FW: Srila Prabhupada speaks on: Bad, Good And Truly Good

March 4, 2008

Sun, 2 Mar 2008 20:53:52 +0300manikantankTo: kanaiyyadesh (AT) googl (DOT) com; koottalaSubject: Srila Prabhupada speaks on: Bad, Good And Truly Good

"Bad, Good And Truly Good" Srimad-Bhagavatam 1.16.20Hawaii, January 16, 1974 listen

Pradyumna: (leads chanting, etc.)

padair nyunam socasi maika-padamatmanam va vrsalair bhoksyamanamaho suradin hrta-yajna-bhaganpraja uta svin maghavaty avarsati

Translation: "I have lost my three legs and am now standing on one only. Are you lamenting for my state of existence? Or are you in great anxiety because henceforward the unlawful meat-eaters will exploit you? Or are you in a sorry plight because the demigods are now bereft of their share of sacrificial offerings because no sacrifices are being performed at present? Or are you grieving for living beings because of their sufferings due to famine and drought?"

Prabhupada: Read the purport. Read. Long purport.

Pradyumna: "With the progress of the age of Kali, four things particularly, namely the duration of life, mercy, the power of recollection, and moral or religious principles will gradually diminish. Since dharma, or the principles of religion, would be lost in the proportion of three out of four, the symbolic bull was standing on one leg only. When three-fourths of the population of the whole world become irreligious, the situation is converted into hell for the animals. In the age of Kali, godless civilizations will create so many so-called religious societies in which the Personality of Godhead will be directly or indirectly defied. And thus faithless societies of men will make the world uninhabitable for the saner section of people. There are gradations of human beings in terms of proportionate faith in the Supreme Personality of Godhead. The first-class..."

Prabhupada: Yes. Go on.

Pradyumna: "The first-class faithful men are the Vaisnavas and the brahmanas, then the ksatriyas, then the vaisyas, then the sudras, then the mlecchas, the yavanas, and at last the candalas. The degradation of the human instinct begins from the mlecchas..."

Prabhupada: Candalas means the dog-eaters. In the human society, the division of higher class and lower class is determined by the standard of eating. So first-class men, just like brahmana, Vaisnava, they eat very purified prasadam. Their responsibility practically does not depend on them. Because Vaisnava... Brahmana also. Without becoming a brahmana, nobody can become Vaisnava. So when you speak of Vaisnava, it is to be supposed that he's already brahmana. Therefore, to bring the neophyte devotees to the perfectional stage, we offer the brahmana's sacred thread. But if people, after promising everything, and break their promise, that is very abominable. When they're initiated before the Deity, before the Lord, before the fire, they should not break it. That is most sinful if you break your promise. Otherwise, you should not be coming forward for initiation if you cannot keep your promise.

So the first-class, second-class, third-class, fourth-class men are considered according to the guna and karma, quality and work. That is described in the Srimad-Bhag..., er, Bhagavad-gita, catur-varnyam maya srstam guna-karma-vibhagasah [bg. 4.13]. That is the system, not by force one can become first-class. According to the sastra, who is first-class, who is second-class, who is third-class, who is fourth-class, who is fifth-class, that is to be understood. Guna-karma-vibhagasah. So when one becomes above the gunas by devotional service... Guna means quality. A devotee is on the position of first-class human society because a devotee is engaged in devotional service. That is stated in the Bhagavad-gita,

mam ca yo 'vyabhicarenabhakti-yogena sevatesa gunan samatityaitanbrahma-bhuyaya kalpate [bg. 14.26]

"Anyone who is engaged cent percent without any motive in the devotional service of the Lord," mam ca yo 'vyabhicarena bhakti-yogena [bg. 14.26], bhakti-yogena, avyabhicarena, "without any adulteration, such person," mam ca yo 'vyabhicarena bhakti-yogena sevate, sa gunan... Gunan means these material qualities: goodness, passion and ignorance. These are gunas. Sa gunan samatitya, samatitya, "fully transcendental, fully surpassing." Brahma-bhuyaya kalpate: "Then that is the stage of self-realization."

So if one is not even on the stage of self-realization, how he can teach others? That is cheating. That is cheating. If one is not a graduate, if he becomes a teacher, he is not a teacher; he is a cheater. One must be first of all qualified. That qualification means one must be above the three qualities of material nature. Goodness... Even you have to go beyond the quality of goodness. In the material world we have made, concocted, "This is good, this is bad." So even taking it... Actually, everything in the material world is bad. Anything. It is simply mental concoction. We are creating, "This is good, this is bad." The... So long one is in the material world, everything is bad. Even the so-called religious practice, that is also bad, in the material world. So therefore, Bhagavad-gita says, sa gunan samatitya etan: "One has to transcend even the quality of goodness, the so-called goodness."

Actually there is no goodness, because here people dress like in the platform of goodness, but thinking just like animals. That kind of goodness has no value. Actually goodness, that goodness is sa gunan samatityaitan brahma-bhuyaya kalpate [bg. 14.26], when one transcends the qualities of material nature, above the brahmana quality. Brahmana quality is... Suppose... Suppose actually, in comparison to other qualities, that is the first-class quality. Satyam samo damas titiksa arjavam, eh? Jnanam vijnanam astikyam brahma-karma svabhava-jam. When one is situated in these qualities -- truthfulness, satyam; samah, controlling the senses; damah, controlling the mind; samo damas titiksa, tolerant -- in spite of all tribulation, tolerant -- samo damas titiksa saucam, cleanliness. Then jnanam, full knowledge. Full knowledge means "What I am, what is God, what is this material world, what is our relationship." That is called knowledge. And that knowledge, when practically applied in life, that is called vijnanam. Jnanam vijnanam astikyam, astikyam, full faith in the sastras and in God. That is called astikyam. If you have full faith in the revealed scriptures, then you are astikya. Because you cannot manufacture your God, so-called incarnation God. No. You must have full knowledge of God through the authority of revealed scriptures. That is God consciousness. If you give up the injunction of the scripture, revealed scriptures, you consider something as God, that is not God. Or you consider something as religion, that is not religion. Yah sastra-vidhim utsrjya vartate kama-karatah, na sa siddhim avapnoti. If you become aberrant to the injunction of the sastras, then na sukham savapnoti, you'll never get happiness. Na sukham, yah sastra-vidhim utsrjya vartate kama-karatah, na, na sa siddhim avapnoti. There is no question of siddhi, perfection, neither there is question of happiness, na sukham na param gatim, and what to speak of going back home, back to Godhead. It is useless.

Therefore we must abide by the sadhu-sastra-guru. (aside:) Ah, what is this sound, is going on now? You can ask somebody to stop. Sadhu means saintly person. Sastra means revealed scriptures. Sadhu, sastra and guru, spiritual master. So we must follow the footprints of saintly persons, mahajano yena gatah sa panthah. That is the way. We have to follow great superior personalities, just like sad-gosvami. Narottama dasa Thakura says, ei chay gosani janr mui tanr dasa: "I become servant, servant or disciple, of such a person who follows the footprints of the six Gosvamis." Otherwise one becomes guru, anyone, just like nowadays they become. They are manufacturing guru. Guru is not manufactured. Guru is in the disciplic succession, one who is strictly follows the footsteps of the sad-gosvamis. Ei chay gosani janr. Anyone who is following the footsteps of the gosvamis, Rupa Gosvami... Rupa Gosvami gives his Upadesamrta instruction:

vaco vegam manasah krodha-vegamjihva-vegam udaropastha-vegametan vegan yo visaheta dhirahsarvam apimam prthivim sa sisyat

This is the injunction given by Rupa Gosvami. Vaco vegam. Vaco vegam means the force of talking, vegam. What is the meaning, vegam?

Nitai: Urge.

Prabhupada: Urge, yes. Just like I am talking some nonsense. That the vaco vegam; it has no value. We should fix something which has value. One who can control, it is better not to talk than to talk foolish. So that is the world. All foolish talking or foolish literature, it has no value. So it has to be controlled. That is called controlling the vaco vegam. Krodha-vegam. Krodha means anger. So it is also urge. Suppose I am insulted by somebody. Naturally, I'll be angry, but if I can control, "All right, let me... He's a foolish. He has done. Why shall I lose my temper?" That is called controlling krodha-vegam. Vaco vegam krodha-vegam, manasa-vegam, mind. It has got so many urges. Mind is driving practically, "Let us go there, let us go there, let us do this, let us..." Never mind sinful or pious, mind is always dictating and rejecting.

So vaco vegam manasah krodha-vegam, krodha-vegam, udara-vegam. Udara-vegam is the urge of the belly. "I shall eat this, I shall eat that, I shall eat that." Why? Simply you shall eat bhagavat-prasadam. Prasade sarva-duhkhanam. Then udara-vegam, and upastha-vegam, the urge of the genital. That is the most important. The jihva-vegam, jihva-vegam, udara-vegam, then genital, the straight line. So if one can control the urge of these three things... Ta'ra madhye jihva ati, lobhamoy sudurmati. Bhaktivinoda Thakura says that out of the urges of the tongue and other senses, down to the genital, up... There are many urges: urge of the mind, urge of the anger, urge of the talking, urge of the tongue, then belly, then genital. In this way, we are driven by so many urges. So out of that, the strongest enemy is our tongue, is our tongue. Jihva-vegam. If one can control the urges of the tongue then he will be naturally able to stop the urges of the belly and the urges of the genital, three straight line.

So these are to be practiced. Etan vegan yo visaheta dhirah: "One who has become successful in controlling the urges of all these things," prthivim sa sisyat, "now he's free to make disciples all over the world." And they're not, that... I cannot control even my tongue and control my genital, and I become spiritual master? This is nonsense. This is nonsense. You learn first of all. Try to control. Become first-class controller, dhirah. That is called dhirah, not disturbed by any urges. Etan vegan yo visaheta dhirah. Dhiras tatra na muhyati. This word is used, dhirah. Dhirah means very sober, fully controlled. That is called dhirah. Dhiras tatra na muhyati. Unless you become dhirah, you cannot understand what is spiritual life. That is not possible. Therefore Krsna says in the Bhagavad-gita, tatha dehantara-praptir dhiras tatra na muhyati [bg. 2.13]. Dhiras tatra na muhyati.

So you cannot understand even. Unless you become a dhirah, you cannot understand what is spiritual life, what is spirit. It is not a bogus thing that I manufacture something, concoct something, and do something, and I become a leader, I become a spiritual master. This is all nonsense. Dhiras tatra na muhyati. The word is dhirah, and dhirah is explained in the Kumara-sambhava, that dhirah, just like Lord Siva... Lord Siva lost his wife; she committed suicide before her father. That's in Daksa-yajna, was learned about Daksa-yajna. So Lord Siva was performing yoga practice meditation, and in the meantime, his wife Devi, she took birth as daughter of Himalaya, King of Himalaya, Parvati. So the..., there was fight between the demigods and the demons. So there was a plan that "If by the semina of Lord Siva, one son is born, Karttikeya, then he'll be able to kill these demons; otherwise, it is very difficult." So Lord Siva was engaged in meditation after the death of his wife. In the meantime, his wife took birth in the Himalaya. So now he, he has to be induced to unite with this Parvati. So there was plan made. The plan made that Parvati, young age, beautiful girl, and Lord Siva is meditating naked, and she was offering worshipable flowers on the genital. Still, he was not disturbed. Young girl touching the genital of a person, but he is not disturbed. That is dhirah, that is the example of perfection of dhirah. Even in the presence of being agitated, one who is not agitated, that is called dhirah. Otherwise, everyone becomes agitated. That is natural. A young boy sees another young man or a young man sees another young girl. Natural sex appetite, natural. But one who can control that, that is dhirah. That is dhirah. Dhiras tatra na muhyati. That is yoga practice. That is yoga practice, controlling. "When there will be need, I shall use it."

Just like Kardama Muni. Kardama Muni was given the best, beautiful daughter of King Manu. So she was simply serving, not that immediately coming and sexually inclined. She was... So Kardama Muni saw that "This girl came to me, and I have accepted her as my wife, but she is engaged fully, although she is the prince, the daughter of king, very great king. But I'm not giving her any comfort. She has become lean and thin, skinny, but engaged." So he promised that "I am accepting your daughter, but as soon as she will have some children, then I'll leave her. On this condition, I can accept your daughter." The father came with the daughter, that "My daughter has selected you as the proper husband, please accept her." So he accepted, but he made this condition that "As soon as your daughter will have some children, then I'll leave home. Then I'll accept."

So these are the examples, how to become dhirah. It is not spiritual consciousness, it is not so easy thing that you can go. But by the grace of Caitanya Mahaprabhu, it is being easily distributed. That is the grace of Sri Caitanya Mahaprabhu. But if we misuse it, even this facility, we do not know what is the aim of life, then we are missing the opportunity. So go on reading.

Pradyumna: "The degradation of the human instinct begins from the mlecchas, and the candala state of life is the last word in human degradation. All the above terms mentioned in the Vedic literatures..."

Prabhupada: This is first-class life, satyam samo damas titiksa arjavam jnanam vijnanam astikyam brahma-karma svabhava-jam. And the lowest class of life... Practically, nowadays all lowest class of life, the life of a candala, dog-eaters. So this is the description in the sastra. Go on.

Pradyumna: "All the above terms mentioned in the Vedic literatures are never meant for any particular community or birth..."

Prabhupada: It is not that because one has taken birth in the lowest class family -- suppose candala, dog-eaters -- it does not mean that he'll have to remain in that position. Just like uneducated persons. It is not that he'll have to remain in that uneducated standard, but he can become educated. He can become educated. That is Krsna consciousness movement, that there is no check on any particular person, community, to become God conscious. Became God Himself says, Krsna says, mam hi partha vyapasritya ye 'pi syuh papa-yonayah. Papa-yoni, to take birth in lower class of human society, is called papa-yoni. But Krsna says, "Never mind, papa-yoni.

mam hi partha vyapasrityaye 'pi syuh papa-yonayahstriyo vaisyas tatha sudraste 'pi yanti param gatim [bg. 9.32]

Formerly, in the Vedic civilization, even women and sudra, and vaisya, they were also considered amongst the papa-yoni, what to speak of others. But Krsna says, "Never mind whatever papa-yoni one may be." Mam hi partha vyapasritya: "If one takes shelter of My devotee," vyapasritya, "and works under his direction, then..." Vyapa. That is called vyapasritya. Visesa rupena asritya. "Then he also...," te 'pi yanti param gatim, "he can also go back to home, back to Godhead." There is no bar.

But one has to purify himself by the purificatory process. That is called samskara. Samskarad bhaved dvijah. By purificatory process, one becomes purified, and purified means no more sinful life. That is purification. Yesam tv anta-gatam papam. One who is fully freed from sinful activities:

yesam tv anta-gatam papamjananam punya-karmanamte dvandva-moha-nirmuktabhajante mam drdha-vratah [bg. 7.28]

So krsna-bhajana is not very difficult. Simply we have to follow the four principles of sinful life: no illicit sex, no gambling, no intoxication, no meat-eating. And chant Hare Krsna. And be happy.

Thank you very much. (end)

>>> Ref. VedaBase => Srimad-Bhagavatam 1.16.20 -- Hawaii, January 16, 1974

-- ChantHare Krsna, Hare Krsna, Krsna Krsna, Hare Hare II Hare Rama, Hare Rama, Rama Rama, Hare Hare II --is the sublime method for reviving our Krsna consciousness. As living spiritual souls we are all originally Krsna conscious entities, but due to our asociation with matter since time immemorial, our consciousness is now poluted by material atmosphere. In this polluted concept of life, we are all trying to exploit the resources of material nature, but actually we are becoming more and more entangled in our complexities. This illusion is called Maya, or hard struggle for existence over the stringent laws of material nature. This illusory struggle against the material nature can at once be stopped by revival of our Krsna consciousness. And Be Happy --~--~---------~--~----~------------~-------~--~----~You received this message because you are d to the Google Groups "kanaiyyadesh" group. To post to this group, send email to kanaiyyadesh (AT) googl (DOT) com