Q: Is the Caste System by Birth or by Deed?

[Guest guest]

||Shri Hari||

 

Would appreciate comments and views with reference to verses of the Gita -

Is the Caste System by Birth or by Deed?

 

Ram Ram

 

 

from MODERATOR

 

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Ram Ram

[Guest guest]

Dear Rama Krishna,

 

Love and Love alone....

 

Bhagawan says in Srimad Bhagawat Gita (Ch. IV, Sloka 13) that:

 

Chaaturvarnam Mayaa Srishtam Gunakarma Vibhaagasaha

Tasya Karthaarapi Maam Vidyakartaaramavyayam

 

It means, I created Chatur Varnas (Four Segments), i.e., Brahmana, Kshatriya, Vysya and Shoodra, according to their innate tendencies (guna karmas). Though I am above all this srishti (Akartha), but understand that I am the One Who has created and running all this srishti.

 

 

Many people, including very learned one, argue that the Chatur Varnam is according to the caste system prevalent at present, but I personally feel that it is according to the innate tendencies prevalent in each and every human being. That is what the sloka also indicates -- Guna Karma Vibhagasaha.

 

 

This is the outer explanation, but if you want, you can go deep into this and analyse many aspects.

 

Love and Love alone....

 

P. Gopi Krishna

On 3/6/07, Ram Krishna <rkp wrote:

 

 

 

 

 

||Shri Hari||Would appreciate comments and views with reference to verses of the Gita -Is the Caste System by Birth or by Deed?Ram Ramfrom MODERATORThe following are the guidelines for Gita-Talk discussions.

1. Wherever possible, please quote Gita or other scriptures tosubstantiate the response2. Kindly make your responses concise and to the point. (Up totwenty line maximum, if possible).3. Please limit discussions to subject at hand.

4. Please do not include links to other sites or other organizations5. Please do not include your personal information such as phonenumber, address etc.6. Kindly do not address the response to a particular individual,

since the message is going to the entire group.MODERATORRam Ram -- Paritala Gopi Krishna

[Guest guest]

> THERE WAS NO CAST SYSTEM IN ANYWHERE IN OUR COUNTRY BEFORE 800AD.EVEN

DURING THE EPIC PERIOD THERE WAS NO CAST SYSTEM AS SUCH.ONLY BY FUNCTION

OR DEED THE DIFFERENT WORKS WERE EARMARKED OR ASSIGNED AND THERE WAS

SOCIAL BALANCING IN DISTRIBUTION OF WORK/TASK.THERE WAS COMPLETE HARMONY

AND THERE WAS NO DISCRIMINATION BASED ON BIRTH. ONLY IN THE FUNCTIONS

AND NATURE OF FOOD THERE WAS A DISTINCTION.SUBSEQUENTLY IN 9 TH CENTURY

DISCRIMINATION BY VIRTUE OF BIRTH STARTED BY THE PEOPLE IN POWER WHICH

HAVE LED TO THE PRESENT SORRY STATE OF DISCRIMINATION BASED ON CAST,

LANGUAGE,COMMUNITY.INFACT THE CONCEPT OF COMMUNITY IS WRONG.WE ALL ARE

HUMAN BEINGS THERE FORE WHAT IS COMMUNITY AND WHY

GROUPISM,SEGREGATION,DISCRIMINATION OR FAVOURATISM BASED ON COMMUNITY OR

LANGUAGE OR STATE?THESE PRACTICES BY THE POWERFUL AND RICH HAVE CREATED

HATRED BETWEEN STATES/PEOPLE WHICH DAY BY DAY IS INCREASING AND THIS IS

NOT GOOD FOR HUMAN CIVILISATION.PEOPLE WHO ARE IN POWERFUL POSTS AND

RICH SHOULD RISE ABOVE THE PARTISAN/DISCRIMINATORY NATURE AND PROMOTE

DEVELOPMENT OF EVERY BODY JUSTIFIABLY SO THAT OUR COUNTRY CAN BECOME A

MODEL FOR THE WORLD AT LARGE

 

REGARDS

N.PANDA

>

> Would appreciate comments and views with reference to verses of the Gita -

> Is the Caste System by Birth or by Deed?

>

> Ram Ram

>

>

> from MODERATOR

>

> The following are the guidelines for Gita-Talk discussions.

>

> 1. Wherever possible, please quote Gita or other scriptures to

> substantiate the response

>

> 2. Kindly make your responses concise and to the point. (Up to

> twenty line maximum, if possible).

>

> 3. Please limit discussions to subject at hand.

>

> 4. Please do not include links to other sites or other organizations

>

> 5. Please do not include your personal information such as phone

> number, address etc.

>

> 6. Kindly do not address the response to a particular individual,

> since the message is going to the entire group.

>

> MODERATOR

> Ram Ram

>

[Guest guest]

Ram, In the Bhagwad Gita, Shri Krishna defines the four fold division of people types, based on "GunKarma" -(Bhagwad Gita 4-13) guna is quality or "nature" of a person and Karma are his actions. Karmas are straightforward to see, since they are manifested actions. What results in the formation of "gunas" in a person. ie what are the contributing factors to the "quality" or "nature' of a person. I found a more direct answer in the Udhav Gita, wherein Krishna gives 10 causative factors which result in ones Guna. They are the food one eats, scriptures, people, place, time, work, birth, meditation, Mantra and purificatory rites (Udhav Gita : 8-4). Udhav Gita is the message of Shri Krishna to Udhava, like Bhagvad Gita was Shri Krishnas message to Arjuna. To answer your question, deed definitely, birth plays a relatively minor role. Hari Om, Ram

Krishna <rkp wrote: ||Shri Hari||Would appreciate comments and views with reference to verses of the Gita -Is the Caste System by Birth or by Deed?Ram Ramfrom MODERATORThe following are the guidelines for Gita-Talk discussions.1. Wherever possible, please quote Gita or other scriptures tosubstantiate the response2. Kindly make your responses concise and to the point. (Up totwenty line maximum, if possible).3. Please limit discussions to subject at

hand.4. Please do not include links to other sites or other organizations5. Please do not include your personal information such as phonenumber, address etc.6. Kindly do not address the response to a particular individual,since the message is going to the entire group.MODERATORRam Ram

Sucker-punch spam with award-winning protection. Try the free Mail Beta.

[Guest guest]

There is no caste system by birth or even by deeds. Varna is not

equivalent to caste. All Vernas are arising from a single Person

tnat means every person has all the qualities of 4 types a power to

think and meditate, strength to fight for truth and dharma,earning

for sustaining family , service of society. Every person is complete

in himself. Keep aside these caste notions. There is no caste system

in Hinduism and those who follow such notions are going on a wrong

track

 

, Suhas Kulhalli <srkulhalli

wrote:

>

> Ram,

>

> In the Bhagwad Gita, Shri Krishna defines the four fold division

of people types, based on " GunKarma " -(Bhagwad Gita 4-13) guna is

quality or " nature " of a person and Karma are his actions. Karmas

are straightforward to see, since they are manifested actions.

>

> What results in the formation of " gunas " in a person. ie what

are the contributing factors to the " quality " or " nature' of a

person. I found a more direct answer in the Udhav Gita, wherein

Krishna gives 10 causative factors which result in ones Guna. They

are the food one eats, scriptures, people, place, time, work, birth,

meditation, Mantra and purificatory rites (Udhav Gita : 8-4). Udhav

Gita is the message of Shri Krishna to Udhava, like Bhagvad Gita was

Shri Krishnas message to Arjuna.

>

> To answer your question, deed definitely, birth plays a relatively

minor role.

>

> Hari Om,

>

> Ram Krishna <rkp wrote:

> ||Shri Hari||

>

> Would appreciate comments and views with reference to verses of

the Gita -

> Is the Caste System by Birth or by Deed?

>

> Ram Ram

>

> from MODERATOR

>

> The following are the guidelines for Gita-Talk discussions.

>

> 1. Wherever possible, please quote Gita or other scriptures to

> substantiate the response

>

> 2. Kindly make your responses concise and to the point. (Up to

> twenty line maximum, if possible).

>

> 3. Please limit discussions to subject at hand.

>

> 4. Please do not include links to other sites or other

organizations

>

> 5. Please do not include your personal information such as phone

> number, address etc.

>

> 6. Kindly do not address the response to a particular individual,

> since the message is going to the entire group.

>

> MODERATOR

> Ram Ram

>

>

>

>

>

>

> Sucker-punch spam with award-winning protection.

> Try the free Mail Beta.

>

[Guest guest]

B K <bkgswu>

 

There are Brahmins, Kshatriyas, Vaishyas, and Shudras.

 

Brahmins are the ones who are fully Soul conscious and God conscious

and imbibe the teachings of Supreme in their life with ease.

 

Kshatriyas are the ones who have lot of conflicts in their mind

before they inculcate the advice of the Supreme, with difficulty.

Sometimes they are soul conscious and some times they are body

conscious.

 

Vaishyas are the ones who imbibe the teachings of the Supreme with

some expectations and selfish motive and they are not soul conscious

as well.

 

Shudras are the ones who are fully body conscious and they do not

imbibe the teachings of Supreme in their life at all.

 

If we look at the self, we would realize that at times we are

behaving like Brahmins, and sometimes we are living like Kshatriyas

and many times we live as Vaishyas and rest of the times like

Shudras.

 

The clan is not classified by birth. It has got to do with the

actions that we perform throughout the day. Moreover actions are

colored by the consciousness the self holds, at the time of

performing the actions.

 

Raja Yoga enables the self to lead life like Brahmins throughout the

day now, and thereby would elevate the status to that of Deities in

the future for ever.

 

--\

-----

Dear Friends:

Acoording to Gita and according to Purushsooktha and any other part of our

Shastras, The mention of Chaturvarna relates ONLY to GUNA and KARMA - that is by

in-born nature, intelligence, education, training and the deeds we perform.

There is no mention about this in anyway related to birth or parents. Vedas do

not mention about the four Varnas as distinct family groups but only as

individual nature of the Gunas. Veda Vyasa Sri Krishna Dwaipanya and several

other Rishis are all of mixed birth - which means there was no bar against

mixing of Varnas. Now again, This is NOT, and in no way to be referred as

Castes. Varnas are NOT Castes, Caste is Jaathi and Jaathi is by birth like a

family name and possibly could represent the

family heritage and traditions, but necessarily the job they perform,

though after the mideval and recent past times it got corrupted to

represent Jaathi as Caste, caste related to jobs [karma] one performs due to

family training for the job and later caste going on to be related or referring

to Varna that is Chaturvarna. Let us all erase those Shastras that got corrupted

and seek the proper meaning of the Shastras based on Vedas and Agamas and

Puranas which form the true Hindu Dharma. Again, Jaathi or Caste is not the same

as Varna, let us not be confused on this.

Varna is a great institution,but it is the Caste system that got

corrupted. It is just a family name like Kennedy, Wordsworth and Goldsmith in

the Western world. Let us keep it at that and treat every one with Equal rights

and Equal Privileges.

Namaskaram,

Bala N. Aiyer

------

 

, " Ram Krishna " <rkp wrote:

>

> ||Shri Hari||

>

> Would appreciate comments and views with reference to verses of

the Gita -

> Is the Caste System by Birth or by Deed?

>

> Ram Ram

>

>

> from MODERATOR

>

> The following are the guidelines for Gita-Talk discussions.

>

> 1. Wherever possible, please quote Gita or other scriptures to

> substantiate the response

>

> 2. Kindly make your responses concise and to the point. (Up to

> twenty line maximum, if possible).

>

> 3. Please limit discussions to subject at hand.

>

> 4. Please do not include links to other sites or other

organizations

>

> 5. Please do not include your personal information such as phone

> number, address etc.

>

> 6. Kindly do not address the response to a particular individual,

> since the message is going to the entire group.

>

> MODERATOR

> Ram Ram

>