Guest guest Posted May 16, 2005 Report Share Posted May 16, 2005 Dear Balagopal, Actually speaking there are a number of such instances when mantras hv been taught by the sages to diferent people.For eg.in Ramayana sage Viswamithra taught the mantras of bala-adhibhala to Sri Rama and Lakshmana to overcome hunger and thirst which helped them to kill the demons forgetting hunger and thirst.Arunagirinathar a great devotee was taught the pranava mantra by Lord Subrahmanya himself and with that he was able to recite the famous Tirupugazh, a great hymn in Tamil euologising Lord Muruga of the six hill temples in which He is seated.Instances are a lot and all this happens even in our present age and we need not embark on the puranic quotes though it is also ok.Regarding the power of mantra siddhi I hv read recently about an unpublished letter of Swami Vivekananda which was found among the old papers and written to the Maharaja of Khetri in Rajasthan and found in the sub divisional office.The letter is very interesting and just for infmn I give below the gist.The letter was written in June 1893 or so. Swami Vivekananda heard from some persons about an astrologer of Chetty caste who was living in a village near Kumbakonam,Tamilnad.The astrologer possessed great mind reading power.Vivekananda wanted to test him and thought abt 3 things in his mind.Firstly he had a dream in which he saw the death of his mother.Secondly he wanted to know whether he shuld believe the words of his Master.Thirdlly he thought above some mantra in Tibetan tongue.So he with two of his companions went to see the astrologer.On seeing them he got ferocious by saying that becoz of the arrival of some Britishers he got fever and could not give them seance and finally agreed to give them seance if they pay Rs.10/-Vivekanandas companions were glad to give Rs.10/-Then he asked Swami to give some ashes.For that Vivekananda replied that he did not possess any power to cure illness and the astrologer said dont worry abt those things and just give the ashes that is enough for which Swami agreed. The astrologer then went to his private room and after some time came and then wrote something in a paper and asked the Swami to sign the same as a mark of confmn and put that paper in the pocket of one of Swamis companions.Then he asked Swami why a Sanyasi like him think about his mother for which Vivekananda replied that even Adi Sankara had an affection to his mother.The astrologer nodded in approval and said I hv written abt yr mother in the paper.Secondly when swami asked abt the Master the astrologer said he is no more and a very evolved person and the Swami must believe in his Masters words as the Master is looking after him from his ethereal body.Swami then asked I can believe this only if you name who is my Master.For that the astrologer said the Master has a very sweet name and the same is written in the paper.Then when Swamy wanted to know the mantra he had in his mind the astrologer intervened the mantra is in Tibetan language and the same is 'Lamaha capsechua' which is also written by him in the paper.The astrologer Govind chetty then asked to think abt any mantra in any language and he will say.Swami thought 'Om Namo Bagavathey Vasudevaya'.The astrologer said what the mantra he thought is also written in the paper that is put in the pocket of his companion. When Vivekananda saw the paper it is written that his mother is a very pious and noble lady who is ok but always think abt her son Narendra(vivekananda) and because of this she feels as if she is dead and she shall die in two years and if the Swami wants to see her he can see within two years.Second and third questions also were correctly written He descrined the Master is called Rama Krishna Paramahansa.Finally he has written the Swami will think abt the mantra Om Namo Bagavathey Vasudevaya after an hour of discussion.The Swamiji was flabbergasted at the accurate thinking of his mind.Then the astrologer told swami who he is and the purpose of his visit to the village.Then he toned down his voice and said he wont accept any money from Swami as he is a great soul and wished to do some seva for him.He gave some milk to Swami and asked his family members to prostrate before him.The curiosity of Vivekananda increased and he asked the astrologer how he was able to read his mind about the questions he wanted to ask two days before coming.After some initial hesitation the astrologer revealed it is all due to Mantra Siddhi and Sahaya of Devi. Such is the potency of mantras.Of course for attaining siddhi of a mantra there are some rituals which shuld be scruplously followed and then the sadhak finds the deity in him which guides and goads him in his endeavours.The siddhi mantra has to be got from some great Guru who himself must hv attained siddhy power and it shuld be recited daily after certain rituals in particular numbers for eg.if it is recited 1000 times daily everyday the same number shuld be recited.The norm is for every letter of the mantra one lakh times the mantra shuld be repeated.For Panchakshari mantra Om Nama Sivaya 5 lakh times,Om Namo Narayanaya 8 lakh times and so on with absolute concentration and devotion and after reciting the mantra necessary offerings shuld be offered to the deity.If strictly followed siddhi is assured afer the completion of the number of times.The siddhi does not take any form but the mantra siddha can do great things.Even now there are many doing such things.One must remeber that by reciting the mantra the aspirant invokes the cosmic energy which lies in him in a dormant form and shuld be careful in his sadhana. Of course it is not possible for everybody to adopt this becoz of various mundane activities in the present day world and hence simple mantras which can be easily recited all times like Rama,Krishna etc are prescribed in this age.As the same requires time and only people who can afford time for mantra recitation are in a position to attain siddhi.Further lot of disciplines and keeping body and soul in gud condition avoiding things that are prohibited all are essential to attain sadhwic siddhi.So only rare people embark on this course which is full of thorns.I hv just posted this abt the intricacies of Mantras and their potent power.So it is suggested in this age Nama smarana of the Lord itself is a great thing. Hare Krishna, agramanbalagopal ramakrishnan <rbalpal wrote: !!HARI AUM!!The power is evident in the case of Druva to whomNarada had delivered the mantra-OM NAMO BHAGAVATHEVASUDEVAYAH.The same sage Narada gave a different Mantra toValmiki-Maramaramara...It means the Mantras differ depending upon achperson's current state of mental evolution.Probabaly Valmiki in his robber self may not be in aposition even to take the Lord Rama's name as such.Shree Ganapathy Raman's intro into this powerful tool(Mantra) is very thought provoking too. Isn't our day to day speech a sort of mantra japa?Looking ahead for more of valuable contributions fromour Krishna BhakthasAum Namo NarayanayahBalagaopal______________________ India Matrimony: Find your life partner onlineGo to: http://.shaadi.com/india-matrimonyOm Namo Narayanaya: India Matrimony: Find your life partner online. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted May 17, 2005 Report Share Posted May 17, 2005 !! Sri Rama Jayam !! Dear Shri Balagopal, Your point is very true, that Mantras differ from person to person. Our immortal sages & yogis have spent their entire lifetime discovering the power & glory of these mantras. Each mantra therefore has deity, the preceptor (one who has fully understood the pros & cons of the mantra/deity) & the student (who pledges to safegaurd & make the best use of the mantra). That's why any mantra should attain the status of "Guru mantra" (dictated by a spiritual guru) before any body accepts or uses it. Otherwise, the student is highly prone to face the severe outcomes. Moreover, in the early yugas, the preceptor possessed the command to withdraw all the strengths of the respective mantras from the student, in case of any misuse. A very popular example, is that of Karna, who forgot the technique to use the deadly weapon (given by his master Sri Parashurama) against Arjuna in the kurukshetra warfield. Another beautiful example is that of sage Yagyavalkaya, whose unhappy guru asked him to vomit all the essence of Veda/Upanishad teachings that he'd received. It is said that a group of birds named "Thitar" consumed up all the vomitted remains. That lead to a new branch of Upanishad called "Thaitareeya Upanishad". In Ramayanam, sage Vishwamitra is addressed as the weapon expert. He'd a big chain of students who were totally dedicated in designing new & highly sophisticated weapons. Ravana knew this already, & that's why he appointed his relatives Khara, Dushana, Trishira, Marich & Taraka near to Dandaka forest lying in between Arya kshetram & Kishkinta puri.Two of the major findings of Vishwamtra were "Bala" & "Atibala", which were presented to Sri Rama & Sri Laxmana, becoz that great sage identified these to human lions as the most efficient & capable persons on earth to save "Dharma" & restrict "Adharma". In this age, power of mantras are really unknown to even a so-called guru & that's why our great saints have not asserted on "Mantra Sankirtanam", but only on "Namasankirtanam". The "Nama" is more powerful than the "Nami". We all are really fortunate to be born in this age, as sung by Poonthanam, becoz Hari bhakti has become so simple & accessible to everybody just by chanting his name. Janaki Kantha smarana - "Jaya Jaya Rama Rama " Nityam Bhajami Sri Raghuvamshanatham. Krishna Krishna Mukunda Janardhana Krishna Govinda Narayana Hare Achyuthananda Govinda Madhava Sachidananda Narayana Hare Karalil vivekam koodathe kanda ara nimishambada kalayaratharum Maranam varumini ennu ninachiha maruvuka satatam Narayana Jaya Gurunathan thuna cheyka santatam Thirunamangal navin mel eppozhum Piriyathe irikkenam nammude Narjanmam saphalamakeeduan. Hare Krishna Hare Rama guruvayur [guruvayur ]On Behalf Of balagopal ramakrishnanMonday, May 16, 2005 4:43 PMguruvayur Subject: [Guruvayur/Guruvayoor] Power of Mantras!!HARI AUM!!The power is evident in the case of Druva to whomNarada had delivered the mantra-OM NAMO BHAGAVATHEVASUDEVAYAH.The same sage Narada gave a different Mantra toValmiki-Maramaramara...It means the Mantras differ depending upon achperson's current state of mental evolution.Probabaly Valmiki in his robber self may not be in aposition even to take the Lord Rama's name as such.Shree Ganapathy Raman's intro into this powerful tool(Mantra) is very thought provoking too. Isn't our day to day speech a sort of mantra japa?Looking ahead for more of valuable contributions fromour Krishna BhakthasAum Namo NarayanayahBalagaopal______________________ India Matrimony: Find your life partner onlineGo to: http://.shaadi.com/india-matrimonyOm Namo Narayanaya: Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted May 17, 2005 Report Share Posted May 17, 2005 Dear Vinod, Your points are really thought provoking to some extent.When we live in a different age still we harp on the ages of thousands of years before.What were pertinent and adapatable during Treda and Dwaraka yugas cant be applied to Kali Yuga.During those days the sages by just pouring some water or some other thing were able to curse people who did something out of ignorance and instances are galore and the methods were adopted by all the great rishis like Durvasa,Viswamithra, to quote two of the famous rishis.On the other hand there were rishis also like Vashita who were having compassion,kindness and sympathy unlike Viswamithra and Durvasa who becoz of the knowledge and powers obtained by doing penance dissipated their energies on frivolous things as their ego was such.The disciples of them as well the kings of those days when those rishis were living were always under fear and tried their level best to placate the angry rishis to get boons etc not out of love but simply out of fear of being cursed by them.In Bharatha also there is an instance that Draupadi was given an akshaya patra which produced the food and other things when the pandavas were in exile.On instigation by the enemies of pandavas Durvasa went to the pandavas at noon with his disciples and asked for lunch.Draupadi had already finished the food generated by the akshayapatra which can be utilised only once a day.She was in a quandry as how ro feed the angry Durvasa and his retinue.She anyway asked them to hv thei bath and come for taking the offerings.The rishi and his followers went to take bath.The pandavas were terribly worried and when pushed to the wall Draupadi prayed Krishna for help.The ever protecting Parantama came there and Draupadi narrated her predicament.The Lord asked her to bring the patra though empty and founf a small leaf sticking to it.He took it with great relish and said His stomach was full and he could not take anything more.By the same time Durvasa and the his retinue also had their stomach full and in a huff they left the place even without telling the pandavas.This story might hv been read by all.So what I wish to stress is that Guru shuld be one who never gave himself to self importance and possess ego of their powers but a kind hearted one.The story of Drona asking for the thumb of Ekalayva as Guru dakshina though he was not taken as his disciple but in his mind took Drona as his Guru and Drona in his anger asked for the thumb as Guru dakshina so that Ekalayva wont be a competitor to arjuna is also well known.So such rishis with anger and without compassion ,do they deserve to be real Gurus?The same Guru was not in a position to help his disciples in the court of Duryodhana when Draupadi was offended.Then how can one say they practiced the nature of Dharma. Just becoz they were fed by Duryodhana they wanted to be his slaves forgetting their Dharmic nature.May be all these shuld hv happened in the Grand scheme the Lord had visualised. I am hearing Mantra Kirtana for the first time.Mantras as far as I know are invocations of the Supreme Being.Of course there shuld be a rishi,some chandas and a devata.Such things are initiated to an aspirant in his pursuit to enter the realms of higher stages of consciousness.Again mantras can't be concocted or tailor made for the individual despite some claims.They hv always existed on a latent state as sound energies.Just as gravity was discovered but not invented by Newton,Mantras too were revealed to the ancient masters.There is no controversy on this.They hv been codified in the scriptures and handed down from guru to disciple.Neither mantra,deity not guru once chosen shuld be changed.There are many paths up the mountain.Preservance on one alone will bring the aspirant to the top faster than if he were to spread his energies in exploring all the alternative paths. Japa meditation is a method of channeling one's consciousness from the lowest to the highest level of pure thought.Repeated verbally and mentally, a Mantra lifts one into the telepathic stage and beyond to the transcendental."Rama", for instance,has a specific form that merges with the name in the telepathic state.On reaching higher levels, name,form, and one's own Self as witness are indistinguishable.They unite and a state of bliss prevails.One does not enjoy bliss,but becomes Bliss itself.This is the true experience of meditation.Japa is one of the direct ways of self realisation,or Universal Consciousness.It removes the dirt of the mind,the anger,greed ,lust and other impurities that hide the light within.Just as a dusty mirror acquires the power of reflection when cleaned,the mind from which impurities hv been removed acquires the capacity to reflect higher spiritual truth.Even a little recitation with feeling and one pointedness in concentration on the meaning destroys mental impurities.Japa meditation done with faith,devotion and purity augments the power of the aspirant,bestowing on him the virtues and powers of the Mantra's presiding deity.Revealing God to his consciousness,it confers illumination and eternal bliss. The Supreme is not an individual entity.God is an experience realised on a particular wavelength.Japa produces in the mind the form of the deity connected with the Mantra.As said earlier repetition with concentration on the meaning of Mantra and on the attributes of the particular deity will bring God Realization quickly.Of course I do agree that before attempting to embark on this path which is not for all but only to true aspirants, before attempting japa one shuld seek out a Guru and receive Mantra initiation from him.Only who are pure themselves can give initiation to others.Therefore it is imperative to find a qualified guru.There must be psychic affinity between the teacher and student,for the spiritual path is a life time involvement.There are no short cut to the goals.Needless to say ,the commercial peddlers of instant-mix mumbo-jumbo which is sold as Mantras shuld be assiduously avoided.They are opportunists preying on the spiritual instincts of those who are sincerely looking for Truth. If no Guru of worth can be found,Lord Dakshinamoorthy can be mentally taken as the Guru as He is the Guru of all Gurus,one may select any Mantra that seems appropriate and to the liking.There is no harm and whatever said in the instant made books need not inculcate the fear psychosis in the minds of true aspirant.The mantra when repeated mentally with faith and devotion everyday has a purifactory effect,and the Realisation can be achieved in course of time depending on sadhaks sincerity and discipline.The vibrations of mantras and those of the aspirants on the spirtual journey must be mutually compatible.The mind must also be receptive to the deity whose form it will eventually assume.The process of attuning body and mind to the Mantra thru japa meditation is prolonged.When attunement is achieved,meditation takes place.In deeper meditation which takes time the response comes in a fine rain of magnetism which bathes the body in a downward flow of soft electricity.One experiences that eternal Silence which encompasses all sound. So I do feel it is a misnomer that there are no qualified Gurus.When the time comes Guru himself comes to the disciple as narrated in the story of Narendra(future Vivekananda) who in his arduous task of finding a person who has seen God went to so many of the Gurus of his time and when he could not get convincing replies finally landed at the place of Sri Ramakrishna Paramahansa and little Narendra put the question which he put to the people whom he met already whether "you hv seen God' and Ramakrishna who was waiting for his pet disciple replied yes,very much as I am seeing you.This only confused Narendra and Sri Ramakrishna touched Narendra's head and immeduately Narendra went to Samadhy stage in which he enjoyed the eternal Bliss and forgot his body,mind and everything as he became attuned to the Supra Conscious stage and subsequently became a devotee of Ramakrishna and became his principal disciple.Even this day we hv heard many people who hv reached great heights in spituality and the examples are Swamy Ramadas of Kanjangad,Swamy Ramananda of Ottapalam,Swamy of Tapovana in Tamilnad,Yogi Surat Ramkumar of Tiruvannamalai,Bhagawan Ramana Maharishy,Paramacharya of Kanchi,Seshathri Swamy etc all of whom hv attained Mahasamathy.So it is not correct to say that there are lack of satgurus.They are still avilable and one must hv the luck to find such a person and it is also essential that such Guru shuld accept one as his disciple.As they are highly evolved persons by just seeing a person they can study his whole history which will flash in their minds like TV and they will take them as their disciples only when they are convinced. There is no dispute Nama Sankeerthan is gud for the beginners but one who wants to hv more advanced studies they hv to go thru the various processes that are prescribed.Nama Sankeerthan gives the elementary principles of Bakti like a child studying LKG,UKG but never rises one to great heights.If some hv achieved it is becoz of their devotion and sincerity.Hence creating panic in the minds of ardent seekers who wish to adavance in their quest for more knowledge is not a welcome development.There is no comparison with such evolved souls like Poonthanam ,Chaitanya,Tulsidas and others whose dedication to the Lord was par excellence and I dont think such noble souls can be found in great numbers.So Nama can be recited for those who wants to inculcate Bakti in their mind and that too not simply saying as a matter of routine but with great devotion where one forgets himself and see only the Lord when he recites the name.In modern temples we hear whether in Guruvayur,Sabarimala and others people shout loudly the name of the Lord but how many people say this Nama with sincerity and devotion is a matter for argument.I hv seen such outcrying the name of the Lord but at the same time many people who says such names see others and shout.I am not going to dispute anybodys Bakti but even repeating silently the names of the Lord in the mind He can hear instead of making hysterical gestures. In essence the Nama Sankeerthan of Hari is for devotees who wish to inculcate Bakti in their minds in the first instance and the Mantra Japa is only for those who hv absolute discipline,devotion,taking only one mantra of their ishta devata,and seeing that devata in all deities and never flinching from the path despite obstacles and if these are sincerly followed one can get more illumination as it is a long process and can be achieved only when one tames his mind.Lack of a proper Guru is not a must as by taking God as his Guru one can practice mantra japa and when the aspirant advances in stages the real Guru meant for him will come to him either in physical form or ethereal form or directions will be given in dreams.It has happened and will also happen.There is no doubt abt it.One cant expect results overnight but thru preservance,patience,practice results are bound to come.The same is the case with Nama Sankeerthan also.In this age when the whole mind is pre occupied with the pleasures of life and other problems one face it is difficult to practice the Mantra Japa as one cant understand the intricacies and nature of such things.Hence it was suggested to do Nama Sankeerthan.But even for that devotion and dedication and concentration are essential.By simply calling Krishna He wont come unless the mind is also in tune with the name one pronounces.But there may be aspirants to know the ultimate truth and for them Mantra Japa is prescribed and not for all the people as a child studying Xth Std cant understand the dynamics of higher studies like post graduation or doctorate degrees.The meaning and nature of Mantra japa will automatically understood by the sadhaka once he reaches certain stages above the terrestrial spheres as the power within him goes up from the base of the spine.This is another aspect which can be discussed at a later stage.This is the Universal Law of Nature. Hare Krishna, agraman"PS, Vinod K (GE Energy)" <vinod.ps wrote: !! Sri Rama Jayam !! Dear Shri Balagopal, Your point is very true, that Mantras differ from person to person. Our immortal sages & yogis have spent their entire lifetime discovering the power & glory of these mantras. Each mantra therefore has deity, the preceptor (one who has fully understood the pros & cons of the mantra/deity) & the student (who pledges to safegaurd & make the best use of the mantra). That's why any mantra should attain the status of "Guru mantra" (dictated by a spiritual guru) before any body accepts or uses it. Otherwise, the student is highly prone to face the severe outcomes. Moreover, in the early yugas, the preceptor possessed the command to withdraw all the strengths of the respective mantras from the student, in case of any misuse. A very popular example, is that of Karna, who forgot the technique to use the deadly weapon (given by his master Sri Parashurama) against Arjuna in the kurukshetra warfield. Another beautiful example is that of sage Yagyavalkaya, whose unhappy guru asked him to vomit all the essence of Veda/Upanishad teachings that he'd received. It is said that a group of birds named "Thitar" consumed up all the vomitted remains. That lead to a new branch of Upanishad called "Thaitareeya Upanishad". In Ramayanam, sage Vishwamitra is addressed as the weapon expert. He'd a big chain of students who were totally dedicated in designing new & highly sophisticated weapons. Ravana knew this already, & that's why he appointed his relatives Khara, Dushana, Trishira, Marich & Taraka near to Dandaka forest lying in between Arya kshetram & Kishkinta puri.Two of the major findings of Vishwamtra were "Bala" & "Atibala", which were presented to Sri Rama & Sri Laxmana, becoz that great sage identified these to human lions as the most efficient & capable persons on earth to save "Dharma" & restrict "Adharma". In this age, power of mantras are really unknown to even a so-called guru & that's why our great saints have not asserted on "Mantra Sankirtanam", but only on "Namasankirtanam". The "Nama" is more powerful than the "Nami". We all are really fortunate to be born in this age, as sung by Poonthanam, becoz Hari bhakti has become so simple & accessible to everybody just by chanting his name. Janaki Kantha smarana - "Jaya Jaya Rama Rama " Nityam Bhajami Sri Raghuvamshanatham. Krishna Krishna Mukunda Janardhana Krishna Govinda Narayana Hare Achyuthananda Govinda Madhava Sachidananda Narayana Hare Karalil vivekam koodathe kanda ara nimishambada kalayaratharum Maranam varumini ennu ninachiha maruvuka satatam Narayana Jaya Gurunathan thuna cheyka santatam Thirunamangal navin mel eppozhum Piriyathe irikkenam nammude Narjanmam saphalamakeeduan. Hare Krishna Hare Rama guruvayur [guruvayur ]On Behalf Of balagopal ramakrishnanMonday, May 16, 2005 4:43 PMguruvayur Subject: [Guruvayur/Guruvayoor] Power of Mantras!!HARI AUM!!The power is evident in the case of Druva to whomNarada had delivered the mantra-OM NAMO BHAGAVATHEVASUDEVAYAH.The same sage Narada gave a different Mantra toValmiki-Maramaramara...It means the Mantras differ depending upon achperson's current state of mental evolution.Probabaly Valmiki in his robber self may not be in aposition even to take the Lord Rama's name as such.Shree Ganapathy Raman's intro into this powerful tool(Mantra) is very thought provoking too. Isn't our day to day speech a sort of mantra japa?Looking ahead for more of valuable contributions fromour Krishna BhakthasAum Namo NarayanayahBalagaopal______________________ India Matrimony: Find your life partner onlineGo to: http://.shaadi.com/india-matrimonyOm Namo Narayanaya: Om Namo Narayanaya: India Matrimony: Find your life partner online. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted May 18, 2005 Report Share Posted May 18, 2005 !! Sri rama Jayam !! Dear shri Balagopal, Appreciate your defense & I too accept that to a gud extent. Please don't tame any feeling that I am trying to challenge the importance of mantras. But, to me it's the Rama Nama which stands above Rama Mantra & even Rama himself. I will try to comment on this based on your opinions. Let me pick it up on-by-one. 1. "Nama Sankeerthan gives the elementary principles of Bhakti like a child studying LKG,UKG but never rises one to great heights." I don't agree on this point. It is true that nama sankirtanam makes us aware of the elementary principles. But parallely, it is the most IMP thing in Bhakti that one shud never forget these elementary principles, when he/she has reached the highest class of consciousness. We have many such examples in our holy texts, that even great yogis & Mahayogis have fallen badly after reaching their peak. I have heard a story from Srimad Bhagavattam that once Krishna & his mates went a long way into a forest where some rishis were performing Vishnu Mahayagya to please the supreme. Krishna asked the sages to give him some part of the yagya offerings so that he cud pacify the hunger of his friends. But to krishna's surprise, sages asked him to stay till the yagya gets completed. This is a very interesting scene, when the respective Lord of yagya himself is asking for the offering & the offerer is unable to visualize his presence. Those sages were not ordinary one, let me assume, then what to talk of us in the kali age. The rishis possesed every highest quality of consciousness, but they easily missed out the elementary thing that "Krishna is omnipresent & all-aware". 2. "Nama Sankeerthan is gud for the beginners" True, but not the least, it is the best of learned devotees also. Take for example, Sabari was born in a low-class illiterate society of forest-dwellers. When her Guru (Matanga muni)left for samadhi, he blessed her service with a rare opportunity of Sri Rama darshanam & on spot mukti. There was no any mantra advised by her Guru as such, rather to wait patiently for the Lord, who alone will come searching for her & bless her finally. Young sabari understood her guru's indication & practiced the elementary lesson of devotion throughout her life. The group of sages residing around PAMPA got news about the arrival of their most awaited Lord. But they were not so happy about Rama's visit to Sabari ashramam at first. Lord has come to bless his most dear devotee Sabari for her undying patience that kept her living with same enthusiasm of a beginner at her old age. There the yogis realized the true importance of the elementary devotion that they have missed out in there long journey. Dear shri Balagopal, what I am trying to put is that our Lord is more particular about his unexperienced devotees & I always prefer to be a grandchild devotee of the Lord. He is fully immersed in my consciousness that way. Sorry, if my writing hurts you. Hare Krishna Hare Rama guruvayur [guruvayur ]On Behalf Of GANAPATHY RAMANWednesday, May 18, 2005 2:11 AMguruvayur Subject: RE: [Guruvayur/Guruvayoor] Power of Mantras Dear Vinod, Your points are really thought provoking to some extent.When we live in a different age still we harp on the ages of thousands of years before.What were pertinent and adapatable during Treda and Dwaraka yugas cant be applied to Kali Yuga.During those days the sages by just pouring some water or some other thing were able to curse people who did something out of ignorance and instances are galore and the methods were adopted by all the great rishis like Durvasa,Viswamithra, to quote two of the famous rishis.On the other hand there were rishis also like Vashita who were having compassion,kindness and sympathy unlike Viswamithra and Durvasa who becoz of the knowledge and powers obtained by doing penance dissipated their energies on frivolous things as their ego was such.The disciples of them as well the kings of those days when those rishis were living were always under fear and tried their level best to placate the angry rishis to get boons etc not out of love! but simply out of fear of being cursed by them.In Bharatha also there is an instance that Draupadi was given an akshaya patra which produced the food and other things when the pandavas were in exile.On instigation by the enemies of pandavas Durvasa went to the pandavas at noon with his disciples and asked for lunch.Draupadi had already finished the food generated by the akshayapatra which can be utilised only once a day.She was in a quandry as how ro feed the angry Durvasa and his retinue.She anyway asked them to hv thei bath and come for taking the offerings.The rishi and his followers went to take bath.The pandavas were terribly worried and when pushed to the wall Draupadi prayed Krishna for help.The ever protecting Parantama came there and Draupadi narrated her predicament.The Lord asked her to bring the patra though empty and founf a small leaf sticking to it.He took it with great relish and said His stomach was full and he could not take anything more.By the same time Durv! asa and the his retinue also had their stomach full and in a huff they left the place even without telling the pandavas.This story might hv been read by all.So what I wish to stress is that Guru shuld be one who never gave himself to self importance and possess ego of their powers but a kind hearted one.The story of Drona asking for the thumb of Ekalayva as Guru dakshina though he was not taken as his disciple but in his mind took Drona as his Guru and Drona in his anger asked for the thumb as Guru dakshina so that Ekalayva wont be a competitor to arjuna is also well known.So such rishis with anger and without compassion ,do they deserve to be real Gurus?The same Guru was not in a position to help his disciples in the court of Duryodhana when Draupadi was offended.Then how can one say they practiced the nature of Dharma. Just becoz they were fed by Duryodhana they wanted to be his slaves forgetting their Dharmic nature.May be all these shuld hv happened in the Gra! nd scheme the Lord had visualised. I am hearing Mantra Kirtana for the first time.Mantras as far as I know are invocations of the Supreme Being.Of course there shuld be a rishi,some chandas and a devata.Such things are initiated to an aspirant in his pursuit to enter the realms of higher stages of consciousness.Again mantras can't be concocted or tailor made for the individual despite some claims.They hv always existed on a latent state as sound energies.Just as gravity was discovered but not invented by Newton,Mantras too were revealed to the ancient masters.There is no controversy on this.They hv been codified in the scriptures and handed down from guru to disciple.Neither mantra,deity not guru once chosen shuld be changed.There are many paths up the mountain.Preservance on one alone will bring the aspirant to the top faster than if he were to spread his energies in exploring all the alternative paths. Japa meditation is a method of channeling one's consciousness from the lowest to the highest level of pure thought.Repeated verbally and mentally, a Mantra lifts one into the telepathic stage and beyond to the transcendental."Rama", for instance,has a specific form that merges with the name in the telepathic state.On reaching higher levels, name,form, and one's own Self as witness are indistinguishable.They unite and a state of bliss prevails.One does not enjoy bliss,but becomes Bliss itself.This is the true experience of meditation.Japa is one of the direct ways of self realisation,or Universal Consciousness.It removes the dirt of the mind,the anger,greed ,lust and other impurities that hide the light within.Just as a dusty mirror acquires the power of reflection when cleaned,the mind from which impurities hv been removed acquires the capacity to reflect higher spiritual truth.Even a little recitation with feeling and one pointedness in concentration on the meaning des! troys mental impurities.Japa meditation done with faith,devotion and purity augments the power of the aspirant,bestowing on him the virtues and powers of the Mantra's presiding deity.Revealing God to his consciousness,it confers illumination and eternal bliss. The Supreme is not an individual entity.God is an experience realised on a particular wavelength.Japa produces in the mind the form of the deity connected with the Mantra.As said earlier repetition with concentration on the meaning of Mantra and on the attributes of the particular deity will bring God Realization quickly.Of course I do agree that before attempting to embark on this path which is not for all but only to true aspirants, before attempting japa one shuld seek out a Guru and receive Mantra initiation from him.Only who are pure themselves can give initiation to others.Therefore it is imperative to find a qualified guru.There must be psychic affinity between the teacher and student,for the spiritual path is a life time involvement.There are no short cut to the goals.Needless to say ,the commercial peddlers of instant-mix mumbo-jumbo which is sold as Mantras shuld be assiduously avoided.They are opportunists preying on the spiritual instincts of those who are s! incerely looking for Truth. If no Guru of worth can be found,Lord Dakshinamoorthy can be mentally taken as the Guru as He is the Guru of all Gurus,one may select any Mantra that seems appropriate and to the liking.There is no harm and whatever said in the instant made books need not inculcate the fear psychosis in the minds of true aspirant.The mantra when repeated mentally with faith and devotion everyday has a purifactory effect,and the Realisation can be achieved in course of time depending on sadhaks sincerity and discipline.The vibrations of mantras and those of the aspirants on the spirtual journey must be mutually compatible.The mind must also be receptive to the deity whose form it will eventually assume.The process of attuning body and mind to the Mantra thru japa meditation is prolonged.When attunement is achieved,meditation takes place.In deeper meditation which takes time the response comes in a fine rain of magnetism which bathes the body in a downward flow of soft electricity.One exp! eriences that eternal Silence which encompasses all sound. So I do feel it is a misnomer that there are no qualified Gurus.When the time comes Guru himself comes to the disciple as narrated in the story of Narendra(future Vivekananda) who in his arduous task of finding a person who has seen God went to so many of the Gurus of his time and when he could not get convincing replies finally landed at the place of Sri Ramakrishna Paramahansa and little Narendra put the question which he put to the people whom he met already whether "you hv seen God' and Ramakrishna who was waiting for his pet disciple replied yes,very much as I am seeing you.This only confused Narendra and Sri Ramakrishna touched Narendra's head and immeduately Narendra went to Samadhy stage in which he enjoyed the eternal Bliss and forgot his body,mind and everything as he became attuned to the Supra Conscious stage and subsequently became a devotee of Ramakrishna and became his principal disciple.Even this day we hv heard many people who hv reached great hei! ghts in spituality and the examples are Swamy Ramadas of Kanjangad,Swamy Ramananda of Ottapalam,Swamy of Tapovana in Tamilnad,Yogi Surat Ramkumar of Tiruvannamalai,Bhagawan Ramana Maharishy,Paramacharya of Kanchi,Seshathri Swamy etc all of whom hv attained Mahasamathy.So it is not correct to say that there are lack of satgurus.They are still avilable and one must hv the luck to find such a person and it is also essential that such Guru shuld accept one as his disciple.As they are highly evolved persons by just seeing a person they can study his whole history which will flash in their minds like TV and they will take them as their disciples only when they are convinced. There is no dispute Nama Sankeerthan is gud for the beginners but one who wants to hv more advanced studies they hv to go thru the various processes that are prescribed.Nama Sankeerthan gives the elementary principles of Bakti like a child studying LKG,UKG but never rises one to great heights.If some hv achieved it is becoz of their devotion and sincerity.Hence creating panic in the minds of ardent seekers who wish to adavance in their quest for more knowledge is not a welcome development.There is no comparison with such evolved souls like Poonthanam ,Chaitanya,Tulsidas and others whose dedication to the Lord was par excellence and I dont think such noble souls can be found in great numbers.So Nama can be recited for those who wants to inculcate Bakti in their mind and that too not simply saying as a matter of routine but with great devotion where one forgets himself and see only the Lord when he recites the name.In modern temples we hear whether in Guruvayur,Sabarimala! and others people shout loudly the name of the Lord but how many people say this Nama with sincerity and devotion is a matter for argument.I hv seen such outcrying the name of the Lord but at the same time many people who says such names see others and shout.I am not going to dispute anybodys Bakti but even repeating silently the names of the Lord in the mind He can hear instead of making hysterical gestures. In essence the Nama Sankeerthan of Hari is for devotees who wish to inculcate Bakti in their minds in the first instance and the Mantra Japa is only for those who hv absolute discipline,devotion,taking only one mantra of their ishta devata,and seeing that devata in all deities and never flinching from the path despite obstacles and if these are sincerly followed one can get more illumination as it is a long process and can be achieved only when one tames his mind.Lack of a proper Guru is not a must as by taking God as his Guru one can practice mantra japa and when the aspirant advances in stages the real Guru meant for him will come to him either in physical form or ethereal form or directions will be given in dreams.It has happened and will also happen.There is no doubt abt it.One cant expect results overnight but thru preservance,patience,practice results are bound to come.The same is the case with Nama Sankeerthan also.In this age when the whole mind is pre occupied ! with the pleasures of life and other problems one face it is difficult to practice the Mantra Japa as one cant understand the intricacies and nature of such things.Hence it was suggested to do Nama Sankeerthan.But even for that devotion and dedication and concentration are essential.By simply calling Krishna He wont come unless the mind is also in tune with the name one pronounces.But there may be aspirants to know the ultimate truth and for them Mantra Japa is prescribed and not for all the people as a child studying Xth Std cant understand the dynamics of higher studies like post graduation or doctorate degrees.The meaning and nature of Mantra japa will automatically understood by the sadhaka once he reaches certain stages above the terrestrial spheres as the power within him goes up from the base of the spine.This is another aspect which can be discussed at a later stage.This is the Universal Law of Nature. Hare Krishna, agraman"PS, Vinod K (GE Energy)" <vinod.ps wrote: !! Sri Rama Jayam !! Dear Shri Balagopal, Your point is very true, that Mantras differ from person to person. Our immortal sages & yogis have spent their entire lifetime discovering the power & glory of these mantras. Each mantra therefore has deity, the preceptor (one who has fully understood the pros & cons of the mantra/deity) & the student (who pledges to safegaurd & make the best use of the mantra). That's why any mantra should attain the status of "Guru mantra" (dictated by a spiritual guru) before any body accepts or uses it. Otherwise, the student is highly prone to face the severe outcomes. Moreover, in the early yugas, the preceptor possessed the command to withdraw all the strengths of the respective mantras from the student, in case of any misuse. A very popular example, is that of Karna, who forgot the technique to use the deadly weapon (given by his master Sri Paras! hurama) against Arjuna in the kurukshetra warfield. Another beautiful example is that of sage Yagyavalkaya, whose unhappy guru asked him to vomit all the essence of Veda/Upanishad teachings that he'd received. It is said that a group of birds named "Thitar" consumed up all the vomitted remains. That lead to a new branch of Upanishad called "Thaitareeya Upanishad". In Ramayanam, sage Vishwamitra is addressed as the weapon expert. He'd a big chain of students who were totally dedicated in designing new & highly sophisticated weapons. Ravana knew this already, & that's why he appointed his relatives Khara, Dushana, Trishira, Marich & Taraka near to Dandaka forest lying in between Arya kshetram & Kishkinta puri.Two of the major findings of Vishwamtra were "Bala" & "Atibala", which were presented to Sri Rama & Sri Laxmana, becoz that great sage identified these to human lions as the most efficient & capable persons on earth to save "Dharma" & restrict "Adharma". In this age, power of mantras are really unknown to even a so-called guru & that's why our great saints have not asserted on "Mantra Sankirtanam", but only on "Namasankirtanam". The "Nama" is more powerful than the "Nami". We all are really fortunate to be born in this age, as sung by Poonthanam, becoz Hari bhakti has become so simple & accessible to everybody just by chanting his name. Janaki Kantha smarana - "Jaya Jaya Rama Rama " Nityam Bhajami Sri Raghuvamshanatham. Krishna Krishna Mukunda Janardhana Krishna Govinda Narayana Hare Achyuthananda Govinda Madhava Sachidananda Narayana Hare Karalil vivekam koodathe kanda ara nimishambada kalayaratharum Maranam varumini ennu ninachiha maruvuka satatam Narayana Jaya Gurunathan thuna cheyka santatam Thirunamangal navin mel eppozhum Piriyathe irikkenam nammude Narjanmam saphalamakeeduan. Hare Krishna Hare Rama guruvayur [guruvayur ]On Behalf Of balagopal ramakrishnanMonday, May 16, 2005 4:43 PMguruvayur Subject: [Guruvayur/Guruvayoor] Power of Mantras!!HARI AUM!!The power is evident in the case of Druva to whomNarada had delivered the mantra-OM NAMO BHAGAVATHEVASUDEVAYAH.The same sage Narada gave a different Mantra toValmiki-Maramaramara...It means the Mantras differ depending upon achperson's current state of mental evolution.Probabaly Valmiki in his robber self may not be in aposition even to take the Lord Rama's name as such.Shree Ganapathy Raman's intro into this powerful tool(Mantra) is very thought provoking too. Isn't our day to day speech a sort of mantra japa?Looking ahead for more of valuable contributions fromour Krishna BhakthasAum Namo NarayanayahBalagaopal______________________ India Matrimony: Find your life partner onlineGo to: http://.shaadi.com/india-matrimonyOm Namo Narayanaya: Om Namo Narayanaya: India Matrimony: Find your life partner online. Om Namo Narayanaya: Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted May 18, 2005 Report Share Posted May 18, 2005 Dear Shree Vinod, I fully appreciate your mail. In fact the detailed mail to you was from Shree Ganapathy Raman. Shree Raman as I had noted earlier is one of our most earnest of Bhakthas. He studies the discussions and gives elaborate suggestions and replies. Moreover I also noticed that he has a wealth of knowledge. The reply to your mail is also praiseworthy. I also appreciate your whole-hearted participations. Let us keep the spirit flowing and remember the famous Upanishadic invocation: Aum sahanvavavatu Sahanaubhunakhkthu Sahaveeryam Karavavahayah Tejaswinavadheedhamastu Ma vidhvishavahai As the last line says-Mavidvishavahai-let there be no animosity while we all together enlighten us. Aum Narayanayah Balagopal --- " PS, Vinod K (GE Energy) " <vinod.ps wrote: > !! Sri rama Jayam !! > > Dear shri Balagopal, > > Appreciate your defense & I too accept that to a gud > extent. Please don't tame any feeling that I am > trying to challenge the importance of mantras. But, > to me it's the Rama Nama which stands above Rama > Mantra & even Rama himself. I will try to comment on > this based on your opinions. Let me pick it up > on-by-one. > > 1. " Nama Sankeerthan gives the elementary principles > of Bhakti like a child studying LKG,UKG but never > rises one to great heights. " > I don't agree on this point. It is true that nama > sankirtanam makes us aware of the elementary > principles. But parallely, it is the most IMP thing > in Bhakti that one shud never forget these > elementary principles, when he/she has reached the > highest class of consciousness. We have many such > examples in our holy texts, that even great yogis & > Mahayogis have fallen badly after reaching their > peak. I have heard a story from Srimad Bhagavattam > that once Krishna & his mates went a long way into a > forest where some rishis were performing Vishnu > Mahayagya to please the supreme. Krishna asked the > sages to give him some part of the yagya offerings > so that he cud pacify the hunger of his friends. But > to krishna's surprise, sages asked him to stay till > the yagya gets completed. This is a very interesting > scene, when the respective Lord of yagya himself is > asking for the offering & the offerer is unable to > visualize his presence. Those sages were not > ordinary one, let me assume, then what to talk of us > in the kali age. The rishis possesed every highest > quality of consciousness, but they easily missed out > the elementary thing that " Krishna is omnipresent & > all-aware " . > > 2. " Nama Sankeerthan is gud for the beginners " > > True, but not the least, it is the best of learned > devotees also. > Take for example, Sabari was born in a low-class > illiterate society of forest-dwellers. When her Guru > (Matanga muni)left for samadhi, he blessed her > service with a rare opportunity of Sri Rama > darshanam & on spot mukti. There was no any mantra > advised by her Guru as such, rather to wait > patiently for the Lord, who alone will come > searching for her & bless her finally. Young sabari > understood her guru's indication & practiced the > elementary lesson of devotion throughout her life. > The group of sages residing around PAMPA got news > about the arrival of their most awaited Lord. But > they were not so happy about Rama's visit to Sabari > ashramam at first. Lord has come to bless his most > dear devotee Sabari for her undying patience that > kept her living with same enthusiasm of a beginner > at her old age. There the yogis realized the true > importance of the elementary devotion that they have > missed out in there long journey. > > Dear shri Balagopal, what I am trying to put is that > our Lord is more particular about his unexperienced > devotees & I always prefer to be a grandchild > devotee of the Lord. He is fully immersed in my > consciousness that way. Sorry, if my writing hurts > you. > > Hare Krishna > Hare Rama > > > > > > guruvayur > [guruvayur ]On Behalf Of > GANAPATHY RAMAN > Wednesday, May 18, 2005 2:11 AM > guruvayur > RE: [Guruvayur/Guruvayoor] Power of Mantras > > > Dear Vinod, > Your points are really thought provoking to some > extent.When we live in a different age still we harp > on the ages of thousands of years before.What were > pertinent and adapatable during Treda and Dwaraka > yugas cant be applied to Kali Yuga.During those days > the sages by just pouring some water or some other > thing were able to curse people who did something > out of ignorance and instances are galore and the > methods were adopted by all the great rishis like > Durvasa,Viswamithra, to quote two of the famous > rishis.On the other hand there were rishis also like > Vashita who were having compassion,kindness and > sympathy unlike Viswamithra and Durvasa who becoz > of the knowledge and powers obtained by doing > penance dissipated their energies on frivolous > things as their ego was such.The disciples of them > as well the kings of those days when those rishis > were living were always under fear and tried their > level best to placate the angry rishis to get boons > etc not out of love! but simply out of fear of being > cursed by them.In Bharatha also there is an instance > that Draupadi was given an akshaya patra which > produced the food and other things when the pandavas > were in exile.On instigation by the enemies of > pandavas Durvasa went to the pandavas at noon with > his disciples and asked for lunch.Draupadi had > already finished the food generated by the > akshayapatra which can be utilised only once a > day.She was in a quandry as how ro feed the angry > Durvasa and his retinue.She anyway asked them to hv > thei bath and come for taking the offerings.The > rishi and his followers went to take bath.The > pandavas were terribly worried and when pushed to > the wall Draupadi prayed Krishna for help.The ever > protecting Parantama came there and Draupadi > narrated her predicament.The Lord asked her to bring > the patra though empty and founf a small leaf > sticking to it.He took it with great relish and said > His stomach was full and he could not take anything > more.By the same time Durv! asa and the his retinue > also had their stomach full and in a huff they left > the place even without telling the pandavas.This > story might hv been read by all.So what I wish to > stress is that Guru shuld be one who never gave > himself to self importance and possess ego of their > powers but a kind hearted one.The story of Drona > asking for the thumb of Ekalayva as Guru dakshina > though he was not taken as his disciple but in his > mind took Drona as his Guru and Drona in his anger > asked for the thumb as Guru dakshina so that > Ekalayva wont be a competitor to arjuna is also well > known.So such rishis with anger and without > compassion ,do they deserve to be real Gurus?The > same Guru was not in a position to help his > disciples in the court of Duryodhana when Draupadi > was offended.Then how can one say they practiced the > nature of Dharma. Just becoz they were fed by > Duryodhana they wanted to be his slaves forgetting > their Dharmic nature.May be all these shuld hv > happened in the Gra! nd scheme the Lord had > visualised. > I am hearing Mantra Kirtana for the first > time.Mantras as far as I know are invocations of the > Supreme Being.Of course there shuld be a rishi,some > chandas and a devata.Such things are initiated to an > aspirant in his pursuit to enter the realms of > higher stages of consciousness.Again mantras can't > be concocted or tailor made for the individual > despite some claims.They hv always existed on a > latent state as sound energies.Just as gravity was > discovered but not invented by Newton,Mantras too > were revealed to the ancient masters.There is no > controversy on this.They hv been codified in the > scriptures and handed down from guru to > disciple.Neither mantra,deity not guru once chosen > shuld be changed.There are many paths up the > mountain.Preservance on one alone will bring the > aspirant to the top faster than if he were to spread > his energies in exploring all the alternative paths. > > Japa meditation is a method of channeling one's > consciousness from the lowest to the highest level > of pure thought.Repeated verbally and mentally, a > Mantra lifts one into the telepathic stage and > beyond to the transcendental. " Rama " , for > instance,has a specific form that merges with the > name in the telepathic state.On reaching higher > levels, name,form, and one's own Self as witness are > indistinguishable.They unite and a state of bliss > prevails.One does not enjoy bliss,but becomes Bliss > itself.This is the true experience of > meditation.Japa is one of the direct ways of self > realisation,or Universal Consciousness.It removes > the dirt of the mind,the anger,greed ,lust and other > impurities that hide the light within.Just as a > dusty mirror acquires the power of reflection when > cleaned,the mind from which impurities hv been > removed acquires the capacity to reflect higher > spiritual truth.Even a little recitation with > feeling and one pointedness in concentration on the > meaning des! troys mental impurities.Japa meditation > done with faith,devotion and purity augments the > power of the aspirant,bestowing on him the virtues > and powers of the Mantra's presiding deity.Revealing > God to his consciousness,it confers illumination and > eternal bliss. > > The Supreme is not an individual entity.God is an > experience realised on a particular wavelength.Japa > produces in the mind the form of the deity connected > with the Mantra.As said earlier repetition with > concentration on the meaning of Mantra and on the > attributes of the particular deity will bring God > Realization quickly.Of course I do agree that before > attempting === message truncated === ______________________ India Matrimony: Find your life partner online Go to: http://.shaadi.com/india-matrimony Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted May 19, 2005 Report Share Posted May 19, 2005 !! Sri Rama Jayam !! Shri Balagopal & Shri G Raman, Pranams ... Very sorry for a wrong understanding about the mail sender. This discussion was quite very IMP to me, as I cud also understand some very interesting aspects of spiritual science. When I see responses to any of my mails especially by senior members, I am internally driven to have a more open talk with them. It is the speciality of our great Bharatha Bhumi where the upcoming devotees like me & many others, get plenty of opportunities & freedom to share & discuss on many relevant topics with matured devotees like you. My special thanks to this great group from where I earn my consciousness each day. Let me take this opportunity to invite each member of this group to come forward with any small or big querry they have. Sharing spiritual querries & finding answers to it is a very sound technique of God realization. Thanks once agin. Hare Krishna Hare Rama guruvayur [guruvayur ]On Behalf Of balagopal ramakrishnanWednesday, May 18, 2005 11:53 PMguruvayur Subject: RE: [Guruvayur/Guruvayoor] Power of MantrasDear Shree Vinod,I fully appreciate your mail.In fact the detailed mail to you was from ShreeGanapathy Raman.Shree Raman as I had noted earlier is one of our mostearnest of Bhakthas. He studies the discussions andgives elaborate suggestions and replies. Moreover Ialso noticed that he has a wealth of knowledge.The reply to your mail is also praiseworthy.I also appreciate your whole-hearted participations.Let us keep the spirit flowing and remember the famousUpanishadic invocation:Aum sahanvavavatuSahanaubhunakhkthuSahaveeryam KaravavahayahTejaswinavadheedhamastuMa vidhvishavahaiAs the last line says-Mavidvishavahai-let there be noanimosity while we all together enlighten us.Aum Narayanayah Balagopal--- "PS, Vinod K (GE Energy)" <vinod.ps wrote:> !! Sri rama Jayam !!> > Dear shri Balagopal,> > Appreciate your defense & I too accept that to a gud> extent. Please don't tame any feeling that I am> trying to challenge the importance of mantras. But,> to me it's the Rama Nama which stands above Rama> Mantra & even Rama himself. I will try to comment on> this based on your opinions. Let me pick it up> on-by-one.> > 1. "Nama Sankeerthan gives the elementary principles> of Bhakti like a child studying LKG,UKG but never> rises one to great heights."> I don't agree on this point. It is true that nama> sankirtanam makes us aware of the elementary> principles. But parallely, it is the most IMP thing> in Bhakti that one shud never forget these> elementary principles, when he/she has reached the> highest class of consciousness. We have many such> examples in our holy texts, that even great yogis & > Mahayogis have fallen badly after reaching their> peak. I have heard a story from Srimad Bhagavattam> that once Krishna & his mates went a long way into a> forest where some rishis were performing Vishnu> Mahayagya to please the supreme. Krishna asked the> sages to give him some part of the yagya offerings> so that he cud pacify the hunger of his friends. But> to krishna's surprise, sages asked him to stay till> the yagya gets completed. This is a very interesting> scene, when the respective Lord of yagya himself is> asking for the offering & the offerer is unable to> visualize his presence. Those sages were not> ordinary one, let me assume, then what to talk of us> in the kali age. The rishis possesed every highest> quality of consciousness, but they easily missed out> the elementary thing that "Krishna is omnipresent & > all-aware". > > 2. "Nama Sankeerthan is gud for the beginners"> > True, but not the least, it is the best of learned> devotees also.> Take for example, Sabari was born in a low-class> illiterate society of forest-dwellers. When her Guru> (Matanga muni)left for samadhi, he blessed her> service with a rare opportunity of Sri Rama> darshanam & on spot mukti. There was no any mantra> advised by her Guru as such, rather to wait> patiently for the Lord, who alone will come> searching for her & bless her finally. Young sabari> understood her guru's indication & practiced the> elementary lesson of devotion throughout her life.> The group of sages residing around PAMPA got news> about the arrival of their most awaited Lord. But> they were not so happy about Rama's visit to Sabari> ashramam at first. Lord has come to bless his most> dear devotee Sabari for her undying patience that> kept her living with same enthusiasm of a beginner> at her old age. There the yogis realized the true> importance of the elementary devotion that they have> missed out in there long journey.> > Dear shri Balagopal, what I am trying to put is that> our Lord is more particular about his unexperienced> devotees & I always prefer to be a grandchild> devotee of the Lord. He is fully immersed in my> consciousness that way. Sorry, if my writing hurts> you.> > Hare Krishna> Hare Rama> > > > > > guruvayur > [guruvayur ]On Behalf Of> GANAPATHY RAMAN> Wednesday, May 18, 2005 2:11 AM> guruvayur > RE: [Guruvayur/Guruvayoor] Power of Mantras> > > Dear Vinod,> Your points are really thought provoking to some> extent.When we live in a different age still we harp> on the ages of thousands of years before.What were> pertinent and adapatable during Treda and Dwaraka> yugas cant be applied to Kali Yuga.During those days> the sages by just pouring some water or some other> thing were able to curse people who did something> out of ignorance and instances are galore and the> methods were adopted by all the great rishis like> Durvasa,Viswamithra, to quote two of the famous> rishis.On the other hand there were rishis also like> Vashita who were having compassion,kindness and> sympathy unlike Viswamithra and Durvasa who becoz> of the knowledge and powers obtained by doing> penance dissipated their energies on frivolous> things as their ego was such.The disciples of them> as well the kings of those days when those rishis> were living were always under fear and tried their> level best to placate the angry rishis to get boons> etc not out of love! but simply out of fear of being> cursed by them.In Bharatha also there is an instance> that Draupadi was given an akshaya patra which> produced the food and other things when the pandavas> were in exile.On instigation by the enemies of> pandavas Durvasa went to the pandavas at noon with> his disciples and asked for lunch.Draupadi had> already finished the food generated by the> akshayapatra which can be utilised only once a> day.She was in a quandry as how ro feed the angry> Durvasa and his retinue.She anyway asked them to hv> thei bath and come for taking the offerings.The> rishi and his followers went to take bath.The> pandavas were terribly worried and when pushed to> the wall Draupadi prayed Krishna for help.The ever> protecting Parantama came there and Draupadi> narrated her predicament.The Lord asked her to bring> the patra though empty and founf a small leaf> sticking to it.He took it with great relish and said> His stomach was full and he could not take anything> more.By the same time Durv! asa and the his retinue> also had their stomach full and in a huff they left> the place even without telling the pandavas.This> story might hv been read by all.So what I wish to> stress is that Guru shuld be one who never gave> himself to self importance and possess ego of their> powers but a kind hearted one.The story of Drona> asking for the thumb of Ekalayva as Guru dakshina> though he was not taken as his disciple but in his> mind took Drona as his Guru and Drona in his anger> asked for the thumb as Guru dakshina so that> Ekalayva wont be a competitor to arjuna is also well> known.So such rishis with anger and without> compassion ,do they deserve to be real Gurus?The> same Guru was not in a position to help his> disciples in the court of Duryodhana when Draupadi> was offended.Then how can one say they practiced the> nature of Dharma. Just becoz they were fed by> Duryodhana they wanted to be his slaves forgetting> their Dharmic nature.May be all these shuld hv> happened in the Gra! nd scheme the Lord had> visualised.> I am hearing Mantra Kirtana for the first> time.Mantras as far as I know are invocations of the> Supreme Being.Of course there shuld be a rishi,some> chandas and a devata.Such things are initiated to an> aspirant in his pursuit to enter the realms of> higher stages of consciousness.Again mantras can't> be concocted or tailor made for the individual> despite some claims.They hv always existed on a> latent state as sound energies.Just as gravity was> discovered but not invented by Newton,Mantras too> were revealed to the ancient masters.There is no> controversy on this.They hv been codified in the> scriptures and handed down from guru to> disciple.Neither mantra,deity not guru once chosen> shuld be changed.There are many paths up the> mountain.Preservance on one alone will bring the> aspirant to the top faster than if he were to spread> his energies in exploring all the alternative paths.> > Japa meditation is a method of channeling one's> consciousness from the lowest to the highest level> of pure thought.Repeated verbally and mentally, a> Mantra lifts one into the telepathic stage and> beyond to the transcendental."Rama", for> instance,has a specific form that merges with the> name in the telepathic state.On reaching higher> levels, name,form, and one's own Self as witness are> indistinguishable.They unite and a state of bliss> prevails.One does not enjoy bliss,but becomes Bliss> itself.This is the true experience of> meditation.Japa is one of the direct ways of self> realisation,or Universal Consciousness.It removes> the dirt of the mind,the anger,greed ,lust and other> impurities that hide the light within.Just as a> dusty mirror acquires the power of reflection when> cleaned,the mind from which impurities hv been> removed acquires the capacity to reflect higher> spiritual truth.Even a little recitation with> feeling and one pointedness in concentration on the> meaning des! troys mental impurities.Japa meditation> done with faith,devotion and purity augments the> power of the aspirant,bestowing on him the virtues> and powers of the Mantra's presiding deity.Revealing> God to his consciousness,it confers illumination and> eternal bliss.> > The Supreme is not an individual entity.God is an> experience realised on a particular wavelength.Japa> produces in the mind the form of the deity connected> with the Mantra.As said earlier repetition with> concentration on the meaning of Mantra and on the> attributes of the particular deity will bring God> Realization quickly.Of course I do agree that before> attempting === message truncated ===______________________ India Matrimony: Find your life partner onlineGo to: http://.shaadi.com/india-matrimonyOm Namo Narayanaya: Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted May 19, 2005 Report Share Posted May 19, 2005 Dear Vinod, It is ok that in certain circumstances such mistakes of Identity Crisis do happen. I dont hv any type of ill feeling against you as there are no experienced devotees and unexperienced devotees before God as He treats them both equally as He is only a silent witness of everything.Even in Gita Krishna enunciates the same that both believers and non believers are equal to Him. In many instances you are well advanced in grasping the matters and hv gud knowledge of the various things and hv made very gud efforts to go thru various sources and post the same for the digestion of the members and such efforts are really appreciable.So saying that you are an upcoming devotee shows your humility as you deserve great encomiums from the members for posting matters hitherto unheard of by most of the members.So don't take anything seriously and never feel wounded.It is only thru such rebuttals and praises that one will be able to distinguish the real concept of any matter and for that equanimity of mind is essential. I don't claim to hv great knowledge of anything in the matter of spirtuality as it is like a deep ocean and nobody can claim that his views only are correct.However thru argumentation one can learn the positive and negative aspects of a subject and can come to some conclusion.In this way only knowledge develops.If this forum is useful for that purpose then all the more I am happy.I wish that there shuld be such arguments for and against a subject though it need not necessarily confer superiority on any one arguing for or against but it will definitely hv an impact on the matters which are known and unknown to us.As Shakespeare has said in a famous novel Horatio,there are more things in the the world and heavens than your philosophy can dream of.I again appreciate the sentiments expressed and looking forward to more such discussion though at times it becomes hot which is unavoidable as a debate is always like that and in the end we conclude on the definte mechanism of a particular subject.All the Wishes. Hare Krishna, A G RAMAN " PS, Vinod K (GE Energy) " <vinod.ps wrote: !! Sri Rama Jayam !! Shri Balagopal & Shri G Raman, Pranams ... Very sorry for a wrong understanding about the mail sender. This discussion was quite very IMP to me, as I cud also understand some very interesting aspects of spiritual science. When I see responses to any of my mails especially by senior members, I am internally driven to have a more open talk with them. It is the speciality of our great Bharatha Bhumi where the upcoming devotees like me & many others, get plenty of opportunities & freedom to share & discuss on many relevant topics with matured devotees like you. My special thanks to this great group from where I earn my consciousness each day. Let me take this opportunity to invite each member of this group to come forward with any small or big querry they have. Sharing spiritual querries & finding answers to it is a very sound technique of God realization. Thanks once agin. Hare Krishna Hare Rama guruvayur [guruvayur ]On Behalf Of balagopal ramakrishnan Wednesday, May 18, 2005 11:53 PM guruvayur RE: [Guruvayur/Guruvayoor] Power of Mantras Dear Shree Vinod, I fully appreciate your mail. In fact the detailed mail to you was from Shree Ganapathy Raman. Shree Raman as I had noted earlier is one of our most earnest of Bhakthas. He studies the discussions and gives elaborate suggestions and replies. Moreover I also noticed that he has a wealth of knowledge. The reply to your mail is also praiseworthy. I also appreciate your whole-hearted participations. Let us keep the spirit flowing and remember the famous Upanishadic invocation: Aum sahanvavavatu Sahanaubhunakhkthu Sahaveeryam Karavavahayah Tejaswinavadheedhamastu Ma vidhvishavahai As the last line says-Mavidvishavahai-let there be no animosity while we all together enlighten us. Aum Narayanayah Balagopal --- " PS, Vinod K (GE Energy) " <vinod.ps wrote: > !! Sri rama Jayam !! > > Dear shri Balagopal, > > Appreciate your defense & I too accept that to a gud > extent. Please don't tame any feeling that I am > trying to challenge the importance of mantras. But, > to me it's the Rama Nama which stands above Rama > Mantra & even Rama himself. I will try to comment on > this based on your opinions. Let me pick it up > on-by-one. > > 1. " Nama Sankeerthan gives the elementary principles > of Bhakti like a child studying LKG,UKG but never > rises one to great heights. " > I don't agree on this point. It is true that nama > sankirtanam makes us aware of the elementary > principles. But parallely, it is the most IMP thing > in Bhakti that one shud never forget these > elementary principles, when he/she has reached the > highest class of consciousness. We have many such > examples in our holy texts, that even great yogis & > Mahayogis have fallen badly after reaching their > peak. I have heard a story from Srimad Bhagavattam > that once Krishna & his mates went a long way into a > forest where some rishis were performing Vishnu > Mahayagya to please the supreme. Krishna asked the > sages to give him some part of the yagya offerings > so that he cud pacify the hunger of his friends. But > to krishna's surprise, sages asked him to stay till > the yagya gets completed. This is a very interesting > scene, when the respective Lord of yagya himself is > asking for the offering & the offerer is unable to > visualize his presence. Those sages were not > ordinary one, let me assume, then what to talk of us > in the kali age. The rishis possesed every highest > quality of consciousness, but they easily missed out > the elementary thing that " Krishna is omnipresent & > all-aware " . > > 2. " Nama Sankeerthan is gud for the beginners " > > True, but not the least, it is the best of learned > devotees also. > Take for example, Sabari was born in a low-class > illiterate society of forest-dwellers. When her Guru > (Matanga muni)left for samadhi, he blessed her > service with a rare opportunity of Sri Rama > darshanam & on spot mukti. There was no any mantra > advised by her Guru as such, rather to wait > patiently for the Lord, who alone will come > searching for her & bless her finally. Young sabari > understood her guru's indication & practiced the > elementary lesson of devotion throughout her life. > The group of sages residing around PAMPA got news > about the arrival of their most awaited Lord. But > they were not so happy about Rama's visit to Sabari > ashramam at first. Lord has come to bless his most > dear devotee Sabari for her undying patience that > kept her living with same enthusiasm of a beginner > at her old age. There the yogis realized the true > importance of the elementary devotion that they have > missed out in there long journey. > > Dear shri Balagopal, what I am trying to put is that > our Lord is more particular about his unexperienced > devotees & I always prefer to be a grandchild > devotee of the Lord. He is fully immersed in my > consciousness that way. Sorry, if my writing hurts > you. > > Hare Krishna > Hare Rama > > > > > > guruvayur > [guruvayur ]On Behalf Of > GANAPATHY RAMAN > Wednesday, May 18, 2005 2:11 AM > guruvayur > RE: [Guruvayur/Guruvayoor] Power of Mantras > > > Dear Vinod, > Your points are really thought provoking to some > extent.When we live in a different age still we harp > on the ages of thousands of years before.What were > pertinent and adapatable during Treda and Dwaraka > yugas cant be applied to Kali Yuga.During those days > the sages by just pouring some water or some other > thing were able to curse people who did something > out of ignorance and instances are galore and the > methods were adopted by all the great rishis like > Durvasa,Viswamithra, to quote two of the famous > rishis.On the other hand there were rishis also like > Vashita who were having compassion,kindness and > sympathy unlike Viswamithra and Durvasa who becoz > of the knowledge and powers obtained by doing > penance dissipated their energies on frivolous > things as their ego was such.The disciples of them > as well the kings of those days when those rishis > were living were always under fear and tried their > level best to placate the angry rishis to get boons > etc not out of love! but simply out of fear of being > cursed by them.In Bharatha also there is an instance > that Draupadi was given an akshaya patra which > produced the food and other things when the pandavas > were in exile.On instigation by the enemies of > pandavas Durvasa went to the pandavas at noon with > his disciples and asked for lunch.Draupadi had > already finished the food generated by the > akshayapatra which can be utilised only once a > day.She was in a quandry as how ro feed the angry > Durvasa and his retinue.She anyway asked them to hv > thei bath and come for taking the offerings.The > rishi and his followers went to take bath.The > pandavas were terribly worried and when pushed to > the wall Draupadi prayed Krishna for help.The ever > protecting Parantama came there and Draupadi > narrated her predicament.The Lord asked her to bring > the patra though empty and founf a small leaf > sticking to it.He took it with great relish and said > His stomach was full and he could not take anything > more.By the same time Durv! asa and the his retinue > also had their stomach full and in a huff they left > the place even without telling the pandavas.This > story might hv been read by all.So what I wish to > stress is that Guru shuld be one who never gave > himself to self importance and possess ego of their > powers but a kind hearted one.The story of Drona > asking for the thumb of Ekalayva as Guru dakshina > though he was not taken as his disciple but in his > mind took Drona as his Guru and Drona in his anger > asked for the thumb as Guru dakshina so that > Ekalayva wont be a competitor to arjuna is also well > known.So such rishis with anger and without > compassion ,do they deserve to be real Gurus?The > same Guru was not in a position to help his > disciples in the court of Duryodhana when Draupadi > was offended.Then how can one say they practiced the > nature of Dharma. Just becoz they were fed by > Duryodhana they wanted to be his slaves forgetting > their Dharmic nature.May be all these shuld hv > happened in the Gra! nd scheme the Lord had > visualised. > I am hearing Mantra Kirtana for the first > time.Mantras as far as I know are invocations of the > Supreme Being.Of course there shuld be a rishi,some > chandas and a devata.Such things are initiated to an > aspirant in his pursuit to enter the realms of > higher stages of consciousness.Again mantras can't > be concocted or tailor made for the individual > despite some claims.They hv always existed on a > latent state as sound energies.Just as gravity was > discovered but not invented by Newton,Mantras too > were revealed to the ancient masters.There is no > controversy on this.They hv been codified in the > scriptures and handed down from guru to > disciple.Neither mantra,deity not guru once chosen > shuld be changed.There are many paths up the > mountain.Preservance on one alone will bring the > aspirant to the top faster than if he were to spread > his energies in exploring all the alternative paths. > > Japa meditation is a method of channeling one's > consciousness from the lowest to the highest level > of pure thought.Repeated verbally and mentally, a > Mantra lifts one into the telepathic stage and > beyond to the transcendental. " Rama " , for > instance,has a specific form that merges with the > name in the telepathic state.On reaching higher > levels, name,form, and one's own Self as witness are > indistinguishable.They unite and a state of bliss > prevails.One does not enjoy bliss,but becomes Bliss > itself.This is the true experience of > meditation.Japa is one of the direct ways of self > realisation,or Universal Consciousness.It removes > the dirt of the mind,the anger,greed ,lust and other > impurities that hide the light within.Just as a > dusty mirror acquires the power of reflection when > cleaned,the mind from which impurities hv been > removed acquires the capacity to reflect higher > spiritual truth.Even a little recitation with > feeling and one pointedness in concentration on the > meaning des! troys mental impurities.Japa meditation > done with faith,devotion and purity augments the > power of the aspirant,bestowing on him the virtues > and powers of the Mantra's presiding deity.Revealing > God to his consciousness,it confers illumination and > eternal bliss. > > The Supreme is not an individual entity.God is an > experience realised on a particular wavelength.Japa > produces in the mind the form of the deity connected > with the Mantra.As said earlier repetition with > concentration on the meaning of Mantra and on the > attributes of the particular deity will bring God > Realization quickly.Of course I do agree that before > attempting === message truncated === ______________________ India Matrimony: Find your life partner online Go to: http://.shaadi.com/india-matrimony Om Namo Narayanaya: Om Namo Narayanaya: Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted May 22, 2005 Report Share Posted May 22, 2005 sri govinaya namah. the method of learning vedic literatures is given in bg itself. tad viddhi prani padna pariprasnena sevaya upadekshyanti te jnanam jnaninas tattva darshinah. we should serve and learn from those who have realized knowledge. when we dont yet have the fortune to surrender to a guru, we should try to teach the opinion of the acharya whom we trust be it sanakra, ramanuja, madhwa or caitanya. this will help in some real learnngbalagopal ramakrishnan <rbalpal wrote: Dear Shree Vinod,I fully appreciate your mail.In fact the detailed mail to you was from ShreeGanapathy Raman.Shree Raman as I had noted earlier is one of our mostearnest of Bhakthas. He studies the discussions andgives elaborate suggestions and replies. Moreover Ialso noticed that he has a wealth of knowledge.The reply to your mail is also praiseworthy.I also appreciate your whole-hearted participations.Let us keep the spirit flowing and remember the famousUpanishadic invocation:Aum sahanvavavatuSahanaubhunakhkthuSahaveeryam KaravavahayahTejaswinavadheedhamastuMa vidhvishavahaiAs the last line says-Mavidvishavahai-let there be noanimosity while we all together enlighten us.Aum Narayanayah Balagopal--- "PS, Vinod K (GE Energy)" <vinod.ps wrote:> !! Sri rama Jayam !!> > Dear shri Balagopal,> > Appreciate your defense & I too accept that to a gud> extent. Please don't tame any feeling that I am> trying to challenge the importance of mantras. But,> to me it's the Rama Nama which stands above Rama> Mantra & even Rama himself. I will try to comment on> this based on your opinions. Let me pick it up> on-by-one.> > 1. "Nama Sankeerthan gives the elementary principles> of Bhakti like a child studying LKG,UKG but never> rises one to great heights."> I don't agree on this point. It is true that nama> sankirtanam makes us aware of the elementary> principles. But parallely, it is the most IMP thing> in Bhakti that one shud never forget these> elementary principles, when he/she has reached the> highest class of consciousness. We have many such> examples in our holy texts, that even great yogis & > Mahayogis have fallen badly after reaching their> peak. I have heard a story from Srimad Bhagavattam> that once Krishna & his mates went a long way into a> forest where some rishis were performing Vishnu> Mahayagya to please the supreme. Krishna asked the> sages to give him some part of the yagya offerings> so that he cud pacify the hunger of his friends. But> to krishna's surprise, sages asked him to stay till> the yagya gets completed. This is a very interesting> scene, when the respective Lord of yagya himself is> asking for the offering & the offerer is unable to> visualize his presence. Those sages were not> ordinary one, let me assume, then what to talk of us> in the kali age. The rishis possesed every highest> quality of consciousness, but they easily missed out> the elementary thing that "Krishna is omnipresent & > all-aware". > > 2. "Nama Sankeerthan is gud for the beginners"> > True, but not the least, it is the best of learned> devotees also.> Take for example, Sabari was born in a low-class> illiterate society of forest-dwellers. When her Guru> (Matanga muni)left for samadhi, he blessed her> service with a rare opportunity of Sri Rama> darshanam & on spot mukti. There was no any mantra> advised by her Guru as such, rather to wait> patiently for the Lord, who alone will come> searching for her & bless her finally. Young sabari> understood her guru's indication & practiced the> elementary lesson of devotion throughout her life.> The group of sages residing around PAMPA got news> about the arrival of their most awaited Lord. But> they were not so happy about Rama's visit to Sabari> ashramam at first. Lord has come to bless his most> dear devotee Sabari for her undying patience that> kept her living with same enthusiasm of a beginner> at her old age. There the yogis realized the true> importance of the elementary devotion that they have> missed out in there long journey.> > Dear shri Balagopal, what I am trying to put is that> our Lord is more particular about his unexperienced> devotees & I always prefer to be a grandchild> devotee of the Lord. He is fully immersed in my> consciousness that way. Sorry, if my writing hurts> you.> > Hare Krishna> Hare Rama> > > > > > guruvayur > [guruvayur ]On Behalf Of> GANAPATHY RAMAN> Wednesday, May 18, 2005 2:11 AM> To: guruvayur > RE: [Guruvayur/Guruvayoor] Power of Mantras> > > Dear Vinod,> Your points are really thought provoking to some> extent.When we live in a different age still we harp> on the ages of thousands of years before.What were> pertinent and adapatable during Treda and Dwaraka> yugas cant be applied to Kali Yuga.During those days> the sages by just pouring some water or some other> thing were able to curse people who did something> out of ignorance and instances are galore and the> methods were adopted by all the great rishis like> Durvasa,Viswamithra, to quote two of the famous> rishis.On the other hand there were rishis also like> Vashita who were having compassion,kindness and> sympathy unlike Viswamithra and Durvasa who becoz> of the knowledge and powers obtained by doing> penance dissipated their energies on frivolous> things as their ego was such.The disciples of them> as well the kings of those days when those rishis> were living were always under fear and tried their> level best to placate the angry rishis to get boons> etc not out of love! but simply out of fear of being> cursed by them.In Bharatha also there is an instance> that Draupadi was given an akshaya patra which> produced the food and other things when the pandavas> were in exile.On instigation by the enemies of> pandavas Durvasa went to the pandavas at noon with> his disciples and asked for lunch.Draupadi had> already finished the food generated by the> akshayapatra which can be utilised only once a> day.She was in a quandry as how ro feed the angry> Durvasa and his retinue.She anyway asked them to hv> thei bath and come for taking the offerings.The> rishi and his followers went to take bath.The> pandavas were terribly worried and when pushed to> the wall Draupadi prayed Krishna for help.The ever> protecting Parantama came there and Draupadi> narrated her predicament.The Lord asked her to bring> the patra though empty and founf a small leaf> sticking to it.He took it with great relish and said> His stomach was full and he could not take anything> more.By the same time Durv! asa and the his retinue> also had their stomach full and in a huff they left> the place even without telling the pandavas.This> story might hv been read by all.So what I wish to> stress is that Guru shuld be one who never gave> himself to self importance and possess ego of their> powers but a kind hearted one.The story of Drona> asking for the thumb of Ekalayva as Guru dakshina> though he was not taken as his disciple but in his> mind took Drona as his Guru and Drona in his anger> asked for the thumb as Guru dakshina so that> Ekalayva wont be a competitor to arjuna is also well> known.So such rishis with anger and without> compassion ,do they deserve to be real Gurus?The> same Guru was not in a position to help his> disciples in the court of Duryodhana when Draupadi> was offended.Then how can one say they practiced the> nature of Dharma. Just becoz they were fed by> Duryodhana they wanted to be his slaves forgetting> their Dharmic nature.May be all these shuld hv> happened in the Gra! nd scheme the Lord had> visualised.> I am hearing Mantra Kirtana for the first> time.Mantras as far as I know are invocations of the> Supreme Being.Of course there shuld be a rishi,some> chandas and a devata.Such things are initiated to an> aspirant in his pursuit to enter the realms of> higher stages of consciousness.Again mantras can't> be concocted or tailor made for the individual> despite some claims.They hv always existed on a> latent state as sound energies.Just as gravity was> discovered but not invented by Newton,Mantras too> were revealed to the ancient masters.There is no> controversy on this.They hv been codified in the> scriptures and handed down from guru to> disciple.Neither mantra,deity not guru once chosen> shuld be changed.There are many paths up the> mountain.Preservance on one alone will bring the> aspirant to the top faster than if he were to spread> his energies in exploring all the alternative paths.> > Japa meditation is a method of channeling one's> consciousness from the lowest to the highest level> of pure thought.Repeated verbally and mentally, a> Mantra lifts one into the telepathic stage and> beyond to the transcendental."Rama", for> instance,has a specific form that merges with the> name in the telepathic state.On reaching higher> levels, name,form, and one's own Self as witness are> indistinguishable.They unite and a state of bliss> prevails.One does not enjoy bliss,but becomes Bliss> itself.This is the true experience of> meditation.Japa is one of the direct ways of self> realisation,or Universal Consciousness.It removes> the dirt of the mind,the anger,greed ,lust and other> impurities that hide the light within.Just as a> dusty mirror acquires the power of reflection when> cleaned,the mind from which impurities hv been> removed acquires the capacity to reflect higher> spiritual truth.Even a little recitation with> feeling and one pointedness in concentration on the> meaning des! troys mental impurities.Japa meditation> done with faith,devotion and purity augments the> power of the aspirant,bestowing on him the virtues> and powers of the Mantra's presiding deity.Revealing> God to his consciousness,it confers illumination and> eternal bliss.> > The Supreme is not an individual entity.God is an> experience realised on a particular wavelength.Japa> produces in the mind the form of the deity connected> with the Mantra.As said earlier repetition with> concentration on the meaning of Mantra and on the> attributes of the particular deity will bring God> Realization quickly.Of course I do agree that before> attempting === message truncated ===______________________ India Matrimony: Find your life partner onlineGo to: http://.shaadi.com/india-matrimonyOm Namo Narayanaya: Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Recommended Posts
Join the conversation
You are posting as a guest. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account.
Note: Your post will require moderator approval before it will be visible.