Digest Number 113

June 28, 2004

hi folks,

Murugan Saranam.

As far as i concerned, i don't feel any difference between the worship of Murugan as Kumarasamy or Valli Devasena Sametha Subramanyan.

If you totally dedicate yourself and involve into the prayers of Lord Murugan, he'll surely help you out. Surrender yourself to him. He'll surely help you.

I have really experienced that in my life in several times.

Murugan is the GOD.

Infact Murugan has given me a prayer on his own... that is as follows:

"VALVINAI THEERTHTHU

VARUVINAI THAVIRTHU

NALVINAI ARULVAI MURUGA"

I have felt his grace over me several times and still feel the same.

Chant Murugans' prayers & enjoy his grace over you.

Murugan Saranam

- Rameshdhandapani wrote:

June 28, 2004

MURUGA SARANAM

I think the various forms or manisfestations of Lord

Murugan has created a serious discussion here. Before

I go further, I wish that everyone is allowed to air

their views without saying that it is against the

masses or against Lord Murugan. Only when we

generously allow different opinions to be aired in the

group all of us can get our doubts cleared or clear

others’ doubts in possible. As long as the views are

presented without hurting anyone personally it should

be received with acceptance and we can always post our

views against it. One thing glad to note that everyone

Loves Him so much ir-respective of what he or she

says.

I think the issue raised by Kala has not been

addressed adequately. Why should one form be preferred

than the other? Is He not the same all Pervading One.

Learned people have said that as long as we stick to

the forms such issues always come. Through our Bhakthi

we should raise above that level and once we raise our

level of consciousness/identification we see no

difference between Jeevaathma and Paramaathma. That’s

what various ideologies of traditional Hinduism says.

Even the yogis and saints say the same thing. In One

Thirupugazh verse Lord Murugan is described as Lord of

Vadamalai which is Thirupathi. Hari is Haran and Haran

is Hari. Murugan is a Manifestation of Haran only. In

preface to Thiruvasagam by the RK Mutt Publication the

Editor says, there are eight (think so) forms of

Hinduism which are Saivam (Siva as Supreme Lord),

Vaishnavam (Vishnu), Ganapheyam (Ganesh), Saktham

(Shakthi, Kaumaram (Kumaran or Murugan) etc.. In fact

whichever form you pray to Him, He is ever the same.

Even you can call Him Allah or The Heavenly Father.

All these are after we achieve that higher level of

identification. But as long as we are in lower levels

of identification (seeing everything and every entity

as separate) we see and recognize Him in various forms

and He has blessed us at various times in those forms.

Based on this these ideas have developed. Probably I

think He has blessed Pamban swamigal in His Kandasamy

form. So I guess that in connection with similar

incidents it is said that every form is related to

some way or aspect of life. I strongly feel that in

the ritual based practice of religion all effects of

different forms of Lord apply. This way I feel what

was said about Kandasamy or Kumarasamy form of Lord is

applicable. But still He doesn’t do any harm to us.

Whichever From we pray to Him, though we may not get

married, He is still guiding us towards Higher levels

of happiness or Bliss. Any form you pray to Him ‘you

may not get married or you maynot win your case’ but

He is ever loving to lead us towards Moksha – The

sayujya padvi of eternally residing at His Lotus feet

and serving Him – the highest level of eternal

happiness possible for anyone. He never deprives us of

anything that can take us towards Him. He only gives

what we ask for. If one likes marriage there is

nothing wrong and we can pray to him in His other

divine forms.

Reg Re-installatuon of the original Navabashana statue

at Palani, I was also very glad to know that. When

something was installed (now-a-days no one can make a

statue of Navabhasahana of that quality I believe) by

some one like Bogha Siddhar what way we are qualified

to replace it with a statue of our choice. It is said

that the effects of various herbal medicines get

transferred to the panchamritham and other abhisheka

materials and the devotees are benefited by that.

Ofcourse without His blessings any mulikai medicine

can’t work for a devotee. So why should one change the

statue and again bring it back. It may not be a

punishing for the one who did it. It may be a blessing

for millions of others. It depends on the way we state

it.

If we prefer to pray to Him in some other form need

not construe that we hate Him in the other form.

Whatever form we choose He is always there to help us.

In one book by one of RK Mutt saints I read that a

Hindu says, that Oh! My Lord, pl forgive me for taking

pilgrimage thus denying your omnipresence. And Pl

forgive me for praying to thee in various forms though

Thou art formless. I regret for forgetting the rest of

the well written words. It in total says that we don’t

deny his omnipresent qualities as Brahman when we

practice our religion in traditional ways which are

full of customs and rituals. We do it while we realize

His higher and pure nature as All Pervading Brahman.

I think what the person (in the first post reg

Kumarasamy form of Lord) said was not intending that

we hate Him or replace Him as per our need. We are

just choosing a form of Him as He has done such things

in His forms to bless His devotees at various times.

Many sthala puranams of temple state history of the

temples saying that such and such devotee got relief

from such and such problem of got salvation while

practicing religion in such a lineage or tradition.

Hence people who are interested to get similar

solutions are advised to follow the same practice and

visit that particular thiru thalam. We know that He is

everywhere, but going to His temple benefits us in

many ways including the fact that His great devotees

are the best inspirations for us in lives.

I could be entirely wrong and would be glad if someone

wishes to correct me. I encourage people to allow

entirely different opinions to “flow freely” and

request all to respect others’ privilege to post their

views.

I am again Glad to tell that everyone loves Lord

Murugan so deeply that they get seriously disturbed if

they feel that something is said wrong about Him. May

He bless everyone of us in abundance. What makes me

glad is that devotees are ready to take on anything if

it is wish of Murugan (as stated by Senthil Vel

Murugan). I again request members to post their views

even if it is seriously contradicting, as then only we

can unify our views and agree upon common and correct

view reached within the group. Only thing is views

need to placed against views and not against the

authors.

MURUGA SARANAM

Muruga Please increase us in our knowledge.

With Best Regards

Meyyappan S

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June 29, 2004

Dear All,

Thanks to Meyyappan for his detail brief on the motto of forming a group and elevating all our view into a unified one.Also a good info on varous form off our loving lord Murugan.

Well, thanks L_ganesh for ur wishes and hope we all unify to grace the Muruga Sharnam to our best.

I need a help to get info on KadhiKamam(srilanka) - is it ok to go for dharshan this time, when the padha yathra taking place there...and i hope if our group can schedule a visit to Kadirkamam - which most of them can join and make it a memorable one.

Muruganukku arogara, kandanukku arogara!!!

regards to all

kathirMeyyappan S <meyyappan_s wrote:

MURUGA SARANAMI think the various forms or manisfestations of LordMurugan has created a serious discussion here. BeforeI go further, I wish that everyone is allowed to airtheir views without saying that it is against themasses or against Lord Murugan. Only when wegenerously allow different opinions to be aired in thegroup all of us can get our doubts cleared or clearothers? doubts in possible. As long as the views arepresented without hurting anyone personally it shouldbe received with acceptance and we can always post ourviews against it. One thing glad to note that everyoneLoves Him so much ir-respective of what he or shesays.I think the issue raised by Kala has not beenaddressed adequately. Why should one form be preferredthan the other? Is He not the same all Pervading One.Learned people have said that as

long as we stick tothe forms such issues always come. Through our Bhakthiwe should raise above that level and once we raise ourlevel of consciousness/identification we see nodifference between Jeevaathma and Paramaathma. That?swhat various ideologies of traditional Hinduism says.Even the yogis and saints say the same thing. In OneThirupugazh verse Lord Murugan is described as Lord ofVadamalai which is Thirupathi. Hari is Haran and Haranis Hari. Murugan is a Manifestation of Haran only. Inpreface to Thiruvasagam by the RK Mutt Publication theEditor says, there are eight (think so) forms ofHinduism which are Saivam (Siva as Supreme Lord),Vaishnavam (Vishnu), Ganapheyam (Ganesh), Saktham(Shakthi, Kaumaram (Kumaran or Murugan) etc.. In factwhichever form you pray to Him, He is ever the same.Even you can call Him Allah or The Heavenly Father.All these are after we achieve that higher level ofidentification. But as

long as we are in lower levelsof identification (seeing everything and every entityas separate) we see and recognize Him in various formsand He has blessed us at various times in those forms.Based on this these ideas have developed. Probably Ithink He has blessed Pamban swamigal in His Kandasamyform. So I guess that in connection with similarincidents it is said that every form is related tosome way or aspect of life. I strongly feel that inthe ritual based practice of religion all effects ofdifferent forms of Lord apply. This way I feel whatwas said about Kandasamy or Kumarasamy form of Lord isapplicable. But still He doesn?t do any harm to us.Whichever From we pray to Him, though we may not getmarried, He is still guiding us towards Higher levelsof happiness or Bliss. Any form you pray to Him ?youmay not get married or you maynot win your case? butHe is ever loving to lead us towards Moksha ? Thesayujya padvi

of eternally residing at His Lotus feetand serving Him ? the highest level of eternalhappiness possible for anyone. He never deprives us ofanything that can take us towards Him. He only giveswhat we ask for. If one likes marriage there isnothing wrong and we can pray to him in His otherdivine forms.Reg Re-installatuon of the original Navabashana statueat Palani, I was also very glad to know that. Whensomething was installed (now-a-days no one can make astatue of Navabhasahana of that quality I believe) bysome one like Bogha Siddhar what way we are qualifiedto replace it with a statue of our choice. It is saidthat the effects of various herbal medicines gettransferred to the panchamritham and other abhishekamaterials and the devotees are benefited by that.Ofcourse without His blessings any mulikai medicinecan?t work for a devotee. So why should one change thestatue and again bring it back. It may not be

apunishing for the one who did it. It may be a blessingfor millions of others. It depends on the way we stateit.If we prefer to pray to Him in some other form neednot construe that we hate Him in the other form.Whatever form we choose He is always there to help us.In one book by one of RK Mutt saints I read that aHindu says, that Oh! My Lord, pl forgive me for takingpilgrimage thus denying your omnipresence. And Plforgive me for praying to thee in various forms thoughThou art formless. I regret for forgetting the rest ofthe well written words. It in total says that we don?tdeny his omnipresent qualities as Brahman when wepractice our religion in traditional ways which arefull of customs and rituals. We do it while we realizeHis higher and pure nature as All Pervading Brahman.I think what the person (in the first post regKumarasamy form of Lord) said was not intending thatwe hate Him or replace Him as

per our need. We arejust choosing a form of Him as He has done such thingsin His forms to bless His devotees at various times.Many sthala puranams of temple state history of thetemples saying that such and such devotee got relieffrom such and such problem of got salvation whilepracticing religion in such a lineage or tradition.Hence people who are interested to get similarsolutions are advised to follow the same practice andvisit that particular thiru thalam. We know that He iseverywhere, but going to His temple benefits us inmany ways including the fact that His great devoteesare the best inspirations for us in lives.I could be entirely wrong and would be glad if someonewishes to correct me. I encourage people to allowentirely different opinions to ?flow freely? andrequest all to respect others? privilege to post theirviews.I am again Glad to tell that everyone loves LordMurugan so deeply that they

get seriously disturbed ifthey feel that something is said wrong about Him. MayHe bless everyone of us in abundance. What makes meglad is that devotees are ready to take on anything ifit is wish of Murugan (as stated by Senthil VelMurugan). I again request members to post their viewseven if it is seriously contradicting, as then only wecan unify our views and agree upon common and correctview reached within the group. Only thing is viewsneed to placed against views and not against theauthors.MURUGA SARANAMMURUGA SARANAMMURUGA SARANAMMuruga Please increase us in our knowledge.With Best RegardsMeyyappan SNew and Improved Mail - Send 10MB messages!