to me, he also replied to another

Christian SY from this forum who told him about Jagbir's websites, and this is

what " J " said:-

 

" Attached is the short piece I did on the Gospel. Please let me know what you

think about it and any questions you might have. I don't have ALL the answers,

but I will try to find any I can't answer. Regarding the website you gave

me......I have spent over an hour looking at it. Let me post some things it

claims (from different areas of the website) first:

 

1) " For those who are treading the Christian path, I can tell you that Sahaja

Yoga has the unrestricted knowledge of Jesus's teachings and that the

incarnation of Sri Mataji Nirmala Devi fulfills the Prophecy of the Coming of

the Comforter who would be the Spirit of Truth and who would teach all things

and bring to remembrance all things. "

 

2) " The Adi Shakti (Hinduism), Comforter/Holy Spirit (Christianity),Shekinah

(Judaism), Ma Adi/Ruh (Islam), Mai Treya (Buddhism), Great Mother (Taoism) and

Aykaa Mayee (Sikhism) are the one and same primordial Divine Feminine. As

Messiah She fulfils this ancient Jewish prophecy. As Comforter/Holy Spirit

promised by Lord Jesus She completes His teachings and commences the Last

Judgment. "

 

3) " It is false to say that Jesus is the only 'true' god. As Hindus rightly

believe, the Divine has manifested himself throughout the ages under different

names and identities, whether it is Christ, Buddha,Krishna or Mohammad. "

 

My beliefs (and I can support them with the Bible):

 

Regarding #1 and #2: This lady, the Adi Shakti, claims to be something the Bible

totally disagrees with. If she and her movement proclaim all religions to be

truth, how can one of those religions (TRUE Christianity) refute something she

claims? She claims to be the Holy Spirit that Jesus in book of John would be

sent to the world after His ascension. THAT Holy Spirit was sent just 7 or so

days AFTER Jesus' ascension, but this woman was born in 1920! How can that be?

 

She also claims (in #2 above) to be the fulfillment of the Messiah of ancient

Jewish prophecy. Jesus claimed to be (and is) the Messiah. How can there be

two?

 

 

Regarding #3: God has manifested Himself throughout the ages under different

names, but NOT under different identities. God's identity, once He manifested

Himself in the person of Jesus Christ, is FOREVER going to be Jesus Christ. The

Bible is clear on that. Paul said, " GOD was manifest in the flesh... " (1

Timothy 3:16), and that " the FULLNESS of the Godhead (Deity) dwells IN the man

Jesus Christ " (Colossian 2:9).....just to quote two biblical truths. I can't

accept that God has " another " set of truths somewhere that would refute these.

In addition to those, Jesus Christ (in the book of Revelation) proclaims to be

GOD ALMIGHTY Himself for eternity and is the only One on the Throne of Heaven.

So, either this man they call " Shri Jesus " (apparently ONE of MANY deities in

heaven) is what they claim or HE IS God Almighty as the Holy Bible proclaims.

He can't be both, can He?

 

Based on the above, I cannot accept their beliefs. I know what this primarily

Eastern religion (Brahmanism, if I'm not mistaken) is saying -- that ALL

religions are of God and ALL are correct, etc.

 

(Name of yogi withheld), this is just one of the many movements that are

fulfilling the end time prophecy of the Bible that there will be a unified

" religious system " in place for the Antichrist to rule over. If you look

around, even the Roman Catholic Church is pushing for unity in the world's

religions. When THEY do that you gotta believe the end is near, because the

Vatican has always pushed " Catholicism or hell " . But you see the gradual change

in their stance and this is playing right into the hands of the end time

prophecies.

 

I can't tell you what to do, but I have to tell you that this " religion " is

totally against biblical truths. They try to paint this movement as agreeing

with the Bible, and thus accepting of ALL religions as paths to God, but so many

of the things their founder, this lady Adi Shakti, claims to be and believe in

absolutely are refuted by the Bible. How can she believe in something that

refutes what she says?

[NULL]

I'll be more than happy to scripturally show you why I believe so strongly

against this and FOR the only word of Almighty God proven to be true -- the

Bible.

 

" J "

 

As Jagbir has rightly surmised, we need to have a 'Christian-oriented' Sahaja

Yoga Website for people like " J " . i am asking those who come from Christian

backgrounds to please help me to do this. We can do this in 'bits and pieces'.

It is a big job, but a big job gets done by doing a bit at a time and that way,

it is manageable.

 

We can start by answering " J's " questions. They are not easy questions, but we

have to answer them. Shri Mataji expects us to give Her Message to people of all

spiritual traditions, and in order to do that, we have to explain Her Message in

the way that it can be readily accepted and received.

 

This can be simply done by just writing a post and addressing the particular

question/s of " J's " you want to tackle.

 

i particularly would like help with this one, which needs to be 'backed' with

Christian Scriptures:-

 

" Regarding #1 and #2: This lady, the Adi Shakti, claims to be something the

Bible totally disagrees with. If she and her movement proclaim all religions to

be truth, how can one of those religions (TRUE Christianity) refute something

she claims? She claims to be the Holy Spirit that Jesus in book of John would

be sent to the world after His ascension. THAT Holy Spirit was sent just 7 or

so days AFTER Jesus' ascension, but this woman was born in 1920! How can that

be? "

 

Thanking you,

 

Violet

 

 

 

 

, " jagbir singh "

<adishakti_org wrote:

>

> , " jagbir singh "

> <adishakti_org@> wrote:

> >

> > To bring forth the sea of change necessary to sustain our

> > collective push to usher Satya Yuga by 2013 i actually set up the

> > following:

> >

> > http://www.adishakti.org/ (Divine Message of Divine Feminine)

> > http://www.al-qiyamah.org/ (Divine Message of Divine Feminine )

> > http://www.adi-shakti.org/ (Divine Feminine of Hinduism)

> > http://www.tao-mother.org/ (Divine Feminine of Taoism)

> > http://www.aykaa-mayee.org/ (Divine Feminine of Sikhsim)

> > http://www.ruh-allah.org/ (Divine Feminine of Islam)

> > http://www.holyspirit-mother.org/ (Divine Feminine of

Christianity)

> >

> > The last two were not mentioned earlier as i had to tie up some

> > loose ends. Yes, now we have individual sites of Adi Shakti, Tao,

> > Aykaa Mayee, Ruh and Holy Spirit to collectively declare Her

> > Divine Message. After all, they are one and the same. All we need

> > is to provide evidence to that effect.

> >

> > We have seven websites as our seven chakras and the top three are:

> >

> > http://www.adi-shakti.org/ (The Sahasrara)

> > http://www.holyspirit-mother.org/ (The Agnya Chakra)

> > http://www.adishakti.org/ (The Vishuddhi Chakra)

> >

> > The http://www.adishakti.org/ (The Vishuddhi Chakra) will remain

> > as it is because it was the first site established in North

> > America to communicate Her Divine Message to the rest of the

world.

> >

> > http://www.holyspirit-mother.org/ (The Agnya Chakra) will be

> > handed over to Violet and other SYs with a Christian background to

> > establish the Holy Spirit, Mother and Comforter as promised by

> > Lord Jesus. The Narrow Gate where Lord Jesus resides guards the

> > entrance to the Kingdom of God (Sahasrara). The site will reflect

> > that.

> >

> > Violet and her chosen company will be completely free to use

> > their creative talents and knowledge to populate it. i will only

> > upload and maintain the website but play no part in filling it

> > with knowledge. i have great confidence that Violet will rise to

> > the challenge and spread Lord Jesus' promise of salvation prior to

> > His Second Coming. This work carries great responsibilities and

> > tireless, fearless dedication to the Truth. Violet has more than

> > met the requirements.

> >

>

> Today i received an email that justifies the need to have a website

> entirely dedicated to the Holy Spirit. (i think some SYs may have

> questioned the need for seven different sites.) The email reads:

>

> -------------------

>

> Thank you for the quick reply

>

> The reason I am writing is because a friend of mine gave me the link

> to your website, and I now have a question or two that I can't find

> the answer to on there. I do pray you can and will answer them for

> me.

>

> 1) Does your belief system allow that Jesus Christ is God Almighty

as

> proclaimed by the prophet Isaiah in Isaiah 9:6 and by Jesus Himself

> in the book of Revelation chapter 1 verse 8?

> 2) Do you believe that Jehovah/Yahweh and Allah are the same Deity?

> 3) Do you promote the Adi Shakti to be the same Holy Spirit of God

> that was poured out on the day of Pentecost in Acts chapter 2 as

> prophesied it would be in Joel 2:28 and was confirmed by Peter as

> being such in Acts 2:16-17?

>

> Thank you so much!

>

> J.

>

> ------------------

>

> It can be seen that some people are uncomfortable and maybe even

> confused with non-Christian teachings. i can sense the existing

> tensions between Christianity and Islam, and that is a hinderance. i

> did forsee such problems with www.adishakti.org site and that is why

> separate sites were needed as more seekers are visiting the main

> multi-religious site. They need sites based entirely on their

> religious background and upbringing.

>

> Violet will have to use exclusive Bible-based Christian teachings in

> www.holyspirit-mother to make Christians like J. comfortable. Once

> they have absorbed the contents seekers will be able to understand

> the Divine Message at www.adishakti.org better. Anytime they feel

> uneasy they can always return to www.holyspirit-mother.org and

> regain their faith and confidence. (The same goes for all other

> traditions.) Anyway, all sites will have the same Divine Message but

> based strictly on their Holy Scriptures. However, they will all be

> synthesized at the main www.adishakti.org website.

>

> jagbir

>

[Guest guest]

, " Violet "

<violet.tubb wrote:

>

> I received a reply a few days later from " J " . i will let you in on

> a 'secret' and this is that " J " is a 'fundamentalist Christian'. All

> fundamentalists...regardless of what spiritual tradition they come

> from...believe that they are the ONLY TRUE ONE. What Shri Mataji has

> told us is true...and this is that... " all fundamentalists have lost

> the fundamentals " .

>

 

Dear Violet,

 

We should never try convincing a fundamentalist because it is a sheer

waste of energy and time. i will not waste my time with them. But you

need to compile hard facts against them. Your present answers should

be saved, and over time more added. Once there is sufficient data all

you need is post him/her one at a time or the whole works. Perhaps you

may want to have a section devoted just to fundamentalism. This will

save you so much energy in future - as easy as pressing a button. That

way you can let the fundamentalist digest all the facts against them,

the more the better. i have given up trying to reason with them. You

should too once there is sufficient Q & A material.

 

jagbir

[Guest guest]

, " Violet "

<violet.tubb wrote:

>

> Dear Jagbir,

>

> You said:

> " We should never try convincing a fundamentalist because it is a

> sheer waste of energy and time. i will not waste my time with

> them. " (i agree it is a waste of time to try and convince a

> fundamentalist regarding their 'lack of fundamentals.')

>

 

Yes Violet, never try to convince a fundamentalist. Glaciers recede

faster than them to the truth (of global warming).

 

> You said:

> " But you need to compile hard facts against them. Your present

> answers should be saved, and over time more added. "

> (Jagbir, is what i have written what you had in mind,

> regarding 'hard facts against them'. i am just not sure if this is

> what you had in mind?)

>

Hard facts are irrefutable evidence gleaned from scriptures,

spiritual experiences and science. We are sure the Earth is older

than 6000 years and not built in 6 days. There are many ways to

demolish fundamentalists like John.

 

> You said:

> " Your present answers should be saved, and over time more added. "

> (Jagbir, where are these to be saved? Am i supposed to save them

> somewhere, or are you uploading them to the Site Designated?)

>

 

Just save them in your computer Violet for the time being. You will

need to have around 50 pages or more before i will upload onto the

new website.

 

> You said:

> " Once there is sufficient data all you need is post him/her one at

> a time or the whole works. "

> (That will work really well and not be time-consuming.)

>

There is nothing easier than pressing a few keys to retrieve data

and answer FAQ questions.

 

> You said:

> " Perhaps you may want to have a section devoted just

> to 'fundamentalism'. This will save you so much energy in future -

> as easy as pressing a button. "

> (Yes, that would be a really good idea. Are you meaning for the

> Fundamentalism Section to be on the Designated New Website? It

> would definitely be an energy-saver.)

>

Yes, that all will be for the new website. " Fundamentalism " should

be a section that will be useful. All the seven websites will

eventually be cross-linked for reference purposes. Ultimately they

should have data to cover every aspect of spirituality, a sort of

one-stop mega-spiritual mall. i am talking about a few thousand

webpages. This is going to take a long time but the rigorous journey

will be dearly appreciated by many in future.

 

 

> You said:

> " That way you can let the fundamentalist digest all the facts

> against them, the more the better. "

> (That's true. Maybe, they need to see it in black-and-white. At

> least we don't have to re-hash everything. It would be good to

> have the information all there....that way, if they 'gang up on

> us' as they are 'wont to do', we will be ready to show them that

> there is a 'hole in that thar bucket'.)

>

The overwhelming Truth will silence them.

 

 

> You said:

> i have given up trying to reason with them. You should too once

> there is sufficient Q & A material.

> (i will never try to reason with them. It is just impossible! They

> do not base their doctrines and dogmas on the logical facts from

> the traditional Judeo-Christian " God-Logic " , but have twisted and

> turned Jesus to be His Father, when what Jesus is clearly

> saying...is that His Father and Himself are One In Spirit! How can

> you reason with that kind of 'non-sense'. You just can't! It

> completely defies any logic. However, God is not illogical. He is

> actually very logical, when it comes to HARD FACTS, but they just

> cannot see these HARD FACTS which are staring them right in the

> face!!! Believe me!!!....i will be glad to stop trying to reason

> with them, once i have collected enough evidence.)

>

 

Christian fundamentalists are by far the worst of the lot. i have

met them over the years and know their outrageous ability to quote

the most obscure verse to defend their beliefs. i know of a

Jehovah's Witness who still wants to convert me. Believing in Jesus

is just not enough. So just forget about them.

 

jagbir

[Guest guest]

Dear Jagbir,

 

Thanks for the info. i have made a separate file and am keeping everything saved

in there, so when the time comes to upload, there will be a substantial amount.

 

The idea of someone be it Jehovah's Witness or whatever wanting to 'convert'

someone....well, i don't think that any of the Divine Incarnations or Prophets

actually tried to 'convert' a person, as such. They usually just encouraged them

to 'mend their ways' to become more spiritually minded.

 

Jesus Himself said that the Law and Prophets, that is, the Ten Commandments are

fulfilled if we love our neighbour as ourself.

 

Really....that covers it all! Jesus was able to put in a 'nutshell' what all the

Laws and Prophets really taught.

 

" For the whole Law is fulfilled in one word, in the statement, " You shall love

your neighbor as yourself. " (Galatians 5:14)

 

i do believe that to try and 'convert' someone to a 'way of religious

thinking' is not really loving that person. There is an ulterior

motive, whether this is known or not.

 

The ultimate is to tell others the Divine Message without any ulterior motive,

such as wanting them to become members of some particular church.

 

love and best wishes,

 

Violet

 

 

 

, " jagbir singh "

<adishakti_org wrote:

>

> , " Violet "

> <violet.tubb@> wrote:

> >

> > Dear Jagbir,

> >

> > You said:

> > " We should never try convincing a fundamentalist because it is a

> > sheer waste of energy and time. i will not waste my time with

> > them. " (i agree it is a waste of time to try and convince a

> > fundamentalist regarding their 'lack of fundamentals.')

> >

>

> Yes Violet, never try to convince a fundamentalist. Glaciers recede

> faster than them to the truth (of global warming).

>

> > You said:

> > " But you need to compile hard facts against them. Your present

> > answers should be saved, and over time more added. "

> > (Jagbir, is what i have written what you had in mind,

> > regarding 'hard facts against them'. i am just not sure if this is

> > what you had in mind?)

> >

> Hard facts are irrefutable evidence gleaned from scriptures,

> spiritual experiences and science. We are sure the Earth is older

> than 6000 years and not built in 6 days. There are many ways to

> demolish fundamentalists like John.

>

> > You said:

> > " Your present answers should be saved, and over time more added. "

> > (Jagbir, where are these to be saved? Am i supposed to save them

> > somewhere, or are you uploading them to the Site Designated?)

> >

>

> Just save them in your computer Violet for the time being. You will

> need to have around 50 pages or more before i will upload onto the

> new website.

>

> > You said:

> > " Once there is sufficient data all you need is post him/her one at

> > a time or the whole works. "

> > (That will work really well and not be time-consuming.)

> >

> There is nothing easier than pressing a few keys to retrieve data

> and answer FAQ questions.

>

> > You said:

> > " Perhaps you may want to have a section devoted just

> > to 'fundamentalism'. This will save you so much energy in future -

> > as easy as pressing a button. "

> > (Yes, that would be a really good idea. Are you meaning for the

> > Fundamentalism Section to be on the Designated New Website? It

> > would definitely be an energy-saver.)

> >

> Yes, that all will be for the new website. " Fundamentalism " should

> be a section that will be useful. All the seven websites will

> eventually be cross-linked for reference purposes. Ultimately they

> should have data to cover every aspect of spirituality, a sort of

> one-stop mega-spiritual mall. i am talking about a few thousand

> webpages. This is going to take a long time but the rigorous journey

> will be dearly appreciated by many in future.

>

>

> > You said:

> > " That way you can let the fundamentalist digest all the facts

> > against them, the more the better. "

> > (That's true. Maybe, they need to see it in black-and-white. At

> > least we don't have to re-hash everything. It would be good to

> > have the information all there....that way, if they 'gang up on

> > us' as they are 'wont to do', we will be ready to show them that

> > there is a 'hole in that thar bucket'.)

> >

> The overwhelming Truth will silence them.

>

>

> > You said:

> > i have given up trying to reason with them. You should too once

> > there is sufficient Q & A material.

> > (i will never try to reason with them. It is just impossible! They

> > do not base their doctrines and dogmas on the logical facts from

> > the traditional Judeo-Christian " God-Logic " , but have twisted and

> > turned Jesus to be His Father, when what Jesus is clearly

> > saying...is that His Father and Himself are One In Spirit! How can

> > you reason with that kind of 'non-sense'. You just can't! It

> > completely defies any logic. However, God is not illogical. He is

> > actually very logical, when it comes to HARD FACTS, but they just

> > cannot see these HARD FACTS which are staring them right in the

> > face!!! Believe me!!!....i will be glad to stop trying to reason

> > with them, once i have collected enough evidence.)

> >

>

> Christian fundamentalists are by far the worst of the lot. i have

> met them over the years and know their outrageous ability to quote

> the most obscure verse to defend their beliefs. i know of a

> Jehovah's Witness who still wants to convert me. Believing in Jesus

> is just not enough. So just forget about them.

>

> jagbir

>