Guest guest Posted November 3, 2007 Report Share Posted November 3, 2007 Dear Sadhakas, Namaste! One has to know God in some way in the beginning to develop Bhakti, just as one has to know something or someone to love or to do anything at all for that thing or person. However, in most cases whatever one knows is one's own ideas, images, opinions, and beliefs about person or thing one claims to know as being outside. One knows oneself also in the same way, his/her own ideas about him/her(likes, dislikes, personal desires, fears, etc). In the same way God becomes an image and belief in one's mind and then one calls one Bhakta to get something from this God. Admittedly, we are attached to our own ideas of what we can get from this image we call God. If this is understood convincingly as false, one can take first step to know God as an experience beyond mind, beyond beliefs! Next, if one burns with the desire or love for truth of oneself, one is on the path already to develop Bhakti(unconditional love). Then Sadhana begins for one towards this. Many helpful hints which were going unnoticed before such as a book like Gita, swamiji's or someone's spiritual discourses, joining the spiritual group such this one etc etc will surface often and get noticed without efforts. One is now a Bhakta if one doesn't let this flame of self-knowledge extinguish by committing to someone, or something but remaining open to all possibilities! At some point down the road, Universe will conspire to give such Bhakta glimpses of Self, his/her true nature, as devotional contemplation continues. This will lead to knowing/experiencing with certainty God as Pure Awareness(Consciousness) eternal, Impersonal and Absolute! at the same time God being very personal (moderator addition) In this way God and Bhakta both resolve into ONE Awareness experience of Existence, Consciousness and Bliss Absolute (SatChitAnanda) as described in scriptures! Bhakta (Devotee) who is now Bhakti (the devotion itself) really will surface from time to time to help others in their Bhakti. God is known as not separate from Him/HerSelf/Universe! The above is a process of development, so to speak, as I understand it! Pratap .....Lovingly ---------- Shree Hari Ram Ram Pujya Swamiji emphasizes the importance of having a relationship with God for devotion (bhakti). He says there is very little a devotee needs to do besides accepting this relationship with God (God as father, or mother, or wife, or husband, or child, or lover, or friend, or master or even an enemy). Just like the married woman accepts that she belongs to her husband, so does a devotee accept that He belongs to God. Just like the devout wife, when she accepts the relationship with her husband, she does not have to do anything special and there after all the work that she does, she does for her husband, including cooking, bathing, dressing up, shopping, taking care of in-laws, or children and husband's relatives etc. Everything is as a result of the relationship with her husband. Similarly, the devotee on accepting that he belongs to God, does not do anything special, but thereafter for the rest of his life, he is doing God's work. All work whether worldly (mundane) or spiritual is all work that is to be done for God. The sense of mine-ness (egoism) changes, it transforms. Previously the devotee considered himself to be of this world (someone's son, someone's employee or someone's boss etc), but on accepting an exclusive relationship with God, all other relationship's become as a result of the relationship with only God. A Devotee may experience the following - 1) I am God's (I belong to God) 2) I live in His kingdom 3) I do His work 4) I receive gifts / offerings from Him 5) With these gifts / offerings, I serve His children. Absolutely everything is due to that one exclusive relationship. A devotee becomes clear about the exclusive relationship with God i.e. 1) I am only God's (I belong to only God) 2) Only God is mine 3) There is no one else who is my very own and 4) I am no one else's. His dependency is on only God. A Sadhak Ram Ram ---------- <p> --- sundeep gupta <sundeepgupta1 wrote: > Please advise, how to develop bhakti for God? Which > is the most easy path for a person who is > uninitiated to God worship? > How does one develop Bhakti for God, when living > in a world where selfishness is considered a virtue > and a path to material success? Where evil prevails > over goodness, and people speaking truth are rarer. > > Please advise > > regards > Sundeep Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted November 5, 2007 Report Share Posted November 5, 2007 dear sir if you want to develop bhakti. please read the 'sadhak sanjivani' and 'tatva chintamani' 1st listen to the following site www.swamiramsukhdasji.org if u really want to have bhakti u would like this.pravachans are in hindi. regards sadhak ----------- Dear friend, there was everything you said during Pandavas life span. But they were virtuous. Don`t see things around, but keep singing in mind about God, listen plenty of Puranas, life histories of saints. These will guide you easily the valuable points to reach GOD. Lord Krishna said in Bagavath Gita, "One who tries Yoga, Yagna, Tapas, meditations Etc will take 100 of births to reach me". But the same lord says, "if I (Lord) make sankalpam, I can make that person to attain me in the same birth". It means, that if we desire that will it is difficult. But if we surrender then it is the responsibility of the Lord to guide you in showing a Guru, right path, spritual way of life, get you fixed in Sat Sangh and finally, you reach HIM. A lady wearing a diamond nose ring went on showing aound. She happened to cross Kabir Doss. Kabir said, "think of the lord who gave you nose to wear". Use everything that comes to you righteously thinking of the Lord each time. Discard that wrong things (that your consience says) still thinking of the Lord. That is what GOPIES did and were said in puranas that Gopies are greater than Saints. B.Sathyanarayan ----------- Lord Krishna said, that HE can give Kaivaliyam (liberation) but not Bakthi. One who gets Bakthi, the Lord has to be with that person. If tears flow, your hairs on skin raises by hearing about God, then you are in the path of Bakthi. Bakthi comes easily with association of person in Sat Sangh. B.Sathyanarayan ----------- Dear brother Pratap.. a very beutiful explanation! thanks for sharing your thoughts. abhimanyu ----------- dear Sadhakas, Bhakti is not something elusive. It is possible for every one to breathe and live in Bhakti. Bhakti is intense love for the Lord. We know love only in the mundane sense. For want of suitable word to express Bhakti, we use the word LOVE which has fallen into disrepute. Without love, the world will fall apart. By the divine grace, we are endowed with love. We don't have to struggle to earn it. It is not the prerogative of only human beings. It is universal. The love of cow for its calf is proverbial. We love the one who pleases us - boss giving promotion to his chela. We love those we belong to us.- husband, wife, children, kith and kin. We love the one who helps us in times of crisis- giving blood or kidney to save someone. In all these, there is a reason to love someone - they bestowed us some benefit. From these descriptions we are clear about LOVE Now let us see " What is Bhakti ? " The love toward God is Bhakti. Hence it is important to know, how to know God. If you accept there is God, it is easy to practice Bhakti. If you don't believe in God, you have to ask yourself, who am I ? How I am able to eat, drink and move around ? If you don't get an answer, continue to ask these questions. Within few days, you will get the answer that you belong to HIM you are his dependent. Another way to know God is that when we put all human efforts to achieve some lofty objective, we are unable to be successful and we raise our hands. - an able doctor doing everthing to save the life of his patient - a parent unable to save their child from a fire accident or the collapse of a building. - Draupadi couldn't be saved by her husbands and even Bhismacharya. until she called Govinda, Dwarakapurivas. - Gajendra couldn't be saved by other elephants until he called Adi Moolame. Now turn mundane love towards God. Think of his grace for having bestowed you with all the comforts. Look around those who are not so fortunate. This will take you nearer to the Lord. You stop asking for all the benefits you have hitherto been praying. Your intense love will make you realise that he is showering all these blessingseven without your asking. Gradually, you will realise that he is showering his grace without any expectations from you. He has been loving you so much even before you were born but only now you have become aware of it.. Once this step is reached, the clock of Bhakti within you will automatically tick to love him without any expectations. You will have no more questions and there will be peace and love in your heart for all. You have realised Bhakti. Bhakti is directing love towards the Lord without any expectation. If we have FAITH in the Lord, We can progressively reach Divine Love ( Bhakti ), from mundane love. Mundane love has to be directed towards Lord without any expectations. Ever remain in the thought of his grace. Dasan, Sridhara, ----------- - sundeep gupta sadhak_insight ; gita Friday, November 02, 2007 2:00 AM How to develop Bhakti? Please advise, how to develop bhakti for God? Which is the most easy path for a person who is uninitiated to God worship? How does one develop Bhakti for God, when living in a world where selfishness is considered a virtue and a path to material success? Where evil prevails over goodness, and people speaking truth are rarer. Please advise regards Sundeep Gita Talk Guidelines FROM THE MODERATOR The following are the guidelines for Gita-Talk discussions. 1. Purpose of the group is to help Sadhaks clarify their doubts related to Gita shlokas. For responses to be posted, they must further clarify the understanding of Gitaji. 2. Wherever possible, please quote Gitaji or other scriptures to substantiate the response 3. Please limit personal feelings, opinions, beliefs etc. 4. Kindly make your responses concise and to the point. (Up to twenty line maximum, if possible). 5. Please limit discussions to subject at hand. 6. Please do not include links to other sites or other organizations 7. Please do not include your personal information such as phone number, address etc. 8. Kindly do not address the response to a particular individual, since the message is going to the entire group. 9. Due to a large readership, not all responses will be posted. 10. Moderator at his discretion, may modify the posting, if content is unclear or not appropriate for distribution to the group. 11. Please respond taking into consideration novices, youth, westerners, non-secterian audience. Please limit the use on only sanskrit words, and provide the english word with sanskrit bracketed wherever possible. MODERATOR Ram Ram Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted November 6, 2007 Report Share Posted November 6, 2007 Apart from all reading on Bhakti consult the narada bhakti sutras in translation even to get a grasp on it. Bhakti is internal and placing oneself upon a higher principle. There is no one who can fulfil your wants other than God. the acting Principle at all times. He manifests his grace in the form of friends and opportunities. Respect and with discretion and acknowledgement, act on. Bhakti is total surrender. It will be stress free. prabhakar --------- Jai Guru Datta! Om Namahshivay! World is an intriguing manifestation of our collective knowledge, choices deeds. Trying to find God in the world before finding Him within us is like trying to pick out a clean instrument with dirty hands. Finding God within ourselves is Self Realization. Bhakti is a great way to do this according to Gita. Bhakti is paramount without which Karma Yoga [self-less service] is harder to practice; Sri Rama Krishna Paramahamsa says "to get to the level of fully knowing that Devotion to the people is the Devotion to the Supreme, seeker must first develop Bhakti [love for God] who is ever present in every thing". How does one know or love someone? by reading, listening, discussing, thinking and meditating about that someone and thats when we begin to develop a certain feeling in our hearts. Puranas [Divine History from the heart] are an expression around a story with respect to our getting a grasp of how a particular Divine manifestation came about. We are sort of the directors for depicting the puranic story with words, feelings expressions in full glory. Through all such depictions, our collective knowledge about the God figure develops a certain sacred notion that upholds the best of all attributes with the noblest of emotions about Him, which when played out in our being as thoughts in meditation or as words in our narration, brings out tears of joy realization for that God Figure washing away our selfish little notions lifting us up to a higher vibration. The more joyous we feel, the closer we are to open our hearts to let His grace to flow. In summary, how we develop Bhakti is meditating on Lord's stories step by step where we play the role of the Lord down to our noblest, kindest purest expression until we feel that "Satyam, Shivam Sundaram" in our being. In such ecstacy where we are so joyous, His grace will flow and miracles are simply byproducts further deepening our conviction. With Bhakti, self-less service become easier which reduces thoughts. As Bhakti deepens, each puranic story finds a place in one's own evolution toward Self realization [for example, Churning of Milk Ocean is about Meditation to realize the Self] thus developing seeker's Jnana which provides a proper direction for thoughts; thus, quality thoughts [gentle pure] in a correct direction leads to the broader field of Truth where the thoughts stop consciousness expands - the beginning of Self Realization. Sree Guru Datta! ShivMallik --------- Reading about your question "how to develop bhakti for God?" gives me idea that you believe in God already but are trying to want to develop Bhakthi on that divinity. Hence this is my humble opinion. Just ask/pray that God which u believe in to show you the path to developing the Bhakthi by complete surrendering onto that God and with full reverance and faith and that SUPREME will show you the path the way it is intended. Do not lose the FAITH in praying to that God to show u the way and that GOD will definitely answer you. Miraculous the SUPREME"s ways in showing the person whoever it may be and whatever he needs anything for that matter. The only thing is COMPLETE surrender onto HIM which also happens only by HIS grace. do NOT please lose FAITH eventhough sometimes the answer seems to come to us late..do not leave the FAITH and you will definitely get the answer you are looking for. Regards, Bharathi. --------- Bhakti (devotion and love) is the means and the end result which leads to the ultimate clear understanding of what is happening ....rest just happens Clear understanding leads to joy and happiness, trust and faith in every thing happening...and that leads to Bhakti then to ....Moksha - oneness.. It is a process.....and with clear understanding, as it develops the process becomes interesting.... one can only pray for the opportunity to have that clear understanding and guidance... Called Grace....... Sushil Jain --------- om kalanki namah there are three ways to reach the ultimate goal of the humanlife - bhakti dhyan and gyan marg Whatever name / form appears sweet to you , one that you believe and have faith in, simply grow that relationship even further. Intense longing and desire to develop devotion is key to your success in the path of devotion (bhakti marg). (moderator addition) dilip bhamawat om kalanki namah --------- Jai Shree Krishna, I am not expert in this but I think Lord shiva's blessings are necessary to develop bhakti. Shamrila Moharir --------- omkara p kalrav pande --------- laxmi vaghela <lvaghela wrote: dear sir if you want to develop bhakti. please read the 'sadhak sanjivani' and 'tatva chintamani' 1st listen to the following site www.swamiramsukhdasji.org if u really want to have bhakti u would like this.pravachans are in hindi. regards sadhak ----------- Dear friend, there was everything you said during Pandavas life span. But they were virtuous. Don`t see things around, but keep singing in mind about God, listen plenty of Puranas, life histories of saints. These will guide you easily the valuable points to reach GOD. Lord Krishna said in Bagavath Gita, "One who tries Yoga, Yagna, Tapas, meditations Etc will take 100 of births to reach me". But the same lord says, "if I (Lord) make sankalpam, I can make that person to attain me in the same birth". It means, that if we desire that will it is difficult. But if we surrender then it is the responsibility of the Lord to guide you in showing a Guru, right path, spritual way of life, get you fixed in Sat Sangh and finally, you reach HIM. A lady wearing a diamond nose ring went on showing aound. She happened to cross Kabir Doss. Kabir said, "think of the lord who gave you nose to wear". Use everything that comes to you righteously thinking of the Lord each time. Discard that wrong things (that your consience says) still thinking of the Lord. That is what GOPIES did and were said in puranas that Gopies are greater than Saints. B.Sathyanarayan ----------- Lord Krishna said, that HE can give Kaivaliyam (liberation) but not Bakthi. One who gets Bakthi, the Lord has to be with that person. If tears flow, your hairs on skin raises by hearing about God, then you are in the path of Bakthi. Bakthi comes easily with association of person in Sat Sangh. B.Sathyanarayan ----------- Dear brother Pratap.. a very beutiful explanation! thanks for sharing your thoughts. abhimanyu ----------- dear Sadhakas, Bhakti is not something elusive. It is possible for every one to breathe and live in Bhakti. Bhakti is intense love for the Lord. We know love only in the mundane sense. For want of suitable word to express Bhakti, we use the word LOVE which has fallen into disrepute. Without love, the world will fall apart. By the divine grace, we are endowed with love. We don't have to struggle to earn it. It is not the prerogative of only human beings. It is universal. The love of cow for its calf is proverbial. We love the one who pleases us - boss giving promotion to his chela. We love those we belong to us.- husband, wife, children, kith and kin. We love the one who helps us in times of crisis- giving blood or kidney to save someone. In all these, there is a reason to love someone - they bestowed us some benefit. From these descriptions we are clear about LOVE Now let us see " What is Bhakti ? " The love toward God is Bhakti. Hence it is important to know, how to know God. If you accept there is God, it is easy to practice Bhakti. If you don't believe in God, you have to ask yourself, who am I ? How I am able to eat, drink and move around ? If you don't get an answer, continue to ask these questions. Within few days, you will get the answer that you belong to HIM you are his dependent. Another way to know God is that when we put all human efforts to achieve some lofty objective, we are unable to be successful and we raise our hands. - an able doctor doing everthing to save the life of his patient - a parent unable to save their child from a fire accident or the collapse of a building. - Draupadi couldn't be saved by her husbands and even Bhismacharya. until she called Govinda, Dwarakapurivas. - Gajendra couldn't be saved by other elephants until he called Adi Moolame. Now turn mundane love towards God. Think of his grace for having bestowed you with all the comforts. Look around those who are not so fortunate. This will take you nearer to the Lord. You stop asking for all the benefits you have hitherto been praying. Your intense love will make you realise that he is showering all these blessingseven without your asking. Gradually, you will realise that he is showering his grace without any expectations from you. He has been loving you so much even before you were born but only now you have become aware of it.. Once this step is reached, the clock of Bhakti within you will automatically tick to love him without any expectations. You will have no more questions and there will be peace and love in your heart for all. You have realised Bhakti. Bhakti is directing love towards the Lord without any expectation. If we have FAITH in the Lord, We can progressively reach Divine Love ( Bhakti ), from mundane love. Mundane love has to be directed towards Lord without any expectations. Ever remain in the thought of his grace. Dasan, Sridhara, ----------- - sundeep gupta sadhak_insight ; gita Friday, November 02, 2007 2:00 AM How to develop Bhakti? Please advise, how to develop bhakti for God? Which is the most easy path for a person who is uninitiated to God worship? How does one develop Bhakti for God, when living in a world where selfishness is considered a virtue and a path to material success? Where evil prevails over goodness, and people speaking truth are rarer. Please advise regards Sundeep Gita Talk Guidelines FROM THE MODERATOR The following are the guidelines for Gita-Talk discussions. 1. Purpose of the group is to help Sadhaks clarify their doubts related to Gita shlokas. For responses to be posted, they must further clarify the understanding of Gitaji. 2. Wherever possible, please quote Gitaji or other scriptures to substantiate the response 3. Please limit personal feelings, opinions, beliefs etc. 4. Kindly make your responses concise and to the point. (Up to twenty line maximum, if possible). 5. Please limit discussions to subject at hand. 6. Please do not include links to other sites or other organizations 7. Please do not include your personal information such as phone number, address etc. 8. Kindly do not address the response to a particular individual, since the message is going to the entire group. 9. Due to a large readership, not all responses will be posted. 10. Moderator at his discretion, may modify the posting, if content is unclear or not appropriate for distribution to the group. 11. Please respond taking into consideration novices, youth, westerners, non-secterian audience. Please limit the use on only sanskrit words, and provide the english word with sanskrit bracketed wherever possible. MODERATOR Ram Ram Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted November 12, 2007 Report Share Posted November 12, 2007 Jai Guru Datta! Om Namah Shivay! Narada Bhakti Sutra is a wonderful text and it offered much validation after reading it a few years back. I heard that Kaliyug is such that drastic measures are not required to realize Bhakti and obtain Lord's mercy. I found His grace just with surrender, but without complete (physical) renunciation. Following Dharma until He liberates and dwelling in His thoughts with pure heart is a good formula for Kaliyug. Sree Guru Datta! ShivMallik || Sree || Namaskar Seekers, Yes “one should just pray to God to show you the path to developing the Bhakthi by complete surrendering unto that God and with full reverence and faith and that one should not lose FAITH even though sometimes the answer seems to come to us late”. The greater the surrender, the greater will we perceive His grace. The intensity of our bhava (spiritual emotion)in our prayer is key in movinge the Lord. One more thing. As per the spiritual science, the five basic characteristics i.e. smell, taste, form, touch and sound and their energies co-exist. For example, if one utters the Name of one’s God (i.e. sound characteristic) continuously, the energy of sound is activated and it reaches the Lord who sort of wakes up and starts bestowing His grace on the one who is chanting. Chanting should therefore be done with utmost faith and a complete sense of surrender, then alone it will reach the Lotus Feet of the Lord. Chanting done consistently also purifies our mind and goes to remove the impressions of past births on our sub-conscious mind. A pure mind’s chanting is most intense. God showers His grace on us and sows the seed of development of Bhakti in our mind. Consistent prayers and chanting with faith, spiritual emotion and a sense of complete surrender will certainly pave the way for development of Bhakti in our mind. Gurucharani a.d. tapkire Prabhakar C L <clprabhakar wrote: Apart from all reading on Bhakti consult the narada bhakti sutras in translation even to get a grasp on it. Bhakti is internal and placing oneself upon a higher principle. There is no one who can fulfil your wants other than God. the acting Principle at all times. He manifests his grace in the form of friends and opportunities. Respect and with discretion and acknowledgement, act on. Bhakti is total surrender. It will be stress free. prabhakar --------- Jai Guru Datta! Om Namahshivay! World is an intriguing manifestation of our collective knowledge, choices deeds. Trying to find God in the world before finding Him within us is like trying to pick out a clean instrument with dirty hands. Finding God within ourselves is Self Realization. Bhakti is a great way to do this according to Gita. Bhakti is paramount without which Karma Yoga [self-less service] is harder to practice; Sri Rama Krishna Paramahamsa says "to get to the level of fully knowing that Devotion to the people is the Devotion to the Supreme, seeker must first develop Bhakti [love for God] who is ever present in every thing". How does one know or love someone? by reading, listening, discussing, thinking and meditating about that someone and thats when we begin to develop a certain feeling in our hearts. Puranas [Divine History from the heart] are an expression around a story with respect to our getting a grasp of how a particular Divine manifestation came about. We are sort of the directors for depicting the puranic story with words, feelings expressions in full glory. Through all such depictions, our collective knowledge about the God figure develops a certain sacred notion that upholds the best of all attributes with the noblest of emotions about Him, which when played out in our being as thoughts in meditation or as words in our narration, brings out tears of joy realization for that God Figure washing away our selfish little notions lifting us up to a higher vibration. The more joyous we feel, the closer we are to open our hearts to let His grace to flow. In summary, how we develop Bhakti is meditating on Lord's stories step by step where we play the role of the Lord down to our noblest, kindest purest expression until we feel that "Satyam, Shivam Sundaram" in our being. In such ecstacy where we are so joyous, His grace will flow and miracles are simply byproducts further deepening our conviction. With Bhakti, self-less service become easier which reduces thoughts. As Bhakti deepens, each puranic story finds a place in one's own evolution toward Self realization [for example, Churning of Milk Ocean is about Meditation to realize the Self] thus developing seeker's Jnana which provides a proper direction for thoughts; thus, quality thoughts [gentle pure] in a correct direction leads to the broader field of Truth where the thoughts stop consciousness expands - the beginning of Self Realization. Sree Guru Datta! ShivMallik --------- Reading about your question "how to develop bhakti for God?" gives me idea that you believe in God already but are trying to want to develop Bhakthi on that divinity. Hence this is my humble opinion. Just ask/pray that God which u believe in to show you the path to developing the Bhakthi by complete surrendering onto that God and with full reverance and faith and that SUPREME will show you the path the way it is intended. Do not lose the FAITH in praying to that God to show u the way and that GOD will definitely answer you. Miraculous the SUPREME"s ways in showing the person whoever it may be and whatever he needs anything for that matter. The only thing is COMPLETE surrender onto HIM which also happens only by HIS grace. do NOT please lose FAITH eventhough sometimes the answer seems to come to us late..do not leave the FAITH and you will definitely get the answer you are looking for. Regards, Bharathi. --------- Bhakti (devotion and love) is the means and the end result which leads to the ultimate clear understanding of what is happening ....rest just happens Clear understanding leads to joy and happiness, trust and faith in every thing happening...and that leads to Bhakti then to ....Moksha - oneness.. It is a process.....and with clear understanding, as it develops the process becomes interesting.... one can only pray for the opportunity to have that clear understanding and guidance... Called Grace....... Sushil Jain --------- om kalanki namah there are three ways to reach the ultimate goal of the humanlife - bhakti dhyan and gyan marg Whatever name / form appears sweet to you , one that you believe and have faith in, simply grow that relationship even further. Intense longing and desire to develop devotion is key to your success in the path of devotion (bhakti marg). (moderator addition) dilip bhamawat om kalanki namah --------- Jai Shree Krishna, I am not expert in this but I think Lord shiva's blessings are necessary to develop bhakti. Shamrila Moharir --------- omkara p kalrav pande --------- laxmi vaghela <lvaghela (AT) msn (DOT) com> wrote: dear sir if you want to develop bhakti. please read the 'sadhak sanjivani' and 'tatva chintamani' 1st listen to the following site www.swamiramsukhdasji.org if u really want to have bhakti u would like this.pravachans are in hindi. regards sadhak ----------- Dear friend, there was everything you said during Pandavas life span. But they were virtuous. Don`t see things around, but keep singing in mind about God, listen plenty of Puranas, life histories of saints. These will guide you easily the valuable points to reach GOD. Lord Krishna said in Bagavath Gita, "One who tries Yoga, Yagna, Tapas, meditations Etc will take 100 of births to reach me". But the same lord says, "if I (Lord) make sankalpam, I can make that person to attain me in the same birth". It means, that if we desire that will it is difficult. But if we surrender then it is the responsibility of the Lord to guide you in showing a Guru, right path, spritual way of life, get you fixed in Sat Sangh and finally, you reach HIM. A lady wearing a diamond nose ring went on showing aound. She happened to cross Kabir Doss. Kabir said, "think of the lord who gave you nose to wear". Use everything that comes to you righteously thinking of the Lord each time. Discard that wrong things (that your consience says) still thinking of the Lord. That is what GOPIES did and were said in puranas that Gopies are greater than Saints. B.Sathyanarayan ----------- Lord Krishna said, that HE can give Kaivaliyam (liberation) but not Bakthi. One who gets Bakthi, the Lord has to be with that person. If tears flow, your hairs on skin raises by hearing about God, then you are in the path of Bakthi. Bakthi comes easily with association of person in Sat Sangh. B.Sathyanarayan ----------- Dear brother Pratap.. a very beutiful explanation! thanks for sharing your thoughts. abhimanyu ----------- dear Sadhakas, Bhakti is not something elusive. It is possible for every one to breathe and live in Bhakti. Bhakti is intense love for the Lord. We know love only in the mundane sense. For want of suitable word to express Bhakti, we use the word LOVE which has fallen into disrepute. Without love, the world will fall apart. By the divine grace, we are endowed with love. We don't have to struggle to earn it. It is not the prerogative of only human beings. It is universal. The love of cow for its calf is proverbial. We love the one who pleases us - boss giving promotion to his chela. We love those we belong to us.- husband, wife, children, kith and kin. We love the one who helps us in times of crisis- giving blood or kidney to save someone. In all these, there is a reason to love someone - they bestowed us some benefit. From these descriptions we are clear about LOVE Now let us see " What is Bhakti ? " The love toward God is Bhakti. Hence it is important to know, how to know God. If you accept there is God, it is easy to practice Bhakti. If you don't believe in God, you have to ask yourself, who am I ? How I am able to eat, drink and move around ? If you don't get an answer, continue to ask these questions. Within few days, you will get the answer that you belong to HIM you are his dependent. Another way to know God is that when we put all human efforts to achieve some lofty objective, we are unable to be successful and we raise our hands. - an able doctor doing everthing to save the life of his patient - a parent unable to save their child from a fire accident or the collapse of a building. - Draupadi couldn't be saved by her husbands and even Bhismacharya. until she called Govinda, Dwarakapurivas. - Gajendra couldn't be saved by other elephants until he called Adi Moolame. Now turn mundane love towards God. Think of his grace for having bestowed you with all the comforts. Look around those who are not so fortunate. This will take you nearer to the Lord. You stop asking for all the benefits you have hitherto been praying. Your intense love will make you realise that he is showering all these blessingseven without your asking. Gradually, you will realise that he is showering his grace without any expectations from you. He has been loving you so much even before you were born but only now you have become aware of it.. Once this step is reached, the clock of Bhakti within you will automatically tick to love him without any expectations. You will have no more questions and there will be peace and love in your heart for all. You have realised Bhakti. Bhakti is directing love towards the Lord without any expectation. If we have FAITH in the Lord, We can progressively reach Divine Love ( Bhakti ), from mundane love. Mundane love has to be directed towards Lord without any expectations. Ever remain in the thought of his grace. Dasan, Sridhara, ----------- - sundeep gupta sadhak_insight ; gita Friday, November 02, 2007 2:00 AM How to develop Bhakti? Please advise, how to develop bhakti for God? Which is the most easy path for a person who is uninitiated to God worship? How does one develop Bhakti for God, when living in a world where selfishness is considered a virtue and a path to material success? Where evil prevails over goodness, and people speaking truth are rarer. Please advise regards Sundeep Gita Talk Guidelines FROM THE MODERATOR The following are the guidelines for Gita-Talk discussions. 1. Purpose of the group is to help Sadhaks clarify their doubts related to Gita shlokas. For responses to be posted, they must further clarify the understanding of Gitaji. 2. Wherever possible, please quote Gitaji or other scriptures to substantiate the response 3. Please limit personal feelings, opinions, beliefs etc. 4. Kindly make your responses concise and to the point. (Up to twenty line maximum, if possible). 5. Please limit discussions to subject at hand. 6. Please do not include links to other sites or other organizations 7. Please do not include your personal information such as phone number, address etc. 8. Kindly do not address the response to a particular individual, since the message is going to the entire group. 9. Due to a large readership, not all responses will be posted. 10. Moderator at his discretion, may modify the posting, if content is unclear or not appropriate for distribution to the group. 11. Please respond taking into consideration novices, youth, westerners, non-secterian audience. Please limit the use on only sanskrit words, and provide the english word with sanskrit bracketed wherever possible. MODERATOR Ram Ram Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted November 13, 2007 Report Share Posted November 13, 2007 for those of us who don´t know, the Gopi Chandan mudstone is used for enlightenment and gopies appear to be gifted monads... please explain. A lady wearing a diamond nose ring went on showing aound. She happened to cross Kabir Doss. Kabir said, "think of the lord who gave you nose to wear". Use everything that comes to you righteously thinking of the Lord each time. Discard that wrong things (that your consience says) still thinking of the Lord. That is what GOPIES did and were said in puranas that Gopies are greater than Saints. B.Sathyanarayan ----------- Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted November 14, 2007 Report Share Posted November 14, 2007 Dear Sadhak friends, After quite some time , I am able to come across this rather important topic for discussion, so I thought of jumping in with few of my own thoughts. Before I give my own views I wish to draw the attention of fellow sadhak friends to a rich statement on Bhakti made by none other than our great scholar and statesman Shri. ( Late) Rajagopalachari ji. Shri. Rajagopalachari ji, before releasing the famous song Bhajagovindham sung by the great singer Mrs.(Late) M.S.Subhulakshmi, quoting Shri Adi Shankara has aptly described the concept of Bhakti. Though this is well known to most of us, I would humbly request all fellow friends to once again take a look at this pearls of wisdom. ' Adi Shankaracharya wrote a number of vedhantic works for imparting knowledge of the self and the universal spirit. He also composed a number of hymns to foster Bhakti in the hearts of human. One of these hymns is the famous ' Bhajagovindham '. The way of devotion is not different from the way of knowledge or Gyaana. When intelligence matures and lodges securely in the mind it becomes WISDOM. When wisdom is integrated with life and issues out in action it becomes BAKTHI. Knowledge when it becomes fully mature is BHAKTHI. if it does not get transformed in to BHAKTI such knowledge is a useless tinsel. To believe that gyna and bhakti ( knowledge and devotion ) is different from each other is ignorance. If Shri Adi shankara himself who drank the ocean of gyana as easily as it waters from one's hand, sank in his later years hymns to develope devotion ( BHAKTI ) it is enough to show that gyana and bhakti are one and the same. Shri. Shankara has packed into the Bhajagovindham song the substance of all vedhanta and set the oneness of gyana and bhakti to melodiums music'. From whatever I understood so far in my life and the noble thoughts of our elders, Bhakti can be developed by putting in good practice the knowledge that we gather along in our life. Bhakti can be effectively developed by being among Bhaktas and by observing them how they conduct themselves and feel. Even God / Goddesses have some how remained focused in developing Bhakti among themselves towards an unknown / unseen force which they too aimed to reach to. In my view God Nature is the ultimate God / force which is controlled by a matter amongst itself about which none of these seem to have a clear idea but keep pursuing. Bhakti can be further developed and purified by adding value to it each day you pass by. If Bhakti is practiced for selfish motives and benefits, then it would only elude you and the implications could be counter productive. When one tries to show Bhakti or practice it for one own peace and happiness, it would only elude you and one would end up cheating oneself by this way. No matter how best you get dressed, attired, clean yourself externally and chants tons of manthras, shlokas, singsto show off your devotion, you would continue to cheat not only yourself but others as well. This is what is being practiced by so called so called experts, priests, spiritual gurus etc, whose main aim is to instill abundant superstition among the virgin minds in the society for their own vested interests. This practice has unfortunately been kept on duplicated for generation and we find today ourselves utterly confused and compelled to do the same mistakes. Just go to any temples or any places of worship irrespective of any cast , religion this is precisely what happens. The worst thing is children are getting trapped in to such matters having no direction. Every ritual is to be lead by the right manthras , shlokas in the right manner. Any symbolic procedure is worthless. A true Bhakti is one of the greatest ritual that surpasses any such routes to spiritual moksha. I Pray to God that good sense prevails and spreads to all those who lack it. Dharmarajaiyer --- On Mon, 12/11/07, mallik kotamarti <mkotamarti wrote:mallik kotamarti <mkotamartiRe: How to develop Bhakti? Date: Monday, 12 November, 2007, 11:08 PM Jai Guru Datta! Om Namah Shivay! Narada Bhakti Sutra is a wonderful text and it offered much validation after reading it a few years back. I heard that Kaliyug is such that drastic measures are not required to realize Bhakti and obtain Lord's mercy. I found His grace just with surrender, but without complete (physical) renunciation. Following Dharma until He liberates and dwelling in His thoughts with pure heart is a good formula for Kaliyug. Sree Guru Datta! ShivMallik ------------ --------- --------- --------- --------- --------- --------- --------- --- || Sree || Namaskar Seekers, Yes “one should just pray to God to show you the path to developing the Bhakthi by complete surrendering unto that God and with full reverence and faith and that one should not lose FAITH even though sometimes the answer seems to come to us lateâ€. The greater the surrender, the greater will we perceive His grace. The intensity of our bhava (spiritual emotion)in our prayer is key in movinge the Lord. One more thing. As per the spiritual science, the five basic characteristics i.e. smell, taste, form, touch and sound and their energies co-exist. For example, if one utters the Name of one’s God (i.e. sound characteristic) continuously, the energy of sound is activated and it reaches the Lord who sort of wakes up and starts bestowing His grace on the one who is chanting. Chanting should therefore be done with utmost faith and a complete sense of surrender, then alone it will reach the Lotus Feet of the Lord. Chanting done consistently also purifies our mind and goes to remove the impressions of past births on our sub-conscious mind. A pure mind’s chanting is most intense. God showers His grace on us and sows the seed of development of Bhakti in our mind. Consistent prayers and chanting with faith, spiritual emotion and a sense of complete surrender will certainly pave the way for development of Bhakti in our mind. Gurucharani a.d. tapkire ------------ --------- --------- --------- --------- --------- --------- --------- --- Prabhakar C L <clprabhakar@ > wrote: Apart from all reading on Bhakti consult the narada bhakti sutras in translation even to get a grasp on it. Bhakti is internal and placing oneself upon a higher principle. There is no one who can fulfil your wants other than God. the acting Principle at all times. He manifests his grace in the form of friends and opportunities. Respect and with discretion and acknowledgement, act on. Bhakti is total surrender. It will be stress free. prabhakar ------------ --------- --------- --------- --------- --------- --------- --------- Jai Guru Datta! Om Namahshivay! World is an intriguing manifestation of our collective knowledge, choices deeds. Trying to find God in the world before finding Him within us is like trying to pick out a clean instrument with dirty hands. Finding God within ourselves is Self Realization. Bhakti is a great way to do this according to Gita. Bhakti is paramount without which Karma Yoga [self-less service] is harder to practice; Sri Rama Krishna Paramahamsa says "to get to the level of fully knowing that Devotion to the people is the Devotion to the Supreme, seeker must first develop Bhakti [love for God] who is ever present in every thing". How does one know or love someone? by reading, listening, discussing, thinking and meditating about that someone and thats when we begin to develop a certain feeling in our hearts. Puranas [Divine History from the heart] are an expression around a story with respect to our getting a grasp of how a particular Divine manifestation came about. We are sort of the directors for depicting the puranic story with words, feelings expressions in full glory. Through all such depictions, our collective knowledge about the God figure develops a certain sacred notion that upholds the best of all attributes with the noblest of emotions about Him, which when played out in our being as thoughts in meditation or as words in our narration, brings out tears of joy realization for that God Figure washing away our selfish little notions lifting us up to a higher vibration. The more joyous we feel, the closer we are to open our hearts to let His grace to flow. In summary, how we develop Bhakti is meditating on Lord's stories step by step where we play the role of the Lord down to our noblest, kindest purest expression until we feel that "Satyam, Shivam Sundaram" in our being. In such ecstacy where we are so joyous, His grace will flow and miracles are simply byproducts further deepening our conviction. With Bhakti, self-less service become easier which reduces thoughts. As Bhakti deepens, each puranic story finds a place in one's own evolution toward Self realization [for example, Churning of Milk Ocean is about Meditation to realize the Self] thus developing seeker's Jnana which provides a proper direction for thoughts; thus, quality thoughts [gentle pure] in a correct direction leads to the broader field of Truth where the thoughts stop consciousness expands - the beginning of Self Realization. Sree Guru Datta! ShivMallik ------------ --------- --------- --------- --------- --------- --------- --------- Reading about your question "how to develop bhakti for God?" gives me idea that you believe in God already but are trying to want to develop Bhakthi on that divinity. Hence this is my humble opinion. Just ask/pray that God which u believe in to show you the path to developing the Bhakthi by complete surrendering onto that God and with full reverance and faith and that SUPREME will show you the path the way it is intended. Do not lose the FAITH in praying to that God to show u the way and that GOD will definitely answer you. Miraculous the SUPREME"s ways in showing the person whoever it may be and whatever he needs anything for that matter. The only thing is COMPLETE surrender onto HIM which also happens only by HIS grace. do NOT please lose FAITH eventhough sometimes the answer seems to come to us late..do not leave the FAITH and you will definitely get the answer you are looking for. Regards, Bharathi. ------------ --------- --------- --------- --------- --------- --------- --------- Bhakti (devotion and love) is the means and the end result which leads to the ultimate clear understanding of what is happening ....rest just happens Clear understanding leads to joy and happiness, trust and faith in every thing happening... and that leads to Bhakti then to ....Moksha - oneness.. It is a process..... and with clear understanding, as it develops the process becomes interesting. ... one can only pray for the opportunity to have that clear understanding and guidance... Called Grace....... Sushil Jain ------------ --------- --------- --------- --------- --------- --------- --------- om kalanki namah there are three ways to reach the ultimate goal of the humanlife - bhakti dhyan and gyan marg Whatever name / form appears sweet to you , one that you believe and have faith in, simply grow that relationship even further. Intense longing and desire to develop devotion is key to your success in the path of devotion (bhakti marg). (moderator addition) dilip bhamawat om kalanki namah ------------ --------- --------- --------- --------- --------- --------- --------- Jai Shree Krishna, I am not expert in this but I think Lord shiva's blessings are necessary to develop bhakti. Shamrila Moharir ------------ --------- --------- --------- --------- --------- --------- --------- omkara p kalrav pande ------------ --------- --------- --------- --------- --------- --------- --------- laxmi vaghela <lvaghela (AT) msn (DOT) com> wrote: dear sir if you want to develop bhakti. please read the 'sadhak sanjivani' and 'tatva chintamani' 1st listen to the following site www.swamiramsukhdas ji.org if u really want to have bhakti u would like this.pravachans are in hindi. regards sadhak ------------ --------- --------- --------- --------- --------- --------- --------- -- Dear friend, there was everything you said during Pandavas life span. But they were virtuous. Don`t see things around, but keep singing in mind about God, listen plenty of Puranas, life histories of saints. These will guide you easily the valuable points to reach GOD. Lord Krishna said in Bagavath Gita, "One who tries Yoga, Yagna, Tapas, meditations Etc will take 100 of births to reach me". But the same lord says, "if I (Lord) make sankalpam, I can make that person to attain me in the same birth". It means, that if we desire that will it is difficult. But if we surrender then it is the responsibility of the Lord to guide you in showing a Guru, right path, spritual way of life, get you fixed in Sat Sangh and finally, you reach HIM. A lady wearing a diamond nose ring went on showing aound. She happened to cross Kabir Doss. Kabir said, "think of the lord who gave you nose to wear". Use everything that comes to you righteously thinking of the Lord each time. Discard that wrong things (that your consience says) still thinking of the Lord. That is what GOPIES did and were said in puranas that Gopies are greater than Saints. B.Sathyanarayan ------------ --------- --------- --------- --------- --------- --------- --------- -- Lord Krishna said, that HE can give Kaivaliyam (liberation) but not Bakthi. One who gets Bakthi, the Lord has to be with that person. If tears flow, your hairs on skin raises by hearing about God, then you are in the path of Bakthi. Bakthi comes easily with association of person in Sat Sangh. B.Sathyanarayan ------------ --------- --------- --------- --------- --------- --------- --------- -- Dear brother Pratap.. a very beutiful explanation! thanks for sharing your thoughts. abhimanyu ------------ --------- --------- --------- --------- --------- --------- --------- -- dear Sadhakas, Bhakti is not something elusive. It is possible for every one to breathe and live in Bhakti. Bhakti is intense love for the Lord. We know love only in the mundane sense. For want of suitable word to express Bhakti, we use the word LOVE which has fallen into disrepute. Without love, the world will fall apart. By the divine grace, we are endowed with love. We don't have to struggle to earn it. It is not the prerogative of only human beings. It is universal. The love of cow for its calf is proverbial. We love the one who pleases us - boss giving promotion to his chela. We love those we belong to us.- husband, wife, children, kith and kin. We love the one who helps us in times of crisis- giving blood or kidney to save someone. In all these, there is a reason to love someone - they bestowed us some benefit. From these descriptions we are clear about LOVE Now let us see " What is Bhakti ? " The love toward God is Bhakti. Hence it is important to know, how to know God. If you accept there is God, it is easy to practice Bhakti. If you don't believe in God, you have to ask yourself, who am I ? How I am able to eat, drink and move around ? If you don't get an answer, continue to ask these questions. Within few days, you will get the answer that you belong to HIM you are his dependent. Another way to know God is that when we put all human efforts to achieve some lofty objective, we are unable to be successful and we raise our hands. - an able doctor doing everthing to save the life of his patient - a parent unable to save their child from a fire accident or the collapse of a building. - Draupadi couldn't be saved by her husbands and even Bhismacharya. until she called Govinda, Dwarakapurivas. - Gajendra couldn't be saved by other elephants until he called Adi Moolame. Now turn mundane love towards God. Think of his grace for having bestowed you with all the comforts. Look around those who are not so fortunate. This will take you nearer to the Lord. You stop asking for all the benefits you have hitherto been praying. Your intense love will make you realise that he is showering all these blessingseven without your asking. Gradually, you will realise that he is showering his grace without any expectations from you. He has been loving you so much even before you were born but only now you have become aware of it.. Once this step is reached, the clock of Bhakti within you will automatically tick to love him without any expectations. You will have no more questions and there will be peace and love in your heart for all. You have realised Bhakti. Bhakti is directing love towards the Lord without any expectation. If we have FAITH in the Lord, We can progressively reach Divine Love ( Bhakti ), from mundane love. Mundane love has to be directed towards Lord without any expectations. Ever remain in the thought of his grace. Dasan, Sridhara, ------------ --------- --------- --------- --------- --------- --------- --------- -- - sundeep gupta sadhak_insight@ ; gita Friday, November 02, 2007 2:00 AM How to develop Bhakti? Please advise, how to develop bhakti for God? Which is the most easy path for a person who is uninitiated to God worship? How does one develop Bhakti for God, when living in a world where selfishness is considered a virtue and a path to material success? Where evil prevails over goodness, and people speaking truth are rarer. Please advise regards Sundeep Gita Talk Guidelines FROM THE MODERATOR The following are the guidelines for Gita-Talk discussions. 1. Purpose of the group is to help Sadhaks clarify their doubts related to Gita shlokas. For responses to be posted, they must further clarify the understanding of Gitaji. 2. Wherever possible, please quote Gitaji or other scriptures to substantiate the response 3. Please limit personal feelings, opinions, beliefs etc. 4. Kindly make your responses concise and to the point. (Up to twenty line maximum, if possible). 5. Please limit discussions to subject at hand. 6. Please do not include links to other sites or other organizations 7. Please do not include your personal information such as phone number, address etc. 8. Kindly do not address the response to a particular individual, since the message is going to the entire group. 9. Due to a large readership, not all responses will be posted. 10. Moderator at his discretion, may modify the posting, if content is unclear or not appropriate for distribution to the group. 11. Please respond taking into consideration novices, youth, westerners, non-secterian audience. Please limit the use on only sanskrit words, and provide the english word with sanskrit bracketed wherever possible. MODERATOR Ram Ram S.DHARMARAJAN B.A. (Eco) DIEM (XIM) Volunteer 98207 43157 humanitarian services creative support project promotion legal / government matters office administration--- On Mon, 12/11/07, mallik kotamarti <mkotamarti wrote:mallik kotamarti <mkotamartiRe: How to develop Bhakti? Date: Monday, 12 November, 2007, 11:08 PM Jai Guru Datta! Om Namah Shivay! Narada Bhakti Sutra is a wonderful text and it offered much validation after reading it a few years back. I heard that Kaliyug is such that drastic measures are not required to realize Bhakti and obtain Lord's mercy. I found His grace just with surrender, but without complete (physical) renunciation. Following Dharma until He liberates and dwelling in His thoughts with pure heart is a good formula for Kaliyug. Sree Guru Datta! ShivMallik ------------ --------- --------- --------- --------- --------- --------- --------- --- || Sree || Namaskar Seekers, Yes “one should just pray to God to show you the path to developing the Bhakthi by complete surrendering unto that God and with full reverence and faith and that one should not lose FAITH even though sometimes the answer seems to come to us lateâ€. The greater the surrender, the greater will we perceive His grace. The intensity of our bhava (spiritual emotion)in our prayer is key in movinge the Lord. One more thing. As per the spiritual science, the five basic characteristics i.e. smell, taste, form, touch and sound and their energies co-exist. For example, if one utters the Name of one’s God (i.e. sound characteristic) continuously, the energy of sound is activated and it reaches the Lord who sort of wakes up and starts bestowing His grace on the one who is chanting. Chanting should therefore be done with utmost faith and a complete sense of surrender, then alone it will reach the Lotus Feet of the Lord. Chanting done consistently also purifies our mind and goes to remove the impressions of past births on our sub-conscious mind. A pure mind’s chanting is most intense. God showers His grace on us and sows the seed of development of Bhakti in our mind. Consistent prayers and chanting with faith, spiritual emotion and a sense of complete surrender will certainly pave the way for development of Bhakti in our mind. Gurucharani a.d. tapkire ------------ --------- --------- --------- --------- --------- --------- --------- --- Prabhakar C L <clprabhakar@ > wrote: Apart from all reading on Bhakti consult the narada bhakti sutras in translation even to get a grasp on it. Bhakti is internal and placing oneself upon a higher principle. There is no one who can fulfil your wants other than God. the acting Principle at all times. He manifests his grace in the form of friends and opportunities. Respect and with discretion and acknowledgement, act on. Bhakti is total surrender. It will be stress free. prabhakar ------------ --------- --------- --------- --------- --------- --------- --------- Jai Guru Datta! Om Namahshivay! World is an intriguing manifestation of our collective knowledge, choices deeds. Trying to find God in the world before finding Him within us is like trying to pick out a clean instrument with dirty hands. Finding God within ourselves is Self Realization. Bhakti is a great way to do this according to Gita. Bhakti is paramount without which Karma Yoga [self-less service] is harder to practice; Sri Rama Krishna Paramahamsa says "to get to the level of fully knowing that Devotion to the people is the Devotion to the Supreme, seeker must first develop Bhakti [love for God] who is ever present in every thing". How does one know or love someone? by reading, listening, discussing, thinking and meditating about that someone and thats when we begin to develop a certain feeling in our hearts. Puranas [Divine History from the heart] are an expression around a story with respect to our getting a grasp of how a particular Divine manifestation came about. We are sort of the directors for depicting the puranic story with words, feelings expressions in full glory. Through all such depictions, our collective knowledge about the God figure develops a certain sacred notion that upholds the best of all attributes with the noblest of emotions about Him, which when played out in our being as thoughts in meditation or as words in our narration, brings out tears of joy realization for that God Figure washing away our selfish little notions lifting us up to a higher vibration. The more joyous we feel, the closer we are to open our hearts to let His grace to flow. In summary, how we develop Bhakti is meditating on Lord's stories step by step where we play the role of the Lord down to our noblest, kindest purest expression until we feel that "Satyam, Shivam Sundaram" in our being. In such ecstacy where we are so joyous, His grace will flow and miracles are simply byproducts further deepening our conviction. With Bhakti, self-less service become easier which reduces thoughts. As Bhakti deepens, each puranic story finds a place in one's own evolution toward Self realization [for example, Churning of Milk Ocean is about Meditation to realize the Self] thus developing seeker's Jnana which provides a proper direction for thoughts; thus, quality thoughts [gentle pure] in a correct direction leads to the broader field of Truth where the thoughts stop consciousness expands - the beginning of Self Realization. Sree Guru Datta! ShivMallik ------------ --------- --------- --------- --------- --------- --------- --------- Reading about your question "how to develop bhakti for God?" gives me idea that you believe in God already but are trying to want to develop Bhakthi on that divinity. Hence this is my humble opinion. Just ask/pray that God which u believe in to show you the path to developing the Bhakthi by complete surrendering onto that God and with full reverance and faith and that SUPREME will show you the path the way it is intended. Do not lose the FAITH in praying to that God to show u the way and that GOD will definitely answer you. Miraculous the SUPREME"s ways in showing the person whoever it may be and whatever he needs anything for that matter. The only thing is COMPLETE surrender onto HIM which also happens only by HIS grace. do NOT please lose FAITH eventhough sometimes the answer seems to come to us late..do not leave the FAITH and you will definitely get the answer you are looking for. Regards, Bharathi. ------------ --------- --------- --------- --------- --------- --------- --------- Bhakti (devotion and love) is the means and the end result which leads to the ultimate clear understanding of what is happening ....rest just happens Clear understanding leads to joy and happiness, trust and faith in every thing happening... and that leads to Bhakti then to ....Moksha - oneness.. It is a process..... and with clear understanding, as it develops the process becomes interesting. ... one can only pray for the opportunity to have that clear understanding and guidance... Called Grace....... Sushil Jain ------------ --------- --------- --------- --------- --------- --------- --------- om kalanki namah there are three ways to reach the ultimate goal of the humanlife - bhakti dhyan and gyan marg Whatever name / form appears sweet to you , one that you believe and have faith in, simply grow that relationship even further. Intense longing and desire to develop devotion is key to your success in the path of devotion (bhakti marg). (moderator addition) dilip bhamawat om kalanki namah ------------ --------- --------- --------- --------- --------- --------- --------- Jai Shree Krishna, I am not expert in this but I think Lord shiva's blessings are necessary to develop bhakti. Shamrila Moharir ------------ --------- --------- --------- --------- --------- --------- --------- omkara p kalrav pande ------------ --------- --------- --------- --------- --------- --------- --------- laxmi vaghela <lvaghela (AT) msn (DOT) com> wrote: dear sir if you want to develop bhakti. please read the 'sadhak sanjivani' and 'tatva chintamani' 1st listen to the following site www.swamiramsukhdas ji.org if u really want to have bhakti u would like this.pravachans are in hindi. regards sadhak ------------ --------- --------- --------- --------- --------- --------- --------- -- Dear friend, there was everything you said during Pandavas life span. But they were virtuous. Don`t see things around, but keep singing in mind about God, listen plenty of Puranas, life histories of saints. These will guide you easily the valuable points to reach GOD. Lord Krishna said in Bagavath Gita, "One who tries Yoga, Yagna, Tapas, meditations Etc will take 100 of births to reach me". But the same lord says, "if I (Lord) make sankalpam, I can make that person to attain me in the same birth". It means, that if we desire that will it is difficult. But if we surrender then it is the responsibility of the Lord to guide you in showing a Guru, right path, spritual way of life, get you fixed in Sat Sangh and finally, you reach HIM. A lady wearing a diamond nose ring went on showing aound. She happened to cross Kabir Doss. Kabir said, "think of the lord who gave you nose to wear". Use everything that comes to you righteously thinking of the Lord each time. Discard that wrong things (that your consience says) still thinking of the Lord. That is what GOPIES did and were said in puranas that Gopies are greater than Saints. B.Sathyanarayan ------------ --------- --------- --------- --------- --------- --------- --------- -- Lord Krishna said, that HE can give Kaivaliyam (liberation) but not Bakthi. One who gets Bakthi, the Lord has to be with that person. If tears flow, your hairs on skin raises by hearing about God, then you are in the path of Bakthi. Bakthi comes easily with association of person in Sat Sangh. B.Sathyanarayan ------------ --------- --------- --------- --------- --------- --------- --------- -- Dear brother Pratap.. a very beutiful explanation! thanks for sharing your thoughts. abhimanyu ------------ --------- --------- --------- --------- --------- --------- --------- -- dear Sadhakas, Bhakti is not something elusive. It is possible for every one to breathe and live in Bhakti. Bhakti is intense love for the Lord. We know love only in the mundane sense. For want of suitable word to express Bhakti, we use the word LOVE which has fallen into disrepute. Without love, the world will fall apart. By the divine grace, we are endowed with love. We don't have to struggle to earn it. It is not the prerogative of only human beings. It is universal. The love of cow for its calf is proverbial. We love the one who pleases us - boss giving promotion to his chela. We love those we belong to us.- husband, wife, children, kith and kin. We love the one who helps us in times of crisis- giving blood or kidney to save someone. In all these, there is a reason to love someone - they bestowed us some benefit. From these descriptions we are clear about LOVE Now let us see " What is Bhakti ? " The love toward God is Bhakti. Hence it is important to know, how to know God. If you accept there is God, it is easy to practice Bhakti. If you don't believe in God, you have to ask yourself, who am I ? How I am able to eat, drink and move around ? If you don't get an answer, continue to ask these questions. Within few days, you will get the answer that you belong to HIM you are his dependent. Another way to know God is that when we put all human efforts to achieve some lofty objective, we are unable to be successful and we raise our hands. - an able doctor doing everthing to save the life of his patient - a parent unable to save their child from a fire accident or the collapse of a building. - Draupadi couldn't be saved by her husbands and even Bhismacharya. until she called Govinda, Dwarakapurivas. - Gajendra couldn't be saved by other elephants until he called Adi Moolame. Now turn mundane love towards God. Think of his grace for having bestowed you with all the comforts. Look around those who are not so fortunate. This will take you nearer to the Lord. You stop asking for all the benefits you have hitherto been praying. Your intense love will make you realise that he is showering all these blessingseven without your asking. Gradually, you will realise that he is showering his grace without any expectations from you. He has been loving you so much even before you were born but only now you have become aware of it.. Once this step is reached, the clock of Bhakti within you will automatically tick to love him without any expectations. You will have no more questions and there will be peace and love in your heart for all. You have realised Bhakti. Bhakti is directing love towards the Lord without any expectation. If we have FAITH in the Lord, We can progressively reach Divine Love ( Bhakti ), from mundane love. Mundane love has to be directed towards Lord without any expectations. Ever remain in the thought of his grace. Dasan, Sridhara, ------------ --------- --------- --------- --------- --------- --------- --------- -- - sundeep gupta sadhak_insight@ ; gita Friday, November 02, 2007 2:00 AM How to develop Bhakti? Please advise, how to develop bhakti for God? Which is the most easy path for a person who is uninitiated to God worship? How does one develop Bhakti for God, when living in a world where selfishness is considered a virtue and a path to material success? Where evil prevails over goodness, and people speaking truth are rarer. Please advise regards Sundeep Gita Talk Guidelines FROM THE MODERATOR The following are the guidelines for Gita-Talk discussions. 1. Purpose of the group is to help Sadhaks clarify their doubts related to Gita shlokas. For responses to be posted, they must further clarify the understanding of Gitaji. 2. Wherever possible, please quote Gitaji or other scriptures to substantiate the response 3. Please limit personal feelings, opinions, beliefs etc. 4. Kindly make your responses concise and to the point. (Up to twenty line maximum, if possible). 5. Please limit discussions to subject at hand. 6. Please do not include links to other sites or other organizations 7. Please do not include your personal information such as phone number, address etc. 8. Kindly do not address the response to a particular individual, since the message is going to the entire group. 9. Due to a large readership, not all responses will be posted. 10. Moderator at his discretion, may modify the posting, if content is unclear or not appropriate for distribution to the group. 11. Please respond taking into consideration novices, youth, westerners, non-secterian audience. Please limit the use on only sanskrit words, and provide the english word with sanskrit bracketed wherever possible. MODERATOR Ram Ram Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted November 19, 2007 Report Share Posted November 19, 2007 Jai Guru Datta! Om Namh Shivay! Once up on a time, a wise saintly woman approached an Ashram and wanted to be initiated into sanyasa {renunciation} so that she too could become part of the ashram to practice her spirituality and worship the Absolute. She was refused by the elders in the ashram saying that women are a distraction and they are indeed not fit to become renunciates. The wise woman politely sent another note with a question "isn't the Lord only real Purusha {Masculine} and isn't everyone {of the seekers} in fact a woman {feminine} in front of Him as all Jivatmas {souls} long union with the Paramatma {Absolute}?". Soon after this question was sent, elders let her join the ashram. (The wise woman was Meerabai) Gopies {plural as opposed to the absolute which is only ONE}, as Prakriti {personified as women}, were in such ecstasy in their love for Purusha {Krishna}, they lived every moment filled with the thought of Divine Krishna; they could long and experience the union so completely as they knew themselves as feminine and view God as their masculine partner. It was said that many a saint cannot fully realize their oneness with the Lord because they still identify male aspect with God and/or themselves where as Gopies fully accept their being as complementary to the Lord and immerse in the blissful union with the Lord. Master Saint Sri Rama Krishna Paramahamsa was known to have wondered at the advantage women saints have and in fact, to fully experience his oneness with the Absolute, he took up a practice for some time {a month or so} acting as a woman {with all mannerisms} to fully surrender himself to the Lord. Purush & Prakriti represent the Absolute and the Nature; without Nature, Purush cannot be seen and without Purush, Prakriti doesn't exist. Gopies have reached such a perfect state that they were Prakriti and longed for Krishna who is the Absolute. In this context, Gopies are greater than saints & appear to be gifted monads somuch so that Gopi Chandan is used in practice for enlightenment {sadhana}. Sree Guru Datta! ShivMalliktombabur wrote: for those of us who don´t know, the Gopi Chandan mudstone is used for enlightenment and gopies appear to be gifted monads... please explain. A lady wearing a diamond nose ring went on showing aound. She happened to cross Kabir Doss. Kabir said, "think of the lord who gave you nose to wear". Use everything that comes to you righteously thinking of the Lord each time. Discard that wrong things (that your consience says) still thinking of the Lord. That is what GOPIES did and were said in puranas that Gopies are greater than Saints. B.Sathyanarayan ----------- Be a better pen pal. Text or chat with friends inside Mail. See how. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted November 22, 2007 Report Share Posted November 22, 2007 Bakthi comes to one by constant thought on God in form one likes. Bakthi is not development made. Lord Krishna says Bakthi I (lord) cannot give, but I (Lord) can give even moksha. In Yagna, Tapas, meditation one can bring God to consience only for a while. Bakthi can make God to remain with one who sheds tears for love of God. Constant Sat Sangh, pronouncing HIS name, reading or listening puranas etc will bring in Bakthi. Ex: Mother Andal in south India- Any saint for that matter- Meera- Etc Symptom of one having Bakthi- Tears will flow, hairs on body raise, feeling of body in extecy on hearing the name of Lord B.Sathyanarayan Jai Guru Datta! Om NamhShivay! Rajaji's preamble to Bhaja Govindam is quite revealing memorable and in fact I quoted it myself several times. Since there is such a thing as "Moodha Bhakti" {ignorant devotion} which is also acknowledged by the Lord as shown in the story of Bhakta Kannappa, pundit knowledge is not necessary where there is true bhakti; this is the story in which the ignorant tribal man takes out his eyes to help heal shiva's (linga's) eyes while placing his Toe on the Shiva Linga. Bhakti is rewarding in its own right. When Bhakti matures to the level of Darshan of the Lord (TRUTH), devotee arrives at the true knowledge just as when knowledge matures,the pundit arrives at the true Bhakti. Vedanta, the later teachings of which advises that one follow Bhakti to purify through heart, Jnana to direct realization efforts through the intellect and Karma to detach through self-less action. Through personal experience, I find that expressing Bhakti in solitude to the Lord gives me the most joy and I would not trade it for any thing. Sree Guru Datta! ShivMallik Bhagavata purana is a book on Bhakti and the measures variously suited to all.So a look at the episode of Dhruva, the son of the king Uttanapada where Dhruva was initiated into the lore of Bhakti and assurence that the goal whatever could definitely be attained. His mother suggested the way. Narada advised Dhruva to go with the japa of the mantra' om namo bhagavate vasudevaaya' until the end is attained.This to be practised in a secluded forest where scope for concentration is mighty. Dhruva did follow the advice of his mother sage Narada.He went with dhyana and upasana. He adopted three measures of Pranayama and made the lokas get annoyed with the choking caused by his pranayamayogabala. When gods approached Lord Narayana, he said he would go and stop that difficulty.Lord Narayana granted him the boons asked for and made him the Nakshatra in firmament of the sky. Here the lesson is quest, obedience to the sage's instruction and determination until the said result is obtained. It does not matter how hard or soft be the measures of Bhakti and they are simply adhered. Bhakti is an automatic machinery spiritual as it is which helps to find ways and means by itslelf to comfort the seeker. Bhakti is a hard path and luring to plunge into it for peace. prabhakar Prabhakar C L Blind bhakti or reasoned bhakti- bottom line is bhakti, without which no mukti as per the bhakti school. tatachar Dear sadhakas, Bhakti does not need so much brain trembling laws sutras..... Just be GOPIS.. Simplest is the best form that God likes... NIMAL MAN JAN SO MOHI PAWA, MOHI KAPAT CHHAL CHHIDRA NA BHAWA. THANX RAJAom kalanki namah you are right the bhakti can not be developed unless you know to whom you are praying bhaj govindam bhaj govindam bhajgovindam mude matha mude matha meand ignorants or agyanee or murkh it is fact that the entire universe is full of ignorants that is why the celebrets one day in a year as fools day they could not find a day to celebret as wise day so before become bhakt for any thing one has to know it fully then only you can go on bhakti path and as you said rigtly that knowledge is the first step of bhakti om kalanki namah Nitin Bora BHAKTI MEANS OFFERING SELF TO HIM.COMPLETE SURRENDER AND DEDICATION TO HIM.EVERYWHERE MOST OF THE PEOPLE ARE PUNGENTLY SELFISH AND SLOTHFUL.ONE SHOULD NOT THINK OF SELFISH PEOPLE AND DISCHARGE THE FUNCTIONS WITHOUT ANY ATTACHMENT.GOD IS THE ONLY SAVIOUR.ME HAVE BEEN EXPERIENCING THE SAME U HAVE MENTIONED IN YOUR MESSAGE.LET TRUTH AND OPENNESS PREVAIL EVERY NOOK&CORNER OF THE PLACE U STAY. REGARDS N.PANDA Dear Sadhar friends, Can some one help me on how to get this book / sutra for more enlightenment on Bhakti ?. Narada Bhakti Sutra May God Bless you all regards dharmarajaiyer Dharma Rajan mallik kotamarti <mkotamarti wrote: Jai Guru Datta! Om Namh Shivay! Once up on a time, a wise saintly woman approached an Ashram and wanted to be initiated into sanyasa {renunciation} so that she too could become part of the ashram to practice her spirituality and worship the Absolute. She was refused by the elders in the ashram saying that women are a distraction and they are indeed not fit to become renunciates. The wise woman politely sent another note with a question "isn't the Lord only real Purusha {Masculine} and isn't everyone {of the seekers} in fact a woman {feminine} in front of Him as all Jivatmas {souls} long union with the Paramatma {Absolute}?". Soon after this question was sent, elders let her join the ashram. (The wise woman was Meerabai) Gopies {plural as opposed to the absolute which is only ONE}, as Prakriti {personified as women}, were in such ecstasy in their love for Purusha {Krishna}, they lived every moment filled with the thought of Divine Krishna; they could long and experience the union so completely as they knew themselves as feminine and view God as their masculine partner. It was said that many a saint cannot fully realize their oneness with the Lord because they still identify male aspect with God and/or themselves where as Gopies fully accept their being as complementary to the Lord and immerse in the blissful union with the Lord. Master Saint Sri Rama Krishna Paramahamsa was known to have wondered at the advantage women saints have and in fact, to fully experience his oneness with the Absolute, he took up a practice for some time {a month or so} acting as a woman {with all mannerisms} to fully surrender himself to the Lord. Purush & Prakriti represent the Absolute and the Nature; without Nature, Purush cannot be seen and without Purush, Prakriti doesn't exist. Gopies have reached such a perfect state that they were Prakriti and longed for Krishna who is the Absolute. In this context, Gopies are greater than saints & appear to be gifted monads somuch so that Gopi Chandan is used in practice for enlightenment {sadhana}. Sree Guru Datta! ShivMalliktombabur (AT) aol (DOT) com wrote: for those of us who don´t know, the Gopi Chandan mudstone is used for enlightenment and gopies appear to be gifted monads... please explain. A lady wearing a diamond nose ring went on showing aound. She happened to cross Kabir Doss. Kabir said, "think of the lord who gave you nose to wear". Use everything that comes to you righteously thinking of the Lord each time. Discard that wrong things (that your consience says) still thinking of the Lord. That is what GOPIES did and were said in puranas that Gopies are greater than Saints. B.Sathyanarayan ----------- Be a better pen pal. Text or chat with friends inside Mail. See how. Save all your chat conversations. Find them online. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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