I ask you to consider that it may be time to stop openly fighting.

[Guest guest]

Dear Jagbir,

 

I understand your frustration that Shri Mataji has been very little

announced in Her greater form, as explained on your homepage. But I

noted twice recently that She was named as a Goddess on the

Sahajayoga.org news pages (SWAN). One of these items also calls Her

the Adi Shakti, surely a large step forward. Going back perhaps

three or four years there was even the official website

theworldsavior.org , which for a while mentioned in a quite simple

but open way that Shri Mataji was a divine person, who had

incarnated to save humanity. Later they cancelled that website and

made it the same as sahjayoga.org.

 

SWAN had this in 2006: " ....the Realize America Tour culminated at

the feet of the Adi Shakti at Her home in Calabasas California "

 

---------------

- Raksha Bandhan With The Goddess

 

On the auspicious occasion of Raksha Bandhan on the evening of

August 9, the Realize America Tour culminated at the feet of the Adi

Shakti at Her home in Calabasas California.

http://www.sahajayoga.org/swan/view/swan_543_2006.asp

---------------

..

and this:

..

---------------

- The Goddess Arrives in the City of Angels

 

The most auspicious occasion of Her Holiness Shri Mataji Nirmala

Devi arriving in Los Angeles occurred Thursday, the day of the Guru.

 

http://www.sahajayoga.org/swan/view/swan_536_2006.asp

---------------

..

So, these were either 'mistakes' against policy made by both the

author of the report and the website controller or there has been a

slight shift in the level of 'clarity' which is allowed about Shri

Mataji's status. Slight yes, but significant.

..

..

 

Can you please explain what happened in June 2006? Perhaps I missed

something important. You wrote:

 

" They were finally compelled to completely disassociate themselves

from the organization in June 2006 when WCASY members, taking

advantage of an incapacitated 83-year-old Shri Mataji, openly

claimed and appointed themselves to be the sole representatives of

Her Will. "

 

Did I miss some new public announcement about the authority of WCASY

or was it this next item you are referring to, relating events from

way back in 2005 and containing Sir CP's explanation of Shri

Mataji's wishes at that time:

 

http://www.sahajayoga.org/swan/view/swan_512_2006.asp

 

or was it something more private, in relation to yourself and family

that they had decided in June 2006?

 

Whatever may be the answer, I remember a key seminar in the UK at

Cheltenham and the talk on 31st July 1982. I recall that I was

present. Shri Mataji said:

 

" You have to dedicate yourself completely to me, not to Sahaja Yoga,

but to me. Sahaja Yoga is only one of my aspects. Leaving everything

you have to dedicate. Complete dedication - otherwise you cannot

ascend any further. Without questioning, without arguing. Complete

dedication is the only way you can achieve it. "

 

Your website has no record of this talk or quotation, that I could

find, but it is extremely significant, for the world and for your

family. So WCASY is about the advancement of SY and that is perhaps

its entire scope and authority. I do not have, to hand, a copy of

their charter or any authorisation from Shri Mataji, which might

explain their role in more detail. But I suggest, like a lawyer

identifying a loophole in established legislation, that in relation

to Shri Mataji's other aspects, well...WCASY has no authority

there! Am I right or am I right? What aspects? A deep topic

certainly but here are some aspects and I cannot say clearly yet if

it is useful, in anything more than an academic sense, to consider

them in the context of the material above. Probably it is useful...

 

- Paramchaitanya (the cosmic mechanism of consciousness operating

the created universe and its evolution, within its own folds. SY and

WCASY are within that and are subservient to that)

 

- Mahamaya (the God and Goddess maintaining a distance from people

who do not deserve Her darshan - The Bible says 'do not cast pearls

before swine' and in the Bhagvat Gita Shri Krishna tells Arjuna

something like not to tell the full and subtlest of truths to those

who only know or deserve the part)

 

- Music (a universal discipline, well established in both secular

and religious fields and offering something to enrich human life and

consciousness)

 

- Kundalini (a core issue in SY but well beyond the control of SY.

People whose Kundalini is really established and active need no

higher authorisations for their actions. There was a New Year Puja

in Kalwe, Bombay, back in about '97 in which Shri Mataji said, in

broad terms, that previously people had needed to take Her

permission before starting major projects but now She was giving us

permission to go ahead with our plans without asking Her. Something

might also have been said that there was an implicit requirement

that those actions to be taken were auspicious. How to judge that?

Even checking vibrations many people can make mistakes. National

leaders have sometimes failed to discriminate when activity was

inauspicious. I said to myself that one might introduce a criterion,

whenever there was any doubt, of: " Would Mahatma Gandhi approve of

what you are doing? " Many of his decisions and opinions had

tradition as a basis and were supported by wisdom and were also

consistent with rationality.)

 

Perhaps there are people in SY who do not deserve the role of

announcing Shri Mataji or being part of the announcing process. Shri

Mataji often said that anybody might come to SY and some would be

completely useless and others very negative. This reference by me is

a bit rational and sounds just like an excuse to be 'out'.

 

Next point is very significant. Sheffield seminar 1985 in the UK:

Shri Mataji explained that if a person is not collective, they catch

on Sahastrar as well as Vishuddhi and the reason is that Shri

Mataji, in the Sahastrar, is the Collectivity of all the Deities. I

never heard or saw that same point being made before or after

Sheffield but the audio tape has recorded it.

 

There can be a difference of fundamental significance between the

issue of being physically in or out of the collective, as opposed to

the issue of being a person who, by temperament or nature, is

collective or uncollective. Collectivity is a state. This is a

delicate area and it may be dangerous for someone who is both

psychologically and physically outside the SY collective to believe

themselves as collective or even as more collective than those

inside. But it could sometimes be the truth. Good people and

incarnations have always been marginalised or opposed. William Blake

was consider to be a crazy or an unworthy person by many, while he

was alive. He wrote to a friend:

 

" ...Yet I laugh & sing, for if on Earth neglected I am in heaven a

Prince among Princes, & even on Earth beloved by the Good as a Good

man. "

 

He went on to write:

 

" ...for as Man liveth not by bread alone, I shall live altho' I

should want bread- nothing is necessary to me but to do my duty & to

rejoice in the exceeding joy that is always poured out on my Spirit,

to pray that my friends & you above the rest may be partakers of the

joy that the world cannot conceive, that you may still be

replenish'd with the same & be as you always have been, a glorious &

triumphant Dweller in immortality. "

 

Here, however, is the bottom line: If somebody is out of the

collective, because they are uncollective, then their Sahastrar will

not open properly and they have little authority to announce and

promote the Goddess of the Sahastrar. If they try, it is unlikely to

achieve much and they will most likely become lost in ego or super

ego or both, having very limited access to higher positions.

Vibrations will not support their activities. On a related issue,

there is a quote on the cover of an Indian Divine Cool Breeze

collection of Shri Mataji's talks, 1998:

 

" Be sure that you are telling the truth and nothing else and that

you have felt the truth in full ways. Those who have not felt the

vibrations should not talk of Sahaja Yoga. They have no authority.

They have to receive vibrations. They have to fully imbibe within

them and then they can say : " Yes, we felt. " This is a very important

task Sahaja Yogis have to do in modern times, i.e. to tell aloud

that they have found the truth. "

 

Superficial yogis always explain about the Sahastrar Chalkra, for

example in public programmes, that it is the integration of all the

other chakras. They miss the point that there is a higher role. The

Sahastrar chakra knows and indicates and actively supports truth and

its manifestation.

 

But, to change the subject, the Mahamaya issue is interesting. If

God's existence, about which there is still public debate and no

resolution, becomes public knowledge in some concrete sense and

according to some degree of proof or weight of evidence, then it

takes away much of the illusory sense that human's have of

possessing free will. Have you watched the MATRIX movies? Maybe Shri

Mataji is not ready for that to happen, for the illusion to pass

away. I have often been frustrated that SY looked on the outside

just like a chakra cleansing cult but I took this view - I could see

that many national and international leaders had some skill in

addressing and controlling large groups of yogis, and many were well

established financially and thus able to travel, but they had no

apparent interest or habit to communicate outside SY. I formed an

opinion, quite often, that Shri Mataji used such people, whose

communication or collective skills were really only there on a

superficial level, to maintain a necessary stability.

 

So, time to draw a conclusion. First the Goddess and Adi Shakti

announcement. Then the talk about 'SY is only one of my aspects'

which might come as a surprise for you. Then the Sheffield seminar

talk and the issue of what the Sahastrar chakra will tolerate. I ask

you to consider that it may be time to stop openly fighting the

organisation of SY. Perhaps that is not worthy of your time or

perhaps you don't have the Divine authority or the truth may lie

somewhere between. In the full context, the role of the WCASY may be

smaller than it thinks.

 

I am not going to judge you on the basis of a website or your words

there. I do think that you should continue but with a change of

attitude or outer presentation. ...

 

I trust that my message above is more reliable for the benefit of

that Darshan.

 

Kind Regards,

 

Xxxxxx

[Guest guest]

Dear Xxxxx,

you imply that WCASY tried to present Shri Mataji as

a divine personality. But calling Her Adi Shakti on

the website, makes little relevance for people with

Christian or Muslim background. They simply do not

know what it means. Also writing " Godess " on the

website

is not going to bring much. The roman and greek

mitologies are full of " Godesses " . Do you know how

many

websites about gurus pretending they are the Adi

Shakti exists?

Don't you think that " Last Judgment " and

" Resurection " have by far a better and wider impact?

But of course, to declare that we are living this

great times, one needs to have knowledge and faith in

what you say. It seems that WCASY and the leaders of

SY have neither knowledge nor faith. Otherwise why are

they brave only during pujas, seminars etc, and run

away when openly declaring what they believe in

privat?

The " come and take Realisation " procedure of the

leaders has failed and of course they noticed that,

but they won't change it because they either don't

have the faith in declaring SM's advent or their ego

is too high to admit they had so sadly mistaken.

You ask Jagbir " to stop openly fighting " . What would

you do instead? Continue the endless seminars about

treatments, Kundalini awakening (which people not

coming from Hindu culture have no idea what it is),

indian music. We have seen that this is not going to

bring anything.

best regards

Calin Martin

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

--- jagbir singh <adishakti_org wrote:

 

> Dear Jagbir,

>

> I understand your frustration that Shri Mataji has

> been very little

> announced in Her greater form, as explained on your

> homepage. But I

> noted twice recently that She was named as a Goddess

> on the

> Sahajayoga.org news pages (SWAN). One of these items

> also calls Her

> the Adi Shakti, surely a large step forward. Going

> back perhaps

> three or four years there was even the official

> website

> theworldsavior.org , which for a while mentioned in

> a quite simple

> but open way that Shri Mataji was a divine person,

> who had

> incarnated to save humanity. Later they cancelled

> that website and

> made it the same as sahjayoga.org.

>

> SWAN had this in 2006: " ....the Realize America

> Tour culminated at

> the feet of the Adi Shakti at Her home in Calabasas

> California "

>

> ---------------

> - Raksha Bandhan With The Goddess

>

> On the auspicious occasion of Raksha Bandhan on the

> evening of

> August 9, the Realize America Tour culminated at the

> feet of the Adi

> Shakti at Her home in Calabasas California.

>

http://www.sahajayoga.org/swan/view/swan_543_2006.asp

> ---------------

> .

> and this:

> .

> ---------------

> - The Goddess Arrives in the City of Angels

>

> The most auspicious occasion of Her Holiness Shri

> Mataji Nirmala

> Devi arriving in Los Angeles occurred Thursday, the

> day of the Guru.

>

>

http://www.sahajayoga.org/swan/view/swan_536_2006.asp

> ---------------

> .

> So, these were either 'mistakes' against policy made

> by both the

> author of the report and the website controller or

> there has been a

> slight shift in the level of 'clarity' which is

> allowed about Shri

> Mataji's status. Slight yes, but significant.

> .

> .

>

> Can you please explain what happened in June 2006?

> Perhaps I missed

> something important. You wrote:

>

> " They were finally compelled to completely

> disassociate themselves

> from the organization in June 2006 when WCASY

> members, taking

> advantage of an incapacitated 83-year-old Shri

> Mataji, openly

> claimed and appointed themselves to be the sole

> representatives of

> Her Will. "

>

> Did I miss some new public announcement about the

> authority of WCASY

> or was it this next item you are referring to,

> relating events from

> way back in 2005 and containing Sir CP's explanation

> of Shri

> Mataji's wishes at that time:

>

>

http://www.sahajayoga.org/swan/view/swan_512_2006.asp

>

> or was it something more private, in relation to

> yourself and family

> that they had decided in June 2006?

>

> Whatever may be the answer, I remember a key seminar

> in the UK at

> Cheltenham and the talk on 31st July 1982. I recall

> that I was

> present. Shri Mataji said:

>

> " You have to dedicate yourself completely to me, not

> to Sahaja Yoga,

> but to me. Sahaja Yoga is only one of my aspects.

> Leaving everything

> you have to dedicate. Complete dedication -

> otherwise you cannot

> ascend any further. Without questioning, without

> arguing. Complete

> dedication is the only way you can achieve it. "

>

> Your website has no record of this talk or

> quotation, that I could

> find, but it is extremely significant, for the world

> and for your

> family. So WCASY is about the advancement of SY and

> that is perhaps

> its entire scope and authority. I do not have, to

> hand, a copy of

> their charter or any authorisation from Shri Mataji,

> which might

> explain their role in more detail. But I suggest,

> like a lawyer

> identifying a loophole in established legislation,

> that in relation

> to Shri Mataji's other aspects, well...WCASY has no

> authority

> there! Am I right or am I right? What aspects? A

> deep topic

> certainly but here are some aspects and I cannot say

> clearly yet if

> it is useful, in anything more than an academic

> sense, to consider

> them in the context of the material above. Probably

> it is useful...

>

> - Paramchaitanya (the cosmic mechanism of

> consciousness operating

> the created universe and its evolution, within its

> own folds. SY and

> WCASY are within that and are subservient to that)

>

> - Mahamaya (the God and Goddess maintaining a

> distance from people

> who do not deserve Her darshan - The Bible says 'do

> not cast pearls

> before swine' and in the Bhagvat Gita Shri Krishna

> tells Arjuna

> something like not to tell the full and subtlest of

> truths to those

> who only know or deserve the part)

>

> - Music (a universal discipline, well established in

> both secular

> and religious fields and offering something to

> enrich human life and

> consciousness)

>

> - Kundalini (a core issue in SY but well beyond the

> control of SY.

> People whose Kundalini is really established and

> active need no

> higher authorisations for their actions. There was a

> New Year Puja

> in Kalwe, Bombay, back in about '97 in which Shri

> Mataji said, in

> broad terms, that previously people had needed to

> take Her

> permission before starting major projects but now

> She was giving us

> permission to go ahead with our plans without asking

> Her. Something

> might also have been said that there was an implicit

> requirement

> that those actions to be taken were auspicious. How

> to judge that?

> Even checking vibrations many people can make

> mistakes. National

> leaders have sometimes failed to discriminate when

> activity was

> inauspicious. I said to myself that one might

> introduce a criterion,

> whenever there was any doubt, of: " Would Mahatma

> Gandhi approve of

> what you are doing? " Many of his decisions and

> opinions had

> tradition as a basis and were supported by wisdom

> and were also

> consistent with rationality.)

>

> Perhaps there are people in SY who do not deserve

> the role of

> announcing Shri Mataji or being part of the

> announcing process. Shri

> Mataji often said that anybody might come to SY and

> some would be

> completely useless and others very negative. This

> reference by me is

> a bit rational and sounds just like an excuse to be

> 'out'.

>

> Next point is very significant. Sheffield seminar

> 1985 in the UK:

> Shri Mataji explained that if a person is not

> collective, they catch

> on Sahastrar as well as Vishuddhi and the reason is

> that Shri

> Mataji, in the Sahastrar, is the Collectivity of all

> the Deities. I

> never heard or saw that same point being made before

> or after

> Sheffield but the audio tape has recorded it.

>

> There can be a difference of fundamental

> significance between the

> issue of being physically in or out of the

> collective, as opposed to

> the issue of being a person who, by temperament or

> nature, is

> collective or uncollective. Collectivity is a state.

> This is a

> delicate area and it may be dangerous for someone

> who is both

> psychologically and physically outside the SY

> collective to believe

> themselves as collective or even as more collective

> than those

> inside. But it could sometimes be the truth. Good

> people and

> incarnations have always been marginalised or

> opposed. William Blake

> was consider to be a crazy or an unworthy person by

> many, while he

> was alive. He wrote to a friend:

>

> " ...Yet I laugh & sing, for if on Earth neglected I

> am in heaven a

> Prince among Princes, & even on Earth beloved by the

> Good as a Good

> man. "

>

> He went on to write:

>

> " ...for as Man liveth not by bread alone, I shall

> live altho' I

> should want bread- nothing is necessary to me but to

> do my duty & to

> rejoice in the exceeding joy that is always poured

> out on my Spirit,

> to pray that my friends & you above the rest may be

> partakers of the

> joy that the world cannot conceive, that you may

> still be

> replenish'd with the same & be as you always have

> been, a glorious &

> triumphant Dweller in immortality. "

>

> Here, however, is the bottom line: If somebody is

> out of the

> collective, because they are uncollective, then

> their Sahastrar will

> not open properly and they have little authority to

> announce and

> promote the Goddess of the Sahastrar. If they try,

> it is unlikely to

> achieve much and they will most likely become lost

> in ego or super

> ego or both, having very limited access to higher

> positions.

> Vibrations will not support their activities. On a

> related issue,

> there is a quote on the cover of an Indian Divine

> Cool Breeze

> collection of Shri Mataji's talks, 1998:

>

> " Be sure that you are telling the truth and nothing

> else and that

> you have felt the truth in full ways. Those who have

> not felt the

> vibrations should not talk of Sahaja Yoga. They have

> no authority.

> They have to receive vibrations. They have to fully

> imbibe within

> them and then they can say : " Yes, we felt. " This is

> a very important

> task Sahaja Yogis have to do in modern times, i.e.

> to tell aloud

> that they have found the truth. "

>

> Superficial yogis always explain about the Sahastrar

> Chalkra, for

> example in public programmes, that it is the

> integration of all the

> other chakras. They miss the point that there is a

> higher role. The

> Sahastrar chakra knows and indicates and actively

> supports truth and

> its manifestation.

>

> But, to change the subject, the Mahamaya issue is

> interesting. If

> God's existence, about which there is still public

> debate and no

> resolution, becomes public knowledge in some

> concrete sense and

> according to some degree of proof or weight of

> evidence, then it

> takes away much of the illusory sense that human's

> have of

> possessing free will. Have you watched the MATRIX

> movies? Maybe Shri

> Mataji is not ready for that to happen, for the

> illusion to pass

> away. I have often been frustrated that SY looked on

> the outside

> just like a chakra cleansing cult but I took this

> view - I could see

> that many national and international leaders had

> some skill in

> addressing and controlling large groups of yogis,

> and many were well

> established financially and thus able to travel, but

> they had no

> apparent interest or habit to communicate outside

> SY. I formed an

> opinion, quite often, that Shri Mataji used such

> people, whose

> communication or collective skills were really only

> there on a

> superficial level, to maintain a necessary

> stability.

>

> So, time to draw a conclusion. First the Goddess and

> Adi Shakti

> announcement. Then the talk about 'SY is only one of

> my aspects'

> which might come as a surprise for you. Then the

> Sheffield seminar

> talk and the issue of what the Sahastrar chakra will

> tolerate. I ask

> you to consider that it may be time to stop openly

> fighting the

> organisation of SY. Perhaps that is not worthy of

> your time or

> perhaps you don't have the Divine authority or the

> truth may lie

> somewhere between. In the full context, the role of

> the WCASY may be

> smaller than it thinks.

>

> I am not going to judge you on the basis of a

> website or your words

> there. I do think that you should continue but with

> a change of

> attitude or outer presentation. ...

>

> I trust that my message above is more reliable for

> the benefit of

> that Darshan.

>

> Kind Regards,

>

> Xxxxxx

>

>

>

>

 

 

visit my web-page :

http://www.geocities.com/calinez

 

Send instant messages to your online friends http://uk.messenger.

[Guest guest]

, Calin Martin

<calinez wrote:

>

> Dear Xxxxx,

> you imply that WCASY tried to present Shri Mataji as

> a divine personality. But calling Her Adi Shakti on

> the website, makes little relevance for people with

> Christian or Muslim background. They simply do not

> know what it means. Also writing " Godess " on the

> website is not going to bring much. The roman and greek

> mitologies are full of " Godesses " . Do you know how

> many

>

 

 

>

> Dear Jagbir,

>

> I understand your frustration that Shri Mataji has been very little

> announced in Her greater form, as explained on your homepage. But I

> noted twice recently that She was named as a Goddess on the

> Sahajayoga.org news pages (SWAN).

>

 

------------

 

>

> Dear jagbir,

>

> I felt compelled to write to you after i just visited adishakti.org

> after some months now when i realized your message on the

> frontpage. First let me introduce myself, my name is Xxxxx and i

> live in Xxxxx and i am Xx and got my realization X years back.

> Anyways I knew about your site for

>

 

Dear Xxxxx and Xxxxxxxxx,

 

i am willing to post your private response to maintain your identity

if any of you feel a response will compromise your standing in the

collective, or for any other reason. You may also adopt another ID

if you want to respond directly.

 

i know SYs are uncomfortable to post any remarks/response on this

forum as it will be taken as an anti-Sahaja Yoga sign by the SY

leadership. This may lead to problems in the local collective. As we

all know John Noyce is the official watchdog of WCASY who sends

reports to council member Alan Wherry. This Inquisytion chief then

directs other council members/Will-wannabees to use their influence

on the marked SY to bend to official rules. i don't want that to

happen again and am willing to work around this negativity.

 

Just two days ago i met a Montreal SY at the metro and we were going

in the same direction. Thus there was ample opportunity to catch up

on things and discuss about Shri Mataji and Sahaja Yoga. In the end

i told this person that the followers of Jesus Christ, Guru Nanak

and Prophet Muhammad openly announced the incarnation, and that only

SYs have that dubious distinction of being the first and only

followers in history afraid to do so. i added that Sahaja Yoga will

never spread till we spoke the truth.

 

This SY, clearly very uncomfortable to do so, responded by saying

that s/he have so many SY brothers and sisters who share the same

subtle system approach. Under no circumstance will s/he go against

the collective to declare the Truth without official approval. In

other words, it is far more important that s/he follow the official

subtle system approach and stay in the collective than risk telling

the truth and losing these friends.

 

i believe most SYs do not want to risk losing the joy of their

collectives, and thus rather remain silent or aloof. For me this is

a selfish and cowardly approach that betrays their lack of dharma

and lower level of self-realization.

 

i am not asking Xxxxx and Xxxxxxxx to reveal their identities. Just

their desire that the truth regarding Shri Mataji and Her Message be

told openly is enough and goes a long way to rally others. All you

need is an ID like Chandra and post here without any fear of

official reprisal. It is so comforting to support the Truth and

nourish mind, body and soul with a clear conscience. Try it and see

how you will progress.

 

regards,

 

 

jagbir

[Guest guest]

, " jagbir

singh " <adishakti_org wrote:

 

" It is so comforting to support the Truth and nourish mind, body and

soul with a clear conscience. Try it and see how you will progress. "

 

Dear Jagbir,

 

i agree wholeheartedly that it is so comforting to support the Truth and nourish

mind, body and soul with a clear conscience. i feel the loss of the physical

collective at times... especially when i just looked at the photographs of the

most beautifully renovated Burwood Ashram in Sydney, where i spent many

beautiful times with brothers and sisters.

 

However, i could never live with myself... with my conscience if i did not

speak/support the Truth. i feel compelled to do so, even if it goes against

Sahaja Yoga Politics. i understand that there is politics in every organisation,

however Sahaja Yoga is a Movement of Love that is supposed to uphold the HIGHEST

TRUTH at a time when there is much untruth in the world today.

 

Shri Mataji talked about TRUTH IN POLITICS. Truth is Truth and if the Truth is

just followed that is all that is needed. Truth is also above Politics. Even if

the Politics comes from SY leaders, it is not above Truth and never can be above

Truth. If by standing up for the Truth, it slightly ruffles the feathers of SY

Politicians, then that is the price they pay for not UPHOLDING THE TRUTH, but

suppressing the Truth. (We have evidence that SY Politicians are not upholding

the Truth but are actively suppressing the Truth.)

 

So... i (you) have to make the decision. Am i going to stand up for TRUTH IN

POLITICS... or not?

 

If there is not TRUTH IN POLITICS, and a person considers that TRUTH is above

POLITICS... as Jagbir has done... then he has to fight that from within or

without the Political Arena. He fought it within the arena surrounded by the SY

Politicians, but the numbers were against him, and those who were not against

him were subsequently lobbied to go against him. That is politics my dears...

not spirituality... i have to inform!

 

This does not mean that SY Collectives are not a great place where seekers can

come and have their self-realisation and get the subtle system knowledge and

learn that Shri Mataji is the Adi Shakti. This does not mean that being in the

collective is not a wonderful experience... because it is. But Truth comes over

Politics. That is the point, and when SY Elites play the Game of Politics and it

takes over the Truth, then the " Truth-Sayers " have to Say The Truth!

 

To not stand up for the Truth and act according to one's innermost conscience,

however, is a derreliction of duty to one's Spirit and

to the Adi Shakti (Holy Spirit) within. If a person loses their

physical collective and the beautiful surroundings due to going against a

political stance of a religious politician... then so be it. That is just the

price they have to pay. That does not mean that they willingly leave the

collective, but that is the price for going against the prevailing politicians,

who make life difficult and not nice if you don't agree with their political

opinion and consider you as an enemy of their political stance.

 

In a Movement of Love, which Sahaja Yoga is... politics must not take over from

the Truth. i am sure one day many SYs will appreciate that others sacrificed

collective togetherness in order to uphold Truth. The (unnamed) young student is

appreciating it. Kyyan appreciated it. Chuck appreciated it. i have appreciated

also that Jagbir has stood up for Truth in the Politics of SY.

 

violet

 

 

, Calin Martin

> <calinez@> wrote:

> >

> > Dear Xxxxx,

> > you imply that WCASY tried to present Shri Mataji as

> > a divine personality. But calling Her Adi Shakti on

> > the website, makes little relevance for people with

> > Christian or Muslim background. They simply do not

> > know what it means. Also writing " Godess " on the

> > website is not going to bring much. The roman and greek

> > mitologies are full of " Godesses " . Do you know how

> > many

> >

>

>

> >

> > Dear Jagbir,

> >

> > I understand your frustration that Shri Mataji has been very

little

> > announced in Her greater form, as explained on your homepage. But

I

> > noted twice recently that She was named as a Goddess on the

> > Sahajayoga.org news pages (SWAN).

> >

>

> ------------

>

> >

> > Dear jagbir,

> >

> > I felt compelled to write to you after i just visited

adishakti.org

> > after some months now when i realized your message on the

> > frontpage. First let me introduce myself, my name is Xxxxx and i

> > live in Xxxxx and i am Xx and got my realization X years back.

> > Anyways I knew about your site for

> >

>

> Dear Xxxxx and Xxxxxxxxx,

>

> i am willing to post your private response to maintain your identity

> if any of you feel a response will compromise your standing in the

> collective, or for any other reason. You may also adopt another ID

> if you want to respond directly.

>

> i know SYs are uncomfortable to post any remarks/response on this

> forum as it will be taken as an anti-Sahaja Yoga sign by the SY

> leadership. This may lead to problems in the local collective. As we

> all know John Noyce is the official watchdog of WCASY who sends

> reports to council member Alan Wherry. This Inquisytion chief then

> directs other council members/Will-wannabees to use their influence

> on the marked SY to bend to official rules. i don't want that to

> happen again and am willing to work around this negativity.

>

> Just two days ago i met a Montreal SY at the metro and we were going

> in the same direction. Thus there was ample opportunity to catch up

> on things and discuss about Shri Mataji and Sahaja Yoga. In the end

> i told this person that the followers of Jesus Christ, Guru Nanak

> and Prophet Muhammad openly announced the incarnation, and that only

> SYs have that dubious distinction of being the first and only

> followers in history afraid to do so. i added that Sahaja Yoga will

> never spread till we spoke the truth.

>

> This SY, clearly very uncomfortable to do so, responded by saying

> that s/he have so many SY brothers and sisters who share the same

> subtle system approach. Under no circumstance will s/he go against

> the collective to declare the Truth without official approval. In

> other words, it is far more important that s/he follow the official

> subtle system approach and stay in the collective than risk telling

> the truth and losing these friends.

>

> i believe most SYs do not want to risk losing the joy of their

> collectives, and thus rather remain silent or aloof. For me this is

> a selfish and cowardly approach that betrays their lack of dharma

> and lower level of self-realization.

>

> i am not asking Xxxxx and Xxxxxxxx to reveal their identities. Just

> their desire that the truth regarding Shri Mataji and Her Message be

> told openly is enough and goes a long way to rally others. All you

> need is an ID like Chandra and post here without any fear of

> official reprisal. It is so comforting to support the Truth and

> nourish mind, body and soul with a clear conscience. Try it and see

> how you will progress.

>

> regards,

>

>

> jagbir

>

[Guest guest]

Dear xxxxxx,

 

Jagbir is not fighting for anything but the Truth. Nobody would spend

that much time, tirelessly and consistently working... if they did

not have a mission to get Shri Mataji's Message and Identity out there. It is

due to Jagbir's consistent efforts over the years that we have at least one

website that proclaims the Divine Message and Identity of Shri Mataji to the

public.

 

The website http://www.adishakti.org/ also gives " Eschatological Evidence " in

support of Shri Mataji's Divine Message and Identity. It is an essential

resource for every Sahaja Yogi, and for their use. There is also

http://www.al-qiyamah.org/ for Muslims. SYs will not find any such information

or evidence on any other website, because as promised... Shri Mataji has

revealed much about the spiritual world through Jagbir's children... two of

which She said are special personalities. The Adi Shakti has revealed that two

of them are " angels " which accompany Her. So... please do not forget that it is

" Her Evidence " that the Adi Shakti has given. it is not Jagbir's evidence. It is

not Jagbir's children's evidence. It is the Adi Shakti's Evidence. Accept it or

reject it... the evidence is there for all to study.

 

Going back in time to the mid- 1990's, i remember we SYs were burning any

negativity that was preventing an Official Announcement of Her Message and

Identity. (That was a precious time for me with much hope.) Little did we know

then, however... that the negativity that was preventing an Official

Announcement was within SY itself. It was the SY leadership! And over the years

the leadership have convinced their followers of the same determination... and

this determination is that Shri Mataji Nirmala Devi does not need an Official

Announcement of Her Divine Message and Incarnation. So the simple thing SM said

would happen... has happened. Jagbir is now responsible for Her Message from

'outside the organisation of SY' just as SM predicted... if SYs were not 'up to

the Task'.

 

Regarding an 'open fight'... 'open fighting' is much better. SY leadership

fought Jagbir behind his back in a hidden manner and called his children

possessed. They should have done so openly in front of all SYs instead of doing

so in a hidden manner, thus preventing general knowledge of what was happening.

Jagbir certainly did not want this fight. He was only given this spiritual

responsibility because the SY leadership refused to take it on. They shirked

their spiritual duty to the Adi Shakti by not Offically Announcing Her Divine

Message and Incarnation when She had asked them to. Therefore the Open Spiritual

Battle (which is what it is) will continue until Shri Mataji's Divine Message

and Identity is known to the whole world. That is the Spiritual Mission of

Jagbir's Website.

 

On a more positive note, there is a lot for SYs to learn from Jagbir's website.

It gives information for a Spiritual Message Approach. There needs to be a

Spiritual Approach now, so that when people have their self-realisation, they

will not think it is just about meditation and chakras. (They need to know how

it relates to Jesus's Message if they come from the West, for example.)

 

It is important to understand what is at stake here. It is not important to

please religious politicians when Her Message and Identity are at stake. If SYs

determine to give people the Spiritual Message instead of just a Subtle System

Message... then that is good. The seekers can also be referred to these websites

where they will learn as much as they desire about Shri Mataji. It is all very

straightforward and simple. Better not to make it too complicated.

 

with love and best wishes,

 

violet

 

 

,

" Violet " <violet.tubb wrote:

>

> , " jagbir

> singh " <adishakti_org@> wrote:

>

> " It is so comforting to support the Truth and nourish mind, body and

> soul with a clear conscience. Try it and see how you will progress. "

>

> Dear Jagbir,

>

> i agree wholeheartedly that it is so comforting to support the

Truth and nourish mind, body and soul with a clear conscience. i feel

the loss of the physical collective at times... especially when i

just looked at the photographs of the most beautifully renovated

Burwood Ashram in Sydney, where i spent many beautiful times with

brothers and sisters.

>

> However, i could never live with myself... with my conscience if i

did not speak/support the Truth. i feel compelled to do so, even if

it goes against Sahaja Yoga Politics. i understand that there is

politics in every organisation, however Sahaja Yoga is a Movement of

Love that is supposed to uphold the HIGHEST TRUTH at a time when

there is much untruth in the world today.

>

> Shri Mataji talked about TRUTH IN POLITICS. Truth is Truth and if

the Truth is just followed that is all that is needed. Truth is also

above Politics. Even if the Politics comes from SY leaders, it is not

above Truth and never can be above Truth. If by standing up for the

Truth, it slightly ruffles the feathers of SY Politicians, then that

is the price they pay for not UPHOLDING THE TRUTH, but suppressing

the Truth. (We have evidence that SY Politicians are not upholding

the Truth but are actively suppressing the Truth.)

>

> So... i (you) have to make the decision. Am i going to stand up for

TRUTH IN POLITICS... or not?

>

> If there is not TRUTH IN POLITICS, and a person considers that

TRUTH is above POLITICS... as Jagbir has done... then he has to fight

that from within or without the Political Arena. He fought it within

the arena surrounded by the SY Politicians, but the numbers were

against him, and those who were not against him were subsequently

lobbied to go against him. That is politics my dears... not

spirituality... i have to inform!

>

> This does not mean that SY Collectives are not a great place where

seekers can come and have their self-realisation and get the subtle

system knowledge and learn that Shri Mataji is the Adi Shakti. This

does not mean that being in the collective is not a wonderful

experience... because it is. But Truth comes over Politics. That is

the point, and when SY Elites play the Game of Politics and it takes

over the Truth, then the " Truth-Sayers " have to Say The Truth!

>

> To not stand up for the Truth and act according to one's innermost

conscience, however, is a derreliction of duty to one's Spirit and

> to the Adi Shakti (Holy Spirit) within. If a person loses their

> physical collective and the beautiful surroundings due to going

against a political stance of a religious politician... then so be

it. That is just the price they have to pay. That does not mean that

they willingly leave the collective, but that is the price for going

against the prevailing politicians, who make life difficult and not

nice if you don't agree with their political opinion and consider you

as an enemy of their political stance.

>

> In a Movement of Love, which Sahaja Yoga is... politics must not

take over from the Truth. i am sure one day many SYs will appreciate

that others sacrificed collective togetherness in order to uphold

Truth. The (unnamed) young student is appreciating it. Kyyan

appreciated it. Chuck appreciated it. i have appreciated also that

Jagbir has stood up for Truth in the Politics of SY.

>

> violet

>

>

> , Calin Martin

> > <calinez@> wrote:

> > >

> > > Dear Xxxxx,

> > > you imply that WCASY tried to present Shri Mataji as

> > > a divine personality. But calling Her Adi Shakti on

> > > the website, makes little relevance for people with

> > > Christian or Muslim background. They simply do not

> > > know what it means. Also writing " Godess " on the

> > > website is not going to bring much. The roman and greek

> > > mitologies are full of " Godesses " . Do you know how

> > > many

> > >

> >

> >

> > >

> > > Dear Jagbir,

> > >

> > > I understand your frustration that Shri Mataji has been very

> little

> > > announced in Her greater form, as explained on your homepage.

But

> I

> > > noted twice recently that She was named as a Goddess on the

> > > Sahajayoga.org news pages (SWAN).

> > >

> >

> > ------------

> >

> > >

> > > Dear jagbir,

> > >

> > > I felt compelled to write to you after i just visited

> adishakti.org

> > > after some months now when i realized your message on the

> > > frontpage. First let me introduce myself, my name is Xxxxx and i

> > > live in Xxxxx and i am Xx and got my realization X years back.

> > > Anyways I knew about your site for

> > >

> >

> > Dear Xxxxx and Xxxxxxxxx,

> >

> > i am willing to post your private response to maintain your

identity

> > if any of you feel a response will compromise your standing in the

> > collective, or for any other reason. You may also adopt another ID

> > if you want to respond directly.

> >

> > i know SYs are uncomfortable to post any remarks/response on this

> > forum as it will be taken as an anti-Sahaja Yoga sign by the SY

> > leadership. This may lead to problems in the local collective. As

we

> > all know John Noyce is the official watchdog of WCASY who sends

> > reports to council member Alan Wherry. This Inquisytion chief then

> > directs other council members/Will-wannabees to use their

influence

> > on the marked SY to bend to official rules. i don't want that to

> > happen again and am willing to work around this negativity.

> >

> > Just two days ago i met a Montreal SY at the metro and we were

going

> > in the same direction. Thus there was ample opportunity to catch

up

> > on things and discuss about Shri Mataji and Sahaja Yoga. In the

end

> > i told this person that the followers of Jesus Christ, Guru Nanak

> > and Prophet Muhammad openly announced the incarnation, and that

only

> > SYs have that dubious distinction of being the first and only

> > followers in history afraid to do so. i added that Sahaja Yoga

will

> > never spread till we spoke the truth.

> >

> > This SY, clearly very uncomfortable to do so, responded by saying

> > that s/he have so many SY brothers and sisters who share the same

> > subtle system approach. Under no circumstance will s/he go against

> > the collective to declare the Truth without official approval. In

> > other words, it is far more important that s/he follow the

official

> > subtle system approach and stay in the collective than risk

telling

> > the truth and losing these friends.

> >

> > i believe most SYs do not want to risk losing the joy of their

> > collectives, and thus rather remain silent or aloof. For me this

is

> > a selfish and cowardly approach that betrays their lack of dharma

> > and lower level of self-realization.

> >

> > i am not asking Xxxxx and Xxxxxxxx to reveal their identities.

Just

> > their desire that the truth regarding Shri Mataji and Her Message

be

> > told openly is enough and goes a long way to rally others. All you

> > need is an ID like Chandra and post here without any fear of

> > official reprisal. It is so comforting to support the Truth and

> > nourish mind, body and soul with a clear conscience. Try it and

see

> > how you will progress.

> >

> > regards,

> >

> >

> > jagbir

> >

>

[Guest guest]

, " jagbir singh " <adishakti_org

wrote:

>

> Dear Jagbir,

>

> I understand your frustration that Shri Mataji has been very little

> announced in Her greater form, as explained on your homepage. But I

> noted twice recently that She was named as a Goddess on the

> Sahajayoga.org news pages (SWAN). One of these items also calls Her

> the Adi Shakti, surely a large step forward. Going back perhaps

> three or four years there was even the official website

> theworldsavior.org , which for a while mentioned in a quite simple

> but open way that Shri Mataji was a divine person, who had

> incarnated to save humanity. Later they cancelled that website and

> made it the same as sahjayoga.org.

>

> SWAN had this in 2006: " ....the Realize America Tour culminated at

> the feet of the Adi Shakti at Her home in Calabasas California "

>

> ---------------

> - Raksha Bandhan With The Goddess

>

> On the auspicious occasion of Raksha Bandhan on the evening of

> August 9, the Realize America Tour culminated at the feet of the

> Adi Shakti at Her home in Calabasas California.

> http://www.sahajayoga.org/swan/view/swan_543_2006.asp

> ---------------

> .

> and this:

> .

> ---------------

> - The Goddess Arrives in the City of Angels

>

> The most auspicious occasion of Her Holiness Shri Mataji Nirmala

> Devi arriving in Los Angeles occurred Thursday, the day of the

> Guru.

>

> http://www.sahajayoga.org/swan/view/swan_536_2006.asp

> ---------------

> .

> So, these were either 'mistakes' against policy made by both the

> author of the report and the website controller or there has been a

> slight shift in the level of 'clarity' which is allowed about Shri

> Mataji's status. Slight yes, but significant.

> .

 

We must realize that SWAN is mainly for Sahaja Yoga announcements like pujas,

programs, book releases etc. Non-SYs do not visit SWAN. So it hardly makes any

difference or qualify as a shift in the level of 'clarity'. As you said " Going

back perhaps three or four years there was even the official website

theworldsavior.org, which for a while mentioned in a quite simple but open way

that Shri Mataji was a divine person, who had incarnated to save humanity. " Now

even this has been removed and have regressed since. They just do not have what

it takes to do what Shri Mataji has wanted done since the 1980s.

 

>

> Can you please explain what happened in June 2006? Perhaps I missed

> something important. You wrote:

>

> " They were finally compelled to completely disassociate themselves

> from the organization in June 2006 when WCASY members, taking

> advantage of an incapacitated 83-year-old Shri Mataji, openly

> claimed and appointed themselves to be the sole representatives of

> Her Will. "

>

> Did I miss some new public announcement about the authority of

> WCASY or was it this next item you are referring to, relating

> events from way back in 2005 and containing Sir CP's explanation

> of Shri Mataji's wishes at that time:

>

> http://www.sahajayoga.org/swan/view/swan_512_2006.asp

>

> or was it something more private, in relation to yourself and

> family that they had decided in June 2006?

>

 

In www.adishakti.org i write in the third person. Perhaps that caused some

confusion.

 

The day i realized that Sir CP wants SYs to believe that WCASY represents the

Will of the Adi Shakti i decided to completely disassociate from the Sahaja Yoga

organization. As a family we do not want to participate or empower in any way a

group of humans who have the temerity and ignorance to believe they can be

representatives of the Adi Shakti's Will. Till today i still cannot find the

words to describe this blasphemy. Maybe it's time SYs understand what

" blasphemy " means:

 

Main Entry: blas•phe•my

Pronunciation: 'blas-f & -mE

Function: noun

Inflected Form(s): plural -mies

1 a : the act of insulting or showing contempt or lack of reverence for God b :

the act of claiming the attributes of deity

2 : irreverence toward something considered sacred or inviolable

 

www.webster.com/dictionary/blasphemy

 

>

> Whatever may be the answer, I remember a key seminar in the UK at

> Cheltenham and the talk on 31st July 1982. I recall that I was

> present. Shri Mataji said:

>

> " You have to dedicate yourself completely to me, not to Sahaja

> Yoga, but to me. Sahaja Yoga is only one of my aspects. Leaving

> everything you have to dedicate. Complete dedication - otherwise

> you cannot ascend any further. Without questioning, without

> arguing. Complete dedication is the only way you can achieve it. "

>

 

This quote only gives added weight as to what i am trying to denounce about the

celebrated hijacking of Her Will by WCASY. By complete dedication Shri Mataji is

also implying that we obey and carry out Her instructions unconditionally

............... and that includes declaring Her advent and Divine Message to

humanity. So how come those who claim to represent Her Will do not have the will

to do Her Will? Was there a loss of cerebral data during what is now touted by

WCASY as the historic transfer of Her Will?

 

>

> Your website has no record of this talk or quotation, that I could

> find, but it is extremely significant, for the world and for your

> family.

>

 

Yes, i still have to put this very important quote. i will do so at the proper

place and time.

 

>

> So WCASY is about the advancement of SY and that is perhaps its

> entire scope and authority. I do not have, to hand, a copy of

> their charter or any authorisation from Shri Mataji, which might

> explain their role in more detail. But I suggest, like a lawyer

> identifying a loophole in established legislation, that in relation

> to Shri Mataji's other aspects, well...WCASY has no authority

> there! Am I right or am I right? What aspects?

>

 

This is what Shri Mataji said when WCASY was formed 14th June, 2004:

 

 

WORLD COUNCIL FOR THE ADVANCEMENT OF SAHAJA YOGA

 

In addition to those already appointed, Bohdan Shehovych is designated as a

World Leader and Member of the Council.

 

Gagan Ahluwalia, Paul Ellis, Alan Wherry and Alan Pereira, formerly appointed as

Advisors, are hereby designated as World Leaders and Members of the Council.

Alan Pereira will function as Member-Secretary of the Council.

 

The World Council will be a perpetual body for providing inspiring and elevating

guidance to SAHAJA YOGIS and YOGINIS throughout the world with a view,

primarily, to creating complete ONENESS among them all. The World Council will

further promote a deeper and an ever-widening perennial message of SAHAJA YOGA

in all parts of the world. The World Council may suggest specific programmes for

this purpose.

 

The composition of the World Council will be reviewed by me from time to time,

as necessary.

 

An updated list of the World Leaders and Members of the WORLD COUNCIL is

annexed.

 

 

SHRI MATAJI NIRMALA DEVI

 

14th June, 2004

 

 

Till date WCASY has neither the will, direction nor knowledge to " promote a

deeper and an ever-widening perennial message of SAHAJA YOGA in all parts of the

world. " Despite all the hype it is common knowledge that few seekers ever stay,

and growth has stagnated in Europe and North America. Moreover, there are many

countries where Sahaja Yoga is non-existent. i did that infamous calculation

that at present rate of progress 1% of the world will know about Sahaja Yoga by

the year 8023 AD! And by " Sahaja Yoga " i mean much more than the official

self-realization/subtle system public pretendtation.

 

Although Shri Mataji mentioned that the " World Council may suggest specific

programmes for this purpose " it continues to keep seekers in the dark by

ignoring irrefutable evidence of Her advent and Divine Message as

www.adishakti.org. This website records what Shri Mataji told SYs in Australia

in 1994 as a great blessing to mankind that would confirm Her incarnation.

 

<http://www.adishakti.org/forum/shri_mataji_told_of_a_great_blessing_to_mankind_\

10-04-2006.htm>

 

On the contrary, certain council members have begun an insidious campaign to

discredit it.

 

Alan Wherry was the first council member to violate the pledge " to creating

complete ONENESS among them all " by initiating a campaign to discredit/denounce

all the work i have done to promote Shri Mataji as the Adi Shakti and announce

Her Divine Message to humanity. In the process he recruited the help of Viktor

Bondar, John Noyce and others to ensure SYs do not have any links to the

www.adishakti.org website. i present evidence of council member Viktor Bondar

asking Yura to read Alan's email and remove the links:

 

 

Viktor Bondar <viktorbo108

" Yura " < inspired

Mon, 6 Mar 2006 17:23:59 +0200

Fw: Hi Viktor

________

 

Äæåé Øðè Ìàòàäæè!

 

Þðà, ÿ ïîëó÷èë âîò òàêîå ñîîáùåíèå îò Àëàíà Âåðè. ×òî ñêàæåøü?

 

Ñ óâàæåíèåì,

Âèêòîð

 

 

John Noyce of Australia has been keeping a close eye on the

activities of the owner of www.adishakti.org, who used to be in SY

but clearly isn't a Sahaja Yogi now, and is openly critical of all

Sahaja leadership, including, at times Shri Mataji Herself.

 

He is somewhat eccentric and for example, advocates not using a

photo of Mother when meditating, not footsoaking etc. The owner of

this site, one Jagbir Singh of Canada is on a crusade to spread his

own eccentric, supraconscious view of what Sahaja Yoga is, and

where possible we should advise people not to go there - although

of course, individuals are free to do what they like.

 

John tells me that the web site http://inspired.kiev.ua/about/

links to www.adishakti.org

 

Obviously, I don't know the owner of that web site, Yuriy Linnyk,

whether he is Sahaj or not, but in the event that he is known to

you, is it possible that you might prevail upon him to remove the

link as it contains much erroneous and inaccurate information.

Yuriy lists adishakti.org before the official Sahaj Yoga website.

 

Much love and best wishes

 

Alan

Jai Shri Mataji

 

 

>

> A deep topic certainly but here are some aspects and I cannot say

> clearly yet if it is useful, in anything more than an academic

> sense, to consider them in the context of the material above.

> Probably it is useful...

>

> - Paramchaitanya (the cosmic mechanism of consciousness operating

> the created universe and its evolution, within its own folds. SY

> and WCASY are within that and are subservient to that)

>

> - Mahamaya (the God and Goddess maintaining a distance from people

> who do not deserve Her darshan - The Bible says 'do not cast pearls

> before swine' and in the Bhagvat Gita Shri Krishna tells Arjuna

> something like not to tell the full and subtlest of truths to those

> who only know or deserve the part)

>

> - Music (a universal discipline, well established in both secular

> and religious fields and offering something to enrich human life

> and consciousness)

>

> - Kundalini (a core issue in SY but well beyond the control of SY.

> People whose Kundalini is really established and active need no

> higher authorisations for their actions. There was a New Year Puja

> in Kalwe, Bombay, back in about '97 in which Shri Mataji said, in

> broad terms, that previously people had needed to take Her

> permission before starting major projects but now She was giving us

> permission to go ahead with our plans without asking Her. Something

> might also have been said that there was an implicit requirement

> that those actions to be taken were auspicious. How to judge that?

> Even checking vibrations many people can make mistakes. National

> leaders have sometimes failed to discriminate when activity was

> inauspicious. I said to myself that one might introduce a

> criterion, whenever there was any doubt, of: " Would Mahatma

> Gandhi approve of what you are doing? " Many of his decisions and

> opinions had tradition as a basis and were supported by wisdom and

> were also consistent with rationality.)

>

 

i have to agree on your observations.

 

>

> Perhaps there are people in SY who do not deserve the role of

> announcing Shri Mataji or being part of the announcing process.

> Shri Mataji often said that anybody might come to SY and some

> would be completely useless and others very negative. This

> reference by me is a bit rational and sounds just like an excuse

> to be 'out'.

>

 

If the SY leadership does not deserve the role then it should refrain from

preventing those who can.

 

>

> Next point is very significant. Sheffield seminar 1985 in the UK:

> Shri Mataji explained that if a person is not collective, they

> catch on Sahastrar as well as Vishuddhi and the reason is that Shri

> Mataji, in the Sahastrar, is the Collectivity of all the Deities. I

> never heard or saw that same point being made before or after

> Sheffield but the audio tape has recorded it.

>

 

There is a difference between local collective consciousness and Collective

Consciousness. Many SYs have yet to understand/attain the later, and are happy

in their local collectives. Collective Consciousness requires far more than

subtle system knowledge.

 

>

> There can be a difference of fundamental significance between the

> issue of being physically in or out of the collective, as opposed

> to the issue of being a person who, by temperament or nature, is

> collective or uncollective. Collectivity is a state. This is a

> delicate area and it may be dangerous for someone who is both

> psychologically and physically outside the SY collective to believe

> themselves as collective or even as more collective than those

> inside. But it could sometimes be the truth. Good people and

> incarnations have always been marginalised or opposed. William

> Blake was consider to be a crazy or an unworthy person by many,

> while he was alive.

>

 

The SY collectivity is a small group of people whose consciousness is mainly

about the subtle system, catches and cures. Collective Consciousness is about

humanity receiving the knowledge and faith to evolve into the eternal spirit as

they meditate on the Shakti (Holy Spirit/Ruh) within during the Last Judgment

and Resurrection. The far superior Collective Consciousness has little to do

with the ceaseless chatter of catches and cures of SY collectives and

consciousness.

 

 

> He wrote to a friend:

>

> " ...Yet I laugh & sing, for if on Earth neglected I am in heaven a

> Prince among Princes, & even on Earth beloved by the Good as a Good

> man. "

>

> He went on to write:

>

> " ...for as Man liveth not by bread alone, I shall live altho' I

> should want bread- nothing is necessary to me but to do my duty &

> to rejoice in the exceeding joy that is always poured out on my

> Spirit, to pray that my friends & you above the rest may be

> partakers of the joy that the world cannot conceive, that you may

> still be replenish'd with the same & be as you always have been, a

> glorious & triumphant Dweller in immortality. "

>

 

Yes, nothing is necessary to me but to do my duty & to rejoice in the exceeding

joy that is always poured out on my Spirit.

 

>

> Here, however, is the bottom line: If somebody is out of the

> collective, because they are uncollective, then their Sahastrar

> will not open properly and they have little authority to announce

> and promote the Goddess of the Sahastrar. If they try, it is

> unlikely to achieve much and they will most likely become lost in

> ego or super ego or both, having very limited access to higher

> positions. Vibrations will not support their activities.

>

 

David Frawley, an expert on Hindu philosophy and religion, comments

on Dharma as follows:

 

A universal tradition has room for all faiths and all religious and

spiritual practices regardless of the time or country of their

origin. Yet it places religious and spiritual teachings in their

appropriate place relative to the ultimate goal of Self-realization,

to which secondary practices are subordinated. Sanatan Dharma also

recognizes that the greater portion of human religious aspirations

has always been unknown, undefined and outside of any

institutionalized belief. Sanatan Dharma thereby gives reverence to

individual spiritual experience over any formal religious doctrine.

Wherever the Universal Truth is manifest; there is Sanatan Dharma—

whether it is in a field of religion, art or science, or in the life

of a person or community. Wherever the Universal Truth is not

recognized, or is scaled down or limited to a particular group, book

or person, even if done so in the name of God, there Sanatan Dharma

ceases to function, whatever the activity is called. "

 

Dharma (Wikipedia)

 

 

Note: In case WCASY, SY leadership and followers of the Sahaja Yoga

Subtle System Religion miss the point here it it: " Wherever the

Universal Truth is not recognized, or is scaled down or limited to a

particular group, book or person, even if done so in the name of

God, there Sanatan Dharma ceases to function, whatever the activity

is called. "

 

>

> On a related issue, there is a quote on the cover of an Indian

> Divine Cool Breeze collection of Shri Mataji's talks, 1998:

>

> " Be sure that you are telling the truth and nothing else and that

> you have felt the truth in full ways. Those who have not felt the

> vibrations should not talk of Sahaja Yoga. They have no authority.

> They have to receive vibrations. They have to fully imbibe within

> them and then they can say : " Yes, we felt. " This is a very

> important task Sahaja Yogis have to do in modern times, i.e. to

> tell aloud that they have found the truth. "

>

 

" Today, Sahaja Yoga has reached the state of Mahayoga, which is en-masse

evolution manifested through it. It is this day's Yuga Dharma. It is the way the

Last Judgment is taking place. Announce it to all the seekers of truth, to all

the nations of the world, so that nobody misses the blessings of the Divine to

achieve their meaning, their absolute, their spirit. "

 

Shri Mataji Nirmala Devi

 

 

“The main thing that one has to understand is that the time has come for you to

get all that is promised in the scriptures, not only in the Bible but all the

scriptures of the world. The time has come today that you have to become a

Christian, a Brahmin, a Pir, through your Kundalini awakening only. There is no

other way. And that your Last Judgment is also now.”

 

Shri Mataji Nirmala Devi

 

 

" Of course there are some absurd things which grew with misinterpretation and

interference from unholy people, which are common in these religions. For

example, Jews, Christian and Muslims believe that when they die their bodies

will come out of their graves and they will all be resurrected at the Time of

Resurrection, at the Time of Last Judgment, at the Time of Qiyamah. It is

illogical to think what will remain inside those graves after five hundred

years. Nobody wants to think and understand that it is not the body but the soul

that will come out of these bodies, be born again as human beings and be saved

through Qiyamah and Resurrection. "

 

Shri Mataji Nirmala Devi

 

 

“The Indian sage, who may be called the pioneer in this field, was the first

great astrologer Bhrigumuni. In his book Nadi Granth, he made clear predictions

about these Modern Times. He also specifically predicted how the Kundalini would

be awakened spontaneously through Sahaja Yoga, that is, spontaneous union with

the Divine, and become the means of both individual and collective

transformation on a large scale, through teaching incarnation of a great Yogi.

This Yogi would be an unparalleled master of the Kundalini and would teach all

the people the ancients secrets of self-transformation. These are the times

described in the Holy Bible as the Last Judgment and in the Koran as Qiyamah —

the Resurrection Time. Astrologically it also called the Age of Aquarius, the

Time of Rebirth and of great spiritual development on the Earth.”

 

Shri Mataji Nirmala Devi

 

 

“In between Jesus Christ and His destroying incarnation of Mahavishnu called as

Kalki there is a time given to human beings to rectify themselves; for them to

enter into the Kingdom of God which in the Bible is called as Last Judgment —

that you will be judged, all of you, will be judged on this Earth... This is the

most important times because Sahaja Yoga is the Last Judgment. It is fantastic

to hear this but that’s the fact it is the Truth. "

 

Shri Mataji Nirmala Devi

 

 

 

>

> Superficial yogis always explain about the Sahastrar Chalkra, for

> example in public programmes, that it is the integration of all the

> other chakras. They miss the point that there is a higher role. The

> Sahastrar chakra knows and indicates and actively supports truth

> and its manifestation.

>

 

" Wherever the Universal Truth is not recognized, or is scaled down or limited to

a particular group, book or person, even if done so in the name of God, there

Sanatan Dharma ceases to function, whatever the activity is called. "

 

 

> But, to change the subject, the Mahamaya issue is interesting. If

> God's existence, about which there is still public debate and no

> resolution, becomes public knowledge in some concrete sense and

> according to some degree of proof or weight of evidence, then it

> takes away much of the illusory sense that human's have of

> possessing free will. Have you watched the MATRIX movies? Maybe

> Shri Mataji is not ready for that to happen, for the illusion to

> pass away. I have often been frustrated that SY looked on the

> outside just like a chakra cleansing cult but I took this view - I

> could see that many national and international leaders had some

> skill in addressing and controlling large groups of yogis, and

> many were well established financially and thus able to travel,

> but they had no apparent interest or habit to communicate outside

> SY. I formed an opinion, quite often, that Shri Mataji used such

> people, whose communication or collective skills were really only

> there on a superficial level, to maintain a necessary stability.

>

 

i agree with all you have written.

 

 

>

> So, time to draw a conclusion. First the Goddess and Adi Shakti

> announcement. Then the talk about 'SY is only one of my aspects'

> which might come as a surprise for you. Then the Sheffield seminar

> talk and the issue of what the Sahastrar chakra will tolerate. I

> ask you to consider that it may be time to stop openly fighting the

> organisation of SY. Perhaps that is not worthy of your time or

> perhaps you don't have the Divine authority or the truth may lie

> somewhere between. In the full context, the role of the WCASY may

> be smaller than it thinks.

>

 

i have presented evidence of WCASY members actively undermining the very

evidence needed to confirm Shri Mataji's incarnation and Message. This

Inquisytion started with ex-world leader Yogi Mahajan and continues till today.

i kept quiet for years thinking that my witnessing will solve the problems. That

only emboldened the perpetrators who took it as a sign of weakness. Now i have

no choice but to destroy this satanic negativity.

 

 

Jagbir Singh <s.jagbir

Yura <inspired

Apr 29, 2006 7:28 AM

Re: How can we throw off the dominion of the priestly dark powers and

walk in Light?

 

Dear Yura,

 

Viktor Bondar is a murmuring soul if he calls me a " possessed false guru " . Alan

Wherry and John Noyce are just the same since they are using others like VB to

destroy Shri Mataji's Divine Message by their actions. VB is just following such

people like a sheep. Does he not have the brains or vibrations to know the

truth?

 

Anyway it is me who has stated the facts and i have every intention to stand on

my statement. If they want to take any action then it will be against me. i am

not a person who is easily intimidated. i have such negativity against me for

more then a decade. i have decided to stand up and fight it tooth and nail.

 

They are trying to make you remove the link to www.adishakti.org website, a site

that Shri Mataji is happy about and has approved it. This fact comes from

someone who is close to Shri Mataji and has personally heard it. Who then is

Victor Bondar to tell you not to link? Why did he call me a " possessed false

guru " to influence you to do so? They have 99% of SYs on their side. If the

remaining 1% goes then there will be no Divine Message. Yura, have you got any

idea how high the stakes are to resist them so that Shri Mataji's Message and

Vision is sustained. Introspect deeply and ask yourself if your duty and

allegiance is to Shri Mataji, Ganesha, Krishna, Jesus or to the likes of Viktor

Bondar, Alan Wherry and John Noyce. i doubt you will have any problem making a

decision.

 

Jai Shri Mataji,

 

 

jagbir

 

 

>

> I am not going to judge you on the basis of a website or your words

> there. I do think that you should continue but with a change of

> attitude or outer presentation. ...

>

> I trust that my message above is more reliable for the benefit of

> that Darshan.

>

 

i thank you for giving me this opportunity to clarify issues that affect all of

us. Any dialogue and knowledge only empowers all of us to be our own masters.

Only then is it possible to obey the Adi Shakti's instructions:

 

" You have to dedicate yourself completely to me, not to Sahaja Yoga, but to me.

Sahaja Yoga is only one of my aspects. Leaving everything you have to dedicate.

Complete dedication - otherwise you cannot ascend any further. Without

questioning, without arguing. Complete dedication is the only way you can

achieve it. "

 

by seeking and meditating on Her within. So dedicate yourself completely to Shri

Mataji and Her Message to emancipate humanity.

 

 

jagbir

[Guest guest]

Dear truthful friends, Like Suzy works for me. No one in any SY collective knows I read this site let alone respond to it. But my honest, heart felt feelings about SY and Shri Mataji are here. Yes, I am a coward. I don't want to put up with the political nonsense I would have to endure and I want the option of joining collective meditation with the larger collective. There are many rank and file yogis who know what WCASY is but don't say anything about it openly. After all, we are in SY for spiritual growth and to spread realization and knowledge of Mother's incarnation. We choose to let WCASY do whatever as they are going to anyway. Why get involved with them when we can still give realization and enjoy the larger collective as well. And, I can chat with you good folks about truth. All the sisterly love, Suzy jagbir singh <adishakti_org wrote: , Calin Martin <calinez wrote:>> Dear Xxxxx,> you imply that WCASY tried to present Shri Mataji as> a divine personality. But calling Her Adi Shakti on> the website, makes little relevance for people with>

Christian or Muslim background. They simply do not> know what it means. Also writing "Godess" on the> website is not going to bring much. The roman and greek> mitologies are full of "Godesses". Do you know how> many >>> Dear Jagbir,> > I understand your frustration that Shri Mataji has been very little> announced in Her greater form, as explained on your homepage. But I> noted twice recently that She was named as a Goddess on the> Sahajayoga.org news pages (SWAN). >------------>> Dear jagbir,>> I felt compelled to write to you after i just visited adishakti.org> after some months now when i realized your message on the > frontpage. First let me introduce myself, my name is Xxxxx and i > live in Xxxxx and i am Xx and got my realization X years back. > Anyways I knew about your site for>Dear Xxxxx

and Xxxxxxxxx,i am willing to post your private response to maintain your identity if any of you feel a response will compromise your standing in the collective, or for any other reason. You may also adopt another ID if you want to respond directly.i know SYs are uncomfortable to post any remarks/response on this forum as it will be taken as an anti-Sahaja Yoga sign by the SY leadership. This may lead to problems in the local collective. As we all know John Noyce is the official watchdog of WCASY who sends reports to council member Alan Wherry. This Inquisytion chief then directs other council members/Will-wannabees to use their influence on the marked SY to bend to official rules. i don't want that to happen again and am willing to work around this negativity.Just two days ago i met a Montreal SY at the metro and we were going in the same direction. Thus there was ample opportunity to catch up on

things and discuss about Shri Mataji and Sahaja Yoga. In the end i told this person that the followers of Jesus Christ, Guru Nanak and Prophet Muhammad openly announced the incarnation, and that only SYs have that dubious distinction of being the first and only followers in history afraid to do so. i added that Sahaja Yoga will never spread till we spoke the truth.This SY, clearly very uncomfortable to do so, responded by saying that s/he have so many SY brothers and sisters who share the same subtle system approach. Under no circumstance will s/he go against the collective to declare the Truth without official approval. In other words, it is far more important that s/he follow the official subtle system approach and stay in the collective than risk telling the truth and losing these friends.i believe most SYs do not want to risk losing the joy of their collectives, and thus rather remain silent or aloof. For

me this is a selfish and cowardly approach that betrays their lack of dharma and lower level of self-realization.i am not asking Xxxxx and Xxxxxxxx to reveal their identities. Just their desire that the truth regarding Shri Mataji and Her Message be told openly is enough and goes a long way to rally others. All you need is an ID like Chandra and post here without any fear of official reprisal. It is so comforting to support the Truth and nourish mind, body and soul with a clear conscience. Try it and see how you will progress.regards,jagbir

Talk is cheap. Use Messenger to make PC-to-Phone calls. Great rates starting at 1¢/min.

[Guest guest]

Dear Suzy Creamcheese and All,

 

i am pleased to hear you are telling Her full Message and i would not be

surprised if others are too. i cannot blame you for hiding your identity,

because we all know now what the consequences are for speaking openly. i would

have done so too, except that i am a person that reveals a lot, and i knew my

identity would come out in the end anyway... because once i start writing, i

can't help but to write from my heart... the truth. i just cannot allow anyone

to prevent me writing the truth. Otherwise, i hurt my Spirit, and i could not do

that.

 

i saw Jagbir as very courageous (still do) and not afraid to tell the truth when

everyone seemed to be against him, and i felt he needed the support. However, i

also only supported Jagbir because i " knew " he was telling the Truth, and he was

saying what i was thinking mostly anyway. That is why i decided to reveal my

identity upfront and i trusted that Shri Mataji would take care of me, and if i

got in trouble with any WCASY elements, i would have to deal with that later.

 

So... i really left the local collective because of WCASY force of their will on

individual yogis who just like to say the truth from their hearts. Their will on

SYs includes labelling Jagbir as 'anti-SY' and a 'false guru'. By association,

they have also called me 'anti-Sy'... therefore a 'non-SY'.

 

But that is okay. i would rather be called a 'bad person' for telling the Truth,

than be called a 'good person' for believing what is untrue, and to say that

Jagbir is 'anti-SY' and a 'false guru' and his children as 'possessed'... is

untruth.

 

So... i am happy to make sacrifices for the Movement of Love that is Sahaja

Yoga. As Sahaja Yoga means " The Spontaneous Union with the Divine " ... Sahaja

Yoga cannot ever be exclusively owned by WCASY. And this should give us much

confidence and joy, because in Reality, Sahaja Yoga belongs to all of humanity,

and in no way belongs to an exclusive group.

 

The Message of Sahaja Yoga is the Message of Truth that Shri Mataji gave. Shri

Mataji warned that nobody will be able to organise Her Message of Truth of

Sahaja Yoga. This is true. WCASY might have 'organised SYs to their opinions',

however they have not been able to organise Her Truth. Her Truth breaks all

boundaries of religions, politics, economics, everything! These are important

points to remember when people bring out that 'legal stuff'... as if somehow

that makes them Spiritual heirs. No! WE ARE ALL HER SPIRITUAL HEIRS... all who

accept Her Message... and most importantly... LIVE IT! Her Truth of Sahaja Yoga

can only be owned by the Spirit, and in the Spirit is Unity, and not division.

 

i am glad that there are 'sisters' like you who can straddle this 'apparent

division' caused by WCASY. Because... as stated the Truth about Spiritual

Reality is that it goes beyond any physical, mental or emotional barriers or

boundaries, and no mere 'physically-based-organisation like WCASY' can ever

sever the True Spiritual Unity that is in the hearts of men and women. This is

most comforting! So, we can send that love to each other on the spiritual level,

which will neutralise that 'poison'.

 

And... we will continue on here with Her Whole Truth, giving Her Message, Her

Identity to the World, and givng Her Evidence to prove Her Identity to the

World. That is an important Job that all SYs can do privately or publicly.

 

It " is really nice " to chat with good folks about the truth. What would we do if

we could not do that here!

 

sisterly love to you,

 

violet

 

 

, Suzy Creamcheese

<suzyogi wrote:

>

> Dear truthful friends,

>

> Like Suzy works for me. No one in any SY collective knows I read

this site let alone respond to it. But my honest, heart felt

feelings about SY and Shri Mataji are here.

>

> Yes, I am a coward. I don't want to put up with the political

nonsense I would have to endure and I want the option of joining

collective meditation with the larger collective. There are many rank

and file yogis who know what WCASY is but don't say anything about it

openly. After all, we are in SY for spiritual growth and to spread

realization and knowledge of Mother's incarnation. We choose to let

WCASY do whatever as they are going to anyway. Why get involved

with them when we can still give realization and enjoy the larger

collective as well.

>

> And, I can chat with you good folks about truth.

>

> All the sisterly love,

> Suzy

>

>

> jagbir singh <adishakti_org wrote:

> , Calin

Martin

> <calinez@> wrote:

> >

> > Dear Xxxxx,

> > you imply that WCASY tried to present Shri Mataji as

> > a divine personality. But calling Her Adi Shakti on

> > the website, makes little relevance for people with

> > Christian or Muslim background. They simply do not

> > know what it means. Also writing " Godess " on the

> > website is not going to bring much. The roman and greek

> > mitologies are full of " Godesses " . Do you know how

> > many

> >

>

> >

> > Dear Jagbir,

> >

> > I understand your frustration that Shri Mataji has been very

little

> > announced in Her greater form, as explained on your homepage. But

I

> > noted twice recently that She was named as a Goddess on the

> > Sahajayoga.org news pages (SWAN).

> >

>

> ------------

>

> >

> > Dear jagbir,

> >

> > I felt compelled to write to you after i just visited

adishakti.org

> > after some months now when i realized your message on the

> > frontpage. First let me introduce myself, my name is Xxxxx and i

> > live in Xxxxx and i am Xx and got my realization X years back.

> > Anyways I knew about your site for

> >

>

> Dear Xxxxx and Xxxxxxxxx,

>

> i am willing to post your private response to maintain your

identity

> if any of you feel a response will compromise your standing in the

> collective, or for any other reason. You may also adopt another ID

> if you want to respond directly.

>

> i know SYs are uncomfortable to post any remarks/response on this

> forum as it will be taken as an anti-Sahaja Yoga sign by the SY

> leadership. This may lead to problems in the local collective. As

we

> all know John Noyce is the official watchdog of WCASY who sends

> reports to council member Alan Wherry. This Inquisytion chief then

> directs other council members/Will-wannabees to use their influence

> on the marked SY to bend to official rules. i don't want that to

> happen again and am willing to work around this negativity.

>

> Just two days ago i met a Montreal SY at the metro and we were

going

> in the same direction. Thus there was ample opportunity to catch up

> on things and discuss about Shri Mataji and Sahaja Yoga. In the end

> i told this person that the followers of Jesus Christ, Guru Nanak

> and Prophet Muhammad openly announced the incarnation, and that

only

> SYs have that dubious distinction of being the first and only

> followers in history afraid to do so. i added that Sahaja Yoga will

> never spread till we spoke the truth.

>

> This SY, clearly very uncomfortable to do so, responded by saying

> that s/he have so many SY brothers and sisters who share the same

> subtle system approach. Under no circumstance will s/he go against

> the collective to declare the Truth without official approval. In

> other words, it is far more important that s/he follow the official

> subtle system approach and stay in the collective than risk telling

> the truth and losing these friends.

>

> i believe most SYs do not want to risk losing the joy of their

> collectives, and thus rather remain silent or aloof. For me this is

> a selfish and cowardly approach that betrays their lack of dharma

> and lower level of self-realization.

>

> i am not asking Xxxxx and Xxxxxxxx to reveal their identities. Just

> their desire that the truth regarding Shri Mataji and Her Message

be

> told openly is enough and goes a long way to rally others. All you

> need is an ID like Chandra and post here without any fear of

> official reprisal. It is so comforting to support the Truth and

> nourish mind, body and soul with a clear conscience. Try it and see

> how you will progress.

>

> regards,

>

> jagbir

 

> Talk is cheap. Use Messenger to make PC-to-Phone calls.

Great rates starting at 1¢/min.

>

[Guest guest]

Dear Jagbir and All,

 

This is an interesting discussion and insightful from all sides. One thing i

would like to say is that when Shri Mataji signed the documents that gave WCASY

control of Her properties, monies, and videotapes... that this in no way negated

all She taught and said for the last 30 years or so... prior to that signing.

 

What are some of these things that She has said over all these years then?

 

She has said that She hoped nobody would try and organise/edit Her Truths that

She gave. She said we are all to become our own masters, gurus, and teachers.

She asked us to proclaim Her Message of the Resurrection. She told that no

Groupism was to take over SYs. She taught us to love each other as She loved us.

She taught us to stand up for the Truth " just like Arjuna " . (We on this forum

can appreciate that one very well actually.)

 

So... all these things She taught that have not been negated by Her signing

those documents. However, " if " any of those things have somehow been negated by

the signing of the documents, then we can know that the Dharma has been

breached.

 

i would just like to restate the above:

 

Signing those documents does not mean that now we can organise/edit what She

said. Signing those documents does not mean we do not have to be our own

masters, gurus, and teachers anymore. Signing those documents did not give our

individual will to WCASY. Signing those documents does not mean we no longer

have to give Her Message and proclaim Her Identity. Signing those documents does

not mean a Sahaja Yoga Group can dominate us now. Signing those documents does

not mean we do not have to stand on the Truth/Dharma now... even if it goes

against 'family members'.

 

Another point that needs considering is that the main reason for the signing of

the documents was all about the spiritual stewardship of the properties, monies,

and videotapes. Shri Mataji often expressed Her concern about that to us SYs...

but She repeatedly expressed " even greater concern " that then this group of SYs

would probably also feel that they could be in charge of SYs too. Therefore, She

ended up not organising this. It ended up that others had to organise this, in

order to tie up the loose ends.

 

Indeed... i never understood the great WCASY excitement that accompanied what

was essentially a legal procedure. Why... you would have thought that they had

won the lottery or something like that!

 

i just wish they were that excited about giving Her Message and Identity to the

world too.

 

violet

 

 

, " jagbir

singh " <adishakti_org wrote:

>

> , " jagbir

singh " <adishakti_org@> wrote:

> >

> > Dear Jagbir,

> >

> > I understand your frustration that Shri Mataji has been very

little

> > announced in Her greater form, as explained on your homepage. But

I

> > noted twice recently that She was named as a Goddess on the

> > Sahajayoga.org news pages (SWAN). One of these items also calls

Her

> > the Adi Shakti, surely a large step forward. Going back perhaps

> > three or four years there was even the official website

> > theworldsavior.org , which for a while mentioned in a quite

simple

> > but open way that Shri Mataji was a divine person, who had

> > incarnated to save humanity. Later they cancelled that website and

> > made it the same as sahjayoga.org.

> >

> > SWAN had this in 2006: " ....the Realize America Tour culminated

at

> > the feet of the Adi Shakti at Her home in Calabasas California "

> >

> > ---------------

> > - Raksha Bandhan With The Goddess

> >

> > On the auspicious occasion of Raksha Bandhan on the evening of

> > August 9, the Realize America Tour culminated at the feet of the

> > Adi Shakti at Her home in Calabasas California.

> > http://www.sahajayoga.org/swan/view/swan_543_2006.asp

> > ---------------

> > .

> > and this:

> > .

> > ---------------

> > - The Goddess Arrives in the City of Angels

> >

> > The most auspicious occasion of Her Holiness Shri Mataji Nirmala

> > Devi arriving in Los Angeles occurred Thursday, the day of the

> > Guru.

> >

> > http://www.sahajayoga.org/swan/view/swan_536_2006.asp

> > ---------------

> > .

> > So, these were either 'mistakes' against policy made by both the

> > author of the report and the website controller or there has been

a

> > slight shift in the level of 'clarity' which is allowed about Shri

> > Mataji's status. Slight yes, but significant.

> > .

>

> We must realize that SWAN is mainly for Sahaja Yoga announcements

like pujas, programs, book releases etc. Non-SYs do not visit SWAN.

So it hardly makes any difference or qualify as a shift in the level

of 'clarity'. As you said " Going back perhaps three or four years

there was even the official website theworldsavior.org, which for a

while mentioned in a quite simple but open way that Shri Mataji was a

divine person, who had incarnated to save humanity. " Now even this

has been removed and have regressed since. They just do not have what

it takes to do what Shri Mataji has wanted done since the 1980s.

>

> >

> > Can you please explain what happened in June 2006? Perhaps I

missed

> > something important. You wrote:

> >

> > " They were finally compelled to completely disassociate themselves

> > from the organization in June 2006 when WCASY members, taking

> > advantage of an incapacitated 83-year-old Shri Mataji, openly

> > claimed and appointed themselves to be the sole representatives of

> > Her Will. "

> >

> > Did I miss some new public announcement about the authority of

> > WCASY or was it this next item you are referring to, relating

> > events from way back in 2005 and containing Sir CP's explanation

> > of Shri Mataji's wishes at that time:

> >

> > http://www.sahajayoga.org/swan/view/swan_512_2006.asp

> >

> > or was it something more private, in relation to yourself and

> > family that they had decided in June 2006?

> >

>

> In www.adishakti.org i write in the third person. Perhaps that

caused some confusion.

>

> The day i realized that Sir CP wants SYs to believe that WCASY

represents the Will of the Adi Shakti i decided to completely

disassociate from the Sahaja Yoga organization. As a family we do not

want to participate or empower in any way a group of humans who have

the temerity and ignorance to believe they can be representatives of

the Adi Shakti's Will. Till today i still cannot find the words to

describe this blasphemy. Maybe it's time SYs understand what

" blasphemy " means:

>

> Main Entry: blas•phe•my

> Pronunciation: 'blas-f & -mE

> Function: noun

> Inflected Form(s): plural -mies

> 1 a : the act of insulting or showing contempt or lack of reverence

for God b : the act of claiming the attributes of deity

> 2 : irreverence toward something considered sacred or inviolable

>

> www.webster.com/dictionary/blasphemy

>

> >

> > Whatever may be the answer, I remember a key seminar in the UK at

> > Cheltenham and the talk on 31st July 1982. I recall that I was

> > present. Shri Mataji said:

> >

> > " You have to dedicate yourself completely to me, not to Sahaja

> > Yoga, but to me. Sahaja Yoga is only one of my aspects. Leaving

> > everything you have to dedicate. Complete dedication - otherwise

> > you cannot ascend any further. Without questioning, without

> > arguing. Complete dedication is the only way you can achieve it. "

> >

>

> This quote only gives added weight as to what i am trying to

denounce about the celebrated hijacking of Her Will by WCASY. By

complete dedication Shri Mataji is also implying that we obey and

carry out Her instructions unconditionally .............. and that

includes declaring Her advent and Divine Message to humanity. So how

come those who claim to represent Her Will do not have the will to do

Her Will? Was there a loss of cerebral data during what is now touted

by WCASY as the historic transfer of Her Will?

>

> >

> > Your website has no record of this talk or quotation, that I could

> > find, but it is extremely significant, for the world and for your

> > family.

> >

>

> Yes, i still have to put this very important quote. i will do so at

the proper place and time.

>

> >

> > So WCASY is about the advancement of SY and that is perhaps its

> > entire scope and authority. I do not have, to hand, a copy of

> > their charter or any authorisation from Shri Mataji, which might

> > explain their role in more detail. But I suggest, like a lawyer

> > identifying a loophole in established legislation, that in

relation

> > to Shri Mataji's other aspects, well...WCASY has no authority

> > there! Am I right or am I right? What aspects?

> >

>

> This is what Shri Mataji said when WCASY was formed 14th June, 2004:

>

>

> WORLD COUNCIL FOR THE ADVANCEMENT OF SAHAJA YOGA

>

> In addition to those already appointed, Bohdan Shehovych is

designated as a World Leader and Member of the Council.

>

> Gagan Ahluwalia, Paul Ellis, Alan Wherry and Alan Pereira, formerly

appointed as Advisors, are hereby designated as World Leaders and

Members of the Council. Alan Pereira will function as Member-

Secretary of the Council.

>

> The World Council will be a perpetual body for providing inspiring

and elevating guidance to SAHAJA YOGIS and YOGINIS throughout the

world with a view, primarily, to creating complete ONENESS among them

all. The World Council will further promote a deeper and an ever-

widening perennial message of SAHAJA YOGA in all parts of the world.

The World Council may suggest specific programmes for this purpose.

>

> The composition of the World Council will be reviewed by me from

time to time, as necessary.

>

> An updated list of the World Leaders and Members of the WORLD

COUNCIL is annexed.

>

>

> SHRI MATAJI NIRMALA DEVI

>

> 14th June, 2004

>

>

> Till date WCASY has neither the will, direction nor knowledge to

" promote a deeper and an ever-widening perennial message of SAHAJA

YOGA in all parts of the world. " Despite all the hype it is common

knowledge that few seekers ever stay, and growth has stagnated in

Europe and North America. Moreover, there are many countries where

Sahaja Yoga is non-existent. i did that infamous calculation that at

present rate of progress 1% of the world will know about Sahaja Yoga

by the year 8023 AD! And by " Sahaja Yoga " i mean much more than the

official self-realization/subtle system public pretendtation.

>

> Although Shri Mataji mentioned that the " World Council may suggest

specific programmes for this purpose " it continues to keep seekers in

the dark by ignoring irrefutable evidence of Her advent and Divine

Message as www.adishakti.org. This website records what Shri Mataji

told SYs in Australia in 1994 as a great blessing to mankind that

would confirm Her incarnation.

>

> <http://www.adishakti.org/forum/

shri_mataji_told_of_a_great_blessing_to_mankind_10-04-2006.htm>

>

> On the contrary, certain council members have begun an insidious

campaign to discredit it.

>

> Alan Wherry was the first council member to violate the pledge " to

creating complete ONENESS among them all " by initiating a campaign to

discredit/denounce all the work i have done to promote Shri Mataji as

the Adi Shakti and announce Her Divine Message to humanity. In the

process he recruited the help of Viktor Bondar, John Noyce and others

to ensure SYs do not have any links to the www.adishakti.org website.

i present evidence of council member Viktor Bondar asking Yura to

read Alan's email and remove the links:

>

>

> Viktor Bondar <viktorbo108

> " Yura " < inspired

> Mon, 6 Mar 2006 17:23:59 +0200

> Fw: Hi Viktor

> ________

>

> Äæåé Øðè Ìàòàäæè!

>

> Þðà, ÿ ïîëó÷èë âîò òàêîå ñîîáùåíèå îò Àëàíà Âåðè. ×òî ñêàæåøü?

>

> Ñ óâàæåíèåì,

> Âèêòîð

>

>

> John Noyce of Australia has been keeping a close eye on the

> activities of the owner of www.adishakti.org, who used to be in SY

> but clearly isn't a Sahaja Yogi now, and is openly critical of all

> Sahaja leadership, including, at times Shri Mataji Herself.

>

> He is somewhat eccentric and for example, advocates not using a

> photo of Mother when meditating, not footsoaking etc. The owner of

> this site, one Jagbir Singh of Canada is on a crusade to spread his

> own eccentric, supraconscious view of what Sahaja Yoga is, and

> where possible we should advise people not to go there - although

> of course, individuals are free to do what they like.

>

> John tells me that the web site http://inspired.kiev.ua/about/

> links to www.adishakti.org

>

> Obviously, I don't know the owner of that web site, Yuriy Linnyk,

> whether he is Sahaj or not, but in the event that he is known to

> you, is it possible that you might prevail upon him to remove the

> link as it contains much erroneous and inaccurate information.

> Yuriy lists adishakti.org before the official Sahaj Yoga website.

>

> Much love and best wishes

>

> Alan

> Jai Shri Mataji

>

>

> >

> > A deep topic certainly but here are some aspects and I cannot say

> > clearly yet if it is useful, in anything more than an academic

> > sense, to consider them in the context of the material above.

> > Probably it is useful...

> >

> > - Paramchaitanya (the cosmic mechanism of consciousness operating

> > the created universe and its evolution, within its own folds. SY

> > and WCASY are within that and are subservient to that)

> >

> > - Mahamaya (the God and Goddess maintaining a distance from people

> > who do not deserve Her darshan - The Bible says 'do not cast

pearls

> > before swine' and in the Bhagvat Gita Shri Krishna tells Arjuna

> > something like not to tell the full and subtlest of truths to

those

> > who only know or deserve the part)

> >

> > - Music (a universal discipline, well established in both secular

> > and religious fields and offering something to enrich human life

> > and consciousness)

> >

> > - Kundalini (a core issue in SY but well beyond the control of SY.

> > People whose Kundalini is really established and active need no

> > higher authorisations for their actions. There was a New Year Puja

> > in Kalwe, Bombay, back in about '97 in which Shri Mataji said, in

> > broad terms, that previously people had needed to take Her

> > permission before starting major projects but now She was giving

us

> > permission to go ahead with our plans without asking Her.

Something

> > might also have been said that there was an implicit requirement

> > that those actions to be taken were auspicious. How to judge

that?

> > Even checking vibrations many people can make mistakes. National

> > leaders have sometimes failed to discriminate when activity was

> > inauspicious. I said to myself that one might introduce a

> > criterion, whenever there was any doubt, of: " Would Mahatma

> > Gandhi approve of what you are doing? " Many of his decisions and

> > opinions had tradition as a basis and were supported by wisdom and

> > were also consistent with rationality.)

> >

>

> i have to agree on your observations.

>

> >

> > Perhaps there are people in SY who do not deserve the role of

> > announcing Shri Mataji or being part of the announcing process.

> > Shri Mataji often said that anybody might come to SY and some

> > would be completely useless and others very negative. This

> > reference by me is a bit rational and sounds just like an excuse

> > to be 'out'.

> >

>

> If the SY leadership does not deserve the role then it should

refrain from preventing those who can.

>

> >

> > Next point is very significant. Sheffield seminar 1985 in the UK:

> > Shri Mataji explained that if a person is not collective, they

> > catch on Sahastrar as well as Vishuddhi and the reason is that

Shri

> > Mataji, in the Sahastrar, is the Collectivity of all the Deities.

I

> > never heard or saw that same point being made before or after

> > Sheffield but the audio tape has recorded it.

> >

>

> There is a difference between local collective consciousness and

Collective Consciousness. Many SYs have yet to understand/attain the

later, and are happy in their local collectives. Collective

Consciousness requires far more than subtle system knowledge.

>

> >

> > There can be a difference of fundamental significance between the

> > issue of being physically in or out of the collective, as opposed

> > to the issue of being a person who, by temperament or nature, is

> > collective or uncollective. Collectivity is a state. This is a

> > delicate area and it may be dangerous for someone who is both

> > psychologically and physically outside the SY collective to

believe

> > themselves as collective or even as more collective than those

> > inside. But it could sometimes be the truth. Good people and

> > incarnations have always been marginalised or opposed. William

> > Blake was consider to be a crazy or an unworthy person by many,

> > while he was alive.

> >

>

> The SY collectivity is a small group of people whose consciousness

is mainly about the subtle system, catches and cures. Collective

Consciousness is about humanity receiving the knowledge and faith to

evolve into the eternal spirit as they meditate on the Shakti (Holy

Spirit/Ruh) within during the Last Judgment and Resurrection. The far

superior Collective Consciousness has little to do with the ceaseless

chatter of catches and cures of SY collectives and consciousness.

>

>

> > He wrote to a friend:

> >

> > " ...Yet I laugh & sing, for if on Earth neglected I am in heaven

a

> > Prince among Princes, & even on Earth beloved by the Good as a

Good

> > man. "

> >

> > He went on to write:

> >

> > " ...for as Man liveth not by bread alone, I shall live altho' I

> > should want bread- nothing is necessary to me but to do my duty &

> > to rejoice in the exceeding joy that is always poured out on my

> > Spirit, to pray that my friends & you above the rest may be

> > partakers of the joy that the world cannot conceive, that you may

> > still be replenish'd with the same & be as you always have been, a

> > glorious & triumphant Dweller in immortality. "

> >

>

> Yes, nothing is necessary to me but to do my duty & to rejoice in

the exceeding joy that is always poured out on my Spirit.

>

> >

> > Here, however, is the bottom line: If somebody is out of the

> > collective, because they are uncollective, then their Sahastrar

> > will not open properly and they have little authority to announce

> > and promote the Goddess of the Sahastrar. If they try, it is

> > unlikely to achieve much and they will most likely become lost in

> > ego or super ego or both, having very limited access to higher

> > positions. Vibrations will not support their activities.

> >

>

> David Frawley, an expert on Hindu philosophy and religion, comments

> on Dharma as follows:

>

> A universal tradition has room for all faiths and all religious and

> spiritual practices regardless of the time or country of their

> origin. Yet it places religious and spiritual teachings in their

> appropriate place relative to the ultimate goal of Self-realization,

> to which secondary practices are subordinated. Sanatan Dharma also

> recognizes that the greater portion of human religious aspirations

> has always been unknown, undefined and outside of any

> institutionalized belief. Sanatan Dharma thereby gives reverence to

> individual spiritual experience over any formal religious doctrine.

> Wherever the Universal Truth is manifest; there is Sanatan Dharma—

> whether it is in a field of religion, art or science, or in the life

> of a person or community. Wherever the Universal Truth is not

> recognized, or is scaled down or limited to a particular group, book

> or person, even if done so in the name of God, there Sanatan Dharma

> ceases to function, whatever the activity is called. "

>

> Dharma (Wikipedia)

>

>

> Note: In case WCASY, SY leadership and followers of the Sahaja Yoga

> Subtle System Religion miss the point here it it: " Wherever the

> Universal Truth is not recognized, or is scaled down or limited to a

> particular group, book or person, even if done so in the name of

> God, there Sanatan Dharma ceases to function, whatever the activity

> is called. "

>

> >

> > On a related issue, there is a quote on the cover of an Indian

> > Divine Cool Breeze collection of Shri Mataji's talks, 1998:

> >

> > " Be sure that you are telling the truth and nothing else and that

> > you have felt the truth in full ways. Those who have not felt the

> > vibrations should not talk of Sahaja Yoga. They have no authority.

> > They have to receive vibrations. They have to fully imbibe within

> > them and then they can say : " Yes, we felt. " This is a very

> > important task Sahaja Yogis have to do in modern times, i.e. to

> > tell aloud that they have found the truth. "

> >

>

> " Today, Sahaja Yoga has reached the state of Mahayoga, which is en-

masse evolution manifested through it. It is this day's Yuga Dharma.

It is the way the Last Judgment is taking place. Announce it to all

the seekers of truth, to all the nations of the world, so that nobody

misses the blessings of the Divine to achieve their meaning, their

absolute, their spirit. "

>

> Shri Mataji Nirmala Devi

>

>

> " The main thing that one has to understand is that the time has

come for you to get all that is promised in the scriptures, not only

in the Bible but all the scriptures of the world. The time has come

today that you have to become a Christian, a Brahmin, a Pir, through

your Kundalini awakening only. There is no other way. And that your

Last Judgment is also now. "

>

> Shri Mataji Nirmala Devi

>

>

> " Of course there are some absurd things which grew with

misinterpretation and interference from unholy people, which are

common in these religions. For example, Jews, Christian and Muslims

believe that when they die their bodies will come out of their graves

and they will all be resurrected at the Time of Resurrection, at the

Time of Last Judgment, at the Time of Qiyamah. It is illogical to

think what will remain inside those graves after five hundred years.

Nobody wants to think and understand that it is not the body but the

soul that will come out of these bodies, be born again as human

beings and be saved through Qiyamah and Resurrection. "

>

> Shri Mataji Nirmala Devi

>

>

> " The Indian sage, who may be called the pioneer in this field, was

the first great astrologer Bhrigumuni. In his book Nadi Granth, he

made clear predictions about these Modern Times. He also specifically

predicted how the Kundalini would be awakened spontaneously through

Sahaja Yoga, that is, spontaneous union with the Divine, and become

the means of both individual and collective transformation on a large

scale, through teaching incarnation of a great Yogi. This Yogi would

be an unparalleled master of the Kundalini and would teach all the

people the ancients secrets of self-transformation. These are the

times described in the Holy Bible as the Last Judgment and in the

Koran as Qiyamah — the Resurrection Time. Astrologically it also

called the Age of Aquarius, the Time of Rebirth and of great

spiritual development on the Earth. "

>

> Shri Mataji Nirmala Devi

>

>

> " In between Jesus Christ and His destroying incarnation of

Mahavishnu called as Kalki there is a time given to human beings to

rectify themselves; for them to enter into the Kingdom of God which

in the Bible is called as Last Judgment — that you will be judged,

all of you, will be judged on this Earth... This is the most

important times because Sahaja Yoga is the Last Judgment. It is

fantastic to hear this but that's the fact it is the Truth. "

>

> Shri Mataji Nirmala Devi

>

>

>

> >

> > Superficial yogis always explain about the Sahastrar Chalkra, for

> > example in public programmes, that it is the integration of all

the

> > other chakras. They miss the point that there is a higher role.

The

> > Sahastrar chakra knows and indicates and actively supports truth

> > and its manifestation.

> >

>

> " Wherever the Universal Truth is not recognized, or is scaled down

or limited to a particular group, book or person, even if done so in

the name of God, there Sanatan Dharma ceases to function, whatever

the activity is called. "

>

>

> > But, to change the subject, the Mahamaya issue is interesting. If

> > God's existence, about which there is still public debate and no

> > resolution, becomes public knowledge in some concrete sense and

> > according to some degree of proof or weight of evidence, then it

> > takes away much of the illusory sense that human's have of

> > possessing free will. Have you watched the MATRIX movies? Maybe

> > Shri Mataji is not ready for that to happen, for the illusion to

> > pass away. I have often been frustrated that SY looked on the

> > outside just like a chakra cleansing cult but I took this view - I

> > could see that many national and international leaders had some

> > skill in addressing and controlling large groups of yogis, and

> > many were well established financially and thus able to travel,

> > but they had no apparent interest or habit to communicate outside

> > SY. I formed an opinion, quite often, that Shri Mataji used such

> > people, whose communication or collective skills were really only

> > there on a superficial level, to maintain a necessary stability.

> >

>

> i agree with all you have written.

>

>

> >

> > So, time to draw a conclusion. First the Goddess and Adi Shakti

> > announcement. Then the talk about 'SY is only one of my aspects'

> > which might come as a surprise for you. Then the Sheffield seminar

> > talk and the issue of what the Sahastrar chakra will tolerate. I

> > ask you to consider that it may be time to stop openly fighting

the

> > organisation of SY. Perhaps that is not worthy of your time or

> > perhaps you don't have the Divine authority or the truth may lie

> > somewhere between. In the full context, the role of the WCASY may

> > be smaller than it thinks.

> >

>

> i have presented evidence of WCASY members actively undermining the

very evidence needed to confirm Shri Mataji's incarnation and

Message. This Inquisytion started with ex-world leader Yogi Mahajan

and continues till today. i kept quiet for years thinking that my

witnessing will solve the problems. That only emboldened the

perpetrators who took it as a sign of weakness. Now i have no choice

but to destroy this satanic negativity.

>

>

> Jagbir Singh <s.jagbir

> Yura <inspired

> Apr 29, 2006 7:28 AM

> Re: How can we throw off the dominion of the priestly dark

powers and walk in Light?

>

> Dear Yura,

>

> Viktor Bondar is a murmuring soul if he calls me a " possessed false

guru " . Alan Wherry and John Noyce are just the same since they are

using others like VB to destroy Shri Mataji's Divine Message by their

actions. VB is just following such people like a sheep. Does he not

have the brains or vibrations to know the truth?

>

> Anyway it is me who has stated the facts and i have every intention

to stand on my statement. If they want to take any action then it

will be against me. i am not a person who is easily intimidated. i

have such negativity against me for more then a decade. i have

decided to stand up and fight it tooth and nail.

>

> They are trying to make you remove the link to www.adishakti.org

website, a site that Shri Mataji is happy about and has approved it.

This fact comes from someone who is close to Shri Mataji and has

personally heard it. Who then is Victor Bondar to tell you not to

link? Why did he call me a " possessed false guru " to influence you to

do so? They have 99% of SYs on their side. If the remaining 1% goes

then there will be no Divine Message. Yura, have you got any idea how

high the stakes are to resist them so that Shri Mataji's Message and

Vision is sustained. Introspect deeply and ask yourself if your duty

and allegiance is to Shri Mataji, Ganesha, Krishna, Jesus or to the

likes of Viktor Bondar, Alan Wherry and John Noyce. i doubt you will

have any problem making a decision.

>

> Jai Shri Mataji,

>

>

> jagbir

>

>

> >

> > I am not going to judge you on the basis of a website or your

words

> > there. I do think that you should continue but with a change of

> > attitude or outer presentation. ...

> >

> > I trust that my message above is more reliable for the benefit of

> > that Darshan.

> >

>

> i thank you for giving me this opportunity to clarify issues that

affect all of us. Any dialogue and knowledge only empowers all of us

to be our own masters. Only then is it possible to obey the Adi

Shakti's instructions:

>

> " You have to dedicate yourself completely to me, not to Sahaja

Yoga, but to me. Sahaja Yoga is only one of my aspects. Leaving

everything you have to dedicate. Complete dedication - otherwise you

cannot ascend any further. Without questioning, without arguing.

Complete dedication is the only way you can achieve it. "

>

> by seeking and meditating on Her within. So dedicate yourself

completely to Shri Mataji and Her Message to emancipate humanity.

>

>

> jagbir

>