[Guruvayur/Guruvayoor] What's Happening in Guruvayoor ?

[Guest guest]

Though we cannot justify suicide, we have to put an end to this attack on our nation and tradition. It is time we understand that the nation is under siege and fight back. Saffron Tiger <saffron_tigers wrote: Suicide of Krishna devotee by Missionary humiliation www.haindavakeralam.org8/19/2006 2:54:55 AM HK Guruvayur:The suicide of Ammini Amma, an ardent devotee of Sri Krishna, who was humiliated by the Christian Missionaries is an ample example of the threat Hinduism is facing from the merciless Conversionist thugs.Ammini Amma was one among the victim of Kidnapping attempt by Palayur Immanuel Christian Charity organisation for conversion purpose at Guruvayur Temple. The Kidnapping attempt by these followers of Jesus was spoiled then by the timely intervention of Devotees and Hindu organisation.The photo above depicts her mental agony when she was forced to sit inside the Ambulance of Christian Missionaries.She was crying aloud and praying

to Lord Krishna to protect her from these witched wolves.Ammini Amma was not a destitute as thought by the Missionaries, She was from a reputed family, who wilfully decided to spend her last moments within the divine feets of Sri Guruvayoorappan.This conversion attempt shocked and humiliated her and she decided to end her life under the wheels of a running train.This conversion attempt was with the support of local police and few Security employees in Guruvayur.The media who runs editorials and serial stories on controversies surrounding Sabarimala and Guruvayur were least bothered by this gruesome incident. What's Happening in Guruvayoor ? http://www.kesarionline.org/www/details-template.php?nid=1339 http://img223.imageshack.us/img223/2397/guruvayoorye8.jpg How low will we go? Check out Messenger’s low PC-to-Phone call rates.

Want to be your own boss? Learn how on Small Business.

[Guest guest]

Hari OM!

 

Dear all,

 

A Strong anti conversion bill should be implemented pretty soon, if the things should become

normalize and no more new churches!

 

See all religions should co-exist peacefully but not through forcing and converting they can

become the majority. this is only a personal view.

 

 

Now, over to Swami Dayananda Saraswati:Q: You have come out strongly against the Pope's statements on theanti-forcible conversions laws. You have also been a campaigneragainst conversions, terming it as violence. Can you elaborate?Ans: Okay. What is violence? When you physically hurt me it isviolence. When you do anything that can instigate physical violence,that

is an act of violence, too. And if you can hurt me emotionallyit is also violence. If you can hurt me spiritually that is the worstviolence, rank violence. All these are there in

conversion because itleads to physical violence. When you convert somebody you have tocriticise the person's religion, his worship, his culture; all thesehurt. Even when he changes it hurts. How will he change? He has to

disown his parents, and their wisdom and their culture, hisancestors, and entire community; you are isolating him, uprooting himand all the uprooted people are emotionally unsettled.For instance, Blacks in America are uprooted people. Even after

generations they are not emotionally settled. It will never help thepersons who are uprooted from their culture. So it is great violence

against culture, tradition etc.Q: Is the religious person, then, the core person?Ans: Yes, we find some people die for their religion because in their

scripture it is told that if your religion is in danger then you willhave to sacrifice your life so that you will also have a better place

in paradise. The fellow begins to believe that and he is ready togive up his life. This is indoctrination. So, for their religion's

sake, they have double standards. One who does not believe in theirreligion is anti-god as if God has given only their religion tofollow. If he does not follow that he is an enemy to God, an infideland deserves to be killed. Though God any way is going to destroyhim, but if you destroy him, God will be pleased that you have proved

your faith. This is the double standard. The values are not common.For followers one set of values, for non-followers another set ofvalues. Killing gets a sanction. That is why these are all dangerousreligions. And I say all converting religions are dangerous. Theyhave created problems. It is like somebody wanting freedom to destroy

me. If I do not give this freedom, I become a fundamentalist. But ifI give them the freedom to destroy me, then I am a liberal, myreligion a free religion. That's it. Now this very concept of freedomitself has to be questioned, examined and told to the people.

Q: And to the Pope?Ans: Not only Pope. Pope told this because they have got away with itfor 2,000 years in the name of freedom of Religion. They have wipedout continents, cultures in various continents, religions in

countries ... where are those religions and cultures that built thosepyramids? Show me one fellow now as a sample. Greek and Romanmonuments are there, but where are the religions? In Europe theycompletely wiped out all the indigenous religions. In North America

and South America they have finished off all the native cultures.Even in Africa it is almost finished.So now in Asia they are planting their religion. They want to be

successful, between these two people they want to destroy allcultures in this world. So therefore, I say enough is enough. I don'twant to ask them to give up their (the converts) religions now.

But their concepts, their beliefs are not acceptable to me. I givethem the freedom to follow what they follow. But I want them to leaveme free to follow what I believe! They cannot say evangelising

is notagainst other religions. It is against other religions; Conversionsare against other religions. We don't believe in conversion

itself.We do not accept that, we do not do that.Q: Then how do you deal with this problem when it is so basic? Whatare the practical ways?Ans: The theologians have to change. But they will not. That isbecause they have enough in-built programming. What we callindoctrination. There is no use even to make an attempt. But weshould keep talking about that to them. But there is one thing withthem. They just wait for a time when there is more freedom for themto do. So let that time be kept away. That conducive time for them to

convert be kept away. The people have to be made aware and proud oftheir religion and that would take care of that in course of time.They should be able to say enough is

enough.Q: But there is the lure of money and incentives and other benefitsthat the naive fall for...Ans: It is not really the money that buys. What do they do? Small

things, and then they try to tempt them. That gives the thumb space.They begin to enter the heart. Then they tell the most unkindly cut.When the missionary tells that the fellow's daily pooja

is wrong,that his altar of prayer is not the altar, he has to alter that. Thatis the unkindest cut you can get. It

is a stab in the heart, wherethis fellow innocently gives some space for the missionary to enter.That very place becomes a place for attack. He attacks at the heartof the person, his religious core. And therefore the missionaries are

the most violent people in the world. They have committed violenceand nobody has committed violence as they have done. They continue to

do that. But people do not realise this. They do seemingly goodthings in order to commit this violence.Q: What is the effect of missionary activity on national security?

Ans: Look at the Northeast. I wonder if I can go and talk there, inmy own country. They ask if I am from India! This is what themissionaries have done. Those people are made to feel they are non-

Indians. It is very unfortunate. It is a major problem for nationalintegrity. And not good for our tradition. In fact, Hindu religion

has to be saved for the sake of humanity because the Christians don'tbelieve the Muslims will go to heaven, the Muslims don't believe theChristians will go anywhere. They both are fighting each other intrying to reach heaven or paradise. And both believe that the other

is not going there, so they will fight forever. The only person whosays paradise is not up there but here

is the Hindu. Hindu is theonly one who makes sense. He has also got a methodology to teach, itis not just a belief. Only they are working on belief. We are working

on wisdom. There it is just beliefs, many of which cannot be provedand several of which are wrong and foolish. See, a belief is above

reason. When you say there is heaven it is above reason. You canbelieve that. You survive death then you will go to heaven, which isalso a belief. But when you say that you will survive death, but youwill go to heaven or hell, then it is difficult to believe. And

another thing they say is God is formless. But he needs a location.You cannot define foolishness in a better way. When you believe

against all the evidence then it is called foolishness.Q: The inequalities that have cropped up in Hinduism are used ashandle against?Ans: Even they have their own inequalities. They have their own

problems that are endless. But that doesn't give us a sanction for usto have problems. We should try and solve them. But still all theseare our problems. Brothers are fighting each other over a propertyand if a third fellow comes and says, since you two are fighting let

me occupy the property, that cannot be allowed. You remain anencroacher. You can help us, but you cannot become a beneficiary ofour fight. Therefore we should resolve our own fights. You have nobusiness interfering in our house and I would not intrude in yours.

Indian Christians and Indian Muslims are converted from Hinduism,without themselves knowing what they are getting into. But onceconverted they are told that their brethren and forefathers are devilworshippers! This is what I say is dangerous. As Indians they have aright to know the religions, the people and their culture and formsetc. If they know there will be no problems. But they are purposely

kept away. The clergy is responsible for that, Islamic and Christianclergy are responsible for that.Q: But if they want to know or even reconvert, will theHindu 'clergy' allow that...

Ans: In India, there is no clergy. Here all are Hindus until theycall themselves different because when I allow every form of worshipthen where

is the problem? We deem you another Hindu, only you aresaying I am this and that. There is no re- conversion. There

is aprodigality and they come back. like a prodigal son. We do not evenneed to baptise. We have to ask him to give up beef that is all.Please see also Swamiji's open letter to The Pope.

http://www.hindunet.org/conversions/pope99/to_pope_from_swami_dayananada_sa.htm

 

On 8/22/06, Rajaram Venkataramani <v_raja_ram wrote:

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

Though we cannot justify suicide, we have to put an end to this attack on our nation and tradition. It is time we understand that the nation is under siege and fight back.

 

 

Saffron Tiger <saffron_tigers > wrote:

 

 

 

Suicide of Krishna devotee by Missionary humiliation

 

 

www.haindavakeralam.org8/19/2006 2:54:55 AM HK

Guruvayur:The suicide of Ammini Amma, an ardent devotee of Sri Krishna, who was humiliated by the Christian Missionaries is an ample example of the threat Hinduism is facing from the merciless Conversionist thugs.

Ammini Amma was one among the victim of Kidnapping attempt by Palayur Immanuel Christian Charity organisation for conversion purpose at Guruvayur Temple. The Kidnapping attempt by these followers of Jesus was spoiled then by the timely intervention of Devotees and Hindu organisation.

The photo above depicts her mental agony when she was forced to sit inside the Ambulance of Christian Missionaries.She was crying aloud and praying to Lord Krishna to protect her from these witched wolves.

Ammini Amma was not a destitute as thought by the Missionaries, She was from a reputed family, who wilfully decided to spend her last moments within the divine feets of Sri Guruvayoorappan.This conversion attempt shocked and humiliated her and she decided to end her life under the wheels of a running train.

This conversion attempt was with the support of local police and few Security employees in Guruvayur.The media who runs editorials and serial stories on controversies surrounding Sabarimala and Guruvayur were least bothered by this gruesome incident.

 

 

What's Happening in Guruvayoor ?

 

http://www.kesarionline.org/www/details-template.php?nid=1339

 

 

 

 

 

http://img223.imageshack.us/img223/2397/guruvayoorye8.jpg

 

 

How low will we go? Check out Messenger's low

PC-to-Phone call rates.

 

 

 

Want to be your own boss? Learn how on Small Business.

-- dotcompals:

www.dotcompals.in .Org domain Nemes for just 2.5 USDKrishna PrasadDare to give up the comfort of the 'known' and venture into the 'unknown' The more we know, the more we will come to realize what we do not know.

If we want to achieve our true potential and live life to the fullest. As Poojya Gurudev said it, "Open your eyes. Burst your shell. Spread your wings and fly!"Swami ChinmayanandaHate not the sinner - hate the sin; and always hate the sin even with an excess of hatred. "

[Guest guest]

Hi Krishna Prasa Its a fantastic article. How can we prevent these type of activities Hari Om UnnikrishnanKrishna Prasad <rkrishp99 wrote: Hari OM! Dear all, A Strong anti conversion bill should be implemented pretty soon, if the things should become normalize and no more new churches! See all religions should co-exist

peacefully but not through forcing and converting they can become the majority. this is only a personal view. Now, over to Swami Dayananda Saraswati:Q: You have come out strongly against the Pope's statements on theanti-forcible conversions laws. You have also been a campaigneragainst conversions, terming it as violence. Can you elaborate?Ans: Okay. What is violence? When you physically hurt me it isviolence. When you do anything that can instigate physical violence,that is an act of violence, too. And if you can hurt me emotionallyit is

also violence. If you can hurt me spiritually that is the worstviolence, rank violence. All these are there in conversion because itleads to physical violence. When you convert somebody you have tocriticise the person's religion, his worship, his culture; all thesehurt. Even when he changes it hurts. How will he change? He has to disown his parents, and their wisdom and their culture, hisancestors, and entire community; you are isolating him, uprooting himand all the uprooted people are emotionally unsettled.For instance, Blacks in America are uprooted people. Even after generations they are not emotionally settled. It will never help thepersons who are uprooted from their culture. So it is great violence against culture, tradition etc.Q: Is the religious person, then, the core person?Ans: Yes, we find some people die for their religion because in theirscripture it is told that if your religion is in danger then you willhave to sacrifice your life so that you will also have a better place in paradise. The fellow begins to believe that and he is ready togive up his life. This is indoctrination. So, for their religion's sake, they have double standards. One who does not believe in theirreligion is anti-god as if God has given only their religion tofollow. If he does not follow that he is an

enemy to God, an infideland deserves to be killed. Though God any way is going to destroyhim, but if you destroy him, God will be pleased that you have proved your faith. This is the double standard. The values are not common.For followers one set of values, for non-followers another set ofvalues. Killing gets a sanction. That is why these are all dangerousreligions. And I say all converting religions are dangerous. Theyhave created problems. It is like somebody wanting freedom to destroy me. If I do not give this freedom, I become a fundamentalist. But ifI give them the freedom to destroy me, then I am a liberal, myreligion a free religion. That's it. Now this very concept of freedomitself has to be questioned, examined and told to the people. Q: And to the

Pope?Ans: Not only Pope. Pope told this because they have got away with itfor 2,000 years in the name of freedom of Religion. They have wipedout continents, cultures in various continents, religions in countries ... where are those religions and cultures that built thosepyramids? Show me one fellow now as a sample. Greek and Romanmonuments are there, but where are the religions? In Europe theycompletely wiped out all the indigenous religions. In North America and South America they have finished off all the native cultures.Even in Africa it is almost finished.So now in Asia they are planting their religion. They want to be successful, between these two people they want to destroy allcultures in this world. So therefore, I say enough is enough. I don'twant to ask them to give up their (the converts) religions now. But their

concepts, their beliefs are not acceptable to me. I givethem the freedom to follow what they follow. But I want them to leaveme free to follow what I believe! They cannot say evangelising is notagainst other religions. It is against other religions; Conversionsare against other religions. We don't believe in conversion itself.We do not accept that, we do not do that.Q: Then how do you deal with this problem when it is so basic? Whatare the practical ways?Ans: The theologians have to change. But they will not. That isbecause they have enough in-built programming. What we callindoctrination. There is no use even to make an attempt. But weshould keep talking about that to them. But there is one thing withthem. They just wait for a time when there is more freedom for themto do. So let that time be kept away. That conducive time for them to convert be kept away. The people have to be made aware and proud oftheir religion and that would take care of that in course of time.They should be able to say enough is enough.Q: But there is the lure of money and incentives and other benefitsthat the naive fall for...Ans: It is not really the money that buys. What do they do? Small things, and then they try to tempt them. That gives the thumb space.They begin to enter the heart. Then they tell the most unkindly cut.When the missionary tells that the fellow's daily pooja is wrong,that his altar of

prayer is not the altar, he has to alter that. Thatis the unkindest cut you can get. It is a stab in the heart, wherethis fellow innocently gives some space for the missionary to enter.That very place becomes a place for attack. He attacks at the heartof the person, his religious core. And therefore the missionaries are the most violent people in the world. They have committed violenceand nobody has committed violence as they have done. They continue to do that. But people do not realise this. They do seemingly goodthings in order to commit this violence.Q: What is the effect of missionary activity on national security? Ans: Look at the Northeast. I wonder if I can

go and talk there, inmy own country. They ask if I am from India! This is what themissionaries have done. Those people are made to feel they are non- Indians. It is very unfortunate. It is a major problem for nationalintegrity. And not good for our tradition. In fact, Hindu religion has to be saved for the sake of humanity because the Christians don'tbelieve the Muslims will go to heaven, the Muslims don't believe theChristians will go anywhere. They both are fighting each other intrying to reach heaven or paradise. And both believe that the other is not going there, so they will fight forever. The only person whosays paradise is not up there but here is the Hindu. Hindu is theonly one who makes sense. He has also got a methodology to teach, itis not just a belief. Only they are working on belief. We are working on wisdom. There it is just beliefs, many of which cannot be provedand several of which are wrong and foolish. See, a belief is above reason. When you say there is heaven it is above reason. You canbelieve that. You survive death then you will go to heaven, which isalso a belief. But when you say that you will survive death, but youwill go to heaven or hell, then it is difficult to believe. And another thing they say is God is formless. But he

needs a location.You cannot define foolishness in a better way. When you believe against all the evidence then it is called foolishness.Q: The inequalities that have cropped up in Hinduism are used ashandle against?Ans: Even they have their own inequalities. They have their own problems that are endless. But that doesn't give us a sanction for usto have problems. We should try and solve them. But still all theseare our problems. Brothers are fighting each other over a propertyand if a third fellow comes and says, since you two are fighting let me occupy the property, that cannot be allowed. You remain anencroacher. You can help us, but you cannot become a beneficiary ofour fight. Therefore we should resolve our own fights. You have nobusiness interfering in our house and I would not intrude in yours. Indian Christians and Indian Muslims are converted from

Hinduism,without themselves knowing what they are getting into. But onceconverted they are told that their brethren and forefathers are devilworshippers! This is what I say is dangerous. As Indians they have aright to know the religions, the people and their culture and formsetc. If they know there will be no problems. But they are purposely kept away. The clergy is responsible for that, Islamic and Christianclergy are responsible for that.Q: But if they want to know or even reconvert, will theHindu 'clergy' allow that... Ans: In India, there is no clergy. Here all are Hindus until theycall themselves different because when I allow every form of worshipthen where is the problem? We deem you another Hindu, only you aresaying I

am this and that. There is no re- conversion. There is aprodigality and they come back. like a prodigal son. We do not evenneed to baptise. We have to ask him to give up beef that is all.Please see also Swamiji's open letter to The Pope. http://www.hindunet.org/conversions/pope99/to_pope_from_swami_dayananada_sa.htm On 8/22/06, Rajaram Venkataramani <v_raja_ram > wrote: Though we cannot justify suicide, we have to put an end to this attack on our nation and tradition. It is time we understand that the nation is under siege and fight back. Saffron Tiger <saffron_tigers > wrote: Suicide of Krishna devotee by Missionary humiliation www.haindavakeralam.org8/19/2006 2:54:55 AM HK Guruvayur:The suicide of Ammini Amma, an ardent devotee of Sri Krishna, who was humiliated by the

Christian Missionaries is an ample example of the threat Hinduism is facing from the merciless Conversionist thugs. Ammini Amma was one among the victim of Kidnapping attempt by Palayur Immanuel Christian Charity organisation for conversion purpose at Guruvayur Temple. The Kidnapping attempt by these followers of Jesus was spoiled then by the timely intervention of Devotees and Hindu organisation. The photo above depicts her mental agony when she was forced to sit inside the Ambulance of Christian Missionaries.She was crying aloud and praying to Lord Krishna to protect her from these witched wolves.Ammini Amma was not a destitute as thought by the Missionaries, She was from a reputed family, who wilfully decided to spend her last moments within the divine feets of Sri Guruvayoorappan.This conversion attempt shocked and humiliated her and she decided to end her life under the wheels of a running train. This conversion attempt was

with the support of local police and few Security employees in Guruvayur.The media who runs editorials and serial stories on controversies surrounding Sabarimala and Guruvayur were least bothered by this gruesome incident. What's Happening in Guruvayoor ? http://www.kesarionline.org/www/details-template.php?nid=1339 http://img223.imageshack.us/img223/2397/guruvayoorye8.jpg How low will we go? Check out Messenger's low PC-to-Phone call rates. Want to be your own boss? Learn how on Small Business. -- dotcompals: www.dotcompals.in .Org domain Nemes for just 2.5 USDKrishna PrasadDare to give up the comfort of the 'known' and venture into the 'unknown' The more we know, the more we will come to realize what we do not know. If we want to achieve our true potential and live life to the fullest. As Poojya Gurudev said it,

"Open your eyes. Burst your shell. Spread your wings and fly!"Swami ChinmayanandaHate not the sinner - hate the sin; and always hate the sin even with an excess of hatred."

Everyone is raving about the all-new Mail.