[Guruvayur/Guruvayoor] Fw - Beware of Anti-Vedic Moves in Guruvayoor .

[Guest guest]

!! Sri Rama Jayam !!

 

Dear All,

 

This is a highly sensitive issue.

A debate on this will run long & I hope there will not be any positive outcome.

We have so many other things to share, discuss & decide.

Whether Yesudas or any other non-hindu be allowed or not to enter GURUVAYUR

temple premises is beyond all our terrestrial abilities.

Guruvayur temple is based on certain vedic codes of conduct & administrational

practices.

No body should challenge those as far as communal harmony & preserving cultural

heritage is concerned.

It is exactly like we decide maintaining our house-hold activities irrespective

of what our neighbors do or do not.

I am not trying to support any one's voice here.

Hence, leave the decision to Sri Guruvayurappan & may not try to raise such

talks in future again.

Our GURUVAYURAPPAN is 'Sarvasakshi'.

We must believe that his decisions are the most superior ones.

 

Let us all hope for the best.

 

Sarve Bhavantu sukhinaha ...

 

HARE KRISHNA

HARE RAMA

 

 

 

 

guruvayur [guruvayur ]On

Behalf Of krishnadaya

Thursday, January 26, 2006 4:57 PM

guruvayur

[Guruvayur/Guruvayoor] Fw - Beware of Anti-Vedic Moves in

Guruvayoor .

 

 

Please find below, an interesting article published recetly in a

devotional group .

 

 

Dear all,

 

As a humble Hindu-devotee, I am shocked to see that some

opportunistic Hindus are trying to force the entry of non-Hindus

like Yesudas inside Guruvayoor temple . They appear to be following

the Christian culture where the Idol is inert and everything is

decided by the clergy and influential men.

 

It is an absolute truth that, Sree Krishna & #8217;s deity in the Guruvayoor

temple is Living God . The Lord doesn & #8217;t require His duties to be

performed by mortal men .

 

In this regard , please note the following :

 

1. Lord Sri Krishna is Sattva-guna personified and His worship

in deity-form is different from that of other Devatas. The

functioning of the sacred Guruvayoor temple is based on the

procedures established by Aadi Sankara. Sree Guruvayoorappan had

instructed him personally to put in place, necessary systems to

ensure His constant presence on the Deity. The related rituals and

rules are unique and applicable only for Guruvayoor temple .

 

2. According to the above, the decision of authorized Tantri (

Puzhakkkal Chennar Illam & #8217;s Senior most Namboodirippad) is the final

word in all matters concerning the Guruvayoor temple. This authority

has been confirmed by Supreme Court of India. Numerous lawsuits were

filed by publicity-crazy, un-believers asking for entry of no-Hindus

in Guruvayoor temple but all of them were dismissed . Recently, one

such demonic Hindu was ridiculed by the Calicut court, for raising

an irrelevant issue ( seeking entry of non-Hindus) for the sake of

publicity.

 

3. Guruvayoorappan is not a passive Deity . The Lord is in full

control of the temple . He has systems in place like instructions

to Tantri / Priests during dreams (Swapna-darsana) , revelation

during 'Devaprasna' etc, to convey His additional instructions, as

and when required. Any one violating Him would be pay dearly for his

offence .

 

4. If Lord Guruvayoorappan wanted Yesudas to enter Guruvayoor

temple , the Lord Himself would have arranged for it .

 

5. Yesudas is a great singer and he has many good qualities .

However, he is not a not a Hindu . Yesudas is actually a

Christian believer and his wife and children too follow Christian

faith . But unlike other Christians , Yesudas worships

Guruvayoorappan also as One of the forms of God . For sure ,

Guruvayoorappan is not his Upasana-moorti (Principal deity) . On His

part, the merciful Guruvayoorappan has generously rewarded Yesudas ,

for whatever bhakti towards Him.

 

6. On the other hand , the Lord & #8217;s favourite devotee-singer Chembai

Vaidayanatha Bhagavartar ( Guru of yesudas) was fully loyal to the

Lord ; and he surrendered most of his earnings for the service of the

Lord .Gurvayoorappan interacted with Chembai on a personal level

(Listed here below some true incidents taken from the biography of

Chemabai by LRV ) .

 

MIRACULOUS TREATMENT BY GURUVAYOORAPPAN ( 1931)

 

In the year 1931 on an Ekadasi day , Chembai was about to commence a

music concert in the presence of King Samutiri at Calicut . Just

before starting the concert, there was a sudden change in his voice

and he could not even speak. It was diagnosed as a chronic throat

ailment and frantic treatments followed . Unfortunately , in spite of

continuing for a full year , all the high-tech treatments failed to

produce any difference .

 

A heartbroken Chembai finally came to Guruvayoor temple and stood

before the Lord of Guruvayur with tears in his eyes, asking, OH LORD!

HAVE YOU FORSAKEN ME TO THIS EXTENT, SO THAT YOU CANNOT EVEN BEAR TO

HEAR MY VOICE RECITE A VERSE IN YOUR PRAISE. Suddenly an unknown

Brhamin reached there and after prescribing the formula of a new

herbal medicine to Chembai, left unnoticed. This particular medicine

was quickly prepared at the Poomulli Mana. Soon after taking this

medicine, Chembai & #8217;s ailment was cured. His voice became better than

ever before. The restoration of his voice was by the grace of Sree

Guruvayurappan .

 

After this miracle, Chembai took a vow to sing in front of Sree

Guruvayoorppan on every Sukla paksham & #8217; Ekadasi day .

 

POWER OF FAITH [1939]

 

Chembai was about to start a performance at the palace in Kallikotai.

Suddenly he discovered that his voice was 'frozen'. He was puzzled

since he had no problem of any kind earlier that day. The sound of

the tambura sruti seemed to gain in volume as Chembai pondered the

reason. Suddenly, a question arose in his mind. He asked someone

seated nearby whether it was Sukla paksham after the new moon. This

was the month of Kartika and it was Chembai's vow to offer musical

prayers at the Sree Krishna temple in Guruvayur on the Ekadasi day

of the 'sukla paksham' in the month of Kartika every year ( As

thanksgiving to Lord Sree Krishna for curing his illness) .

 

When a reference to an almanac confirmed that it was Sukla paksham

Ekadasi, Chembai explained the matter to the host and requested

permission and help to go to Guruvayoor and fulfill his commitment.

The host obliged. Chembai speeded to Guruvayoor in a car, offered his

apologies and prayers to Sree Krishna.

 

He had no problem singing; he had recovered his voice fully. He sang

many songs and long until he was satisfied that the Lord had forgiven

his lapse.

 

He sang at Kallikkotai the next evening, without any problem.

 

THE SALVATION (16-OCTOBER-1974)

 

Poozhikunnam Sri Krishna temple is situated on the banks of the

Nila river. After finishing the music concert there, Chembai said

to his aides : PLEASE TAKE ME TO THE SANCTUM SANCTORUM .Two people

held his hands and led him to the door of the sanctum.

 

He sat down on the floor, shut his eyes, and prayed for a few

minutes. Then he called out to the deity in a supplicating tone:

KRISHNA! GURUVAYOORAPPA ! I AM 80. YOU HAVE FULFILLED ALL MY DESIRES.

WHY DO YOU STILL MAKE ME GO ABOUT WITH THIS BODY? WHY DON'T YOU CALL

ME [TO YOU]?

 

When he got up, after receiving the prasadam, and giving dakshina to

the priest, Rama Marar said:

 

Bhagavatar will live for the full span of 125 years.

 

Chembai laughed aloud and retorted : You don't poke your head in it.

All is settled between me and Guruvayoorappan.

 

He returned to his friend O.M.V's nearby residence. He washed his

feet and face, and sat down for prayers in the verandah. After a few

minutes, it was noticed that his head was sliding to one side.

Somebody supported him, and slowly eased him down to lie on the

floor. He was perspiring profusely. Neelakantan Namboodiripad, who

knows Marana lakshana [signs of death] went near to examine him. He

looked only for a few seconds, and called out: " Everything is over

for Bhagavatar. "

 

An APPEAL - The religious matters of Vedic Religion must be left

alone to those faithful Hindus who live according to Vedic

scriptures . If & #8216;faithless Hindus & #8217; continue to tamper with Vedas,

India's end is not far away.

 

OM NAMO NARAYANAYA NAMAH!!!

 

A bhakta .

 

 

To:-hindushaktikerala

- " Vandemataram ....... " <bharathsevak

Date:-Wed, 25 Jan 2006 04

Subject:-Re: Yesudas !

 

I too agree with Jinesh, the hurdles late Kalamandalam Hyderali

faced during his younger days and the people who oppose Yesudas is

something not to be encouraged. Instead of making their mind enter

into the world of Universal religion our orthodox people are driving

them out and creating hatred in their mind about Hindutva

 

 

----

- " Jagdos larikker " <jlarikker

Date:-Tue, 24 Jan 2006 18:19:29 -0800 (PST)

Subject:-Re: Yesudas !

 

I agree with Jinesh.

 

Our religion and culture has accepted everyone with an open heart -

this had had good and bad results.

 

however in the current scenario, we should encourage more and more

non hindus to believe, accept and adopt the hindu religion. so should

we also encourage our youth to get more religious, which i think they

are getting to.

 

Pranam

Jagdos

----

Jinesh <kbjinesh wrote:

 

The law that no non-Hindu can enter Guruvayur Temple is a law by the

Devaswam board, Guruvayurappan didn't make it. Denial of a believer

in a temple is the biggest sin a Hindu can do, either on political or

on religious reasons.

 

The argument of the author in Kesari is childish. We all know that

Yesudas visits Sabarimala every year, that is not based on any song

he sang. He visits Mookambika every year; it is not for fame. His

devotion to Guruvayurappan is much more sincere than some of our

politicians show. It may be bigger than any one of us has. Changing

religion officially will offend the Christians, which of course is

not fair from his side (though Hindus will be happy by that). On the

contrary, we have no hesitation to accept the donations by non-Hindus

to temples, which we seldom talk about!

On one side, people are converting Hindus to other religions. On the

other, we are denying others to enter temples, just because they

don't have a certificate to 'prove' their belief! The question of

allowing Yesudas in to Guruvayur temple is not the matter of

converting one Christian to Hindu religion by certificate, it is a

matter of believes. I think then there is no reason to deny him.

 

If that is not the case, we are not talking about the religion, we

are talking politics, which is unfair!

 

Regards,

Jinesh.

 

----

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

Om Namo Narayanaya:

 

[Guest guest]

Vinod,

I agree with you.

This issue is for the respective temple authorities to deal with, as

they deem appropriate. We laymen have very limited knowledge about

these matters and we are not competent to pass verdict on this or to

criticise the religious practices of Guruvayoor temple. Another

example is the Shree Padmanabha Swamy Temple at Trivandrum. With all

due respect to Yesudas and individuals like him, singing praises of

Sree Guruvayoorappan, or showing loyalty ( and belief) to Hinduism or

being student of Chembai is not sufficient qualification to get

entry into these temples.

Dr Frank Morales is a highly respected authority on Hinduism. Let's

see what he has to written about it.

 

PS

It is not my intention to prolong this discussion but to throw some

light on this issue.

 

Jai Shree Krishna !

Krishnanujan

 

---Who is a Hindu?

from Dr. Frank Morales

 

When the question of who is a Hindu is discussed today, we get a

multitude of confused and contradictory answers from both Hindu

laypersons and from Hindu leaders. That we have such a difficult time

understanding the answer to even so fundamental a question as " who is

a Hindu? " is a starkly sad indicator of the lack of knowledge in the

Hindu community today.

Common Answers

Some of the more simplistic answers to this question include: Anyone

born in India is automatically a Hindu (the ethnicity fallacy), if

your parents are Hindu, then you are Hindu (the familial argument),

if you are born into a certain caste, then you are Hindu (the genetic

inheritance model), if you believe in reincarnation, then you are

Hindu (forgetting that many non-Hindu religions share at least some

of the beliefs of Hinduism), if you practice any religion originating

from India, then you are a Hindu (the national origin fallacy).

 

 

The Real Answer

The real answer to this question has already been conclusively

answered by the ancient sages of Hinduism, and is actually much

simpler to ascertain than we would guess. The two primary factors

that distinguish the individual uniqueness of the great world

religious traditions are a) the scriptural authority upon which the

tradition is based, and b) the fundamental religious tenet(s) that it

espouses. If we ask the question what is a Jew?, for example, the

answer is: someone who accepts the Torah as their scriptural guide

and believes in the monotheistic concept of God espoused in these

scriptures. What is a Christian? - a person who accepts the Gospels

as their scriptural guide and believes that Jesus is the incarnate

God who died for their sins. What is a Muslim? - someone who accepts

the Qur'an as their scriptural guide, and believes that there is no

God but Allah, and that Mohammed is his prophet.

 

Scriptural Authority

In general, what determines whether a person is a follower of any

particular religion is whether or not they accept, and attempt to

live by, the scriptural authority of that religion. This is no less

true of Hinduism than it is of any other religion on earth. Thus, the

question of what is a Hindu is similarly very easily answered.

 

The Definition

By definition, a Hindu is an individual who accepts as authoritative

the religious guidance of the Vedic scriptures, and who strives to

live in accordance with Dharma, God's divine laws as revealed in the

Vedic scriptures.

 

Only If You Accept the Vedas

In keeping with this standard definition, all of the Hindu thinkers

of the six traditional schools of Hindu philosophy (Shad-darshanas)

insisted on the acceptance of the scriptural authority of the Vedas

(shabda-pramana) as the primary criterion for distinguishing a Hindu

from a non-Hindu, as well as distinguishing overtly Hindu

philosophical positions from non-Hindu ones. It has been the

historically accepted standard that, if you accept the Vedas (and by

extension Bhagavad Gita, Puranas, etc.) as your scriptural authority,

and lived your life in accordance with the Dharmic principles of the

Vedas, you are then a Hindu. Thus, an Indian who rejects the Veda is

obviously not a Hindu. While an American, Russian, Indonesian or

Indian who does accept the Veda obviously is a Hindu.

 

 

******************

 

Jai Shree Krishna !

 

In guruvayur , " PS, Vinod K \(GE Infra, Energy\) "

<vinod.ps@g...> wrote:

>

> !! Sri Rama Jayam !!

>

> Dear All,

>

> This is a highly sensitive issue.

> A debate on this will run long & I hope there will not be any

positive outcome.

> We have so many other things to share, discuss & decide.

> Whether Yesudas or any other non-hindu be allowed or not to enter

GURUVAYUR temple premises is beyond all our terrestrial abilities.

> Guruvayur temple is based on certain vedic codes of conduct &

administrational practices.

> No body should challenge those as far as communal harmony &

preserving cultural heritage is concerned.

> It is exactly like we decide maintaining our house-hold activities

irrespective of what our neighbors do or do not.

> I am not trying to support any one's voice here.

> Hence, leave the decision to Sri Guruvayurappan & may not try to

raise such talks in future again.

> Our GURUVAYURAPPAN is 'Sarvasakshi'.

> We must believe that his decisions are the most superior ones.

>

> Let us all hope for the best.

>

> Sarve Bhavantu sukhinaha ...

>

> HARE KRISHNA

> HARE RAMA

>

>

>

>

> guruvayur [guruvayur ]On

> Behalf Of krishnadaya

> Thursday, January 26, 2006 4:57 PM

> guruvayur

> [Guruvayur/Guruvayoor] Fw - Beware of Anti-Vedic Moves in

> Guruvayoor .

>

>

> Please find below, an interesting article published recetly in a

> devotional group .

>

>

> Dear all,

>

> As a humble Hindu-devotee, I am shocked to see that some

> opportunistic Hindus are trying to force the entry of non-Hindus

> like Yesudas inside Guruvayoor temple . They appear to be following

> the Christian culture where the Idol is inert and everything is

> decided by the clergy and influential men.

>

> It is an absolute truth that, Sree Krishna & #8217;s deity in the

Guruvayoor

> temple is Living God . The Lord doesn & #8217;t require His duties

to be

> performed by mortal men .

>

> In this regard , please note the following :

>

> 1. Lord Sri Krishna is Sattva-guna personified and His worship

> in deity-form is different from that of other Devatas. The

> functioning of the sacred Guruvayoor temple is based on the

> procedures established by Aadi Sankara. Sree Guruvayoorappan had

> instructed him personally to put in place, necessary systems to

> ensure His constant presence on the Deity. The related rituals and

> rules are unique and applicable only for Guruvayoor temple .

>

> 2. According to the above, the decision of authorized Tantri (

> Puzhakkkal Chennar Illam & #8217;s Senior most Namboodirippad) is

the final

> word in all matters concerning the Guruvayoor temple. This

authority

> has been confirmed by Supreme Court of India. Numerous lawsuits

were

> filed by publicity-crazy, un-believers asking for entry of no-

Hindus

> in Guruvayoor temple but all of them were dismissed . Recently, one

> such demonic Hindu was ridiculed by the Calicut court, for raising

> an irrelevant issue ( seeking entry of non-Hindus) for the sake of

> publicity.

>

> 3. Guruvayoorappan is not a passive Deity . The Lord is in full

> control of the temple . He has systems in place like instructions

> to Tantri / Priests during dreams (Swapna-darsana) , revelation

> during 'Devaprasna' etc, to convey His additional instructions, as

> and when required. Any one violating Him would be pay dearly for

his

> offence .

>

> 4. If Lord Guruvayoorappan wanted Yesudas to enter Guruvayoor

> temple , the Lord Himself would have arranged for it .

>

> 5. Yesudas is a great singer and he has many good qualities .

> However, he is not a not a Hindu . Yesudas is actually a

> Christian believer and his wife and children too follow Christian

> faith . But unlike other Christians , Yesudas worships

> Guruvayoorappan also as One of the forms of God . For sure ,

> Guruvayoorappan is not his Upasana-moorti (Principal deity) . On

His

> part, the merciful Guruvayoorappan has generously rewarded

Yesudas ,

> for whatever bhakti towards Him.

>

> 6. On the other hand , the Lord & #8217;s favourite devotee-singer

Chembai

> Vaidayanatha Bhagavartar ( Guru of yesudas) was fully loyal to

the

> Lord ; and he surrendered most of his earnings for the service of

the

> Lord .Gurvayoorappan interacted with Chembai on a personal level

> (Listed here below some true incidents taken from the biography

of

> Chemabai by LRV ) .

>

> MIRACULOUS TREATMENT BY GURUVAYOORAPPAN ( 1931)

>

> In the year 1931 on an Ekadasi day , Chembai was about to commence

a

> music concert in the presence of King Samutiri at Calicut . Just

> before starting the concert, there was a sudden change in his

voice

> and he could not even speak. It was diagnosed as a chronic throat

> ailment and frantic treatments followed . Unfortunately , in spite

of

> continuing for a full year , all the high-tech treatments failed

to

> produce any difference .

>

> A heartbroken Chembai finally came to Guruvayoor temple and stood

> before the Lord of Guruvayur with tears in his eyes, asking, OH

LORD!

> HAVE YOU FORSAKEN ME TO THIS EXTENT, SO THAT YOU CANNOT EVEN BEAR

TO

> HEAR MY VOICE RECITE A VERSE IN YOUR PRAISE. Suddenly an unknown

> Brhamin reached there and after prescribing the formula of a new

> herbal medicine to Chembai, left unnoticed. This particular

medicine

> was quickly prepared at the Poomulli Mana. Soon after taking

this

> medicine, Chembai & #8217;s ailment was cured. His voice became

better than

> ever before. The restoration of his voice was by the grace of Sree

> Guruvayurappan .

>

> After this miracle, Chembai took a vow to sing in front of Sree

> Guruvayoorppan on every Sukla paksham & #8217; Ekadasi day .

>

> POWER OF FAITH [1939]

>

> Chembai was about to start a performance at the palace in

Kallikotai.

> Suddenly he discovered that his voice was 'frozen'. He was puzzled

> since he had no problem of any kind earlier that day. The sound of

> the tambura sruti seemed to gain in volume as Chembai pondered the

> reason. Suddenly, a question arose in his mind. He asked someone

> seated nearby whether it was Sukla paksham after the new moon. This

> was the month of Kartika and it was Chembai's vow to offer

musical

> prayers at the Sree Krishna temple in Guruvayur on the Ekadasi day

> of the 'sukla paksham' in the month of Kartika every year ( As

> thanksgiving to Lord Sree Krishna for curing his illness) .

>

> When a reference to an almanac confirmed that it was Sukla paksham

> Ekadasi, Chembai explained the matter to the host and requested

> permission and help to go to Guruvayoor and fulfill his commitment.

> The host obliged. Chembai speeded to Guruvayoor in a car, offered

his

> apologies and prayers to Sree Krishna.

>

> He had no problem singing; he had recovered his voice fully. He

sang

> many songs and long until he was satisfied that the Lord had

forgiven

> his lapse.

>

> He sang at Kallikkotai the next evening, without any problem.

>

> THE SALVATION (16-OCTOBER-1974)

>

> Poozhikunnam Sri Krishna temple is situated on the banks of the

> Nila river. After finishing the music concert there, Chembai said

> to his aides : PLEASE TAKE ME TO THE SANCTUM SANCTORUM .Two people

> held his hands and led him to the door of the sanctum.

>

> He sat down on the floor, shut his eyes, and prayed for a few

> minutes. Then he called out to the deity in a supplicating tone:

> KRISHNA! GURUVAYOORAPPA ! I AM 80. YOU HAVE FULFILLED ALL MY

DESIRES.

> WHY DO YOU STILL MAKE ME GO ABOUT WITH THIS BODY? WHY DON'T YOU

CALL

> ME [TO YOU]?

>

> When he got up, after receiving the prasadam, and giving dakshina

to

> the priest, Rama Marar said:

>

> Bhagavatar will live for the full span of 125 years.

>

> Chembai laughed aloud and retorted : You don't poke your head in

it.

> All is settled between me and Guruvayoorappan.

>

> He returned to his friend O.M.V's nearby residence. He washed his

> feet and face, and sat down for prayers in the verandah. After a

few

> minutes, it was noticed that his head was sliding to one side.

> Somebody supported him, and slowly eased him down to lie on the

> floor. He was perspiring profusely. Neelakantan Namboodiripad, who

> knows Marana lakshana [signs of death] went near to examine him. He

> looked only for a few seconds, and called out: " Everything is over

> for Bhagavatar. "

>

> An APPEAL - The religious matters of Vedic Religion must be left

> alone to those faithful Hindus who live according to Vedic

> scriptures . If & #8216;faithless Hindus & #8217; continue to tamper

with Vedas,

> India's end is not far away.

>

> OM NAMO NARAYANAYA NAMAH!!!

>

> A bhakta .

>

>

> To:-hindushaktikerala

> - " Vandemataram ....... " <bharathsevak>

> Date:-Wed, 25 Jan 2006 04

> Subject:-Re: Yesudas !

>

> I too agree with Jinesh, the hurdles late Kalamandalam Hyderali

> faced during his younger days and the people who oppose Yesudas is

> something not to be encouraged. Instead of making their mind enter

> into the world of Universal religion our orthodox people are

driving

> them out and creating hatred in their mind about Hindutva

>

>

> --

--

> - " Jagdos larikker " <jlarikker

> Date:-Tue, 24 Jan 2006 18:19:29 -0800 (PST)

> Subject:-Re: Yesudas !

>

> I agree with Jinesh.

>

> Our religion and culture has accepted everyone with an open heart -

> this had had good and bad results.

>

> however in the current scenario, we should encourage more and more

> non hindus to believe, accept and adopt the hindu religion. so

should

> we also encourage our youth to get more religious, which i think

they

> are getting to.

>

> Pranam

> Jagdos

> --

--

> Jinesh <kbjinesh> wrote:

>

> The law that no non-Hindu can enter Guruvayur Temple is a law by

the

> Devaswam board, Guruvayurappan didn't make it. Denial of a believer

> in a temple is the biggest sin a Hindu can do, either on political

or

> on religious reasons.

>

> The argument of the author in Kesari is childish. We all know that

> Yesudas visits Sabarimala every year, that is not based on any song

> he sang. He visits Mookambika every year; it is not for fame. His

> devotion to Guruvayurappan is much more sincere than some of our

> politicians show. It may be bigger than any one of us has. Changing

> religion officially will offend the Christians, which of course is

> not fair from his side (though Hindus will be happy by that). On

the

> contrary, we have no hesitation to accept the donations by non-

Hindus

> to temples, which we seldom talk about!

> On one side, people are converting Hindus to other religions. On

the

> other, we are denying others to enter temples, just because they

> don't have a certificate to 'prove' their belief! The question of

> allowing Yesudas in to Guruvayur temple is not the matter of

> converting one Christian to Hindu religion by certificate, it is a

> matter of believes. I think then there is no reason to deny him.

>

> If that is not the case, we are not talking about the religion, we

> are talking politics, which is unfair!

>

> Regards,

> Jinesh.

>

> --

--

>

>

>

>

>

>

>

Om Namo Narayanaya:

>

[Guest guest]

Dear Sri Krishnanujan, I am in total agreement with you on this topic. When the issue of Mercy Ravi entering Guruvayoor kicked up a controversy, the Tantri of Guruvayoor Temple had offered some clarifications, which came out in the papers. What I remember of the statement is that such restrictions are laid down at the very time of the establishment of the temple, going by certain tantravidhis, and that this was beyond the scope of adjudication of any sort. If individuals earn enough merit to have darshan of Guruvayoorappan, He can even appear to them in visions; there are any number of such experiences which I have heard from devotees. In my personal opinion, no real devotee can be stubborn about such things.Om Namo Narayanaya A.J.Thomas.krishnanujan <krishnanujan wrote: Vinod,I

agree with you.This issue is for the respective temple authorities to deal with, as they deem appropriate. We laymen have very limited knowledge about these matters and we are not competent to pass verdict on this or to criticise the religious practices of Guruvayoor temple. Another example is the Shree Padmanabha Swamy Temple at Trivandrum. With all due respect to Yesudas and individuals like him, singing praises of Sree Guruvayoorappan, or showing loyalty ( and belief) to Hinduism or being student of Chembai is not sufficient qualification to get entry into these temples. Dr Frank Morales is a highly respected authority on Hinduism. Let's see what he has to written about it.PSIt is not my intention to prolong this discussion but to throw some light on this issue. Jai Shree Krishna !Krishnanujan---Who is a Hindu?from Dr. Frank MoralesWhen the question of who is a Hindu is

discussed today, we get a multitude of confused and contradictory answers from both Hindu laypersons and from Hindu leaders. That we have such a difficult time understanding the answer to even so fundamental a question as "who is a Hindu?" is a starkly sad indicator of the lack of knowledge in the Hindu community today. Common AnswersSome of the more simplistic answers to this question include: Anyone born in India is automatically a Hindu (the ethnicity fallacy), if your parents are Hindu, then you are Hindu (the familial argument), if you are born into a certain caste, then you are Hindu (the genetic inheritance model), if you believe in reincarnation, then you are Hindu (forgetting that many non-Hindu religions share at least some of the beliefs of Hinduism), if you practice any religion originating from India, then you are a Hindu (the national origin fallacy). The Real AnswerThe real answer to this question

has already been conclusively answered by the ancient sages of Hinduism, and is actually much simpler to ascertain than we would guess. The two primary factors that distinguish the individual uniqueness of the great world religious traditions are a) the scriptural authority upon which the tradition is based, and b) the fundamental religious tenet(s) that it espouses. If we ask the question what is a Jew?, for example, the answer is: someone who accepts the Torah as their scriptural guide and believes in the monotheistic concept of God espoused in these scriptures. What is a Christian? - a person who accepts the Gospels as their scriptural guide and believes that Jesus is the incarnate God who died for their sins. What is a Muslim? - someone who accepts the Qur'an as their scriptural guide, and believes that there is no God but Allah, and that Mohammed is his prophet. Scriptural AuthorityIn general, what determines

whether a person is a follower of any particular religion is whether or not they accept, and attempt to live by, the scriptural authority of that religion. This is no less true of Hinduism than it is of any other religion on earth. Thus, the question of what is a Hindu is similarly very easily answered. The DefinitionBy definition, a Hindu is an individual who accepts as authoritative the religious guidance of the Vedic scriptures, and who strives to live in accordance with Dharma, God's divine laws as revealed in the Vedic scriptures. Only If You Accept the VedasIn keeping with this standard definition, all of the Hindu thinkers of the six traditional schools of Hindu philosophy (Shad-darshanas) insisted on the acceptance of the scriptural authority of the Vedas (shabda-pramana) as the primary criterion for distinguishing a Hindu from a non-Hindu, as well as distinguishing overtly Hindu philosophical positions

from non-Hindu ones. It has been the historically accepted standard that, if you accept the Vedas (and by extension Bhagavad Gita, Puranas, etc.) as your scriptural authority, and lived your life in accordance with the Dharmic principles of the Vedas, you are then a Hindu. Thus, an Indian who rejects the Veda is obviously not a Hindu. While an American, Russian, Indonesian or Indian who does accept the Veda obviously is a Hindu. ******************Jai Shree Krishna ! In guruvayur , "PS, Vinod K \(GE Infra, Energy\)" <vinod.ps@g...> wrote:>> !! Sri Rama Jayam !!> > Dear All,> > This is a highly sensitive issue. > A debate on this will run long & I hope there will not be any positive outcome.> We have so many other things to share, discuss

& decide.> Whether Yesudas or any other non-hindu be allowed or not to enter GURUVAYUR temple premises is beyond all our terrestrial abilities.> Guruvayur temple is based on certain vedic codes of conduct & administrational practices. > No body should challenge those as far as communal harmony & preserving cultural heritage is concerned. > It is exactly like we decide maintaining our house-hold activities irrespective of what our neighbors do or do not.> I am not trying to support any one's voice here.> Hence, leave the decision to Sri Guruvayurappan & may not try to raise such talks in future again.> Our GURUVAYURAPPAN is 'Sarvasakshi'.> We must believe that his decisions are the most superior ones.> > Let us all hope for the best.> > Sarve Bhavantu sukhinaha ...> > HARE KRISHNA> HARE RAMA> > > > -----Original

Message-----> guruvayur [guruvayur ]On> Behalf Of krishnadaya> Thursday, January 26, 2006 4:57 PM> guruvayur > [Guruvayur/Guruvayoor] Fw - Beware of Anti-Vedic Moves in> Guruvayoor .> > > Please find below, an interesting article published recetly in a > devotional group .> > > Dear all, > > As a humble Hindu-devotee, I am shocked to see that some > opportunistic Hindus are trying to force the entry of non-Hindus > like Yesudas inside Guruvayoor temple . They appear to be following > the Christian culture where the Idol is inert and everything is > decided by the clergy and influential men. > > It is an absolute truth that, Sree Krishna & #8217;s deity in the Guruvayoor > temple is Living God . The Lord

doesn & #8217;t require His duties to be > performed by mortal men . > > In this regard , please note the following : > > 1. Lord Sri Krishna is Sattva-guna personified and His worship > in deity-form is different from that of other Devatas. The > functioning of the sacred Guruvayoor temple is based on the > procedures established by Aadi Sankara. Sree Guruvayoorappan had > instructed him personally to put in place, necessary systems to > ensure His constant presence on the Deity. The related rituals and > rules are unique and applicable only for Guruvayoor temple .> > 2. According to the above, the decision of authorized Tantri ( > Puzhakkkal Chennar Illam & #8217;s Senior most Namboodirippad) is the final > word in all matters concerning the Guruvayoor temple. This

authority > has been confirmed by Supreme Court of India. Numerous lawsuits were > filed by publicity-crazy, un-believers asking for entry of no-Hindus > in Guruvayoor temple but all of them were dismissed . Recently, one > such demonic Hindu was ridiculed by the Calicut court, for raising > an irrelevant issue ( seeking entry of non-Hindus) for the sake of > publicity.> > 3. Guruvayoorappan is not a passive Deity . The Lord is in full > control of the temple . He has systems in place like instructions > to Tantri / Priests during dreams (Swapna-darsana) , revelation > during 'Devaprasna' etc, to convey His additional instructions, as > and when required. Any one violating Him would be pay dearly for his > offence . > > 4. If Lord Guruvayoorappan wanted Yesudas to enter Guruvayoor > temple , the Lord Himself would

have arranged for it .> > 5. Yesudas is a great singer and he has many good qualities . > However, he is not a not a Hindu . Yesudas is actually a > Christian believer and his wife and children too follow Christian > faith . But unlike other Christians , Yesudas worships > Guruvayoorappan also as One of the forms of God . For sure , > Guruvayoorappan is not his Upasana-moorti (Principal deity) . On His > part, the merciful Guruvayoorappan has generously rewarded Yesudas , > for whatever bhakti towards Him.> > 6. On the other hand , the Lord & #8217;s favourite devotee-singer Chembai > Vaidayanatha Bhagavartar ( Guru of yesudas) was fully loyal to the > Lord ; and he surrendered most of his earnings for the service of the > Lord

..Gurvayoorappan interacted with Chembai on a personal level > (Listed here below some true incidents taken from the biography of > Chemabai by LRV ) . > > MIRACULOUS TREATMENT BY GURUVAYOORAPPAN ( 1931)> > In the year 1931 on an Ekadasi day , Chembai was about to commence a > music concert in the presence of King Samutiri at Calicut . Just > before starting the concert, there was a sudden change in his voice > and he could not even speak. It was diagnosed as a chronic throat > ailment and frantic treatments followed . Unfortunately , in spite of > continuing for a full year , all the high-tech treatments failed to > produce any difference . > > A heartbroken Chembai finally came to Guruvayoor temple and stood > before the Lord of Guruvayur with tears in his eyes, asking, OH LORD! >

HAVE YOU FORSAKEN ME TO THIS EXTENT, SO THAT YOU CANNOT EVEN BEAR TO > HEAR MY VOICE RECITE A VERSE IN YOUR PRAISE. Suddenly an unknown > Brhamin reached there and after prescribing the formula of a new > herbal medicine to Chembai, left unnoticed. This particular medicine > was quickly prepared at the Poomulli Mana. Soon after taking this > medicine, Chembai & #8217;s ailment was cured. His voice became better than > ever before. The restoration of his voice was by the grace of Sree > Guruvayurappan .> > After this miracle, Chembai took a vow to sing in front of Sree > Guruvayoorppan on every Sukla paksham & #8217; Ekadasi day . > > POWER OF FAITH [1939]> > Chembai was about to start a performance at the palace in Kallikotai. > Suddenly he discovered that his voice was 'frozen'. He was puzzled >

since he had no problem of any kind earlier that day. The sound of > the tambura sruti seemed to gain in volume as Chembai pondered the > reason. Suddenly, a question arose in his mind. He asked someone > seated nearby whether it was Sukla paksham after the new moon. This > was the month of Kartika and it was Chembai's vow to offer musical > prayers at the Sree Krishna temple in Guruvayur on the Ekadasi day > of the 'sukla paksham' in the month of Kartika every year ( As > thanksgiving to Lord Sree Krishna for curing his illness) .> > When a reference to an almanac confirmed that it was Sukla paksham > Ekadasi, Chembai explained the matter to the host and requested > permission and help to go to Guruvayoor and fulfill his commitment. > The host obliged. Chembai speeded to Guruvayoor in a car, offered his > apologies and prayers to Sree Krishna.> >

He had no problem singing; he had recovered his voice fully. He sang > many songs and long until he was satisfied that the Lord had forgiven > his lapse.> > He sang at Kallikkotai the next evening, without any problem.> > THE SALVATION (16-OCTOBER-1974)> > Poozhikunnam Sri Krishna temple is situated on the banks of the > Nila river. After finishing the music concert there, Chembai said > to his aides : PLEASE TAKE ME TO THE SANCTUM SANCTORUM .Two people > held his hands and led him to the door of the sanctum. > > He sat down on the floor, shut his eyes, and prayed for a few > minutes. Then he called out to the deity in a supplicating tone: > KRISHNA! GURUVAYOORAPPA ! I AM 80. YOU HAVE FULFILLED ALL MY DESIRES. > WHY DO YOU STILL MAKE ME GO ABOUT WITH THIS BODY? WHY DON'T YOU CALL > ME [TO YOU]?> > When he

got up, after receiving the prasadam, and giving dakshina to > the priest, Rama Marar said:> > Bhagavatar will live for the full span of 125 years.> > Chembai laughed aloud and retorted : You don't poke your head in it. > All is settled between me and Guruvayoorappan.> > He returned to his friend O.M.V's nearby residence. He washed his > feet and face, and sat down for prayers in the verandah. After a few > minutes, it was noticed that his head was sliding to one side.> Somebody supported him, and slowly eased him down to lie on the > floor. He was perspiring profusely. Neelakantan Namboodiripad, who > knows Marana lakshana [signs of death] went near to examine him. He > looked only for a few seconds, and called out: "Everything is over > for Bhagavatar."> > An APPEAL - The religious matters of Vedic Religion must be

left > alone to those faithful Hindus who live according to Vedic > scriptures . If & #8216;faithless Hindus & #8217; continue to tamper with Vedas, > India's end is not far away. > > OM NAMO NARAYANAYA NAMAH!!!> > A bhakta .> > > To:-hindushaktikerala > - "Vandemataram ......." <bharathsevak> > Date:-Wed, 25 Jan 2006 04> Subject:-Re: Yesudas !> > I too agree with Jinesh, the hurdles late Kalamandalam Hyderali > faced during his younger days and the people who oppose Yesudas is > something not to be encouraged. Instead of making their mind enter > into the world of Universal religion our orthodox people are driving > them out and creating hatred in their mind about Hindutva> > >

----> - "Jagdos larikker" <jlarikker> Date:-Tue, 24 Jan 2006 18:19:29 -0800 (PST)> Subject:-Re: Yesudas !> > I agree with Jinesh.> > Our religion and culture has accepted everyone with an open heart - > this had had good and bad results. > > however in the current scenario, we should encourage more and more > non hindus to believe, accept and adopt the hindu religion. so should > we also encourage our youth to get more religious, which i think they > are getting to.> > Pranam> Jagdos> ----> Jinesh <kbjinesh> wrote:> > The law that no non-Hindu can enter Guruvayur Temple is a law by the > Devaswam board, Guruvayurappan didn't make it.

Denial of a believer > in a temple is the biggest sin a Hindu can do, either on political or > on religious reasons. > > The argument of the author in Kesari is childish. We all know that > Yesudas visits Sabarimala every year, that is not based on any song > he sang. He visits Mookambika every year; it is not for fame. His > devotion to Guruvayurappan is much more sincere than some of our > politicians show. It may be bigger than any one of us has. Changing > religion officially will offend the Christians, which of course is > not fair from his side (though Hindus will be happy by that). On the > contrary, we have no hesitation to accept the donations by non-Hindus > to temples, which we seldom talk about!> On one side, people are converting Hindus to other religions. On the > other, we are denying others to enter temples, just because they > don't have a

certificate to 'prove' their belief! The question of > allowing Yesudas in to Guruvayur temple is not the matter of > converting one Christian to Hindu religion by certificate, it is a > matter of believes. I think then there is no reason to deny him.> > If that is not the case, we are not talking about the religion, we > are talking politics, which is unfair!> > Regards,> Jinesh.> > ----> > > > > > > > > > > > > > Om Namo Narayanaya: >

[Guest guest]

Dear All, This is the problem.The laws are set by human beings and there was a time when a non brahmin was not allowed to enter a temple.I am talking about our own Hindu temple in which a Hindu who is of the lower caste was denied entry based on what we call as untouchability.Who made that ystem?Did God made that.It is we human beeing who is making laws and breaking them for their own convenience.It was a brahmin dominated society at that time and so they were denied entry.Does that mean Guruvayoorappan did not want the so called untouchables at that time not to enter the temple.I have seen many people who go to the temple after eating non vegetarian ...yes they are Hindus and still have an entry into the temple. So my question is why not a Christian who believes in Hindu faith.Yesudas knows Sanskrit much better than any Brahmin in India .Then why not an entry be given to him.But I am sure that as untouchables were given entry soon

Yesudas and other Hindu believers will be gfiven entry. It should also be noted that Sabarimala had set a perfect example of respecting the human race by allowing entry to any person of any religion caste or creed .At the end of the day we must remember that we are human beings.We die as a Hindu but there is no guarantee that you will be born as a Hindu again.We are praising and defending the aspect because we are born as Hindus .But once we leave our last breathe then no Hindu,Christian or Muslim.Only one thing that is one with the universe.The concept of Aham Brahmamasmi comes into play also known as tatvamasi. Anyhow everything depends on the way in which the basics are understood.Eveen Krishna had mentioned about the importance of soul in bhagavad geeta.We praise Hinduism when we are born as Hindus ,we praise Jesus when born as Christians and as Muslims we praise Allah.But at the end we fail to realise that it was the

sam3e old soul in three different forms praising individual religions the body had gained during that period of time. Anyhow wishing eeverone a good day. best Regards, Hemant Vinod,I agree with you.This issue is for the respective temple authorities to deal with, as they deem appropriate. We laymen have very limited knowledge about these matters and we are not competent to pass verdict on this or to criticise the religious practices of Guruvayoor temple. Another example is the Shree Padmanabha Swamy Temple at Trivandrum. With all due respect to Yesudas and individuals like him, singing praises of Sree Guruvayoorappan, or showing loyalty ( and belief) to Hinduism or being student of Chembai is not sufficient qualification to get entry

into these temples. Dr Frank Morales is a highly respected authority on Hinduism. Let's see what he has to written about it.PSIt is not my intention to prolong this discussion but to throw some light on this issue. Jai Shree Krishna !Krishnanujan---Who is a Hindu?from Dr. Frank MoralesWhen the question of who is a Hindu is discussed today, we get a multitude of confused and contradictory answers from both Hindu laypersons and from Hindu leaders. That we have such a difficult time understanding the answer to even so fundamental a question as "who is a Hindu?" is a starkly sad indicator of the lack of knowledge in the Hindu community today. Common AnswersSome of the more simplistic answers to this question include: Anyone born in India is automatically a Hindu (the ethnicity fallacy), if your parents are Hindu, then you are Hindu (the familial argument), if you are born into a certain

caste, then you are Hindu (the genetic inheritance model), if you believe in reincarnation, then you are Hindu (forgetting that many non-Hindu religions share at least some of the beliefs of Hinduism), if you practice any religion originating from India, then you are a Hindu (the national origin fallacy). The Real AnswerThe real answer to this question has already been conclusively answered by the ancient sages of Hinduism, and is actually much simpler to ascertain than we would guess. The two primary factors that distinguish the individual uniqueness of the great world religious traditions are a) the scriptural authority upon which the tradition is based, and b) the fundamental religious tenet(s) that it espouses. If we ask the question what is a Jew?, for example, the answer is: someone who accepts the Torah as their scriptural guide and believes in the monotheistic concept of God espoused in these scriptures.

What is a Christian? - a person who accepts the Gospels as their scriptural guide and believes that Jesus is the incarnate God who died for their sins. What is a Muslim? - someone who accepts the Qur'an as their scriptural guide, and believes that there is no God but Allah, and that Mohammed is his prophet. Scriptural AuthorityIn general, what determines whether a person is a follower of any particular religion is whether or not they accept, and attempt to live by, the scriptural authority of that religion. This is no less true of Hinduism than it is of any other religion on earth. Thus, the question of what is a Hindu is similarly very easily answered. The DefinitionBy definition, a Hindu is an individual who accepts as authoritative the religious guidance of the Vedic scriptures, and who strives to live in accordance with Dharma, God's divine laws as revealed in the Vedic scriptures. Only If You Accept the

VedasIn keeping with this standard definition, all of the Hindu thinkers of the six traditional schools of Hindu philosophy (Shad-darshanas) insisted on the acceptance of the scriptural authority of the Vedas (shabda-pramana) as the primary criterion for distinguishing a Hindu from a non-Hindu, as well as distinguishing overtly Hindu philosophical positions from non-Hindu ones. It has been the historically accepted standard that, if you accept the Vedas (and by extension Bhagavad Gita, Puranas, etc.) as your scriptural authority, and lived your life in accordance with the Dharmic principles of the Vedas, you are then a Hindu. Thus, an Indian who rejects the Veda is obviously not a Hindu. While an American, Russian, Indonesian or Indian who does accept the Veda obviously is a Hindu. ******************Jai Shree

Krishna ! In guruvayur , "PS, Vinod K \(GE Infra, Energy\)" <vinod.ps@g...> wrote:>> !! Sri Rama Jayam !!> > Dear All,> > This is a highly sensitive issue. > A debate on this will run long & I hope there will not be any positive outcome.> We have so many other things to share, discuss & decide.> Whether Yesudas or any other non-hindu be allowed or not to enter GURUVAYUR temple premises is beyond all our terrestrial abilities.> Guruvayur temple is based on certain vedic codes of conduct & administrational practices. > No body should challenge those as far as communal harmony & preserving cultural heritage is concerned. > It is exactly like we decide maintaining our house-hold activities irrespective of what our neighbors do or do not.> I am not trying to support any one's voice here.> Hence, leave the decision to Sri

Guruvayurappan & may not try to raise such talks in future again.> Our GURUVAYURAPPAN is 'Sarvasakshi'.> We must believe that his decisions are the most superior ones.> > Let us all hope for the best.> > Sarve Bhavantu sukhinaha ...> > HARE KRISHNA> HARE RAMA> > > > > guruvayur [guruvayur ]On> Behalf Of krishnadaya> Thursday, January 26, 2006 4:57 PM> guruvayur > [Guruvayur/Guruvayoor] Fw - Beware of Anti-Vedic Moves in> Guruvayoor .> > > Please find below, an interesting article published recetly in a > devotional group .> > > Dear all, > > As a humble Hindu-devotee, I am shocked to see that some > opportunistic Hindus are trying to force the entry of

non-Hindus > like Yesudas inside Guruvayoor temple . They appear to be following > the Christian culture where the Idol is inert and everything is > decided by the clergy and influential men. > > It is an absolute truth that, Sree Krishna & #8217;s deity in the Guruvayoor > temple is Living God . The Lord doesn & #8217;t require His duties to be > performed by mortal men . > > In this regard , please note the following : > > 1. Lord Sri Krishna is Sattva-guna personified and His worship > in deity-form is different from that of other Devatas. The > functioning of the sacred Guruvayoor temple is based on the > procedures established by Aadi Sankara. Sree Guruvayoorappan had > instructed him personally to put in place, necessary systems to > ensure His constant presence on

the Deity. The related rituals and > rules are unique and applicable only for Guruvayoor temple .> > 2. According to the above, the decision of authorized Tantri ( > Puzhakkkal Chennar Illam & #8217;s Senior most Namboodirippad) is the final > word in all matters concerning the Guruvayoor temple. This authority > has been confirmed by Supreme Court of India. Numerous lawsuits were > filed by publicity-crazy, un-believers asking for entry of no-Hindus > in Guruvayoor temple but all of them were dismissed . Recently, one > such demonic Hindu was ridiculed by the Calicut court, for raising > an irrelevant issue ( seeking entry of non-Hindus) for the sake of > publicity.> > 3. Guruvayoorappan is not a passive Deity . The Lord is in full > control of the temple . He has systems in place like instructions >

to Tantri / Priests during dreams (Swapna-darsana) , revelation > during 'Devaprasna' etc, to convey His additional instructions, as > and when required. Any one violating Him would be pay dearly for his > offence . > > 4. If Lord Guruvayoorappan wanted Yesudas to enter Guruvayoor > temple , the Lord Himself would have arranged for it .> > 5. Yesudas is a great singer and he has many good qualities . > However, he is not a not a Hindu . Yesudas is actually a > Christian believer and his wife and children too follow Christian > faith . But unlike other Christians , Yesudas worships > Guruvayoorappan also as One of the forms of God . For sure , > Guruvayoorappan is not his Upasana-moorti (Principal deity) . On His > part, the merciful Guruvayoorappan has generously rewarded Yesudas , >

for whatever bhakti towards Him.> > 6. On the other hand , the Lord & #8217;s favourite devotee-singer Chembai > Vaidayanatha Bhagavartar ( Guru of yesudas) was fully loyal to the > Lord ; and he surrendered most of his earnings for the service of the > Lord .Gurvayoorappan interacted with Chembai on a personal level > (Listed here below some true incidents taken from the biography of > Chemabai by LRV ) . > > MIRACULOUS TREATMENT BY GURUVAYOORAPPAN ( 1931)> > In the year 1931 on an Ekadasi day , Chembai was about to commence a > music concert in the presence of King Samutiri at Calicut . Just > before starting the concert, there was a sudden change in his voice > and he could not even speak. It was diagnosed as a chronic throat > ailment and frantic

treatments followed . Unfortunately , in spite of > continuing for a full year , all the high-tech treatments failed to > produce any difference . > > A heartbroken Chembai finally came to Guruvayoor temple and stood > before the Lord of Guruvayur with tears in his eyes, asking, OH LORD! > HAVE YOU FORSAKEN ME TO THIS EXTENT, SO THAT YOU CANNOT EVEN BEAR TO > HEAR MY VOICE RECITE A VERSE IN YOUR PRAISE. Suddenly an unknown > Brhamin reached there and after prescribing the formula of a new > herbal medicine to Chembai, left unnoticed. This particular medicine > was quickly prepared at the Poomulli Mana. Soon after taking this > medicine, Chembai & #8217;s ailment was cured. His voice became better than > ever before. The restoration of his voice was by the grace of Sree > Guruvayurappan .> > After

this miracle, Chembai took a vow to sing in front of Sree > Guruvayoorppan on every Sukla paksham & #8217; Ekadasi day . > > POWER OF FAITH [1939]> > Chembai was about to start a performance at the palace in Kallikotai. > Suddenly he discovered that his voice was 'frozen'. He was puzzled > since he had no problem of any kind earlier that day. The sound of > the tambura sruti seemed to gain in volume as Chembai pondered the > reason. Suddenly, a question arose in his mind. He asked someone > seated nearby whether it was Sukla paksham after the new moon. This > was the month of Kartika and it was Chembai's vow to offer musical > prayers at the Sree Krishna temple in Guruvayur on the Ekadasi day > of the 'sukla paksham' in the month of Kartika every year ( As > thanksgiving to Lord Sree Krishna for curing his illness) .> > When a

reference to an almanac confirmed that it was Sukla paksham > Ekadasi, Chembai explained the matter to the host and requested > permission and help to go to Guruvayoor and fulfill his commitment. > The host obliged. Chembai speeded to Guruvayoor in a car, offered his > apologies and prayers to Sree Krishna.> > He had no problem singing; he had recovered his voice fully. He sang > many songs and long until he was satisfied that the Lord had forgiven > his lapse.> > He sang at Kallikkotai the next evening, without any problem.> > THE SALVATION (16-OCTOBER-1974)> > Poozhikunnam Sri Krishna temple is situated on the banks of the > Nila river. After finishing the music concert there, Chembai said > to his aides : PLEASE TAKE ME TO THE SANCTUM SANCTORUM .Two people > held his hands and led him to the door of the sanctum. >

> He sat down on the floor, shut his eyes, and prayed for a few > minutes. Then he called out to the deity in a supplicating tone: > KRISHNA! GURUVAYOORAPPA ! I AM 80. YOU HAVE FULFILLED ALL MY DESIRES. > WHY DO YOU STILL MAKE ME GO ABOUT WITH THIS BODY? WHY DON'T YOU CALL > ME [TO YOU]?> > When he got up, after receiving the prasadam, and giving dakshina to > the priest, Rama Marar said:> > Bhagavatar will live for the full span of 125 years.> > Chembai laughed aloud and retorted : You don't poke your head in it. > All is settled between me and Guruvayoorappan.> > He returned to his friend O.M.V's nearby residence. He washed his > feet and face, and sat down for prayers in the verandah. After a few > minutes, it was noticed that his head was sliding to one side.> Somebody supported him, and slowly eased him

down to lie on the > floor. He was perspiring profusely. Neelakantan Namboodiripad, who > knows Marana lakshana [signs of death] went near to examine him. He > looked only for a few seconds, and called out: "Everything is over > for Bhagavatar."> > An APPEAL - The religious matters of Vedic Religion must be left > alone to those faithful Hindus who live according to Vedic > scriptures . If & #8216;faithless Hindus & #8217; continue to tamper with Vedas, > India's end is not far away. > > OM NAMO NARAYANAYA NAMAH!!!> > A bhakta .> > > To:-hindushaktikerala > - "Vandemataram ......." <bharathsevak> > Date:-Wed, 25 Jan 2006 04> Subject:-Re: Yesudas !> > I too agree with Jinesh, the hurdles late Kalamandalam Hyderali > faced during his younger days and the people who

oppose Yesudas is > something not to be encouraged. Instead of making their mind enter > into the world of Universal religion our orthodox people are driving > them out and creating hatred in their mind about Hindutva> > > ----> - "Jagdos larikker" <jlarikker> Date:-Tue, 24 Jan 2006 18:19:29 -0800 (PST)> Subject:-Re: Yesudas !> > I agree with Jinesh.> > Our religion and culture has accepted everyone with an open heart - > this had had good and bad results. > > however in the current scenario, we should encourage more and more > non hindus to believe, accept and adopt the hindu religion. so should > we also encourage our youth to get more religious, which i think they > are getting to.> > Pranam>

Jagdos> ----> Jinesh <kbjinesh> wrote:> > The law that no non-Hindu can enter Guruvayur Temple is a law by the > Devaswam board, Guruvayurappan didn't make it. Denial of a believer > in a temple is the biggest sin a Hindu can do, either on political or > on religious reasons. > > The argument of the author in Kesari is childish. We all know that > Yesudas visits Sabarimala every year, that is not based on any song > he sang. He visits Mookambika every year; it is not for fame. His > devotion to Guruvayurappan is much more sincere than some of our > politicians show. It may be bigger than any one of us has. Changing > religion officially will offend the Christians, which of course is > not fair from his side (though Hindus will be happy by that). On the > contrary, we have no

hesitation to accept the donations by non-Hindus > to temples, which we seldom talk about!> On one side, people are converting Hindus to other religions. On the > other, we are denying others to enter temples, just because they > don't have a certificate to 'prove' their belief! The question of > allowing Yesudas in to Guruvayur temple is not the matter of > converting one Christian to Hindu religion by certificate, it is a > matter of believes. I think then there is no reason to deny him.> > If that is not the case, we are not talking about the religion, we > are talking politics, which is unfair!> > Regards,> Jinesh.> > ----> > > > > > > > > > > > > > Om Namo Narayanaya: >

Links>

Jiyo cricket on India cricket

[Guest guest]

Hari OM!

 

Dear all,

 

Whoever born as a Hindu is only a Hindu, and the religious practice

differs there is no concept of conversion in Hinduism. And we can say

others who live the way as per the vedic scriptures is practicing

Hinduism that is all. Taking Birth in our great religion in itself is

a privilege given by Lord Guruvayurappan.

 

We do not need a Frank Morale to say to us, We have our great Rishis

and also our sages like Swami Vivekanandan etc...

 

What ever the Lord Guruvayurappan does is best for that period of time

and space.in that soceity even the one who can question it, is doing

itself because of his power leela, so surrendering to HIS lotus feet.

 

 

With Love & OM!

 

Krishna Prasad

 

On 1/27/06, krishnanujan <krishnanujan wrote:

> Vinod,

> I agree with you.

> This issue is for the respective temple authorities to deal with, as

> they deem appropriate. We laymen have very limited knowledge about

> these matters and we are not competent to pass verdict on this or to

> criticise the religious practices of Guruvayoor temple. Another

> example is the Shree Padmanabha Swamy Temple at Trivandrum. With all

> due respect to Yesudas and individuals like him, singing praises of

> Sree Guruvayoorappan, or showing loyalty ( and belief) to Hinduism or

> being student of Chembai is not sufficient qualification to get

> entry into these temples.

> Dr Frank Morales is a highly respected authority on Hinduism. Let's

> see what he has to written about it.

>

> PS

> It is not my intention to prolong this discussion but to throw some

> light on this issue.

>

> Jai Shree Krishna !

> Krishnanujan

>

> ---Who is a Hindu?

> from Dr. Frank Morales

>

> When the question of who is a Hindu is discussed today, we get a

> multitude of confused and contradictory answers from both Hindu

> laypersons and from Hindu leaders. That we have such a difficult time

> understanding the answer to even so fundamental a question as " who is

> a Hindu? " is a starkly sad indicator of the lack of knowledge in the

> Hindu community today.

> Common Answers

> Some of the more simplistic answers to this question include: Anyone

> born in India is automatically a Hindu (the ethnicity fallacy), if

> your parents are Hindu, then you are Hindu (the familial argument),

> if you are born into a certain caste, then you are Hindu (the genetic

> inheritance model), if you believe in reincarnation, then you are

> Hindu (forgetting that many non-Hindu religions share at least some

> of the beliefs of Hinduism), if you practice any religion originating

> from India, then you are a Hindu (the national origin fallacy).

>

>

> The Real Answer

> The real answer to this question has already been conclusively

> answered by the ancient sages of Hinduism, and is actually much

> simpler to ascertain than we would guess. The two primary factors

> that distinguish the individual uniqueness of the great world

> religious traditions are a) the scriptural authority upon which the

> tradition is based, and b) the fundamental religious tenet(s) that it

> espouses. If we ask the question what is a Jew?, for example, the

> answer is: someone who accepts the Torah as their scriptural guide

> and believes in the monotheistic concept of God espoused in these

> scriptures. What is a Christian? - a person who accepts the Gospels

> as their scriptural guide and believes that Jesus is the incarnate

> God who died for their sins. What is a Muslim? - someone who accepts

> the Qur'an as their scriptural guide, and believes that there is no

> God but Allah, and that Mohammed is his prophet.

>

> Scriptural Authority

> In general, what determines whether a person is a follower of any

> particular religion is whether or not they accept, and attempt to

> live by, the scriptural authority of that religion. This is no less

> true of Hinduism than it is of any other religion on earth. Thus, the

> question of what is a Hindu is similarly very easily answered.

>

> The Definition

> By definition, a Hindu is an individual who accepts as authoritative

> the religious guidance of the Vedic scriptures, and who strives to

> live in accordance with Dharma, God's divine laws as revealed in the

> Vedic scriptures.

>

> Only If You Accept the Vedas

> In keeping with this standard definition, all of the Hindu thinkers

> of the six traditional schools of Hindu philosophy (Shad-darshanas)

> insisted on the acceptance of the scriptural authority of the Vedas

> (shabda-pramana) as the primary criterion for distinguishing a Hindu

> from a non-Hindu, as well as distinguishing overtly Hindu

> philosophical positions from non-Hindu ones. It has been the

> historically accepted standard that, if you accept the Vedas (and by

> extension Bhagavad Gita, Puranas, etc.) as your scriptural authority,

> and lived your life in accordance with the Dharmic principles of the

> Vedas, you are then a Hindu. Thus, an Indian who rejects the Veda is

> obviously not a Hindu. While an American, Russian, Indonesian or

> Indian who does accept the Veda obviously is a Hindu.

>

>

> ******************

>

> Jai Shree Krishna !

>

> In guruvayur , " PS, Vinod K \(GE Infra, Energy\) "

>

> <vinod.ps@g...> wrote:

> >

> > !! Sri Rama Jayam !!

> >

> > Dear All,

> >

> > This is a highly sensitive issue.

> > A debate on this will run long & I hope there will not be any

> positive outcome.

> > We have so many other things to share, discuss & decide.

> > Whether Yesudas or any other non-hindu be allowed or not to enter

> GURUVAYUR temple premises is beyond all our terrestrial abilities.

> > Guruvayur temple is based on certain vedic codes of conduct &

> administrational practices.

> > No body should challenge those as far as communal harmony &

> preserving cultural heritage is concerned.

> > It is exactly like we decide maintaining our house-hold activities

> irrespective of what our neighbors do or do not.

> > I am not trying to support any one's voice here.

> > Hence, leave the decision to Sri Guruvayurappan & may not try to

> raise such talks in future again.

> > Our GURUVAYURAPPAN is 'Sarvasakshi'.

> > We must believe that his decisions are the most superior ones.

> >

> > Let us all hope for the best.

> >

> > Sarve Bhavantu sukhinaha ...

> >

> > HARE KRISHNA

> > HARE RAMA

> >

> >

> >

> >

> > guruvayur [guruvayur ]On

> > Behalf Of krishnadaya

> > Thursday, January 26, 2006 4:57 PM

> > guruvayur

> > [Guruvayur/Guruvayoor] Fw - Beware of Anti-Vedic Moves in

> > Guruvayoor .

> >

> >

> > Please find below, an interesting article published recetly in a

> > devotional group .

> >

> >

> > Dear all,

> >

> > As a humble Hindu-devotee, I am shocked to see that some

> > opportunistic Hindus are trying to force the entry of non-Hindus

> > like Yesudas inside Guruvayoor temple . They appear to be following

> > the Christian culture where the Idol is inert and everything is

> > decided by the clergy and influential men.

> >

> > It is an absolute truth that, Sree Krishna & #8217;s deity in the

> Guruvayoor

> > temple is Living God . The Lord doesn & #8217;t require His duties

> to be

> > performed by mortal men .

> >

> > In this regard , please note the following :

> >

> > 1. Lord Sri Krishna is Sattva-guna personified and His worship

> > in deity-form is different from that of other Devatas. The

> > functioning of the sacred Guruvayoor temple is based on the

> > procedures established by Aadi Sankara. Sree Guruvayoorappan had

> > instructed him personally to put in place, necessary systems to

> > ensure His constant presence on the Deity. The related rituals and

> > rules are unique and applicable only for Guruvayoor temple .

> >

> > 2. According to the above, the decision of authorized Tantri (

> > Puzhakkkal Chennar Illam & #8217;s Senior most Namboodirippad) is

> the final

> > word in all matters concerning the Guruvayoor temple. This

> authority

> > has been confirmed by Supreme Court of India. Numerous lawsuits

> were

> > filed by publicity-crazy, un-believers asking for entry of no-

> Hindus

> > in Guruvayoor temple but all of them were dismissed . Recently, one

> > such demonic Hindu was ridiculed by the Calicut court, for raising

> > an irrelevant issue ( seeking entry of non-Hindus) for the sake of

> > publicity.

> >

> > 3. Guruvayoorappan is not a passive Deity . The Lord is in full

> > control of the temple . He has systems in place like instructions

> > to Tantri / Priests during dreams (Swapna-darsana) , revelation

> > during 'Devaprasna' etc, to convey His additional instructions, as

> > and when required. Any one violating Him would be pay dearly for

> his

> > offence .

> >

> > 4. If Lord Guruvayoorappan wanted Yesudas to enter Guruvayoor

> > temple , the Lord Himself would have arranged for it .

> >

> > 5. Yesudas is a great singer and he has many good qualities .

> > However, he is not a not a Hindu . Yesudas is actually a

> > Christian believer and his wife and children too follow Christian

> > faith . But unlike other Christians , Yesudas worships

> > Guruvayoorappan also as One of the forms of God . For sure ,

> > Guruvayoorappan is not his Upasana-moorti (Principal deity) . On

> His

> > part, the merciful Guruvayoorappan has generously rewarded

> Yesudas ,

> > for whatever bhakti towards Him.

> >

> > 6. On the other hand , the Lord & #8217;s favourite devotee-singer

> Chembai

> > Vaidayanatha Bhagavartar ( Guru of yesudas) was fully loyal to

> the

> > Lord ; and he surrendered most of his earnings for the service of

> the

> > Lord .Gurvayoorappan interacted with Chembai on a personal level

> > (Listed here below some true incidents taken from the biography

> of

> > Chemabai by LRV ) .

> >

> > MIRACULOUS TREATMENT BY GURUVAYOORAPPAN ( 1931)

> >

> > In the year 1931 on an Ekadasi day , Chembai was about to commence

> a

> > music concert in the presence of King Samutiri at Calicut . Just

> > before starting the concert, there was a sudden change in his

> voice

> > and he could not even speak. It was diagnosed as a chronic throat

> > ailment and frantic treatments followed . Unfortunately , in spite

> of

> > continuing for a full year , all the high-tech treatments failed

> to

> > produce any difference .

> >

> > A heartbroken Chembai finally came to Guruvayoor temple and stood

> > before the Lord of Guruvayur with tears in his eyes, asking, OH

> LORD!

> > HAVE YOU FORSAKEN ME TO THIS EXTENT, SO THAT YOU CANNOT EVEN BEAR

> TO

> > HEAR MY VOICE RECITE A VERSE IN YOUR PRAISE. Suddenly an unknown

> > Brhamin reached there and after prescribing the formula of a new

> > herbal medicine to Chembai, left unnoticed. This particular

> medicine

> > was quickly prepared at the Poomulli Mana. Soon after taking

> this

> > medicine, Chembai & #8217;s ailment was cured. His voice became

> better than

> > ever before. The restoration of his voice was by the grace of Sree

> > Guruvayurappan .

> >

> > After this miracle, Chembai took a vow to sing in front of Sree

> > Guruvayoorppan on every Sukla paksham & #8217; Ekadasi day .

> >

> > POWER OF FAITH [1939]

> >

> > Chembai was about to start a performance at the palace in

> Kallikotai.

> > Suddenly he discovered that his voice was 'frozen'. He was puzzled

> > since he had no problem of any kind earlier that day. The sound of

> > the tambura sruti seemed to gain in volume as Chembai pondered the

> > reason. Suddenly, a question arose in his mind. He asked someone

> > seated nearby whether it was Sukla paksham after the new moon. This

> > was the month of Kartika and it was Chembai's vow to offer

> musical

> > prayers at the Sree Krishna temple in Guruvayur on the Ekadasi day

> > of the 'sukla paksham' in the month of Kartika every year ( As

> > thanksgiving to Lord Sree Krishna for curing his illness) .

> >

> > When a reference to an almanac confirmed that it was Sukla paksham

> > Ekadasi, Chembai explained the matter to the host and requested

> > permission and help to go to Guruvayoor and fulfill his commitment.

> > The host obliged. Chembai speeded to Guruvayoor in a car, offered

> his

> > apologies and prayers to Sree Krishna.

> >

> > He had no problem singing; he had recovered his voice fully. He

> sang

> > many songs and long until he was satisfied that the Lord had

> forgiven

> > his lapse.

> >

> > He sang at Kallikkotai the next evening, without any problem.

> >

> > THE SALVATION (16-OCTOBER-1974)

> >

> > Poozhikunnam Sri Krishna temple is situated on the banks of the

> > Nila river. After finishing the music concert there, Chembai said

> > to his aides : PLEASE TAKE ME TO THE SANCTUM SANCTORUM .Two people

> > held his hands and led him to the door of the sanctum.

> >

> > He sat down on the floor, shut his eyes, and prayed for a few

> > minutes. Then he called out to the deity in a supplicating tone:

> > KRISHNA! GURUVAYOORAPPA ! I AM 80. YOU HAVE FULFILLED ALL MY

> DESIRES.

> > WHY DO YOU STILL MAKE ME GO ABOUT WITH THIS BODY? WHY DON'T YOU

> CALL

> > ME [TO YOU]?

> >

> > When he got up, after receiving the prasadam, and giving dakshina

> to

> > the priest, Rama Marar said:

> >

> > Bhagavatar will live for the full span of 125 years.

> >

> > Chembai laughed aloud and retorted : You don't poke your head in

> it.

> > All is settled between me and Guruvayoorappan.

> >

> > He returned to his friend O.M.V's nearby residence. He washed his

> > feet and face, and sat down for prayers in the verandah. After a

> few

> > minutes, it was noticed that his head was sliding to one side.

> > Somebody supported him, and slowly eased him down to lie on the

> > floor. He was perspiring profusely. Neelakantan Namboodiripad, who

> > knows Marana lakshana [signs of death] went near to examine him. He

> > looked only for a few seconds, and called out: " Everything is over

> > for Bhagavatar. "

> >

> > An APPEAL - The religious matters of Vedic Religion must be left

> > alone to those faithful Hindus who live according to Vedic

> > scriptures . If & #8216;faithless Hindus & #8217; continue to tamper

> with Vedas,

> > India's end is not far away.

> >

> > OM NAMO NARAYANAYA NAMAH!!!

> >

> > A bhakta .

> >

> >

> > To:-hindushaktikerala

> > - " Vandemataram ....... " <bharathsevak>

> > Date:-Wed, 25 Jan 2006 04

> > Subject:-Re: Yesudas !

> >

> > I too agree with Jinesh, the hurdles late Kalamandalam Hyderali

> > faced during his younger days and the people who oppose Yesudas is

> > something not to be encouraged. Instead of making their mind enter

> > into the world of Universal religion our orthodox people are

> driving

> > them out and creating hatred in their mind about Hindutva

> >

> >

> >

> --

> --

> > - " Jagdos larikker " <jlarikker

> > Date:-Tue, 24 Jan 2006 18:19:29 -0800 (PST)

> > Subject:-Re: Yesudas !

> >

> > I agree with Jinesh.

> >

> > Our religion and culture has accepted everyone with an open heart -

> > this had had good and bad results.

> >

> > however in the current scenario, we should encourage more and more

> > non hindus to believe, accept and adopt the hindu religion. so

> should

> > we also encourage our youth to get more religious, which i think

> they

> > are getting to.

> >

> > Pranam

> > Jagdos

> >

> --

> --

> > Jinesh <kbjinesh> wrote:

> >

> > The law that no non-Hindu can enter Guruvayur Temple is a law by

> the

> > Devaswam board, Guruvayurappan didn't make it. Denial of a believer

> > in a temple is the biggest sin a Hindu can do, either on political

> or

> > on religious reasons.

> >

> > The argument of the author in Kesari is childish. We all know that

> > Yesudas visits Sabarimala every year, that is not based on any song

> > he sang. He visits Mookambika every year; it is not for fame. His

> > devotion to Guruvayurappan is much more sincere than some of our

> > politicians show. It may be bigger than any one of us has. Changing

> > religion officially will offend the Christians, which of course is

> > not fair from his side (though Hindus will be happy by that). On

> the

> > contrary, we have no hesitation to accept the donations by non-

> Hindus

> > to temples, which we seldom talk about!

> > On one side, people are converting Hindus to other religions. On

> the

> > other, we are denying others to enter temples, just because they

> > don't have a certificate to 'prove' their belief! The question of

> > allowing Yesudas in to Guruvayur temple is not the matter of

> > converting one Christian to Hindu religion by certificate, it is a

> > matter of believes. I think then there is no reason to deny him.

> >

> > If that is not the case, we are not talking about the religion, we

> > are talking politics, which is unfair!

> >

> > Regards,

> > Jinesh.

> >

> >

> --

> --

> >

> >

> >

> >

> >

> >

> >

> >

> >

> >

> >

> >

> >

> > Om Namo Narayanaya:

> >

[Guest guest]

Hari OM!

 

Dear Hemant,

 

That was a good article, the people like in your description with the

same kind of mental setup can be considered as a Brahmin and not the

person who wears Yagyopaveedam.

 

Then, Yesudas I respect him because he is having a noble gift of

voice from Guruvayurappan! But if you say he knows Sanskrit than any

other Brahmin in India it is an ignorant statement. Statement which

should be ignored, Yesudas learned Sanskrit for sometime for his

" Akshara Spudatham " and also for doing the songs of Srimad Bhagawad

Geetha, and Rigvedam etc. There are great Sanskirt Scholars like Swami

Paramarthanadaji, Swami Dayanandaji etc, living in India. And they are

only some of them, people who knows Panini, and Vyakaranam also is

there. So we cannot project Yesudas as a Sanskrit all knowing.

 

As per Hinduism ( I mean Sanathana Dharma) we should not eat non-veg,

how many of us follows it now adays? You said every body is having

the same soul .The basic nature of each soul is to live, and let live,

when Humans kill cattle, and other creatures for their own benefit, it

is harming GOD himself, because each creature in essence is Bhagwan

only. If we are constantly chanting his name definitely we will be

born as Hindu only, do not worry about that, What ever you think that

becomes YOU finally. You said man made rules but Who is giving the

power the basic Jeeva power to make the rules it is HIM alone, Sarvam

Brahmamayam! most of us often live as Brhama mayam!.

 

We can pray to HIM to make changes

 

Oh Lord Grant me the freedom, Serenity and Maturity to accept Gracefully

what I cannot Change.

 

May I have the courage and will to change what I need to and What I can.

 

May I have the wisdom to see the difference between what I can and what I cannot

change.

 

May I have freedom in relationships.

 

brahmârpanam brahma havirbrahmâgnau brahmanâ hutam

brahmaiva tena gantavyam brahmakarmasamâdhinâ

 

The means of offering is Brahman. The oblation is Brahman,

offered by Brahman into the fire, which is Brahman. Brahman

indeed is to be reached by one who sees everything as Brahman.

(Bhagavad Gîtâ 4-24)

 

 

Yes Lord Guruvyurappan knows what is better for each being in this

world, we can only Chant his name we cannot understand him we can only

STAND UNDER HIM!

 

With Love & OM!

 

Krishna Prasad

 

 

On 1/27/06, Hemant Radhakrishnan <hemant197515 wrote:

> Dear All,

>

> This is the problem.The laws are set by human beings and there was a time

> when a non brahmin was not allowed to enter a temple.I am talking about our

> own Hindu temple in which a Hindu who is of the lower caste was denied entry

> based on what we call as untouchability.Who made that ystem?Did God made

> that.It is we human beeing who is making laws and breaking them for their

> own convenience.It was a brahmin dominated society at that time and so they

> were denied entry.Does that mean Guruvayoorappan did not want the so called

> untouchables at that time not to enter the temple.I have seen many people

> who go to the temple after eating non vegetarian ...yes they are Hindus and

> still have an entry into the temple.

> So my question is why not a Christian who believes in Hindu faith.Yesudas

> knows Sanskrit much better than any Brahmin in India .Then why not an entry

> be given to him.But I am sure that as untouchables were given entry soon

> Yesudas and other Hindu believers will be gfiven entry.

>

> It should also be noted that Sabarimala had set a perfect example of

> respecting the human race by allowing entry to any person of any religion

> caste or creed .At the end of the day we must remember that we are human

> beings.We die as a Hindu but there is no guarantee that you will be born as

> a Hindu again.We are praising and defending the aspect because we are born

> as Hindus .But once we leave our last breathe then no Hindu,Christian or

> Muslim.Only one thing that is one with the universe.The concept of Aham

> Brahmamasmi comes into play also known as tatvamasi.

>

> Anyhow everything depends on the way in which the basics are

> understood.Eveen Krishna had mentioned about the importance of soul in

> bhagavad geeta.We praise Hinduism when we are born as Hindus ,we praise

> Jesus when born as Christians and as Muslims we praise Allah.But at the end

> we fail to realise that it was the sam3e old soul in three different forms

> praising individual religions the body had gained during that period of

> time.

>

> Anyhow wishing eeverone a good day.

>

> best Regards,

> Hemant

>

>

> Vinod,

> I agree with you.

> This issue is for the respective temple authorities to deal with, as

> they deem appropriate. We laymen have very limited knowledge about

> these matters and we are not competent to pass verdict on this or to

> criticise the religious practices of Guruvayoor temple. Another

> example is the Shree Padmanabha Swamy Temple at Trivandrum. With all

> due respect to Yesudas and individuals like him, singing praises of

> Sree Guruvayoorappan, or showing loyalty ( and belief) to Hinduism or

> being student of Chembai is not sufficient qualification to get

> entry into these temples.

> Dr Frank Morales is a highly respected authority on Hinduism. Let's

> see what he has to written about it.

>

> PS

> It is not my intention to prolong this discussion but to throw some

> light on this issue.

>

> Jai Shree Krishna !

> Krishnanujan

>

> ---Who is a Hindu?

> from Dr. Frank Morales

>

> When the question of who is a Hindu is discussed today, we get a

> multitude of confused and contradictory answers from both Hindu

> laypersons and from Hindu leaders. That we have such a difficult time

> understanding the answer to even so fundamental a question as " who is

> a Hindu? " is a starkly sad indicator of the lack of knowledge in the

> Hindu community today.

> Common Answers

> Some of the more simplistic answers to this question include: Anyone

> born in India is automatically a Hindu (the ethnicity fallacy), if

> your parents are Hindu, then you are Hindu (the familial argument),

> if you are born into a certain caste, then you are Hindu (the genetic

> inheritance model), if you believe in reincarnation, then you are

> Hindu (forgetting that many non-Hindu religions share at least some

> of the beliefs of Hinduism), if you practice any religion originating

> from India, then you are a Hindu (the national origin fallacy).

>

>

> The Real Answer

> The real answer to this question has already been conclusively

> answered by the ancient sages of Hinduism, and is actually much

> simpler to ascertain than we would guess. The two primary factors

> that distinguish the individual uniqueness of the great world

> religious traditions are a) the scriptural authority upon which the

> tradition is based, and b) the fundamental religious tenet(s) that it

> espouses. If we ask the question what is a Jew?, for example, the

> answer is: someone who accepts the Torah as their scriptural guide

> and believes in the monotheistic concept of God espoused in these

> scriptures. What is a Christian? - a person who accepts the Gospels

> as their scriptural guide and believes that Jesus is the incarnate

> God who died for their sins. What is a Muslim? - someone who accepts

> the Qur'an as their scriptural guide, and believes that there is no

> God but Allah, and that Mohammed is his prophet.

>

> Scriptural Authority

> In general, what determines whether a person is a follower of any

> particular religion is whether or not they accept, and attempt to

> live by, the scriptural authority of that religion. This is no less

> true of Hinduism than it is of any other religion on earth. Thus, the

> question of what is a Hindu is similarly very easily answered.

>

> The Definition

> By definition, a Hindu is an individual who accepts as authoritative

> the religious guidance of the Vedic scriptures, and who strives to

> live in accordance with Dharma, God's divine laws as revealed in the

> Vedic scriptures.

>

> Only If You Accept the Vedas

> In keeping with this standard definition, all of the Hindu thinkers

> of the six traditional schools of Hindu philosophy (Shad-darshanas)

> insisted on the acceptance of the scriptural authority of the Vedas

> (shabda-pramana) as the primary criterion for distinguishing a Hindu

> from a non-Hindu, as well as distinguishing overtly Hindu

> philosophical positions from non-Hindu ones. It has been the

> historically accepted standard that, if you accept the Vedas (and by

> extension Bhagavad Gita, Puranas, etc.) as your scriptural authority,

> and lived your life in accordance with the Dharmic principles of the

> Vedas, you are then a Hindu. Thus, an Indian who rejects the Veda is

> obviously not a Hindu. While an American, Russian, Indonesian or

> Indian who does accept the Veda obviously is a Hindu.

>

>

> ******************

>

> Jai Shree Krishna !

>

> In guruvayur , " PS, Vinod K \(GE Infra, Energy\) "

> <vinod.ps@g...> wrote:

> >

> > !! Sri Rama Jayam !!

> >

> > Dear All,

> >

> > This is a highly sensitive issue.

> > A debate on this will run long & I hope there will not be any

> positive outcome.

> > We have so many other things to share, discuss & decide.

> > Whether Yesudas or any other non-hindu be allowed or not to enter

> GURUVAYUR temple premises is beyond all our terrestrial abilities.

> > Guruvayur temple is based on certain vedic codes of conduct &

> administrational practices.

> > No body should challenge those as far as communal harmony &

> preserving cultural heritage is concerned.

> > It is exactly like we decide maintaining our house-hold activities

> irrespective of what our neighbors do or do not.

> > I am not trying to support any one's voice here.

> > Hence, leave the decision to Sri Guruvayurappan & may not try to

> raise such talks in future again.

> > Our GURUVAYURAPPAN is 'Sarvasakshi'.

> > We must believe that his decisions are the most superior ones.

> >

> > Let us all hope for the best.

> >

> > Sarve Bhavantu sukhinaha ...

> >

> > HARE KRISHNA

> > HARE RAMA

> >

> >

> >

> >

> > guruvayur [guruvayur ]On

> > Behalf Of krishnadaya

> > Thursday, January 26, 2006 4:57 PM

> > guruvayur

> > [Guruvayur/Guruvayoor] Fw - Beware of Anti-Vedic Moves in

> > Guruvayoor .

> >

> >

> > Please find below, an interesting article published recetly in a

> > devotional group .

> >

> >

> > Dear all,

> >

> > As a humble Hindu-devotee, I am shocked to see that some

> > opportunistic Hindus are trying to force the entry of non-Hindus

> > like Yesudas inside Guruvayoor temple . They appear to be following

> > the Christian culture where the Idol is inert and everything is

> > decided by the clergy and influential men.

> >

> > It is an absolute truth that, Sree Krishna & #8217;s deity in the

> Guruvayoor

> > temple is Living God . The Lord doesn & #8217;t require His duties

> to be

> > performed by mortal men .

> >

> > In this regard , please note the following :

> >

> > 1. Lord Sri Krishna is Sattva-guna personified and His worship

> > in deity-form is different from that of other Devatas. The

> > functioning of the sacred Guruvayoor temple is based on the

> > procedures established by Aadi Sankara. Sree Guruvayoorappan had

> > instructed him personally to put in place, necessary systems to

> > ensure His constant presence on the Deity. The related rituals and

> > rules are unique and applicable only for Guruvayoor temple .

> >

> > 2. According to the above, the decision of authorized Tantri (

> > Puzhakkkal Chennar Illam & #8217;s Senior most Namboodirippad) is

> the final

> > word in all matters concerning the Guruvayoor temple. This

> authority

> > has been confirmed by Supreme Court of India. Numerous lawsuits

> were

> > filed by publicity-crazy, un-believers asking for entry of no-

> Hindus

> > in Guruvayoor temple but all of them were dismissed . Recently, one

> > such demonic Hindu was ridiculed by the Calicut court, for raising

> > an irrelevant issue ( seeking entry of non-Hindus) for the sake of

> > publicity.

> >

> > 3. Guruvayoorappan is not a passive Deity . The Lord is in full

> > control of the temple . He has systems in place like instructions

> > to Tantri / Priests during dreams (Swapna-darsana) , revelation

> > during 'Devaprasna' etc, to convey His additional instructions, as

> > and when required. Any one violating Him would be pay dearly for

> his

> > offence .

> >

> > 4. If Lord Guruvayoorappan wanted Yesudas to enter Guruvayoor

> > temple , the Lord Himself would have arranged for it .

> >

> > 5. Yesudas is a great singer and he has many good qualities .

> > However, he is not a not a Hindu . Yesudas is actually a

> > Christian believer and his wife and children too follow Christian

> > faith . But unlike other Christians , Yesudas worships

> > Guruvayoorappan also as One of the forms of God . For sure ,

> > Guruvayoorappan is not his Upasana-moorti (Principal deity) . On

> His

> > part, the merciful Guruvayoorappan has generously rewarded

> Yesudas ,

> > for whatever bhakti towards Him.

> >

> > 6. On the other hand , the Lord & #8217;s favourite devotee-singer

> Chembai

> > Vaidayanatha Bhagavartar ( Guru of yesudas) was fully loyal to

> the

> > Lord ; and he surrendered most of his earnings for the service of

> the

> > Lord .Gurvayoorappan interacted with Chembai on a personal level

> > (Listed here below some true incidents taken from the biography

> of

> > Chemabai by LRV ) .

> >

> > MIRACULOUS TREATMENT BY GURUVAYOORAPPAN ( 1931)

> >

> > In the year 1931 on an Ekadasi day , Chembai was about to commence

> a

> > music concert in the presence of King Samutiri at Calicut . Just

> > before starting the concert, there was a sudden change in his

> voice

> > and he could not even speak. It was diagnosed as a chronic throat

> > ailment and frantic treatments followed . Unfortunately , in spite

> of

> > continuing for a full year , all the high-tech treatments failed

> to

> > produce any difference .

> >

> > A heartbroken Chembai finally came to Guruvayoor temple and stood

> > before the Lord of Guruvayur with tears in his eyes, asking, OH

> LORD!

> > HAVE YOU FORSAKEN ME TO THIS EXTENT, SO THAT YOU CANNOT EVEN BEAR

> TO

> > HEAR MY VOICE RECITE A VERSE IN YOUR PRAISE. Suddenly an unknown

> > Brhamin reached there and after prescribing the formula of a new

> > herbal medicine to Chembai, left unnoticed. This particular

> medicine

> > was quickly prepared at the Poomulli Mana. Soon after taking

> this

> > medicine, Chembai & #8217;s ailment was cured. His voice became

> better than

> > ever before. The restoration of his voice was by the grace of Sree

> > Guruvayurappan .

> >

> > After this miracle, Chembai took a vow to sing in front of Sree

> > Guruvayoorppan on every Sukla paksham & #8217; Ekadasi day .

> >

> > POWER OF FAITH [1939]

> >

> > Chembai was about to start a performance at the palace in

> Kallikotai.

> > Suddenly he discovered that his voice was 'frozen'. He was puzzled

> > since he had no problem of any kind earlier that day. The sound of

> > the tambura sruti seemed to gain in volume as Chembai pondered the

> > reason. Suddenly, a question arose in his mind. He asked someone

> > seated nearby whether it was Sukla paksham after the new moon. This

> > was the month of Kartika and it was Chembai's vow to offer

> musical

> > prayers at the Sree Krishna temple in Guruvayur on the Ekadasi day

> > of the 'sukla paksham' in the month of Kartika every year ( As

> > thanksgiving to Lord Sree Krishna for curing his illness) .

> >

> > When a reference to an almanac confirmed that it was Sukla paksham

> > Ekadasi, Chembai explained the matter to the host and requested

> > permission and help to go to Guruvayoor and fulfill his commitment.

> > The host obliged. Chembai speeded to Guruvayoor in a car, offered

> his

> > apologies and prayers to Sree Krishna.

> >

> > He had no problem singing; he had recovered his voice fully. He

> sang

> > many songs and long until he was satisfied that the Lord had

> forgiven

> > his lapse.

> >

> > He sang at Kallikkotai the next evening, without any problem.

> >

> > THE SALVATION (16-OCTOBER-1974)

> >

> > Poozhikunnam Sri Krishna temple is situated on the banks of the

> > Nila river. After finishing the music concert there, Chembai said

> > to his aides : PLEASE TAKE ME TO THE SANCTUM SANCTORUM .Two people

> > held his hands and led him to the door of the sanctum.

> >

> > He sat down on the floor, shut his eyes, and prayed for a few

> > minutes. Then he called out to the deity in a supplicating tone:

> > KRISHNA! GURUVAYOORAPPA ! I AM 80. YOU HAVE FULFILLED ALL MY

> DESIRES.

> > WHY DO YOU STILL MAKE ME GO ABOUT WITH THIS BODY? WHY DON'T YOU

> CALL

> > ME [TO YOU]?

> >

> > When he got up, after receiving the prasadam, and giving dakshina

> to

> > the priest, Rama Marar said:

> >

> > Bhagavatar will live for the full span of 125 years.

> >

> > Chembai laughed aloud and retorted : You don't poke your head in

> it.

> > All is settled between me and Guruvayoorappan.

> >

> > He returned to his friend O.M.V's nearby residence. He washed his

> > feet and face, and sat down for prayers in the verandah. After a

> few

> > minutes, it was noticed that his head was sliding to one side.

> > Somebody supported him, and slowly eased him down to lie on the

> > floor. He was perspiring profusely. Neelakantan Namboodiripad, who

> > knows Marana lakshana [signs of death] went near to examine him. He

> > looked only for a few seconds, and called out: " Everything is over

> > for Bhagavatar. "

> >

> > An APPEAL - The religious matters of Vedic Religion must be left

> > alone to those faithful Hindus who live according to Vedic

> > scriptures . If & #8216;faithless Hindus & #8217; continue to tamper

> with Vedas,

> > India's end is not far away.

> >

> > OM NAMO NARAYANAYA NAMAH!!!

> >

> > A bhakta .

> >

> >

> > To:-hindushaktikerala

> > - " Vandemataram ....... " <bharathsevak>

> > Date:-Wed, 25 Jan 2006 04

> > Subject:-Re: Yesudas !

> >

> > I too agree with Jinesh, the hurdles late Kalamandalam Hyderali

> > faced during his younger days and the people who oppose Yesudas is

> > something not to be encouraged. Instead of making their mind enter

> > into the world of Universal religion our orthodox people are

> driving

> > them out and creating hatred in their mind about Hindutva

> >

> >

> >

> --

> --

> > - " Jagdos larikker " <jlarikker

> > Date:-Tue, 24 Jan 2006 18:19:29 -0800 (PST)

> > Subject:-Re: Yesudas !

> >

> > I agree with Jinesh.

> >

> > Our religion and culture has accepted everyone with an open heart -

> > this had had good and bad results.

> >

> > however in the current scenario, we should encourage more and more

> > non hindus to believe, accept and adopt the hindu religion. so

> should

> > we also encourage our youth to get more religious, which i think

> they

> > are getting to.

> >

> > Pranam

> > Jagdos

> >

> --

> --

> > Jinesh <kbjinesh> wrote:

> >

> > The law that no non-Hindu can enter Guruvayur Temple is a law by

> the

> > Devaswam board, Guruvayurappan didn't make it. Denial of a believer

> > in a temple is the biggest sin a Hindu can do, either on political

> or

> > on religious reasons.

> >

> > The argument of the author in Kesari is childish. We all know that

> > Yesudas visits Sabarimala every year, that is not based on any song

> > he sang. He visits Mookambika every year; it is not for fame. His

> > devotion to Guruvayurappan is much more sincere than some of our

> > politicians show. It may be bigger than any one of us has. Changing

> > religion officially will offend the Christians, which of course is

> > not fair from his side (though Hindus will be happy by that). On

> the

> > contrary, we have no hesitation to accept the donations by non-

> Hindus

> > to temples, which we seldom talk about!

> > On one side, people are converting Hindus to other religions. On

> the

> > other, we are denying others to enter temples, just because they

> > don't have a certificate to 'prove' their belief! The question of

> > allowing Yesudas in to Guruvayur temple is not the matter of

> > converting one Christian to Hindu religion by certificate, it is a

> > matter of believes. I think then there is no reason to deny him.

> >

> > If that is not the case, we are not talking about the religion, we

> > are talking politics, which is unfair!

> >

> > Regards,

> > Jinesh.

> >

> >

> --

> --

> >

> >

> >

> >

> >

> >

> >

> >

> >

> >

> >

> >

> >

> > Om Namo Narayanaya:

> >

[Guest guest]

Whoever is born as a Hindu is only Hindu. Can some one give sastric evidence for

this statement??? Simply making statements without reference to sastras is

non-sense.

 

The lord says in bhagavad gita mamaivamse jiva. Every one is his amsa. We have

jati based on birth but one falls out of the birth right if he gives up the

duties and becomes a pancama. This is the case with most of us. Whether one is

by birth a pancama or becomes one by action, he is still an amsa of the lord. In

that sense, what to speak of Christians, Muslims etc. even plants and animals

are his amsa only. The only way we can divide people in to communities by their

respective actions and cosnciousness.

 

Krishna Prasad <rkrishp99

guruvayur

Friday, January 27, 2006 8:24:29 AM

Re: [Guruvayur/Guruvayoor] Fw - Beware of Anti-Vedic Moves in

Guruvayoor .

 

Hari OM!

 

Dear all,

 

Whoever born as a Hindu is only a Hindu, and the religious practice

differs there is no concept of conversion in Hinduism. And we can say

others who live the way as per the vedic scriptures is practicing

Hinduism that is all. Taking Birth in our great religion in itself is

a privilege given by Lord Guruvayurappan.

 

We do not need a Frank Morale to say to us, We have our great Rishis

and also our sages like Swami Vivekanandan etc...

 

What ever the Lord Guruvayurappan does is best for that period of time

and space.in that soceity even the one who can question it, is doing

itself because of his power leela, so surrendering to HIS lotus feet.

 

 

With Love & OM!

 

Krishna Prasad

 

On 1/27/06, krishnanujan <krishnanujan wrote:

> Vinod,

> I agree with you.

> This issue is for the respective temple authorities to deal with, as

> they deem appropriate. We laymen have very limited knowledge about

> these matters and we are not competent to pass verdict on this or to

> criticise the religious practices of Guruvayoor temple. Another

> example is the Shree Padmanabha Swamy Temple at Trivandrum. With all

> due respect to Yesudas and individuals like him, singing praises of

> Sree Guruvayoorappan, or showing loyalty ( and belief) to Hinduism or

> being student of Chembai is not sufficient qualification to get

> entry into these temples.

> Dr Frank Morales is a highly respected authority on Hinduism. Let's

> see what he has to written about it.

>

> PS

> It is not my intention to prolong this discussion but to throw some

> light on this issue.

>

> Jai Shree Krishna !

> Krishnanujan

>

> ---Who is a Hindu?

> from Dr. Frank Morales

>

> When the question of who is a Hindu is discussed today, we get a

> multitude of confused and contradictory answers from both Hindu

> laypersons and from Hindu leaders. That we have such a difficult time

> understanding the answer to even so fundamental a question as " who is

> a Hindu? " is a starkly sad indicator of the lack of knowledge in the

> Hindu community today.

> Common Answers

> Some of the more simplistic answers to this question include: Anyone

> born in India is automatically a Hindu (the ethnicity fallacy), if

> your parents are Hindu, then you are Hindu (the familial argument),

> if you are born into a certain caste, then you are Hindu (the genetic

> inheritance model), if you believe in reincarnation, then you are

> Hindu (forgetting that many non-Hindu religions share at least some

> of the beliefs of Hinduism), if you practice any religion originating

> from India, then you are a Hindu (the national origin fallacy).

>

>

> The Real Answer

> The real answer to this question has already been conclusively

> answered by the ancient sages of Hinduism, and is actually much

> simpler to ascertain than we would guess. The two primary factors

> that distinguish the individual uniqueness of the great world

> religious traditions are a) the scriptural authority upon which the

> tradition is based, and b) the fundamental religious tenet(s) that it

> espouses. If we ask the question what is a Jew?, for example, the

> answer is: someone who accepts the Torah as their scriptural guide

> and believes in the monotheistic concept of God espoused in these

> scriptures. What is a Christian? - a person who accepts the Gospels

> as their scriptural guide and believes that Jesus is the incarnate

> God who died for their sins. What is a Muslim? - someone who accepts

> the Qur'an as their scriptural guide, and believes that there is no

> God but Allah, and that Mohammed is his prophet.

>

> Scriptural Authority

> In general, what determines whether a person is a follower of any

> particular religion is whether or not they accept, and attempt to

> live by, the scriptural authority of that religion. This is no less

> true of Hinduism than it is of any other religion on earth. Thus, the

> question of what is a Hindu is similarly very easily answered.

>

> The Definition

> By definition, a Hindu is an individual who accepts as authoritative

> the religious guidance of the Vedic scriptures, and who strives to

> live in accordance with Dharma, God's divine laws as revealed in the

> Vedic scriptures.

>

> Only If You Accept the Vedas

> In keeping with this standard definition, all of the Hindu thinkers

> of the six traditional schools of Hindu philosophy (Shad-darshanas)

> insisted on the acceptance of the scriptural authority of the Vedas

> (shabda-pramana) as the primary criterion for distinguishing a Hindu

> from a non-Hindu, as well as distinguishing overtly Hindu

> philosophical positions from non-Hindu ones. It has been the

> historically accepted standard that, if you accept the Vedas (and by

> extension Bhagavad Gita, Puranas, etc.) as your scriptural authority,

> and lived your life in accordance with the Dharmic principles of the

> Vedas, you are then a Hindu. Thus, an Indian who rejects the Veda is

> obviously not a Hindu. While an American, Russian, Indonesian or

> Indian who does accept the Veda obviously is a Hindu.

>

>

> ******************

>

> Jai Shree Krishna !

>

> In guruvayur , " PS, Vinod K \(GE Infra, Energy\) "

>

> <vinod.ps@g...> wrote:

> >

> > !! Sri Rama Jayam !!

> >

> > Dear All,

> >

> > This is a highly sensitive issue.

> > A debate on this will run long & I hope there will not be any

> positive outcome.

> > We have so many other things to share, discuss & decide.

> > Whether Yesudas or any other non-hindu be allowed or not to enter

> GURUVAYUR temple premises is beyond all our terrestrial abilities.

> > Guruvayur temple is based on certain vedic codes of conduct &

> administrational practices.

> > No body should challenge those as far as communal harmony &

> preserving cultural heritage is concerned.

> > It is exactly like we decide maintaining our house-hold activities

> irrespective of what our neighbors do or do not.

> > I am not trying to support any one's voice here.

> > Hence, leave the decision to Sri Guruvayurappan & may not try to

> raise such talks in future again.

> > Our GURUVAYURAPPAN is 'Sarvasakshi'.

> > We must believe that his decisions are the most superior ones.

> >

> > Let us all hope for the best.

> >

> > Sarve Bhavantu sukhinaha ...

> >

> > HARE KRISHNA

> > HARE RAMA

> >

> >

> >

> >

> > guruvayur [guruvayur ]On

> > Behalf Of krishnadaya

> > Thursday, January 26, 2006 4:57 PM

> > guruvayur

> > [Guruvayur/Guruvayoor] Fw - Beware of Anti-Vedic Moves in

> > Guruvayoor .

> >

> >

> > Please find below, an interesting article published recetly in a

> > devotional group .

> >

> >

> > Dear all,

> >

> > As a humble Hindu-devotee, I am shocked to see that some

> > opportunistic Hindus are trying to force the entry of non-Hindus

> > like Yesudas inside Guruvayoor temple . They appear to be following

> > the Christian culture where the Idol is inert and everything is

> > decided by the clergy and influential men.

> >

> > It is an absolute truth that, Sree Krishna & #8217;s deity in the

> Guruvayoor

> > temple is Living God . The Lord doesn & #8217;t require His duties

> to be

> > performed by mortal men .

> >

> > In this regard , please note the following :

> >

> > 1. Lord Sri Krishna is Sattva-guna personified and His worship

> > in deity-form is different from that of other Devatas. The

> > functioning of the sacred Guruvayoor temple is based on the

> > procedures established by Aadi Sankara. Sree Guruvayoorappan had

> > instructed him personally to put in place, necessary systems to

> > ensure His constant presence on the Deity. The related rituals and

> > rules are unique and applicable only for Guruvayoor temple .

> >

> > 2. According to the above, the decision of authorized Tantri (

> > Puzhakkkal Chennar Illam & #8217;s Senior most Namboodirippad) is

> the final

> > word in all matters concerning the Guruvayoor temple. This

> authority

> > has been confirmed by Supreme Court of India. Numerous lawsuits

> were

> > filed by publicity-crazy, un-believers asking for entry of no-

> Hindus

> > in Guruvayoor temple but all of them were dismissed . Recently, one

> > such demonic Hindu was ridiculed by the Calicut court, for raising

> > an irrelevant issue ( seeking entry of non-Hindus) for the sake of

> > publicity.

> >

> > 3. Guruvayoorappan is not a passive Deity . The Lord is in full

> > control of the temple . He has systems in place like instructions

> > to Tantri / Priests during dreams (Swapna-darsana) , revelation

> > during 'Devaprasna' etc, to convey His additional instructions, as

> > and when required. Any one violating Him would be pay dearly for

> his

> > offence .

> >

> > 4. If Lord Guruvayoorappan wanted Yesudas to enter Guruvayoor

> > temple , the Lord Himself would have arranged for it .

> >

> > 5. Yesudas is a great singer and he has many good qualities .

> > However, he is not a not a Hindu . Yesudas is actually a

> > Christian believer and his wife and children too follow Christian

> > faith . But unlike other Christians , Yesudas worships

> > Guruvayoorappan also as One of the forms of God . For sure ,

> > Guruvayoorappan is not his Upasana-moorti (Principal deity) . On

> His

> > part, the merciful Guruvayoorappan has generously rewarded

> Yesudas ,

> > for whatever bhakti towards Him.

> >

> > 6. On the other hand , the Lord & #8217;s favourite devotee-singer

> Chembai

> > Vaidayanatha Bhagavartar ( Guru of yesudas) was fully loyal to

> the

> > Lord ; and he surrendered most of his earnings for the service of

> the

> > Lord .Gurvayoorappan interacted with Chembai on a personal level

> > (Listed here below some true incidents taken from the biography

> of

> > Chemabai by LRV ) .

> >

> > MIRACULOUS TREATMENT BY GURUVAYOORAPPAN ( 1931)

> >

> > In the year 1931 on an Ekadasi day , Chembai was about to commence

> a

> > music concert in the presence of King Samutiri at Calicut . Just

> > before starting the concert, there was a sudden change in his

> voice

> > and he could not even speak. It was diagnosed as a chronic throat

> > ailment and frantic treatments followed . Unfortunately , in spite

> of

> > continuing for a full year , all the high-tech treatments failed

> to

> > produce any difference .

> >

> > A heartbroken Chembai finally came to Guruvayoor temple and stood

> > before the Lord of Guruvayur with tears in his eyes, asking, OH

> LORD!

> > HAVE YOU FORSAKEN ME TO THIS EXTENT, SO THAT YOU CANNOT EVEN BEAR

> TO

> > HEAR MY VOICE RECITE A VERSE IN YOUR PRAISE. Suddenly an unknown

> > Brhamin reached there and after prescribing the formula of a new

> > herbal medicine to Chembai, left unnoticed. This particular

> medicine

> > was quickly prepared at the Poomulli Mana. Soon after taking

> this

> > medicine, Chembai & #8217;s ailment was cured. His voice became

> better than

> > ever before. The restoration of his voice was by the grace of Sree

> > Guruvayurappan .

> >

> > After this miracle, Chembai took a vow to sing in front of Sree

> > Guruvayoorppan on every Sukla paksham & #8217; Ekadasi day .

> >

> > POWER OF FAITH [1939]

> >

> > Chembai was about to start a performance at the palace in

> Kallikotai.

> > Suddenly he discovered that his voice was 'frozen'. He was puzzled

> > since he had no problem of any kind earlier that day. The sound of

> > the tambura sruti seemed to gain in volume as Chembai pondered the

> > reason. Suddenly, a question arose in his mind. He asked someone

> > seated nearby whether it was Sukla paksham after the new moon. This

> > was the month of Kartika and it was Chembai's vow to offer

> musical

> > prayers at the Sree Krishna temple in Guruvayur on the Ekadasi day

> > of the 'sukla paksham' in the month of Kartika every year ( As

> > thanksgiving to Lord Sree Krishna for curing his illness) .

> >

> > When a reference to an almanac confirmed that it was Sukla paksham

> > Ekadasi, Chembai explained the matter to the host and requested

> > permission and help to go to Guruvayoor and fulfill his commitment.

> > The host obliged. Chembai speeded to Guruvayoor in a car, offered

> his

> > apologies and prayers to Sree Krishna.

> >

> > He had no problem singing; he had recovered his voice fully. He

> sang

> > many songs and long until he was satisfied that the Lord had

> forgiven

> > his lapse.

> >

> > He sang at Kallikkotai the next evening, without any problem.

> >

> > THE SALVATION (16-OCTOBER-1974)

> >

> > Poozhikunnam Sri Krishna temple is situated on the banks of the

> > Nila river. After finishing the music concert there, Chembai said

> > to his aides : PLEASE TAKE ME TO THE SANCTUM SANCTORUM .Two people

> > held his hands and led him to the door of the sanctum.

> >

> > He sat down on the floor, shut his eyes, and prayed for a few

> > minutes. Then he called out to the deity in a supplicating tone:

> > KRISHNA! GURUVAYOORAPPA ! I AM 80. YOU HAVE FULFILLED ALL MY

> DESIRES.

> > WHY DO YOU STILL MAKE ME GO ABOUT WITH THIS BODY? WHY DON'T YOU

> CALL

> > ME [TO YOU]?

> >

> > When he got up, after receiving the prasadam, and giving dakshina

> to

> > the priest, Rama Marar said:

> >

> > Bhagavatar will live for the full span of 125 years.

> >

> > Chembai laughed aloud and retorted : You don't poke your head in

> it.

> > All is settled between me and Guruvayoorappan.

> >

> > He returned to his friend O.M.V's nearby residence. He washed his

> > feet and face, and sat down for prayers in the verandah. After a

> few

> > minutes, it was noticed that his head was sliding to one side.

> > Somebody supported him, and slowly eased him down to lie on the

> > floor. He was perspiring profusely. Neelakantan Namboodiripad, who

> > knows Marana lakshana [signs of death] went near to examine him. He

> > looked only for a few seconds, and called out: " Everything is over

> > for Bhagavatar. "

> >

> > An APPEAL - The religious matters of Vedic Religion must be left

> > alone to those faithful Hindus who live according to Vedic

> > scriptures . If & #8216;faithless Hindus & #8217; continue to tamper

> with Vedas,

> > India's end is not far away.

> >

> > OM NAMO NARAYANAYA NAMAH!!!

> >

> > A bhakta .

> >

> >

> > To:-hindushaktikerala

> > - " Vandemataram ....... " <bharathsevak>

> > Date:-Wed, 25 Jan 2006 04

> > Subject:-Re: Yesudas !

> >

> > I too agree with Jinesh, the hurdles late Kalamandalam Hyderali

> > faced during his younger days and the people who oppose Yesudas is

> > something not to be encouraged. Instead of making their mind enter

> > into the world of Universal religion our orthodox people are

> driving

> > them out and creating hatred in their mind about Hindutva

> >

> >

> >

> --

> --

> > - " Jagdos larikker " <jlarikker

> > Date:-Tue, 24 Jan 2006 18:19:29 -0800 (PST)

> > Subject:-Re: Yesudas !

> >

> > I agree with Jinesh.

> >

> > Our religion and culture has accepted everyone with an open heart -

> > this had had good and bad results.

> >

> > however in the current scenario, we should encourage more and more

> > non hindus to believe, accept and adopt the hindu religion. so

> should

> > we also encourage our youth to get more religious, which i think

> they

> > are getting to.

> >

> > Pranam

> > Jagdos

> >

> --

> --

> > Jinesh <kbjinesh> wrote:

> >

> > The law that no non-Hindu can enter Guruvayur Temple is a law by

> the

> > Devaswam board, Guruvayurappan didn't make it. Denial of a believer

> > in a temple is the biggest sin a Hindu can do, either on political

> or

> > on religious reasons.

> >

> > The argument of the author in Kesari is childish. We all know that

> > Yesudas visits Sabarimala every year, that is not based on any song

> > he sang. He visits Mookambika every year; it is not for fame. His

> > devotion to Guruvayurappan is much more sincere than some of our

> > politicians show. It may be bigger than any one of us has. Changing

> > religion officially will offend the Christians, which of course is

> > not fair from his side (though Hindus will be happy by that). On

> the

> > contrary, we have no hesitation to accept the donations by non-

> Hindus

> > to temples, which we seldom talk about!

> > On one side, people are converting Hindus to other religions. On

> the

> > other, we are denying others to enter temples, just because they

> > don't have a certificate to 'prove' their belief! The question of

> > allowing Yesudas in to Guruvayur temple is not the matter of

> > converting one Christian to Hindu religion by certificate, it is a

> > matter of believes. I think then there is no reason to deny him.

> >

> > If that is not the case, we are not talking about the religion, we

> > are talking politics, which is unfair!

> >

> > Regards,

> > Jinesh.

> >

> >

> --

> --

> >

> >

> >

> >

> >

> >

> >

> >

> >

> >

> >

> >

> >

> > Om Namo Narayanaya:

> >

[Guest guest]

Hare Krishna ! Guruvayurappa !

I agree with Rajaram's views on this topic. Unless we

see everyone as equal, we are still thinking that we

are this body - Hindu, Muslim, Christian, American,

Indian - all these designations end with the body. And

as long as we delve more into these differences, we

will move more and more into the bodily concept of

life and forget our duties as Spirit Souls.

 

It is easy to make loose statements on sentimental

grounds; but we need to be scripturally correct in

what we say - we should have backing from the vedic

scriptures.

 

Let us not be fanatic about HINDUISM - even the word

HINDU has ABSOLUTELY NO scriptural significance - it

was a word mispronounced after all by people on the

other side of the river Sindhu. There is no point

being fanatic about our birth also - I shall quote

here a verse from Narayaneeyam which will shed more

light to all on this topic:

 

Narayaneeyam - Dasakam 91, Verse 2:

" O All pervading Being! Whatever I do with body, mind

and words prompted by Your power, all that, I offer at

Your feet, O Supreme Spirit. Even if a person be of

low birth (from a family of dog eaters), if he has

resigned his mind, power of action, speech, senses and

vital energies at Your feet, he sanctifies the worlds.

But vain, indeed is the pride of the Brahmana in his

high birth if his mind is turned away from You. "

 

 

Here Bhattathiri openly admits his desire to become a

first class devotee of Sri Guruvayurappan. He mentions

here that a person completely absorbed in Sri Krishna

sanctifies the whole world irrespective of his birth -

and therefore Bhattathiri himself is surrendering

everything to the Lord. This is in line with the

statement from the Srimad Bhagavatam - tirthi kurvanti

tirthani - actually, the devotees of the Lord sanctify

the places of pilgrimage - We must learn to recognize

and worship such devotees of the Lord.

sajjanangaLe kaaNunna nErathu

lajja kooDAthe veeNu namikkaNam. (Jnanapana)

 

What to speak of a mere Hindu, even being born in a

Brahmana family is not in itself a great qualification

unless our activities are directed towards pleasing

the Supreme Lord. The Lord is equal towards all

beings.

 

This sloka is ample evidence for all of us devotees

of Sri Guruvayurappan to understand that the issue of

BIRTH is NOT, i repeat NOT very important as far as

the Lord is concerned.

 

I may remind the famous words of Poonthanam in his

Jnanapana:

brahmanyam kondu kunthichu kunthichu

brahmaavum enikkokkaa ennum chilar.

(Intoxicated by their brahmin-ISM, they consider even

Lord Brahma to be inferior to them)

 

To give an opportunity to all people to worship the

Supreme Lord is certainly not Anti Vedic - the aim of

vedas is to understand Lord Krishna (Vedais cha

sarvair aham eva vedyah - Of all the Vedas, I am to be

known - Bhagavad Gita). So we would be bringing more

and more people to this end.

 

Once again, do not try to restrict and limit Sri

Guruvayurappan to be one among 33 Crore Hindu Gods -

Lord Guruvayurappan has amply demonstrated that He is

not just one among many Gods - but is indeed the

Supreme Lord of all that be. He is the Supreme Lord

and Controller for all, irrespective of caste or

religion or species (remember the Maraprabhu

incident?).

 

 

Someone had commented that Hindus are not supposed to

eat meat - but that is not the case in practise -

majority of Hindus eat meat and come to the temple.

Now, can you imagine why Christians and Muslims were

restricted in the past? They were chandalas and

yavanas - outcastes as far as Vedic civilization was

concerned - they ate meat. But, now Hindus themselves

are below Chandala and Yavana !!! and Christians and

Muslims are getting attracted to devotional practises

to Lord Guruvayurappan - I personally know such people

who pray from a distance outside Guruvayur temple and

often ask me to make some offerings to the Lord in

their name. I even came across a few Christian friends

who sneaked into Guruvayur temple and had darshan -

they were full of BLISS !!! So many of them told me -

why can't they open out the temple to us also ????

 

The so called Hindu religion has degraded and has

become a hodge-podge of " do whatever that will make

you feel good " philosophies. We must face the reality

instead of living in a dream world. Let us not be

Hypocritic and let us learn to accept the harsh

reality!!

 

Do not try to distance people from God by being

fanatic. Fanaticism will ultimately spell doom for its

practicioners.

 

But, who cares for what the Lord likes or prefers,

anyway ??????

-sriram

========

Smartavya satatam Vishnu

vismartavyo na jatucit

sarve vidhi-nishedhah syuh

etayor eva kinkarah.

" Always remember Vishnu. Never forget Vishnu. All

the rules and regulations (Do's and Dont's) are

subservient to these two rules. "

===============================================================

 

 

--- Rajaram Venkataramani <v_raja_ram

wrote:

 

> Whoever is born as a Hindu is only Hindu. Can some

> one give sastric evidence for this statement???

> Simply making statements without reference to

> sastras is non-sense.

>

> The lord says in bhagavad gita mamaivamse jiva.

> Every one is his amsa. We have jati based on birth

> but one falls out of the birth right if he gives up

> the duties and becomes a pancama. This is the case

> with most of us. Whether one is by birth a pancama

> or becomes one by action, he is still an amsa of the

> lord. In that sense, what to speak of Christians,

> Muslims etc. even plants and animals are his amsa

> only. The only way we can divide people in to

> communities by their respective actions and

> cosnciousness.

>

> Krishna Prasad <rkrishp99

> guruvayur

> Friday, January 27, 2006 8:24:29 AM

> Re: [Guruvayur/Guruvayoor] Fw - Beware of

> Anti-Vedic Moves in Guruvayoor .

>

> Hari OM!

>

> Dear all,

>

> Whoever born as a Hindu is only a Hindu, and the

> religious practice

> differs there is no concept of conversion in

> Hinduism. And we can say

> others who live the way as per the vedic scriptures

> is practicing

> Hinduism that is all. Taking Birth in our great

> religion in itself is

> a privilege given by Lord Guruvayurappan.

>

> We do not need a Frank Morale to say to us, We have

> our great Rishis

> and also our sages like Swami Vivekanandan etc...

>

> What ever the Lord Guruvayurappan does is best for

> that period of time

> and space.in that soceity even the one who can

> question it, is doing

> itself because of his power leela, so surrendering

> to HIS lotus feet.

>

>

> With Love & OM!

>

> Krishna Prasad

>

> On 1/27/06, krishnanujan <krishnanujan

> wrote:

> > Vinod,

> > I agree with you.

> > This issue is for the respective temple

> authorities to deal with, as

> > they deem appropriate. We laymen have very limited

> knowledge about

> > these matters and we are not competent to pass

> verdict on this or to

> > criticise the religious practices of Guruvayoor

> temple. Another

> > example is the Shree Padmanabha Swamy Temple at

> Trivandrum. With all

> > due respect to Yesudas and individuals like him,

> singing praises of

> > Sree Guruvayoorappan, or showing loyalty ( and

> belief) to Hinduism or

> > being student of Chembai is not sufficient

> qualification to get

> > entry into these temples.

> > Dr Frank Morales is a highly respected authority

> on Hinduism. Let's

> > see what he has to written about it.

> >

> > PS

> > It is not my intention to prolong this discussion

> but to throw some

> > light on this issue.

> >

> > Jai Shree Krishna !

> > Krishnanujan

> >

> > ---Who is a Hindu?

> > from Dr. Frank Morales

> >

> > When the question of who is a Hindu is discussed

> today, we get a

> > multitude of confused and contradictory answers

> from both Hindu

> > laypersons and from Hindu leaders. That we have

> such a difficult time

> > understanding the answer to even so fundamental a

> question as " who is

> > a Hindu? " is a starkly sad indicator of the lack

> of knowledge in the

> > Hindu community today.

> > Common Answers

> > Some of the more simplistic answers to this

> question include: Anyone

> > born in India is automatically a Hindu (the

> ethnicity fallacy), if

> > your parents are Hindu, then you are Hindu (the

> familial argument),

> > if you are born into a certain caste, then you are

> Hindu (the genetic

> > inheritance model), if you believe in

> reincarnation, then you are

> > Hindu (forgetting that many non-Hindu religions

> share at least some

> > of the beliefs of Hinduism), if you practice any

> religion originating

> > from India, then you are a Hindu (the national

> origin fallacy).

> >

> >

> > The Real Answer

> > The real answer to this question has already been

> conclusively

> > answered by the ancient sages of Hinduism, and is

> actually much

> > simpler to ascertain than we would guess. The two

> primary factors

> > that distinguish the individual uniqueness of the

> great world

> > religious traditions are a) the scriptural

> authority upon which the

> > tradition is based, and b) the fundamental

> religious tenet(s) that it

> > espouses. If we ask the question what is a Jew?,

> for example, the

> > answer is: someone who accepts the Torah as their

> scriptural guide

> > and believes in the monotheistic concept of God

> espoused in these

> > scriptures. What is a Christian? - a person who

> accepts the Gospels

> > as their scriptural guide and believes that Jesus

> is the incarnate

> > God who died for their sins. What is a Muslim? -

> someone who accepts

> > the Qur'an as their scriptural guide, and believes

> that there is no

> > God but Allah, and that Mohammed is his prophet.

> >

> > Scriptural Authority

> > In general, what determines whether a person is a

> follower of any

> > particular religion is whether or not they accept,

> and attempt to

> > live by, the scriptural authority of that

> religion. This is no less

> > true of Hinduism than it is of any other religion

> on earth. Thus, the

> > question of what is a Hindu is similarly very

> easily answered.

> >

> > The Definition

> > By definition, a Hindu is an individual who

> accepts as authoritative

> > the religious guidance of the Vedic scriptures,

> and who strives to

> > live in accordance with Dharma, God's divine laws

> as revealed in the

> > Vedic scriptures.

> >

> > Only If You Accept the Vedas

> > In keeping with this standard definition, all of

> the Hindu thinkers

> > of the six traditional schools of Hindu philosophy

> (Shad-darshanas)

> > insisted on the acceptance of the scriptural

> authority of the Vedas

> > (shabda-pramana) as the primary criterion for

> distinguishing a Hindu

> > from a non-Hindu, as well as distinguishing

> overtly Hindu

> > philosophical positions from non-Hindu ones. It

> has been the

> > historically accepted standard that, if you accept

> the Vedas (and by

> > extension Bhagavad Gita, Puranas, etc.) as your

> scriptural authority,

> > and lived your life in accordance with the Dharmic

> principles of the

> > Vedas, you are then a Hindu. Thus, an Indian who

> rejects the Veda is

> > obviously not a Hindu. While an American, Russian,

> Indonesian or

> > Indian who does accept the Veda obviously is a

> Hindu.

> >

> >

> > ******************

> >

> > Jai Shree Krishna !

> >

> > In guruvayur , " PS, Vinod K \(GE

> Infra,

=== message truncated ===

 

 

 

 

 

 

[Guest guest]

OM Narayana,

I have been following the Topic.

Most reply to me it seems is from freinds who have not

seen any other religion dealing.

Go to any part of the Arab world.You will know.

have you seen it the following way.

For a a msulim he is muslim first then a Human,

To a chirstian first Christian and then a Human.

for Hindu he is a human and then a Hindu.(I am a

proud HINDU).

tkae the Kerala istance.

A muslim communist he will not miss a Friday

prayer.(It is his personal affairs)

A christian cannot miss his SUNDAY MASS foe the he

will be out of his EDAVAKA.( Dont interfere in

personal matters).

A hindu goes to a temple or give her daughter in

marraige in HIndu right. He is doing things agianst a

comunist.And you will find all

making a protest march.

for communist doesnot beleive in GOD.

(DEWASWAM BOARD membership is a different story.A

comunist can be a minister or a board member).Lot of

money to loose out?

No one to be blamed we Hindus try to please other and

live for other preaching.

please wake or else you will be left out and soon be a

part of the

second citizen of largest muslim / Christian India.

If they are in majority Hindu will have no say.

And the way things are going it will be around the end

of this centuray.

Communists are no longer communist. they have become

communalists with a deffenite turn to Muslims.

And take any TV channels in Malayalam all are biased.

 

OM Namaho NARAYAN..

 

may guruvayoorappan BLESS all.

 

Unni.

 

 

--- SRIRAM SUBRAMANIAN <abheri wrote:

 

 

 

Hare Krishna ! Guruvayurappa !

I agree with Rajaram's views on this topic. Unless we

see everyone as equal, we are still thinking that we

are this body - Hindu, Muslim, Christian, American,

Indian - all these designations end with the body. And

as long as we delve more into these differences, we

will move more and more into the bodily concept of

life and forget our duties as Spirit Souls.

 

It is easy to make loose statements on sentimental

grounds; but we need to be scripturally correct in

what we say - we should have backing from the vedic

scriptures.

 

Let us not be fanatic about HINDUISM - even the word

HINDU has ABSOLUTELY NO scriptural significance - it

was a word mispronounced after all by people on the

other side of the river Sindhu. There is no point

being fanatic about our birth also - I shall quote

here a verse from Narayaneeyam which will shed more

light to all on this topic:

 

Narayaneeyam - Dasakam 91, Verse 2:

" O All pervading Being! Whatever I do with body, mind

and words prompted by Your power, all that, I offer at

Your feet, O Supreme Spirit. Even if a person be of

low birth (from a family of dog eaters), if he has

resigned his mind, power of action, speech, senses and

vital energies at Your feet, he sanctifies the worlds.

But vain, indeed is the pride of the Brahmana in his

high birth if his mind is turned away from You. "

 

 

Here Bhattathiri openly admits his desire to become a

first class devotee of Sri Guruvayurappan. He mentions

here that a person completely absorbed in Sri Krishna

sanctifies the whole world irrespective of his birth -

and therefore Bhattathiri himself is surrendering

everything to the Lord. This is in line with the

statement from the Srimad Bhagavatam - tirthi kurvanti

tirthani - actually, the devotees of the Lord sanctify

the places of pilgrimage - We must learn to recognize

and worship such devotees of the Lord.

sajjanangaLe kaaNunna nErathu

lajja kooDAthe veeNu namikkaNam. (Jnanapana)

 

What to speak of a mere Hindu, even being born in a

Brahmana family is not in itself a great qualification

unless our activities are directed towards pleasing

the Supreme Lord. The Lord is equal towards all

beings.

 

This sloka is ample evidence for all of us devotees

of Sri Guruvayurappan to understand that the issue of

BIRTH is NOT, i repeat NOT very important as far as

the Lord is concerned.

 

I may remind the famous words of Poonthanam in his

Jnanapana:

brahmanyam kondu kunthichu kunthichu

brahmaavum enikkokkaa ennum chilar.

(Intoxicated by their brahmin-ISM, they consider even

Lord Brahma to be inferior to them)

 

To give an opportunity to all people to worship the

Supreme Lord is certainly not Anti Vedic - the aim of

vedas is to understand Lord Krishna (Vedais cha

sarvair aham eva vedyah - Of all the Vedas, I am to be

known - Bhagavad Gita). So we would be bringing more

and more people to this end.

 

Once again, do not try to restrict and limit Sri

Guruvayurappan to be one among 33 Crore Hindu Gods -

Lord Guruvayurappan has amply demonstrated that He is

not just one among many Gods - but is indeed the

Supreme Lord of all that be. He is the Supreme Lord

and Controller for all, irrespective of caste or

religion or species (remember the Maraprabhu

incident?).

 

 

Someone had commented that Hindus are not supposed to

eat meat - but that is not the case in practise -

majority of Hindus eat meat and come to the temple.

Now, can you imagine why Christians and Muslims were

restricted in the past? They were chandalas and

yavanas - outcastes as far as Vedic civilization was

concerned - they ate meat. But, now Hindus themselves

are below Chandala and Yavana !!! and Christians and

Muslims are getting attracted to devotional practises

to Lord Guruvayurappan - I personally know such people

who pray from a distance outside Guruvayur temple and

often ask me to make some offerings to the Lord in

their name. I even came across a few Christian friends

who sneaked into Guruvayur temple and had darshan -

they were full of BLISS !!! So many of them told me -

why can't they open out the temple to us also ????

 

The so called Hindu religion has degraded and has

become a hodge-podge of " do whatever that will make

you feel good " philosophies. We must face the reality

instead of living in a dream world. Let us not be

Hypocritic and let us learn to accept the harsh

reality!!

 

Do not try to distance people from God by being

fanatic. Fanaticism will ultimately spell doom for its

practicioners.

 

But, who cares for what the Lord likes or prefers,

anyway ??????

-sriram

========

Smartavya satatam Vishnu

vismartavyo na jatucit

sarve vidhi-nishedhah syuh

etayor eva kinkarah.

" Always remember Vishnu. Never forget Vishnu. All

the rules and regulations (Do's and Dont's) are

subservient to these two rules. "

===============================================================

 

 

--- Rajaram Venkataramani <v_raja_ram

wrote:

 

> Whoever is born as a Hindu is only Hindu. Can some

> one give sastric evidence for this statement???

> Simply making statements without reference to

> sastras is non-sense.

>

> The lord says in bhagavad gita mamaivamse jiva.

> Every one is his amsa. We have jati based on birth

> but one falls out of the birth right if he gives up

> the duties and becomes a pancama. This is the case

> with most of us. Whether one is by birth a pancama

> or becomes one by action, he is still an amsa of the

> lord. In that sense, what to speak of Christians,

> Muslims etc. even plants and animals are his amsa

> only. The only way we can divide people in to

> communities by their respective actions and

> cosnciousness.

>

> Krishna Prasad <rkrishp99

> guruvayur

> Friday, January 27, 2006 8:24:29 AM

> Re: [Guruvayur/Guruvayoor] Fw - Beware of

> Anti-Vedic Moves in Guruvayoor .

>

> Hari OM!

>

> Dear all,

>

> Whoever born as a Hindu is only a Hindu, and the

> religious practice

> differs there is no concept of conversion in

> Hinduism. And we can say

> others who live the way as per the vedic scriptures

> is practicing

> Hinduism that is all. Taking Birth in our great

> religion in itself is

> a privilege given by Lord Guruvayurappan.

>

> We do not need a Frank Morale to say to us, We have

> our great Rishis

> and also our sages like Swami Vivekanandan etc...

>

> What ever the Lord Guruvayurappan does is best for

> that period of time

> and space.in that soceity even the one who can

> question it, is doing

> itself because of his power leela, so surrendering

> to HIS lotus feet.

>

>

> With Love & OM!

>

> Krishna Prasad

>

> On 1/27/06, krishnanujan <krishnanujan

> wrote:

> > Vinod,

> > I agree with you.

> > This issue is for the respective temple

> authorities to deal with, as

> > they deem appropriate. We laymen have very limited

> knowledge about

> > these matters and we are not competent to pass

> verdict on this or to

> > criticise the religious practices of Guruvayoor

> temple. Another

> > example is the Shree Padmanabha Swamy Temple at

> Trivandrum. With all

> > due respect to Yesudas and individuals like him,

> singing praises of

> > Sree Guruvayoorappan, or showing loyalty ( and

> belief) to Hinduism or

> > being student of Chembai is not sufficient

> qualification to get

> > entry into these temples.

> > Dr Frank Morales is a highly respected authority

> on Hinduism. Let's

> > see what he has to written about it.

> >

> > PS

> > It is not my intention to prolong this discussion

> but to throw some

> > light on this issue.

> >

> > Jai Shree Krishna !

> > Krishnanujan

> >

> > ---Who is a Hindu?

> > from Dr. Frank Morales

> >

> > When the question of who is a Hindu is discussed

> today, we get a

> > multitude of confused and contradictory answers

> from both Hindu

> > laypersons and from Hindu leaders. That we have

> such a difficult time

> > understanding the answer to even so fundamental a

> question as " who is

> > a Hindu? " is a starkly sad indicator of the lack

> of knowledge in the

> > Hindu community today.

> > Common Answers

> > Some of the more simplistic answers to this

> question include: Anyone

> > born in India is automatically a Hindu (the

> ethnicity fallacy), if

> > your parents are Hindu, then you are Hindu (the

> familial argument),

> > if you are born into a certain caste, then you are

> Hindu (the genetic

> > inheritance model), if you believe in

> reincarnation, then you are

> > Hindu (forgetting that many non-Hindu religions

> share at least some

> > of the beliefs of Hinduism), if you practice any

> religion originating

> > from India, then you are a Hindu (the national

> origin fallacy).

> >

> >

> > The Real Answer

> > The real answer to this question has already been

> conclusively

> > answered by the ancient sages of Hinduism, and is

> actually much

> > simpler to ascertain than we would guess. The two

> primary factors

> > that distinguish the individual uniqueness of the

> great world

> > religious traditions are a) the scriptural

> authority upon which the

> > tradition is based, and b) the fundamental

> religious tenet(s) that it

> > espouses. If we ask the question what is a Jew?,

> for example, the

> > answer is: someone who accepts the Torah as their

> scriptural guide

> > and believes in the monotheistic concept of God

> espoused in these

> > scriptures. What is a Christian? - a person who

> accepts the Gospels

> > as their scriptural guide and believes that Jesus

> is the incarnate

> > God who died for their sins. What is a Muslim? -

> someone who accepts

> > the Qur'an as their scriptural guide, and believes

> that there is no

> > God but Allah, and that Mohammed is his prophet.

> >

> > Scriptural Authority

> > In general, what determines whether a person is a

> follower of any

> > particular religion is whether or not they accept,

> and attempt to

> > live by, the scriptural authority of that

> religion. This is no less

> > true of Hinduism than it is of any other religion

> on earth. Thus, the

> > question of what is a Hindu is similarly very

> easily answered.

> >

> > The Definition

> > By definition, a Hindu is an individual who

> accepts as authoritative

> > the religious guidance of the Vedic scriptures,

> and who strives to

> > live in accordance with Dharma, God's divine laws

> as revealed in the

> > Vedic scriptures.

> >

> > Only If You Accept the Vedas

> > In keeping with this standard definition, all of

> the Hindu thinkers

> > of the six traditional schools of Hindu philosophy

> (Shad-darshanas)

> > insisted on the acceptance of the scriptural

> authority of the Vedas

> > (shabda-pramana) as the primary criterion for

> distinguishing a Hindu

> > from a non-Hindu, as well as distinguishing

> overtly Hindu

> > philosophical positions from non-Hindu ones. It

> has been the

> > historically accepted standard that, if you accept

> the Vedas (and by

> > extension Bhagavad Gita, Puranas, etc.) as your

> scriptural authority,

> > and lived your life in accordance with the Dharmic

> principles of the

> > Vedas, you are then a Hindu. Thus, an Indian who

> rejects the Veda is

> > obviously not a Hindu. While an American, Russian,

> Indonesian or

> > Indian who does accept the Veda obviously is a

> Hindu.

> >

> >

> > ******************

> >

> > Jai Shree Krishna !

> >

> > In guruvayur , " PS, Vinod K \(GE

> Infra,

=== message truncated ===

 

 

 

 

Tired of spam? Mail has the best spam

protection around

 

 

 

 

 

Om Namo Narayanaya:

 

 

 

[Guest guest]

Hari-Om

=======

 

Sri Thomas,

 

I appreciate your views.

It is a relief to know that the real inner meaning of the answers and

explanations of this controversy, as explained in my posting has not

gone un-comprehended.

 

Krishnanujan

Jai Shree Krishna !

 

guruvayur , " A.J.Thomas " <thomasaj1952>

wrote:

>

> Dear Sri Krishnanujan,

>

> I am in total agreement with you on this topic. When the issue of

Mercy Ravi entering Guruvayoor kicked up a controversy, the Tantri of

Guruvayoor Temple had offered some clarifications, which came out in

the papers. What I remember of the statement is that such

restrictions are laid down at the very time of the establishment of

the temple, going by certain tantravidhis, and that this was beyond

the scope of adjudication of any sort. If individuals earn enough

merit to have darshan of Guruvayoorappan, He can even appear to them

in visions; there are any number of such experiences which I have

heard from devotees. In my personal opinion, no real devotee can be

stubborn about such things.

> Om Namo Narayanaya

> A.J.Thomas.

> krishnanujan <krishnanujan> wrote:

> Vinod,

> I agree with you.

> This issue is for the respective temple authorities to deal with,

as

> they deem appropriate. We laymen have very limited knowledge about

> these matters and we are not competent to pass verdict on this or

to

> criticise the religious practices of Guruvayoor temple. Another

> example is the Shree Padmanabha Swamy Temple at Trivandrum. With

all

> due respect to Yesudas and individuals like him, singing praises of

> Sree Guruvayoorappan, or showing loyalty ( and belief) to Hinduism

or

> being student of Chembai is not sufficient qualification to get

> entry into these temples.

> Dr Frank Morales is a highly respected authority on Hinduism. Let's

> see what he has to written about it.

>

> PS

> It is not my intention to prolong this discussion but to throw some

> light on this issue.

>

> Jai Shree Krishna !

> Krishnanujan

>

> ---Who is a Hindu?

> from Dr. Frank Morales

>

> When the question of who is a Hindu is discussed today, we get a

> multitude of confused and contradictory answers from both Hindu

> laypersons and from Hindu leaders. That we have such a difficult

time

> understanding the answer to even so fundamental a question as " who

is

> a Hindu? " is a starkly sad indicator of the lack of knowledge in

the

> Hindu community today.

> Common Answers

> Some of the more simplistic answers to this question include:

Anyone

> born in India is automatically a Hindu (the ethnicity fallacy), if

> your parents are Hindu, then you are Hindu (the familial argument),

> if you are born into a certain caste, then you are Hindu (the

genetic

> inheritance model), if you believe in reincarnation, then you are

> Hindu (forgetting that many non-Hindu religions share at least some

> of the beliefs of Hinduism), if you practice any religion

originating

> from India, then you are a Hindu (the national origin fallacy).

>

>

> The Real Answer

> The real answer to this question has already been conclusively

> answered by the ancient sages of Hinduism, and is actually much

> simpler to ascertain than we would guess. The two primary factors

> that distinguish the individual uniqueness of the great world

> religious traditions are a) the scriptural authority upon which the

> tradition is based, and b) the fundamental religious tenet(s) that

it

> espouses. If we ask the question what is a Jew?, for example, the

> answer is: someone who accepts the Torah as their scriptural guide

> and believes in the monotheistic concept of God espoused in these

> scriptures. What is a Christian? - a person who accepts the Gospels

> as their scriptural guide and believes that Jesus is the incarnate

> God who died for their sins. What is a Muslim? - someone who

accepts

> the Qur'an as their scriptural guide, and believes that there is no

> God but Allah, and that Mohammed is his prophet.

>

> Scriptural Authority

> In general, what determines whether a person is a follower of any

> particular religion is whether or not they accept, and attempt to

> live by, the scriptural authority of that religion. This is no less

> true of Hinduism than it is of any other religion on earth. Thus,

the

> question of what is a Hindu is similarly very easily answered.

>

> The Definition

> By definition, a Hindu is an individual who accepts as

authoritative

> the religious guidance of the Vedic scriptures, and who strives to

> live in accordance with Dharma, God's divine laws as revealed in

the

> Vedic scriptures.

>

> Only If You Accept the Vedas

> In keeping with this standard definition, all of the Hindu thinkers

> of the six traditional schools of Hindu philosophy (Shad-darshanas)

> insisted on the acceptance of the scriptural authority of the Vedas

> (shabda-pramana) as the primary criterion for distinguishing a

Hindu

> from a non-Hindu, as well as distinguishing overtly Hindu

> philosophical positions from non-Hindu ones. It has been the

> historically accepted standard that, if you accept the Vedas (and

by

> extension Bhagavad Gita, Puranas, etc.) as your scriptural

authority,

> and lived your life in accordance with the Dharmic principles of

the

> Vedas, you are then a Hindu. Thus, an Indian who rejects the Veda

is

> obviously not a Hindu. While an American, Russian, Indonesian or

> Indian who does accept the Veda obviously is a Hindu.

>

>

> ******************

>

> Jai Shree Krishna !

>

> In guruvayur , " PS, Vinod K \(GE Infra, Energy\) "

> <vinod.ps@g...> wrote:

> >

> > !! Sri Rama Jayam !!

> >

> > Dear All,

> >

> > This is a highly sensitive issue.

> > A debate on this will run long & I hope there will not be any

> positive outcome.

> > We have so many other things to share, discuss & decide.

> > Whether Yesudas or any other non-hindu be allowed or not to enter

> GURUVAYUR temple premises is beyond all our terrestrial abilities.

> > Guruvayur temple is based on certain vedic codes of conduct &

> administrational practices.

> > No body should challenge those as far as communal harmony &

> preserving cultural heritage is concerned.

> > It is exactly like we decide maintaining our house-hold

activities

> irrespective of what our neighbors do or do not.

> > I am not trying to support any one's voice here.

> > Hence, leave the decision to Sri Guruvayurappan & may not try to

> raise such talks in future again.

> > Our GURUVAYURAPPAN is 'Sarvasakshi'.

> > We must believe that his decisions are the most superior ones.

> >

> > Let us all hope for the best.

> >

> > Sarve Bhavantu sukhinaha ...

> >

> > HARE KRISHNA

> > HARE RAMA

> >

> >

> >

> >

> > guruvayur [guruvayur ]

On

> > Behalf Of krishnadaya

> > Thursday, January 26, 2006 4:57 PM

> > guruvayur

> > [Guruvayur/Guruvayoor] Fw - Beware of Anti-Vedic Moves in

> > Guruvayoor .

> >

> >

> > Please find below, an interesting article published recetly in a

> > devotional group .

> >

> >

> > Dear all,

> >

> > As a humble Hindu-devotee, I am shocked to see that some

> > opportunistic Hindus are trying to force the entry of non-Hindus

> > like Yesudas inside Guruvayoor temple . They appear to be

following

> > the Christian culture where the Idol is inert and everything is

> > decided by the clergy and influential men.

> >

> > It is an absolute truth that, Sree Krishna & #8217;s deity in the

> Guruvayoor

> > temple is Living God . The Lord doesn & #8217;t require His duties

> to be

> > performed by mortal men .

> >

> > In this regard , please note the following :

> >

> > 1. Lord Sri Krishna is Sattva-guna personified and His

worship

> > in deity-form is different from that of other Devatas. The

> > functioning of the sacred Guruvayoor temple is based on the

> > procedures established by Aadi Sankara. Sree Guruvayoorappan had

> > instructed him personally to put in place, necessary systems

to

> > ensure His constant presence on the Deity. The related rituals

and

> > rules are unique and applicable only for Guruvayoor temple .

> >

> > 2. According to the above, the decision of authorized Tantri (

> > Puzhakkkal Chennar Illam & #8217;s Senior most Namboodirippad) is

> the final

> > word in all matters concerning the Guruvayoor temple. This

> authority

> > has been confirmed by Supreme Court of India. Numerous lawsuits

> were

> > filed by publicity-crazy, un-believers asking for entry of no-

> Hindus

> > in Guruvayoor temple but all of them were dismissed . Recently,

one

> > such demonic Hindu was ridiculed by the Calicut court, for

raising

> > an irrelevant issue ( seeking entry of non-Hindus) for the sake

of

> > publicity.

> >

> > 3. Guruvayoorappan is not a passive Deity . The Lord is in full

> > control of the temple . He has systems in place like

instructions

> > to Tantri / Priests during dreams (Swapna-darsana) , revelation

> > during 'Devaprasna' etc, to convey His additional instructions,

as

> > and when required. Any one violating Him would be pay dearly for

> his

> > offence .

> >

> > 4. If Lord Guruvayoorappan wanted Yesudas to enter Guruvayoor

> > temple , the Lord Himself would have arranged for it .

> >

> > 5. Yesudas is a great singer and he has many good qualities .

> > However, he is not a not a Hindu . Yesudas is actually a

> > Christian believer and his wife and children too follow Christian

> > faith . But unlike other Christians , Yesudas worships

> > Guruvayoorappan also as One of the forms of God . For sure ,

> > Guruvayoorappan is not his Upasana-moorti (Principal deity) . On

> His

> > part, the merciful Guruvayoorappan has generously rewarded

> Yesudas ,

> > for whatever bhakti towards Him.

> >

> > 6. On the other hand , the Lord & #8217;s favourite devotee-singer

> Chembai

> > Vaidayanatha Bhagavartar ( Guru of yesudas) was fully loyal to

> the

> > Lord ; and he surrendered most of his earnings for the service of

> the

> > Lord .Gurvayoorappan interacted with Chembai on a personal level

> > (Listed here below some true incidents taken from the

biography

> of

> > Chemabai by LRV ) .

> >

> > MIRACULOUS TREATMENT BY GURUVAYOORAPPAN ( 1931)

> >

> > In the year 1931 on an Ekadasi day , Chembai was about to

commence

> a

> > music concert in the presence of King Samutiri at Calicut . Just

> > before starting the concert, there was a sudden change in his

> voice

> > and he could not even speak. It was diagnosed as a chronic

throat

> > ailment and frantic treatments followed . Unfortunately , in

spite

> of

> > continuing for a full year , all the high-tech treatments

failed

> to

> > produce any difference .

> >

> > A heartbroken Chembai finally came to Guruvayoor temple and stood

> > before the Lord of Guruvayur with tears in his eyes, asking, OH

> LORD!

> > HAVE YOU FORSAKEN ME TO THIS EXTENT, SO THAT YOU CANNOT EVEN BEAR

> TO

> > HEAR MY VOICE RECITE A VERSE IN YOUR PRAISE. Suddenly an unknown

> > Brhamin reached there and after prescribing the formula of a new

> > herbal medicine to Chembai, left unnoticed. This particular

> medicine

> > was quickly prepared at the Poomulli Mana. Soon after taking

> this

> > medicine, Chembai & #8217;s ailment was cured. His voice became

> better than

> > ever before. The restoration of his voice was by the grace of

Sree

> > Guruvayurappan .

> >

> > After this miracle, Chembai took a vow to sing in front of Sree

> > Guruvayoorppan on every Sukla paksham & #8217; Ekadasi day .

> >

> > POWER OF FAITH [1939]

> >

> > Chembai was about to start a performance at the palace in

> Kallikotai.

> > Suddenly he discovered that his voice was 'frozen'. He was

puzzled

> > since he had no problem of any kind earlier that day. The sound

of

> > the tambura sruti seemed to gain in volume as Chembai pondered

the

> > reason. Suddenly, a question arose in his mind. He asked someone

> > seated nearby whether it was Sukla paksham after the new moon.

This

> > was the month of Kartika and it was Chembai's vow to offer

> musical

> > prayers at the Sree Krishna temple in Guruvayur on the Ekadasi

day

> > of the 'sukla paksham' in the month of Kartika every year ( As

> > thanksgiving to Lord Sree Krishna for curing his illness) .

> >

> > When a reference to an almanac confirmed that it was Sukla

paksham

> > Ekadasi, Chembai explained the matter to the host and requested

> > permission and help to go to Guruvayoor and fulfill his

commitment.

> > The host obliged. Chembai speeded to Guruvayoor in a car, offered

> his

> > apologies and prayers to Sree Krishna.

> >

> > He had no problem singing; he had recovered his voice fully. He

> sang

> > many songs and long until he was satisfied that the Lord had

> forgiven

> > his lapse.

> >

> > He sang at Kallikkotai the next evening, without any problem.

> >

> > THE SALVATION (16-OCTOBER-1974)

> >

> > Poozhikunnam Sri Krishna temple is situated on the banks of the

> > Nila river. After finishing the music concert there, Chembai

said

> > to his aides : PLEASE TAKE ME TO THE SANCTUM SANCTORUM .Two

people

> > held his hands and led him to the door of the sanctum.

> >

> > He sat down on the floor, shut his eyes, and prayed for a few

> > minutes. Then he called out to the deity in a supplicating tone:

> > KRISHNA! GURUVAYOORAPPA ! I AM 80. YOU HAVE FULFILLED ALL MY

> DESIRES.

> > WHY DO YOU STILL MAKE ME GO ABOUT WITH THIS BODY? WHY DON'T YOU

> CALL

> > ME [TO YOU]?

> >

> > When he got up, after receiving the prasadam, and giving dakshina

> to

> > the priest, Rama Marar said:

> >

> > Bhagavatar will live for the full span of 125 years.

> >

> > Chembai laughed aloud and retorted : You don't poke your head in

> it.

> > All is settled between me and Guruvayoorappan.

> >

> > He returned to his friend O.M.V's nearby residence. He washed

his

> > feet and face, and sat down for prayers in the verandah. After a

> few

> > minutes, it was noticed that his head was sliding to one side.

> > Somebody supported him, and slowly eased him down to lie on the

> > floor. He was perspiring profusely. Neelakantan Namboodiripad,

who

> > knows Marana lakshana [signs of death] went near to examine him.

He

> > looked only for a few seconds, and called out: " Everything is

over

> > for Bhagavatar. "

> >

> > An APPEAL - The religious matters of Vedic Religion must be left

> > alone to those faithful Hindus who live according to Vedic

> > scriptures . If & #8216;faithless Hindus & #8217; continue to tamper

> with Vedas,

> > India's end is not far away.

> >

> > OM NAMO NARAYANAYA NAMAH!!!

> >

> > A bhakta .

> >

> >

> > To:-hindushaktikerala

> > - " Vandemataram ....... " <bharathsevak>

> > Date:-Wed, 25 Jan 2006 04

> > Subject:-Re: Yesudas !

> >

> > I too agree with Jinesh, the hurdles late Kalamandalam Hyderali

> > faced during his younger days and the people who oppose Yesudas

is

> > something not to be encouraged. Instead of making their mind

enter

> > into the world of Universal religion our orthodox people are

> driving

> > them out and creating hatred in their mind about Hindutva

> >

> >

> >

--

> --

> > - " Jagdos larikker " <jlarikker

> > Date:-Tue, 24 Jan 2006 18:19:29 -0800 (PST)

> > Subject:-Re: Yesudas !

> >

> > I agree with Jinesh.

> >

> > Our religion and culture has accepted everyone with an open

heart -

> > this had had good and bad results.

> >

> > however in the current scenario, we should encourage more and

more

> > non hindus to believe, accept and adopt the hindu religion. so

> should

> > we also encourage our youth to get more religious, which i think

> they

> > are getting to.

> >

> > Pranam

> > Jagdos

> >

--

> --

> > Jinesh <kbjinesh> wrote:

> >

> > The law that no non-Hindu can enter Guruvayur Temple is a law by

> the

> > Devaswam board, Guruvayurappan didn't make it. Denial of a

believer

> > in a temple is the biggest sin a Hindu can do, either on

political

> or

> > on religious reasons.

> >

> > The argument of the author in Kesari is childish. We all know

that

> > Yesudas visits Sabarimala every year, that is not based on any

song

> > he sang. He visits Mookambika every year; it is not for fame. His

> > devotion to Guruvayurappan is much more sincere than some of our

> > politicians show. It may be bigger than any one of us has.

Changing

> > religion officially will offend the Christians, which of course

is

> > not fair from his side (though Hindus will be happy by that). On

> the

> > contrary, we have no hesitation to accept the donations by non-

> Hindus

> > to temples, which we seldom talk about!

> > On one side, people are converting Hindus to other religions. On

> the

> > other, we are denying others to enter temples, just because they

> > don't have a certificate to 'prove' their belief! The question of

> > allowing Yesudas in to Guruvayur temple is not the matter of

> > converting one Christian to Hindu religion by certificate, it is

a

> > matter of believes. I think then there is no reason to deny him.

> >

> > If that is not the case, we are not talking about the religion,

we

> > are talking politics, which is unfair!

> >

> > Regards,

> > Jinesh.

> >

> >

--

> --

> >

> >

> >

> >

> >

> >

> >

> >

> >

> >

> >

> >

> >

> > Om Namo Narayanaya:

> >

[Guest guest]

Unni,

You are exactly correct. That is why all rulers are think against us. And

supporting other community.

When I was a college student, Our principal wrote a book, on that something he

wrote about Mohamed Nabi. on that time I saw all the Muslims took a protest

against his book. I saw the Congress man, Communists (including one communist

councilor from the Municipality). How many books , how many persons wrote

against Hindu gods, what is the reaction of the Hindus?

Now see the protest of the gulf countries against Denmark.

 

 

 

Praveen

U4 <unni_u4 wrote:

OM Narayana,

I have been following the Topic.

Most reply to me it seems is from freinds who have not

seen any other religion dealing.

Go to any part of the Arab world.You will know.

have you seen it the following way.

For a a msulim he is muslim first then a Human,

To a chirstian first Christian and then a Human.

for Hindu he is a human and then a Hindu.(I am a

proud HINDU).

tkae the Kerala istance.

A muslim communist he will not miss a Friday

prayer.(It is his personal affairs)

A christian cannot miss his SUNDAY MASS foe the he

will be out of his EDAVAKA.( Dont interfere in

personal matters).

A hindu goes to a temple or give her daughter in

marraige in HIndu right. He is doing things agianst a

comunist.And you will find all

making a protest march.

for communist doesnot beleive in GOD.

(DEWASWAM BOARD membership is a different story.A

comunist can be a minister or a board member).Lot of

money to loose out?

No one to be blamed we Hindus try to please other and

live for other preaching.

please wake or else you will be left out and soon be a

part of the

second citizen of largest muslim / Christian India.

If they are in majority Hindu will have no say.

And the way things are going it will be around the end

of this centuray.

Communists are no longer communist. they have become

communalists with a deffenite turn to Muslims.

And take any TV channels in Malayalam all are biased.

 

OM Namaho NARAYAN..

 

may guruvayoorappan BLESS all.

 

Unni.

 

 

--- SRIRAM SUBRAMANIAN <abheri wrote:

 

 

 

Hare Krishna ! Guruvayurappa !

I agree with Rajaram's views on this topic. Unless we

see everyone as equal, we are still thinking that we

are this body - Hindu, Muslim, Christian, American,

Indian - all these designations end with the body. And

as long as we delve more into these differences, we

will move more and more into the bodily concept of

life and forget our duties as Spirit Souls.

 

It is easy to make loose statements on sentimental

grounds; but we need to be scripturally correct in

what we say - we should have backing from the vedic

scriptures.

 

Let us not be fanatic about HINDUISM - even the word

HINDU has ABSOLUTELY NO scriptural significance - it

was a word mispronounced after all by people on the

other side of the river Sindhu. There is no point

being fanatic about our birth also - I shall quote

here a verse from Narayaneeyam which will shed more

light to all on this topic:

 

Narayaneeyam - Dasakam 91, Verse 2:

" O All pervading Being! Whatever I do with body, mind

and words prompted by Your power, all that, I offer at

Your feet, O Supreme Spirit. Even if a person be of

low birth (from a family of dog eaters), if he has

resigned his mind, power of action, speech, senses and

vital energies at Your feet, he sanctifies the worlds.

But vain, indeed is the pride of the Brahmana in his

high birth if his mind is turned away from You. "

 

 

Here Bhattathiri openly admits his desire to become a

first class devotee of Sri Guruvayurappan. He mentions

here that a person completely absorbed in Sri Krishna

sanctifies the whole world irrespective of his birth -

and therefore Bhattathiri himself is surrendering

everything to the Lord. This is in line with the

statement from the Srimad Bhagavatam - tirthi kurvanti

tirthani - actually, the devotees of the Lord sanctify

the places of pilgrimage - We must learn to recognize

and worship such devotees of the Lord.

sajjanangaLe kaaNunna nErathu

lajja kooDAthe veeNu namikkaNam. (Jnanapana)

 

What to speak of a mere Hindu, even being born in a

Brahmana family is not in itself a great qualification

unless our activities are directed towards pleasing

the Supreme Lord. The Lord is equal towards all

beings.

 

This sloka is ample evidence for all of us devotees

of Sri Guruvayurappan to understand that the issue of

BIRTH is NOT, i repeat NOT very important as far as

the Lord is concerned.

 

I may remind the famous words of Poonthanam in his

Jnanapana:

brahmanyam kondu kunthichu kunthichu

brahmaavum enikkokkaa ennum chilar.

(Intoxicated by their brahmin-ISM, they consider even

Lord Brahma to be inferior to them)

 

To give an opportunity to all people to worship the

Supreme Lord is certainly not Anti Vedic - the aim of

vedas is to understand Lord Krishna (Vedais cha

sarvair aham eva vedyah - Of all the Vedas, I am to be

known - Bhagavad Gita). So we would be bringing more

and more people to this end.

 

Once again, do not try to restrict and limit Sri

Guruvayurappan to be one among 33 Crore Hindu Gods -

Lord Guruvayurappan has amply demonstrated that He is

not just one among many Gods - but is indeed the

Supreme Lord of all that be. He is the Supreme Lord

and Controller for all, irrespective of caste or

religion or species (remember the Maraprabhu

incident?).

 

 

Someone had commented that Hindus are not supposed to

eat meat - but that is not the case in practise -

majority of Hindus eat meat and come to the temple.

Now, can you imagine why Christians and Muslims were

restricted in the past? They were chandalas and

yavanas - outcastes as far as Vedic civilization was

concerned - they ate meat. But, now Hindus themselves

are below Chandala and Yavana !!! and Christians and

Muslims are getting attracted to devotional practises

to Lord Guruvayurappan - I personally know such people

who pray from a distance outside Guruvayur temple and

often ask me to make some offerings to the Lord in

their name. I even came across a few Christian friends

who sneaked into Guruvayur temple and had darshan -

they were full of BLISS !!! So many of them told me -

why can't they open out the temple to us also ????

 

The so called Hindu religion has degraded and has

become a hodge-podge of " do whatever that will make

you feel good " philosophies. We must face the reality

instead of living in a dream world. Let us not be

Hypocritic and let us learn to accept the harsh

reality!!

 

Do not try to distance people from God by being

fanatic. Fanaticism will ultimately spell doom for its

practicioners.

 

But, who cares for what the Lord likes or prefers,

anyway ??????

-sriram

========

Smartavya satatam Vishnu

vismartavyo na jatucit

sarve vidhi-nishedhah syuh

etayor eva kinkarah.

" Always remember Vishnu. Never forget Vishnu. All

the rules and regulations (Do's and Dont's) are

subservient to these two rules. "

===============================================================

 

 

--- Rajaram Venkataramani <v_raja_ram

wrote:

 

> Whoever is born as a Hindu is only Hindu. Can some

> one give sastric evidence for this statement???

> Simply making statements without reference to

> sastras is non-sense.

>

> The lord says in bhagavad gita mamaivamse jiva.

> Every one is his amsa. We have jati based on birth

> but one falls out of the birth right if he gives up

> the duties and becomes a pancama. This is the case

> with most of us. Whether one is by birth a pancama

> or becomes one by action, he is still an amsa of the

> lord. In that sense, what to speak of Christians,

> Muslims etc. even plants and animals are his amsa

> only. The only way we can divide people in to

> communities by their respective actions and

> cosnciousness.

>

> Krishna Prasad <rkrishp99

> guruvayur

> Friday, January 27, 2006 8:24:29 AM

> Re: [Guruvayur/Guruvayoor] Fw - Beware of

> Anti-Vedic Moves in Guruvayoor .

>

> Hari OM!

>

> Dear all,

>

> Whoever born as a Hindu is only a Hindu, and the

> religious practice

> differs there is no concept of conversion in

> Hinduism. And we can say

> others who live the way as per the vedic scriptures

> is practicing

> Hinduism that is all. Taking Birth in our great

> religion in itself is

> a privilege given by Lord Guruvayurappan.

>

> We do not need a Frank Morale to say to us, We have

> our great Rishis

> and also our sages like Swami Vivekanandan etc...

>

> What ever the Lord Guruvayurappan does is best for

> that period of time

> and space.in that soceity even the one who can

> question it, is doing

> itself because of his power leela, so surrendering

> to HIS lotus feet.

>

>

> With Love & OM!

>

> Krishna Prasad

>

> On 1/27/06, krishnanujan <krishnanujan

> wrote:

> > Vinod,

> > I agree with you.

> > This issue is for the respective temple

> authorities to deal with, as

> > they deem appropriate. We laymen have very limited

> knowledge about

> > these matters and we are not competent to pass

> verdict on this or to

> > criticise the religious practices of Guruvayoor

> temple. Another

> > example is the Shree Padmanabha Swamy Temple at

> Trivandrum. With all

> > due respect to Yesudas and individuals like him,

> singing praises of

> > Sree Guruvayoorappan, or showing loyalty ( and

> belief) to Hinduism or

> > being student of Chembai is not sufficient

> qualification to get

> > entry into these temples.

> > Dr Frank Morales is a highly respected authority

> on Hinduism. Let's

> > see what he has to written about it.

> >

> > PS

> > It is not my intention to prolong this discussion

> but to throw some

> > light on this issue.

> >

> > Jai Shree Krishna !

> > Krishnanujan

> >

> > ---Who is a Hindu?

> > from Dr. Frank Morales

> >

> > When the question of who is a Hindu is discussed

> today, we get a

> > multitude of confused and contradictory answers

> from both Hindu

> > laypersons and from Hindu leaders. That we have

> such a difficult time

> > understanding the answer to even so fundamental a

> question as " who is

> > a Hindu? " is a starkly sad indicator of the lack

> of knowledge in the

> > Hindu community today.

> > Common Answers

> > Some of the more simplistic answers to this

> question include: Anyone

> > born in India is automatically a Hindu (the

> ethnicity fallacy), if

> > your parents are Hindu, then you are Hindu (the

> familial argument),

> > if you are born into a certain caste, then you are

> Hindu (the genetic

> > inheritance model), if you believe in

> reincarnation, then you are

> > Hindu (forgetting that many non-Hindu religions

> share at least some

> > of the beliefs of Hinduism), if you practice any

> religion originating

> > from India, then you are a Hindu (the national

> origin fallacy).

> >

> >

> > The Real Answer

> > The real answer to this question has already been

> conclusively

> > answered by the ancient sages of Hinduism, and is

> actually much

> > simpler to ascertain than we would guess. The two

> primary factors

> > that distinguish the individual uniqueness of the

> great world

> > religious traditions are a) the scriptural

> authority upon which the

> > tradition is based, and b) the fundamental

> religious tenet(s) that it

> > espouses. If we ask the question what is a Jew?,

> for example, the

> > answer is: someone who accepts the Torah as their

> scriptural guide

> > and believes in the monotheistic concept of God

> espoused in these

> > scriptures. What is a Christian? - a person who

> accepts the Gospels

> > as their scriptural guide and believes that Jesus

> is the incarnate

> > God who died for their sins. What is a Muslim? -

> someone who accepts

> > the Qur'an as their scriptural guide, and believes

> that there is no

> > God but Allah, and that Mohammed is his prophet.

> >

> > Scriptural Authority

> > In general, what determines whether a person is a

> follower of any

> > particular religion is whether or not they accept,

> and attempt to

> > live by, the scriptural authority of that

> religion. This is no less

> > true of Hinduism than it is of any other religion

> on earth. Thus, the

> > question of what is a Hindu is similarly very

> easily answered.

> >

> > The Definition

> > By definition, a Hindu is an individual who

> accepts as authoritative

> > the religious guidance of the Vedic scriptures,

> and who strives to

> > live in accordance with Dharma, God's divine laws

> as revealed in the

> > Vedic scriptures.

> >

> > Only If You Accept the Vedas

> > In keeping with this standard definition, all of

> the Hindu thinkers

> > of the six traditional schools of Hindu philosophy

> (Shad-darshanas)

> > insisted on the acceptance of the scriptural

> authority of the Vedas

> > (shabda-pramana) as the primary criterion for

> distinguishing a Hindu

> > from a non-Hindu, as well as distinguishing

> overtly Hindu

> > philosophical positions from non-Hindu ones. It

> has been the

> > historically accepted standard that, if you accept

> the Vedas (and by

> > extension Bhagavad Gita, Puranas, etc.) as your

> scriptural authority,

> > and lived your life in accordance with the Dharmic

> principles of the

> > Vedas, you are then a Hindu. Thus, an Indian who

> rejects the Veda is

> > obviously not a Hindu. While an American, Russian,

> Indonesian or

> > Indian who does accept the Veda obviously is a

> Hindu.

> >

> >

> > ******************

> >

> > Jai Shree Krishna !

> >

> > In guruvayur , " PS, Vinod K \(GE

> Infra,

=== message truncated ===

 

 

 

 

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Om Namo Narayanaya:

 

 

 

[Guest guest]

Dear All Members,

 

Om Nomoh Bhagavthe Vasudevaya,

Sree Guruvayoorappan Saranam,

Hare Rama Hare Krishna Krishna Hare Hare

 

After viewing all the views put forward by our esteemed members taking time

amd thoughtfuly forwarding their views. First of all I will fully support Shri

PS Vinod's view on this debate, Here are my views

 

We are all that guruvayoorappan's children only, he is the aadhi and antham of

all our lives, will he not know whom he should allow to see him and the other

way, I think as shri Vinod is written let us discuss the good thing and share

the knowledge we have about the lord and flourish in our lives. My salutes to

all of you who have contributed in this discussion, Let us remember the gita

sar as we are all from him and we will go back to him. My request to all members

is let us pray for all the living beings in the world for their well being

 

Plse correct me if I am wrong. My sincere apologies if this message hurts

anyone. This is my personal opinion, plse accept if it can be.

 

Loka samastha sukhino bhavanthu

 

KRISHNA GURUVAYOORAPPA

 

Sri Rama Rameithi ramea ramo mano ramea

Sahasra nama dathuliyam rama nama varananea

 

Rama Rama

 

Krishna Kumar

 

 

 

 

" PS, Vinod K (GE Infra, Energy) " <vinod.ps wrote:

!! Sri Rama Jayam !!

 

Dear All,

 

This is a highly sensitive issue.

A debate on this will run long & I hope there will not be any positive outcome.

We have so many other things to share, discuss & decide.

Whether Yesudas or any other non-hindu be allowed or not to enter GURUVAYUR

temple premises is beyond all our terrestrial abilities.

Guruvayur temple is based on certain vedic codes of conduct & administrational

practices.

No body should challenge those as far as communal harmony & preserving cultural

heritage is concerned.

It is exactly like we decide maintaining our house-hold activities irrespective

of what our neighbors do or do not.

I am not trying to support any one's voice here.

Hence, leave the decision to Sri Guruvayurappan & may not try to raise such

talks in future again.

Our GURUVAYURAPPAN is 'Sarvasakshi'.

We must believe that his decisions are the most superior ones.

 

Let us all hope for the best.

 

Sarve Bhavantu sukhinaha ...

 

HARE KRISHNA

HARE RAMA

 

 

 

 

guruvayur [guruvayur ]On

Behalf Of krishnadaya

Thursday, January 26, 2006 4:57 PM

guruvayur

[Guruvayur/Guruvayoor] Fw - Beware of Anti-Vedic Moves in

Guruvayoor .

 

 

Please find below, an interesting article published recetly in a

devotional group .

 

 

Dear all,

 

As a humble Hindu-devotee, I am shocked to see that some

opportunistic Hindus are trying to force the entry of non-Hindus

like Yesudas inside Guruvayoor temple . They appear to be following

the Christian culture where the Idol is inert and everything is

decided by the clergy and influential men.

 

It is an absolute truth that, Sree Krishna & #8217;s deity in the Guruvayoor

temple is Living God . The Lord doesn & #8217;t require His duties to be

performed by mortal men .

 

In this regard , please note the following :

 

1. Lord Sri Krishna is Sattva-guna personified and His worship

in deity-form is different from that of other Devatas. The

functioning of the sacred Guruvayoor temple is based on the

procedures established by Aadi Sankara. Sree Guruvayoorappan had

instructed him personally to put in place, necessary systems to

ensure His constant presence on the Deity. The related rituals and

rules are unique and applicable only for Guruvayoor temple .

 

2. According to the above, the decision of authorized Tantri (

Puzhakkkal Chennar Illam & #8217;s Senior most Namboodirippad) is the final

word in all matters concerning the Guruvayoor temple. This authority

has been confirmed by Supreme Court of India. Numerous lawsuits were

filed by publicity-crazy, un-believers asking for entry of no-Hindus

in Guruvayoor temple but all of them were dismissed . Recently, one

such demonic Hindu was ridiculed by the Calicut court, for raising

an irrelevant issue ( seeking entry of non-Hindus) for the sake of

publicity.

 

3. Guruvayoorappan is not a passive Deity . The Lord is in full

control of the temple . He has systems in place like instructions

to Tantri / Priests during dreams (Swapna-darsana) , revelation

during 'Devaprasna' etc, to convey His additional instructions, as

and when required. Any one violating Him would be pay dearly for his

offence .

 

4. If Lord Guruvayoorappan wanted Yesudas to enter Guruvayoor

temple , the Lord Himself would have arranged for it .

 

5. Yesudas is a great singer and he has many good qualities .

However, he is not a not a Hindu . Yesudas is actually a

Christian believer and his wife and children too follow Christian

faith . But unlike other Christians , Yesudas worships

Guruvayoorappan also as One of the forms of God . For sure ,

Guruvayoorappan is not his Upasana-moorti (Principal deity) . On His

part, the merciful Guruvayoorappan has generously rewarded Yesudas ,

for whatever bhakti towards Him.

 

6. On the other hand , the Lord & #8217;s favourite devotee-singer Chembai

Vaidayanatha Bhagavartar ( Guru of yesudas) was fully loyal to the

Lord ; and he surrendered most of his earnings for the service of the

Lord .Gurvayoorappan interacted with Chembai on a personal level

(Listed here below some true incidents taken from the biography of

Chemabai by LRV ) .

 

MIRACULOUS TREATMENT BY GURUVAYOORAPPAN ( 1931)

 

In the year 1931 on an Ekadasi day , Chembai was about to commence a

music concert in the presence of King Samutiri at Calicut . Just

before starting the concert, there was a sudden change in his voice

and he could not even speak. It was diagnosed as a chronic throat

ailment and frantic treatments followed . Unfortunately , in spite of

continuing for a full year , all the high-tech treatments failed to

produce any difference .

 

A heartbroken Chembai finally came to Guruvayoor temple and stood

before the Lord of Guruvayur with tears in his eyes, asking, OH LORD!

HAVE YOU FORSAKEN ME TO THIS EXTENT, SO THAT YOU CANNOT EVEN BEAR TO

HEAR MY VOICE RECITE A VERSE IN YOUR PRAISE. Suddenly an unknown

Brhamin reached there and after prescribing the formula of a new

herbal medicine to Chembai, left unnoticed. This particular medicine

was quickly prepared at the Poomulli Mana. Soon after taking this

medicine, Chembai & #8217;s ailment was cured. His voice became better than

ever before. The restoration of his voice was by the grace of Sree

Guruvayurappan .

 

After this miracle, Chembai took a vow to sing in front of Sree

Guruvayoorppan on every Sukla paksham & #8217; Ekadasi day .

 

POWER OF FAITH [1939]

 

Chembai was about to start a performance at the palace in Kallikotai.

Suddenly he discovered that his voice was 'frozen'. He was puzzled

since he had no problem of any kind earlier that day. The sound of

the tambura sruti seemed to gain in volume as Chembai pondered the

reason. Suddenly, a question arose in his mind. He asked someone

seated nearby whether it was Sukla paksham after the new moon. This

was the month of Kartika and it was Chembai's vow to offer musical

prayers at the Sree Krishna temple in Guruvayur on the Ekadasi day

of the 'sukla paksham' in the month of Kartika every year ( As

thanksgiving to Lord Sree Krishna for curing his illness) .

 

When a reference to an almanac confirmed that it was Sukla paksham

Ekadasi, Chembai explained the matter to the host and requested

permission and help to go to Guruvayoor and fulfill his commitment.

The host obliged. Chembai speeded to Guruvayoor in a car, offered his

apologies and prayers to Sree Krishna.

 

He had no problem singing; he had recovered his voice fully. He sang

many songs and long until he was satisfied that the Lord had forgiven

his lapse.

 

He sang at Kallikkotai the next evening, without any problem.

 

THE SALVATION (16-OCTOBER-1974)

 

Poozhikunnam Sri Krishna temple is situated on the banks of the

Nila river. After finishing the music concert there, Chembai said

to his aides : PLEASE TAKE ME TO THE SANCTUM SANCTORUM .Two people

held his hands and led him to the door of the sanctum.

 

He sat down on the floor, shut his eyes, and prayed for a few

minutes. Then he called out to the deity in a supplicating tone:

KRISHNA! GURUVAYOORAPPA ! I AM 80. YOU HAVE FULFILLED ALL MY DESIRES.

WHY DO YOU STILL MAKE ME GO ABOUT WITH THIS BODY? WHY DON'T YOU CALL

ME [TO YOU]?

 

When he got up, after receiving the prasadam, and giving dakshina to

the priest, Rama Marar said:

 

Bhagavatar will live for the full span of 125 years.

 

Chembai laughed aloud and retorted : You don't poke your head in it.

All is settled between me and Guruvayoorappan.

 

He returned to his friend O.M.V's nearby residence. He washed his

feet and face, and sat down for prayers in the verandah. After a few

minutes, it was noticed that his head was sliding to one side.

Somebody supported him, and slowly eased him down to lie on the

floor. He was perspiring profusely. Neelakantan Namboodiripad, who

knows Marana lakshana [signs of death] went near to examine him. He

looked only for a few seconds, and called out: " Everything is over

for Bhagavatar. "

 

An APPEAL - The religious matters of Vedic Religion must be left

alone to those faithful Hindus who live according to Vedic

scriptures . If & #8216;faithless Hindus & #8217; continue to tamper with Vedas,

India's end is not far away.

 

OM NAMO NARAYANAYA NAMAH!!!

 

A bhakta .

 

 

To:-hindushaktikerala

- " Vandemataram ....... " <bharathsevak

Date:-Wed, 25 Jan 2006 04

Subject:-Re: Yesudas !

 

I too agree with Jinesh, the hurdles late Kalamandalam Hyderali

faced during his younger days and the people who oppose Yesudas is

something not to be encouraged. Instead of making their mind enter

into the world of Universal religion our orthodox people are driving

them out and creating hatred in their mind about Hindutva

 

 

----

- " Jagdos larikker " <jlarikker

Date:-Tue, 24 Jan 2006 18:19:29 -0800 (PST)

Subject:-Re: Yesudas !

 

I agree with Jinesh.

 

Our religion and culture has accepted everyone with an open heart -

this had had good and bad results.

 

however in the current scenario, we should encourage more and more

non hindus to believe, accept and adopt the hindu religion. so should

we also encourage our youth to get more religious, which i think they

are getting to.

 

Pranam

Jagdos

----

Jinesh <kbjinesh wrote:

 

The law that no non-Hindu can enter Guruvayur Temple is a law by the

Devaswam board, Guruvayurappan didn't make it. Denial of a believer

in a temple is the biggest sin a Hindu can do, either on political or

on religious reasons.

 

The argument of the author in Kesari is childish. We all know that

Yesudas visits Sabarimala every year, that is not based on any song

he sang. He visits Mookambika every year; it is not for fame. His

devotion to Guruvayurappan is much more sincere than some of our

politicians show. It may be bigger than any one of us has. Changing

religion officially will offend the Christians, which of course is

not fair from his side (though Hindus will be happy by that). On the

contrary, we have no hesitation to accept the donations by non-Hindus

to temples, which we seldom talk about!

On one side, people are converting Hindus to other religions. On the

other, we are denying others to enter temples, just because they

don't have a certificate to 'prove' their belief! The question of

allowing Yesudas in to Guruvayur temple is not the matter of

converting one Christian to Hindu religion by certificate, it is a

matter of believes. I think then there is no reason to deny him.

 

If that is not the case, we are not talking about the religion, we

are talking politics, which is unfair!

 

Regards,

Jinesh.

 

----

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

Om Namo Narayanaya: