Guest guest Posted December 1, 2009 Report Share Posted December 1, 2009 Dear Gurudevs, I thought I would convey some thoughts that came up in my mind. We often find good people who have done nothing wrong in this life, suffering in various ways. They have devotion, they pray fervently to God for relief from their troubles, but no relief seems to come. We begin to wonder why good people suffer so much, in spite of the Puranas saying that God is karunamurti. We are even tempted to lose faith in God. Why does God appear to be so indifferent? When I was thinking on these lines an answer came up in my mind. According to Vedanta each individual has to experience the results of his good and bad actions in some birth or other. This is a rule which even God will not violate. So if He takes compassion on some one and relieves him of his present suffering, the person will have to undergo the same suffering in a future birth. That means there can be only a postponement of the suffering. Rather than postpone it, it is better that he goes through it and becomes free from that sin. A person may be very good in this birth, but he may have committed some sin in some birth long ago, for which he has to suffer now. Moreover, we see from the Puranic stories that even wrongs committed inadvertently give rise to Paapa for which the person will have to suffer. Liberation comes only when a person becomes free from all sin. By postponing suffering the chances of liberation also get postponed. So we have to accept suffering with the feeling that we are thereby going nearer to liberation. God may be giving the suffering only to hasten the person’s liberation. The Brihadaranyaka upanishad says that all suffering is tapas. It therefore purifies the person and makes him fit for liberation. S.N.Sastri Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted December 1, 2009 Report Share Posted December 1, 2009 Hari Om! Very true.... I too believe in this philosophy. I never wanted to take treatment even for my ailings even if promised by many.. I prefer to suffer in this janma itself and get liberted. 2009/12/1 Nilakantan sastri <snsastri Dear Gurudevs,I thought I would convey some thoughts that came up in my mind.We often find good people who have done nothing wrong in this life, suffering in various ways. They have devotion, they pray fervently to God for relief from their troubles, but no relief seems to come. We begin to wonder why good people suffer so much, in spite of the Puranas saying that God is karunamurti. We are even tempted to lose faith in God. Why does God appear to be so indifferent? When I was thinking on these lines an answer came up in my mind. According to Vedanta each individual has to experience the results of his good and bad actions in some birth or other. This is a rule which even God will not violate. So if He takes compassion on some one and relieves him of his present suffering, the person will have to undergo the same suffering in a future birth. That means there can be only a postponement of the suffering. Rather than postpone it, it is better that he goes through it and becomes free from that sin. A person may be very good in this birth, but he may have committed some sin in some birth long ago, for which he has to suffer now. Moreover, we see from the Puranic stories that even wrongs committed inadvertently give rise to Paapa for which the person will have to suffer. Liberation comes only when a person becomes free from all sin. By postponing suffering the chances of liberation also get postponed. So we have to accept suffering with the feeling that we are thereby going nearer to liberation. God may be giving the suffering only to hasten the person’s liberation. The Brihadaranyaka upanishad says that all suffering is tapas. It therefore purifies the person and makes him fit for liberation.S.N.Sastri -- Best regardsJayasree MenonBangaloremy blog link: http://www.pythrukam.blogspot.com/ --A well-thought out plan, execution excellence, market timing, personal leadership are drivers of the growth trajectory. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted December 1, 2009 Report Share Posted December 1, 2009 Dear and respected Sastriji, I enjoyed reading your thoughts and and those thoughts make me think also. I have observed that those who are devotees become closer to God with suffering. They find shanthi in going through the results of one's own past karmaas. As you mentioned, it is a blessing if we are able to think that each adverse circumstances and negative situations leads us closer to liberation. I have heard about a conversation between a disciple and Guru. Disciple asked Guru about the sufferings of Pandavaas in spite of their dharmam and good nature. Disciple said: " Guro, I would rather be a Duryodhana, enjoy the life and then die in the battle field to get veeraswargam. " Guru said: " Yes, seemingly, Durodhana and Kauravaas were very happy and enjoyed the material pleasures. But you do not know about the unrest and agitation in their mind through out their life. They had the enjoyments of senses and body, but an unhappy, greedy and agitated mind never allowed them to enjoy the seemingly enjoyable life. But Pandavaas on the other hand, did lead a good life and abstained from adharmam and so their seemingly miserable life experienced by the senses and body did not affect their inner peace. Bhagavaan's constant presence in their mind (and the real presence as their contemporary) made their suffering bearable and increased their faith in Him. " Sastriji, I am reminded of your interpretation of Melpatthoor's Gagendra moksham " shanthyarthham hi shraanthidosi swakaanaam " - : " It is only for their ultimate welfare that Thou dost inflict such sufferings on thy devotees. " Thank you so much for sharing your thoughts and making us think. Respectful regards and prayers savitri On Tue, Dec 1, 2009 at 3:43 AM, Nilakantan sastri <snsastri wrote: Dear Gurudevs,I thought I would convey some thoughts that came up in my mind.We often find good people who have done nothing wrong in this life, suffering in various ways. They have devotion, they pray fervently to God for relief from their troubles, but no relief seems to come. We begin to wonder why good people suffer so much, in spite of the Puranas saying that God is karunamurti. We are even tempted to lose faith in God. Why does God appear to be so indifferent? When I was thinking on these lines an answer came up in my mind. According to Vedanta each individual has to experience the results of his good and bad actions in some birth or other. This is a rule which even God will not violate. So if He takes compassion on some one and relieves him of his present suffering, the person will have to undergo the same suffering in a future birth. That means there can be only a postponement of the suffering. Rather than postpone it, it is better that he goes through it and becomes free from that sin. A person may be very good in this birth, but he may have committed some sin in some birth long ago, for which he has to suffer now. Moreover, we see from the Puranic stories that even wrongs committed inadvertently give rise to Paapa for which the person will have to suffer. Liberation comes only when a person becomes free from all sin. By postponing suffering the chances of liberation also get postponed. So we have to accept suffering with the feeling that we are thereby going nearer to liberation. God may be giving the suffering only to hasten the person’s liberation. The Brihadaranyaka upanishad says that all suffering is tapas. It therefore purifies the person and makes him fit for liberation.S.N.Sastri Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted December 1, 2009 Report Share Posted December 1, 2009 Dear respected Sastriji and other Gurudevs, Radhe Krishna! This was what exactly the same thought which was passing through in my mind, when I was chanting,     അമരീ-കബരീ-à´à´¾à´°-à´àµà´°à´®à´°àµ€-à´®àµà´–രീകൃതà\ ´‚        ദൂരീകരോതൠദàµà´°à´¿à´¤à´‚ ഗൌരീ-à´šà´°à´£-പങàµà´•à´œà´‚. I was explaining to the participants in the " Narayaneeyam " discussion group we have here, that the woes can only be postponed and not totally destroyed, as said in the stotram, by the expression, " ദൂരീകരോതൠ" . It is only postponing the evil to a future date, may be in the present birth or a future one which the person will be forced to take to wear his/her Prarabdha-karmas. I was wondering whether my explanation was correct or not, but respected Sastriji's clarification which has, now come by itself clarifies my stand. As goes in the story of " Narayanatthu Bhranthan " , the legendary Avadhutha in our Kerala history, when Bhadrakaali asked him whether She can cure him of his elephantiasis of one leg, he tells her that if She does that, he would have to take another janma to wear it out, and hence requests Her, to transfer, if She can, the elephantiasis from that leg to the other! Regards KVG. On Tue, Dec 1, 2009 at 3:13 PM, Nilakantan sastri <snsastri wrote: > > > >  Gurudevs,, > I thought I would convey some thoughts that came up in my mind. > We often find good people who have done nothing wrong in this life, suffering in various ways. They have devotion, they pray fervently to God for relief from their troubles, but no relief seems to come. We begin to wonder why good people suffer so much, in spite of the Puranas saying that God is karunamurti. We are even tempted to lose faith in God. Why does God appear to be so indifferent? When I was thinking on these lines an answer came up in my mind. According to Vedanta each individual has to experience the results of his good and bad actions in some birth or other. This is a rule which even God will not violate. So if He takes compassion on some one and relieves him of his present suffering, the person will have to undergo the same suffering in a future birth. That means there can be only a postponement of the suffering. Rather than postpone it, it is better that he goes through it and becomes free from that sin. A person may be very good in this > birth, but he may have committed some sin in some birth long ago, for which he has to suffer now. Moreover, we see from the Puranic stories that even wrongs committed inadvertently give rise to Paapa for which the person will have to suffer. > Liberation comes only when a person becomes free from all sin. By postponing suffering the chances of liberation also get postponed. So we have to accept suffering with the feeling that we are thereby going nearer to liberation. God may be giving the suffering only to hasten the person’s liberation. > The Brihadaranyaka upanishad says that all suffering is tapas. It therefore purifies the person and makes him fit for liberation. > S.N.Sastri > > -- कृषà¥à¤£à¥‡à¤¤à¤¿ मंगलमॠनाम यसà¥à¤¯ वाचि पà¥à¤°à¤µà¤°à¥à¤¤à¤¤à¥‡ | à¤à¤¸à¥à¤®à¥€à¤à¤µà¤¨à¥à¤¤à¤¿ तसà¥à¤¯à¤¾à¤¶à¥ महापातककोटयः || കൃഷàµà´¨àµà´¨àµ†à´¤à´¿  മംഗളം  നാമ  യസàµà´¯  വാചി  പàµà´°à´µà´°àµâ€à´¤àµà´¤à´¤àµ‡ à´à´¾à´¸àµà´®àµ€à´à´µà´¨àµà´¤à´¿  തസàµà´¯à´¾à´¶àµ  മഹാപാതകകൊടയ:   . Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted December 2, 2009 Report Share Posted December 2, 2009 HARI AUM Is there anything 'his' name cannot cure, correct, change, delete, create, enlighten, save, liberate, bend, eliminate, relieve, provide.......We are so fortunate to have 'him' around as 'gurupavanapuraadeesha'. Just let oneself lose in 'him'. I think the thoughts we have were the same that Arjuna had and more over he experienced life very very badly than most of us can ever even imagine. Let us see what Bhagavan said to Arjuna in some 'his' lines of 'his' 'gita. These verses are very relieving and providing 'shantih': "mAtrAsparshAstu kaunteya shItoShNasukhaduHkhadAH . AgamApAyino.anityAstA.nstitikShasva bhArata" - 2/14.. "karmaNo hyapi boddhavya.n boddhavya.n cha vikarmaNaH . akarmaNashcha boddhavya.n gahanA karmaNo gatiH" - 4/17 "yathaidhA.nsi samiddho.agnirbhasmasAtkurute.arjuna . j~nAnAgniH sarvakarmANi bhasmasAtkurute tathA" - 4/37 "ananyAshchintayanto mA.n ye janAH paryupAsate . eShA.n nityAbhiyuktAnA.n yogakShema.n vahAmyaham" - 9/22 "kShipra.n bhavati dharmAtmA shashvachChAnti.n nigachChati . kaunteya pratijAnIhi na me bhaktaH praNashyati" - 9/31 "sarvadharmAnparityajya mAmeka.n sharaNa.n vraja . aha.n tvA sarvapApebhyo mokShayiShyAmi mA shuchaH" - 18/66.. Regards Balagopal NARAYANA NARAYANA NARAYANA The INTERNET now has a personality. YOURS! See your Homepage. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted December 2, 2009 Report Share Posted December 2, 2009  Jai Shri Krishna!!! Taken in conjunction with the verses below, does it make sense to interpret this to mean that the Lord does intervene to the extent of allowing, even hastening, sufferings into this life so that one can be liberated? Does anyone have any other thoughts on how to reconcile the Lord's promises in these verses with the impersonal Prarabdha-karma described in the posts below? Manmanaa bhava madbhakto madyaajee maam namaskuru;Maamevaishyasi satyam te pratijaane priyo’si me.65. Fix thy mind on Me, be devoted to Me, sacrifice to Me, bow down to Me. Thou shaltcome even to Me; truly do I promise unto thee, (for) thou art dear to Me. Sarvadharmaan parityajya maamekam sharanam vraja;Aham twaa sarvapaapebhyo mokshayishyaami maa shuchah.66. Abandoning all duties, take refuge in Me alone; I will liberate thee from all sins; grievenot. In His Service, Radhe - K.V Gopalakrishna guruvayur Tuesday, December 01, 2009 1:49 PM Re: [Guruvayur] Some thoughts Dear respected Sastriji and other Gurudevs,Radhe Krishna!This was what exactly the same thought which was passing through in mymind, when I was chanting, അമരീ-കബരീ-à´à´¾à´°-à´àµà´°à´®à´°àµ€-à´®àµà´–രീകൃതം ദൂരീകരോതൠദàµà´°à´¿à´¤à´‚ ഗൌരീ-à´šà´°à´£-പങàµà´•à´œà´‚.I was explaining to the participants in the "Narayaneeyam" discussiongroup we have here, that the woes can only be postponed and nottotally destroyed, as said in the stotram, by the expression, "ദൂരീകരോതൠ". It is only postponing the evil to a future date, may bein the present birth or a future one which the person will be forcedto take to wear his/her Prarabdha-karmas. I was wondering whether myexplanation was correct or not, but respected Sastriji's clarificationwhich has, now come by itself clarifies my stand.As goes in the story of "Narayanatthu Bhranthan", the legendaryAvadhutha in our Kerala history, when Bhadrakaali asked him whetherShe can cure him of his elephantiasis of one leg, he tells her that ifShe does that, he would have to take another janma to wear it out, andhence requests Her, to transfer, if She can, the elephantiasis fromthat leg to the other!RegardsKVG.On Tue, Dec 1, 2009 at 3:13 PM, Nilakantan sastri <snsastri > wrote:>>>> Gurudevs,,> I thought I would convey some thoughts that came up in my mind.> We often find good people who have done nothing wrong in this life, suffering in various ways. They have devotion, they pray fervently to God for relief from their troubles, but no relief seems to come. We begin to wonder why good people suffer so much, in spite of the Puranas saying that God is karunamurti. We are even tempted to lose faith in God. Why does God appear to be so indifferent? When I was thinking on these lines an answer came up in my mind. According to Vedanta each individual has to experience the results of his good and bad actions in some birth or other. This is a rule which even God will not violate. So if He takes compassion on some one and relieves him of his present suffering, the person will have to undergo the same suffering in a future birth. That means there can be only a postponement of the suffering. Rather than postpone it, it is better that he goes through it and becomes free from that sin. A person may be very good in this> birth, but he may have committed some sin in some birth long ago, for which he has to suffer now. Moreover, we see from the Puranic stories that even wrongs committed inadvertently give rise to Paapa for which the person will have to suffer.> Liberation comes only when a person becomes free from all sin. By postponing suffering the chances of liberation also get postponed. So we have to accept suffering with the feeling that we are thereby going nearer to liberation. God may be giving the suffering only to hasten the person’s liberation.> The Brihadaranyaka upanishad says that all suffering is tapas. It therefore purifies the person and makes him fit for liberation.> S.N.Sastri>> --कृषà¥à¤£à¥‡à¤¤à¤¿ मंगलमॠनाम यसà¥à¤¯ वाचि पà¥à¤°à¤µà¤°à¥à¤¤à¤¤à¥‡ |à¤à¤¸à¥à¤®à¥€à¤à¤µà¤¨à¥à¤¤à¤¿ तसà¥à¤¯à¤¾à¤¶à¥ महापातककोटयः ||കൃഷàµà´¨àµà´¨àµ†à´¤à´¿ മംഗളം നാമ യസàµà´¯ വാചി à´ªàµà´°à´µà´°àµâ€à´¤àµà´¤à´¤àµ‡à´à´¾à´¸àµà´®àµ€à´à´µà´¨àµà´¤à´¿ തസàµà´¯à´¾à´¶àµ മഹാപാതകകൊടയ: . Checked by AVG - www.avg.com Version: 8.5.426 / Virus Database: 270.14.88/2538 - Release 12/01/09 07:59:00 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted December 2, 2009 Report Share Posted December 2, 2009 Please disregard, the previous reply on this topic as it was sent out by mistake. namo narayana Respected Radheji, The reason for getting born in this material plane is the Karmic entanglement, BOTH good karmas and bad karmas are responsible for this entanglement because the arise from the "Ego-ship" or the "Doer-ship". Hence if a jeevatma wants to attain liberation, he must be free from both paapam (iron shackles) and punyam (gold shackles) which take him to either naraka or swaraga respectively, but after exhausting his karmas there he then comes back to this material existence again. To burn all the karmas, Sanchita, Prarabdha and Aagami karmas is not possible for weak humans like us in this day and age, and hence one of the methods which is the best suited for this Kali yuga is undergoing "Sharangathi" to Lord Narayana. After performing a whole-hearted, sincere sharangathi to the Lord, the Lord removes the sanchita karma of his sharangathaa and hence there cannot be any agami karmas (those karmas which are added to the sanchita karmas during life), the Lord then adjusts the prarabha karma of His sharangathaa such that at the end of his life, the sharangathaa is led to moksham in Sri Vaikuntham where he constantly enjoys serving the Lord This method is particularly prescribed in the Sri Vaishnava Sampradayam and here the devotee "approaches" an acharya with humility, sincerity to formally surrender his soul and the responsibility of safe-gausrding his soul at the feet of the Lord. This process is called by various names, such as "Prapatti", "bhara- samarpanam" (giving up the responsibility of ones soul", "Bhara-nyasam". This sharangathi consists of five angas 1. Anukoolya Sankalpam: Doing only those acts that are prescribed by the Lord in the shaastra to please Him. 2. Pratikulya Varjanam: Not doing any act transgressing the shaastras which will displease the Lord. 3. Maha-vishwasam: Having an unshakeable faith that the Lord Narayana, Himself is the only upaaya to attain salvation and not to seek anyone else for help under any circumstances. This is the most important aspect of Sharangathi. 4. Kaarpanyam: Realizing the limitations of the self in achieving liberation by one's own merit and effort. It is important to know for a common man, that he by himself cannot extricate himself form the endless karmic entanglements without the help of the Lord. 5. Goptrtva Varanam: Always requesting the Lord to help us in our daily lives and in important decisions till the last breath. The beauty of sharangathi margam is that it is vratham of the Lord Himself, to save and assure liberation to His sharangathaas. Here the jeevatma assumes no responsibility of getting moksham by himself, but express his inability and weakness to the Lord sincerely and the Lord Himself has to take the burden of granting the sharangathaa liberation. Gajendra is a wonderful example of a sharangathaa. Initially he was fighting with the crocodile (Huhu gandharva) and was thinking that he with his great physical might be able to release himself from the crocodile. Till the time he was fighting with the crocodile, the Lord did not come to his rescue. Only when he realized that no amount of strength of his own or his family would save him and only the Lord can save him, he wholeheartedly sincerely surrendered and the Lord HAD to come and rescue His sharangathaa as per His own vratham. In this path the Lord Himself is the way to achieve Him. In the end this margam is easier than bhakti margam which may take several janmas of purifiying one-self of all karmas until one reaches moksham. Sincerely, Kamlesh --- On Wed, 12/2/09, Radhe <shaantih wrote: Radhe <shaantihRe: [Guruvayur] Some thoughtsguruvayur Date: Wednesday, December 2, 2009, 9:50 AM  Jai Shri Krishna!!! Taken in conjunction with the verses below, does it make sense to interpret this to mean that the Lord does intervene to the extent of allowing, even hastening, sufferings into this life so that one can be liberated? Does anyone have any other thoughts on how to reconcile the Lord's promises in these verses with the impersonal Prarabdha-karma described in the posts below? Manmanaa bhava madbhakto madyaajee maam namaskuru;Maamevaishyasi satyam te pratijaane priyo’si me.65. Fix thy mind on Me, be devoted to Me, sacrifice to Me, bow down to Me. Thou shaltcome even to Me; truly do I promise unto thee, (for) thou art dear to Me. Sarvadharmaan parityajya maamekam sharanam vraja;Aham twaa sarvapaapebhyo mokshayishyaami maa shuchah.66. Abandoning all duties, take refuge in Me alone; I will liberate thee from all sins; grievenot. In His Service, Radhe - K.V Gopalakrishna guruvayur@grou ps.com Tuesday, December 01, 2009 1:49 PM Re: [Guruvayur] Some thoughts Dear respected Sastriji and other Gurudevs,Radhe Krishna!This was what exactly the same thought which was passing through in mymind, when I was chanting, അമരീ-കബരീ-à´à´¾à´°-à´àµà´°à´®à´°àµ€-à´®àµà´–രീകൃതം ദൂരീകരോതൠദàµà´°à´¿à´¤à´‚ ഗൌരീ-à´šà´°à´£-പങàµà´•à´œà´‚.I was explaining to the participants in the "Narayaneeyam" discussiongroup we have here, that the woes can only be postponed and nottotally destroyed, as said in the stotram, by the expression, "ദൂരീകരോതൠ". It is only postponing the evil to a future date, may bein the present birth or a future one which the person will be forcedto take to wear his/her Prarabdha-karmas. I was wondering whether myexplanation was correct or not, but respected Sastriji's clarificationwhich has, now come by itself clarifies my stand.As goes in the story of "Narayanatthu Bhranthan", the legendaryAvadhutha in our Kerala history, when Bhadrakaali asked him whetherShe can cure him of his elephantiasis of one leg, he tells her that ifShe does that, he would have to take another janma to wear it out, andhence requests Her, to transfer, if She can, the elephantiasis fromthat leg to the other!RegardsKVG.On Tue, Dec 1, 2009 at 3:13 PM, Nilakantan sastri <snsastri > wrote:>>>> Gurudevs,,> I thought I would convey some thoughts that came up in my mind.> We often find good people who have done nothing wrong in this life, suffering in various ways. They have devotion, they pray fervently to God for relief from their troubles, but no relief seems to come. We begin to wonder why good people suffer so much, in spite of the Puranas saying that God is karunamurti. We are even tempted to lose faith in God. Why does God appear to be so indifferent? When I was thinking on these lines an answer came up in my mind. According to Vedanta each individual has to experience the results of his good and bad actions in some birth or other. This is a rule which even God will not violate. So if He takes compassion on some one and relieves him of his present suffering, the person will have to undergo the same suffering in a future birth. That means there can be only a postponement of the suffering. Rather than postpone it, it is better that he goes through it and becomes free from that sin. A person may be very good in this> birth, but he may have committed some sin in some birth long ago, for which he has to suffer now. Moreover, we see from the Puranic stories that even wrongs committed inadvertently give rise to Paapa for which the person will have to suffer.> Liberation comes only when a person becomes free from all sin. By postponing suffering the chances of liberation also get postponed. So we have to accept suffering with the feeling that we are thereby going nearer to liberation. God may be giving the suffering only to hasten the person’s liberation.> The Brihadaranyaka upanishad says that all suffering is tapas. It therefore purifies the person and makes him fit for liberation.> S.N.Sastri>> --कृषà¥à¤£à¥‡à¤¤à¤¿ मंगलमॠनाम यसà¥à¤¯ वाचि पà¥à¤°à¤µà¤°à¥à¤¤à¤¤à¥‡ |à¤à¤¸à¥à¤®à¥€à¤à¤µà¤¨à¥à¤¤à¤¿ तसà¥à¤¯à¤¾à¤¶à¥ महापातककोटयः ||കൃഷàµà´¨àµà´¨àµ†à´¤à´¿ മംഗളം നാമ യസàµà´¯ വാചി à´ªàµà´°à´µà´°àµâ€à´¤àµà´¤à´¤àµ‡à´à´¾à´¸àµà´®àµ€à´à´µà´¨àµà´¤à´¿ തസàµà´¯à´¾à´¶àµ മഹാപാതകകൊടയ: . Checked by AVG - www.avg.com Version: 8.5.426 / Virus Database: 270.14.88/2538 - Release 12/01/09 07:59:00 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted December 3, 2009 Report Share Posted December 3, 2009 Very true and difficult to pass the parikshas from God,especially since our approach to God may have been on the wrong path at the start of this life. Slowly and surely, all of us can be on right track... Here is a recording from Swami Udit Chaitanyaji's Bhagawatamrutam daily program on Asianet on how a BHAKTA should be, citing verses from Srimad Bhagawatam,Bhagawat Gita (on the topic of Prahlada bhakti). OM NAMO NARAYANAYA: Anil Re: [Guruvayur] Some thoughts Please disregard, the previous reply on this topic as it was sent out by mistake. namo narayana Respected Radheji, The reason for getting born in this material plane is the Karmic entanglement, BOTH good karmas and bad karmas are responsible for this entanglement because the arise from the "Ego-ship" or the "Doer-ship". Hence if a jeevatma wants to attain liberation, he must be free from both paapam (iron shackles) and punyam (gold shackles) which take him to either naraka or swaraga respectively, but after exhausting his karmas there he then comes back to this material existence again. To burn all the karmas, Sanchita, Prarabdha and Aagami karmas is not possible for weak humans like us in this day and age, and hence one of the methods which is the best suited for this Kali yuga is undergoing "Sharangathi" to Lord Narayana. After performing a whole-hearted, sincere sharangathi to the Lord, the Lord removes the sanchita karma of his sharangathaa and hence there cannot be any agami karmas (those karmas which are added to the sanchita karmas during life), the Lord then adjusts the prarabha karma of His sharangathaa such that at the end of his life, the sharangathaa is led to moksham in Sri Vaikuntham where he constantly enjoys serving the Lord This method is particularly prescribed in the Sri Vaishnava Sampradayam and here the devotee "approaches" an acharya with humility, sincerity to formally surrender his soul and the responsibility of safe-gausrding his soul at the feet of the Lord. This process is called by various names, such as "Prapatti", "bhara- samarpanam" (giving up the responsibility of ones soul", "Bhara-nyasam". This sharangathi consists of five angas 1. Anukoolya Sankalpam: Doing only those acts that are prescribed by the Lord in the shaastra to please Him. 2. Pratikulya Varjanam: Not doing any act transgressing the shaastras which will displease the Lord. 3. Maha-vishwasam: Having an unshakeable faith that the Lord Narayana, Himself is the only upaaya to attain salvation and not to seek anyone else for help under any circumstances. This is the most important aspect of Sharangathi. 4. Kaarpanyam: Realizing the limitations of the self in achieving liberation by one's own merit and effort. It is important to know for a common man, that he by himself cannot extricate himself form the endless karmic entanglements without the help of the Lord. 5. Goptrtva Varanam: Always requesting the Lord to help us in our daily lives and in important decisions till the last breath. The beauty of sharangathi margam is that it is vratham of the Lord Himself, to save and assure liberation to His sharangathaas. Here the jeevatma assumes no responsibility of getting moksham by himself, but express his inability and weakness to the Lord sincerely and the Lord Himself has to take the burden of granting the sharangathaa liberation. Gajendra is a wonderful example of a sharangathaa. Initially he was fighting with the crocodile (Huhu gandharva) and was thinking that he with his great physical might be able to release himself from the crocodile. Till the time he was fighting with the crocodile, the Lord did not come to his rescue. Only when he realized that no amount of strength of his own or his family would save him and only the Lord can save him, he wholeheartedly sincerely surrendered and the Lord HAD to come and rescue His sharangathaa as per His own vratham. In this path the Lord Himself is the way to achieve Him. In the end this margam is easier than bhakti margam which may take several janmas of purifiying one-self of all karmas until one reaches moksham. Sincerely, Kamlesh 1 of 1 File(s) Voice019.amr Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted December 3, 2009 Report Share Posted December 3, 2009  Om Namo Narayana Respected Kamleshji: Thank you so much for your beautifully written response. Everything about it makes so much sense to me and I am grateful to read about what I know is my path. I often refer to myself as a bhakta, but I think in my heart I am really a Sharangathaa (or hope I am) which I presume subsumes bhakti. May He grant me the strength to walk in Sharangathi under His guidance and protection. Shri Krishna saranam mamah. In His Service, Radhe - Veryytterium guruvayur Wednesday, December 02, 2009 1:17 PM Re: [Guruvayur] Some thoughts Please disregard, the previous reply on this topic as it was sent out by mistake. namo narayana Respected Radheji, The reason for getting born in this material plane is the Karmic entanglement, BOTH good karmas and bad karmas are responsible for this entanglement because the arise from the "Ego-ship" or the "Doer-ship". Hence if a jeevatma wants to attain liberation, he must be free from both paapam (iron shackles) and punyam (gold shackles) which take him to either naraka or swaraga respectively, but after exhausting his karmas there he then comes back to this material existence again. To burn all the karmas, Sanchita, Prarabdha and Aagami karmas is not possible for weak humans like us in this day and age, and hence one of the methods which is the best suited for this Kali yuga is undergoing "Sharangathi" to Lord Narayana. After performing a whole-hearted, sincere sharangathi to the Lord, the Lord removes the sanchita karma of his sharangathaa and hence there cannot be any agami karmas (those karmas which are added to the sanchita karmas during life), the Lord then adjusts the prarabha karma of His sharangathaa such that at the end of his life, the sharangathaa is led to moksham in Sri Vaikuntham where he constantly enjoys serving the Lord This method is particularly prescribed in the Sri Vaishnava Sampradayam and here the devotee "approaches" an acharya with humility, sincerity to formally surrender his soul and the responsibility of safe-gausrding his soul at the feet of the Lord. This process is called by various names, such as "Prapatti", "bhara- samarpanam" (giving up the responsibility of ones soul", "Bhara-nyasam". This sharangathi consists of five angas 1. Anukoolya Sankalpam: Doing only those acts that are prescribed by the Lord in the shaastra to please Him. 2. Pratikulya Varjanam: Not doing any act transgressing the shaastras which will displease the Lord. 3. Maha-vishwasam: Having an unshakeable faith that the Lord Narayana, Himself is the only upaaya to attain salvation and not to seek anyone else for help under any circumstances. This is the most important aspect of Sharangathi. 4. Kaarpanyam: Realizing the limitations of the self in achieving liberation by one's own merit and effort. It is important to know for a common man, that he by himself cannot extricate himself form the endless karmic entanglements without the help of the Lord. 5. Goptrtva Varanam: Always requesting the Lord to help us in our daily lives and in important decisions till the last breath. The beauty of sharangathi margam is that it is vratham of the Lord Himself, to save and assure liberation to His sharangathaas. Here the jeevatma assumes no responsibility of getting moksham by himself, but express his inability and weakness to the Lord sincerely and the Lord Himself has to take the burden of granting the sharangathaa liberation. Gajendra is a wonderful example of a sharangathaa. Initially he was fighting with the crocodile (Huhu gandharva) and was thinking that he with his great physical might be able to release himself from the crocodile. Till the time he was fighting with the crocodile, the Lord did not come to his rescue. Only when he realized that no amount of strength of his own or his family would save him and only the Lord can save him, he wholeheartedly sincerely surrendered and the Lord HAD to come and rescue His sharangathaa as per His own vratham. In this path the Lord Himself is the way to achieve Him. In the end this margam is easier than bhakti margam which may take several janmas of purifiying one-self of all karmas until one reaches moksham. Sincerely, Kamlesh --- On Wed, 12/2/09, Radhe <shaantih (AT) comcast (DOT) net> wrote: Radhe <shaantih (AT) comcast (DOT) net>Re: [Guruvayur] Some thoughtsguruvayur Date: Wednesday, December 2, 2009, 9:50 AM  Jai Shri Krishna!!! Taken in conjunction with the verses below, does it make sense to interpret this to mean that the Lord does intervene to the extent of allowing, even hastening, sufferings into this life so that one can be liberated? Does anyone have any other thoughts on how to reconcile the Lord's promises in these verses with the impersonal Prarabdha-karma described in the posts below? Manmanaa bhava madbhakto madyaajee maam namaskuru;Maamevaishyasi satyam te pratijaane priyo’si me.65. Fix thy mind on Me, be devoted to Me, sacrifice to Me, bow down to Me. Thou shaltcome even to Me; truly do I promise unto thee, (for) thou art dear to Me. Sarvadharmaan parityajya maamekam sharanam vraja;Aham twaa sarvapaapebhyo mokshayishyaami maa shuchah.66. Abandoning all duties, take refuge in Me alone; I will liberate thee from all sins; grievenot. In His Service, Radhe - K.V Gopalakrishna guruvayur@grou ps.com Tuesday, December 01, 2009 1:49 PM Re: [Guruvayur] Some thoughts Dear respected Sastriji and other Gurudevs,Radhe Krishna!This was what exactly the same thought which was passing through in mymind, when I was chanting, അമരീ-കബരീ-à´à´¾à´°-à´àµà´°à´®à´°àµ€-à´®àµà´–രീകൃതം ദൂരീകരോതൠദàµà´°à´¿à´¤à´‚ ഗൌരീ-à´šà´°à´£-പങàµà´•à´œà´‚.I was explaining to the participants in the "Narayaneeyam" discussiongroup we have here, that the woes can only be postponed and nottotally destroyed, as said in the stotram, by the expression, "ദൂരീകരോതൠ". It is only postponing the evil to a future date, may bein the present birth or a future one which the person will be forcedto take to wear his/her Prarabdha-karmas. I was wondering whether myexplanation was correct or not, but respected Sastriji's clarificationwhich has, now come by itself clarifies my stand.As goes in the story of "Narayanatthu Bhranthan", the legendaryAvadhutha in our Kerala history, when Bhadrakaali asked him whetherShe can cure him of his elephantiasis of one leg, he tells her that ifShe does that, he would have to take another janma to wear it out, andhence requests Her, to transfer, if She can, the elephantiasis fromthat leg to the other!RegardsKVG.On Tue, Dec 1, 2009 at 3:13 PM, Nilakantan sastri <snsastri > wrote:>>>> Gurudevs,,> I thought I would convey some thoughts that came up in my mind.> We often find good people who have done nothing wrong in this life, suffering in various ways. They have devotion, they pray fervently to God for relief from their troubles, but no relief seems to come. We begin to wonder why good people suffer so much, in spite of the Puranas saying that God is karunamurti. We are even tempted to lose faith in God. Why does God appear to be so indifferent? When I was thinking on these lines an answer came up in my mind. According to Vedanta each individual has to experience the results of his good and bad actions in some birth or other. This is a rule which even God will not violate. So if He takes compassion on some one and relieves him of his present suffering, the person will have to undergo the same suffering in a future birth. That means there can be only a postponement of the suffering. Rather than postpone it, it is better that he goes through it and becomes free from that sin. A person may be very good in this> birth, but he may have committed some sin in some birth long ago, for which he has to suffer now. Moreover, we see from the Puranic stories that even wrongs committed inadvertently give rise to Paapa for which the person will have to suffer.> Liberation comes only when a person becomes free from all sin. By postponing suffering the chances of liberation also get postponed. So we have to accept suffering with the feeling that we are thereby going nearer to liberation. God may be giving the suffering only to hasten the person’s liberation.> The Brihadaranyaka upanishad says that all suffering is tapas. It therefore purifies the person and makes him fit for liberation.> S.N.Sastri>> --कृषà¥à¤£à¥‡à¤¤à¤¿ मंगलमॠनाम यसà¥à¤¯ वाचि पà¥à¤°à¤µà¤°à¥à¤¤à¤¤à¥‡ |à¤à¤¸à¥à¤®à¥€à¤à¤µà¤¨à¥à¤¤à¤¿ तसà¥à¤¯à¤¾à¤¶à¥ महापातककोटयः ||കൃഷàµà´¨àµà´¨àµ†à´¤à´¿ മംഗളം നാമ യസàµà´¯ വാചി à´ªàµà´°à´µà´°àµâ€à´¤àµà´¤à´¤àµ‡à´à´¾à´¸àµà´®àµ€à´à´µà´¨àµà´¤à´¿ തസàµà´¯à´¾à´¶àµ മഹാപാതകകൊടയ: . Checked by AVG - www.avg.com Version: 8.5.426 / Virus Database: 270.14.88/2538 - Release 12/01/09 07:59:00 Checked by AVG - www.avg.com Version: 8.5.426 / Virus Database: 270.14.90/2540 - Release 12/02/09 07:33:00 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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