Guest guest Posted October 6, 2006 Report Share Posted October 6, 2006 Hi friends Sometimes i think there is God but sometimes i think there is no such thing in this world , so I am in a condition of confusion . And friends there are so many thing which i noticed,that makes me confirm about the absense of any God in this world. Pls show me the right way. Thanking you, Puran Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted October 6, 2006 Report Share Posted October 6, 2006 Namaste Puranji; Are we all not in a way confused in this world? We are all confused about GOD, our actions, responsibilities, spirituality and my place in all these variety of things! The first thing you have to find out yourself what is "The thing" you like to do with enjoyment, it can be worldly thing also. You concentrate on it for some time and DO IT without thinking any other thing, about GOD etc. Enjoy yourself, do it with love. This way the mind is trained to do something for future what you would like. Next step, you will take later. Nobody including Sant, mahatma, Dharmacharya, kathakar, etc. knows everything about GOD, so if you ask different people, you will have the different replies, ideas etc. That will confuse you more, please note. You will find so many ways and things, such as Yog, Bhakti, Gyan, GeetaGyan, swadhyaya, Gayatri sadhana, meditation, kirtan, chanting, follow only my Guru etc. etc. Padmakant Khambhati puran koranga <puran_koranga87 wrote: Hi friends Sometimes i think there is God but sometimes i think there is no such thing in this world , so I am in a condition of confusion . And friends there are so many thing which i noticed,that makes me confirm about the absense of any God in this world. Pls show me the right way.Thanking you, Puran Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted October 6, 2006 Report Share Posted October 6, 2006 Loving Divine, Pranam. In past we had a very good, detailed discussion on the subject titled 'God - definition'; you may want to go through it from the archive & read all responses: /message/264. Also read the following emails: /message/127 /message/302 Sometimes I feel that whether God is there or not need not be discussed at all because it is not the subject of discussion rather has to have 'anubhuti' or divine perception! No matter how much we discuss we will not understand until we pay our whole hearted attention ( /message/292). Babaji gives these examples - talking about what's on menu will not cure your hunger or talking about medicine will not cure your disease; you have to cook & eat or take medicine to be cured!!! Now this can be as simple as accepting God is ALL without doubt and doing everything for Him/His pleasure or making some efforts in controlling your mind, calming it down so that you can perceive what God is via yoga-mediation-mantra chanting - whatever suits your temperament! Watch your every single breath no matter which activity you are involved in; you will definitely find your answer! Good Luck! Love, always at Thy Divine Feet On 6 Oct 2006 07:20:05 -0000, puran koranga <puran_koranga87 wrote: Hi friends Sometimes i think there is God but sometimes i think there is no such thing in this world , so I am in a condition of confusion . And friends there are so many thing which i noticed,that makes me confirm about the absense of any God in this world. Pls show me the right way. Thanking you, Puran Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted October 6, 2006 Report Share Posted October 6, 2006 Puran Ji; There is ghee in milk but can you see it? No. But there is a process by which the ghee can come out. So similarly, if you follow a bona fide process of 'sadhana' you will see God in everything. Avadhoot puran koranga <puran_koranga87 Sent: Friday, October 6, 2006 12:20:05 AM Is there God in this World? Hi friends Sometimes i think there is God but sometimes i think there is no such thing in this world , so I am in a condition of confusion . And friends there are so many thing which i noticed,that makes me confirm about the absense of any God in this world. Pls show me the right way.Thanking you, Puran Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted October 7, 2006 Report Share Posted October 7, 2006 SHREE HARI MESSAGE SHORTENED BY MODERATOR Today’s world reels under the duress of strife and wars of various dimensions. Man amidst these turbulent and fragmented times seems to have lost the essence of living as one humanity. Man the most evolved and sophisticated of species is thought to be endowed with the sixth sense, a much higher and subtler form of intuitive capabilities that allows him to feel and communicate with the larger cosmos and be in harmony with it. But today man seems to be the cause of much disharmony which prevails around us. Science and technology based on rationality has not solved all the needs and aspirations of humanity and in many ways have also disrupted the harmony (and unable to explain many things). In short, man being deeply dissatisfied with his existence wants to embark on a spiritual journey and build bridges across humanity and across other species. It is high time that all of us irrespective of our caste, creed, Religion, national and ethnic boundaries should once again rekindle our spiritual energies to the essence of human existence in harmony with the cosmos. --- puran koranga <puran_koranga87 wrote: > > Hi friends > i am Puran, 24 yrs, Male, from New Delhi . > Sometimes i think there is God but sometimes i > think there is nothing such thing in this world ,so > i am in a condition of confussion . > > And friends there r so many thing which i noticed > ,that makes me confirm about the absense of any God > in this world . Pls show me the right way. > > Thanking you > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted October 7, 2006 Report Share Posted October 7, 2006 Hi, The question asked by almost all the youngsters, how to see the GOD? Could you tell us what we should do in plain simple english to explain them ? Regards Skandaavadhuta maharaja <avadhutamaharaja wrote: Puran Ji; There is ghee in milk but can you see it? No. But there is a process by which the ghee can come out. So similarly, if you follow a bona fide process of 'sadhana' you will see God in everything. Avadhoot puran koranga <puran_koranga87 Sent: Friday, October 6, 2006 12:20:05 AM Is there God in this World? Hi friends Sometimes i think there is God but sometimes i think there is no such thing in this world , so I am in a condition of confusion . And friends there are so many thing which i noticed,that makes me confirm about the absense of any God in this world. Pls show me the right way.Thanking you, Puran All new Mail "The new Interface is stunning in its simplicity and ease of use." - PC Magazine Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted October 7, 2006 Report Share Posted October 7, 2006 I can empathize with Puran regarding his doubt about God. Many of us have the same dilemma with no clear cut answer. Historically, the concept of God was first introduced by very early Humans. When they did not understand a phenomenon, they described it as an act of God. For instance, if a fire was started in the jungle by 'lightning', it was described as God of Fire. Similarly, God of Wind, God of Creation, God of prosperity, God of Learning, etc. Over a period of time, that definition has been refined. But the basic premise remains pretty much the same. However, the outcome of this was very positive - introduction of Religion - which is the Social Road Map for Humans to behave and live socially with each other. Principles like 'do not steal', respect your parents, love your neighbors, etc. Surely, you have heard most of them over a period of time. In the end, what makes you happy within the norms of society is what matters. If pursuing the concept of God is what makes you happy, by all means pursue it. Just do not hurt others. But on the other hand playing Baseball is what makes you happy, then that is what you should do. From my point of view, you can be as happy or happier playing Baseball as any one pursuing "stasang", renunciation, lose your ego, etc. This is my perspective and may not be the most popular but it is real and not bogged down by a lot of artificial definitions and preachings. And you do not have to Define or believe in God. Happiness is what matters in the totality. And you can continue to enjoy your career, family life, friends, etc. and be a good person as well as a productive member of the society. Good luck. Chandra puran koranga <puran_koranga87 Sent: Friday, October 6, 2006 12:20:05 AM Is there God in this World? Hi friends Sometimes i think there is God but sometimes i think there is no such thing in this world , so I am in a condition of confusion . And friends there are so many thing which i noticed,that makes me confirm about the absense of any God in this world. Pls show me the right way.Thanking you, Puran Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted October 7, 2006 Report Share Posted October 7, 2006 Thank you. Yes, regarding simple procedure for a completely guaranteed path of success we must not accept the words of anyone except Bhagavan-God- or His appointed representative. I hope you agree on this much. Next, we must since this is a Gita forum accept the one Supreme Being [eko bhagavan devaki-putram] that being Shree Krishna [Gita 10.8-11]. As far as His representive He does mention the 'parampara system' in the Gita [evam parampara praptam]. Such a person must be a devotee of Krishna and His friend ['bhaktosi me sakha chetee']. Such a soul sees Lord Krishna always and everywhere. Next we must cry, just like Draupadi, who cried and Shree Krishna Himself appeared. So we must ask Krishna with complete sincerity to lead us to Him, to be steeped in love and devotion. The instructions of the Lord in the fourth chapter of the Gita, verse 34, says that in order to know the truth we must approach a bona fide spiritual master. (This mostly applies to the seekers of knowledge - jnana yoga, but for a Devotee of God, He can receive guidance directly from Krishna - Krishnam Vande Jagat Guru - Moderator's addition per Swami Maharajji's teachings). Thank you again, Avadhoot (message Shortened and edited by Moderator) skanda kumar <D_Skandakumar Sent: Saturday, October 7, 2006 5:14:53 AMRe: Is there God in this World? Hi, The question asked by almost all the youngsters, how to see the GOD? Could you tell us what we should do in plain simple english to explain them ? Regards Skandaavadhuta maharaja <avadhutamaharaja@ > wrote: Puran Ji; There is ghee in milk but can you see it? No. But there is a process by which the ghee can come out. So similarly, if you follow a bona fide process of 'sadhana' you will see God in everything. Avadhoot puran koranga <puran_koranga87@ rediffmail. com>@grou ps.comFriday, October 6, 2006 12:20:05 AM Is there God in this World? Hi friends Sometimes i think there is God but sometimes i think there is no such thing in this world , so I am in a condition of confusion . And friends there are so many thing which i noticed,that makes me confirm about the absense of any God in this world. Pls show me the right way.Thanking you, Puran All new Mail "The new Interface is stunning in its simplicity and ease of use." - PC Magazine Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted October 8, 2006 Report Share Posted October 8, 2006 Skandakumar; For the beginners the Lord speaks of His appearance in nature first. This is the concept of virata or the universal form as described by Krishna in the 10th chapter of Gita-'of purifiers I am the wind, of fishes I am the shark, of rivers I am the Ganges,of beasts I am the lion, among birds I am Garuda, of snakes I am Ananta,' etc. Dear souls; Happiness is what we want indeed, but material happiness is not real, because it is temporary and illusory. It is for those whose vision is tweaked. A sadhu sees for eternity. He only engages in those activities which will bring eternal happiness-ananta sukham. It is a matter of growing up spiritually. Avadhoot skanda kumar <D_Skandakumar Sent: Saturday, October 7, 2006 5:14:53 AMRe: Is there God in this World? Hi, The question asked by almost all the youngsters, how to see the GOD? Could you tell us what we should do in plain simple english to explain them ? Regards Skandaavadhuta maharaja <avadhutamaharaja@ > wrote: Puran Ji; There is ghee in milk but can you see it? No. But there is a process by which the ghee can come out. So similarly, if you follow a bona fide process of 'sadhana' you will see God in everything. Avadhoot puran koranga <puran_koranga87@ rediffmail. com>@grou ps.comFriday, October 6, 2006 12:20:05 AM Is there God in this World? Hi friends Sometimes i think there is God but sometimes i think there is no such thing in this world , so I am in a condition of confusion . And friends there are so many thing which i noticed,that makes me confirm about the absense of any God in this world. Pls show me the right way.Thanking you, Puran All new Mail "The new Interface is stunning in its simplicity and ease of use." - PC Magazine Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted October 8, 2006 Report Share Posted October 8, 2006 Shree Hari From Various Sadhaks ---- " Ajay Rahl " <ajayrahl Hello Friend, Om Namah Shivaya There is no sure thing in this world. God lives in everyones Heart and Soul. I was myself a non believer about six months ago though I had a Tattoo of AUM on my body for about 13 years, I had gone to india after an injuiry from the U.K and for some reason Lord Siva touched my Heart and now I'm a Siva Devotee. My Friend have Faith and Lord Siva will always be with you. Om Namah Sivaya Ajay " Yogesh Kumar Katare " <ykatare There may be God or there may not be God. There are ways to self realization without God also, though tougher. I think rather than trying to be certain of God's existence, we should try to question the reality of things imposed on us by our society, culture, systems on the one hand and our senses and limited intellect on the other hand. Then when we try to deny or prove existence of GOd, what actually are we implying by the term 'God'. God appears to every one according to their own imposed expectations of the term. However, the surrender to God is the easiest of all path. -------------------------------- usha sridhar <deepusmom Hari Om; I humbly ask my young children: How many years you have studied the same principles in science ,maths,social etc. To get a degree how much have U slogged ? everything has no meaning when Tsunami comes, when earthquake comes, when there is natural disasters. How can YOU understand god so easily? First love and respect your parents as God. GIve them protection for their old age. Give them your attention and love. Then GOD himself will unfold the mistery. Otherwise YOU will be in misery. Hari OM. -- " Nand Soni " <nands Dear all, This is a very good question for which no one has definite answer. I never received any answer which satisfied me of existence of God in this Universe. I believe it as God is a Belief, From my heart I feel there is some one who is watching all our activites and acts, good deeds and bad deeds. But from my mind, I do not see any existence of God, the concept of God was started to keep societies safe and moral to control crime and punishment of evil. Feeling of existence of God, gives you more support in distress/crisis and raises hope that god will make every thing good soon. At end, I feel God is more belief than a reality. Personally I do believe in God. Thanks, Nand Soni --- , " puran koranga " <puran_koranga87 wrote: > > > Hi friends > i am Puran, 24 yrs, Male, from New Delhi . > Sometimes i think there is God but sometimes i think there is nothing such thing in this world ,so i am in a condition of confussion . > > And friends there r so many thing which i noticed ,that makes me confirm about the absense of any God in this world . Pls show me the right way. > > Thanking you > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted October 8, 2006 Report Share Posted October 8, 2006 PranamsHere are two arguments proving the existence of God THE ARGUMENT BY SUN AND MAITENANCE 1) Steadily giving out light the sun will continue for about 150 trillion years according to the Vedas. 2) The sun is already shining for 150 trillion of years. 3) Therefore, the question is what causes the sun steadily giving light. 4) As behind shining electric bulbs is the engineer and director of the electricity powerhouse, behind all this design and maintenance is God. THE ARGUMENT OF QUANTUM MECHANICS 1) According to some experiments in quantum mechanics it is now proven that there are forces by which information spreads through the universe instantaneously, much faster then the speed of light. This is called quantum non-locality. 2) We know that nothing happens without consciousness. 3) That all-pervading consciousness that is instantly transmitting information belongs to a person 4) This is the dictionary definition of the person called God 5) Therefore, God exists. ard How low will we go? Check out Messenger’s low PC-to-Phone call rates. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted October 9, 2006 Report Share Posted October 9, 2006 HARI OM "KNOWING GOD IS A MATTER OF EXPERIENCE ONLY BY OUR SOUL AND NOT A MATTER OF UNDERSTANDING BY OUR MATERIAL BRAIN BY APPLYING LOGIC. GOD IS BEYOND AND WELL BEYOND THE CAPACITY OF OUR BRAIN. IF ANYTIME WE COULD UNDERSTAND GOD WITH THE HELP OF BRAIN, THEN BRAIN ITSELF WILL BE THE GOD" avadhuta raya <bodisatva_108 wrote: PranamsHere are two arguments proving the existence of God THE ARGUMENT BY SUN AND MAITENANCE <!--[if !supportLists]-->1) <!--[endif]-->Steadily giving out light the sun will continue for about 150 trillion years according to the Vedas. <!--[if !supportLists]-->2) <!--[endif]-->The sun is already shining for 150 trillion of years. <!--[if !supportLists]-->3) <!--[endif]-->Therefore, the question is what causes the sun steadily giving light. <!--[if !supportLists]-->4) <!--[endif]-->As behind shining electric bulbs is the engineer and director of the electricity powerhouse, behind all this design and maintenance is God. THE ARGUMENT OF QUANTUM MECHANICS <!--[if !supportLists]-->1) <!--[endif]-->According to some experiments in quantum mechanics it is now proven that there are forces by which information spreads through the universe instantaneously, much faster then the speed of light. This is called quantum non-locality. <!--[if !supportLists]-->2) <!--[endif]-->We know that nothing happens without consciousness. <!--[if !supportLists]-->3) <!--[endif]-->That all-pervading consciousness that is instantly transmitting information belongs to a person <!--[if !supportLists]-->4) <!--[endif]-->This is the dictionary definition of the person called God <!--[if !supportLists]-->5) <!--[endif]-->Therefore, God exists.ard How low will we go? Check out Messenger’s low PC-to-Phone call rates. Everyone is raving about the all-new Mail. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted October 10, 2006 Report Share Posted October 10, 2006 Namaste, The Vedantic saying "All is Brahman" indicates clearly that everything is God.The material world is also divine. Just our wrong vision is an obstruction to see the reality. Please be aware that everything is God, also our brain. Our mental capabilities are the outer actions, although limited by the possibilities of Nature of Gods mental, which Sri Aurobindo calls Supramental. There is no division between God and men, only men creates a division. For me this was a great liberational thought. Greetings, Love, Chris > Datum: 07/10/06 04:53 PM> Van: "skanda kumar" > Aan: > CC: > Onderwerp : Re: Is there God in this World?> > Hi, The question asked by almost all the youngsters, how to see the GOD? Could you tell us what we should do in plain simple english to explain them ? Regards Skanda> > avadhuta maharaja wrote: Puran Ji; There is ghee in milk but can you see it? No. But there is a process by which the ghee can come out. So similarly, if you follow a bona fide process of 'sadhana' you will see God in everything. Avadhoot> > > puran koranga > > Friday, October 6, 2006 12:20:05 AM> Is there God in this World?> > > Hi friends > Sometimes i think there is God but sometimes i think there is no such thing in this world , so I am in a condition of confusion .> > And friends there are so many thing which i noticed,that makes me confirm about the absense of any God in this world. Pls show me the right way.> > Thanking you, Puran > > > > > > All new Mail "The new Interface is stunning in its simplicity and ease of use." - PC Magazine Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted October 10, 2006 Report Share Posted October 10, 2006 Shree Hari Ram Ram A lot has been said about the subject " Is there God in this World?" already! pls. forgive me if I am repeating. Based on Swamiji Maharajji's work, humbly submitting few thoughts - Looking at the things in our house, the sofa, TV ... , house itself, we know that all these articles have been made by someone, many times we may even know the company who manufactured the articles. It follows that for everything which exists, there is a maker, there is a source. It follows that there also must be a source behind this constantly evolving huge phenomenon called the world. The saints and scriptures say that the source for all this is GOD. Just because we do not physically see the source does not mean that there is no source. Our equipment (Antah-karan & Bahea-karan) to prove that there is God cannot help because of their limitation. The child believes the mother when she says this is your father, no way to verify this. Also, can we describe the sweetness of sugar? Can we explain the fragrance? Gita ji says God pervades everywhere and is in everything, nothing exists without Him. God is the real essence or "Isness" of things. We say, this is my wife, this is my car, this room is empty, this room is full, sky is overcast, this place is very crowded, this place is crazy, .... this "Isness" principle is God. In Gitaji (7-7), Lord Krishna - All that which exists here is strung on Me as rows of gems on a string. The gems and the string in this garland are made of cotton, He says that cotton is Me. In verses 7-8 through 7-12, Lord Krishna describes this "Isness" as "am" I am sapidity in water, I am light in the moon and the sun,: I am the syllable AUM in all the Vedas, I am sound in the ether and manliness in men, I am the pure fragrance in earth I am brightness in fire I am the life in all beings I am austerity in ascetics I am the eternal seed of all beings I am the intelligence of the intelligent I am the splendor of the splendid I am the strength of the strong, devoid of desire and passion In beings I am desire which is not contrary to Dharma The 10th Chapter of Gitaji describes another long list of Vibhuties (glories) of God. Ram Ram Humble pranam to all! A sadhaka On Behalf Of Manjula PatelFriday, October 06, 2006 6:43 PM Subject: Re: Is there God in this World? Loving Divine, Pranam. In past we had a very good, detailed discussion on the subject titled 'God - definition'; you may want to go through it from the archive & read all responses: /message/264. Also read the following emails: /message/127 /message/302 Sometimes I feel that whether God is there or not need not be discussed at all because it is not the subject of discussion rather has to have 'anubhuti' or divine perception! No matter how much we discuss we will not understand until we pay our whole hearted attention ( /message/292). Babaji gives these examples - talking about what's on menu will not cure your hunger or talking about medicine will not cure your disease; you have to cook & eat or take medicine to be cured!!! Now this can be as simple as accepting God is ALL without doubt and doing everything for Him/His pleasure or making some efforts in controlling your mind, calming it down so that you can perceive what God is via yoga-mediation-mantra chanting - whatever suits your temperament! Watch your every single breath no matter which activity you are involved in; you will definitely find your answer! Good Luck! Love, always at Thy Divine Feet On 6 Oct 2006 07:20:05 -0000, puran koranga <puran_koranga87 wrote: Hi friends Sometimes i think there is God but sometimes i think there is no such thing in this world , so I am in a condition of confusion . And friends there are so many thing which i noticed,that makes me confirm about the absense of any God in this world. Pls show me the right way. Thanking you, Puran Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted October 12, 2006 Report Share Posted October 12, 2006 While unattached myself and distancing myself from ‘ahankar’, still I get easily worried about economics that counts and applies measures, merciless markets that divide families, technologies rapidly destroy nature, and insensitive legal environments polluting civil society and young minds in self destructive pursuits. As time is passing, and I understand leaf of Bhagwat Gita in step by step, I increasingly get clarity in the system of the world, an order and witness how speed by which changes occur. How to live in this condition? I am progressing in yoga by conviction but I want to also fight effectively with undesirable changes in minds of people and order of the world. More I fight, stronger gets the conviction. Eyes opened in world, and mind opened to Sri Krishna, this is a tough but determined balancing act practiced under the Guru Sri Krishna. Does all the Bhagwat Sadhak feel the same way? Or, is it the reason that people run away to Haridwar and leave the world on its own? Does it help to run away? K G On Behalf Of avadhuta maharaja Sunday, October 08, 2006 4:45 AM Re: Is there God in this World? Thank you. Yes, regarding simple procedure for a completely guaranteed path of success we must not accept the words of anyone except Bhagavan-God- or His appointed representative. I hope you agree on this much. Next, we must since this is a Gita forum accept the one Supreme Being [eko bhagavan devaki-putram] that being Shree Krishna [Gita 10.8-11]. As far as His representive He does mention the 'parampara system' in the Gita [evam parampara praptam]. Such a person must be a devotee of Krishna and His friend ['bhaktosi me sakha chetee']. Such a soul sees Lord Krishna always and everywhere. Next we must cry, just like Draupadi, who cried and Shree Krishna Himself appeared. So we must ask Krishna with complete sincerity to lead us to Him, to be steeped in love and devotion. The instructions of the Lord in the fourth chapter of the Gita, verse 34, says that in order to know the truth we must approach a bona fide spiritual master. (This mostly applies to the seekers of knowledge - jnana yoga, but for a Devotee of God, He can receive guidance directly from Krishna - Krishnam Vande Jagat Guru - Moderator's addition per Swami Maharajji's teachings). Thank you again, Avadhoot (message Shortened and edited by Moderator) skanda kumar <D_Skandakumar Saturday, October 7, 2006 5:14:53 AM Re: Is there God in this World? Hi, The question asked by almost all the youngsters, how to see the GOD? Could you tell us what we should do in plain simple english to explain them ? Regards Skanda avadhuta maharaja <avadhutamaharaja@ > wrote: Puran Ji; There is ghee in milk but can you see it? No. But there is a process by which the ghee can come out. So similarly, if you follow a bona fide process of 'sadhana' you will see God in everything. Avadhoot puran koranga <puran_koranga87@ rediffmail. com> @grou ps.com Friday, October 6, 2006 12:20:05 AM Is there God in this World? Hi friends Sometimes i think there is God but sometimes i think there is no such thing in this world , so I am in a condition of confusion . And friends there are so many thing which i noticed,that makes me confirm about the absense of any God in this world. Pls show me the right way. Thanking you, Puran All new Mail " The new Interface is stunning in its simplicity and ease of use. " - PC Magazine Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted October 13, 2006 Report Share Posted October 13, 2006 I also frequently have the same thoughts, and try to act also. But whenever I have examined it deeply, I have found for myself that the root of all the miseries is failure to surrender to the Shri Krishna. Those who do not surrender, will live in misery, even if every thing is set right. The only trouble the world can have is forgetting the Lord. It all belongs to Him, and we can only hand it over to Him, and give up the illusion of being in charge. And whenever I thought like this, I have inevitably faced with various things, attachments, within myself, considering things of Lord as mine. I found that there is so much ego, and whatever I do, would only bring misery to the world. My job is to surrender to the Lord, and be aware of everything contrary. Everything belongs to Lord and whenever He wants, he will set it right himself. And if He likes to make use of me, He does it without my even knowing it. I doubt the efficacy of human effort. Many times I feel world would be much much more beautiful place if more and more people are ready to leave this world and move to the holy banks of Ganga (haridwar).Having said that, still I would say that all of the above may be wrong, Krishna only knows what is good and what is bad, He controls every thing. Yogesh MINOR EDITING BY MODERATOR On 10/11/06, Krishna Gopal Misra <kg wrote: While unattached myself and distancing myself from 'ahankar', still I get easily worried about economics that counts and applies measures, merciless markets that divide families, technologies rapidly destroy nature, and insensitive legal environments polluting civil society and young minds in self destructive pursuits. As time is passing, and I understand leaf of Bhagwat Gita in step by step, I increasingly get clarity in the system of the world, an order and witness how speed by which changes occur. How to live in this condition? I am progressing in yoga by conviction but I want to also fight effectively with undesirable changes in minds of people and order of the world. More I fight, stronger gets the conviction. Eyes opened in world, and mind opened to Sri Krishna, this is a tough but determined balancing act practiced under the Guru Sri Krishna. Does all the Bhagwat Sadhak feel the same way? Or, is it the reason that people run away to Haridwar and leave the world on its own? Does it help to run away? K G On Behalf Of avadhuta maharaja Sunday, October 08, 2006 4:45 AM Re: Is there God in this World? Thank you. Yes, regarding simple procedure for a completely guaranteed path of success we must not accept the words of anyone except Bhagavan-God- or His appointed representative. I hope you agree on this much. Next, we must since this is a Gita forum accept the one Supreme Being [eko bhagavan devaki-putram] that being Shree Krishna [Gita 10.8-11]. As far as His representive He does mention the 'parampara system' in the Gita [evam parampara praptam]. Such a person must be a devotee of Krishna and His friend ['bhaktosi me sakha chetee']. Such a soul sees Lord Krishna always and everywhere. Next we must cry, just like Draupadi, who cried and Shree Krishna Himself appeared. So we must ask Krishna with complete sincerity to lead us to Him, to be steeped in love and devotion. The instructions of the Lord in the fourth chapter of the Gita, verse 34, says that in order to know the truth we must approach a bona fide spiritual master. (This mostly applies to the seekers of knowledge - jnana yoga, but for a Devotee of God, He can receive guidance directly from Krishna - Krishnam Vande Jagat Guru - Moderator's addition per Swami Maharajji's teachings). Thank you again, Avadhoot (message Shortened and edited by Moderator) skanda kumar <D_Skandakumar Saturday, October 7, 2006 5:14:53 AM Re: Is there God in this World? Hi, The question asked by almost all the youngsters, how to see the GOD? Could you tell us what we should do in plain simple english to explain them ? Regards Skanda avadhuta maharaja <avadhutamaharaja@ > wrote: Puran Ji; There is ghee in milk but can you see it? No. But there is a process by which the ghee can come out. So similarly, if you follow a bona fide process of 'sadhana' you will see God in everything. Avadhoot puran koranga <puran_koranga87@ rediffmail. com> @grou ps.com Friday, October 6, 2006 12:20:05 AM Is there God in this World? Hi friends Sometimes i think there is God but sometimes i think there is no such thing in this world , so I am in a condition of confusion . And friends there are so many thing which i noticed,that makes me confirm about the absense of any God in this world. Pls show me the right way. Thanking you, Puran All new Mail " The new Interface is stunning in its simplicity and ease of use. " - PC Magazine Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted October 15, 2006 Report Share Posted October 15, 2006 My comments in red. Just my observarions with respect to my life and my sadhana...Thanks -Krishna "Krishna Gopal Misra" <kg To: , "'avadhuta maharaja'" <avadhutamaharajaRE: Is there God in this World?Thu, 12 Oct 2006 10:57:34 +0530 While unattached myself and distancing myself from ‘ahankar’, still I get easily worried about economics that counts and applies measures, merciless markets that divide families, technologies rapidly destroy nature, and insensitive legal environments polluting civil society and young minds in self destructive pursuits. Unless 'ahankar' is totally dropped how can the worries (acts of ahankar) be eliminated? Eliminating the 'ahankar' is not that simple and only way is distancing further and further. One day it becomes so distanced, there will be hardly any effect of it on the Sadhak. Only observation should be "is the progress positive?" It should not be like two steps forward and three steps backwards. As time is passing, and I understand leaf of Bhagwat Gita in step by step, I increasingly get clarity in the system of the world, an order and witness how speed by which changes occur. How to live in this condition? I am progressing in yoga by conviction but I want to also fight effectively with undesirable changes in minds of people and order of the world. More I fight, stronger gets the conviction. Eyes opened in world, and mind opened to Sri Krishna, this is a tough but determined balancing act practiced under the Guru Sri Krishna. Does all the Bhagwat Sadhak feel the same way? Or, is it the reason that people run away to Haridwar and leave the world on its own? Does it help to run away? As some experts put it, whole cosmos is moving towards perfection. When compared to the cosmos in its age and size, we are not even a miniscule. Having said that how these small things like "this world is changing in a particular way not compatible to a particular aspect" should matter in view of cosmos. Why do I want to take the responsibility of some thing over which I do not have obsolutely any control. I can only have control on my perceptions and receptions of those perceptions. Let me bring some changes within so that I do not get perturbed by the changes in the environment. This is what can bring solace and possible happiness to me. K G On Behalf Of avadhuta maharajaSunday, October 08, 2006 4:45 AM Subject: Re: Is there God in this World? Thank you. Yes, regarding simple procedure for a completely guaranteed path of success we must not accept the words of anyone except Bhagavan-God- or His appointed representative. I hope you agree on this much. Next, we must since this is a Gita forum accept the one Supreme Being [eko bhagavan devaki-putram] that being Shree Krishna [Gita 10.8-11]. As far as His representive He does mention the 'parampara system' in the Gita [evam parampara praptam]. Such a person must be a devotee of Krishna and His friend ['bhaktosi me sakha chetee']. Such a soul sees Lord Krishna always and everywhere. Next we must cry, just like Draupadi, who cried and Shree Krishna Himself appeared. So we must ask Krishna with complete sincerity to lead us to Him, to be steeped in love and devotion. The instructions of the Lord in the fourth chapter of the Gita, verse 34, says that in order to know the truth we must approach a bona fide spiritual master. (This mostly applies to the seekers of knowledge - jnana yoga, but for a Devotee of God, He can receive guidance directly from Krishna - Krishnam Vande Jagat Guru - Moderator's addition per Swami Maharajji's teachings). Thank you again, Avadhoot (message Shortened and edited by Moderator) skanda kumar <D_Skandakumar Sent: Saturday, October 7, 2006 5:14:53 AMRe: Is there God in this World? Hi, The question asked by almost all the youngsters, how to see the GOD? Could you tell us what we should do in plain simple english to explain them ? Regards Skandaavadhuta maharaja <avadhutamaharaja@ > wrote: Puran Ji; There is ghee in milk but can you see it? No. But there is a process by which the ghee can come out. So similarly, if you follow a bona fide process of 'sadhana' you will see God in everything. Avadhoot puran koranga <puran_koranga87@ rediffmail. com>@grou ps.comFriday, October 6, 2006 12:20:05 AM Is there God in this World? Hi friends Sometimes i think there is God but sometimes i think there is no such thing in this world , so I am in a condition of confusion . And friends there are so many thing which i noticed,that makes me confirm about the absense of any God in this world. Pls show me the right way.Thanking you, Puran All new Mail "The new Interface is stunning in its simplicity and ease of use." - PC Magazine Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted October 15, 2006 Report Share Posted October 15, 2006 Shree Hari COMBINING AND SENDING VARIOUS MESSAGES ON THIS TOPIC. PLEASE KINDLY REMEMBER THE GUIDELINES FOR THIS DISCUSSION GROUP The following are the guidelines for Gita-Talk discussions. 1. Wherever possible, please quote Gita or other scriptures to substantiate the response 2. Kindly make your responses concise and to the point. (Up to twenty line maximum, if possible). Lengthy messages will either be edited or combined and sent at a later date at the discretion of the Moderator 3. Please limit discussions to subject at hand. 4. Please kindly do not include links to other sites or other organizations FROM MODERATOR Ram Ram "Manjula Patel" Loving Divine, Pranam. In my understanding the following is a limited view - a view created out of fear and/or ignorance. It is a view of us looking only outside and not within - the essence! That's why we miss out the boat...!!! Our scriptures are very ancient, very deep in understanding - wisdom, very representative of all to convey God's presence in ALL; and none of the scriptures speak of creation of God out of fear (even though that's what so called historians have recorded but our saints and sages were historians too and I believe in what they have recorded...!). Once one understands ('clicks...'), vast knowledge just opens up...!!! Due to our forgetfulness, extroverted views, ignorance, came misunderstanding towards the perception of God! Our scriptures are pointing us to look within and realize the ultimate Doer behind it. Whatever is happening within is the same happening outside and reverse is also true but most of us are already aware of outward phenomenon so going within is very important. The derived happiness from remaining outward is limited while the happiness rather joy derived remaining within (knowing essence) or perceiving the inner most being is long lasting because there is no burden of doership for anything or anybody! Let's look within, our body gets wormth from the fire of stomach, due to this fire our life is constantly burning, i.e., our life is reduced every moment like a candle and it is only this fire that gives luster to this body! Sure we are happy feeding good food to our stomach, thus fire, but knowing the essence - jyaan (who is digesting or how it is getting digested), gives much much more joy than the food itself!!! This essence which is capable of these aspects remains the exact same whether it is a lightening or fire caused by it in a jungle or it is a fire from our stomach!!! To see god in fire represents God in a limited form; therefore, Lord says whatever you offer to demi gods (in our example, god of fire), it still reaches me - like food goes to stomach but the effect is to the entire body (BG 9:23-24; also understand - aham vaishwaa narobhutvaa praaninaam... BG 15:14). Wild fire whether it is in the form of lightening, jungle fire or stomach fire (eating too much) is always destructive! Similarly god of wind - vaayu devataa functions in our body - the same air that keeps the entire creation alive is within us too! The air makes us feel the touch sensastion that's why it is said that the vaayu devataa resides in our skin, it keeps us alive & gives strength that's why it is associated with heart. Again, to view just vaayu as God is also a limited representation of God and therefore falls into the demi-god category. Like this we have god for every senses (5) and there respective actions (5) too - organs of perceptions (jyaanendriya) & actions (karmendriya). It is difficult to explain the essence/mahttattva therefore their representative objects were weaved into our scriptural stories but they all lead towards the very same thing!!! To say god is in all, we selected representative species from the creation like, snake, bird, plant, animal, human, etc. (BG chapter 10 also please see - /message/499 , again would like to take advantage of Madanji's beautiful email :-)...) Shri Bhagwatam as well as Adi Shankaraacharya's 'Tattva-Bodhah 2:1/2)' describe the presence of demi-gods in our body as follows (there might be more but this is what i remember...also there is little variation too but if one understands the essence behind the location of these demi-gods, one will understand why they are located in the place defined below): Mulaadhaar chakra (Base of the spine or behind anus) - god of earth/prithvi devataa/shri ganesh/kundalini devi (ability to earn material wealth), in our anus - god of death/yama or mrutyu devataa; in nose (ability to smell) - ashwinikumars - the twin doctors (also the secrete of our health lies in our breath - no breath, no life!) Swaadhisthaan ckr (in spine behind genital) - in tongue/mouth (ability to taste) - god of water/varun devataa, in genitals - god of creation/prajaapati/brahmaa, maa durgaa or maa mahaashkti (ability to enjoy relationships, friends & family) Manipur ckr (in spine behind naval) - god of fire/agni devataa, right eye - sun god, left eye - moon god, feet/legs - vishnu devataa Anaahad ckr (in spine behind our chest - in center little above heart) - in skin (ability to enjoy sensual pleasures & emotions) - god of air/vaayu devataa, shri hanumaan, in heart - naaraayan, in hands - indra devataa Vishuddha ckr (in spine, in neck) - in ears (ability to enjoy listening, religious satsang/knowledge) - god of space-sky/digdevataa, in neck - shiva devataa, in mouth-tongue-throat - godess of speech/maa saraswati, in tongue - fire Aajnaa ckr (between eyebrows) - guru/atma/shri krishna/ista devi-devataa/agni as like aatma jyoti (ability to enjoy self knowledge, sixth sense) Sahastraar ckr - in fontanale/brahmarandhra - formless God (bliss) Again to remind, all of these represent the same essence!!! Besides listed above, the god of ahamkaar-buddhi-man is considered to be shiva & moon. Hope this helps understanding existence of various gods/goddesses from our scriptural perspective... Humble note: to know God, none of the above knowledge is necessary...!!! Love, always at Thy Holy Feet --- avadhuta raya Pranams Chandra accepted the atheistic presentation of history and religious development. This is nothing less than undermining the scriptures and God Himself. In the book The forbidden archeology written by Drutakarma prabhu there are many proves that human beings existed much more earlier in the evolutionary history than it is taught nowadays by popular science. Farther, the Vedic scriptures describe the coexistence of both primitive and civilized human beings. That means modern humans did not evolved from apes but were created. Atheists made up human and religious history based on the findings of bones and tools of primitive people. They neglect the findings of the remains of very ancient and advanced civilizations as this is pointed out in the Forbidden Archeology. This is called - the archaeological coverups. Now, the religious evolution that is described in the Brahma vaivarta purana, Ganapati kanda chapter 6, is similar to the atheistic religious evolution but the difference is that one advances to higher worship according to the evolution of one's consciousness life after life. Higher forms of worship did not evolve from lower ones. Nobody can understand God and the process of His worship without being told by God Himself or His pure representative. In other words, those conditioned to tamas and rajas like the primitive apes and tribals could not have developed any advanced understanding about God. So, the first step in religious evolution is worshiping small gods (outside of the Vedic culture and without Vedic rituals and proper understanding about gods). The small gods for example for tribal people are the gods of the thunderbolt, ocean, rain etc. This is also known as the worship of the saktis of the virat rupa (universal form) After a life of above described worship of small gods one is born in the Vedic culture and so gets an opportunity to acquire knowledge about the Vedic names of the small gods like Indra, Varuna, Kuvera, the expansions of original Durga (or Parvati) known as Chandika, Sita, Kali, Durga etc. At this stage which is still the first step in religious evolution one still worships the small gods but now by proper Vedic rituals. After advancing in the worship of small gods in the next life one gets an opportunity to worship a higher god which is according to the Brahma vaivarta purana - Surya the sun-god. After 3 lives of worshiping him one then gets to a higher stage of worshiping Siva and Parvati for 7 births. After this period one attains the worship of Lord Narayana for 1 birth and than ultimately becomes the devotee of Lord Sri Krishna. Chant Hare Krishna and be happy ard ------------- jvardya Om Shanti, Before you can decide whether there is God or not, you have to define God so that you know what the parameters are and not just follow a set of dogmas and principles laid out in the books. I like to test the assumptions and statements to verify the validity before accepting it. Historically, the concept of God was first introduced by very early Humans. When they did not understand a phenomenon, they described it as an act of God. For instance, if a fire was started in the jungle by 'lightning', it was described as God of Fire. Similarly, God of Wind, God of Creation, God of prosperity, God of Learning, etc. Over a period of time, that definition has been refined. But the basic premise remains pretty much the same. However, the outcome of this was very positive - introduction of Religion - which is the Social Road Map for Humans to behave and live socially with each other. Principles like 'do not steal', respect your parents, love your neighbors, etc. Surely, you have heard most of them over a period of time. In the end, what makes you HAPPY (not pleasure) within the norms of society is what matters. If pursuing the concept of God is what makes you happy, by all means pursue it. But you must realize and fully define what you are after. Just do not hurt others. But on the other hand, playing Baseball (or anything else) is what makes you happy, then that is what you should do. From my point of view, you can be as happy or happier playing Baseball as any one pursuing "stasang", renunciation, lose your ego, etc. In the end we all "pass away" and leave our body behind. The re-incarnation of soul is open for debate. Christians and Muslims do not believe in it and to-gether they represent abut 70% (a vast majority) of the world's population. This is my perspective and may not be the most popular but it is real and not bogged down by a lot of artificial definitions and preachings. And you do not have to Define or believe in God. Happiness is what matters in the totality. And you can continue to enjoy your health, family life, friends, career, etc. and be a good person as well as a productive member of the society. Good luck. -- avadhuta raya Hare Krishna To say that everything is one with God is misleading. It springs from poor, incomplete understanding of many other statements of the sastras. By neglecting them one is certainly not the true follower of the Vedas, Upanisads etc. After studying all the Vedic literature the goal is to understand Krishna as the highest truth - vedais ca sarvais aham eva vedyo (Bg 15.15). So, here are few quotes to to be considered by those faithful to sastra. Speculators will reject them. Maitrayana-brahmana Up. 6.35: They who rise up out of the material energy, when they have entered into the light of glory (Brahman), appear like so many flame crests in a track of fire. Here there is no oneness Brahman is everywhere. But Krishna don't wants us to think about Brahman. "The Supreme Personality of Godhead said: 'He whose mind is fixed on My personal form, always engaged in worshiping Me with great and transcendental faith, is considered by Me to be the most perfect.'" (Bhagavad-gita 12.1,2) anor aniyan mahato mahiyan atmasya jantor nihito guhayam tam akratuh pasyati vita-soko dhatuh prasadan mahimanam atmanah "Both the Supersoul [Paramatma] and the atomic soul [jivatma] are situated on the same tree of the body within the same heart of the living being, and only one who has become free from all material desires as well as lamentations can, by the grace of the Supreme, understand the glories of the soul." This above sloka is enough clear to understand that there is no oneness and that the Supresoul (Vibhu-atma) is supreior to the jiva-atma or anu-atma. They are both eternally existing being spiritual, unchangeable. For the soul there is neither birth nor death at any time. He has not come into being, does not come into being, and will not come into being. He is unborn, eternal, ever-existing and primeval. He is not slain when the body is slain. (Bg 2.20) nityo nityanam cetanas cetanam -Katha up. 2.2.13 "He is the eternal 'nityo' among the eternals 'nityanam', the conscious 'cetanas' among the (many) conscious 'cetanam'." aninas catma badhyate bhoktr-bhavat jnatva devam mucyate sarva-pasaih "The soul, not being the Lord, is bound due to being an enjoyer. By knowing the Lord 'devam', he is freed from all distress." -Svetasvatar Upanisad (1.9) muktir hitvanyatha-rupam svarupena vyavasthitih Liberation means being situated in one's eternal original form, which he attains after giving up the changeable gross and subtle bodies.' [sB 2.10.6] For those whose minds are attached to the unmanifested, impersonal feature of the Supreme, advancement is very troublesome. To make progress in that discipline is always difficult for those who are embodied. (Bg 12.5) Mundaka Up. 2.2.3: The Upanisads is the bow, the self is the person sharpened by devotion, and as the arrow does not become one with the target he will attain Brahman but not become one. Mandukya Up. 3.1.31: "This liberated soul becomes like (samyam upaiti) the Supreme Brahman (niranjanah paramam), and not actually the Supreme Brahman. He reaches the highest similarity. Katha Up. 1.1.20: Yamaraja to Naciketa: "Ayam asti nayam asti. Is there a person superior to the liberated souls?" Yamaraja answered; "Indeed." Mundaka Up. 1.2.13 (and 3.1.3): By the knowledge given by the guru one comes to the eternal true golden coloured Person, higher than the high imperishable, the highest Immortal, the Source of the brahmajyoti (brahma-yonim) . The highest immortal source. No need of sun, moon, stars, fire in the highest home of Brahman: worship that person. Katha Up. 1.3.10: Higher than senses >sense objects >mind >buddhi >soul >avyakta. Then it says: avyakta purusah para purusa na param kincit sa kastha para gatah. The Purusa, the Personality of Godhead, is superior to the Avyakta. He is the ultimate Entity beyond Avyakta, the supreme goal. ard ----- Hema Reddy There is no need to runaway. You can live happily where you are and do your sadhana and progress. Those who ' runaway ' want to do more intense sadhana to achieve their goal faster. If you are still ' easily worried ', then you are NOT unattached !! You have to learn to go beyond worries. ----- avadhuta maharaja Yogesh; Why not move to Vrindaban where your Lord lived and performed so many divine leelas? Avadhoot ----- Chandrapuran koranga <puran_koranga87 > Sent: Friday, October 6, 2006 12:20:05 AM Is there God in this World? Hi friends Sometimes i think there is God but sometimes i think there is no such thing in this world , so I am in a condition of confusion . And friends there are so many thing which i noticed,that makes me confirm about the absense of any God in this world. Pls show me the right way. Thanking you, Puran Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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